India-US News and Discussion

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Vikas » 28 Jun 2009 05:39

Obama Appoints Kashmiri Muslim as US Envoy to Muslim World

I have a problem with the title of the article. Why could it not say 'Indian Muslim'.
Why did it had to be Kashmiri Muslim. When Bobby Jindal became Governor, no one said ,"A Punjabi American has won"
Too much of Psy-ops in operation I guess or maybe I am being too sensitive here.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 28 Jun 2009 06:48

Sanjay M wrote:Brzezinski Strongly Favors 'G2' Sino-US Alliance

A leading proponent of the G2 is former US national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski, who advised President Barack Obama during his campaign.


IMVVVVHO, ZBrz, has a great command over the English language.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby shravan » 29 Jun 2009 21:15

I don't know where to post it, so posting it here
--------
Posted on Youtube - June 29, 2009
General of US Intelligence says No Plane Hit The Pentagon!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0iry3fiHU4

Major General Albert "Bert" N. Stubblebine III, head of all intelligence says:
Pentagon was NOT hit by a plane, WTC 7 brought down by explosives, Media in America is controlled.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 29 Jun 2009 22:12

shravan wrote:I don't know where to post it, so posting it here
--------
Posted on Youtube - June 29, 2009
General of US Intelligence says No Plane Hit The Pentagon!!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0iry3fiHU4

Major General Albert "Bert" N. Stubblebine III, head of all intelligence says:
Pentagon was NOT hit by a plane, WTC 7 brought down by explosives, Media in America is controlled.


Please research such things before posting.

Albert Stubblebine

He is known for his interest in parapsychology and was a supporter of the Stargate Project.

Stubblebine appeared in the 2006 documentary "One Nation Under Siege"[1] where he states that a Boeing 757 airplane could not have crashed into The Pentagon on September 11, 2001.

He features prominently in Jon Ronson's book The Men Who Stare at Goats where he is described as attempting to walk through walls - "General Stubblebine passionately believes the First Earth Battalion doctrine that every human being alive was capable of performing supernatural miracles...".[2]


His last assignment with the Army was in 1984.

Do not think this is meant for BR discussions ............................ ?????????

At least such material rarely makes it here.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby shravan » 29 Jun 2009 22:46

NRao wrote:Please research such things before posting.


NRao Ji,

I think you have done a lot of research on this subject. It would be great NYC CAN Delivers 52,000 Signatures to City Council -June 27, 2009 if you can answer their questions.

------------
Everyone who talks about 9/11 is called a Conspiracy Theorist.

----------
Major General Albert N. Stubblebine III
He retired as the Commanding General of the United States Army Intelligence and Security Command (INSCOM). Prior to this assignment he commanded the US Army Electronics Research and Development Command (ERADCOM). During his active duty career he commanded soldiers at every level. After his retirement he served as the VP for Intelligence Systems with BDM, a major defense contractor. He has brought these experiences to leading-edge medical research and development in collaboration with his wife Rima E. Laibow, M.D.

He is a long-term out-of-the-box thinker who redesigned the U.S. Army's Intelligence Architecture while serving as the Commanding General of the U.S. Army's Intelligence School and Center. This intelligence restructuring earned him his place in the Intelligence Hall of Fame.

Among his other accomplishments, he participated in a special task force which defined the requirements of the U.S. Army for future conflict. Many of the innovations he developed helped the U.S. to conduct the First Gulf War effectively and swiftly with a very low casualty rate.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 29 Jun 2009 23:53

Dont waste bandwith at tilting at windmills. That means delete those CT posts.

Meanwhile

Spread the word: Obama says he digs Urdu poetry

If you want to make high-brow small talk at one of President Barack Obama’s cocktail parties, don’t bother brushing up your Shakespeare. Try reading Urdu poetry.

As POLITICO’s Ben Smith points out in his blog, Obama showed off his intellectual flair by evoking a standard of Pakistani culture in a recent interview with Dawn, a popular English-language newspaper in Pakistan.

