Indian Space Program Discussion

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 19 Dec 2010 13:41

Launch of GSLV-F06 / GSAT-5P Mission Postponed

The launch of GSLV-F06 with GSAT-5P Satellite onboard, scheduled for December 20, 2010 has been postponed due to a minor leak in one of the valves of the Russian Cryogenic stage, observed during the pre-countdown checks.

The 29-hours countdown sequence planned to commence at 1100 hrs today (Dec 19th) has not been authorized by the Launch Authorisation Board that met this forenoon to review the results of pre-countdown checks.

The revised schedule for launch will be firmed up after ascertaining the cause for the leak, remedial actions and due verifications.

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 19 Dec 2010 17:44

The article you've quoted clearly has a typo because cryogenic engine turbines don't run at such low RPM.

Which turbo pump fizzled? is it the LOX or LH2, because both have different job to do as per the fuel mix ratio. One spins faster than the other. Since it has come through the mouth of some ISRO scientist via "The Hindu", lets find out what is what, before we conclude its typo. Normally the editor would scrutinise his soft copy before the newpaper is released to the outlets.

ShivaS · Post by **ShivaS** » 19 Dec 2010 18:59

http://tinyurl.com/cryospeed

its 10,000 to 30,000 rpm
(just as I guessed from Hydraulic Machines by Khurmi Knowledge, but wanted a confirmation)

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 19 Dec 2010 19:46

ShivaS wrote:http://tinyurl.com/cryospeed

its 10,000 to 30,000 rpm
(just as I guessed from Hydraulic Machines by Khurmi Knowledge, but wanted a confirmation)

Is it for ISRO rocket? because burn time is different, fuel mass different, so is PSI with bigger engine.

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 19 Dec 2010 20:33

ashokpachori wrote:The article you've quoted clearly has a typo because cryogenic engine turbines don't run at such low RPM.

Which turbo pump fizzled? is it the LOX or LH2, because both have different job to do as per the fuel mix ratio. One spins faster than the other. Since it has come through the mouth of some ISRO scientist via "The Hindu", lets find out what is what, before we conclude its typo. Normally the editor would scrutinise his soft copy before the newpaper is released to the outlets.

LH2 pump failed.. Turbo Pump speed @34800rpm

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 19 Dec 2010 21:32

dinesha wrote:
ashokpachori wrote:The article you've quoted clearly has a typo because cryogenic engine turbines don't run at such low RPM.

Which turbo pump fizzled? is it the LOX or LH2, because both have different job to do as per the fuel mix ratio. One spins faster than the other. Since it has come through the mouth of some ISRO scientist via "The Hindu", lets find out what is what, before we conclude its typo. Normally the editor would scrutinise his soft copy before the newpaper is released to the outlets.
LH2 pump failed.. Turbo Pump speed @34800rpm

LOX has one pump, but LH2 has two pumps, number one and number two (because it has re-generative cooling system) which one is which that we are talking about?

Unless you tell me both have the same RPM and how!

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 19 Dec 2010 22:11

ashokpachori wrote: LOX has one pump, but LH2 has two pumps, number one and number two (because it has re-generative cooling system) which one is which that we are talking about?

Unless you tell me both have the same RPM and how!

Here it is in plain English from ISRO's press release on their finding:

The above failure is attributed to the anomalous stopping of Fuel Booster Turbo Pump (FBTP). The start-up of FBTP was normal. It reached a maximum speed of 34,800 rpm and continued to function as predicted after the start of CUS. However, the speed of FBTP started dipping after 0.9 seconds and it stopped within the next 0.6 seconds.

...yeah, that's what we all thought.

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 19 Dec 2010 22:44

PratikDas wrote:
ashokpachori wrote: LOX has one pump, but LH2 has two pumps, number one and number two (because it has re-generative cooling system) which one is which that we are talking about?

