Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan - November 06, 2009

kenop · Post by **kenop** » 26 Nov 2009 16:30

On 26/11 Pak rubs salt in India's wounds
26 Nov 2009, 1629 hrs IST
On the first anniversary of the Pakistan-sponsored 26/11 Mumbai attacks, Pakistan has rubbed salt into India's wounds by blaming India for terrorism in its Balochistan province. The allegations came from a person no less than Pakistan Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani himself.

Gilani was addressing a press conference in Islamabad to announce the federal government's new package for the troubled Balochistan province, which not only borders NWFP and Taliban-controlled tribal areas but has also been racked with an insurgency by rebels demanding independence for the province.

In an answer to a reporter's query about outside forces supporting the Baloch insurgency, Gilani said that the administration had solid evidence about India's involvement in the province and had taken up the matter at the Sharm-el-Shaikh meet. He also reaffirmed Pakistan's intention to take up the issue again with India at the 'appropriate time'.

When the reporter asked Gilani as to when Pakistan would take up the issue of India's interference in Balochistan, he said, "We will take up the issue along with the evidence at the appropriate time. As far as interference is concerned, I took up the matter with PM Manmohan Singh in Sharm-el-Shaikh, and we agreed to discuss both, Kashmir and Balochistan. The forces are trying to destabilise Balochistan and will not succeed."

sunnyP · Post by **sunnyP** » 26 Nov 2009 17:35

We must be ready to fight Hindus, says Nizami

LAHORE - Editor-in-Chief The Nation and Chairman Nazria Pakistan Trust Majid Nizami has said that we should remain well-prepared for war against Hindus as they were casting bad eye on Pakistan and our independence, which is a blessing of Allah.
He was speaking at Aiwan-e-Karkunan Tehrik-e-Pakistan on the 53rd death anniversary of Maulana Zafar Ali Khan on Tuesday.

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... ays-Nizami

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 26 Nov 2009 17:41

RayC wrote: After butting China over Dalai Lama and Arunachal, this is another indication of growing confidence of the Indian leadership!

As a congressi, I am just glad to see our Pradhan Mantri Jee acting firm. Those taunts from BJP wallas were beginning to hurt my feelings.

bart · Post by **bart** » 26 Nov 2009 19:04

sunnyP wrote:

We must be ready to fight Hindus, says Nizami

LAHORE - Editor-in-Chief The Nation and Chairman Nazria Pakistan Trust Majid Nizami has said that we should remain well-prepared for war against Hindus as they were casting bad eye on Pakistan and our independence, which is a blessing of Allah.
He was speaking at Aiwan-e-Karkunan Tehrik-e-Pakistan on the 53rd death anniversary of Maulana Zafar Ali Khan on Tuesday.

http://www.nation.com.pk/pakistan-news- ... ays-Nizami

Isn't the concept of casting a bad eye (boori aankh) an evil Indian superstition, and hence Un-Islamic?

Karan Dixit wrote:
RayC wrote: After butting China over Dalai Lama and Arunachal, this is another indication of growing confidence of the Indian leadership!

As a congressi, I am just glad to see our Pradhan Mantri Jee acting firm. Those taunts from BJP wallas were beginning to hurt my feelings.

True, and to add to that, I am glad that China, Pak and now US to some extent are openly being antagonistic to us. I think they are much more dangerous when they are friendly and our leaders take them at face value or let their guard down...eg. Nehru vs China or ABV's trip to Lahore while Kargil was being infiltrated.

Gagan · Post by **Gagan** » 26 Nov 2009 19:46

Ananya wrote:another of Nucleal war , a limited nuclear war....

http://pkaffairs.com/playshow.asp?pageId=6407

after 20 Mts

That Lt Gen Hamid Nawaz comes across as a low IQ individual. If a chap of this intellect can become a Lt Gen in the Pak Fauj it is very telling about the quality of people that country employs.

He sounds like he's sitting on a charpai in his village spewing conspiracy theories and threatening dire consequences, not realizing that his country is slipping away.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 26 Nov 2009 20:02

Gagan wrote:
Ananya wrote:another of Nucleal war , a limited nuclear war....

http://pkaffairs.com/playshow.asp?pageId=6407

after 20 Mts
That Lt Gen Hamid Nawaz comes across as a low IQ individual. If a chap of this intellect can become a Lt Gen in the Pak Fauj it is very telling about the quality of people that country employs.

He sounds like he's sitting on a charpai in his village spewing conspiracy theories and threatening dire consequences, not realizing that his country is slipping away.