“‘I would love to visit. As you know, I had Pakistani roommates in college who were very close friends of mine. I went to visit them when I was still in college; was in Karachi and went to Hyderabad. Their mothers taught me to cook,’ said Mr Obama.

‘What can you cook?’

‘Oh, keema ... daal ... You name it, I can cook it. And so I have a great affinity for Pakistani culture and the great Urdu poets.’

‘You read Urdu poetry?’

‘Absolutely. So my hope is that I’m going to have an opportunity at some point to visit Pakistan,’ said Mr Obama.”

It may sound somewhat esoteric, but this ancient form of mystical and oft-times philosophical love poetry has been popular in Pakistan and parts of India for centuries. And there are a few things to know before you try to impress the poetry-lover-in-chief.

One of the most popular poets was Mirza Ghalib, whose work dates from the mid-19th century. The still-popular art form usually features the story of a lover scorned by his beloved. And there is almost never a happy ending. “Often the beloved is often a total witch,” :mrgreen: says Gwen Kirk, a University of Texas master’s candidate in the subject of Urdu poetry. “She breaks the lover’s heart all the time; she neglects him. It’s all about the process of trying to get closer to the beloved, and it’s got a lot of Sufi and mystical elements as well.”

The ghazal is the most common form of Urdu poetry, and, like sonnets, it follows strict rules of form: four to 12 couplets with a meter and rhyme scheme. But the similarities end there. Couplets in an Urdu poem can sometimes be completely unrelated to each other, each delving into themes that range from unrequited love to the meaning of life. :mrgreen:

Fear not if your Urdu — one of two official languages in Pakistan — is a little rusty. Obama likely reads one of the many translated compilations of the texts, according to Kirk. Or if he is a truly savvy Urdu poetry enthusiast, he may choose to listen to the poems recited or sung, as it is commonly performed in the region.

Obama’s admission that he shares an affinity with the “great Urdu poets” may get him further in the region than most think. The language and poetry are commonly associated with Pakistan’s and India’s Muslim population, according to Kirk, and it remains intensely popular in the region — poetry recitals sometimes attract gatherings of thousands of people.

“It does show a willingness to understand that part of the world,” says Kirk.

And in general, it gives Obama further credibility as a supporter of the arts. Not only is he one of three American presidents to have poetry read at their Inaugurations, but he reads the stuff, too!

Want to dig into Urdu poetry? Here’s an example of what awaits you:

To hell with all hindering walls and doors!

Love’s eye sees as feather and wing, walls and doors.

My flooded eyes blur the house

Doors and walls becoming walls and doors.

There is no shelter: my love is on her way,

They’ve gone ahead in greeting, walls and doors.

The wine of your splendor floods

Your street, intoxicating walls and doors.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0609/24055.html



Looks like TSP is very apt in appropriating Urdu from India. She/He has a Urdu relationship with the US with frequent role reversals.

Both TSP and US think the other is the beloved. And write in Paki media.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Keshav » 30 Jun 2009 07:04

Despite all of India's paeons to Urdu, it still doesn't get the recognition. I suppose you can't blame the media for being two-dimensional (have they ever told the whole story?), but I suppose that author looked up Pakistan and saw Urdu as the official language.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby SSridhar » 30 Jun 2009 09:26

Keshav wrote:Despite all of India's paeons to Urdu, it still doesn't get the recognition. I suppose you can't blame the media for being two-dimensional (have they ever told the whole story?), but I suppose that author looked up Pakistan and saw Urdu as the official language.


Keshav, I have taken this discussion to TSP Thread as it is OT here; See here

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Ameet » 30 Jun 2009 09:51

Largest Hindu temple in US opens in Minnesota. Cost at around $10M and takes up 43,000 sq. ft.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/29/us/29hindu.html?_r=1

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby csharma » 30 Jun 2009 09:57

http://news.rediff.com/report/2009/jun/ ... n-ties.htm

Indian envoy questions US stance on Indo-Iran ties

Meera Shankar, India's envoy to the United States, on Monday said there are 'double standards' in the US about the issue of India's ties with Iran.

Shankar said that while it is true that India has relations with Teheran, there are American companies as well who have ties with some sectors in that country, through their local subsidiaries.

