India Nuclear News And Discussion

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Kavu » 10 Apr 2010 03:47

merlin wrote:
Gerard wrote:There isn't enough land to set up a car plant or build a reactor and you expect a coal mine?
Think of the poor tribals who will lose their sacred mountain, or valley, or whatever.


Yes, yes. For the good of the country, tribals should be prepared to lose their homes, lands and everything else they hold dear. After all greater good for greater numbers is more important.

Yes it is. as long as they are compensated, they shouldnt complain. I dont, I just lost 50 cents to a National Highway which people made reduce from 65m, to 35m. I am loosing my institution in the particular area because of that, but I have to suck it up for the greater good, the government, central will compensate me, not for the loss of my business as well as the market value, but 30% above the fair value. Its life.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 10 Apr 2010 06:35

Until Linear accelerators came, Co 60 was the only radiation source useful for treating cancers. I am sure there are many Co 60 radiation sources in Indian cancer treatment centers - but living in Bengaluru I see only the "latest changes" and don't know what is happening in less advanced centers.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 10 Apr 2010 08:48

The newspapers today speculate that the nuclear material could be "foreign in origin"

Lovely. That means highly radioactive stuff can be brought in across Indian borders and no one will know until something starts killing people. Jai hind to you too. :roll:

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby niran » 10 Apr 2010 09:55

Sir,obviously, if it was sold to a Scrapy, it must have been old and in past
onlee faaren maal was available, hence faaren origin.

Cobalt 60 AFAIK has only one Indian manufacturer, before it is bought it has to
registered with some Atomic Authorities, and it has to be scarped by the said authority onlee.
The catch is, the cost involved in scraping is mucho costlier than buying a spiffy spanking new one.

the most likely happenstance is this

A a very rich institute orders it, uses it for few years and get a new model, sell the older one to another
Lesser Institute, who sell it to another lesser Institute, so on and so forth until it reaches some small time
Oncologist/Radiologist who got it at a scrap price and squeezed the last Rad of useful Co60 before discarding it.
somewhere along it is conveniently forgotten to inform the relevant authorities, call it honest mistake or huge
coincidence or whatever. Co60 is stored in a Lead box, which must have been separated and sold earlier by the Scrapy, coz, it is heavy and easy money.
There was one similar incidence in Thailand scrap markets few years ago, with altogether 38 people affected,
with 2 immediate deaths and now onlee 3 have survived. all other died horribly slow death.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 10 Apr 2010 11:50

hmmm.. that is a very interesting and plausible explanation niran

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Sanatanan » 10 Apr 2010 17:27

negi wrote:Sanatanam I guess you are talking about Co-60 being detected in buttons supplied by Indian entity for Otis elevators in France .


Thank you negi ji, that is the incident I was referring to.

Co-60 may also be produced in Nuclear Reactors due to in-core neutron irradiation of corrosion / erosion / wear products emanating from various structural materials and alloys. I would imagine that this would be diligently removed from the plant systems, treated and safely stored within the plant itself under stringent multiple levels of operational controls and so cannot find its way into a scrap dealer's shop.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Sanatanan » 10 Apr 2010 17:36

niran wrote:
. . .

Cobalt 60 AFAIK has only one Indian manufacturer, before it is bought it has to
registered with some Atomic Authorities, and it has to be scarped by the said authority onlee.
The catch is, the cost involved in scraping is mucho costlier than buying a spiffy spanking new one.

the most likely happenstance is this

A a very rich institute orders it, uses it for few years and get a new model, sell the older one to another Lesser Institute, who sell it to another lesser Institute, so on and so forth until it reaches some small time Oncologist/Radiologist who got it at a scrap price and squeezed the last Rad of useful Co60 before discarding it. somewhere along it is conveniently forgotten to inform the relevant authorities, call it honest mistake or huge
coincidence or whatever.

. . .



