Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby abhijitm » 22 Jan 2010 23:55

I doubt this will happen or UN will actually pass such resolution but I think India should give a try in UN just to send a chill in the spine of TSP. :twisted:

UN and Non-State-Actor-Country (NSAC) aka TSP

What does NSAC mean?
A country where a person or a group of people are planning or acted towards civilian and/or economical damage of other country, where the NSAC country does not have any control or power to prevent this group from the act of international terrorism.

Which country can be categorized as NSAC?
To become an NSAC a country should accept internationally that there are non state actors operating on her soil. A declaration made by its President or Prime Minister or any equivalent in the UN or at any international conference or to another nation can be recorded as an official declaration and thus gives right to the UN to act further in the accord of protecting the victim country.
A country cannot be declared NSAC by other countries or UN except herself.

By declaration the UN accept the fact that NSAC is incapable of eliminating non state actors and also incapable of providing assurance to the international community on preventing international terrorism initiated from her soil. Thus forms a ground for UN or the Victim country to act against the non state actors.

Who is a Victim country
A country can claimed herself as a Victim of NSAC if any terrorist attack happened on her citizen or assets by non-state-actors of NSAC.
The Victim must provide proofs to the UN security council. Upon acceptance of the proof a country can claim herself as the Victim.

How a Victim country can react
Victim country is entitled to launch a military or police operation against non state actors on the NSAC soil. The operation should not last more than the conveyed timescale in the UN. If the timescale is more than 5 years then it needs approval from the security council 8)

When UN can take the action
UN might take military action if the Victim declares that she is incapable of launching military action by herself.

Guidelines for Victim and NSAC in the event of action
Action of UN or the Victim against the non state actors is considered as a favor to NSAC.

Following are the general guidelines for the Victim and NSAC:
a) NSAC must share intelligence with the Victim during the action
b) NSAC must provide logistical support to the Victim, if demanded
c) in return the Victim must pay the cost to the NSAC with the maximum cap of 100 million USD per annum
d) Victim must compensate for any civilian or asset loss of NSAC. NSAC must get the amount approved by the UN security council at the end of the operation.
e) an operation should be ended as soon as NSAC declare it no more has non state actors. This claim must be accepted by the UN security council along with the Victim who can veto the claim. Upon rejection the military action may continue.

-----------
Abhijit :twisted:

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Prem » 23 Jan 2010 00:08

[="sum"]
"The Indian Premier League is becoming a big mafia that wants to control world cricket; it is not only endangering the existence of the International Cricket Council [ Images ], but also the rest of the cricketing nations.

Guys in close proximity to Mafias( D bhai in this case) see mafias everywhere.[/


Is this Another confirmation to rumor that D company is /was doomed and neutralized quietly? Didid not see the smile on SP'face either when he was on TV last week.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Singha » 23 Jan 2010 00:12

M K Dar formerly of IB was saying in TV that indian intel had captured two light a/c smuggled into india by terrorists via australia. he said aerial craft could be arranged or stolen locally by symathizers and logistic cells, they need not sneak over the border.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby negi » 23 Jan 2010 00:17

France asks Britain, Switzerland for information on Zardari

PARIS: A French judge probing a Pakistan bomb attack that killed 11 French engineers has asked Britain and Switzerland to provide whatever information they have on allegations of embezzlement by Pakistani President Asif Ali Zardari, legal sources here said on Friday.

Judge Marc Trevidic made the request to help him advance his probe into claims the 11 were killed in May 2002 by Pakistani agents taking revenge after a new French government cancelled illegal commissions on an arms deal.

Last month families of victims filed suit in Paris against supporters of former French presidential candidate Edouard Balladur, who was prime minister at the time, alleging they benefited from the deal.

In 1995, newly elected president Jacques Chirac cancelled the pay-offs, which he believed had funded his rival's campaign, angering Pakistani officers awaiting their share of the graft, according to a report commissioned by France's state naval construction firm and leaked last June.

The families believe they were deceived by the French state and top ranking French and Pakistani political leaders, and that their loved ones were exposed and killed as a result of a sordid political funding scandal.