Although she did not spell it out, Shankar's comment indirectly pointed out that those American companies' ties with Iran did not come under Washington's scanner.

"But singling out one country (like India) is not good. We also see that Pakistan and Iran have signed an agreement on a gas pipeline, but that does not figure as a condition for (American) aid to Pakistan,' she said while alluding to the US Senate's approval of tripling of the country's aid to Pakistan last week.

"So, there are double standards operating here," Shankar said in response to a question about India's ties with Iran and its possible impact on Indo-US relationship.

She was delivering special remarks at a conference on 'US-Indian relations in the Obama [ Images ] era', organised by the American Enterprise Institute in Washington DC.

Among those who addressed the morning conference included Robert Blake, assistant secretary of state for South and Central Asia affairs, besides two panel of speakers including George Perkovich, director of the nonproliferation programme at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace in Washington as well as Arvind Panagariya, Jagdish Bhagwati professor of Indian political economy at Columbia.

Danielle Pletka, who has served for ten years as a senior professional staff member for the Near East and South Asia on the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations before joining the AEI, posed a question about US aid to Islamabad [ Images ] to Shankar. She responded by stating that New Delhi [ Images ] shared the concerns of the US about stabilising Pakistan and Afghanistan and moving them towards the direction of stability and moderation.

So that the achievement of this objective can be best pursued, said Shankar, New Delhi supports the flow of assistance to Pakistan, particularly economic assistance, which is essential at this stage given the very precarious state of Pakistan's economy, but not so much the military assistance.

"As far as security assistance is concerned, we feel it should be focused specifically on building counter-terrorism capabilities rather than making provisions for conventional defence equipment," she said.

"And, of course we think that the pursuance of the objective that we share will certainly be easier, if there are benchmarks to ensure that the assistance is linked to deliverables on the ground and that there is both transparency and accountability in the process," Shankar added.

Asked if China was getting priority over India under the new US administration, Shankar said India does not compare its relationship with the US in terms of Washington's relationship with other countries.

"We hope that the US would give priority to India on its own merits. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton [ Images ] is due to visit India in July and we hope that visit would provide the basis for a roadmap to take the India-US relationship to the next level," she said.

Shankar also fielded questions from the audience on terrorism from across the border with Pakistan and why the composite dialogue with Islamabad failed to take off. She said that even after the terrorist attack on Mumbai [ Images ] in November last year, launched by terrorist outfits from Pakistan, and the earlier attack on the Indian embassy in Kabul, in which there was direct involvement of elements from Pakistan's security agencies, New Delhi took a restrained view and continued dialogue.

She pointed out that even though the public opinion in India was against restraint, "we still did not take any retaliatory measures. Not even after the Mumbai attack. We have stressed that the perpetrators of terrorism have been brought to book and there are tangible signs of that," she said.

"I think it is important that there is some honesty and sincerity because in the absence of those, it would be extremely difficult to have a constructive dialogue. Terrorism [ Images ] and dialogue cannot go hand in hand. We would like to see honesty and sincerity from Pakistan on this issue," Shankar said.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby ashish raval » 30 Jun 2009 15:45

^^ I loved the fact that she pointed out US duplicity an standards dealing with other nations. This clearly sends them a message that you are not dealing with a nation who does not understand the games nations play. Every US move is monitored in the region. I would also suggest that Indian diplomats compile list/s of double standard behaviour followed by US in each and every sector and present them at appropriate time/place at appropriate forums. This is one way US can be forced to down the rhetoric and leg-touching on each and every issues in the region.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 30 Jun 2009 16:20

Cairo, Islamabad, Delhi And Washington D.C.: Unitive Quantrangle through Obama Incarnationn by V R Krishna Iyer: Mainstream Weekly (June 13, 2009)

The author is a former judge of the Supreme Court.


