Indian Interests

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Prem
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Prem » 23 Nov 2016 08:18

https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases ... 111816.php

Rice farming in India much older than thought, used as 'summer crop' by Indus civilization

Latest research on archaeological sites of the ancient Indus Civilisation, which stretched across what is now Pakistan and northwest India during the Bronze Age, has revealed that domesticated rice farming in South Asia began far earlier than previously believed, and may have developed in tandem with - rather than as a result of - rice domestication in China.The research also confirms that Indus populations were the earliest people to use complex multi-cropping strategies across both seasons, growing foods during summer (rice, millets and beans) and winter (wheat, barley and pulses), which required different watering regimes. The findings suggest a network of regional farmers supplied assorted produce to the markets of the civilisation's ancient cities.Evidence for very early rice use has been known from the site of Lahuradewa in the central Ganges basin, but it has long been thought that domesticated rice agriculture didn't reach South Asia until towards the end of the Indus era, when the wetland rice arrived from China around 2000 BC. Researchers found evidence of domesticated rice in South Asia as much as 430 years earlier.
"We found evidence for an entirely separate domestication process in ancient South Asia, likely based around the wild species Oryza nivara. This led to the local development of a mix of 'wetland' and 'dryland' agriculture of local Oryza sativa indica rice agriculture before the truly 'wetland' Chinese rice, Oryza sativa japonica, arrived around 2000 BC," says study co-author Dr Jennifer Bates"While wetland rice is more productive, and took over to a large extent when introduced from China, our findings appear to show there was already a long-held and sustainable culture of rice production in India as a widespread summer addition to the winter cropping during the Indus civilisation."Co-author Dr Cameron Petrie says that the location of the Indus in a part of the world that received both summer and winter rains may have encouraged the development of seasonal crop rotation before other major civilisations of the time, such as Ancient Egypt and China's Shang Dynasty."Most contemporary civilisations initially utilised either winter crops, such as the Mesopotamian reliance on wheat and barley, or the summer crops of rice and millet in China - producing surplus with the aim of stockpiling," says Petrie.
"However, the area inhabited by the Indus is at a meteorological crossroads, and we found evidence of year-long farming that predates its appearance in the other ancient river valley civilisations."The archaeologists sifted for traces of ancient grains in the remains of several Indus villages within a few kilometers of the site called Rakhigari: the most recently excavated of the Indus cities that may have maintained a population of some 40,000.As well as the winter staples of wheat and barley and winter pulses like peas and vetches, they found evidence of summer crops: including domesticated rice, but also millet and the tropical beans urad and horsegram, and used radiocarbon dating to provide the first absolute dates for Indus multi-cropping: 2890-2630 BC for millets and winter pulses, 2580-2460 BC for horsegram, and 2430-2140 BC for rice.Millets are a group of small grain, now most commonly used in birdseed, which Petrie describes as "often being used as something to eat when there isn't much else". Urad beans, however, are a relative of the mung bean, often used in popular types of Indian dhal today.In contrast with evidence from elsewhere in the region, the village sites around Rakhigari reveal that summer crops appear to have been much more popular than the wheats of winter.The researchers say this may have been down to the environmental variation in this part of the former civilisation: on the seasonally flooded Ghaggar-Hakra plains where different rainfall patterns and vegetation would have lent themselves to crop diversification - potentially creating local food cultures within individual areas.While they don't yet know what crops were being consumed at Rakhigarhi, Jennifer Bates points out that: "It is certainly possible that a sustainable food economy across the Indus zone was achieved through growing a diverse range of crops, with choice being influenced by local conditions."It is also possible that there was trade and exchange in staple crops between populations living in different regions, though this is an idea that remains to be tested.""Such a diverse system was probably well suited to mitigating risk from shifts in climate," adds Cameron Petrie. "It may be that some of today's farming monocultures could learn from the local crop diversity of the Indus people 4,000 years ago."The findings are the latest from the Land, Water and Settlement Project, which has been conducting research on the ancient Indus Civilisation in northwest India since 2008.

shiv
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby shiv » 05 Dec 2016 06:01

A good talk on the the past and the future of hard power projection by India (as opposed to soft power) by Yusuf Unjhawala of DFI
What he says should make a jingo proud - but also says what is needed for the future
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44klKtxDfS0

Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 10 Dec 2016 05:41

An awe-inspiring takedown of "sacred" sikular icons .
Respect!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFf_WDyUbqM

A background on nitin rivaldo.
https://yourstory.com/2016/04/passiontopaycheck/

I think it time to raise a demand for an unabridged right to freedom of expression to be amended into our Constitutional scheme.Its sancity must be as inviolable as the right to freedom of expression as enjoyed by the US citizens through their 1st amendment .
In comparison we currently make do with the sickly Article 19 - with its plethora of intentionally vague colonial era restrictions(all left to the arbitrary interpretation by courts).
An example of yet another perversion inserted by Nehru into our Constitutional scheme.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby sanjaykumar » 10 Dec 2016 07:34

It may be to avoiding 'hurting the sensitivities of a particular community'.

svinayak
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby svinayak » 11 Dec 2016 05:48

It has not been few days since the change but the stupid articles have started coming
http://www.firstpost.com/india/does-jay ... 49792.html
Does Jayalalithaa's death signal the fall of federalism in Indian democracy?

Tamil Nadu is probably the worst sufferer of centralized powers of the Union government when it comes to economic matters. This industrial powerhouse produces huge revenue, much of which is grabbed by New Delhi, which then uses it to subsidize Hindi states as well as Afspa states. Almost 3 decades ago, J Jayalalithaa pointed out this undue suffering of Tamil Nadu and other Dravidian states which all suffer similarly in the hands of New Delhi as a Rajya Sabha MP as thus, “Where the northern states of India are concerned, whichever political party has been the ruling party in power at the Centre has also been the ruling party in those states all along

Prem
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Prem » 15 Dec 2016 03:25

Multi-Media nature of Ramayna ???? Note his tone and language .


svinayak
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby svinayak » 15 Dec 2016 12:34

Prem wrote:Multi-Media nature of Ramayna ???? Note his tone and language .


This is a research to diminish the role of Ramayana in India
Need to watch these things

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Sicanta » 26 Dec 2016 06:58

Triple Talaq Unconstitutional, Violates Muslim Women's Rights: Allahabad HC

http://www.news18.com/news/india/allaha ... 20688.html

ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 31 Dec 2016 03:03

X-P

Indranil wrote:
rohitvats wrote:^^^Indranil - to the above, I would like to add that HAL did not work with GTRE to address the area ruling in Marut Mk1R with reheat engines developed by GTRE. Again, as per Gp Captain Bhargava, that version of Marut held the best potential and was a very good machine. While inspite of area rule being vitiated due to new engine, it had very good performance in reheat segment, Marut Mk1R had lower performance in dry thrust mode due to area ruling problem. This part HAL never rectified.


Handling area rule is now a 100 year old tech. Many planes have had that problem and were modified suitably. Dr. Whitcomb is famous to have applied it by eyeballing the wind tunnel models and using sandpaper to achieve better ruling. At the point when the decision was being taken in favour of Jags instead of continuing the development of the Marut, there were known solutions of handling fat engines. For example, Saab elongated the Viggen, Convair added fairings. Could Marut have been refined to meet our requirements? I believe the exceptional test pilots of those times. If you like the Jag's low level flying, you would have appreciated the Marut even more. None of the pilots who have flown both planes mince words in describing the same.

The truth of why the Marut failed is probably a cocktail of reasons:

HAL did shoddy PSU work. The camp within IAF who were enamoured with imported airplanes spared no stone in exposing them. The economics of our country made it much easier to just go for ready made imports rather than labour through and pay for ab-initio developments. The political class of independence struggle had perished and left behind a crop that had sunk the country into deep internal political struggle. Who had the time to put IAF/HAL/GTRE together. The job was left to a handful of test pilots who enjoyed enormous respect in IAF circles. Opposing them were the lot who did not and still cannot believe that SDREs of HAL/GTRE cannot handle area ruling :-? Additionally, India was a second class citizen in the world of geopolitics. The Indo-Pak wars were recent and PAF was getting a steady stream of aircrafts from USA. It was easy to be short sighted then and get the Jaguars, which by the way was in need of a lot of final touches too. Only thing was that the engines and airframe sat well together.

