Indian Army: News & Discussion

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Craig Alpert
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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Craig Alpert » 06 Apr 2011 05:32

China's Presence in PoK 'Increasing Steadily': Army
China's presence in Pakistan -occupied Kashmir (PoK) is "increasing steadily" and its troops are "actually present" along the Line of Control, a top Army Commander said, adding the Chinese footprints are "too close for comfort" for India.

"Chinese presence in Gilgit-Baltistan and the Northern Areas is increasing steadily... There are many people who are concerned about the fact that if there was to be hostility between us and Pakistan, what would be the complicity of Chinese. Not only they are in the neighbourhood but the fact that they are actually present and stationed along the LoC," Northern Army Commander Lt Gen K T Parnaik said here last week while addressing a seminar.

He said China's links with Pakistan through PoK "lends strength" to the "nexus" between the two countries which is a cause of "great security concern" for India.

"As part of (China's) 'strings of pearls' policy, Chinese footprints are too close for comfort," Parnaik added.

The Army Commander said such a nexus between the Chinese and Pakistani military "jeopardises our regional strategic interests in the long run and and facilitates speedy and enhanced deployment of Pakistan armed forces to complement China's military operations and thus outranks India."

He said China has been found to be involved in the construction of numerous roads and and several hydro-power projects inside PoK.

Beijing is laying a web of roads that run across areas as distant from each other as Skardu in PoK and Kunming in China near Myanmar border.

China has already constructed roads connecting all its highways to logistic centres and major defence installations that dot the border with India and the Line of Actual Control (LAC) in south-eastern Jammu and Kashmir.

Wonder what the Indian response to this is going to be? Apart from more ALG's there has to be a will to offset logistics and proper facilities to replenish supplies in support of troops during wartime.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Hobbes » 07 Apr 2011 07:01

Craig Alpert wrote:China's Presence in PoK 'Increasing Steadily': Army
China's presence in Pakistan -occupied Kashmir (PoK) is "increasing steadily" and its troops are "actually present" along the Line of Control, a top Army Commander said, adding the Chinese footprints are "too close for comfort" for India.

"Chinese presence in Gilgit-Baltistan and the Northern Areas is increasing steadily... There are many people who are concerned about the fact that if there was to be hostility between us and Pakistan, what would be the complicity of Chinese. Not only they are in the neighbourhood but the fact that they are actually present and stationed along the LoC," Northern Army Commander Lt Gen K T Parnaik said here last week while addressing a seminar.

He said China's links with Pakistan through PoK "lends strength" to the "nexus" between the two countries which is a cause of "great security concern" for India.

"As part of (China's) 'strings of pearls' policy, Chinese footprints are too close for comfort," Parnaik added.

The Army Commander said such a nexus between the Chinese and Pakistani military "jeopardises our regional strategic interests in the long run and and facilitates speedy and enhanced deployment of Pakistan armed forces to complement China's military operations and thus outranks India."

He said China has been found to be involved in the construction of numerous roads and and several hydro-power projects inside PoK.

Beijing is laying a web of roads that run across areas as distant from each other as Skardu in PoK and Kunming in China near Myanmar border.

China has already constructed roads connecting all its highways to logistic centres and major defence installations that dot the border with India and the Line of Actual Control (LAC) in south-eastern Jammu and Kashmir.

Wonder what the Indian response to this is going to be? Apart from more ALG's there has to be a will to offset logistics and proper facilities to replenish supplies in support of troops during wartime.


More whining about our being a peaceful nation with no warlike intentions... :((

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby putnanja » 12 Apr 2011 04:13

Army jawans to finally bid goodbye to PT shoes

NEW DELHI: From thin canvas shoes to Reebok, Adidas and Nike? Well, that would perhaps be too ambitious but the fact is that the around 10 lakh jawans of the Army will now finally get proper "sports shoes" instead of the vintage-pattern PT shoes they have been saddled with for decades.

That's not all, on the footwear front. The Army is also going to soon introduce new combat boots, which will allow soldiers to function with greater efficiency in different types of weather and terrain. "In tune with the endeavour to provide the best available equipment to soldiers, the Army is going in for sports shoes, based on current design and technology available in the market, as well as specially-designed combat boots," said an officer on Monday.
...
...
Incidentally, this comes in the backdrop of defence minister A K Antony being stumped by an unusual request by jawans during his visit to North-East in February. At the 3 Corps HQs in Ranga Pahar in Nagaland, jawans asked Antony to ensure that they were "given new pair of shoes more frequently", that is every year instead of the existing practice of every 26 months.
...

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby sum » 12 Apr 2011 08:35

From thin canvas shoes to Reebok, Adidas and Nike? Well, that would perhaps be too ambitious but the fact is that the around 10 lakh jawans of the Army will now finally get proper "sports shoes" instead of the vintage-pattern PT shoes they have been saddled with for decades.