I couldn't make out whether the honorable judge was really serious or really sarcastic.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Gerard » 30 Jun 2009 16:30

He will probably invite Obama to join his "Concerned Citizens Tribunal" and investigate state terrorism by the Government of India.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby arunsrinivasan » 30 Jun 2009 16:58

I hate to use such language against a person who has held such high constitutional posts, but VR Krishna Iyer is a left wing crackpot, not very different from Arundhati Roy.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Tilak » 30 Jun 2009 18:03

csharma wrote:Indian envoy questions US stance on Indo-Iran ties

Meera Shankar, India's envoy to the United States, on Monday said there are 'double standards' in the US about the issue of India's ties with Iran.



*** Must Watch ***

Watch the whole event@AEI(CSpan) (**Flash Required**)

"U.S.-India Natural Allies? Relations in Obama Era" Click On Watch , ***Top Right Corner***

---> Direct Link to Video

Product ID: 287331-1
Format: Forum
Last Airing: 06/30/2009
Event Date: 06/29/2009
Length: 3 hours, 25 minutes
Location: Washington, DC, United States



A panel discussion was held on U.S.-India relations in the Obama Administration. Topics included security and economic issues affecting both countries.

In the opening session, Indian Ambassador to the U.S. Meera Shankar was interviewed by Danielle Pletka, and she responded to audience members' questions.

9:00 A Conversation on U.S.-Indian Relations Special Remarks: · AMBASSADOR MEERA SHANKAR, Embassy of India Moderator: · DANIELLE PLETKA, AEI 9:30 Panel I: Setting the Course: Priorities for U.S.-Indian Defense and Security Cooperation Panelists: · DAN BLUMENTHAL, AEI · PETER LICHTENBAUM, BAE Systems · SUSAN A. MARAGHY, Lockheed Martin · GEORGE PERKOVICH, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace Moderator: · GARY J. SCHMITT, AEI

10:40 Panel II: The Future of International Economic Cooperation: Civil Nuclear Cooperation, Doha, Outsourcing, and Beyond Panelists: · CLAUDE BARFIELD, AEI · SUSAN G. ESSERMAN, Steptoe & Johnson · DAVID GOOD, Tata Sons · ARVIND PANAGARIYA, Columbia University Moderator: · NEENA SHENAI, AEI

11:55 Keynote Address Introduction: · DANIELLE PLETKA, AEI Keynote Speaker: · ROBERT BLAKE, assistant secretary of state for South and Central Asian affairs

12:30 Adjournment


Tags : CTBT, FMCT, MMRCA, China (String of Pearls), CISMOA, EUVA, US Nuclear Reactors/Nuclear Deal, Mumbai Attacks, Terrorism , Af-Pak, Iran

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 30 Jun 2009 18:18

Nice to see someone who can clearly communicate points of interest in simple, fluent and clear language.

However, Sino-Iran relations should be of a greater concern to the US and yet not one person in the US has the guts to mention this fact.

An Indian company at the most will enhance some aspects of the Iranian economy. Chinese involvement will certainly culminate with a US war ship sinking.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby CRamS » 30 Jun 2009 20:11

ashish raval wrote:^^ I loved the fact that she pointed out US duplicity an standards dealing with other nations. This clearly sends them a message that you are not dealing with a nation who does not understand the games nations play. Every US move is monitored in the region. I would also suggest that Indian diplomats compile list/s of double standard behaviour followed by US in each and every sector and present them at appropriate time/place at appropriate forums. This is one way US can be forced to down the rhetoric and leg-touching on each and every issues in the region.


I respectfully disagree. It was at best a politically correct half-hearted hocus pocus. In addition to poinitng out US companies doing business in Iran, what wopuld have made more of an impact is pointing out that US should look at its own record in funding TSP to the detriment of India. That did not come out as clearly and forcefully as it should.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Keshav » 30 Jun 2009 20:17

Ameet wrote:Largest Hindu temple in US opens in Minnesota. Cost at around $10M and takes up 43,000 sq. ft.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/29/us/29hindu.html?_r=1


I wish they'd stop making temples and actually do something with the ones they already have.

Once all the immigrant parents die, all these temples are going to fall into great disuse.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby putnanja » 30 Jun 2009 20:28

Keshav wrote:I wish they'd stop making temples and actually do something with the ones they already have.

Once all the immigrant parents die, all these temples are going to fall into great disuse.