One leaked French report on the affair said that the commissions paid to Pakistani figures were ordered by Zardari, the widower of the assassinated former prime minister Benazir Bhutto.

Zardari's nickname in Pakistan is "Mr Ten Percent," owing to graft allegations and 11 years spent in jail on charges ranging from corruption to murder.
:mrgreen:

In all, 14 people were killed on May 8, 2002, when a suicide bomber attacked a bus carrying French naval engineers from their Karachi hotel to where they were working on the submarines sold to Pakistan in the suspect deal.

At first, officials in both countries blamed Islamic radicals at war with the West for carrying out the attack, but French counter-terrorism officers have begun privately to accuse Pakistani spies of ordering it.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby shyamd » 23 Jan 2010 00:25

x post:

Some old stuff on Saudi Pak strategic deals signed in October 2003: All signed under Washingtons blessings. This was the famous one incident where there was media speculation that a nuclear pact was signed between the 2 nations. Apparently this wasnt the case.
1 - 80,000 Paki troops can be deployed in KSA if needed
2 - 1000 Paki's stationed in bases near riyad, Jeddah etc
3 - 11 arms and equipment dumps are to be pre-positioned on Saudi territory
4 - Joint Military Command at Hafr Al Bateen.
5- 400 Saudi Pilots will go to Pindi for training with F-16's and F-15's. i.e. in an event of a war, Pak will be flying eagles I think.
6 - Back Paki defence industry by purchasing Al Khalid Tanks
7 - Riyadh has an option to purchase Agosta Submarine delivered to Pak by French
8 - Musharraf sent some of his Long Range missiles and sensitive nook material to Saudi.

Saudi Aim was to replace Washington military umbrella.

More Saudi's visited Pakistan in 2004 to further deepen the bond. The deputy defence min of KSA paid a discreet visit to Kahuta too. There were talks which centered on training for a team of Saudi nuclear physicists at the Khan Research Laboratories in Kahuta

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 00:37

This thread is moving so fast, I am still stuck at page 52 and reading every post.

I have missed out on participating. :((

Anujan :eek:
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby shravan » 23 Jan 2010 00:58

link

The report was posted Friday on a Web site by the Turkistan Islamic Party, SITE Intelligence Group said. SITE quoted the group as saying 13 Uighurs and two Turks were killed Tuesday by a missile fired by a U.S. unmanned aircraft in Afghanistan but did not say where.

Pakistani officials reported two missile attacks along the border Tuesday.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby brihaspati » 23 Jan 2010 01:01

Even a non-powered hang-glider in skillful and experienced hands can be used from high-rise buildings. In urban areas this can be problematic because of turbulence in the thermals between buildings. Advantage is difficulty in detection - also weight limits. But microlites are also feasible and perhaps not too difficult to smuggle in as parts and reassemble inside. They will be freer in terms of weight and range.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 01:51

Possible Pakistani plan: Attack the commonwealth games, now possibly shifted to attacking the IPL itself in view of the slight.

Image

Now will India consider deploying UAVs and Snipers all around to prevent and protect?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby shaunb » 23 Jan 2010 01:58

What would be the costs involved if microlights are used? IBN reporting that 50 para gliding kits were bought. Assuming 50 people being used and instead of paragliders, microlights being used, what would be the costs in such an operation?
Last edited by shaunb on 23 Jan 2010 02:06, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby negi » 23 Jan 2010 02:04

:lol: Gagan ullah you are too much ; how about a daily comic strip for BENIS ?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 02:10

:P

Hmm,

Not a bad idea. But I am currently considering the Savitabhabhi offer.

Salam :mrgreen:

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby pgbhat » 23 Jan 2010 02:16

Gagan-ji too much. :rotfl:
But seriously I would assume any security for IPL/commonwealth would involve snipers, so they can be taken out. 8)

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 02:23

My hunch is that Kiyani saab is getting desperate for power. Since massa won't ordinarily allow a coup, he has undertaken to malign hubby so that power may be usurped in view of an Indian threat.