Unless you tell me both have the same RPM and how!
Here it is in plain English from ISRO's press release on their finding:
The above failure is attributed to the anomalous stopping of Fuel Booster Turbo Pump (FBTP). The start-up of FBTP was normal. It reached a maximum speed of 34,800 rpm and continued to function as predicted after the start of CUS. However, the speed of FBTP started dipping after 0.9 seconds and it stopped within the next 0.6 seconds.
...yeah, that's what we all thought.

So its not 4K, its not 40K
Finally we got magic numbers.
Issue got killed, Thanks.

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 19 Dec 2010 23:33

You were far off from the actual number... you argue just for the sake of argument..
You should have exhibited your knowledge in your first post itself instead of a

“The last time it failed, the culprit was found in the form of fuel boost turbo pump - a complex pump with 4k RPM.”

edit: I take it back

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 20 Dec 2010 00:04

dinesha wrote:^^^Mind that arrogance and attitude .. many have come and gone..
You were far off from the actual number... you argue just for the sake of argument..
You should have exhibited your knowledge in your first post itself instead of a
“The last time it failed, the culprit was found in the form of fuel boost turbo pump - a complex pump with 4k RPM.”
You sound like you have irrefutably upper hand and you are soon to be PhD from a world leading university in Technology Strategy

They were no cooked up numbers that came from my mind. I relied on mainstream news media (URL given) and never claimed the way you have portrayed it to.

As for coming and going, its a generic statement.

Your post is offensive without merit.

Did I ruffle your feathers?

Why become personal?

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 20 Dec 2010 00:37

Engine leak delays GSAT-5P launch

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 21 Dec 2010 11:41

ISRO may take a call on GSLV mission tomorrow (Tuesday-21/12/2010)
Published: Monday, Dec 20, 2010, 16:23 IST
Place: Bangalore | Agency: PTI
http://www.dnaindia.com/scitech/report_ ... ow_1483751

Indian Space Research Organisation (ISRO) is expected to take a decision tomorrow on the fresh date for launch of GSAT-5P satellite on board Geo-Synchronous Satellite Launch Vehicle (GSLV-F06) after conducting an experiment to study the leak that led to the mission's postponement.

As of now, it appears to be a "liveable leak", an ISRO official told PTI in Bangalore, a day after the space agency put off the launch from the spaceport of Sriharikota due to a "minor leak" in one of the valves of the Russian Cryogenic stage, observed during the pre-countdown checks.

"We are planning to do a small experiment tomorrow to ascertain the cause for the leak. If the leak is the same (as noticed during the pre-countdown checks), then we can go ahead with the launch. If the leak is increasing... beyond certain limits, then we have to stop (the mission)," the official said on condition of anonymity.

If things are okay after verifications, ISRO might schedule the launch for Thursday, sources in the Bangalore-headquartered agency said.

The 29-hour countdown planned to commence at 11am yesterday had not been authorised by the Launch Authorisation Board that met in the forenoon to review the results of pre-countdown checks.

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 22 Dec 2010 12:49

I saw a red balloon over quite a height over Bangalore just now, do we have balloon facility in Bangalore, I thought that exists only in Hyderabad. Also balloons used to be white / silver in colour.

Anyone has any guesses what this might be?

PS: Move it to the appropriate thread if this thread is not the right one

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 22 Dec 2010 20:00

ISRO clears GSLV launch after tests

According to S Satish, director, ISRO: ''The test results are satisfactory and the rocket's launch date is being finalised.''

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 22 Dec 2010 20:06

symon, could be a met dept weather balloon.

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 22 Dec 2010 21:46

GSAT-5P to fly on Christmas....

http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/sci ... 77939.html

juvva · Post by **juvva** » 23 Dec 2010 15:39

ISRO official website is now conforming Dec 25th 2010, as launch date.

http://isro.org/news/pdf/GSLV-F06Reschedule.pdf

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Dec 2010 16:23

ashokpachori wrote:
Pratyush wrote:Guys,

Almost no one test launches SLVs with a dummy payload.

The only test rockets which carry a Dummy payload are Balistic missiles.

You want some more ¿¿¿¿¿

I guess that you missed the word almost.
Since you have invited me with more...........