Aren't the institutions / establishments (big or small) operating such Co-60 sources subject to periodic physical (on-site) "safeguards inspections" by appropriate regulatory authorities more or less on the same lines as the IAEA inspections conducted on npps? If this is the case, then illegal transfer of ownership of the Co-60 source to ill qualified person(s) or institution(s), without being detected, would not be possible (since working of the "pursuit" principle might preclude this from happening). Co-60 finding its way to the scrap market along the suggested route above would imply that the Regulation was not sufficiently effective in this case or was somehow circumvented. I, for one, do not feel that this might be the case in this instance.

A scenario about which there does not seem to be any speculative reports as yet is the possibility that this particular incident might have a "terrorist" angle (or be the handiwork of person(s) with malafide intentions), enacted to coincide with MMS's visit the US to attend a conference on nuclear security where he is expected to push for India to be allowed to host the proposed Global Centre on Nuclear Security (in return for agreeing to sign the NPT as a non-weapon country?).

However, an aspect of the above postulate would be that the person(s) who handled the radioactive source into the scrap yard would themselves have been exposed to radiation (might even have been lethal), unless they brought it in a shielded container and took the container away after remotely ejecting the source.
Last edited by Sanatanan on 10 Apr 2010 18:11, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 10 Apr 2010 17:50

This has occurred in other countries

Cesium Radiation Dispersal Disaster in Goiania, Brazil

    Table 1: Radiological Incident Fatalities 1981-2000 (1)
    Year Location Application Worker/Public Fatalities
    1981 Oklahoma, USA Industrial radiography 1/0
    1982 Kjeller, Norway Irradiation facility 1/0
    1984 Morocco Lost iridium-192 source 0/8
    1987 Goiania, Brazil Abandoned cesium-137
    teletherapy source 0/4
    1989 San Salvador Irradiation facility 1/0
    1990 Israel Irradiation facility 1/0
    1990 Zaragoza, Spain Linear accelerator 0/11
    1991 Nesvizh, Belarus Irradiation facility 1/0
    1992 Xinzhou, China Lost cobalt-60 source 0/3
    1992 Indiana, USA Iridium-192 brachytherapy 0/1
    1994 Tammiku, Estonia Abandoned scrap cesium-137 0/1
    1996 Costa Rica Cobalt-60 teletherapy 0/7
    2000 Thailand Lost cobalt-60 0/3
    2000 Egypt Lost iridium-192 0/2
    2000 Panama Cobalt-60 teletherapy 0/5

Lessons Learned The Hard Way

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Kavu » 10 Apr 2010 18:15

India, Pakistan have upset balance of nuclear deterrence: US

Oh, Yes. Only US and the countries which she chooses can possess Nuclear Weapons. Not that her musings is going to change anything in New Delhi. It is quite evident the short term goal of the US Administration is towards Pakistan's interest at the cost of India's, it works fine for the Chinese, especially the next 10 years being the most important part for our entry into superpowerdom
Last edited by Gerard on 10 Apr 2010 18:36, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: edited - copyright

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Amber G. » 10 Apr 2010 18:20

Aren't the institutions / establishments (big or small) operating such Co-60 sources subject to periodic physical (on-site) "safeguards inspections" by appropriate regulatory authorities more or less on the same lines as the IAEA inspections conducted on npps?


To put it in some perspective, As shivji said before Co-60 was used (specially before LinAcc etc) for radiation therapy. Such things can be bought by labs etc.. for example here:
United Nuclear
(Set of 5 disks for $335) (This is from Oak Ridge Reactors - from Russian reactors prices are cheaper)

(They are safely sealed, No NRC license required etc..)
http://unitednuclear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=2_5
(Half life is rather long (5 years), but still I don't know how much second hand/third hand (or used supply) is sold for..)

(One can also buy this from their gift shop)
container :)

... Added later:
This has occurred in other countries

(One rather famous case, IIRC was from US - scrap metal containing Co-60 in junkyard in Mexico).. around 1985..)
Last edited by Amber G. on 10 Apr 2010 18:41, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 10 Apr 2010 18:35

India, Pakistan have upset balance of nuclear deterrence: US


Not one word about Chinese proliferation?