So the domestic front is taken care of:

Checklist:
1. Malign Zardari via the NRO : Status done
2. Another 26/11 type attack on India to ensure India prepares to retaliate: Pending execution.
3. Military Coup in Pakistan: Claim that the enemy is at our borders and 10 percent is going to destroy the country - in an act of supreme sacrifice, I Kiyani must accept the onerous responsibility of ruling pakistan for the next 8 years or so to keep the Kafir Indians at bay.
: Status pending execution.

Plan B:
1. Musharraf to come in as political head, become el presidente and grant ISI pasha and Kiyani the Amrit to rule forever (ie for the next 8 years or so).
2. Once the amrit is swallowed by kiyani, mushy must meet his lamppost and kiyani must accept the onerous responsibility of ruling pakistan for the next 8 years or so to keep the Kafir Indians at bay.
: Status pending execution.

I think India needs to be a little more explicit and say that the Pakistani military leadership will be taken to task personally in any Military reprisal by India to make kiyani cool down and accept retirement quietly.
Last edited by Gagan on 23 Jan 2010 02:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby archan » 23 Jan 2010 02:23

The entertainment continues..
PCB to lodge complaint with ICC
The Pakistan Cricket Board (PCB) has decided to appeal to the ICC regarding the exclusion of all 11 Pakistani players from the IPL after the auction in Mumbai this week. Since the IPL is a domestic tournament, it is outside the ICC's purview and so it is unlikely cricket's ruling body will be able to do much about it :lol: , but the matter continues to rage on in Pakistan.

Dil jaltaa hai toh jalnay dey,
Aansoo na bahaa, fariyaad na kar,
Dil jaltaa hai to jalnay dey.
Pakis can listen to it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu0ibF46cio

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby MurthyB » 23 Jan 2010 02:35

As a paraglider pilot myself, I am intrigued by this attempt at noteriety for this exciting, nature-loving sport by paki bigots.

Launching a paraglider from a building is a skill only the best acro pilots in the world have, and even they have a good chance of being killed while trying such a stunt. Generally, you need a hill or cliff to launch in, and generally, we non-suicidal connoisseurs of the sport like smooth, non-turbulent, non-rotor-y air to fly in. Flying long distances, in the order of even 10s of miles is also a skill acquired after many many flights and much airtime; called "cross country".

Launches are also problematic in that we require places with no obstructions, power lines and so forth. I am not sure if any big Indian city has a suitable launch with a target within an easy glide. One of my dreams is to one day fly off Chamundi betta in Mysuru my birthplace and circumbulate the temple on top of the hill in my PG :mrgreen:. Of-course, we skilled pilots can stay up for hours based on thermal or ridge lift, but that requires suitable conditions. Not sure whether there are many unstable days with good lapse rates in hot-n-humid India.

There is also motorized paragliding that eliminates many issues of launch, wind, and direction. These can be launched from flat ground and can gain altitude under power. However, they are extremely noisy which is one reason they are not that popular. We free-flight pilots like to be one with nature and listen to the breeze, not a lawn-mower-like racket up there. But the upshot is that a motor can be heard miles away, although in the ruckus of an Indian city, it may be unnoticable.

Either way, PGs are the slowest aircraft ever invented (stall speed of 13mph!) and even a pandu with a bolt-action rifle that only works half the time should be able to bring down any of these pigLETs that intend to fly.

Apologies for a long post on a favorite hobby of mine :mrgreen:; don't get many chances to talk about it.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 02:37

CRamS wrote:Who is Unkil trying to fool? A few B-b2 quarter pounders on the tribal areas and problem solved. But then there will be no TSP left after that, and after Unkil leaves Afganisthan, who will cage those smelly smarty Hindoos?

I would say that Unkil is not after teh smelly Hindoos right now. It is the crafty godless Chinese that they are worried about right now.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if all the Mehsuds and Haqqanis could be brought under one umbrella to uh, avenge the atrocities against fellow muslims in Xinjiang hain ji?