IN had already switched over to Nike( or was it Reebok) quite some time back as a standard issue....wonder if IAF also has already done the same?

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby karan_mc » 12 Apr 2011 11:02

I really donot know if Reebok, Adidas and Nike can hold on to tough routine of soldiers , pairs of socks and shoes give to me in NCC Days are most hardcore footwear i ever used ,you guys we be surprised that after 5 years of out of college and NCC pair of socks issued to me still holds ,elastic and cotton is fine , believe me i have tried every brand but no one could come even close to those pairs ,an i still use them some times :D :D

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby merlin » 13 Apr 2011 15:28

Cross posting from newbie thread so that it reaches a wider set of people

Newbie pooch

1. Does an IA division have the same set of brigades always under it? I realize that battalions under the brigade always changes, but do the brigades also change?
2. If brigades don't change, is there a way to find out which brigades are under a particular division - open source only!
3. Same questions for a Corps with respect to Divisions.

Thanks

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby shiv » 13 Apr 2011 16:20

sum wrote:
From thin canvas shoes to Reebok, Adidas and Nike? Well, that would perhaps be too ambitious but the fact is that the around 10 lakh jawans of the Army will now finally get proper "sports shoes" instead of the vintage-pattern PT shoes they have been saddled with for decades.

IN had already switched over to Nike( or was it Reebok) quite some time back as a standard issue....wonder if IAF also has already done the same?


Nowadays these brands have become standard issue in some schools - along with the uniform. Army using them will neither be a big deal nor a big price as long as China is not benefiting.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby ramana » 13 Apr 2011 19:56

Ashok Mehta writes in Pioneer. Time for introspection.

India needs to review forces


India needs to review forces

April 13, 2011 8:26:08 PM

Ashok K Mehta

Blindly acquiring military hardware is not going to help as the nature of threat has changed radically. A Strategic Defence and Security Review would help.

Done last year, Britain’s first comprehensive Strategic Defence and Security Review since 1998 is far-reaching. It is bold, honest and innovative, entailing analytical risks to extricate the armed forces from the Cold War mindset to face the new ground realities, including cuts amounting to 38 billion pounds over 10 years. It informs of the limits of British power — of what it can do alone and in partnership with allies. Pax Britannica no longer rules the waves. It is high time India carried out a similar full-scale review involving all departments of Government to produce both a macro and micro picture of the security situation.

Paraphrased, Britain’s national security strategy which flows from its Strategic Defence and Security Review has put the protection of people, territory and ways of life from major risk uppermost, followed by shaping a stable environment to reduce threats to national interest at home and abroad by tackling potential risks at source.

The high priority risks identified for the next five years are terrorism, including the use of chemical, biological, radiological and nuclear weapons; cyber attacks by other states; major accidents or related hazards; and, international military crises like the one in Libya. Britain has renewed its commitment to success in Afghanistan with a condition-based withdrawal commencing in 2015.

The most striking feature of the Strategic Defence and Security Review is the admission that Britain will no longer be able to undertake combat missions on the scale of Iraq and/or Afghanistan. Against the 45,000 troops deployed in Iraq in 2003, it will now be able to field only up to 30,000 troops for limited periods and with sufficient notice. For protracted operations over several years, the maximum deployable force will be 6,500 as against 10,000 currently committed in Afghanistan. These are significant shrinkages in combat capability, forcing joint or collective defence.

The shift from high-end conflict to low-intensity operations is removing the Cold War mentality of tank-on-tank battles with heavy artillery in the Fulda gap to counter terrorism in Afghanistan.

The strategic parameters are also changing. Although the Trident submarine fleet will remain till 2016 (when its retention will be reviewed) to maintain an independent nuclear deterrent, a joint nuclear capability with France is being considered. The strategic dialogue with France extends to creating joint and integrated defence capabilities like combined joint expeditionary force, maritime task force, joint military doctrine, joint acquisition of military equipment, etc.

The decision to retain one of the two new aircraft carriers with option to field the second has been made in recognition of the salience of stand-off air power. The existing Harrier fleet has been retired as no aircraft carrier will be operational till 2016. Even then the carrier-based version of the joint strike fighter will become available only in 2020. While British forces will remain deployed in Afghanistan till 2016 at the very least, in the interregnum, compatible allied aircraft could take the deck of the British aircraft carrier. These are big calculated risks which the Government of Britain is preparing to take.

By 2015 the Army is to be reduced by 7,000 to 95,000 troops with cuts in tanks and artillery. Manpower reduction will be compensated by Special Forces and Territorial Army who are doing exceptional work in Afghanistan. Similarly the Royal Navy will be down by 5,000 to 30,000 sailors, main losses being in the frigate fleet and Nimrod maritime patrol aircraft. The RAF will be downsized by 5,000 personnel to 33,000 and many aircraft will be retired. The Government has come to the conclusion that future air wars are unlikely and the RAF will have its fast jet fleet based on two advanced aircraft: Typhoon and Tornado.