In hindsight, although it hurts a lot, it is understandable. It is literally a mistake and lesson of national proportion. I only hoped that such a mistake would not be reiterated today. Thankfully, we have the strength to forge forward this time. We have a strong govt. We have the economics and the front seat at the geo-political table to back us. We have an inductable plane whose manufacturing needs to be streamlined, whose design needs to be refined. Our designers and builders to be honed in a time when we have no impending war. Once again, we have small group of test pilots which swears by the LCAs. Unfortunately, once again we have a bigger group who think that we should have second line of "Gripen-like", F-16-like aircraft. Basically, that TFTA goras can teach a bunch of SDREs how to screw together aircrafts. But SDREs cannot teach other SDREs how to do so. Once again, this bigger import-pasand group is winning. It hurts a lot more this time. It is very difficult to keep looking the other way!



Also Congress figured firang maal are good money makers.

ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 05 Jan 2017 00:49

Heart of a BR member!!! Well articulated.

rahulm wrote:GD gosh, probably not as much as I interpret your post but a fair while. Enough that when I say homesick I mean Oz.

For me, my perception is my reality and my world. The experiences of others are knowledge, useful but not really. Otherwise, there would be no need for conjugal relationships. We would just satisfy ourselves from the knowledge gained through the experiences of others :rotfl:

As Sadguru said, whether there is a God or not, an afterlife etc are immaterial if they are not within ones direct experience. In such cases, the best one can do, then , is to remain open to the possibilities that others claim are true but outside our personal experience.

Similarly, exceptions barring, a clean city, corrupt free offices, good governance, traffic rules being followed, high beams not being used to blind me :D etc may be the norm in in India but it is not in my direct experience. I, however, remain open and indeed hopeful to the possibility.

I love India and given a fair chance would r2i in a jiffy. However, I need cleanliness, law and order, politeness and most importantly good governance. It's what I want and I think given a chance most Indians implicitly would welcome this.

My expectations are not shaped by snootiness or after I journeyed overseas. Most are shaped by having being born and brought up in the nicest defence cantonment in India - the NDA and therefore, predate my flight.

I chose to go abroad because, I found it very difficult, after the order and civilities of a fauji life to come to terms with civvy life and more importantly, I suppose, because I wanted a Alfa Romeo convertible :mrgreen:

I quit my Aussie job to backpack through India for 2.5 years without an agenda and using every and I mean every mode of transport available. It was a revelation and one of the the best things I have ever done in my life so far. I lived out of a 75L Kathmandu backpack for 2.5 years and even chose to live the life of a an (unordained) monk for 11 months in Ramakrishna Mission.

One needs to love a country in spite of its problems to do embark on such a journey when I could just have easily chosen to backpack across the world - which I also did later. :D

In the land called India, I feel connected and at peace. The people who populate the land now have,with some exceptions, usually make life difficult for me. I like to follow all rules inc.traffic signs and rules.

Eg I found, across the country, plenty of rhetoric in respect for elders and love for kids etc but the same people will not stop their vehicle for an elderly person or a school kid wanting to cross the road but will instead honk and wish they get out of their way. This was across India. It's such contradictions that I haven't been able to resolve.

During this trip, I have been in India sinceJune trying to resolve a property issue. Is wanting accurate land records and swift justice western/westphallian?

When in India, instead of bitching and moaning, I am trying to make the best of my current situation. I travel, I mix with the locals, I talk, I sit by our magnificent temple studded rivers of many an evening watching the sunset to the sound of the river and evening temple bells. I feel a part of this country, at peace - until a group of people come and start spitting and throwing garbage near me even when there are bins around.

I stay away from malls and multiplexes, Pizza Hut et al instead preferring nondescript tea stalls and road side diners where, inspire of all them issues,I find authenticity even if I donl like it. The authentic experiences I avoid are public toilets and sleeper berths- if I can help,it. :((

I will go back to Oz, hopefully, in Fenruary, where,unlike in Goa, never have I been asked to be subservient or pay homage and patronage to local villagers where I bought property if I want to live a peaceful life,even though I am one of them - an Indian.

Sorry about the ramble. It is after all Nukkad and I am having my masala tea :D

PS When I am heartsick I mean India.

Prem
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Prem » 05 Jan 2017 05:07


ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 06 Jan 2017 07:05

A series of posts to understand West Bengal politics.... Names withheld to avoid problems for them...


First

xxxx wrote:Folks who are trying to understand Didi's popularity in West Bengal need to look at the polling dynamics of the state. Any party or group which can get in excess of 43-44 per cent of the votes sweeps the poll.

There is a 30 per cent minority vote in West Bengal built up assiduously by the Left with illegal migration from Bangladesh and an influx from Bihar. She has been able to hijack this group totally from the Left. As a result, all she needs to sweep the election is another 13-14 per cent votes. Out of this thanks to the syndicates and unions, like the autorickshaw union, she gets another 3-4 per cent assured votes - these are folks who are direct beneficiaries of her rule. On top of that she has very cleverly cultivated local youth clubs in every locality by giving them lakhs of rupees as "grants" for ostensibly "sporting" activities. This group forms an impromptu foot soldier gang which helps out during elections. There are enough folks around who are impressed by her white saree and rubber chappals to make up the 10 per cent.

Net result is she does not need industrialisation, she does not need job creation or any form of development work, save the cosmetic stuff being done to roads and lighting (it would interesting for folks who are commenting on the snazzy lighting on Kolkata streets to do some digging on who has the contract for this. :-) ). Oh by the way here's a trivia: The metro extension work in Kolkata was held up for more than two years and this impasse was finally fixed with the line extension taking a very costly zig zag instead of a straight line because 8 squatter families, very vocal TMC supporters, refused to vacate government land. Yes Didi is a do-er all right!

For the BJP to stand a chance it has to take the anti Left vote bank - this is a considerable section that has traditionally voted Congress. However for that to happen, the party needs to develop local leadership. Amit Shah coming in during election time and delivering a speech isn't going to cut it, particularly if he delivers the speech in Hindi - get real on this folks. There are some promising local leaders but they need support and encouragement. Unfortunately they've got just opposite.

The local BJP leadership had become quite energised but the bonhomie/rapprochement brokered by the central leadership with Didi about a year or so ago, in order to get her help in the Rajya Sabha didn't help. The Sahara investigations, Madan's arrest and Mukul's wavering had really rattled her and had energised the local leadership. By stepping back, the central leadership left the state leaders and cadre in a sort of lurch. It was a definite setback.

Finally the Malsi problem is real and folks have started to notice this even among the much reviled Bhadraloks. This is something to watch out for because the Bhadralok may like his Marx and may discuss Chomsky over Darjeeling tea but he/she is also the first in line to organise Durga Puja and Kali Puja. He/she will also assiduously fast before anjali on Saraswati Puja and celebrate Lakshmi Puja every year. Don't underestimate the commitment when it comes to the crunch, just read up a bit on the pre-partition riots.

Bottomline is a WB election is for Didi to lose and not for someone to win. But it was the same for the Left for 34 years. But once that happens, as it eventually will the way things are going, she's going to just disappear from the scene, much the same way the Left has. She knows that and so does her party leaders and that's why everyone is making hay while the sun shines bright!


Second..

yyyy wrote:I am optimistic. Before 2008 CPIM seemed invincible. Today they are at 26% and declining. I think if Mamata was like Nitish or Naveen and still Paki you would have a hard time to get rid of her. I have a feeling seeing the TMC party they will give opportunities. As for illegals GOI is not going to do anything in WB before Assam is resolved which will take 10-15 years as Himanta is saying that there are around 5 million illegals in Asaam. I don't think Mamata will help in fencing the WB border as long as she is in power. The challenge is to have a BJP govt in both center and state to solve illegal problem. This will require patience and hard work by pro-India forces.