Can you look up and educate me if the USSR also followed the same practice in the time frame quoted Mid 60s for the Atlas tests. Iran & NoKo and TSP don't count.

Also what was the payload for the first Isreali space launch ? A dummy payload or a spy sat?

Also were the first Indan SLV loaded with the Dummy Payloads?

What has been the experience of the ESA and the Japan. How many space crafts they have launched with a dummy payloads. From memory onlee the madian launch of Arian 5 was not with dummy payloads. Nor was the first launch of the Zenit (you can say that it was a modified SS19 (??) rocket so already tested ).

Please include the experience of the PRC with Long march series of rockets as well for my education.

TIA.

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 23 Dec 2010 17:44

Pratyush wrote:
I guess that you missed the word almost.
Since you have invited me with more...........

Can you look up and educate me if the USSR also followed the same practice in the time frame quoted Mid 60s for the Atlas tests. Iran & NoKo and TSP don't count.

Also what was the payload for the first Isreali space launch ? A dummy payload or a spy sat?

Also were the first Indan SLV loaded with the Dummy Payloads?

What has been the experience of the ESA and the Japan. How many space crafts they have launched with a dummy payloads. From memory onlee the madian launch of Arian 5 was not with dummy payloads. Nor was the first launch of the Zenit (you can say that it was a modified SS19 (??) rocket so already tested ).

Please include the experience of the PRC with Long march series of rockets as well for my education.

TIA.

SpaceX Successfully Launches Falcon 1 Rocket Into Orbit

The rocket carried a prism shaped 1.5 m (5 ft) long payload mass simulator that was set into orbit. The dummy satellite, known as Ratsat, will remain in orbit for between five and ten years before burning up in the atmosphere.

Here is a popular science article on ARIANE which first flew with dummy satellite.
Rocket Ariane puts Europe in satellite-launch business
http://tiny.cc/8vua1

Then see the following:

MAQSAT-H/TEAMSAT - . Payload: MAQSAT-H. Nation: Europe. Agency: ESA. Manufacturer: Kayser-Threde. Class: Technology. Type: Navigation technology satellite. Spacecraft: MAQSAT. USAF Sat Cat: 25023 . COSPAR: 1997-066A. Apogee: 26,504 km (16,468 mi). Perigee: 545 km (338 mi). Inclination: 7.6000 deg. Period: 465.70 min. Summary: Dummy communications satellite instrumented to report the actual payload bay environment during launch.

MAQSAT-H was a dummy communications satellite instrumented to report the actual payload bay environment during launch. It also included the TEAMSAT technology experiment payload, developed by ESTEC. TEAMSAT ejected a subsatellite, the Young Engineers Satellite, also with several experiments. MAQSAT-B was a smaller dummy satellite in the lower bay of the SPELTRA dual launch adapter.

BOEING:

Boeing is claiming the third flight of its Delta III booster carrying a dummy satellite on 23 August was a success, despite the satellite not reaching its intended apogee of orbit. According to previous classifications of commercial launcher performance, however, the flight should be classed as a partial failure.

http://business.highbeam.com/411058/art ... orbit-miss

North Korea used dummy satellite, South Korean experts say

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia-Pac ... -woap.html

JAPAN:

Technical problems postponed the maiden voyage of the new rocket in February and again last week. But the $71 million vehicle performed well on Wednesday, flying to an altitude of about 270 kilometers where it dropped off a three-ton dummy satellite into orbit, according to Japan's space agency.

http://articles.cnn.com/2001-08-29/tech ... _s=PM:TECH

British Telecom Satellite Drops Into Ocean After Launch

It was only the third launch for the Boeing-led venture, which uses a converted ocean-going oil rig as a launch pad. It successfully launched a dummy satellite a year ago and a DirecTV satellite in October.