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Kavu » 10 Apr 2010 18:57

Gerard wrote:
Not one word about Chinese proliferation?


Dont blame the Americans nor Chinese, They are doing quite well having frequent Media breifings by their Press Spokesmen and that really nasty looking Chinese Spokeswoman. While India does nothing. I am yet to see, Indian reaction to German parlimentry delgation harrassament to Modi and this issue too.

What stops India from raking up the Pakistani, Irani, Israeli and Chinese. Pakistan is not bothered about being called a problem, by equating India with Pakistan, they have snubbed us. Her assertion that somehow by India getting Nukes, has upset the pre-1967 balance of power, then yes, and there is next to nothing she can do about it. India will continue to make enough weapons to have the assured destruction of Pakistan and China together, which should be the logical assumption. Obama and his cronies are the worst thing that happened to America as well as India. This is coming from a woman whose country holds nearly 15000 nukes.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 10 Apr 2010 21:04

Radiation poisoning a reminder of need for better ‘nuclear security'
India is not alone in facing this problem. The U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission has reported losing track of over 1,500 sealed sources since 1996, with more than half that number untraceable.
of the 1,485 institutions in which the 7,850 nucleonic gauges are located, the AERB conducted just 16 inspections in 2008-09. Similarly, for 505 industrial radiography units, only 39 inspections were done.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 10 Apr 2010 23:07

I wonder if there will be calls to sue the manufacturer of this Co-60 radiation source or extradite them to India for criminal prosecution?

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 10 Apr 2010 23:44


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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby ramana » 11 Apr 2010 00:12

We have so many techies on the forum How about doing a root cause analysis of this Co-60 in the Delhi scrap Iron dealership?

The process is gather all the relevant news reports in one thread. Create a timeline and start identifying the causes. A cause should be correctable and within scope of correction and direct evidence via news report. Citing Fate or the Gods is not a cause.

Then we dig deeper to find the root cause of each path.

And try to describe the underlaying circumstances that allowed the causes to develop and exist.

Any one game or this? I will participate and request AmberG, our resident physicist, to also participate.

Google Cache of Co-60 in scrap iron shop

If we do this it might bring rigor to the process.

If we have traction we can do this in the GD Forum and then make it patent.


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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby CRamS » 11 Apr 2010 05:40

Kavu wrote:India, Pakistan have upset balance of nuclear deterrence: US

Oh, Yes. Only US and the countries which she chooses can possess Nuclear Weapons. Not that her musings is going to change anything in New Delhi. It is quite evident the short term goal of the US Administration is towards Pakistan's interest at the cost of India's, it works fine for the Chinese, especially the next 10 years being the most important part for our entry into superpowerdom



I think it was the famous N^3, an old BRite who first speculated that TSP is nuke nude. He is correct except that TSP is nuke nude in so far as the west & Israel are concerned, but not against SDREs. And that too will be taken away in a hearbeat once the west has Indian nukes in its kitty. The real target is India. So Obama & Co are not working towards TSP's interest, they are working for the west's interest, and unfortunatley for India, TSP has pegged everything it does including nukes with India.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby putnanja » 11 Apr 2010 05:58

Nuke Bill goof-up: minimum turns maximum


In an embarrassing turn of events for the government on the Civil Nuclear Liability Bill, it has now emerged that there is no extraneous legal compulsion to cap the overall liability amount at 300 million special drawing rights (SDRs). In fact, the international convention India wants to join sets the amount only as a minimum floor for eligibility and not as an upper ceiling. :roll: :roll:



This has now prompted a rethink on the operative portions of the Bill. In fact, sources said, the advice of the Ministry of External Affairs during consultations was to treat the amount as a “floor” and yet the Bill ended up projecting it as a cap. More importantly, the government seemed to justify that this was done to meet the pre-conditions of the Convention on Supplementary Compensation (CSC) for Nuclear Damage.



It’s, however, learnt that while detailing the specifics the Bill needs to address for India to become eligible to join the CSC, the MEA had made it known that 300 million SDRs was the floor and not a cap and also that the liability needs to be fixed on the operator and not the supplier.

