Indian Space Program Discussion

MN Kumar · Post by **MN Kumar** » 12 Jan 2010 13:01

Praveen wrote:
MN Kumar wrote:There was a snippet in a local FM channel that India is building an ARTIFICIAL MOON base near Bangalore on a 200 acre land. Didnt see this news anywhere else. Can anyone confirm?
Not a moon base, but the terrain for rover testing.

Thanks. Was expecting on the same lines. Nice to have a facility here instead of Russia.

shravan · Post by **shravan** » 12 Jan 2010 15:26

India to launch first manned spaceship in 2013

Moscow, Jan 12 (PTI) India would launch its first manned space flights by sending two astronauts in an orbit in a Russian spaceship in 2013, according to reports.

Willy · Post by **Willy** » 12 Jan 2010 15:41

Will the soyuz be mated to the GSLC-III? I doubt it. A launch vehicle has to be proven a number of times before it can be used for manned flight.

sunny y · Post by **sunny y** » 12 Jan 2010 15:42

Pardon my lack of understanding but why are we using russian spaceship when ISRO is building its own. We have already tested SRE earlier.

Are these two different missions ??
First one involving russian Soyuz in 2013 to familirise with all the technical things. Second one using ISRO SRE in 2015.
Am I correct ??

Vivek K · Post by **Vivek K** » 12 Jan 2010 23:36

Sunny like someone pointed ot earlier, there are other functions (like a space potty) in a crew capsule that need to be designed, constructed, validated and then implemented. We are using the Soyuz craft to jump these phases and to go straight into flight mode. I hope that we will reverse engineer to learn something from the craft.

Rahul, this is what I was complaining about. Help would mean a flight before 2015 and delay would mean a flight in 2020.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Jan 2010 04:15

SRE is for reentry into the earth's atmosphere. The Soyuz is for the 1 week space stay and descent into earth.

The SRE will be as big as a fighter aircraft cockpit with the antarikshyatris strapped onto their seats. Life support systems and comms equipment and heat shield outside only.

The Soyuz is as big as a Matador minibus (that we see in india's streets)

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 13 Jan 2010 04:20

The chinese Shenzhou Spacecraft is just like the Soyuz, only slightly bigger and the orbital module has its own propulsion.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 13 Jan 2010 19:12

shravan wrote:India to launch first manned spaceship in 2013

Moscow, Jan 12 (PTI) India would launch its first manned space flights by sending two astronauts in an orbit in a Russian spaceship in 2013, according to reports.

This will be carried out by the Russians. 3 crew. 1 Russian flight commander, 2 Indian mission specialists (trainees).

Willy wrote:Will the soyuz be mated to the GSLC-III? I doubt it. A launch vehicle has to be proven a number of times before it can be used for manned flight.

Mk-III has the capability to put 2 Soyuz spacecraft at one go. It has something else special in waiting.

sunny y wrote:Pardon my lack of understanding but why are we using russian spaceship when ISRO is building its own. We have already tested SRE earlier.

Are these two different missions ??
First one involving russian Soyuz in 2013 to familirise with all the technical things. Second one using ISRO SRE in 2015.
Am I correct ??

SRE is just a re-entry technology demonstrator. OV will use some technologies tested/to be tested on it.

The 2013-mission is a Russian mission will have 2 Indian crew. And yes it is to train them in the "real scenario".

Gagan wrote:

Indian OV will be the green part and the service module. An orbital module will later be added.

Jamal K. Malik · Post by **Jamal K. Malik** » 15 Jan 2010 20:16

VSSC launches sounding rocket to study eclipse

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 17 Jan 2010 12:14

Gagan update

Because of India’s location along the equatorial crest, ionospheric effects occur, which makes it difficult to predict and model navigation. GMV is working on a prototype algorithm for the detection of ionospheric depletions in the equatorial region for the receiver the operator uses to retrieve and process information provided by the GAGAN ground segment. This algorithm will then form part of the user receiver of the GAGAN space-based augmentation system, improving the safety performance for GAGAN users.

Avinash R · Post by **Avinash R** » 18 Jan 2010 20:23

India soon to become self-reliant in cryogenic propulsion technology: ISRO chief
PATHANAMTHITTA, January 17, 2010

India is getting ready to launch Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle (GSLV) with indigenously developed cryogenic engine, said Dr. K. Radhakrishnan, Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) chairman.

Dr. Radhakrishnan was talking to reporters at Sabarimala Sannidhanam during his 47th pilgrimage to Lord Ayyappa Temple there on Sunday.

He said ISRO is planning to test GSLV-D3 carrying the communication satellite GSAT-4 with a two tonne payload at Sriharikottah on January 24.