I am beginning to wonder - these fellows are devoutly Islamic right? Despite their being devout if their country is being screwed by all and sundry, surely it does not take too much intelligence to figure out that Allah himself must be singling them out for special punishment?

I mean how much brains does it take to think:

"I am a good Muslim. Allah helps Muslims. But I am being screwed. I have become a better Muslim. I am still getting screwed. Allah can't be wrong in screwing me. Then there must be something wrong with me"

OK I agree that the entire goddam nation of Pakistan has a mental disease, They are in denial and cognitive dissonance is beginning to show itself at a national level. If fact that scheme to remove the name "Islamic" from Pakistan and call it "People's Republic" is an admission that there is a problem. It's only one small step from there to start understanding that cursing India, cursing Hindus, blaming everything on Hindus, Jews etc is not working because Allah does not want it to work. Allah does no seem to believe that the Pakistanis are doing the right things. Or else why would he screw the devout Pakis, I ask you?

Are Pakis really that dumb. I mean all this cousin marriage and stuff - does it really replace the brain with a musharraf?

If Pakistanis claim that they have a great country of great people why is Allah continuously screwing Pakistan. Either Pakis are wrong or Allah is wrong. No? Any Paki should be able to figure that one out.

Ananya · Post by **Ananya** » 26 Nov 2009 20:08

yes their entire mental breakup of TPS is gone . they are like a kintergarden kid which throws up tantrums for everything , sometimes as a parent i feel to put things in order and stop the recus a tight slap is need to bring in a sence of order.

Talking simple wont do

All of them thing they are born to rule India and nothing elese is acceptable , this thought is only prevalent in Punjab and FATA, Sind and baluchitan want growth, education and stocks !!!! these are rarely seen in TV

A_Gupta · Post by **A_Gupta** » 26 Nov 2009 20:43

Gagan wrote: That Lt Gen Hamid Nawaz comes across as a low IQ individual. If a chap of this intellect can become a Lt Gen in the Pak Fauj it is very telling about the quality of people that country employs.

To quote, is it an iodine deficiency?

Imagine, RAW secretly iodizes the waters in the upper reaches of the rivers to solve India's Pakistan problem!

archan · Post by **archan** » 26 Nov 2009 21:17

A_Gupta wrote:
Gagan wrote: That Lt Gen Hamid Nawaz comes across as a low IQ individual. If a chap of this intellect can become a Lt Gen in the Pak Fauj it is very telling about the quality of people that country employs.
To quote, is it an iodine deficiency?

Imagine, RAW secretly iodizes the waters in the upper reaches of the rivers to solve India's Pakistan problem!

You're giving them ideas. Soon Zaid Zaman Hamid will come up with an expose based on LAB tests that the Hindus are injecting a medicine in the water that is making Pakistani men impotent, born with small heads, more interested in goats and AK47s than in women...
Pakistan is a pure country, it is the conspirators like Hindus and Jews that are messing with their brains - or what remains of it.

archan · Post by **archan** » 26 Nov 2009 21:29

India, US casting evil eye on Balochistan's natural resources: JI chief

Jamaat-i-Islami chief Syed Munawar Hasan has accused India and the United States of casting an evil eye on Balochistan's natural resources.

Addressing a rally near Parliament, Hasan said: "The 'Obama-Manmohan nexus' is working against the interests of Pakistan."

The same resources which the Punjabi Pakistanis have been denying to their rightful owners, the Baloch, for over 60 years?

He also demanded of the government to dismiss Interior Minister Rehman Malik in order to save democracy.

"It is unacceptable to allow those who have looted the national exchequer to sit in the parliament," The Daily Times quoted Hasan, as saying.

Really? how many of your ex- and present Prime Ministers, Presidents, Army Chiefs deserve to be on their posts then?

Amber G. · Post by **Amber G.** » 26 Nov 2009 22:45

X - post Face of Pakistan (From a picture in Dawn)

Pakistani scum-e-pig Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, center prays with Syed Salahuddin, right, chief of Hezbul Mujahideen or United Jehad Council at a rally in Muzaffarabad.

Karan Dixit · Post by **Karan Dixit** » 26 Nov 2009 23:37

shiv wrote: Are Pakis really that dumb. I mean all this cousin marriage and stuff - does it really replace the brain with a musharraf?

Yes, it does. It is called inbreeding depression.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inbreeding_depression

Inbreeding depression is a major problem in countries like Pakistan, UK, etc.

asprinzl · Post by **asprinzl** » 27 Nov 2009 02:01

Doc,
I am as perplexed as you are. I have a Palestinian friend. Educated, American wife, businessman, very intelligent. We always discuss about the Israel-Palestinian issues. With his people he would harp continuosly that the Jews are chosen people of God (which I absolutely don't agree) and God will always protect them. However, it never occured to him or his people why Allah is not helping their cause? Is it because what they are doing is disliked by Allah? Funny thing is the solution offered by him and many of his people. Their problem according to him is that his people are not Muslim enough and that is why allah is not helping them.

