Indian Naval Discussion

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 17 Apr 2010 07:30

Austin wrote:
Kersi D wrote:To me this seemes the most likely.

Don't forget Russians are famous for their long term moles. They may keep the pics and then blackmail the "gentleman" when he is an Admiral !!

K
very true , its also a good opportunity to get acquainted with Jr officers who have long career in navy and get to know them up close and personal , in the future these very people will be key decision maker in IN and indeed Russian Intel are very aggressive in doing their task , but do they follow the same approach with friendly countries like India is perhaps unknown .

do you remember the anecdote by a retd. services officer (either from IAF or IN, probably the later) undergoing training in russia ? he got a phone call late at night threatening him to accept that he had illicit relationship with some girl. fortunately his seniors had warned him beforehand that this was a standard KGB trick to get Indians to work for them and he could escape unhurt from that situation.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Apr 2010 07:37

ramana wrote:Is Mr. A.K. Anthony going to cancel the aircraft carrier contract to keep his reputation clean after this revelations?

Knives are out for the Navy in Congressi papers like Telegraph

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1100416/j ... 344802.jsp

Why should AK cancel the deal ? Does it proves he influenced the final price of the deal when the IN admits he was a junior officer.

For all we know it must have been his own habit that must have brought his downfall.

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 17 Apr 2010 07:39

Family member served in '71 war and also among the first to be trained on the Vidyut in Russia (alas he is no more). He had interesting things to say about "normal" dock workers who would suddnely appear with bottles of Vodka & extol the virtues of communism with an aim to "convert"

Suresh S · Post by **Suresh S** » 17 Apr 2010 07:48

This is standard KGB technique(now FSB). Many of prime minister putin,s opponents were discredited this way in a sex scandal. Mikhail fishman was one of them that comes to mind,head of russian edition of newsweek.

If you talk to ordinary russians they will tell you that this is standard KGB technique. How do I know because I have been living with them for close to two decades.

The only important point here is whether the good commodore compromised the price negotiations over gorshakov.

I agree with kartik that since the psus can not provide these extras (sex, Money) there products get rejected by EDITED. I understand that the products provided by the psus are not always the best and on time but these other things do not help.
EDIT.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 17 Apr 2010 08:57

How easy is it for any one Intel in Pakistan or US embassy to tag the Commodore , know his habits and his taste for women , send in some one hot for his taste and get some good pictures only to be sent to Indian Embassy so as to discredit the already labeled bad deal and cancel it for good ?

Why would the Russians ever send this pics to India when they know they could get the deal in trouble ? Could it be done by some foreign intel to scrap the Groshkov deal ?

d_berwal · Post by **d_berwal** » 17 Apr 2010 09:02

snahata wrote:EDITED.

the generalization done here is unwarranted for....

price negotiations are done by MOD officials not service personnels....

ARJUN.. getting more order has been reported in BLOG and much before the scandal happened....

Mods pls take a note of it ... the language used is offensive.

Neshant · Post by **Neshant** » 17 Apr 2010 10:09

The navy is still investigating to see if his affair influenced the final price. So that part isn't proven yet

Obviously they will try to downplay it as much as possible because their own jobs are on the line. Same sh*t happened during the Rabinder Singh spy case where he fled the country after moles stalled his arrest and tipped him off. Later the department downplayed the damage he had caused and the info he leaked until the PM forced them to reveal the extent of the data stolen.

I fear the guy must have revealed a whole lot of info.

This aside from the issue of getting f-ed by the Russians who negotiate contracts, low ball prices and then price gouge once a deposit is paid.

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 17 Apr 2010 10:47

Austin wrote:How easy is it for any one Intel in Pakistan or US embassy to tag the Commodore , know his habits and his taste for women , send in some one hot for his taste and get some good pictures only to be sent to Indian Embassy so as to discredit the already labeled bad deal and cancel it for good ?

Why would the Russians ever send this pics to India when they know they could get the deal in trouble ? Could it be done by some foreign intel to scrap the Groshkov deal ?

This gentleman may have been indiscreet in his behaviour. It may also happen that this chap DID NOT SUCCUMB to blackmail for the powers concerned sent the CD to IN.

Or, as sadi before, it could have been done by some other country to spoil the relations between Indian and Russia

K

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 17 Apr 2010 11:34

Austin wrote:How easy is it for any one Intel in Pakistan or US embassy to tag the Commodore , know his habits and his taste for women , send in some one hot for his taste and get some good pictures only to be sent to Indian Embassy so as to discredit the already labeled bad deal and cancel it for good ?