Third....

zzzz wrote:Those districts in north central WB like Malda Nadia and Murshidabad were already Muslim majority in 47, and those should have been given off to Pakistan at the time. They even hoisted Pakistan flags on 15th August in Nadia district in 47. The whole premise behind WB was to salvage a Bengali Hindu homeland, and this was product of last minute maneuvering by Shyama Proshad Mukhopadhyay. Mind you, differential birth rates and demographic churn of the entire Bengal region as a whole (WB+BD) had happened during British rule. Even during joint family system each married couple in upper castes were having only 2-4 kids, while Bengali Muslims actually come from a very small gene pool from 800 years ago but has simply multiplied tremendously and exponentially. Bhadralok is actually post-Hindutva. These things of love jihad and raising alarm about differential birth rates, these were being brought up among Bengali Hindu bhadralok category from late 1800s. So given the premise behind WB, I don't see why we held on to a few Muslim majority districts in Bengal. The northern part of WB isn't even ethnically Bengali but more of the ethnic cocktail similar to Assam. Now with large Muslim majority parts of Bengal as part of WB and India, it is easier for Bangladeshi Muslims to enter India and wield political power where the whole point was expressly to keep them out of it post partition, let alone the birth rate differential as already existed for centuries. Also there seems to be resentment against settlement of Bangladeshi Hindus throughout Assam, Tripura etc. I totally sympathize with that. West Bengal should be where these Bangladeshi Hindus should come to.


Fourth....


xxxx wrote:
AAAA wrote:@xxxx
When do you see Bengal reaching the tipping point when Bhadraloks (homogeneous & heterogeneous) will rebel against Islamic galvanisation ? What if BJP never becomes a viable option in Bengal? Will Bhadraloks accept Islamic rule, since immigration from east and consolidation will continue.
SO which is lesser evil in that case
TMC vs CPI vs Con cs CPI + Con ?




AAAA,

I personally think this talk about tipping point in terms of demographics is a bit alarmist. Taking it from 30 per cent to 40 per cent isn't going to happen overnight, I would reckon that if it all ever happens it would do so after 2050s timeframe. You've got to understand that the Malsi pasand crowd is also not a homogenous group and even within that group there are differential birthrates. Besides as per my information the influx from the across the border has gone down. It is much more difficult for these folks to get regularised today than it was say 10-15 years ago, when all that was needed was a letter from the local MLA to get a Ration Card (PDS card) and you were set because that card would form the basis of your passport.

The other point I think is Didi herself is bit wary of riding the Malsi tiger. Just before she came to power she rode the Maoist tiger to hit out at the Left. That didn't go too well for her eventually and she actually became so paranoid (with the fear for her life among others) that she used to accuse everybody who disagreed with her of being a Maoist. There was famous incident where she was meeting some college students for a question and answer session on live TV and the moment a girl asked her about the increase in rapes in Kolkata she started screaming that the girl was a Maoist and then walked out of the studio. The entire thing is on YouTube.

If you look at the stupid decision to cancel the discussion on Kashmir and Balochistan which was being organised at Calcutta Club, you'd see how paranoid she is. Calcutta Club and its audience would be an elite group which is far removed from the unwashed masses. The discussion would be in English again far removed from the Urdu and Bengali used by the masses. And yet the Police at the behest of the government cancelled the talk because it was scared that anti-Pakistani rhetoric would displease the Malsi pasand crowd and lead to a law and order situation.

This means she's shit scared of another riot or communal incident talking place. Why? Because she understands that too many of these and there will be a tipping point in perceptions among the majority. There is already a lot of chatter with regards to the riots, the latest being Dulagarh, forget what you read in MSM. There is also a lot of chatter about the fact that a Durga Puja was cancelled in a village because of objections from the Malsi crowd.


The point is she understands that up to a certain point the Malsi crowd needs her for protection but after a certain tipping point, they would not need her anymore and will discard her like a used condom. Whatever she maybe one thing you need to remember is she's street smart.

All this is one aspect. The other is that there will be no short cuts for BJP. It will have to put in the grunt effort - like it did in Assam - if it wants to establish itself in WB. Support will have to earned and the religion card will not work unless there's a cataclysmic event like a massive riot or some such, which is highly unlikely.

The other point to note is TMC has no succession plan in place. Didi tried to project her nephew as the successor but that didn't go well with the other leaders. Besides the nephew is a mini Rahul Baba, foppish in the way new rich are and not a good orator. So that's been put in the backburner. The other point that needs to be noted is that I wonder how good Didi's health is. I've been watching her for a long time and I notice nowadays that the past year or so she looks pretty sickly in comparison to earlier times. There is a lot of stress in her in the way she looks and talks. I wonder.



My comment:

Taking all these in the balance looks like AIADMK and Jayalalitha in TN.

Jehadidi needs to be handled with care and Bengalis with affection.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby rahulm » 06 Jan 2017 10:27

@ramana, thanks for understanding. Really. It can get quite lonely sometimes, if you know what I mean.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Surya » 06 Jan 2017 10:38

rahulm wrote:@ramana, thanks for understanding. Really. It can get quite lonely sometimes, if you know what I mean.


Rahul nice write up - yea the self disciplined suffer -- good luck on return to Oz.

maybe we will link up at some point.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby rahulm » 06 Jan 2017 11:25

Surya it's been a while since we last had a beer. You should come down under again. A nice campervan trip into the desolate and beautiful Aussie outback if you fancy it. Give yourself a week at least.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Surya » 09 Jan 2017 09:44

rahulm wrote:Surya it's been a while since we last had a beer. You should come down under again. A nice campervan trip into the desolate and beautiful Aussie outback if you fancy it. Give yourself a week at least.


Probably will be a little while

have to go through a few more countries before I return for a downunder tour and yes outback and kakadu are on the list

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby GShankar » 09 Jan 2017 10:37

xpost
IndraD wrote:Wary of China, India offers Akash surface-to-air missile systems to Vietnam http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 410196.cms

With Beijing continuing to thwart New Delhi's bid to join the 48-nation Nuclear Suppliers Group and get Jaish-e-Muhammed chief Masood Azhar designated a terrorist by the UN, while also stepping up its naval forays into the Indian Ocean Region, India is responding by fast-tracking military ties with countries in China's own backyard. The expanding "strategic and military partnership" with Japan and Vietnam, in particular, has emerged a major thrust area.
Sources say the discussions under way with Vietnam on the Akash area defence missiles, which have an interception range of 25-km against hostile aircraft, helicopters and drones, come after India earlier offered BrahMos supersonic cruise missiles and Varunastra anti-submarine torpedoes to the country.
India, of course, will also begin training Vietnamese fighter pilots on its Sukhoi-30MKI fighter jets from this year, much like it has been tutoring sailors from that country on the intricate art of operating Kilo-class submarines for the last three years, as reported earlier by TOI.

It was in 2013 that India had kicked off the training of a large number of Vietnamese sailors in "comprehensive underwater combat operations'' in Navy submarine school INS Satavahana, Visakhapatnam.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Prem » 10 Jan 2017 05:45

Newly declassified documents reveal how New Delhi tracked Islamabad’s pursuit of a nuclear device.
By Vivek Prahladan
http://thediplomat.com/2017/01/declassi ... ar-device/