I don't know if inbreeding causes this and I know for fact that his parents are not first cousins. I think they have been so theologically brainwashed that they simply cannot include rational thoughts in matters pertaining to religion. Every other subject under the sun can be disected to the micron level except that one subject. Isn't this exactly what is happening in Pak Is Satan?

How people can dwell in this contradictory spheres if beyond me.
Avram

PS: Happy Thanks Giving to all who are on this side of the Atlantic

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 27 Nov 2009 02:15

Deleted

harbans · Post by **harbans** » 27 Nov 2009 05:05

Pakistani scum-e-pig Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi, center prays
with Syed Salahuddin, right, chief of Hezbul Mujahideen or United Jehad Council at a rally in Muzaffarabad.

He is not praying to God. He's praying to the devil. Satan. Anyone thinking Jihad against an infidel
(thats what it means, violence aginst unbelievers) will get him or her heaven..will earn hell. A perpetual one. However much peace we may wish on the propounders of the psyhe of Jihad, unfortunately they will languish in hell. That is Karma. Time Paki's understood this basic fact of Dharma.

Yes also Jihad ======== Evil======SATAN. Mr Lakhvi.

arnab · Post by **arnab** » 27 Nov 2009 05:38

FO concerned over FICCI report

http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=25823

Friday, November 27, 2009
ISLAMABAD: Expressing concern over the ‘National Security and Terrorism’ report by the Federation of Indian Chambers of Commerce and Industry (FICCI), Pakistan on Thursday said it regards such views as unhelpful to cause of peace in South Asia. In response to a question, Foreign Office spokesman Abdul Basit remarked that “we have noted with deep concern the report titled ‘National Security and Terrorism’ by the Federation of Indian Chambers of Commerce and Industry (FICCI).

The Report in question

http://www.ficci.com/SPdocument/20032/t ... report.pdf

Pg 47 has a chapter 'Managing Pakistan' which must be causing particular angst. It is one thing if GOI releases reports, but if such reports come out of business chambers....

pgbhat · Post by **pgbhat** » 27 Nov 2009 05:52

Myths about Urdu ---- Dr Tariq Rahman

PICK up any Urdu textbook and the chances are that it will endorse the following myths: (a) the term ‘Urdu’ means military camp. Our language is called ‘Urdu’ because it was created in the army camps of the Mughals especially during the reign of Shah Jahan; (b) Urdu is a mixed language (khitchri zubaan); (c) Urdu is a Muslim language.

Now let us deal with these myths one by one.

All the histories in Persian about medieval India use the Turkish word ‘Urdu’ (which means ‘camp’ in original Turkish) for ‘city’. The word is not used in the original Turkish meaning in Indian sources in Persian for the most part. Sometimes the terms ‘Urdu-i-mualla’and ‘Urdu-i-badshahi’ are also used. During Shah Jahan’s time, Urdu-i-mualla referred to the language spoken in the city of Shahjahanabad (Delhi).

The language we now call Urdu has an ancestor referred to as Hindvi and Hindi in most medieval Persian sources. In Gujrat, however, the language is called Gujri and sometimes Gujrati. In the Deccan it is called Dakani and around the Delhi area it is also called Dehlavi. During the 18th century the word ‘Rekhta’ was also used for it.

<SNIP>

Syed Sulaiman Nadwi and some other thinkers who wanted Hindu-Muslim unity in British India even suggested that the term ‘Urdu’ be abandoned in favour of ‘Hindustani’ because the former conjured up the image of a military conquest and war whereas the latter had no such symbolic baggage.

The word ‘Urdu’ is a contraction of the phrase ‘zubaan-i-Urdu-i-mualla’ (i.e. the language of the exalted city) which came to be used during the late 18th century. It is, in fact, the most recent name for a language which certainly existed even in the 13th century. There are words and sentences which we can recognise even today in the malfuzat (sayings) and tazkiras (biographies) as well as other records of that period. They refer to the language used in the marketplace, songs, conversation and in homes. The military reference does not exist though the language must have been used among soldiers also.

It was certainly used in religious circles because even in far-off Kaniguram in Waziristan, a religious reformer called Bayazid Ansari wrote a book called Khairul Bayan in 1560 which has over 16 lines in this language which the author calls Hindi.