I don't think so. There are a good number of immigrants coming into US every year, with student population alone being around 30-40k. So, there will always be patrons for these temples, even if the 2nd gen american-indians turn away from it. In Seattle region, there are currently 4 temples and most of its patrons are 30-40 year olds, not the older generation from 60s and 70s( though the older generation did all the grunt work and put in lot of money and effort to buy land, permits etc). In bay area, the temples built by the earlier generation who came to US in 70s & 80s still has good number of devotees.

As long as there are FOB desis and older immigrants and their kids who wish to remain hindus, there will be no disuse of hindu temples. If those cities themselves die, then all bets are off, and that would be similar to the old abandoned churches in deserted towns.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby Keshav » 30 Jun 2009 20:36

RaviBg wrote:As long as there are FOB desis and older immigrants and their kids who wish to remain hindus, there will be no disuse of hindu temples. If those cities themselves die, then all bets are off, and that would be similar to the old abandoned churches in deserted towns.


The fact remains that Hinduism has not adapted to the climate and that temples have remained relics of bland ritual worship with no ties to the community.

Hindu temples do not serve the community. There are several ways it can change, but change cannot come without the younger generation of which there will be none since the second generation kids never became part of the culture.

The fault ultimately lies in the religious leadership in India. Instead of teaching people about the religion and getting them excited about it, our parents learned some vain rituals.

For example, the other day on campus, I saw several Muslim magazines created by the youth and for the youth.

I saw another show on PBS called "The New Muslim Cool" where Islam is becoming more and more relevant in hip hop and other big musical styles.

Where will you ever find a Hindu so enthused about his religion/culture?

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby vsudhir » 30 Jun 2009 20:37

I don't think so. There are a good number of immigrants coming into US every year, with student population alone being around 30-40k. So, there will always be patrons for these temples, even if the 2nd gen american-indians turn away from it. In Seattle region, there are currently 4 temples and most of its patrons are 30-40 year olds, not the older generation from 60s and 70s( though the older generation did all the grunt work and put in lot of money and effort to buy land, permits etc). In bay area, the temples built by the earlier generation who came to US in 70s & 80s still has good number of devotees.


Good point. Besides, yindoo temples are more than just religious/spitirual places. They are also centers of social gathering in a phoren land. Festivals, marriages and other functions are celebrated. Some family or the other sponsors pujas, satyanarayan vratas and free lunches (mahaprasadams) at my local temple every month (almost).

Then there's bal vihar which sees pretty decent attendence by many pre-teens. An institutional learning and knowledge transfer, if you will.

No sir, temples are far from useless onlee.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby putnanja » 30 Jun 2009 20:46

Keshav wrote:The fact remains that Hinduism has not adapted to the climate and that temples have remained relics of bland ritual worship with no ties to the community.

Hindu temples do not serve the community. There are several ways it can change, but change cannot come without the younger generation of which there will be none since the second generation kids never became part of the culture.

The fault ultimately lies in the religious leadership in India. Instead of teaching people about the religion and getting them excited about it, our parents learned some vain rituals.

For example, the other day on campus, I saw several Muslim magazines created by the youth and for the youth.

I saw another show on PBS called "The New Muslim Cool" where Islam is becoming more and more relevant in hip hop and other big musical styles.

Where will you ever find a Hindu so enthused about his religion/culture?


This is not true by any means. Hindus do not wear religion on their sleeves like some other faiths. Yes, there might be people who wear bindi and sarees, but that is also due to our culture. Hindus don't believe in getting converts, nor do they think that religion should dictate every aspect of their life. Your example of islam doesn't work with hindus because muslims think everything should be done in accordance with their book. Hindus are fine with praying in the morning(if possible), go to work/school, come back and relax, and probably go to temple when they have time, once a week or in a month. Doesn't make them any less hindu. For most hindus, religion comes to the forefront only if someone tries to abuse it, or claim theirs is the right way. Else, the religion will be in the background most of the time.