I agree that this is some way off, but if this were the ultimate aim, wouldn't unkil be preserving the talibs right now and also keeping the pakis in good humour?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 02:39

Then perhaps that paraglider thing is more of a mirage to get india's eyes off the real modus operandi.

Any how the PM should be getting daily briefs about the LET's experience with para gliding and JEM's experience with para sailing.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Anujan » 23 Jan 2010 02:40

Gagan wrote:This thread is moving so fast, I am still stuck at page 52 and reading every post.

I have missed out on participating. :((

Anujan :eek:
Wow! some cartoons you can draw! Please answer the following:
1. What software did you use?
2. Do you have access to a pen mouse / Stylet type drawing tool?
3. You are probably a good artist are you not?


I suck in artistry :P I used a laptop and a mouse and GIMP (freeware)

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Bhima » 23 Jan 2010 03:05


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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby ramana » 23 Jan 2010 03:08

MurthyB, So who makes these para-gliders in Europe? Can you lead a thread on the subject in the Mil forum?

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Karna_A » 23 Jan 2010 03:32

All this exotic stuff is to throw off from real threats.
Al ee Tee is known to talk exotic stuff when being listened to and also buy exotic stuff with no plan to use.
Real threats are only Gunmen, Suicide Bombers, Car/Truck bombs and Hijacking which are tried and tested.

MurthyB wrote:As a paraglider pilot myself, I am intrigued by this attempt at noteriety for this exciting, nature-loving sport by paki bigots.

.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby ramana » 23 Jan 2010 03:34

google bhai has no info on Chinese made para gliders.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Prem » 23 Jan 2010 03:36

ramana wrote:MurthyB, So who makes these para-gliders in Europe? Can you lead a thread on the subject in the Mil forum?


Bet ,It will be supplied by Chinese, Made in China. Most likely the European company will have manufactring facility in PRC and It will be tough to keep eye on the supplier. OTOH , If European /US government co-operate , they can issue instructions and alert the local suppliers to narrrow down the process.
May be Best to have sharp shooters on high, elevated area to facilitate Paki Abdul's fly to Jannats before he lands.
Last edited by SSridhar on 23 Jan 2010 07:10, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Fixed Quote Tag

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Prem » 23 Jan 2010 03:45

archan wrote:The entertainment continues..
Dil jaltaa hai toh jalnay dey,Aansoo na bahaa, fariyaad na kar,
.

Archan sirj, But Paki can only sing this.
Paki hain Mata-e-koocha-O-bazar ki tarah,Utthti hai har nigah Khariddar ki tarah.
3.5 Masters likh rahe hai lo ahle waffa na Naam
Paki khare hue hai Gunahgarr ki tarah.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5sUKvdT ... xt_from=PL

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Ananya » 23 Jan 2010 03:47

The terrorist attacks in India using para is a very very long shot. Possible uses of this could be.

1. Ilfiltration across LOC
2. Attacks in TSP itself , Say US EMBASSY

The two points above have mountains around them so i trust IA has already plan for this on 1 . As far as the arial attacks in india go
the best way would to hijack a saarc or a forieegn airliner and take to Mumbai/barc or Delhi and bang them, it would be too difficult for us to shot down

SIA has already cancelled the flights after the boarding pass issue. AIR lanka has a flight between Karachi and Columbo and this rout makes it perfect for an ambush

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Shankk » 23 Jan 2010 03:49

shiv wrote:Alberuni quotes the Quran Sura 4, 134 as "Speak the truth even if it were against yourselves". This is one line of the Quran that every Paki is made to rape every day of his life.


Not sure about Al Biruni as Harbans has mentioned but one thing Pakistanis have sure managed to do is that Islam does not get any sympathy or ever becomes popular in India. It is different that their basic premise of creating Pakistan is the fear that Islam will get discriminated but that has been proven incorrect by multitude of IMs.