Now for the myth that Urdu is a mixture of other languages. If a language is really a mixture it is called pidgin which is nobody’s mother tongue and a reduced language. It may become a creole when it is developed and becomes somebody’s mother tongue.

Urdu’s ancestor — call it what you will — existed in India (probably in the vicinity of Delhi) as a full language. Words of Persian and Arabic origin crept into it. This was not because of military activities but ordinary everyday interaction.

This is a natural process and modern English came about in exactly this manner. That is why about half the vocabulary of English is from Latin and Greek via Norman French. But English is not called a ‘mixed language’ so why should Urdu be stigmatised as such?

If one starts calling languages mixed in the sense that there was no base for them and words from different languages combined then Urdu is not that kind of product. Urdu is mixed in the same way that English is: it has absorbed words from many languages.The third myth that Urdu is a Muslim language is more problematic. For about 500 years of its existence nobody called it Urdu. It was called Hindi and had many words of Sanskrit origin as do other texts — until the 18th century.

Then a language reform movement initiated by Muslim poets (Hatim, Mirza Mazhar, Nasikh’s students etc) threw out certain words from the corpus of the language. Among them were words like chinta (worry), prem (love), sundar (beautiful) etc. The movement was actually an attempt to create a linguistic marker for the cultural elite which was mostly Muslim. However, instead of being merely a class movement it became a religious one. Thus, Urdu was imbued with distinctive Perso-Arabic cultural content and served as an identity symbol for the Muslims of India.

In the same way, after 1802, modern Hindi was created by weeding out Persian and Arabic words and using only the Devanagari script for writing. These new languages — Sanskritised Hindi and Persianised Urdu — drifted apart from each other and still serve as identity markers for Hindu and Muslim nationalism in South Asia.

During the Pakistan Movement, Urdu became a symbol of the identity of South Asia’s Muslims. It was invested with emotional force and Maulvi Abdul Haq, who used to term it a composite language while in India, started calling it the mainstay of Muslim separatism.

Similarly, Sanskritised Hindi became the symbol of the attempt to eliminate the share of Muslims in Indian culture. This political gulf between the two sister languages remains to this day — although at the spoken level, Urdu and Hindi remain the same language as all Indians who watch Pakistani dramas and all Pakistanis who watch Hindi movies will testify.

However, while Pakistani Muslims insist that Urdu is a Muslim language, the Muslims of India refer to it as a composite language. This is because it is in the political interests of Pakistani Muslims to emphasise the differences between themselves and the Indians while the opposite is in the political interests of Indian Muslims.

In short, Urdu means different things to different people. It is only by separating the myth from reality that we can appreciate its true nature.

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 27 Nov 2009 07:05

Dunno whether to laugh or cry
http://www.thenews.com.pk/top_story_detail.asp?Id=25811

On the first anniversary of the Mumbai attacks, Jamaatud Dawa chief Hafiz Muhammad Saeed has condemned armed activitities and suicide attacks in Pakistan, declaring suicide attacks damaging for the image of Islam and Pakistan.

As I have just mentioned, in a few days a whole year will have passed since the November 26, 2008 attacks in Mumbai, India. Hundreds of families were affected by these attacks and these families must certainly be in a state of mourning on the anniversary of the attacks. Yet, if a few hundred families were affected by these attacks in India, at least five thousand families in Pakistan have also had to endure momentous suffering. This is so because India placed the entire blame of the Mumbai attacks on the Jamaatud Dawah, and me without any proof at all, and succeeded in having UN sanctions imposed upon us with the active collaboration of the United States. The sanctions resulted in a crackdown on the Jamaatud Dawah and all of the organization’s humanitarian and educational projects were shut down, while I, along with a number of my colleagues, was put under preventive detention.

Another reason for India’s personal vendetta against myself, accompanied with all the usual racket, is evident in what every Pakistani man, woman, and child is saying these days, and which I have claimed for several years now; that India is the real sponsor of all the acts of terror and carnage in Pakistan. My crime is that I reveal India’s real face to the people of Pakistan and I expose its two-faced policy of overtly appearing all smiles and geniality, while it conceals a dagger in its sleeve, waiting to stab one in the back at the first opportunity. India cannot stand my existence for another reason too, and that is that I speak about the rights of Muslims of the whole subcontinent. Moreover, I do not stay silent when Muslims are slaughtered in Gujrat and Maharashtra.

Ananya · Post by **Ananya** » 27 Nov 2009 07:14

we have to be politically currect in these situtation and take into consideration geo-political issues.