...
Still, the Department of Atomic Energy retained the language which capped the amount. Now, after all the opposition, the DAE is said to be coming in for sharp criticism within the government for keeping the drafting of the Bill such a “secret affair” even though the PMO too was involved in the process. :shock:

The details about the liability were meant to mirror the requirements marked in Article III of the CSC, which spells out the “undertaking” a country wanting to join the regime needs to make. It states: “The Installation state shall ensure the availability of 300 million SDR or a greater amount that it may have specified to depository at any time prior to the nuclear incident.”


Yet, India’s Civil Liability for Nuclear Damage Bill, which has become a controversy even before its introduction, states: “The maximum amount of liability in respect of each nuclear incident shall be the rupee equivalent of three hundred million Special Drawing Rights.”

Given that there was no need to specify a “maximum amount”, sources said, the Bill could just have identified this as the “minimum” amount available on the table in case of an incident while remaining silent on the upper limit. Instead, the Bill caps the liability which was a step beyond what was needed.

...

...
...

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby niran » 11 Apr 2010 06:28

Sanatanan wrote:
Aren't the institutions / establishments (big or small) operating such Co-60 sources subject to periodic physical (on-site) "safeguards inspections" by appropriate regulatory authorities more or less on the same lines as the IAEA inspections conducted on npps? If this is the case, then illegal transfer of ownership of the Co-60 source to ill qualified person(s) or institution(s), without being detected, would not be possible (since working of the "pursuit" principle might preclude this from happening). Co-60 finding its way to the scrap market along the suggested route above would imply that the Regulation was not sufficiently effective in this case or was somehow circumvented. I, for one, do not feel that this might be the case in this instance.

A scenario about which there does not seem to be any speculative reports as yet is the possibility that this particular incident might have a "terrorist" angle (or be the handiwork of person(s) with malafide intentions), enacted to coincide with MMS's visit the US to attend a conference on nuclear security where he is expected to push for India to be allowed to host the proposed Global Centre on Nuclear Security (in return for agreeing to sign the NPT as a non-weapon country?).

However, an aspect of the above postulate would be that the person(s) who handled the radioactive source into the scrap yard would themselves have been exposed to radiation (might even have been lethal), unless they brought it in a shielded container and took the container away after remotely ejecting the source.


please read the reply here

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby V_Raman » 11 Apr 2010 08:41

CRamS wrote:I think it was the famous N^3, an old BRite who first speculated that TSP is nuke nude. He is correct except that TSP is nuke nude in so far as the west & Israel are concerned, but not against SDREs. And that too will be taken away in a hearbeat once the west has Indian nukes in its kitty. The real target is India. So Obama & Co are not working towards TSP's interest, they are working for the west's interest, and unfortunatley for India, TSP has pegged everything it does including nukes with India.


this is nothing new. i think indian strategy is to create enough economic clout for india, and stick to peace at all costs. S-e-S delinking of terror/talks, foreign secretary level talks etc. can be related to this. as long as we talk, pak cannot attack us officially right. regardless of which faction takes over TSPA, if there is a JDAM, then the west will be forced to make PAK nuke nude w.r.t SDREs as well.

one other strategy could be to build BMD so that PAK will be forced to up its arsenal. this increases the chances of JDAM and might force west to make PAK nuke nude as well.

this water issue has the potential to flare up and i eventually expect india to go slow on the dam construction if it comes to that. india will finish the needed project to retain the right to develop. but then go slow.

JMTP

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gagan » 11 Apr 2010 08:49

Hillary mamsahib's recent expose on India - Pakistan upsetting the nuclear applecart, specifically attempting to re-hyphenate, should be a sign of things to come at the wash dc N summit.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby NRao » 11 Apr 2010 10:04

Hillary Memsaheb is in competition with the DefDept. Also, Israel is on the loose. US is addicted to controlling someone...........

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Sanku » 12 Apr 2010 16:45

Just one thought to those who are holding the current Administration guilty of changing the Indo-US relations especially in nuclear areas.