Why would the Russians ever send this pics to India when they know they could get the deal in trouble ? Could it be done by some foreign intel to scrap the Groshkov deal ?

I think a non-russian source of this tip-off is more likely. doesn't make sense for the russians to do this. unless it is a case of the Commodore being made an example of for not "co-operating" with them. a bit far-fetched but not impossible.

Prabu · Post by **Prabu** » 17 Apr 2010 13:41

Rahul M wrote:
Austin wrote:How easy is it for any one Intel in Pakistan or US embassy to tag the Commodore , know his habits and his taste for women , send in some one hot for his taste and get some good pictures only to be sent to Indian Embassy so as to discredit the already labeled bad deal and cancel it for good ?

Why would the Russians ever send this pics to India when they know they could get the deal in trouble ? Could it be done by some foreign intel to scrap the Groshkov deal ?
I think a non-russian source of this tip-off is more likely. doesn't make sense for the russians to do this. unless it is a case of the Commodore being made an example of for not "co-operating" with them. a bit far-fetched but not impossible.

Rahulji,
Yes ! Russians would not have doen it ! What you are saying is a possibility , but what Austinji is telling may be correct ! Its a anti India force at work and If the compromise is NOT about the price and quality of the ship and more about a moral charecter/disipline about one officer concerned, then Naval top brass should just take action against the officer and go ahead with the deal ! Cancelling the deal is NOT in Indian Interest !

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 17 Apr 2010 16:24

Coast Guard strength will not be downsized: Commander

Indian Navy Commandant D. S. Saini, Commanding Officer, Coast Guard Station, Mandapam said that the arrival of C-146, an advanced interceptor vessel of Coast Guard, will help to engage in monitoring the movement of suspected vessels or persons round-the-clock, as it has modern facilities for night patrol, in an event in Rameaswarm Friday attended by key Indian Coast Guard officers, sources in Ramanathapuram in Tamil Nadu said. The launching of this patrol vessel is observed to be an action taken to strenghthen Coast Guard activities along the coast off Rameswaram in the context of alleged presence of foreign elements including Chinese Navy in the northern seas of Sri Lanka, the sources added.

K Mehta · Post by **K Mehta** » 17 Apr 2010 16:47

Strange that the news comes so late in the day. If I am not wrong, the price negotiations are over and even the refit has advanced towards completion. Why bring up this issue now?

Suresh S · Post by **Suresh S** » 18 Apr 2010 00:36

hello Rahul, I apologise for the strong language but being a rabid Indian nationalist I could not help myself.

As to your statement that says sheer speculation, well a lot of statements by many people on this thread are just speculation too many to enumerate here.

I have the highest respect for the Indian armed forces and they are probably the least corrupt part of Indian society.I feel and hope that only a very small part of the officers corp in india has problems( trying to use diplomatic language).

I do not think anyone of us on this board can prove anything so in a way everything is speculation. It is a well known fact that the Aam aadami in India feels that majority of our poticians are corrupt but there is no way of proving that or punishing them. Had that been possible India would have been in a different place by now.

As to Mr Berwal,s statement that Arjun tank was given the green light by the Army long before this episode he should check his facts. Both these episodes happened too close to each other and this is very suspicious.

Nair · Post by **Nair** » 18 Apr 2010 03:21

If the Naval officer did not let his "external affairs" influence his work then under what grounds will the navy take action?
His personal life is his personal life..not sure if the Navy can tell him that he can't sleep with any woman he wants.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 18 Apr 2010 03:34

Nair wrote:His personal life is his personal life..not sure if the Navy can tell him that he can't sleep with any woman he wants.

Well I guess as an Officer you are expected to behave in a certain manner and should not do or say things that can bring disrepute to institution you serve.

So yes some disciplinary action will be taken against him ,irrespective of what he could have possibly done with Groshkov.

Could be the one innocent fling that brought the officers downfall

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 18 Apr 2010 04:45

Nair wrote:If the Naval officer did not let his "external affairs" influence his work then under what grounds will the navy take action?
His personal life is his personal life..not sure if the Navy can tell him that he can't sleep with any woman he wants.

Nair, remember the words - 'You're in the Army now'...Well, being part of the Armed Forces is more than a job. The ethos and culture of the services have a very deep impact on those who choose to don the uniform and permeates to every facet of one's life...