In most temples around here in seattle, there are programs for children every weekend which teaches them about hindu culture and religion. And as sudhir pointed out, many functions like satyanarayana vrathas, weddings, anna prashanams etc take place in the temple along with special programs on all important hindu festivals. So they do build a sense of community.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby CRamS » 30 Jun 2009 21:28

deleted
Last edited by CRamS on 30 Jun 2009 22:37, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 30 Jun 2009 21:57

Where will you ever find a Hindu so enthused about his religion/culture?


To add to what Ravi posted, "Hindus" (no such word exists in "Hinduism") it is there in every aspect of a "Hindus" life - when practiced properly: food, music (shastriya sangeet - nothing called "Indian Classical Music" - a Western concept), language, cloths/fashions/jewelry/etc, arts.

It permeates our entire life - but - we are not aware of it because we refuse to study it, and actually to a great extent misuse it (bhajans is an example).

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby putnanja » 30 Jun 2009 22:00

CRamS, sent. Please remove your mail from the post above.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 30 Jun 2009 22:15

Paki editorial!!!

Editorial: Our demands from the US

The US National Security Adviser, General (Retd) James L Jones, has met everyone who matters in Pakistan — President Asif Ali Zardari, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gilani and Chief of Army Staff General Ashfaq Kayani. The atmospherics are reported to have been good and Pakistan’s leaders were able to put their demands on the table to the guest who went on to visit India next. If there was a meeting of the minds on the military operation going on against Baitullah Mehsud, there was also the insistence on the part of Pakistan on its old agenda vis-à-vis India.

Pakistan has trimmed its sails realistically by not out-rightly opposing the addition of 21,000 US troops in Afghanistan. It has now actually asked that the troop increase help Pakistan’s operation in South Waziristan: “Washington has agreed to the Pakistani demand to deploy its troops along the Afghan border to prevent cross-border movement of terrorists and spill-over of refugees.” The US is expected to ramp up its offensive by August-September this year as action under its new “Af-Pak” strategy. One can therefore expect Pakistan to get into the decisive phase of its operation in South Waziristan after a month or so.

President Zardari has asked General Jones to clear the way for the US loan of missile-firing drones to Pakistan; and Prime Minister Gilani, apart from asking for a debt write-off, has requested him to convince India to get back into talks with Pakistan. Mr Gilani has also tried to persuade him to get the US “to play its role in resolving the Kashmir and water disputes with India”. Gen Jones’ comment on TV was: “the US wanted to be of help in the process of normalisation of relations between India and Pakistan” and that he would be carrying a message of equality, fairness and reason for the Indian leadership.

It is a good augury that Pakistan is now thinking of accepting the US troop beef-up in Afghanistan as part of its own strategy in South Waziristan. Its earlier stance was probably based on a situation in which Pakistan was not engaged in South Waziristan and therefore feared an influx of the bad Taliban into FATA to further exacerbate the disorder there. It is clear that the national consensus against the Taliban in Pakistan has caused the change in outlook. Now it wants US troops deployed along the border to block the movement of terrorists from both sides.

The drone issue is a part of the “trust deficit” dating back to the time when Pakistan was looking at the Taliban as a “military asset” promising a foothold in Afghanistan if India made too many inroads there. The US has gone through times when intelligence shared with Pakistan ended up with the Taliban who then moved out of the target areas assigned to the drones. There is still a bit of the old fog left in this bilateral conversation as it is not clear what may happen if the drones given to Pakistan are controlled by a certain kind of “ideological” officers. But the situation has changed and requires a different handling of the drone issue now.

As for the Kashmir and “waters” issue, the US should nudge India towards resolution. And one reason for that would be America’s own meeting of the minds with India on the issue of punishing the terrorists whom Pakistan has been using as “non-state actors”. The talks on Kashmir under Gen Musharraf had moved on to the “azadi” tack for the Kashmiris and got stuck on the various modalities of possible “autonomy”. We can pick up on that and finish the job.