Britain’s Future Force 2020 will have two aircraft carrier, five multi-role brigades and an adequate Air Force backed by a minimum effective nuclear deterrence. The non-military pillars of security address conflict prevention through building stability overseas, counter-terrorism and counter radicalisation, creation of a cyber crime strategy, a national crime agency, a maritime information centre and a special security policy. Long-term cooperation with France is the cornerstone of bridging the capability gap while maintaining its role in the European Union and allied security architectures like Nato.

Viewed strictly from the military prism and set against the future character of conflict, the Strategic Defence and Security Review has initiated a total transformation of the armed forces. The emphasis is on precision fire rather than suppression and to combat specific challenges like improvised explosive devices in Afghanistan. The Strategic Defence and Security Review virtually rules out conventional war. including air battles. It believes in partnership of shared capabilities, including a minimum effective nuclear deterrent. Transformation entails risks of capability voids which are to be filled by allies.

The Strategic Defence and Security Review’s impact on Britain’s defence industry is significant. It earns 15 billion pounds annually and employs 355,000 people. Already 7,000 jobs have been lost through suspension and cancellation of programmes, including a 14-billion-pound centralised training academy in Wales.

Accompanying transformation will be the turbulence among combatants made redundant like pilots from Harrier and Nimrod fleets and foot soldiers returning from Afghanistan in a severely recession-hit British economy. Retooling its military has had other consequences. Besides rebasing of 20,000 troops from Germany, a task force set up to scout for forgotten imperial outposts across the world on the payroll of Britain’s Ministry of Defence has traced 20,000 British citizens in locations as exotic as yacht clubs in the US.

Britain ordered its first major strategic reconfiguration in the 1960s in what was called the East of Suez drawdown and political vacuum. The current Strategic Defence and Security Review cuts the cloth according to Britain’s size and stature as a middle level power.

India should draw lessons, the most obvious being ordering a whole Government review of existing capabilities, threats and opportunities and future forces to cope with the challenges. The Indian Army is engaged in an ad hoc transformation which is ‘uplinked’ with the other two services. The Indian Air Force and Navy’s numbers of aircraft and ships have gone haywire as their long-term re-equipment plans never materialised due to bad planning and funding support. Consequently India is already the world’s biggest importer of weapons and will spend $ 100 billion in the next decade.

Britain has cut costs and capability through a defined review mechanism. India is to boost military capabilities which must derive from getting the character of future conflict right without dissipating resources on the fashionable ‘full spectrum of war’. Identifying critical missions and affordable risks must come from political foresight, good generalship and deft diplomacy. We must not duck the review at any rate.


It might be useful to have an informed citizen's review as parallel exercise.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Rahul M » 13 Apr 2011 22:12

merlin wrote:Cross posting from newbie thread so that it reaches a wider set of people

Newbie pooch

1. Does an IA division have the same set of brigades always under it? I realize that battalions under the brigade always changes, but do the brigades also change?
2. If brigades don't change, is there a way to find out which brigades are under a particular division - open source only!
3. Same questions for a Corps with respect to Divisions.

Thanks

rohit will be able to give a better answer but the composition is not fixed, it changes according to need. that said, these changes do not happen very frequently, a bde under a certain div usually stays under it. divisions under corps are re-organized more frequently AFAIK.


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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby ramana » 14 Apr 2011 20:27

Moving the SDR posts to Indian interest thread.....

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby rohitvats » 16 Apr 2011 13:30

merlin wrote:Cross posting from newbie thread so that it reaches a wider set of people

Newbie pooch

1. Does an IA division have the same set of brigades always under it? I realize that battalions under the brigade always changes, but do the brigades also change?
2. If brigades don't change, is there a way to find out which brigades are under a particular division - open source only!
3. Same questions for a Corps with respect to Divisions.

Thanks


1. The number of brigades under a division are assigned as per operational requirement and may vary from 3 (standard) to 5-6. The brigades do not rotate out of a division under normal circumstances and their location ( in terms of area of responsibility) is fixed. During war times, additional brigades may be attached to a division or some may be taken away from it as per the requirement.

2. Brigade level orbat is very-very difficult to build - you can start with historical accounts of wars and battles....most of these formations would have retained their brigades....but there are movements of brigades and they do get re-assigned (though very rarely). And then there are new formations which would have been raised and of which one would not know anything.

3. Same as brigades...all the Corps have a set number of divisions and each division as an operational task assigned to it. Again, divisions may be added to Corps or be taken away as per operational requirement (like shifting of NE based divisions to western sector in Op Parakram).