Sir, as an officer in the Armed Forces, you're expected to behave as an 'Officer and a Gentleman'...this overarching requisite can and does cover everything about one's conduct under the Sun. The liason on part of Naval Officer is an act "Unbecoming of an Officer and a Gentleman" and as per the act which governs the Armed Forces, good enough to earn him Court Martial. Such are the ways of the Armed Forces...

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 18 Apr 2010 05:45

Navy concerned over delays in ship-building

Admiral Verma told The Hindu that while there was a proactive system for approval by the government to build ships, the problem lay in converting these into deliverables. “If you look at ship-building periods [in India], take frigates, destroyers, corvettes, and benchmark it against world standards [of] how much time it takes to finish [a project]of that size and complexity, there is a fair amount of catching up [to do],” he told The Hindu.

For instance, he said the Navy had ordered two fleet tankers being built by a shipyard in Italy, which was being done in two years flat. Comparatively, this would take more time in India though labour is cheaper. With the government's reluctance to engage overseas shipyards for building warships, the Navy came out with a document on the imperative to revitalise the domestic ship-building industry with suggestions to deal with the issue.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Apr 2010 06:25

@ snahata, yes people do speculate on forums such as these but when it is coupled with namecalling and such, it is not acceptable. please, let the mods be the judge on what is allowed and what is not. being a nationalist is no excuse for that kind of language, for every member on BRF thinks of himself or herself in that way. only a very small minority resorts to un-parliamentary language however.

Suresh S · Post by **Suresh S** » 18 Apr 2010 07:11

point taken. hopefully no bias on the part of the mods regarding old vs new, I know someone and I donot know someone, north vs south etc.

Nair · Post by **Nair** » 18 Apr 2010 07:20

rohitvats wrote:
Nair wrote:If the Naval officer did not let his "external affairs" influence his work then under what grounds will the navy take action?
His personal life is his personal life..not sure if the Navy can tell him that he can't sleep with any woman he wants.
Nair, remember the words - 'You're in the Army now'...Well, being part of the Armed Forces is more than a job. The ethos and culture of the services have a very deep impact on those who choose to don the uniform and permeates to every facet of one's life...

Sir, as an officer in the Armed Forces, you're expected to behave as an 'Officer and a Gentleman'...this overarching requisite can and does cover everything about one's conduct under the Sun. The liason on part of Naval Officer is an act "Unbecoming of an Officer and a Gentleman" and as per the act which governs the Armed Forces, good enough to earn him Court Martial. Such are the ways of the Armed Forces...

So the army says you cannot have sex with anyone other than your wife....and if you do so then it is grounds for a court martial? If so doesn't that sound really stupid in the 21st century?

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 18 Apr 2010 07:26

Nair wrote:
So the army says you cannot have sex with anyone other than your wife....and if you do so then it is grounds for a court martial? If so doesn't that sound really stupid in the 21st century?

No, the problem here is that the Commodore was on "Official Visit" to a foreign nation and his act tarnished the image of the Navy.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 18 Apr 2010 07:59

Nair wrote:So the army says you cannot have sex with anyone other than your wife....and if you do so then it is grounds for a court martial? If so doesn't that sound really stupid in the 21st century?

I think the issue is.. if this was used as a ploy by the Russians to influence a reputable official, who was appointed to undertake the process of price negotiations with national financial interests at heart.. The Russians could have potentially used 'favours' to influence the officials final decisions.. and if his acts have compromised national interest at large.. I guess the investigations would help clarify if these acts were at a more personal/individual level or there was more influential Russian forces at work.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 18 Apr 2010 11:33

The worst crime is to seduce your fellow officer's wife or family member.However,some unscrupulous officers-and this is internationally a common feature,often bully junior officers who have beutiful spouses! Sexual harrassment in the services is also becoming a feture in India too as more women join the services.In recent times we have had some well publicised cases.

Anyway,back to the IN,the MOD/IN are very perturbed about the slow pace oif indigenous shipbuilding.The Shivalik took 10 years to arrive (in a few days we are told),wheras Italy is building two auxiliaries for us in just two years time! The IN if it wants to maintain its fleet streingth,will have to adopt a dual rtack strategy,building smaller vessels less complex at hoime and even for the larger warships like frigates upwards,if ordered/planned in large numbers,get a few built abroad as we are doing with the Talwars being built in decent time.Ultimately it is the firepower in hand that matters when the baloon goes up.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 18 Apr 2010 11:49

Nair wrote:So the army says you cannot have sex with anyone other than your wife....and if you do so then it is grounds for a court martial? If so doesn't that sound really stupid in the 21st century?