India, for instance, has taken a keen interest in Pakistan’s pursuit of a nuclear device going back to the 1970s and even earlier. Based on newly declassified Indian documentation I was able to access, what follows is an account of what Indian external intelligence knew about Pakistan’s intentions between the 1970s leading up to the 1990s – the decade that would end with both countries coming out as the world’s sixth and seventh declared nuclear powers.For Indian intelligence in the 1970s, the focus in Pakistan was about its reprocessing capacity and centrifuges. This shifted in the 1980s to focus on the capability to produce an explosive device, and, finally, in the 1990s, focused on the nascent Pakistani missile program routed through China, which was eventually outsourced by China to North Korea.Soon after the 1998 tests by both countries, Indian intelligence was looking at supply chains for Pakistan’s Shaheen-II ballistic missile, almost four years ahead of its first test in 2004.There was already specific knowledge available with India on Shaheen-I, including on the hardware that was involved in steering the missile. Additionally, New Delhi was not entirely convinced that Pakistan would not use choose to use non-nuclear chemical warheads for its missiles
The trail of documents begins with a Joint Intelligence Committee Report (dated February 24, 1976) titled “Pakistan’s Capability to Produce Nuclear Weapons.” This paper was an update to a JIC Paper from March 1975. It assessed that in absence of assistance for plutonium-239 or uranium-235, “Pakistan could not be in a position to explode a nuclear device at least for four years from now.” Further, the report noted that all was not well with Karachi Nuclear Power Plant. It had developed faults due to “leakage in boiler flow down valve which resulted in reactor poisoning.” It was shut down six times in 1975 with the largest one in mid-1975 when Canadian experts were recruited to repair the leakage of heavy water from the heat exchanger.Moreover, in 1976, diplomatic cables from the Indian Embassy in Ottawa reveal that India was becoming aware of Chinese scientists’ presence in Pakistan. A Hungarian diplomat informed an Indian diplomat in Ottawa that the Canadian government was aware that Chinese scientists were being given access to facilities with Canadian material in Pakistan, despite the Karachi Nuclear Power Plant (KANUPP-I) coming under IAEA safeguards.
Pakistan was also sharing Canadian technical knowledge with the Chinese in return for military supplies. Henry Kissinger, then-U.S. secretary of state, had visited Pakistan in 1976, where he was attempting to forge Afghan-Pakistan rapprochement following the visit of Prime Minister Bhutto to Kabul. Kissinger’s secondary agenda was to probe the France-Pakistan nuclear agreement. According to briefings received by Indian officials in Washington, Kissinger and Bhutto agreed that on the nuclear issue, “both sides will avoid confrontation.”By September 1977, India’s external intelligence Research and Analysis Wing (RAW) had begun to report on Pakistan’s plans in detail, issuing a report called “Pakistan — Clandestine Purchase of Nuclear Equipment and Materials.” Pakistan’s Atomic Energy Commission (PAEC) had set up a purchasing channel in Bonn, Germany, and Abdul Waheed, a cousin of General Zia-ul-Haq, oversaw the funds for these clandestine contracts. $11 million was already spent by Pakistan in Western Europe on plutonium technology, including the purchase of a “shearer” for use in its reprocessing facility.The Pakistan explosive device program was coming together and, in 1981, a “Monthly Report” from the Indian Embassy in Islamabad warned New Delhi that “it is very likely that Pakistan will succeed in exploding a nuclear device, possibly this year.” The embassy also informed that “Zia was extremely keen to explode the nuclear device at the earliest possible.”
In the same year, J. N Dixit, who would go on to become India’s national security advisor (2004-2005), circulated a report entitled “Pakistan race to Nuclear Weapons” to all heads of missions. The note concluded that the question of whether “Pakistan has indeed embarked on a nuclear weapons program” could be answered affirmatively. Dixit assessed that “Kahuta, Islamabad, and Sihala form a sort of protected centrifuge triangle.” Kahuta was protected with Crotale surface-to-air missile systems. Pakistan had also gained the capacity to produce uranium hexafluoride.
India anticipated that Pakistan could conduct an atmospheric or underground test in Sindh, Balochistan, or the Northwest Frontier Province (Khyber Pakhtunkhwa today). Meanwhile, Soviet satellites had revealed information on Pakistani tunneling in the Ras Koh range. Alternately, the Indians anticipated that China could have hosted the first Pakistani test at Lop Nor. As one former official in the office of then-Indian Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi told me:…we were following AQ Khan’s movements. A deliberate subterfuge has been created by Pakistan that AQ Khan was running a rogue operation, so called “nuclear Walmart.” A.Q Khan was leading inter-governmental delegations. We knew where he went, whom he talked to i.e. each of his visits to North Korea and then his debriefings in China.A 1981 brief prepared by the Indian Embassy in Washington also revealed Indian anxieties at U.S. President Ronald Reagan’s upgrading of U.S.-Pakistan relations, fortified by a $3 billion military aid package that included F-16 fighters and airborne warning and control system (AWACS) aircraft. In Zia’s talks with members of the U.S. Congress, “the nuclear question figured prominently,” the brief noted. In this year, Secretary East Eric Gonsalves had led an Indian delegation to Canada wherein India pointed out the Libyan connection to the Pakistan nuclear program. Indian information was that “Pakistan could have a plutonium-based explosion by the end of the year and have enriched uranium by 1983.”U.S. officials meanwhile assured India that Reagan had conveyed to Zia “quite clearly that Pakistan’s acquisition of nuclear weapons would damage the entire new relationship worked out between the two countries.” Zia had publicly mentioned his proposal for a mutual inspection of nuclear facilities between India and Pakistan. Lawrence Eagleburger, Reagan’s undersecretary of state for political affairs, told Indian officials that “the [U.S.] administration found credibility in Zia’s nuclear disavowal,” but the Indians remained unconvinced.
In conclusion, Indian cold war era intelligence document reveal that Pakistan’s nuclear weapon program has thrived even in an environment of internal and regional uncertainties. Its leadership has historically fielded questionable nuclear peace proposals as a prelude to nuclear escalation. Speculative nuclear brinkmanship remains perhaps the last remaining viable argument available to the Pakistan government and military to influence new patterns of equilibrium taking place in the subcontinental region. The Cold War continuum suggests that China’s dominant voicing within Pakistan’s securitization will fasten Pakistan’s deterrence operationalization and will to re-demonstrate capability. Undoubtedly, Pakistan continues to view itself as the nuclear sword-bearer among the Islamic nation-states.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Arjun » 11 Jan 2017 09:22

http://www.business-standard.com/articl ... 324_1.html

This is ridiculous !!! So even statements which are backed by data would not be allowed because they are not politically correct - the Elections Commission seems to be on a stupid rampage to take India backwards in time. Where are these morons in the EC getting their support from ?

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 19 Jan 2017 06:08

X-posting....

ramana wrote:A few background reading materials:

1) Treaty of Westphalia (TOW)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_of_Westphalia



The main tenets of the Peace of Westphalia were:
All parties would recognize the Peace of Augsburg of 1555, in which each prince would have the right to determine the religion of his own state, the options being Catholicism, Lutheranism, and now Calvinism (the principle of cuius regio, eius religio).[11][12]
Christians living in principalities where their denomination was not the established church were guaranteed the right to practice their faith in public during allotted hours and in private at their will.[15]
General recognition of the exclusive sovereignty of each party over its lands, people, and agents abroad, and responsibility for the warlike acts of any of its citizens or agents. Issuance of unrestricted letters of marque and reprisal to privateers was forbidden.
....
The treaty did not entirely end conflicts arising out of the Thirty Years' War. Fighting continued between France and Spain until the Treaty of the Pyrenees in 1659. Nevertheless, it did settle many outstanding European issues of the time. Some of the principles developed at Westphalia, especially those relating to respecting the boundaries of sovereign states and non-interference in their domestic affairs, became central to the world order that developed over the following centuries, and remain in effect today.


It ended the Thirty years War in 1648

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirty_Years%27_War
The Thirty Years' War was a series of wars in Central Europe between 1618 and 1648. It was one of the longest and most destructive conflicts in European history,[16] and the deadliest European religious war, resulting in eight million casualties.

Initially a war between various Protestant and Catholic states in the fragmented Holy Roman Empire, it gradually developed into a more general conflict involving most of the great powers.
These states employed relatively large mercenary armies, and the war became less about religion and more of a continuation of the France–Habsburg rivalry for European political pre-eminence. In the 17th century, religious beliefs and practices were a much larger influence on an average European than they are today. During that era, almost everyone was vested on one side of the dispute or another.

The war began when the newly elected Holy Roman Emperor, Ferdinand II, tried to impose religious uniformity on his domains, forcing Roman Catholicism on its peoples. The northern Protestant states, angered by the violation of their rights to choose that had been granted in the Peace of Augsburg, banded together to form the Protestant Union. Ferdinand II was a devout Roman Catholic and relatively intolerant when compared to his predecessor, Rudolf II. His policies were considered heavily pro-Catholic.