It was ALWAYS predicted that this would happen, as far back as 2007. That was the need to get iron cast guarantees (at least on paper) and not leave threads open.

Going along with one persons enthusiasm (GWBs, assuming for a moment that he was sincere and not playing too) while ignoring the institutional behavior of GoTUS was always the recipe for falling flat on our face. I only thank god that the predicted came much sooner than expected (I was expecting to be solidly trapped before the switch happened) and Indians have gotten their backs up before much damage could be done. Hopefully we will have a way out yet.

Obama is actually the best US president for India. He saved us from a lot of trouble later (not just nukes) a lot. We should be truly grateful.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby kenop » 12 Apr 2010 18:54

Just watched an expert (didn't get the name) from DC thinktank on BBC's Impact Asia. Talking about Pakistan he said that the issue of their nuclear stock is related to Cashmere and its resolution has to happen prior to any other development. Nothing new there. But expecting to see some more effort being put in this direction by the powers.
Ombaba is surely working towards paying his dues for the advance Nobel.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 12 Apr 2010 21:08

kenop wrote:Just watched an expert (didn't get the name) from DC thinktank on BBC's Impact Asia. Talking about Pakistan he said that the issue of their nuclear stock is related to Cashmere and its resolution has to happen prior to any other development.


I had a sudden thought about why people say this. Basically they are stuck. As far as they are concerned there is going to be no reduction in the IndiaPakistan nuclear flashpoint.

Note that the entire world is sitting and hoping that Pakis (and Indian) nukes will somehow go away. As far as the "rest of the world" goes the world will never be free from danger of nuclear war unless IndiaPakistan denuke themselves. And the more they study the issue the more they feel that this is the most intractable issue. That of course is plain stupidity. Nukes are not going to go away anytime soon. But the powers who sit at the high table think that Iraq has been de nuked, iran will be denuked, Israel is safe and Korea is not a problem. But Pakistan is a problem that they cannot treat like Iraq or NoKo. So they are asking India to solve the problem, hoping it will go away if India capitulates.

The truth of course is that India will not capitulate and the problem will not go away and the risk of nuclear war will remain. And the West that is propping up Pakistan will keep paying money and the Pakis will keep threatening to nuke India.

India has a trump card up its sleeve which irritates the crap out of everyone. India says - all you great high seat occupiers - you guys get rid of all your nukes, we will follow suit and then let us all think about Pakistan. Of course the real joke is that nobody who has nukes actually wants to get rid of them - so they find a strawman- a bogey to blame and say that nukes are not going away because of IndiaPakistan.

I think it is important to remember the truth as it is.

1) Is IndiaPakistan a nuclear flashpoint? Yes. So what's new?
2) Is Pakistan going to give up nukes. Not unless the Kashmir problem is solved according to Pakis
3) Is India going to give up nukes? Certainly, as long as everyone else does so, simultaneously.
4) Are the nuclear powers going to give up nukes to please India? Balls.
5) Is India going to solve the "Kashmir problem" to Pakistan's satisfaction? Never
6) Is Pakistan going to give up nukes ever? No.

The bottom line is that everyone is a scheming ba$#ard who wants to keep his own nukes but wants everyone else to give up theirs. Everyone points at someone else and says "I am not going to give up because he has nukes"

So if you listen to Western "experts" you will find them pointing fingers at IndiaPakistan
Pakistan points fingers at India
India points fingers at everyone with nukes

Nobody is actually going to give up a weapon that has no real antidote. If something new comes up and renders nukes useless, everyone will scramble for that. It is a global power struggle that defies the "peaceful solution" of UN, IMF, Bretton woods whatever.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 12 Apr 2010 21:39

What does it mean if Pakistan drops one nuke (or more) on India and India does not retaliate?

It means that Pakistan is willing to use nuclear weapons and India is not.

What does it mean if there is a nuclear exchange between India and Pakistan?
It means that both India and Pakistan are willing to use nuclear weapons and that nuclear war is a reality that the world will have to live with.