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Gaur » 19 Apr 2011 21:28

A very interesting article by Col Shukla.
Army general’s battle for hearts in Kashmir

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Singha » 19 Apr 2011 21:33

nike/reebok/adidas do make a bunch of models in India I think. have seen factory 'seconds' stores both in mahipalpur near palam and marathalli here.

for a huge customer like IA , they will be happy to manufacture any shoe on earth here using only khadi and kerala rubber if asked.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Gaur » 19 Apr 2011 21:55

Singha wrote:nike/reebok/adidas do make a bunch of models in India I think. have seen factory 'seconds' stores both in mahipalpur near palam and marathalli here.

for a huge customer like IA , they will be happy to manufacture any shoe on earth here using only khadi and kerala rubber if asked.

I don't know about others, but Adidas does not exactly manufacture shoes in India. Adidas provides lakhani with the designs and it is Lakhani Armaan Group which actually manufactures the product :mrgreen: . Next time you buy Adidas, take a look at the box. It the price is below 5-6k, it would most probably be a "manufactured by Lakhani" product. Else, it would have been imported from China.
I guess the same would apply to other brands also. It seems like is a win win situation for both parties.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby bapatnikhil » 20 Apr 2011 06:29

I dont know about Reebok or Adidas but Nike has plants in many countries. Everyone in my family uses Nike shoes and mine are made in India, my sister's made in Taiwan, my dad's made in China and my mom's made in Vietnam. Just checked all the labels :) It did not say who actually manufactures them though.
Plus all are under Rs 4k

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Vipul » 20 Apr 2011 07:23

After Pak missile test, India flexes muscle.

Diplomatic re-engagement may have begun afresh but both sides are keeping their powder dry. The 1.13-million strong Indian Army is honing its war-fighting machinery with a major combat exercise, codenamed "Vijayee Bhava'' (Be Victorious), in the Thar desert to practice "high tempo'' operations to cut across the border.

Squeamish for long with India's "pro-active conventional war strategy'', or what is colloquially dubbed the "cold start'' doctrine, Pakistan in turn test-fired a new nuclear-capable ballistic missile Hatf-IX on Tuesday.

Given that Hatf-IX has a strike range of only 60 km, it is clearly intended for brandishing as a "battlefield nuclear weapon'' to deter Indian armoured forces from launching rapid thrusts into its territory.

"Pakistan already has the long and medium range Shaheen and Ghauri series of missiles, acquired with help of China and North Korea, to act as the delivery mechanism for strategic nuclear weapons,'' said a senior Indian official.

"So, with this new missile, Islamabad seems to be looking at tactical nuclear deterrence against advancing enemy formations. But it is being foolhardy if it thinks nuclear weapons are war-fighting weapons,'' he added.

India, of course, has its own nuclear and missile plans. It may be steadfast about adhering to a "no first-use'' of nuclear weapons but has made it amply clear that a nuclear retaliation to a first strike will be "massive and designed to inflict unacceptable damage''.

The "Vijayee Bhava'' exercise, of course, is more conventional in nature, even though the combat manoeuvres may be simulated under "a NBC (nuclear, chemical, biological) overhang''.

The exercise, which will enter its peak phase in early-May, is being primarily conducted by the armoured corps-intensive 2 Corps, considered to be the most crucial of Army's three principal "strike'' formations tasked with virtually cutting Pakistan into two during a full-fledged war, said sources.

Incidentally, the 2 Corps based in Ambala is aptly called the `Kharga Corps', taking its name and formation sign from the deadly scythe wielded by Goddess Kali to vanquish enemies.

"In 2009, the 2 Corps had conducted the `Hind Shakti' exercise to fine-tune the pro-active strategy, which is all about mobilizing fast and hitting hard at several border points to catch the enemy unawares and gain momentum,'' said a source.

"The `Vijayee Bhava' exercise, which will also include elements from other Western Army Command (WAC) formations like the Jalandhar-based 11 Corps, will further validate operational concepts,'' he added.

With hundreds of tanks, artillery guns and over 30,000 soldiers, the exercise geared for "network-centric operations'' will see the extensive use of satellite imagery, helicopter-borne surveillance systems, spy drones and a wide array of land-based radars to "achieve battlefield transparency''.

As reported by TOI earlier, after Operation Parakram in 2002 took almost a month to reach D-Day readiness, India has reorganized Army formations all along the western front to enable a more swift and powerful offensive punch.

It was under this overall plan that the South-Western Command (SWAC) was created at Jaipur in 2005 as the Army's sixth operational command. With the Mathura-based 1 `Strike' Corps and Bhatinda-based 10 `Pivot' Corps under it, SWAC is responsible for offensive operations on the western front in conjunction with the Western Army Command (Chandimandir), which controls the 2 `Strike' Corps.

The Northern and Southern Army Commands, with the latter having the Bhopal-based 21 `Strike' Corps, at Udhampur and Pune respectively, will of course also play a crucial part in the event of a war but it will be SWAC and WAC which will assume the pivotal roles.