What is stupid about it? And what has 21st century got to do with it? Or are you saying that it is 'OK' to have sex outside marriage in today's world and was not earlier? Has the society somehow become more permissible about extra-marital affairs?

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 18 Apr 2010 11:59

I would say that if the officer was cleared of any wrong doing as far as price negotiations are concerned, the navy ought to have a look at his service record. If he has been an exemplary officer, this affair should not tarnish a career.

The officer concerned must already be in trouble as his personal family life must be in tatters.

His problem is that he got caught (I wonder if the pictures are incriminating enough). I don't think he is the first or the last officer to have a liaison.

Kersi D · Post by **Kersi D** » 18 Apr 2010 13:18

shukla wrote:
Admiral Verma told The Hindu ......
For instance, he said the Navy had ordered two fleet tankers being built by a shipyard in Italy, which was being done in two years flat. Comparatively, this would take more time in India though labour is cheaper.....

If Italy took two years to build an oil tanker, Garden Reach would have taken 10 years. (Remember INS Brahmaputra & sisters).

Let us assume that the Italian shipyard pays X amount for Y manhours. Assume Indian shipyard (Garden Reach ?) takes 5Y manhours. Would the Indian rates be 1/5 Italian rates ? An what does the IN do in the meantime ?

Indian PSUs are for employment, not getting work done.

I still think that of the 7 something P 17B frigates to be designed abroad, 2 must be built by the foreign shipyard and there could be some technology / know how transfer to Indian SY.

K

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 18 Apr 2010 15:29

Gaur wrote:No, the problem here is that the Commodore was on "Official Visit" to a foreign nation and his act tarnished the image of the Navy.

So had the same act been done in India would it had been acceptable to IN ?

Wonder what the guy family must be going through now that it has been splashed all over the media , quite difficult moment for the family , I hope the IN acknowledges all this fact and treats this case in a very sensitive way and they could have dealt the same in strict confidence and so the media.

David Siegel · Post by **David Siegel** » 18 Apr 2010 22:03

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2010/04/ph ... nduct.html

Did not like the picture though. Looks like IN Personals' equipments and dresses belong to 20 years old stock compared to that of US Navy personal, let alone the Ship and Subs.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 18 Apr 2010 22:13

what about helmets ?

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 18 Apr 2010 22:16

Rahul M wrote:what about helmets ?

We haven't had the usual chappal-scooter helmet-different camo

this year have we? It's high time I guess.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 18 Apr 2010 23:42

Rahul M wrote:what about helmets ?

My guess, the guys are from 91 Infantry Brigade from Trivandrum...Army's very own Amphibious Brigade

BTW, Rahul da, did you check the link I'd posted in Indian Army thread about the pics of BMP-II with Amphib. Brigade???

Craig Alpert · Post by **Craig Alpert** » 19 Apr 2010 04:22

India Opens Major Western Naval Base Near Karwar

Defense Minister Pranab Mukherjee opened the first phase of India’s giant western naval base INS Kadamba in Karwar, Karnataka state, on May 31/05, saying it would protect the country’s Arabian Sea maritime routes. Kadamba has become India’s 3rd operational naval base, after Mumbai and Visakhapatnam. It is valuable for its location, and also for its ability to transcend the fundamental capacity and security limitations of India’s other 2 naval bases.

INS Kadamba is being built near Karwar in the southern state of Karnataka. That Phase I construction was just part of India’s ambitious “Project Seabird,” a potential INR 50+ billion project that will include the naval base, and much more besides. India finished a scaled-back Phase I a full decade after the originally-envisaged 1995 completion date. As might be expected, Phase II remains tied up, and is likely to be approved after it was supposed to have been finished…
Kadamba has many virtues, but none loom larger than helping Navy decongest Mumbai, whose heavy merchant shipping traffic, even heavier swarms of fishing and coastal craft, and large tourist draw make it security very difficult – as India’s experience in 1971 proved. Throw in nearby oil terminal hazards, the constant need for dredging the long, shallow fairway to the sea, the need to berth submarines alongside normal ships, and no dedicated airfield, and Mumbai’s limitations become clear.