Indo-Pak disputes are a victim of trust deficit and lack of normalisation. The waters don’t belong in the “dialogue” but come separately under the Indus Waters Treaty, and the last time we went to the World Bank to resolve the Baglihar Dam dispute we did not win big. Friendly, trade-based ties with India will probably uncover a “third-party” as the real enemy: the changing ecology. If India is acting coy, Pakistan is not letting on that it needs the dialogue with India as a precondition to taking on the Taliban. The sooner this pantomime is broken the better. *

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 30 Jun 2009 22:16

Indian MPs seek safeguards on US aid to Pakistan

June 29th, 2009 - 11:07 am ICT by IANS

By Arun Kumar
Washington, June 29 (IANS) A group of Indian parliamentarians has told Washington that its “Af-Pak policy must necessarily have an inbuilt safeguard component to prevent the direct and indirect diversion of enormous US aid for potentially anti India activities by Pakistan.”

The Indian concerns were conveyed during three-days of meetings, discussions, and interactions with US politicians, policy analysts, and senior US government officials in New York City and Washington after the third edition of India-Yale Parliamentary Leadership Programme concluded last week.

“It was a two way traffic. We wanted a better insight into the US policymakers way of thinking,” said Abhishek Singhvi, national spokesperson of the Congress party. “We were able to firmly and unequivocally convey Indian concerns of contemporary intelligence of far reaching significance.”

Apart from concern about Pakistan, the parliamentarians “conveyed the huge Indian concern about the continued non-reduction of aggregate carbon emissions from USA” as also the “legitimate Indian concerns regarding the scope for progressive reduction and elimination of agricultural subsidies by developed countries including the US.”

The leadership programme “created as always an amazing intra delegation bonding” and provided “an appropriate forum to pause and reflect on vital issues of contemporary significance-something not always possible amidst the hurly burly of parliamentary politics in India,” Singhvi said.

Prakash Javadekar, spokesperson of the Bharatiya Janata Party saw further movement in India-US relations. “Definitely there are concerns from climate change, on agricultural subsidies to Af-Pak policy that we were able to convey very clearly and I think it will be noted,” he said.

Anurag Singh Thakur, Bharatiya Janata Party member from Himachal Pradesh, said the Yale programme would help all the parliamentarians. “It’ll widen our horizons, bring in more confidence and more knowledge and help us do better once we go back.”

Priya Dutt, Congress member of the Lok Sabha, thought the whole Yale programme was “fantastic”. With best professors from Yale speaking on various issues “it opened our minds so much and it was a great learning experience,” she said.

On India-US relationship, she said despite concerns about some issues: “We still got a sense of a relationship which has built into something very strong. India is perceived as a very strong progressive nation.”

“We spoke about how we can synergise in various fields - education and health research and development-and how the two countries can really complement in those fields,” Dutt said. “I feel the India-US relationship is something which is just going to grow from here on.”

“In many ways this programme is fantastic especially for policy makers and politicians in a way to broaden your horizon,” Dutt said.

More than 30 members of India’s parliament have participated in the programme since it was launched in 2007 in collaboration with the Federation of Indian Chambers of Commerce and Industry and the India-US Forum of Parliamentarians.

(Arun Kumar can be contacted at arun.kumar@ians.in)


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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 30 Jun 2009 22:20


RamaY
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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby RamaY » 01 Jul 2009 04:10

Keshav wrote:
Ameet wrote:Largest Hindu temple in US opens in Minnesota. Cost at around $10M and takes up 43,000 sq. ft.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/29/us/29hindu.html?_r=1


I wish they'd stop making temples and actually do something with the ones they already have.

Once all the immigrant parents die, all these temples are going to fall into great disuse.


:lol: You will be there Keshav-ji!

You do not understand but it is part of cultural identification. When all humans die, all these roads, dams, schools also will fall into great disuse... whatta do?

"Jatasya Hi Dhruvo Mrityu" - Death is certain of that which is born. (Gita: 2-27).

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby ramana » 01 Jul 2009 04:37

Its the same temple that the idols were vandalized sometime back. its a good thing that it has been inaugrated or rather consecrated.