We need to pray that terrorist will never come and attack us as we are one united country which would light candles and form a human chain and remember the fact that Central HOME ministery will not have any say in state protection.

peace is the need of the hour till we go to pieces

Malayappan · Post by **Malayappan** » 27 Nov 2009 07:14

Pakistan: two questions, multiple realities Nirupama Subramanian
Worth a read and also for quoting and passing on...
Some excerpts -

“Some corners of the establishment may still hold the view that the LeT can be used as a ‘strategic asset,’ but there is a lot of internal thinking on this, lots of questions are being asked internally about this. My information is that in the majority view, they are now seen more as a liability,” said Amir Rana, author of A-Z of Jihad, and head of the Pakistan Institute of Peace Studies.

But the government’s reluctance to go all the way against the LeT is all too obvious.

In a background briefing for journalists last month, senior military officials warned against India’s “propaganda” of trying to conflate the LeT with Al Qaeda “for its own ends”.

For all Pak watchers I would say the article is a must read!

Malayappan · Post by **Malayappan** » 27 Nov 2009 07:17

Praveen Swami does a quick update on the 26/11 probe Paki dimenisions -

Missing evidence mars Mumbai massacre probe

Malayappan · Post by **Malayappan** » 27 Nov 2009 07:37

Pakistan Taliban regrouping outside Waziristan, Los Angeles Times
http://www.latimes.com/news/nation-and- ... 1309.story

From the article -

Since the Pakistani army launched a long-awaited offensive last month to destroy the Taliban in South Waziristan, many militants have fled to nearby districts and begun to establish new strongholds, a strategy that suggests they will regroup and remain a potent threat to the country's weak, U.S.-backed government.

When the offensive began Oct. 17, Pakistani military leaders said they faced a fighting force of as many as 10,000 battle-hardened militants. Thus far, however, the army has put the number of militants killed at 500.

"The strategy has been bad," said Imtiaz Gul, a security analyst based in Islamabad, the Pakistani capital. "You don't carry out operations after making such announcements. This area gives them huge space for mobility. So when crunch time comes, they can disperse to safer places, regroup, reorganize and hit the state somewhere else."

"The militants have the capacity to regroup and come back," said retired Gen. Talat Masood, an Islamabad-based defense analyst. "They should not be allowed to consolidate. . . . South Waziristan has been a tactical success of sorts, but by no means is it a victory."

Ananya · Post by **Ananya** » 27 Nov 2009 07:48

This article is written in a more sobre way. The basic psychology of Pak will never change . The army and ISI know abt this and the govt is a pupet , the small segment of rougue elements are responsible with the blessing of the entire clan and would continue to be venturing in activites.

heart and heart they know what happened in Mumbai is a proud moment for the PAK ,atleast that boosts their moral.

if they diverge from this they would colapse

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 07:58

Malayappan wrote:Pakistan: two questions, multiple realities Nirupama Subramanian

This lady writes well but there is a problem win the way the entire "secular world" sees the issue. It's like a child asking "Mummy where did I come from?" Mummy say "Oh we found you in a tub of yogurt". OK but that's not where we found my little brother where did he come from?"Well - aaah - ahem - er it must have been something I ate"

Mummy does not want to talk sex with her little darling. Secular societies do not want to talk about the role of religion in geopolitical issues.

Clearly Pakistan is motivated by Islam

It is the Islamic republic of Pakistan
Islam and jihad are the motto of the Pakistan army
The Paki army chief has spoken of Islam and Pakistan being inseparable in the last one week
The LeT is a militant faction of the Jamaat ud dawa which is an islamic "charity"
The conversations of the terrorists from Mumbai clearly speak of what Allah promises if they kil unbelievers

Secular societies fear religious upheaval if they mention religion just like mummy fears that little darling will get funny ideas if she tells him what she had been up to.

It is quite OK for Pakistan to be motivated by Islam. So we can let Pakistan off the hook. But we need to ask if it is OK under Islam to kill unbeliever and to keep killing. These are up front questions that ned to be asked and not answered by us (as they will be on this forum with the usual replies)

The answer whether Islam promotes murder has to be asked to all Islamic societies who claim they are all interlinked to each other by Islam. Pakistan's Islam has to come under scrutiny if Pakistan wants to hide behind Islam. And if Pakistan's Islamic actions are supported or go unquestioned by other Islamic societies - Islam itself needs to be shown up.

If there is one ummah then the actions of an Islamic Pakistan reflect on the entire ummah, and we need a check on exactly what the rest of the Ummah believe Pakistani actions are like.

The way to check Pakistan's actions is to point out that they are completely Islamic and that Pakistan reflects Islam, and Pakistani actions are perfectly correct under islam. There is no other go. Mummy will have to tell baba the truth.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 27 Nov 2009 08:04

Malayappan wrote:Pakistan: two questions, multiple realities Nirupama Subramanian
For all Pak watchers I would say the article is a must read!