INS Kadamba is the antidote: a naval-only installation with depth, cover, and the accompanying facilities needed by a blue-water navy. Sandwiched between the craggy hills of the Western Ghats in the east and the Arabian Sea in the west, Karwar is an excellent naval location. Encompassing over 11,200 acres of land along a 26-km stretch of sea front, Kadamba, named after the famous 4th century dynasty, is the first base to be exclusively controlled by India’s Navy. The depth and width of the base’s approach channel means that all of India’s naval platforms will be able to sail into its harbor. Its hilly terrain offers excellent cover for ground installations, pens cut into the rock face could conceal submarines
Additional facilities include the 10,000 tonne, 175 m x 28 m ship lift and ship transfer system for dry docking at the Naval ship Repair Yard. A new hospital, INHS Patanjali, has an initial capacity of 141 beds, upgradeable to 400. It will be accompanied by ammunition storage, depot ship, parade ground, drill shed, a logistics complex, an officers’ mess, base barracks for sailors, and even an accompanying township. The township is slated to eventually include married accommodation for officers and sailors, a shopping complex, a Sailors Institute, schools, a family clinic, gardens, parks etc.

According to defense experts, the naval base at Karwar will play a major role in securing the seas not only for India but also for countries like Japan, which rely heavily on shipping for imports and exports through maritime routes in the Arabian Sea.

In Pakistan, meanwhile, the new deep-water port of Gwadar is in use by Pakistan – and by its Chinese government financiers, who also rely heavily on shipping for imports and exports through maritime routes in the Arabian Sea.

Commodore K.P. Ramachandran, INS Kadamba’s first Commanding Officer (CO) said that 11 ships could be berthed at Kadamba once the first phase of construction was complete, with the figure going up to 22 after the second phase of construction was completed. Subsequent reports put the Phase II figure at 25-30 ships. The harbour is designed to ultimately berth 42 ships on 11 piers when finally complete, including submarines if need be. The aircraft carrier Admiral Gorshkov is also scheduled to berth in Kadamba with its MiG-29K wing after it is refurbished, renamed the Vikramaaditya, and handed over to the Indian Navy.
................................

srai · Post by **srai** » 19 Apr 2010 06:44

shukla wrote:Carrier battle groups to add muscle to Navy

Nothing projects geostrategic power better than aircraft carriers prowling on high seas. Powerful fighter jets tearing into the skies from a moving airfield, which can travel 600 nautical miles a day, can send shivers down any adversary’s spine. Carrier-battle groups (CBGs) can, after all, rapidly respond across the entire spectrum of operations as ‘‘situation changers’’ in times of crisis. It’s no wonder then that US has as many as 11 CBGs to deploy around the globe, giving it the capability to strike almost anywhere.

India has been making do with a solitary carrier, the 50-year-old INS Viraat, since 1987. But now, with India and Russia finally ending their bitter wrangling over the huge cost escalation in Admiral Gorshkov’s refit, the Navy is steaming towards its aim of deploying two CBGs in Indian Ocean and beyond. ‘‘By 2014-2015, we should have two full-fledged CBGs, with their accompanying fighters and other aircraft, destroyers, frigates and tankers. It will make a huge difference,’’ said Navy chief Admiral Nirmal Verma, talking exclusively to TOI.

The first CBG will be centred around the 44,570-tonne Gorshkov, rechristened INS Vikramaditya, which India will now get in early-2013 under the fresh $2.33 billion deal inked last month. ‘‘We hope to run Vikramaditya for 40 years,’’ said Admiral Verma. The second CBG will be around the 40,000-tonne indigenous aircraft carrier (IAC), whose keel was laid at Cochin Shipyard in February 2009. ‘‘There is some delay but it will be launched by first half of 2011. We should get it by 2014,’’ he added. The 45 MiG-29K fighters, contracted from Russia for about $2 billion, will operate both from Vikramaditya and IAC. Incidentally, a 65,000-tonne IAC-II is also on the drawing board. ‘‘It will be much bigger and capable of operating fighters, AEW (airborne early-warning) aircraft, tankers etc,’’ Admiral Verma said.

But for now, Navy’s intention is to ‘‘stretch’’ the operational life of the 28,000-tonne INS Viraat, even though it’s left with only 11 of its Sea Harrier jump-jets, till IAC is commissioned. With as many as 40 warships and submarines on order, coupled with a dedicated communication satellite to be launched later this year by Isro, Navy is fast emerging as a true-blue three-dimensional blue-water force.

This is critical since India’s geopolitical interests stretch right from Hormuz Strait down to Malacca Strait. ‘‘Construction of support and escort warships for the CBGs is going well,’’ said Admiral Verma. Under the Rs 8,101 crore Project-17 at Mazagon Docks, for instance, the first of the 5,300-tonne stealth frigate INS Shivalik will be commissioned this month.