Moreover, both the western and southwestern commands of IAF have also stepped up coordination with the different Army commands in the western theatre to synergize efforts to build "an integrated and organic'' air-land war-fighting machinery.


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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Brando » 20 Apr 2011 11:29

Singha wrote:nike/reebok/adidas do make a bunch of models in India I think. have seen factory 'seconds' stores both in mahipalpur near palam and marathalli here.

for a huge customer like IA , they will be happy to manufacture any shoe on earth here using only khadi and kerala rubber if asked.


It's a shame we have to fill the pockets of these foreign companies when India has some of the finest shoe design institutes in the world and also has ample manufacturing capacity. Why should the IA have to pay extra for some silly "Reebok" or "Adidas" emblem on the side of their shoes ? Wouldn't it be better for the IA to give their jawans a stipend of say 4000/year so that they can buy what ever shoe they want within certain parameters ? That way it would encourage the private sector to come out with good shoes as well as make companies work harder to offer the best product. Since the jawans are going to be using it day in and day out, who better than they to pick out the best shoe ?

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby merlin » 20 Apr 2011 11:49

rohitvats wrote:
merlin wrote:Cross posting from newbie thread so that it reaches a wider set of people

Newbie pooch

1. Does an IA division have the same set of brigades always under it? I realize that battalions under the brigade always changes, but do the brigades also change?
2. If brigades don't change, is there a way to find out which brigades are under a particular division - open source only!
3. Same questions for a Corps with respect to Divisions.

Thanks


1. The number of brigades under a division are assigned as per operational requirement and may vary from 3 (standard) to 5-6. The brigades do not rotate out of a division under normal circumstances and their location ( in terms of area of responsibility) is fixed. During war times, additional brigades may be attached to a division or some may be taken away from it as per the requirement.

2. Brigade level orbat is very-very difficult to build - you can start with historical accounts of wars and battles....most of these formations would have retained their brigades....but there are movements of brigades and they do get re-assigned (though very rarely). And then there are new formations which would have been raised and of which one would not know anything.

3. Same as brigades...all the Corps have a set number of divisions and each division as an operational task assigned to it. Again, divisions may be added to Corps or be taken away as per operational requirement (like shifting of NE based divisions to western sector in Op Parakram).


Thanks for the reply Rohit. I'm in the process of trying to build the orbat of one particular corps, I know the divisions under it and one brigade of one of the divisions. The rest is a blank and I'm trying to fill in the gaps. Shiv's uncle google is helping a bit.


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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Gaur » 20 Apr 2011 17:36


"No Rescue
No Surrender
Do or Die"

On most people's arm, it would have looked like bravado. On this amazing man's arm, it just reads like a simple fact of life. A motto by which these people live everyday.
This is truly inspiring stuff.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby VinodTK » 21 Apr 2011 03:25

Growing gap
There is need for an overhaul of the salary structure.'

A crippling shortage in the officers’ ranks of the Indian armed forces that is likely to persist beyond 2020 is reason for serious concern. It could severely undermine the efficiency of the country’s armed forces. The armed forces are facing a shortage of 15,004 officers with the army confronted by the most serious shortfall. While the army is short of around 12,349 officers, the navy and air force have a shortfall of 1,818 and 837 officers respectively. The shortage in the army is particularly serious — over 25 per cent of its sanctioned strength. Not only has the shortfall in officers existed for years but also the gap has grown.

Low salaries, high stress and slow promotions in the armed forces are among the reasons why youngsters are not drawn to a career in the armed forces, especially when compared to a job in the private sector. So unattractive has a career in the forces become that seats in the military academies are going unfilled year after year. Those who do give it a shot and enter the forces are putting in their papers before long. The armed forces are suffering from high attrition rates.

Some have suggested forced conscription to address the shortage. This is a bad idea as it will not make for a motivated force. Besides it goes against India’s ethos of democracy. The government has been saying that it is taking remedial measures to deal with the shortfall. It has said that all officers including those in the short service commission (SSC) will be eligible to hold substantive ranks within a few years of reckonable service. The tenure of SSC officers has been increased too. Efforts are on to attract youngsters through advertisements. However, these measures are at best superficial. What is required is a complete overhaul of the salary structure and of the promotions policy so that good officers are motivated to remain in the military and the best and brightest are drawn to a career in the armed forces. In its effort to improve the fighting capability of the armed forces, India is investing billions of dollars in modernising military hardware. It is however neglecting the problem of shortage of officers. The latest weaponry alone will not make our borders safe. We need the right personnel to plan and lead from the front.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby VinodTK » 21 Apr 2011 03:27


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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby abhishek_sharma » 21 Apr 2011 06:13

Institute: Soldiers Need Better Diet After Brain Injury

http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/04/institute-soldiers-need-better.html

In a report released today, the Institute of Medicine recommends that soldiers who suffer a traumatic brain injury (TBI) in the field of battle must receive adequate calories and protein immediately after the injury and for at least 2 weeks after to help reduce inflammation and minimize the damage to the brain. The report was commissioned by the Department of Defense, which wanted a review of the potential role of nutrition in minimizing the impact of brain injury, a signature injury of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The panel of experts who drafted the report noted that although current guidelines for treating TBI recommend early feeding, the details vary.