These events caused widespread fears throughout northern and central Europe, and triggered the Protestant Bohemians living in the dominion of Habsburg Austria to revolt against their nominal ruler, Ferdinand II. They ousted the Habsburgs and instead elected Frederick V, Elector of the Rhenish Palatinate as their monarch. Frederick took the offer without the support of the union. The southern states, mainly Roman Catholic, were angered by this. Led by Bavaria, these states formed the Catholic League to expel Frederick in support of the Emperor. The Empire soon crushed this perceived rebellion in the Battle of White Mountain, but the Protestant world condemned the Emperor's action.

After the atrocities committed in Bohemia, Saxony finally gave its support to the union and decided to fight back. Sweden, at the time a major military power, soon intervened in 1630 under the great general Gustavus Adolphus and started the full-scale great war on the continent. Spain, wishing to finally crush the Dutch rebels in the Netherlands and the Dutch Republic, intervened under the pretext of helping its dynastic Habsburg ally, Austria. No longer able to tolerate the encirclement of two major Habsburg powers on its borders, Catholic France entered the coalition on the side of the Protestants in order to counter the Habsburgs.

The Thirty Years' War devastated entire regions, with famine and disease significantly decreasing the populations of the German and Italian states, the Crown of Bohemia, and the Southern Netherlands. Both mercenaries and soldiers in fighting armies were expected to fund themselves by looting or extorting tribute, which imposed severe hardships on the inhabitants of occupied territories. The war also bankrupted most of the combatant powers. The Dutch Republic enjoyed contrasting fortune; it ended its revolt against Spain in 1648 and subsequently enjoyed a time of great prosperity and development in which it became one of the world's foremost economic and naval powers. The Thirty Years' War ended with the treaties of Osnabrück and Münster, part of the wider Peace of Westphalia. The war altered the previous political order of European powers. The rise of Bourbon France, the curtailing of Habsburg ambition, and the ascendancy of Sweden as a great power created a new balance of power on the continent, with France emerging from the war strengthened and increasingly dominant in the latter part of the 17th century.


In short it limited the power of the Pope and ushered in secular Europe.

But how was the Pope's power curtailed?

Leads us to the Concordat of Worms (COW)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concordat_of_Worms

The Concordat of Worms (Latin: Concordatum Wormatiense),[1] sometimes called the Pactum Calixtinum by papal historians,[a] was an agreement between Pope Calixtus II and Holy Roman Emperor Henry V on September 23, 1122 near the city of Worms. It brought to an end the first phase of the power struggle between the Papacy and the Holy Roman Emperors and has been interpreted as containing within itself the germ of nation-based sovereignty that would one day be confirmed in the Treaty of Westphalia (1648); in part this was an unforeseen result of strategic maneuvering between the Church and the European sovereigns over political control within their domains. The King was recognised as having the right to invest bishops with secular authority ("by the lance") in the territories they governed, but not with sacred authority ("by ring and staff"); the result was that bishops owed allegiance in worldly matters both to the pope and to the king, for they were obligated to affirm the right of the sovereign to call upon them for military support, under his oath of fealty. Previous Holy Roman Emperors had thought it their right, granted by God, to name Church officials within their territories (such as bishops) and to confirm the Papal election (and, at times of extraordinary urgency, actually name popes). In fact, the Emperors had been heavily relying on bishops for their secular administration, as they were not hereditary or quasi-hereditary nobility with family interests, thus adding further suspense to the struggle. A more immediate result of the Investiture struggle identified a proprietary right that adhered to sovereign territory, recognising the right of kings to income from the territory of a vacant diocese and a basis for justifiable taxation. These rights lay outside feudalism, which defined authority in a hierarchy of personal relations, with only a loose relation to territory.[4] The pope emerged as a figure above and out of the direct control of the Holy Roman Emperor.

Following efforts by Lamberto Scannabecchi (later Pope Honorius II) and the Diet of Würzburg (1121) in 1122, Pope Calixtus II and Holy Roman Emperor Henry V entered into an agreement that effectively ended the Investiture Controversy. [b]By the terms of the agreement, the election of bishops and abbots in Germany was to take place in the emperor's presence as judge between potentially disputing parties, free of bribes, thus retaining to the emperor a crucial role in choosing these great territorial magnates of the Empire. Beyond the borders of Germany, in Burgundy and Italy, the Emperor was to forward the symbols of authority within six months.
Calixtus' reference to the feudal homage due the emperor on appointment is guarded: "shall do unto thee for these what he rightfully should" was the wording of the privilegium granted by Calixtus. The Emperor's right to a substantial imbursement on the election of a bishop or abbot was specifically denied.

The Emperor renounced the right to invest ecclesiastics with ring and crosier, the symbols of their spiritual power, and guaranteed election by the canons of cathedral or abbey and free consecration. The two ended by granting one another peace.

The Concordat was confirmed by the First Council of the Lateran in 1123.

The Concordat of Worms was a part of the larger reforms put forth by many popes, most notably Pope Gregory VII. These included celibacy of the clergy, end of simony and autonomy of the Church from secular leaders (lack of autonomy was known as lay investiture).
....


In other words the COW gave the Kings and Pope power to appoint bishops. TOW on the other hand by giving the right to freedom of religion thus limiting the right of external powers(Pope) to interfere (appoint bishops) in sovereign states ushered in Secular State.


So this is how the secular state came about.

Between COW and TOW, the kings ushered in various reforms to reduce the power(economic, judicial, political) of the Clergy in their domains.

In India the new Popes are the CJI.

The power is judicial power. Its now being expanded with leaps and bounds into other areas especially Hindu law.

In other words the Court is becoming non secular with respect to Hindus.

The Kings are the modern day politicians like NaMo who are in pre-COW state.

So how does India come up with its own COW and TOW?


What COW did is it reduced bishop appointments to a game theory. Let me explain.
In every bishopric, the Pope has a choice: 1) appoint a bishop favorable to himself, 2) neutral to him or the King, and 3) favorable to the King.
The King similarly could 1)accept the Pope appointment, 3) reject the appointment. He has two choices vs. three for the Pope. He could stall the choice hoping the Pope or the candidate leaves! But not a real choice all the time.

Mostly it was not the bishops but the bishoprics that decided the appointment.

If the bishopric had low economic value (in end its all about money) the king would accept the Pope's choice. If it was high value, the King would insist on his own choice!!! Pope would insist on is own choice there too. As the Pope was far away the appointments were neutral or favorable to Kings.
At same time the King would work to reduce the power of the most valuable bishopric!

So in India think of Judges as the secular Bishops. Now modern power is judicial power.
The least powerful to most powerful appointments range from State High Courts to Supreme Courts.
The Collegium is the College of Cardinals who are already out of secular or politician power.

So NaMo has to reduce judicial power by getting new laws passed which limit the power of the judges. For this he needs to get more of his own elected that is acquire political power. Same time he needs the Collegium throw up a suitable candidate.

panduranghari
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby panduranghari » 21 Jan 2017 16:50

Ramana wrote:So how does India come up with its own COW and TOW?


Perhaps by undertaking the defenestration of Delhi like they undertook the defenestration of Prague.

Or that is exactly what the CJI coterie want. Which is what we should prevent. Kejritard tried it during 'Damini' episode.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby OmkarC » 22 Jan 2017 13:02

http://www.forbes.com/sites/wadeshepard/2017/01/21/india-tells-sri-lanka-take-your-trincomalee-deep-sea-port-and-shove-it/#4a0e6be26e6e

Analysis request for my own understanding.. why is India rejecting Trincomalee port development project ? How is this not strategically not vital to Indian interests to counter Hambantota ? I hope there is thought beyond the mere pleasure of showing middle finger to SL (and all smaller countries like it) that are trying to play both sides for its own benefit.

ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 25 Jan 2017 00:42

OmkarC Its a buyer walking away from the deal as price is too high.

If China collapses as is being made out then they can have Trincomalee.
Look at its hinterland, nothing.
And Trincomale is good for a naval base only.
Not a commercial harbor. its on the Eastern seaboard. The large container ships why will they stop there?

ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 25 Jan 2017 00:42

Meanwhile x-posting.....