‘‘The second (INS Satpura) will be delivered later this year and the third (INS Sahyadri) next year,’’ he said.

I wonder what the support and escort warships of the 2-CBGs would look like:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier_ba ... ttle_group
The centrepiece of the Indian carrier battle group is currently the INS Viraat, an updated Centaur class light carrier originally built for the Royal Navy as HMS Hermes, which was laid down in 1944 and commissioned in 1959. It was purchased by India in 1986. India will commission a second aircraft carrier, INS Vikramaditya, in 2012 and will follow this with a third carrier, INS Vikrant 2, in 2015. Whilst INS Vikramaditya is a former Soviet Kiev class carrier, the Admiral Gorshkov, the Vikrant will be the first indigenous Indian aircraft carrier.India eventually will have 2 Carrier battle groups by 2017.

The Indian Navy's CBG usually consists of two destroyers (usually of the P-15 Delhi Class, previously Kashins were used) and two or more frigates, (usually a combination of P-16 Brahmaputra and Nerei or Talwar class) and one support ship.

1 AC -> INS Vikrant or INS Vikramaditya
2-3 DDGs -> 1 P15A and P15 (plus second P15A or P15) [total 6 available (3 P15 and 3 P15A]
2-4 FFGs -> 2-3 Krivaks or 2-3 P17 (or a combination of them) [total 9 available (6 Krivaks and 3 P17]
1-2 ASW Corvette -> 1-2 P28 [total 4 available]
1 Support Ship -> Deepak class [total 2 available]
1 SSN/SSK -> 1 Scorpene SSK or 1 Akula-II SSN [total 6 SSK and 1 SSN available]

arun · Post by **arun** » 19 Apr 2010 08:48

Full page advert in the Hindustan times put out by GRSE says that the first P-28 ASW Corvette is to be launched today by Mamta Bannerjee.

uddu · Post by **uddu** » 19 Apr 2010 09:38

Mamata Banerjee?

Noooooooooooooooooooooo

http://www.youngbazaar.com/2010/04/laun ... arine.html
GRSE celebrates 50 golden years in the service of the nation as defence PSU. Launching of first Anti-Submarine Warfare Corvette by Smt Mamatha M, wife of Sri M.M. Pallam Raju.

arun · Post by **arun** » 19 Apr 2010 10:53

Oops

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 19 Apr 2010 11:27

Kersi,sadly the news item some months ago for the P-17s+ ,said that despite the IN's wanting at least the first two to be built abroad,as the foreign shipyards were to provide tech in stealth,etc.,now all will be built in India,some at GR too! What is making experts scratch their heads is how these local yards will come up with the advanced tech required for these ships when it does not exist in the country.The follow on Shivalik's at this rate, will certainly take another decade to arrive.All that mortal enemy Pak has to do is to just wait,then get gifted second-hand frigates and destroyers from the US which through upgrades become almost equal to our desi designed and built warships.During this time too,China simply keeps on relentlessly building its won classes of warships,making improvements with each new type,through indigenous tech or that stolen from abroad by its millions of spies (every Chinaman working abroad can be assumed to be a Chinese spy).It fooled the entire world when the Varyag-once offered to India, was bought for stated use as a "floating casino",allowing it to be towed through the Dardenelles,then reported as beigng "studied" in detail for a new Chinese design,after which while it was being repaired was described as a "training ship" for future carriers and now revealed as a full fledged repaired and modernised 65,000t carrier for which the only missing item is the carrier-borne aircraft,for which the Russians are playing v.hard to get.
Indian shipbuilding has to modernise itself and be thoroughly revamped if we are to achieve the goal of being a "builder's navy",of which several former chiefs were very proud of some time ago,especially during the '80s when we were also building German U-209 subs.We seem to have slipped up in recent years and are seeing some success finally.Whether this can be sustained or accelerated as it must remains to be seen.A pragmatic approach must be taken.We need international expertise in revamping our shipyards,with greater mechanisation and modular construction techniques adopted.

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 19 Apr 2010 15:55

GRSE Launches India's First Indigenous ASW Corvette Today
Clicky

Anujan · Post by **Anujan** » 19 Apr 2010 16:13

^^^

The first picture looks suspiciously like INS Shardul? Doesnt our ASW Corvette look different?

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 19 Apr 2010 16:44

Anujan wrote:^^^

The first picture looks suspiciously like INS Shardul? Doesnt our ASW Corvette look different?

Our ASW corvette (P-28 ) looks similar to the model shown between two bald guys