Keshav if its want for the immigrant parents you wouldnt be here.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby arun » 01 Jul 2009 07:41

Excerpt from article by Former Foreign Secretary Kanwal Sibal dealing with US pressure on India to resume a dialogue with Pakistan:

Proceed with caution

Kanwal Sibal
Tuesday, June 30, 2009 20:59 IST

……………………. US pressure on us to resume dialogue is a product of our weakness rather than any superior American argument, not only because the US itself has spurned a political dialogue with North Korea, Cuba and Iran for several decades, but also because it has traditionally bolstered Pakistan's capacity to confront us. The US wants to reduce post-Mumbai tensions so that the Pakistan military can be pressed to combat more robustly the extremists threatening the American position in Afghanistan.It is also to meet Pakistan's political demand for continued US entanglement in India-Pakistan differences, which it sees as favourable to its interests. But, forcing Pakistan to address India-related terrorism issues is not on the US agenda, as shown by president Obama's latest pronouncements on India-Pakistan relations that omit any reference to this central problem. Taking the initiative to talk to Pakistan ourselves does not preclude external interference as Pakistan does not believe in bilateralism and will always seek intervention of third parties directly or indirectly. ………………………..

DNA

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 07:56

As a FYI:

India’s US debt exposure jumps to $38.5 bn in April ’09

Meanwhile, the Bric nations - Brazil, Russia, India and China -- together have American debt of little over $1 trillion.
Out of the four countries, India has the least exposure to US debt. Till April this year, Russia and Brazil purchased these securities to the tune of $137 billion and $126 billion, respectively.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 08:32



India cannot enlarge the constituency of peace in Pakistan without concessions on Kashmir. If this constituency cannot alter civil-military relations within Pakistan, to expect it to change India-Pakistan equations against military will is wishful thinking.


This is a very powerful argument.

In fact, the US itself has been unable to help the "constituency of peace" within Pakistan for decades. To expect India to provide the lift-power is foolishness. It would do no one any good until the international community disbands the opposing constituency.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 08:35

It is the weakness exhibited by the US that is making progress very slow in Pakistan.

I think India has detected this weakness and expressed it in the form of Amby Meera Shankar's talk of last week.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby RajeshA » 01 Jul 2009 15:09

Al Franken declared winner after 8-month battle: The Philadelphia Inquirer
Franken's victory gives Democrats control of 60 Senate seats - the number they need to overcome Republican filibusters.
Oh Oh!

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby rkirankr » 01 Jul 2009 15:32

With both govts in US and India being pro appeasement, "understanding root causes" and all that, I think the real losers will be Indian people. Terrorists needed some respite and they will get it now. :((

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 19:45

Don't worry. The terrorists will figure out some ways to goof up and bring Obama to reality. A few more "pro-government" tribal leaders and reality will sink in.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 21:27

U.S. Resumes Surveillance Flights Over Pakistan

The sharing of real-time video feeds, communications intercepts and other information with Pakistan’s military is considered essential in the country’s campaign to help hunt down the Taliban leader, Baitullah Mehsud, and destroy his hideouts and forces in the country’s northwest, the officials said.


Under the intelligence-sharing arrangement, which resumed in the past few weeks but has not previously been made public, Pakistani ground forces receive direct support for several hours a day, though not necessarily every day, from remotely piloted American military aircraft based in Afghanistan, a senior American defense official said.


“There has been a lot of improvement in I.S.R.-related U.S. support to Pakistan,” said a senior Pakistani security official, referring to intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance. But, he acknowledged, the technical connections have not been completely worked out.

American and Pakistani officials are still installing equipment to enhance and expand the flow of information from the joint coordination center to Pakistani security databases across the border, the Pakistani official said.


Such activities can only create a greater divide between pro-government and Islamists (NOT terrorists). AND, for such a pro-US program to succeed the divide has to grow.

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Re: India-US News and Discussion

Postby NRao » 01 Jul 2009 22:50

At times I wonder what impact will Karzai's discontent with the US and now Iran's spat (to say the very least)(Iran 'disqualifies' EU from talks), will have on Indian role in the region.

Today, when we compare the situations (relations with the "West") with even 6 months ago: Iran is worse and getting worse every day, Afghanistan I am not sure, but it seems to be about where it was or getting worse and of course Pakistan is real bad.

Looking up for India?


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