SBajwa wrote:http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/trends/a-hockey-stick-replaces-the-gun/348645.html

A hockey stick replaces the gun

Sajeda Momin

It is being claimed that demonitisation has broken the back of the Maoists by making all their cash worthless. But this is merely a short-term solution since in a few months, the Maoists will again get hold of the new currency. There is, however, another man, who is attacking the Maoist menace where it hurts with a more positive approach — by preventing recruits. Dilip Tirkey, three-time Olympian and former Indian hockey team captain, is giving young tribals from the Red Corridor hopes and dreams by picking up hockey sticks and putting down the guns.

By organising the world’s largest rural hockey tournament, the 39-year-old former full-back and deep-defender, now Rajya Sabha member, is telling the youth of his community that if he can do it, so can they. Under the aegis of the Dilip Tirkey Sports Research and Development Foundation, Tirkey has organised the Biju Patnaik Rural Hockey Championships, which has 1,500 teams comprising around 24,000 players competing with each other for three months.

The championships, which began on December 14 last year has teams from 900 villages in the tribal belts of three states — Odisha, Chhattisgarh and Jharkhand — part of the Naxal-infested Red Corridor. The matches, which are being played at 32 venues across the three states, will culminate in the final match on March 5, Biju Patnaik’s birth anniversary, at the Biju Patnaik Hockey Stadium in Rourkela.

In the presence of Vice-President Hamid Ansari, Odisha Chief Minister Navin Patnaik and a host of other former and current National hockey players, the once-shy Tirkey told thousands of young, enthusiastic tribals gathered for the inauguration not to join the Maoists.

“We do have a problem in our midst, and that is a few of our young friends have strayed from the path of righteousness. I also ask them to come back and pick up a hockey stick, instead of a gun,” said Tirkey.

These areas are characterised by unemployment, illiteracy, over-population, and most importantly, poverty, which is the prime breeding ground for Naxal recruits.

“This is the only chance we have of establishing what I call the ‘Hockey Order’ so that we can organise the youth towards an activity, which gives them a chance to get jobs in various sectors,” said Tirkey.

The Olympian, who too came from a very humble background, said “What would I have been if I hadn’t picked up a hockey stick?” It’s also about self-respect and giving back to a society which has given him so much.

“Trying to discipline youngsters cannot be just the job of educationists. Somewhere sport has to play a part,” says Tirkey. Tirkey began working on the tournament more than eight months ago. He admits that as all players are from poor and rural background, the logistics of getting them here and upto speed was a nightmare. However, now seeing their enthusiasm, he would like to see this turn into an all-India affair.

The Rajya Sabha MP and Navin Patnaik’s blue-eyed boy, Tirkey’s detractors have accused him of organising the championships with a political end in mind — helping him win the 2019 Lok Sabha elections from the area. “I don’t see anything wrong in what he is doing. If he is empowering the youth, why criticise that? Today he has brought forward hockey as an instrument for change. I think we should appreciate that,” said Shakti Singh, Santosh Trophy footballer and friend.

Tirkey grew up in the underdeveloped district of Sundergarh and put it on the country’s map with his hockey exploits. After retiring in 2010, he was nominated to the Rajya Sabha by the Biju Janata Dal. In 2014, Tirkey did run for the Lok Sabha on a BJD ticket from here but lost by a narrow margin. However, he rejects the possible political overtones of the tournament. “I am clear that this is a hockey event, and there is nothing political about it”.

The aim of the initiative is to scout for hockey talent, generate interest for the game among the youth and help them find the right path. Even if the championship is able to stop one tribal youth from picking up a gun and becoming a Naxal, it is a success, he adds.

svinayak
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby svinayak » 25 Jan 2017 12:37

Very serious stuff

National Interest




India has all the blocks to be a great power

Philip
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Philip » 25 Jan 2017 13:05

If we truly want to be "great power",we must believe in ourselves and not behave like our MEA does,like headless chickens and eunuchs to boot.
Under the leadership of the current For.Sec.,e have become a second-rate power that struggles to even maintain this dubious status. We look to Washington before we open our mouths on global issues,have kept it totally silent on Middle -Eastern affairs,have been discarded from the Afghan talks,have allowed China to squat on our doorstep in an almost permanent basis in Sri Lanka,at Gwadar in Baluchistan,sell subs to BDesh,and now are trying to woo the UKR (specially inviting its dy.honcho to the R-Day show) ,a dismal depressing state,ruined by oligarchs whose backside has been burnt badly by Russia.This may probably be at the prodding of the US,to help the UKR diplomatically by the UKR's godfather,an act which will may disappoint Russia further and hasten its thaw with Pak.

Despite humiliating an increasing Chinese provocations in the HImalayas,protecting Paki terrorists at the UN,and denying us membership of the NSG,stuffing Pak with every kind of nuclear and conventional weaponry,we have not responded in the recent years to even the Chinese stapled visas,calling Ar.Pr. "Souther Tibet" and discriminating and not allowing at times our citizens resident in J&K and the north-east. Here is an insightful article on how to deal with the PRC,but does the MEA and its mandarins have any b*lls at all,or are they like the mandarins of yore in ancient China a bunch of eunuchs?

http://www.deccanchronicle.com/opinion/ ... -card.html
Territory issues: Why not play Tibet card?
Published Jan 25, 2017, 12:37 am ISTUpdated Jan 25, 2017, 6:56 am IST

By Abhijit Bhattacharya, Lawyer Supreme Court

There is no way China can refer to a legally-acceded J&K to India as a ‘disputed’ territory.

As Republic Day nears, it is worthwhile to take a look at India’s constitutional history, and perhaps clear the doubts of some who may have misgivings about India’s territory and its exercise of sovereign power. This is well established and well documented, unlike several sovereign nations that may have firepower but not the structured legal foundation to justify or defend their actions while challenging or trampling upon India’s sovereignty. It began in the British Parliament with the draft “Indian Independence Act”, passed and placed on the statute book with amazing speed as “Indian Independence Act 1947. The bill, introduced in the House of Commons on July 4, 1947, received the royal assent July 18, 1947, in 14 days, and came into force the same day. The Act provided that from August 15, 1947 (referred to as the “appointed date”), in place of India as defined in the Government of India Act, 1935 there would be set up “two independent dominions, to be known as India and Pakistan...” Under the Act, the Dominion of India got “the residuary territory of India excluding the provinces of Sind, Balochistan, West Punjab, East Bengal and North-Western Frontier Province and Sylhet district in Assam”.

No other territory, contiguous to Pakistan, was referred to. The striking feature is whereas Balochistan, comprising the four princely states of Las Bela, Kharan, Makran and Kalat, was categorised as part of the new state of Pakistan, being both Muslim majority and contiguous to it, no other territory, either Muslim majority or contiguous to Pakistan, was mentioned. Thus, no “further geographical territory” could be claimed as a matter of inherent right by the Dominion of Pakistan. There was nothing left for Pakistan to make claim on any other part of any territory now legally, politically and geographically identifiable as India. If anything had to happen, it had to be through the legal route, not through roads ridden by armed bands of looters, lashkars and loafers in Land Rovers, supported and instigated by the Pakistani state, through illegal means. The territories of independent India and Pakistan had to have the sanctity of law, and follow due process of law. After August 15, 1947, when the princely states hurried to join either India or Pakistan in accordance with the Instrument of Accession Act, or taking their own time to follow legal routes of accession, came the blatantly illegal violent invasion from Pakistan of the princely state of Jammu and Kashmir on October 22, 1947.

Understandably, to counter this illegal act of Pakistan, the Maharaja of J&K had to act quickly and took recourse to the legal route to accede to India on October 26, 1947. What did the ruler of J&K do to declare, and state, his authority over territory which fell under his legal and bona fide jurisdiction while signing the Instrument of Accession to India? “I, Shriman Inder Mahendar Rajrajeshwar Maharajadhiraj Shri Hari Singhji, Jammu Kashmir Naresh Tatha Tibbet adi Deshadhipati, ruler of Jammu and Kashmir state, in exercise of my sovereignty in and over my said state, do hereby execute this my Instrument of Accession...” Should India, post-accession of J&K to New Delhi, have claimed sovereignty thereon? Has India ever made this claim? When things were legally valid, being offered by the competent authority to India through a bona fide, legal accession document? Nothing like that was to happen due to the Indian rulers’ inherent respect for the sensitivities of neighbouring countries. India’s rulers usually are too gentlemanly, hence the only accusation/criticism made against them is that traditionally they lacked aggressive instincts to go beyond what they considered their natural, bona fide boundary or frontier. Never more, but may be less. That indeed is India’s unique characteristic. That is why at least two neighbouring countries, even today, are totally unconcerned about India’s concern over its own bona fide territorial integrity and sovereignty.