Yes, Nirupama Subramanian, one of the only two Indian journalists allowed as resident journalists in Pakistan, is quite good.

From that article,

Indeed, an October 16 report in The News, which was not denied or contradicted yet, said the military flew down the leadership of the Jaish-e-Mohammed and the Sipah-e-Sahaba to negotiate with the GHQ attackers during the siege. From the JeM, it was Mufti Abdul Rauf, the younger brother of Maulana Masood Azhar and acting Ameer of the group.

We know that during the Lal Masjid stand-off too, Pakistani establishment asked Fazlur Rehman Khalil (Founder of HuJI and later Harkat-ul-Mujahideen, HuM) to negotiate. He was supposed to be in protective custody at that time though the Islamic Republic of Pakistan has been proclaiming that it was unaware of his whereabouts in response to India's 'Most Wanted List'. Fazlur Rehman Khalil appears most prominently in that list.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 27 Nov 2009 08:10

shiv wrote:Mummy will have to tell baba the truth.

Jethmalani told the Wahhabi mummy the truth last week because the mummy herself is pretending to be unaware of where the babies come from.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 08:13

shiv wrote: The way to check Pakistan's actions is to point out that they are completely Islamic and that Pakistan reflects Islam, and Pakistani actions are perfectly correct under islam.

Pseudosecularism is the belief that Indian Muslims are convinced that Pakistan's murderous actions are Islamic, and that Indian Muslims will get angry if we question Pakistan's "Islamic" actions.

But we in India have a problem. We don't ask anyone from the ummah, Indian or non Indian if Pakistan's murderous action are Islamic, as claimed by Pakistan. We Indians are so clever that we provide the answer ourselves and say "Pakistan is Islamic and murderous. Pakistan is Islam. Islam is murderous"

That deprives us of the chance to use Pakistan's Islamic card against it.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 08:33

The way to undermine Pakistaniyat is to pick out the most egregious and murderous actions by Pakistan (or in Pakistan), identify an Islamic connection and then ask the ummah and the world at large if this is what Islam is all about.

By stating (as a foregone conclusion) that these actions are mandated by Islam we are "pre-silencing' any members of the ummah (who may agree that Pakistan is screwing islam) and scaring them because they will see us as anti-Islamic.

The foundations of Pakistaniyat are based on the following premises

1) Islam is perfect
2 We (Pakistanis) are islamic
3) All that we do is in the name of Islam
4) Opposing us is opposing Islam

This cannot be opposed by opposing Pakistanis - who will instantly dub you anti-Islamic. You can only oppose this by equating Pakistani actions with Islam and asking for confirmation from the ummah if that is correct.

Ananya · Post by **Ananya** » 27 Nov 2009 09:00

and who is that UMMA group, KSA or IRAN which have different views or among the Sunniets like Egypt or Indonasia,

there is a mad dog and are we trying to convince by offering bones !!!!

arun · Post by **arun** » 27 Nov 2009 09:06

In the Islamic Republic of Pakistan wrapping oneself up in the flag of Islam is deemed an appropriate defence against corruption charges

:

Qadiani lobby’ behind campaign against Babar: spokesman

Thursday, November 26, 2009

RAWALPINDI: A spokesman for Federal Minister for Parliamentary Affairs and senior advocate Dr Babar Awan has alleged that the recent campaign against Mr Awan has been launched at the behest of “Qadiani lobby”, which considers him a hurdle in its nefarious designs.

In a press release, the spokesman said the minister strongly resisted a conspiracy to abolish Islamic clauses from the constitution and changing its name, besides becoming a strong barrier against a campaign for repealing “Tahaffuz-e-Namoos-e-Risalat” law (anti-blasphemy law). The efforts of Dr Awan on the one hand foiled the attempts of this lobby, but on the other hand boiled anger against him, which is evident from the accusations against him, he added. People know the background of Dr Babar Awan, he said and added that he had the honour of being “Wakeel-e-Khatm-e-Nabuwat” and “Aseer-e-Namus-e-Khatm-e-Rusul” in the past and considered it his lifetime achievement. ..................

The News

Details of the corruption charges faced by Dr. Babar Awan are available here:

Babar faces Rs35.5m graft charges

sum · Post by **sum** » 27 Nov 2009 09:13

Few of the impure being sent back to pureland. Is this a good move?

No asylum for 66 Pak nationals, govt tells HC

The fate of 66 Pakistani nationals staying in India illegally for the past one year has been sealed as the Indian government told the Delhi High Court that it rejected their plea to grant political asylum in the country.