What can the world do if Pakistan attacks and India takes a hit and does not retaliate?
a) It can say tsk tsk and let Pakistan retain its nukes, knowing that they are impotent to stop nuclear war.
b) The can worry that Pakistan, which has used a nuke and got away with it will be emboldened to use more nukes. They can further worry that other "nascent nuclear states" will be tempted to develop and use nukes because the world can do nothing about Pakistan

What can the world do if both India and Pakistan exchange nukes?
a) They can say tsk tsk and keep off. But if they do that it will embolden nascent states to acquire nukes because nobody can do anything other than say tsk tsk.
b) The world can try to "act" to stop any further use of nukes. But how? Are they going to attack India and denuke India? How? Are they going to attack Pakistan? Can denuking occur with conventional weapons?

OK assume that India is denuked by a threat from unkil and by sellouts from squeaky voiced slaves of foreign Catholics.

What of Pakistan. How will Pakistan be denuked? By conventional weapons? Heck a Pakistan that has just used nukes on India will be ready to use nuke on other as well.

So is Pakistan going to be denuked?

By whom?

Suppose the US nukes Pakistan to denuke Pakistan after scaring India into capitulation what does that mean?

It means that the US is once again ready to use nukes. What does that mean for Russia? What does that mean for China" What does that mean for Iran? NoKo?

It means use em or lose em.

Any IndiaPakistan nuclear exchange can become a "world headache".

Now you tell me folks. Based on the info I have posted above, or any other info you might want to post which of the following methods is the best way to avoid nuclear war

1) Give into Paki entreaties and ask India to hand Cashmere to Pakistan while nobody makes any promises about nukes?

2) or everyone agrees to get rid of nukes.

I know the answer that the world will choose, but which would be a dharmic answer? The right one.

Nobody is seriously interested in the right answer. Its all a silly joke. Timepass.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 12 Apr 2010 21:44

"I had a sudden thought about why people say this. Basically they are stuck. As far as they are concerned there is going to be no reduction in the IndiaPakistan nuclear flashpoint.

Note that the entire world is sitting and hoping t..."

Excellent. I have already copy and pasted this message to many friends and relatives. Hope you don't mind ;-)

There's another problem, as well. That any use of nuclear weapons against India could invite massive retaliation against the countries that have supplied Pakistan with the means. This is not another trump card, but it is positively something the world wishes to avoid. But they feel somehow, that India is more amenable to their nagging, cajoling and criticism than Pakistan, so they pick on and blame India for the problem/impasse, or place the responsibility more on India's shoulders than on Pakistan or any other country.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby NRao » 13 Apr 2010 01:22

kenop wrote:Just watched an expert (didn't get the name) from DC thinktank on BBC's Impact Asia. Talking about Pakistan he said that the issue of their nuclear stock is related to Cashmere and its resolution has to happen prior to any other development. Nothing new there. But expecting to see some more effort being put in this direction by the powers.


I am very glad that China and the US stopped, at giving Pakistan, only a U/Pu bomb. Something more sinister and Pakistan would have demanded entire India in one demand and these yahoos would have backed Pakistan. Even then 100 nukes and counting only for Kashmir. Cheap guys (including these think tankers). They should ask for a LOT more than Kashmir.

Ombaba is surely working towards paying his dues for the advance Nobel.


Hope they do not charge interest on that.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Chinmayanand » 13 Apr 2010 01:46

Pakistan has nukes and terrorist outfits because they bring them "zakat/jajiya" from kuffars. Not kashmir ,not nuke-nude India can make pakistan give up those two prized assets from pakistan. If Kashmir goes to pakistan , it will say that it needs nukes because India still has nukes or massive edge in conventional weapons.India has nukes because China has nukes.China has nukes because USA has nukes.USA has nukes because it wants to rule the world.The root cause is not Kashmir , the root cause is a nuclear USA. Even if USA gives up its nukes, Russia and China won't because USA enjoys massive superiority in conventional weapons. What applies to Indo-Pak , same applies to Sino-US and US-Russia.
So, bottomline is nobody is going to get rid of nukes. Not those who have them and those who don't have and are shit scared of US imperialism will strive for it.The more states get nuke power , the more powerless USA and its gang becomes.
Nuke free world is a farce and it's not gonna happen.
Even if everyone destroys its nukes, what's the guarantee that they won't make it chori-chori chupke chupke.Nobody gonna trust anybody on that.