China

CZ-2C/SD Chronology

1997 September 1 - . 14:00 GMT - . Launch Site: Taiyuan. Launch Complex: Taiyuan LC1. LV Family: CZ. Launch Vehicle: CZ-2C/SD. LV Configuration: Chang Zheng 2C-III/SD CZ2C-15 (47). Iridium - . Payload: Iridium s/n MFS 1. Mass: 689 kg (1,518 lb). Nation: USA. Agency: Iridium. Manufacturer: Lockheed; Motorola. Program: Iridium. Class: Communications. Type: Civilian communications satellite. Spacecraft: LM 700. USAF Sat Cat: 24925 . COSPAR: 1997-048A. Apogee: 633 km (393 mi). Perigee: 620 km (380 mi). Inclination: 86.3400 deg. Period: 97.25 min. Summary: Plane 5. Ascending node 271.9 degrees. Dummy satellite..

Iridium - . Payload: Iridium s/n MFS 2. Mass: 689 kg (1,518 lb). Nation: USA. Agency: Iridium. Manufacturer: Lockheed; Motorola. Program: Iridium. Class: Communications. Type: Civilian communications satellite. Spacecraft: LM 700. USAF Sat Cat: 24926 . COSPAR: 1997-048B. Apogee: 634 km (393 mi). Perigee: 620 km (380 mi). Inclination: 86.3400 deg. Period: 97.26 min. Summary: Plane 5. Ascending node 272 degrees. Dummy satellite..

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Dec 2010 20:10

^^^

Ashok

Thanks

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 23 Dec 2010 20:26

Pratyush wrote:^^^

Ashok

Thanks

Welcome dear.

symontk · Post by **symontk** » 23 Dec 2010 22:05

a rose is a rose is a rose

Dummy satellite is a perception. You can call GSAT satellites as dummy satellites (It actually started that way). Similarly IRS-Px series. But later it changed and ISRO started sending serious payloads thru these series

juvva · Post by **juvva** » 24 Dec 2010 10:48

The countdown clock must have started ticking a few minutes back........

ashokpachori · Post by **ashokpachori** » 24 Dec 2010 20:42

The 30-hour countdown for the launch of advanced communication satellite GSAT-5P started 10.04 Friday morning at the Sriharikota rocket launch centre

Gerard · Post by **Gerard** » 24 Dec 2010 21:54

Countdown starts for GSAT-5P launch

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 25 Dec 2010 15:33

GSLV F06: Its launch time.

Can anyone post live updates from TV please?

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:34

All Set Ready to Go

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:34

65 Sec to go

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:35

Lift off

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:36

successfull lift off Every thing is fine

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:37

Explosion . Mission fails

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 25 Dec 2010 15:39

WTF??

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 15:40

Lift off was good. First Stage solid stage and 4 strap on were working fine.An explosion occurred at the top of GSLV. I suspect it to be the cryo stage.

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 25 Dec 2010 15:40

The vehicle just exploded at an altitude of about 13 km......

I too suspect an upper stage propellant tank explosion....

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 25 Dec 2010 15:41

Radhakrishnan seems to be hell of a bad luck for ISRO.

What a sad day

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 25 Dec 2010 15:45

All of GSLVs failures (expect one) until now are because of the upper stage failures. Btw..it could have also been the automated self-destruct which led to the explosion.

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 25 Dec 2010 15:50

CUS was not activated. If the failure happened due to some leakage then its totally ISROs fault not upper stage's.

marimuthu · Post by **marimuthu** » 25 Dec 2010 16:00

On Seeing the NDTV clip, i think the strap on Boosters are not ignited and hence the mission failure, Probably the safety officer destructed the vehicle

Narad · Post by **Narad** » 25 Dec 2010 16:02

Can the satellites be saved in event of destruction by choice?

KrishG · Post by **KrishG** » 25 Dec 2010 16:05

marimuthu wrote:On Seeing the NDTV clip, i think the strap on Boosters are not ignited and hence the mission failure, Probably the safety officer destructed the vehicle

I think they ignited properly at T-4.8 sec from what I saw. There was confirmation that both the 1st stage and LSBs were performing normally at about T+10 seconds or so. Something could have gone wrong after that but it's difficult to tell.