They recommend that the military develop standardized nutritional guidelines for soldiers with brain injury and conduct studies to determine the optimal blood sugar levels and feeding regimes to minimize the impact of brain injuries.

The panel also reviewed the scientific literature on various nutritional supplements, including choline, creatine, fish oil, and antioxidants, but concluded that there is not enough evidence for beneficial effects in patients with brain injury to recommend their use at this time.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby rohitvats » 22 Apr 2011 13:56

From Orbat.com:

Starting from around 2005 or so, the Strike Corps (combined with at least one Holding Corps) have been exercised at a much higher tempo. These exercises centered around the Strike Corps's armored divisions have now become an annual affair. This is something that seems to have gone largely unnoticed by those in the media, academia/think-tanks, and the blogosphere that like to comment on military and security issues. Last summer, it was I and X Corps and this summer, it is going to be II and XI Corps. One of the interesting aims of this summer's exercise is to be able to have a division sized battle group from II Corps launch combat operations within 48 hours of the commencement of the exercise. Obviously, this aim needs to be qualified with which brigades are going to be mobilized from which divisions of II Corps and how far are they supposed to travel and where are they supposed to begin their attack. Nonetheless, if this aim of 48 hours for a division-equivalent from II Corps is achieved, then I for one will be impressed. Just two to three years ago, it used to take about 96 hours to achieve a similar aim during these exercises.


My comment: I and X Corps - South Western Command and II and XI - Western Command; how nicely it fits. Watch out for XII and XXI Corps exercise on the same lines.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Pratyush » 24 Apr 2011 12:44

Have been trolling the web and just stumbled on to the UA Army efforts to create the weight carrying exo skeletons. Some thing like that will help the IA in Siachin and similar situations.

U.S. Army Natick Soldier Center to Test Lockheed Martin’s HULC Exoskeleton System

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby sum » 24 Apr 2011 14:53

X-post:
sum wrote:Sachin greets wheelchair-bound army jawans

ust two days before his birthday on Sunday, despite being in the middle of the ongoing Indian Premier League (IPL) tournament, cricketer Sachin Tendulkar did not turn down the opportunity to interact with a large group of wheelchair-bound soldiers in Pune.

In fact, Tendulkar had a big match against the Chennai Super Kings, later in the day (which his team Mumbai Indians won). While Tendulkar could not visit the Paraplegic Rehabilitation Center in Khadki, Pune, due to his IPL commitments, he interacted with the soldiers via videoconferencing (VC).

he interaction, which will be telecast on TV today, lasted for 25 minutes and around 50 soldiers participated in it. When the VC began, Tendulkar was the first to greet the other party, and fired the first salvo. He asked, "Where do you get the strength to fight for the country from?" One member replied, saying, when they go to the battlefield, they don't think about themselves but the country.

When it was the turn of the soldiers, one of them stated that in India, every child wants to become a Sachin Tendulkar. Tendulkar smiled and pointed out that every child has a dream, which is either to become a painter, teacher, cricketer or a soldier. "Parents should support their dreams and children in turn should reciprocate and give their best," he added.

From then on, all the questions focussed on Tendulkar's career. One of the soldiers asked why Tendulkar chose cricket, when as a child he was interested in tennis. In response, Tendulkar revealed his fascination for tennis icon John McEnroe and his never-say-die spirit. "I have always been fascinated by McEnroe because he hated losing. Even today, I catch up on some of the old matches he played at Wimbledon. I joined cricket because I received support from my brother and coach. Thankfully, it was not a bad choice," said Tendulkar, drawing smiles from everyone.

By the end of the interaction, Tendulkar promised to visit the centre once he found time from his cricketing commitments. According to Tendulkar, he is not only keen to visit the centre but also share a food and a game of basketball with the soldiers.

Truely a great guy to spend his Bday with the Khadki soldiers...
my respect for SRT keeps increasing all the time.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Gerard » 25 Apr 2011 02:19


Sachin
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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Sachin » 25 Apr 2011 10:04

Gerard wrote:Army wants own empowered police force

My humble opinion. It is better to "reuse" any of the existing police agencies (Central Police Agencies), in the policing work at the Army. This I feel would be more productive than increasing the size of CMP, recruiting investigating officers (who are permenantly assigned to the CMP), giving them police and law related training etc. The senior commanders of the Army can jointly work with the top officers of say the CRPF, and ensure that the law enforcement in an military unit gets handled by a unit deputed from the CRPF. The CRPF officers would have be given training on the Military laws which are in place, which I feel would be simpler than myraid civil law books which currently exists.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby jai » 25 Apr 2011 11:27

Cross posted from Missiles and Munitions discussion

chackojoseph wrote:I have some great love for Para Military and forces on the border (its the delhi based I have issues with).