By their antics originating from pathological hatred of India they keep creating a certain kind of impression of Islam amongst Indians. Anytime Islam gets a chance to present it's case Pakistanis make sure that Kashmir conflict gets in the way and vitiating an atmosphere by some terrorist attack. I would give that credit to British. It was a master stroke by them to ensure not only constant animosity between the two countries to benefit themselves but they also stunted the growth of Islam by denying it any sympathy or popular support. Islam is left with only one means to grow and that is procreation.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby MurthyB » 23 Jan 2010 04:16

ramana wrote:MurthyB, So who makes these para-gliders in Europe? Can you lead a thread on the subject in the Mil forum?


You mean create a new thread there on it? Sure, if it's waranted based on interest and discussion...

There are lots of manufacturers in Europe: Ozone, Swing, Advance, Airwave, Up are some well known brands. They are all mostly made in Austria, Germany, Switzerland, France, and perhaps Slovenia/Slovak replublic. AFAIK it's a cottage industry of sorts and manufacturing may not have shifted to China yet, but it's quite easy to do since once the design's there, the manufacturing is just some guy sitting at a sewing machine. My wing is made in Switzerland as I recall. Some famous non-Eurpean names are Gin (So. Korea), and Sol (Brazil).

In the US, a wing, harness, helmet, and reserve (basic minimum set up) will run about $4k new, so it's very cheap. Add $700 for vario+GPS.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby a_kumar » 23 Jan 2010 04:21

pgbhat wrote:But seriously I would assume any security for IPL/commonwealth would involve snipers, so they can be taken out. 8)


There is another aspect of it all that we are missing. It could be a red herring like some are saying or another "strategically brilliant" idea.

Either way, it is imposing a heavy cost on us in terms of dedicated personnel for specialized tasks, security equipment (more gizmos), attrition/stress of the forces etc. This is in addition to "traditional law enforcement" that still needs reform.

We have to keep this "cost-incurred" in mind at all times!! This is money that could have gone into welfare schemes or police reform etc.

As an extension, focus needs to be on ways to hit at the finances that give the PeeA cushion for adventures. IPL is one right step in this direction, btw.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby JwalaMukhi » 23 Jan 2010 04:52

It is high time someone from the Indian side counter the loose cannon talk by the gilly groper. It is also urgent as day in day out, Unkil, queendom and other assorted patrons of Bakis are warning that there could be attack in India. If Groper and the gang cannot guarantee that there will be no more attacks on India or its interests, India cannot also guarantee the existence of the pindi and bakistan as a viable poo-land.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby pgbhat » 23 Jan 2010 04:55

a_kumar wrote:There is another aspect of it all that we are missing. It could be a red herring like some are saying or another "strategically brilliant" idea.

Either way, it is imposing a heavy cost on us in terms of dedicated personnel for specialized tasks, security equipment (more gizmos), attrition/stress of the forces etc. This is in addition to "traditional law enforcement" that still needs reform.

Saar, new equipment for terrorists means new tactics CT has to evolve. ;)

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Rahul Shukla » 23 Jan 2010 05:03

India has no problem with supply of US drones to Pakistan (DNA India)

"So long as they are for (the fight against) Taliban, we have no problems", he told reporters who sought his reaction to reports that the US would supply Pakistan with 12 unarmed shadow drones, which would significantly enhance the country's surveillance and reconnaissance capabilities.
Asked if the US decision would affect the military balance in the region, the Air Chief Marshal said: "No, not at all".

Queried if Pakistan would share the technology with China, he said he did not know. "You tell me", he shot back. "How can I think of somebody else. What do you all feel? They will share or not share ? I am not an authority on Pakistan psyche", Naik added.


There goes another yindoo Chief making unwarranted, uncalled for, derogatory, provocative and inflamatory statements. :mrgreen:

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Rupesh » 23 Jan 2010 05:34

Rahul Shukla wrote:
Queried if Pakistan would share the technology with China, he said he did not know. "You tell me", he shot back. "How can I think of somebody else. What do you all feel? They will share or not share ? I am not an authority on Pakistan psyche", Naik added.