The Pakistanis belonging to the Mehdi Foundation had fled their country in April 2007 fearing prosecution on charges of blasphemy as they follow multi-faith spiritual belief that promotes doctrine of divine love.

A Union home ministry official appearing on Thursday before a bench headed by Chief Justice A P Shah said the applications for political asylum submitted in November last year was rejected.

The ministry of external affairs had been informed about it and it would initiate due procedure to deport them to Pakistan, the official said.
After coming to India, the members had staged a protest at Jantar Mantar in the capital and burnt their Pakistani passports.

They had approached the Delhi High Court in November 2008, requesting it stop the Union home ministry action to repatriate them after withdrawing cases of illegal entry and other charges.

The court disposed of the case after issuing direction to the government to initiate appropriate action to deport them at the earliest.
The Mehdi Foundation International Organisation had filed the petition before the high court on behalf of the Pakistanis.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 09:17

Ananya wrote:and who is that UMMA group, KSA or IRAN which have different views or among the Sunniets like Egypt or Indonasia,

there is a mad dog and are we trying to convince by offering bones !!!!

Perhaps the idea is too complex for most people to understand. But the principle is simple. The idea is to create a fait accompli. Just accept that Pakistani actions are justified under islam. Your particular objections come up only after we make that connection. We (India) have not made that connection yet. We are too busy blaming Pakistan and too scared to mention the fact that Pakistani actions are based on Islam.

Show me one Indian spokesperson who has publicly made the connection and said that "if Islam says that this is correct then Pakistanis correct"

All that we do is to weakly bleat "Pakistan is wrong"

What Pakistan does is to tell us "Bugger off. We are Islamic and we are doing those things for Islam. You say we are wrong because you are anti-Islamic"

We need to change our way of handling Pakistan by latching on to the worst Pakistani excesses and saying that Pakistan is right because they are upholding Islam. Pakistan is not wrong. They are only being Islamic. Don't blame Pakistan. Only after we say that can we start worrying about what Iran and KSA might say.

In fact Iran and KSA have only two choices
1) Accept that Pakistan is Islamic and Islam=murder
or
2) Deny that Pakistan is islamic

If choice 1 is taken it is a self goal against Islam. If choice 2 is taken Pakistan gets an ungli up its backside.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 09:21

sum wrote:Few of the impure being sent back to pureland. Is this a good move?

No asylum for 66 Pak nationals, govt tells HC

I think it is a very good move. A Chankian one. As a secular country if India accepts Hindus as refugees, the ISI will send designated people to India as refugees.

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 27 Nov 2009 10:08

A disgruntled Zakaria —Zafar Hilaly

Second-hand Americans like Zakaria cannot let a reference to China slip by without casting it as the emerging economic rival of the US, which is fair enough, but also militarily dangerous for the US, which is by no means obvious or necessarily so. This is done mostly as a ploy to enhance India’s importance for the US. India is indeed an important country, possibly some score years hence also a global power; nevertheless it needs mention that of the one billion population that are supposed to give India its global stature, today 500 million of them are starving . India will need to do better and for much longer to claim the status of a global power.

http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?pa ... 2009_pg3_2

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 27 Nov 2009 10:13

gandharva wrote:
A disgruntled Zakaria —Zafar Hilaly

Second-hand Americans like Zakaria cannot let a reference to China slip by without casting it as the emerging economic rival of the US, which is fair enough, but also militarily dangerous for the US, which is by no means obvious or necessarily so. This is done mostly as a ploy to enhance India’s importance for the US. India is indeed an important country, possibly some score years hence also a global power; nevertheless it needs mention that of the one billion population that are supposed to give India its global stature, today 500 million of them are starving . India will need to do better and for much longer to claim the status of a global power.

http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?pa ... 2009_pg3_2

An India with 500 million starving is bad enough for Pakistan. Things can only get worse and Pakistan will have to ask if Allah is really on their side or is doublecrossing them and helping the kafirs.

gandharva · Post by **gandharva** » 27 Nov 2009 10:13

ANALYSIS: JF-17 Thunder

The success story of the indigenous JF-17 development stands out in sharp contrast to many aviation failures — the American F-111, the Israeli Lavi and the Indian Tejas being some examples of abject failures. The PAF is the only air force in the world to successfully take on the challenge of designing and developing a fighter aircraft.

http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?pa ... 2009_pg3_3

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 27 Nov 2009 10:49

From the above,

The PAF is the only air force in the world to successfully take on the challenge of designing and developing a fighter aircraft.