CJ, so do I !!

The issue is always with those who can misuse their positions of power and not the poor soldiers or laborers from rural India who work the roads and currently man the equipment.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-04-14/india/29417008_1_strategic-roads-bro-defence-ministry

I am therefore convinced that its a systemic and leadership issue - in how this force is managed and supported by the govt.

I Feel that the time is ripe for a total remake of this service. It needs to be now brought out of the shadows of Army Engineers, and either merged into Army Engineers completely - so that they have better manpower and management support or; set them up as a separate service and identity as a Corps.

Either ways, massive infusion of capital in terms of equipment - including tunnel boring machines, men (including engineers on deputation from govt and civilian establishments - ex. employees or people hired from contractors of DMRC who specialize in making tunnels for example) , materials and high technology are now needed to ensure that BR can deliver with speed; nature and adverse weather not withstanding - even if it means creating fully functional camps with family accommodation and schools every 100 Km in their areas of operation.

The need is to increase the network of all weather roads multi fold in all border areas. This is a target that can not be allowed to be slipped any longer.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 25 Apr 2011 12:15

The new push for road on the NE will bring in the reorganisation, may be not excatly, the way you described. They will definitely get the equipment they need. I don't see an issue in terms of organisational prespective. Their structure is fine. Just that they need to get more attention from top. We mostly hear Tanks and planes, not the other stuff.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Marut » 25 Apr 2011 13:21

Sachin wrote:
Gerard wrote:Army wants own empowered police force

My humble opinion. It is better to "reuse" any of the existing police agencies (Central Police Agencies), in the policing work at the Army. This I feel would be more productive than increasing the size of CMP, recruiting investigating officers (who are permenantly assigned to the CMP), giving them police and law related training etc. The senior commanders of the Army can jointly work with the top officers of say the CRPF, and ensure that the law enforcement in an military unit gets handled by a unit deputed from the CRPF. The CRPF officers would have be given training on the Military laws which are in place, which I feel would be simpler than myraid civil law books which currently exists.


IIRC, there isn't much love lost between mils and paramil (CPOs as they are now referred to). Wonder how do we deal with the attitudinal and perceptional differences of the mils being policed by non-mils. I understand the crux of your statement but it needs a lot of thinking (wrt implementation on ground) on the part of higher ups or we risk some yellow matter hitting rotating contraption on the ceiling.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Avik » 25 Apr 2011 16:12

IIRC, there isn't much love lost between mils and paramil (CPOs as they are now referred to).


Sir, this is a wrong characterization. In the main, the relationship between the army and the PMFs like BSF, AR, ITBP is quite close. The army doesnt really have a problem with these orgs and is pretty appreciative of their efforts.Although, it would like operational control of the forces in certain areas and higher levels of training for these forces.
The PMFs have a different point,centered around benefits. Their grouse is more against the way the Central Govt. treats them; they undergo fairly severe hardships, without the support system of the military. But thats a problem which exists because of the GoI's insistence on raising CPO numbers through increasing battalions, without increase in corresponding support infra; in other words, keep increasing the tooth, while totally neglecting the tail.
The systemic problem in the PMFs/CPOs is that they do not have a general staff branch in the same lines and of the same calibre of the IA. The IA's training regimen, all said and done, is one of the best in the world and they have the institutional knowledge and memory to adapt themselves, and seek recourse for peculiar situations. It is this system, which enables the IA to raise support units like ASC, Ordnance, Signals, Hospitals, MCOs, Transit camps, railway reservation quotas, EME etc. when the number of fighting troops are being increased. One strong indicator of this is that it is tougher to raise RR battalions than BSF/CRPF/ITBP units; amongst, the PMF's, it is tough to raise additional AR units because the IA , has admin control of the AR, and insists on an adequate support structure...the PMFs, unfortunately, do not do so.

Hence, you have situations where the hardship for PMFs personnel is increased because they just do not have the support infra, that is the bare minimum required to support fighting troops. And I have not even started on the pathetic lack of family support infra within the PMFs. A lot of these weaknesses in the PMFs is because of the weak general staff branch in the PMF's leading to lack of training, administrative support and weak intelligence leading to sub-par performance in some cases.
Last edited by Avik on 25 Apr 2011 16:32, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Avik » 25 Apr 2011 16:23

My humble opinion. It is better to "reuse" any of the existing police agencies (Central Police Agencies), in the policing work at the Army. This I feel would be more productive than increasing the size of CMP, recruiting investigating officers (who are permenantly assigned to the CMP), giving them police and law related training etc. The senior commanders of the Army can jointly work with the top officers of say the CRPF, and ensure that the law enforcement in an military unit gets handled by a unit deputed from the CRPF.