Reporter should have asked Benis Mullahs or BR Experts :wink:
Last edited by SSridhar on 23 Jan 2010 07:14, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Fixed Quote Tag

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 05:34

Possible plan 2: Attack a high value target within India. Gain access using neighboring hill to bypass perimeter security.
Image

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Gagan » 23 Jan 2010 05:40

But I think, Pakistan is not serious about really really attacking India. Their aim is to just needle, and not cross the red line.

The indian army on the borders does wonders for the brown pants khakhis prestige within pakistan.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby amdavadi » 23 Jan 2010 05:43

gaganullah

this is too much man.You better put watermark on this drawning. Just like your drawing
on arihant was right on the money.We may see media using this drawming of yours
to illustrate how the attack happen.

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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Malayappan » 23 Jan 2010 05:54

Ashok Malik again. In Pioneer, not sure if the site archives now - so posting in full

IPL has added to MEA options

IPL has added to MEA options

Ashok Malik

There are two ways of looking at the decision of the eight franchises of the Indian Premier League to not bid for a single Pakistani cricketer in this week’s auction in Mumbai. The first is to criticise the boycott and resort to the old cliché that “sports and politics must not mix”. The second is to consider a broader phenomenon — the increasing role of Indian business in both shaping and reflecting foreign policy and its concerns.

As one of India’s largest leisure businesses, the IPL fits into this framework. Mixing politics and sport — avoidable or otherwise — is something Governments do. The IPL franchises are private entities, autonomous of the government. They are not mixing sport and politics; they are only refusing to mix business and risk.

An analogy may be useful here. Indian Information Technology and IT-enabled services companies have been expanding. There is a limit to how much they can grow within India. Enough quality human resource simply isn’t available. To fill the gap, Indian ITeS companies have been setting up subsidiaries in countries as far apart as Ireland and Chile. As part its peace dividend, with the civil war having ended, Sri Lanka hopes its English-speaking graduates will attract Indian ITeS companies who may want to make Colombo a hub.

If peace and amity prevailed in South Asia, Lahore and Karachi would have been obvious choices for Indian ITeS companies looking to set up ancillary call centres, data-processing units or other outsourcing facilities. Both cities have a substantial young and educated population. Company executives would find it convenient to travel between headquarters in India and branch offices in Pakistan. There would be fewer food problems and no jet lag!

Yet, no Indian IT/ITeS company in its right mind would consider opening subsidiaries in Pakistan. There would be two compelling obstacles. One, the ability of Pakistani employees, partners and enterprise stakeholders to deliver on contractual commitments would be extraordinarily dependent on cooperation by extraneous, political factors. Two, the cost of keeping facilities located in Pakistan secure from terrorism and other law and order threats would be substantial. It would eat into profitability. Insurance companies would demand higher premiums.

This is exactly how the IPL franchises saw the prospect of recruiting Pakistani cricketers. Contrary to initial speculation, there was no hint from the Government of India. It is true, franchise sources say, that the IPL commissioner did have a chat with the eight city-based teams and told them they could buy Pakistani cricketers at their own risk. If there were visa or political issues and the players couldn’t make it, a last-minute replacement or purchase of a back-up cricketer from another country would not be possible.

The franchise owners then took their call. Particularly in Mumbai, there were apprehensions about protests from groups like the Shiv Sena in case a Pakistani cricketer was part of an IPL team. In these circumstances, the cost of providing security to the single Pakistani in the squad would be disproportionate to what was being spent on safeguarding the rest of the team.

There was also danger of negative publicity. IPL teams are putting together expensive promotional campaigns centred on star cricketers. If one of these focussed on a Pakistani cricketer and happened to coincide with, say, a terror incident linked to Islamist groups across the border, it may have become inconvenient.

Finally, this was not a full-fledged auction; the teams were searching for specific spots and skills — the one fast bowler, a single top order batsman — rather than building complete teams. In this scenario, if a risk-free alternative to a Pakistani was available, he was chosen. That is why Kolkata Knight Riders chased Shane Bond and not Umar Gul. Cricketers from the West Indies, New Zealand and Australia got lucky. It was like Ireland and Chile benefiting from the Indian IT/ITeS sector’s inability to invest in Pakistan.