Dr. Radhakrishnan said achieving self-reliance in cryogenic propulsion technology would boost India’s image, besides taking it to the league of select countries having the technology. So far, India has been using Russian-made cryogenic engines in its launching vehicles.

He said ISRO was also planning to undertake a space mission to take man to space and bring him back safe after conducting studies for a few days there.

The ISRO chairman also said that the pilgrim facility at Sabarimala has been improved much in recent years.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 18 Jan 2010 23:50

Whoa, does this mean that all problems with the cryogenic engine have been sorted out, and ISRO is going to launch the GSLV Mark 2 on Sunday?? Or does the media mean to say that the engine and satellite( GSAT-3) are going to be tested, not launched, on Sunday. If the former, very encouraging, because just 3 weeks ago, they were talking about a March launch date.

A Nandy · Post by **A Nandy** » 19 Jan 2010 18:29

The equipment module will not be added later ? Is it not required on an Indian OV ?

vishwakarmaa · Post by **vishwakarmaa** » 20 Jan 2010 14:17

Avinash R wrote:Dr. Radhakrishnan said achieving self-reliance in cryogenic propulsion technology would boost India’s image, besides taking it to the league of select countries having the technology. So far, India has been using Russian-made cryogenic engines in its launching vehicles.

Typical Indian babu mentality of talking more and doing less. This mentality is more common amongst the old age types. They love "talking" and "boasting" hot air.

It would be better he discuss why there were delays in programme and what he did to resolve them. That will be knowledgeable as well as insightful to the audience, rather than usual decade-old boasting lectures.

vishwakarmaa · Post by **vishwakarmaa** » 20 Jan 2010 14:21

Our old generation was lazy and complacent. They always find excuses to legitimize past failures and paint them as "successes against odds".

Thankfully, I am not like that and new generation is pragmatic and not complacent. So, lets stop this silly practice of passing institutional lethargy as chankyaness.

If space programme were under TATA or private sector, India would have beat Russia by now in space technologies.

Thanks to **deleted** socialists who screwed us and our future.

rgsrini · Post by **rgsrini** » 20 Jan 2010 21:05

vishwakarma wrote:Thankfully, I am not like that and new generation is pragmatic and not complacent.

So, what have you done to Indian space program. You seem to know quite a bit about how to get things done pragmatically. I am dying to hear all your achievements...

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 20 Jan 2010 21:08

rgsrini wrote:
vishwakarma wrote:Thankfully, I am not like that and new generation is pragmatic and not complacent.
So, what have you done to Indian space program. You seem to know quite a bit about how to get things done pragmatically. I am dying to hear all your achievements...

No No. He is not old and may not be planning to get old. Nothing to do with outer space - maybe inter-aural space.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 20 Jan 2010 21:35

ISRO has certainly achieved great things, but what is irritating is the way they set targets that are too over-ambitious. In a 2003 issue of "Frontline", an ISRO spokesman was pretty confidently predicting a 2007 launch of the GSLV Mark 3. It is now 2010, and the launch is at least a year(probably 2) away. The GSLV Mark 2 was originally scheduled for sometime in 2006, 2007 at most. The Indian radarsat( RISAT-1) is also behind by 2 years. One explanation is that they have many projects going on simultaneously( semi-cryogenic engine, RLV, various versions of the PSLV, Mark 3, space capsule, next Chandrayaan etc) and they underestimate the amount of time and personnel required to deal with them all.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 21 Jan 2010 04:09

These delays are seen in other space programs - even those far better funded than ISRO

9 big NASA projects over budget

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 24 Jan 2010 03:22

Towards self-reliance in launch vehicle technology - T.S. Subramanian

...
The GSLV Mk-III will make India totally self-reliant in launch vehicle technology for launching INSAT class of communication satellites which are now being put in orbit for India by the European launcher Ariane-5.

In the fourth week of this month, the ISRO will cross a milestone in its efforts to develop this aerial powerhouse called the GSLV Mk-III when one of its two gigantic strap-on booster motors, S-200, erupts into life and fires for about 130 seconds. The motor will fire at the massive new test facility built at the Satish Dhawan Space Centre (SDSC), Sriharikota. The motor is called S-200 because it is powered by 200 tonnes of solid propellants.

...
In February first week, the ISRO will cross another milestone when the GSLV Mk-III’s core stage (L-110), powered by 110 tonnes of liquid propellants, fires for about 200 seconds at the huge test stand at the Liquid Propulsion Systems Centre (LPSC) at Mahendragiri near Nagercoil in Tamil Nadu.

A test for 15 seconds will be done to validate the performance of the engine and the associated ground facilities before the long-duration test is conducted for 200 seconds. The final preparations for testing the L-110 stage are on at Mahendragiri under the guidance of LPSC Director M.K.G. Nair.