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby ramana » 13 Apr 2010 02:05

Chinmay, Some thing to think over:

Rescuing a Potential Nuke from the Chile Quake

Could Bakis get hold of such HEU instead of the fake AQK manthan?

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 13 Apr 2010 04:58

Wouldn't they still have to enrich it to weapons grade?

shiv
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby shiv » 13 Apr 2010 06:18

Chinmayanand wrote:So, bottomline is nobody is going to get rid of nukes. Not those who have them and those who don't have and are shit scared of US imperialism will strive for it.The more states get nuke power , the more powerless USA and its gang becomes.
Nuke free world is a farce and it's not gonna happen.
Even if everyone destroys its nukes, what's the guarantee that they won't make it chori-chori chupke chupke.Nobody gonna trust anybody on that.



The more states get nuke power , the more powerless USA and its gang becomes.
..and the more they will blame somebody else for this nuclear imbroglio..Like India

Among world nations, the biggest suckers of them all are of two types
1) Voluntary suckers - those who gave up nukes despite the capability to have and retain them
2) Involuntary suckers - those who could never get nukes anyway and foreswore the right to get them (like me talking of divorcing Angelina Jolie)

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby NRao » 13 Apr 2010 07:00

Chinmayanand wrote:Nuke free world is a farce and it's not gonna happen.


The issue right now is that the US/West - in particular - have lost control. Control over "terrorists" (cannot use that word any more since Obama and Mrs. Clinton have dropped it).

They are spending Billions to make sure that even by mistake the Ts do not get a nuke into their forted countries. And Kiyanis are of no use. As Ramana has been stating it is the Yahoos with the TSPA - those that will become Gens in about 10 years - that are of concern. The Real Terrorists, who cannot be called terrorists, but really are.

Heard the Egyptian Foreign Minister. Mumble, fumble ................ took a cool 30 seconds to point fingers at Israel and Iran!!!! As though restraining Iran will solve the problem all by itself. China has done it. Pakistan has done it. "It" = proliferation. But no one can say it in public that the King has no clothes.

Also, I did not know this:
1) ALL participants had been told to bring a "Gift" - something that they will commit to towards "nonproliferation", and
2) It was scripted. This was expected - cannot have 40 Head's of State for two days and have them come to a conclusion. However, the tamasha/circus had to go on.

Damn them "terrorists". What a waste of monies. (Per Obama + Clinton, we cannot say "Islamic" "Terrorists". Only as a FYI.)

Gerard
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 13 Apr 2010 07:12

India's gift:
India to set up global nuclear centre
When he speaks at the plenary session on Tuesday Manmohan will announce a major Indian initiative to fund and set up a Global Centre for Nuclear Energy Partnership in the country. It will have various schools that would focus on nuclear security, advanced nuclear energy systems, application of radioisotopes for medicine and radiological studies. The Centre would offer formal training and education for all interested countries. India plans to project the Centre as a showcase of its “cradle to grave” nuclear expertise that it has built over six decades and also demonstrate the country’s commitment and expertise towards enhancing global nuclear safety, security and energy related issues.

JE Menon
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby JE Menon » 14 Apr 2010 01:55

Apparently centres to be set up by China and Japan as well :)
Pakisatan is going to be frothing at the mouth.. :twisted:

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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 14 Apr 2010 03:09


Amber G.
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Amber G. » 14 Apr 2010 03:23

X -post (posted in full in the intentional nuclear thread)
Statement by PM Manmohan Singh at Nuclear Security Summit, Washington DC

Gerard
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 14 Apr 2010 04:51


Gerard
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Re: India Nuclear News And Discussion

Postby Gerard » 14 Apr 2010 06:54



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