Sir, I think the army is looking to develop the infrastructure for investigation and punishment within its system, given the rash of unsavoury disclosures. They would ideally be looking at something like an internal CID or the NCIS of the US. This would, in the Indian context typically be a combination of investigation + policing + deterrence; something like an internal CBI. So, the CMP obviously doesnt cut it, as they are essentially for the deterrence mode.

The idea of sourcing from the police forces/ CPos may not work, more for practical reasons due to seniority and grade mismatch. Also, very few police inspectors/investigators would want to leave the police force, with its attendant "benefits" for the rigour and pain of the IA, with none of the "benefits". In any case, forces like the CRPF do not have any investigation capability. They are a deterrent + riot control force.

Something of the nature that the IA is seeking can at best have a few lateral recruits from the CBI or state police CID deptts, but I wouldnt hold out too much hope there for eager recruits! This would have to be developed internally with the existing manpower of the CMP, with a specialized officer cadre focused on investigation and analysis. Hence, the army's plan to re-mould the CMP.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby chackojoseph » 25 Apr 2011 16:39

What about Military Police it already has?

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Avik » 25 Apr 2011 16:44

What about Military Police it already has?


Sir...please read what I have written in my previous post!

This would have to be developed internally with the existing manpower of the CMP, with a specialized officer cadre focused on investigation and analysis. Hence, the army's plan to re-mould the CMP.


CMP = Corps of Military Police

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby rohitvats » 25 Apr 2011 16:58

How many here know that CMP does not have it's own officer cadre? All the officers are deputed from other barnches. This is something they can start looking at.

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Gaur » 25 Apr 2011 17:41

rohitvats wrote:How many here know that CMP does not have it's own officer cadre? All the officers are deputed from other barnches. This is something they can start looking at.

That is specifically mentioned in the article. So, I think you may get your wish. :)

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Re: Indian Army: News & Discussion

Postby Sachin » 25 Apr 2011 19:58

Marut wrote:IIRC, there isn't much love lost between mils and paramil (CPOs as they are now referred to). Wonder how do we deal with the attitudinal and perceptional differences of the mils being policed by non-mils.

When I typed the initial post, what caught my eye was the statement (in the report) "With just over 9,000 personnel and no dedicated officer cadre, the CMP has largely been reduced to ceremonial and traffic management duties over the years.". And in many cities like Bengaluru, even for the visits of high ranking Army officers the Army takes active cooperation of the Traffic Police for the route bandobust. The military police generally would be in the convoy as out-riders, escort and pilot (with another Traffic Police jeep a bit more further up). This is a simpler setup, because even Army feels that civil Traffic police are much more suited for this activity (because they have more experience).

The attitudinal and perceptional differences, cannot be just allowed to be there for ever. If the Army is finding it tough to do "police work", try to get an agency and its people who are trained for the "police work". And there are very many crimes/offences in which the Army hands over its personnel to the civil police.

Avik wrote:Sir, I think the army is looking to develop the infrastructure for investigation and punishment within its system, given the rash of unsavoury disclosures. They would ideally be looking at something like an internal CID or the NCIS of the US.

I was told that Army already have a much more stringent punishment mechanism already in place :). From the above I understand that the Army is then trying to have a "Vigilance & Anti-Corruption Bureau" sort of thing. State Police forces generally have a sub-unit like this.

The idea of sourcing from the police forces/ CPos may not work, more for practical reasons due to seniority and grade mismatch.

This seems to be the biggest bottle neck :D. That is the protocol and seniority claims. CBI is currently investigating a case in Kerala, where Dy.SPs,PIs,SIs are charged with a lock up death. Two IPS officers are also on the radar. The investigation officer for this case is a Dy.SP. I feel if crimes are getting investigated, it is better to keep aside seniority and grade aside.

Something of the nature that the IA is seeking can at best have a few lateral recruits from the CBI or state police CID deptts, but I wouldnt hold out too much hope there for eager recruits!

A lot of state police officers go on deputation to vary many other agencies. To assume that they only go for postings which gets them bribes, is a bit preposterous. Any way, the Army would have to take external help here as I don't think they have the necessary means (at the moment) for giving training in police investigations. Also, these investigation officers may also have to attend court hearings in civil courts as well.

And, a police agency is *supposed* to be neutral and hand cases in a non-partisan manner. This means the police agency should be independent to a pretty high level. Can Indian Army have such a police agency in place? One which has a different command hierarchy etc., which is totally independent of other command hierarchies, so that an independent investigation can be carried out? Or else what guarantee is that this new Military Police establishment can carry out its task (which may even include investigation of corruption charges against superior officers etc.) without getting muffled?

Aside: How does the Army Postal Corps work? If I am not mistaken it has staff on deputation coming from the Department of Posts.


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