Sub-systems are getting ready for undergoing tests at the same facility for the upper cryogenic stage, which will be fuelled by 25 tonnes of liquid oxygen and liquid hydrogen.

If everything goes on schedule, the first flight of the GSLV Mk-III will take place by the end of 2011. It is the most powerful rocket to be built by the ISRO, weighing 630 tonnes and 43.5 metres tall. It can put a satellite weighing four tonnes in a geo-synchronous transfer orbit with a perigee of about 200 km and an apogee of 36,000 km. It can put a satellite weighing 10 tonnes in a near-earth orbit at an altitude of about 300 km.

It has three stages. The two boosters, S-200, form the first stage. The boosters hug the core/second liquid stage. Above this liquid stage is the cryogenic stage.

...
...

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 24 Jan 2010 08:49

It can put a satellite weighing 10 tonnes in a near-earth orbit at an altitude of about 300 km.

Tremendously exciting stuff, this is very useful for all sorts of activities-from an Indian space station to putting together satellite and ballistic missile intercept defences.

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 24 Jan 2010 19:36

putnanja, the booster has already been tested successfully today! Nice one, ISRO. The 3rd largest existing solid booster in the world.

sunilUpa · Post by **sunilUpa** » 24 Jan 2010 20:30

India tests rocket booster for heavier satellites

India successfully conducted the static test of its largest solid booster for launching heavier satellites using the Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle (GSLV-Mk III), the space agency said Sunday.

“The solid booster (S200) will form the strap—on stage for the GSLV-Mark III, which is in advanced stage of development for launching four—tonne class of communication satellites,” the state-run Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) said in a statement here.

The test was conducted earlier in the day at ISRO’s spaceport (Satish Dhawan Space Centre) at Sriharikota in Andhra Pradesh, about 80 km north-east of Chennai.

The successful test makes S200 the third largest solid booster in the world, next to the reusable solid rocket motor (RSRM) solid booster of Space Shuttle of the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) and P230 solid booster of Ariane-5 of Arianespace, a launch service and solutions consortium of European countries.

AoA onlee..

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 24 Jan 2010 23:08

The ISRO website has an excellent write up about the s-200 and test, with a brochure giving lots of details.

Willy · Post by **Willy** » 24 Jan 2010 23:15

Dudes for all the table thumping about the GSLV MKIII isnt it going to be able to lift only 4 Tons into geo orbit? Our satellites are going to cross the 4 Ton threshold in the not to distant future. We need a far heavier lift capability not just for ourselves but also if we hope to corner a part of the market.

Also all we here about future launchers is the GSLV MkIII and the reusable one. Isnt there anything bigger even in the conceptual stage?

Also can someone shed light on what the soyuz going to be launched on? Is the launcher also going to be Russian? There is no way any Indian launcher is going to be validated for a manned launch by 2013.

Sridhar · Post by **Sridhar** » 24 Jan 2010 23:43

Willy,

Pls. look up the semi cryogenic engine and universal launch vehicle (also referred to as unified modified launch vehicle) programs of ISRO on this forum and elsewhere.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 25 Jan 2010 02:31

PICTURES: S200 static tests, L110

S200 successfully tested, L110 to follow.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 25 Jan 2010 04:10

Sridhar wrote:Pls. look up the semi cryogenic engine and universal launch vehicle (also referred to as unified modified launch vehicle) programs of ISRO on this forum and elsewhere.

Minor correction
UMLV - Unified Modular Launch Vehicle

ISRO Outcome Budget
http://www.isro.org/pdf/OutcomeBudget2009-2010.pdf

semi-cryogenic Engine / Stage Development: Developing a higher thrust semi-cryogenic core stage for the unified modular launch vehicle

The project is in initial stages. The final outcome, in terms of availability of higher thrust semi-cryogenic stage is expected after six years.

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 25 Jan 2010 05:03

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 25 Jan 2010 06:45

Hmm,

My khurafati brain says, that the S-200 measures 22 m length and 3.2 m diameter and is solid fuelled.

How far will it go if this was a Missile instead of a booster?

____________________________________________________________________________________________

Congrats ISRO !

Sridhar · Post by **Sridhar** » 25 Jan 2010 11:58

Gerard wrote: Minor correction
UMLV - Unified Modular Launch Vehicle

Gerard,

Modular is what I meant to type. One of those instances where the brain and the fingers are not in sync.

I guess "unified" was in my head while typing the next word.

amit · Post by **amit** » 25 Jan 2010 15:13

KrishG wrote:PICTURES: S200 static tests, L110

S200 successfully tested, L110 to follow.

I love these:

What I really like about these type of pictures from ISRO and from DRDO is the distinctive identity they convey. No workers in spotless colour coordinated designer overalls, no TFTA looking scientists with clip boards in their hands trying to look very important. (The Chinese have copied these dress codes very nicely, thank you.)