From the beginning, India played fair, acknowledging for example China’s forced claim on Tibet. Unlike J&K, Tibet didn’t have any Instrument of Accession to show or fall back upon. Tibet, some non-Tibetans claim, enjoyed “suzerainty” but not “sovereignty”. Without conceding this point on Tibet, will it be wrong to counter-question those having doubts about the integration of a sovereign J&K through legal means? Is it not a fact that while J&K voluntarily gave up sovereignty in India’s favour in October 1947, Tibet involuntarily accepted occupation by Chinese troops? Can these cases be even remotely seen as similar? There is thus no way China can refer to a legally-acceded J&K to India as a “disputed” territory. Obversely, if J&K is “disputed” in China’s eyes, Tibet could very well be perceived as more than “disputed territory”; it could be deemed “conquered” and “trampled” land in future. If that were to happen, where would China’s “sovereign sensitivity” stand?

Seen in this perspective, it will be advisable for those who challenge Indian sovereignty over J&K to stop in their tracks and cease vitiating the peace initiatives. They must understand that geostrategically or geopolitically, whereas J&K belongs to India, China’s claim to Tibet can only be seen as a reciprocal, mirror image. Both Tibet and J&K are landlocked territories that were traditionally coveted by distant powers. Realistically speaking, no landlocked territory in that part of geography can afford to retain or exercise its independence. Someone is bound to pounce. Pakistan used illegal means to grab a part of J&K. India got J&K through the legal route instead. China, unlike Pakistan, nevertheless succeeded in Tibet through the use of force. Today, however, both China and Pakistan should cease trampling upon India’s sovereignty over J&K under the guise of “one belt, one road”. What if threatened external powers join hand to snap, rather than shape, it?


Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 01 Feb 2017 12:14

Remembering Marichjhapi, Never forget Never Forgive.

The Forgotten Story Of The Marichjhapi Massacre By Marxists - Swarajya
Jaideep Mazumdar - Jan 30, 2017, 10:59 am

Tuesday will mark the 38th anniversary of one of the worst massacres in independent India that claimed the lives of over a thousand people, many of them women, children and the elderly. It was a cold-blooded, planned and horrendous massacre that few even in Bengal know about or care to remember.

Hardly anyone in India knows about it.

On 31 January 1979, the CPI(M)-led Left Front government, heady with its electoral success in Bengal two years before that, trained its guns on thousands of Bengali Hindu refugees who had fled persecution in East Pakistan (and then Bangladesh) and settled in an uninhabited island in the Sunderbans. Not only were these people desperately poor who had suffered the unimaginable trauma of having had to flee their hearth and homes across the border, they were also all Dalits and OBCs.

The events leading to the Marichjhapi massacre form a sickening narrative on the ugly, hypocritical, diabolic, brutal and inhuman character of communists. Marichjhapi, about 75 kilometres east of Kolkata as the crow flies, also stands as a damning indictment of Bengal’s red helmsman, Jyoti Basu, who presided over his state’s decline while his party gained in strength. It is yet another proof that human lives, even the lives of the poor whose cause they profess to champion, matter little to communists.

Migration From East Pakistan

Lakhs of Bengali Hindus have been fleeing religious, social and economic persecution in East Pakistan, and then Bangladesh, since a little before Partition in 1947. This migration peaked in 1947, and then again in 1970-1971 when the murderous West Pakistani army started a genocidal pogrom against the Bengali-speaking masses in East Pakistan, mainly Hindus. “These migrants were mostly poor, marginal farmers and people engaged in petty vocations in East Pakistan and were mostly Dalits and OBCs. The upper castes, the educated and the wealthy from East Bengal (which became East Pakistan in 1947) had already set up bases and homes in West Bengal before Partition. The poor and the lower castes stayed behind because they did not have the means to migrate,” explained Amiya Majumdar, a historian.

At the time of Partition, millions of lower caste Hindus decided to stay back in East Pakistan primarily because one of their most influential leaders, Jogendra Nath Mandal, gave a call to lower caste Hindus to stay back in East Pakistan instead of migrating to India. He was an ardent advocate of Dalit-Muslim unity, a disastrous experiment that was bound to fail (read about it in this article). Mandal’s plight represents that of the millions of the Dalits and OBCs who heeded his call; Mandal, who was Pakistan’s first labour and law minister, got completely disillusioned by the anti-Hindu policies of the government and its encouragement to Islamists who started forcibly converting Hindus to Islam and other large-scale atrocities on Hindus. He wrote a long resignation letter to then Pakistan premier Liaquat Ali Khan before fleeing to India in 1950.

Resettlement In Dandakaranya

Lakhs of Dalits and OBCs then started crossing over to West Bengal in the footsteps of Mandal after atrocities by Muslim fundamentalists, often encouraged by the authorities, started increasing. Initially, Bengali Hindu refugees were encouraged to settle down in West Bengal, Assam and Tripura. But soon, these three states could no longer absorb the burden of such a huge number of settlers and the Union Government decided to settle the refugees in Dandakaranya (which translates into ‘jungle of punishment’), a vast, arid and adivasi-inhabited region comprising parts of present-day Odisha, Chattisgarh, Madhya Pradesh and Maharashtra. The Union Government set up a Dandakaranya Development Authority (DDA) to facilitate settlement of refugees there and develop the region.

Tens of thousands of Bengali Hindu refugees from East Pakistan streaming into West Bengal were transported to Dandakaranya and settled in camps there. The conditions were harsh, but the Union Government promised loans and other aid, including technical help, to convert the arid lands into farmlands (as in Israel). The DDA planned to give the refugees – an estimated 2.5 lakh who had gone there – pattas (rights) to plots of land for setting up their houses and for farming. But the refugees, used to farming in the fertile alluvial Gangetic delta, felt it would be impossible to grow crops in Dandakaranya. They were also very unhappy with the living conditions in Dandakaranya, where they were (temporarily) put up in tents erected in guarded enclosures. They also found the extreme climate alluvial – very hot summers and freezing winters – too harsh for their comfort. Resentment thus started brewing among them.

Instigating The Refugees

The communists, who had started emerging as a strong opposition force in Bengal by the mid-1960s, started stoking the resentment amongst the refugees. They came out in open support of the refugees. The communists started demanding proper resettlement of the refugees within West Bengal and the scrapping of the Dandakaranya project. They started encouraging the refugees settled in Dandakaranya to return to West Bengal. But they did not do so out of any empathy for the refugees. Thanks to successive Congress governments’ (both in the state and in New Delhi) apathy towards the refugees, the latter started gravitating towards the communists, who promised them the moon if and when they (the communists) came to power. The refugees, numbering lakhs (those who settled in West Bengal as well as the ones in Dandakaranya) started supporting the communists.

Jyoti Basu himself advocated the resettlement of the refugees, who had been sent to Dandakaranya in the vast Sunderbans archipelago. He wrote to (then) Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru and successive chief ministers of Bengal demanding that some islands in the Sunderbans be earmarked for resettling these refugees. Basu sent his comrades to Dandakaranya (among them leaders of the communist-allied Forward Bloc) to instigate the refugees settled there into abandoning their camps and returning to West Bengal. They were promised rehabilitation in the uninhabited islands of the Sunderbans when the Left Front (an alliance of left-leaning parties led by the CPM) came to power in West Bengal.

Dandakaranya To Bengal

Accordingly, groups of refugees started streaming back to West Bengal from the mid-1970s. Many of them were detected and detained at various railway stations en route and sent back, but many managed to slip past police cordons and reach West Bengal. This reverse migration from Dandakaranya picked up soon after the Left Front came to power in West Bengal in mid-1977. They had been scouting for islands in the Sunderbans to settle down in, and the leaders of the Udbastu Unnayanshil Samiti (Refugee Welfare Committee) zeroed in on Marichjhapi.