What are the wider implications of the IPL auction? For a start, they must compel us to rethink the whole issue of civil society pressure in terms of Indo-Pakistani relations.

Thus far civil society pressure has been interpreted as a nudge to Governments in India to make unilateral concessions. The IPL experience suggests a section of civil society is conveying a very different message. It is sceptical of the practicability of meaningful engagement with Pakistan in the near future. Without going into whether this is good or bad, right or wrong, it has to be recognised that this message is a reality.

Next, in a time of greater democratisation, more vociferous expression of middle class opinion and of Indian business leaving its fingerprints on foreign policy, no government can choose to ignore the signal from the Mumbai auction-room. Essentially, key representatives of an industry (IPL/cricket) that has both a massive profile and huge revenues have said they are unsure of how their consumers and clients (or fans and sponsors) will react to an embracing of Pakistan.

This cannot be dismissed. It is indicative of at least a segment of the public mood. There is not necessarily hostility at work here, but perhaps only an abundance of caution. The UPA Government will need to factor it in before it makes its next moves towards Pakistan.

Finally, those who track the Ministry of External Affairs and the sources and imperatives of Indian foreign policy have a new animal to study: Cricket’s potential for coercive diplomacy. The IPL franchises have placed the equivalent of an economic embargo on Pakistan.

India has very little leverage — political or socio-economic — within Pakistan and its ability to “impose costs” in the face of provocation is limited. The IPL boycott of Pakistan, the income loss to individual cricketers and the open snubbing of that country’s cricket community, represents just such an “imposition of costs”.

This has been done by civil society. Yet, it would be foolish to expect Indian diplomacy not to use it to its advantage. Whether agreeable or otherwise, the IPL has just added another arrow to the MEA’s quiver.

Prasad
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Prasad » 23 Jan 2010 06:04

Gagan,
all your illustrations are going to be put together into a talipan lurning manuel by the tali-pakis just like your coconut-hull illustration was used by the media :mrgreen:

brihaspati
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby brihaspati » 23 Jan 2010 06:07

There are electric (battery pack) versions of micro/ultralights, which would be much less noisy than petrol based ones. Still don't see how it would be greatly effective within India. Low flying ones between hills could be better hidden from radar. But simple weight-shift ones (the cheapest/lightest) without power - are practically useless for the supposed purpose. There is some Chinese electric powered version. Not remember off the cuff - but it was definitely mentioned in a meet last year. Micro's are quite easy to learn to fly. If at all such a contraption is being planned - it is most likely to be a weight-shift version with sufficient power, preferably the electric ones. Standard micros can easily carry two or one+payload. Pilots are however more likely to be trained/practised in a foreign country. In AFPAK they could be vulnerable to "scanning" while training. Preferably one which does not require licenses and certifications to fly solo for the class and category planned to be used. USA would come to mind. Canada, NZ, France, UK, Germany all possible within range.

Added later : remembered that there is a sea-plane version too. Against "ports"!! It gets more and more absurd!

Prem
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Re: Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP) - Dec 30 - 2009

Postby Prem » 23 Jan 2010 06:19

http://tinyurl.com/snakeoilman
Stephern Cohen got his Paycheck

In his opinion, Pakistan is "not a failed country but a failing country" and must seek co-operation from India on a range of issues "including water, environmental issues and trade and so forth" if it were to avoid economic and political failures in the long run. On the other hand, he reiterated that India must accommodate Pakistan on a wide range of issues, including the settlement of Kashmir, if it were to achieve the international prestige it aspires.Asked why the US would not put pressure on India to move the dialogue forward, he stated the US perhaps lacked the leverage over India in this regard. He, however, was of the view that Prime Minister Manmohan Singh was interested in finding a way to accommodate Pakistan while his efforts were being undermined by opposing politicians and the security forces which remained deeply suspicious of Pakistan and did not want to move the peace process forward.
Last edited by Prem on 23 Jan 2010 06:39, edited 1 time in total.


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