Just some SDRE looking gents and ladies wearing ordinary shirts and pants, saris or salwars, just like millions of ordinary Indians who go to work everyday.

Yet these folks produce state of the art technology and results which are making everyone sit up.

Way to go!

jaladipc · Post by **jaladipc** » 25 Jan 2010 17:51

Gagan wrote:Hmm,

My khurafati brain says, that the S-200 measures 22 m length and 3.2 m diameter and is solid fuelled.

How far will it go if this was a Missile instead of a booster?

____________________________________________________________________________________________

Congrats ISRO !

Would it make you feel happy for modified s-200 can say hai to khan?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 25 Jan 2010 18:12

Jalpad C, S 200 is purely for Civil purposes, no need to give NPA's any fresh Ammunition

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 25 Jan 2010 19:23

I just wondering what range such a system can fly to if it were used for military purposes.

That being said, ISRO and DRDO are completely separate organizations, with a firewall between them. No personnel can even visit each others premises - they all have to sign in on a register if they do. This was the requirement that India has agreed to to allow civil space cooperation with all nations.

The NPAs are very selective on the issues they holler about. They were crying foul over the Cryogenic engine issue when Russia pipped massa to be ISRO's supplier. Their takleef then was
their claim that cryogenic engines can be used in an ICBM. Strangely this takleef was not evident when ISRO was negotiating with massa for the same cryogenic engines earlier.

But as they say a lot of water has flowed down the ganges and the potomac and many a bridge has been crossed.

Willy · Post by **Willy** » 25 Jan 2010 19:32

Is the space page offline? Anyone can point to any writeups on the UNIFIED MODIFIED thingy ?

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 25 Jan 2010 19:35

^^^ French SLBM M51 is derived from Ariane 5 SBR. So you can have a rough guess based on that. Further range changes wrt Payload.

jaladipc · Post by **jaladipc** » 25 Jan 2010 20:07

Gagan wrote:I just wondering what range such a system can fly to if it were used for military purposes.

That being said, ISRO and DRDO are completely separate organizations, with a firewall between them. No personnel can even visit each others premises - they all have to sign in on a register if they do. This was the requirement that India has agreed to to allow civil space cooperation with all nations.

The NPAs are very selective on the issues they holler about. They were crying foul over the Cryogenic engine issue when Russia pipped massa to be ISRO's supplier. Their takleef then was
their claim that cryogenic engines can be used in an ICBM. Strangely this takleef was not evident when ISRO was negotiating with massa for the same cryogenic engines earlier.

But as they say a lot of water has flowed down the ganges and the potomac and many a bridge has been crossed.

I dont agree with you.
There is one ISRO 2009-2010 budget PDF posted on the same thread. If you got enough time,go through it in detail and try to decipher the hidden facts and collaboration.

** Unnecessary Information Deleted **
JAI HIND.

Craig Alpert · Post by **Craig Alpert** » 26 Jan 2010 04:56

Isro tests third biggest rocket motor

BANGALORE: Indian Space Research Organisation has successfully tested the third biggest solid rocket motor in the world after the booster rocket of Nasa's space shuttle and Arianespace's Ariane-5 launch vehicle. The Isro rocket motor is 22 metres long and 3.2 metres in diameter.

The rocket was tested on ground on Sunday at Sriharikota, Isro's biggest and most powerful rocket motor called S-200, powered by 200 tonnes of solid propellant. This is a vital step in the development of its Geosynchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle Mark-III (GSLV Mk-III), which will put a satellite weighing 4 tonnes in orbit.

N Narayana Moorthy, project director, GSLV Mk-III, described the test as a big success. The firing of the motor began at 8 am at the test bed at the Satish Dhawan Space Centre and lasted its full duration of 130 seconds. The performance was exactly as predicted with nearly 600 parameters being monitored. During the test, the motor produced a peak thrust of 500 tonnes.

Isro scientists have said that the design, development and successful realisation of the motor was entirely an indigenous effort of the Vikram Sarabhai Space Centre, Thiruvananthapuram, and the SDSC, Sriharikota, in collaboration with public and private sector industries. The preparation and casting was done at the newly built Solid Propellant Plant at Sriharikota. V Srinivasan is the Project Director of the S-200 motor programme.

Two S-200 motors will hug the core liquid stage of the GSLV Mk-III rocket, which will also be propelled by a powerful cryogenic engine. The GSLV Mk-III which is at an advanced stage of development will weigh 630 tonnes and will be 43.5 metres tall.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 26 Jan 2010 06:14

JaladipC I and most BRFites are aware of that.

There is nothing to be gained by spelling that out. You might want to edit your post.