Though large in number, the bulk of Indian Air Force (IAF) planes are old and outdated. The IAF fleet of MiG series fighters needs refurbishing and replacement. There have been recurring delays in the Request for Proposals (RFPs) for a multi-role combat aircraft in the form of the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) Tejas , in design and under perpetual development for almost 30 years. Among engineers, journalists and scientists in the aviation industry, the Tejas is sometimes called the ‘Last Chance Aircraft’ because of the false starts and failure. Using GE F404-IN20 engines because the indigenous ‘Kaveri’ engine developed at a whopping cost of Rs 20 billion was not only overweight, it lacked the thrust required, the LCA is now scheduled to enter service in 2011.

The JF-17 will restore to an extent the strategic imbalance in conventional weapons between Pakistan and India and help retain the balance of power in South Asia. {Balance of power in favour of Pakistan, no doubt}

India feels ‘threatened’ every time Pakistan acquires military hardware for its legitimate defence needs, conveniently forgetting that its own massive build up and modernising of its armed forces still gives it a whopping 4:1 superiority in numbers.{So, how is 'balance of power' retained by Pakistan ? Through better quality of indigenous products like JF-17, Hatfs, nukes etc ?}

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 27 Nov 2009 11:04

Pervaiz Elahi was afraid of BB

Pakistan Muslim League-Quaid (PML-Q) Punjab President Chaudhry Pervaiz Elahi was afraid of Benazir Bhutto, PML-Q likeminded group leader Salim Saifullah said on Thursday. Talking to Business Plus host Shahzeb Khanzada during his programme News Line, Saifullah said Elahi had asked former president Pervez Musharraf to withdraw all cases against the Pakistan People’s Party, on condition that Musharraf did not remove the bar on anyone becoming a prime minister for a third term. He said Elahi feared Benazir because the former Punjab chief minister was sure that she would be elected prime minister for a third time.

It has been my strong belief that the 'Chors of Gujrat' were directly involved in the events of Dec. 27, 2007.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 27 Nov 2009 11:18

Regaining Paradise Lost

An urban legend has it that the South Koreans came to Pakistan in the 60s to study our planning process and learn the reasons of our success. I had never quite believed this and attributed its widespread currency to a mixture of nostalgia, pride and a wounded feeling of paradise lost.

It was, therefore, quite a surprise when I met a man on my current trip to Seoul, Korea who had actually been a part of this delegation. Kim Jin-Hyun, who is now the chairman of the trade research advisory committee of Korea International Trade Association and a former minister of science and technology, spoke to me fondly and somewhat nostalgically about the trip.

This was the time when South Korea's per capita income was lower than Pakistan. It was still recovering from the ravages of the Korean war and a major recipient of donor assistance. The World Bank, which was its principle donor, saw Pakistan as a model of success and recommended the Koreans to learn from us, hence the visit.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 27 Nov 2009 12:17

I've got a curious feeling about two events,that have taken place around the annniversary of the 26/11 outrage.The first,our good Doctor's trip to sup with Uncle O and the arrest in Pak of several alleged perpetrators of 26/11 based upon the arrest of Headley & co.

Starting backwards,the arrests in Pak appear surprising.Pak has stonewalled India for a whole year,actually protecting the guilty,chief offenders who are within the ISI.So it is safe to assume that the arrests were deliberately announced just before the world's eyes were focussed upon the first anniversary of the worst terror attack since 9/11,and the complicity of pak which had done bugg*r all to bring the guilty to book.So Pak carried out yet another tamasha of arresting these jehadis.This is mere camouflage,as there is overwhelming evidence as to the heart of the conspiracy.The US most probably knows exactly who were the masterminds,but is keeping silent,just as it did when its own subject,Daniel Pearl was butchered,butchers known to the CIA but not disclosed for fear of opening up the entire US-Pak covert relationship.

Now,the arrests were made upon the info given,we are told by "Headley the deadly".The news of his arrest too appeared quite coincidentally a short while before the frist anniversary of the dastardly deed and our good Doctor's state visit! One report actually says that British intelligence really tipped off the US about Headley the deadly.The "coincidence" is just too perfect.AS Goldfinger famously told Bond,"Once is happenstance. Twice is coincidence. The third time it's enemy action. ..."
It is therefore obvious to the intelligent analyst that the entire drama of Headley the deadly,the paki arrests,etc., are merely a "tamasha",meant to deceive India and the global community that Pak is making genuine efforts at catching the culprits.The sad hard facts are that the US and Pak are deceiving India.Their chicanery is abominable and one day we might even find out that 26/11 was a joint operation between the CIA and the ISI!Truth as they say is stranger than fiction.