By mid-1978, an estimated 1.5 lakh refugees from Dandakaranya and other parts of India where they had been resettled had reached Bengal in the hope that the sympathetic Left Front government in power would facilitate their rehabilitation. They encroached on government and even private lands in Kolkata and adjoining areas and started living in squalid conditions, awaiting the promised manna (in the forms of doles, jobs, education and land pattas) from the communists.

In early 1978, a few hundred refugees made their way to Marichjhapi and started settling down there. They cleared the forests, built embankments to protect the island from high tides, dug ponds for storing rain water and for fisheries, and dividing small plots of lands among themselves to build their small huts. As word spread around, thousands of refugees started streaming into Marichjhapi. By June 1978, about 30,000 refugees had settled down in the large island, built nearly 250-kilometre long embankments, set up a beedi-making unit, a carpentry workshop, a bakery, a hosiery unit, a secondary school and a cooperative for farming and fishing.

The large settlement at Marichjhapi became, more or less, self-reliant. The menfolk would fish in the numerous rivers and creeks of the Sunderbans and sell their produce in the nearby Kumirmari island. The women weaved and knitted and sold garments. The bread and cup cakes from Marichjhapi became quite a hit in the other inhabited islands. Volunteer teachers started taking classes. Roads were built and the settlers set up a rudimentary desalination plant. Life, say those who lived in that island, was hard, but idyllic as well.

The Betrayal

By then, however, the policy of the communists had completely changed. Having used the refugees settled at Dandakaranya to gain the sympathy and support of the millions who had already fled East Pakistan (and then Bangladesh) and settled down in West Bengal, the communists (as is their wont) did a complete U-turn. After coming to power, the communists declared that there was no space left in West Bengal for refugees from the neighbouring country. They declared that all those who had returned from Dandakaranya and other parts of the country where they had been resettled would have to return.

The communist rulers let loose the state police and their cadres to harass and evict the refugees who had returned from Dandakaranya. They were herded to railway stations and bundled into trains bound for other states. The unwilling were threatened and beaten up, their meagre belongings looted and their documents destroyed. The communists, thus, managed to drive away tens of thousands of refugees, who they had promised to rehabilitate in Bengal after they came to power.

Buildup To The Massacre

From end-December 1978, police and CPM cadres started going to Marichjhapi and ordering the settlers there to leave. Tension started building up as the settlers refused and drove away the CPM cadres and goons. Marichjhapi stood out as a prominent spot of defiance of the communist dictators, who could not tolerate the disregard for their diktat (that all refugees from Dandakaranya have to return). The pressure on the settlers at Marichjhapi increased. The CPM cadres started going to the neighbouring islands and warning traders there against dealing with the residents of Marichjhapi, who used to sell their produce – fish, breads, cakes, garments and cane products – to the merchants of those islands and procuring foodstuff and other items from them.

The CPM also started floating wild stories ascribing sinister motives to the settlers. CPM leaders led a whisper campaign alleging that the settlers were Hindu hardliners whose ultimate objective was to establish Hindu dominance in the Sunderbans and drive out Muslims from there. They alleged that the settlers were being funded by external sources, had set up illegal arms manufacturing units and were planning a rebellion against India. Many of these unfounded allegations find circulation even today in articles (like this one written by a communist acolyte) penned to justify, play down and even deny the massacre. Such rumours and allegations were circulated with the diabolic motive of building up a case against the Marichjhapi settlers based on falsehoods (something that communists excel in) and lies that can be termed as inhuman against people who had been forced to flee their homes due to religious, social and economic persecution (in East Pakistan and Bangladesh).

The Blockade Of Marichjhapi

Once the communist rulers of Bengal realised that the settlers in Marichjhapi were bent on defying their diktat, they (the commies) decided to act. From mid-January, police in motorised country boats started patrolling the waters around Marichjhapi island and harassing the islanders. The police – and police boats often had communist cadres in them – started forcibly taking away fish caught by the islanders or other merchandise the islanders would be taking to nearby islands in their small boats. Communist cadres also started landing on the island in the stealth of night to damage the islanders’ boats, carts, cowsheds and anything they could target.

When even such harassment failed, the cops and cadres imposed an economic blockade on the island. This documentary provides a vivid description of the brutality and inhumanity of the cops and (CPM) cadres who perpetrated the cold-blooded massacre of the hapless refugees, who were trying to rebuild their shattered lives on their own, without any help from the communist government, which had posed as their saviours before coming to power. The islanders were prevented from venturing out to Kumirmari and neighbouring islands from where they would procure their food and other supplies. The residents of the other islands were also prevented from sailing to Marichjhapi to trade there.

After more than a week of this blockade, with stocks of water, food, medicines and baby food running dry, the desperate and starving settlers of Marichjhapi decided to brave the blockade and sail to Kumirmari to procure supplies. As this account of the sufferings of the islanders illustrates, they were forced to eat even grass to survive and many children started dying of green dysentery. The situation was desperate and a group of 20-odd settlers sailed to Kumirmari under the cover of darkness on the night of 29 January 1979, to get supplies. They managed to land in that island after slipping past the police cordon of Marichjhapi.

The First Killings

But the next day, they were detected by cops and CPM cadres at Kumirmari bazaar. The cops attempted to take away whatever little money they had and the baby food, rice and other essential commodities they had bought from Kumirmari. The settlers objected and fight broke out with the cops and cadres. The cops fired at them and, according to eyewitness accounts, about a dozen were killed. The cops threw away their bodies into the crocodile-infested waters of the Korankhali river that ran between Kumirmari and Marichjhapi. The other injured islanders were arrested and taken away.

The settlers at Marichjhapi were shocked as the news of the killings reached them on 30 January afternoon. But the shock soon gave way to outrage. A series of meetings were held and it was unanimously decided that they would break through the blockade by the cops and cadres the next day. It was decided that a group of women would be first sent out in boats towards Kumirmari. The assumption was that the cops would not touch the women. Sixteen women volunteered to go to Kumirmari the next morning. But the islanders were wrong in assuming that the cops, acting on the direct orders of bloodthirsty communist cadres, would not touch their womenfolk. They were wrong in assuming that there were some vestiges of humanity left in cops in communist Bengal.

The Massacre

On the morning of 31 January 1979, as the women rowed out from Marichjhapi in 10 country boats, they were asked by police to return. When they refused and continued rowing, the police rammed their mechanised boats into the women’s boats. The women jumped into the water and swam away. The cops even fired into the water and killed two of them. The rest were found a few days later in a forest in another island and all said they had been repeatedly raped by cops and communist cadres.

The islanders, who were watching from the shores of Marichjhapi as their mothers, wives and sisters rowed to Kumirmari, were aghast at the police action. A roar of protest rose from the shores of that island and the islanders started brandishing lathis, choppers and whatever they could lay their hands on. That was the signal for the police and CPM cadres to land in Marichjhapi and fire at, molest, rape and kill the islanders and loot their belongings. The mayhem continued for the whole of January 31. Accounts such as this describe the brutality of the massacre.

According to survivors’ accounts, the police did not even spare about 15 kids – aged between five and 12 – who had taken shelter in their school (a thatched hut). The kids had gathered there to make arrangements for Saraswati Puja, which was to be celebrated the next day (1 February), when the cops and cadres landed at Marichjhapi. Hearing the firing and cries of their elders, the scared kids huddled inside the school, cowering in fear. The cops and cadres herded them out of the school and decapitated them. Not content with their gory act, they smashed the idol of Goddess Saraswati into smithereens.

Though figures vary, it is widely believed that at least 1,700 people, including many women, children and the elderly, were killed on 31 January 1979, at Marichjhapi. Many others were injured. The survivors fled to other parts of the state and many are now settled in the North and South 24 Parganas districts of Bengal, eking out their lives in utter misery and penury. Accounts of their sufferings are sporadically published in the media (such as this), but they have been largely forgotten in Bengal while few outside the state even know of their sad plight.

What these settlers in Marichjhapi cannot figure out even today is why the communist government turned against them after having invited them to rebuild their lives in the islands of the Sunderbans. Why the U-turn by Jyoti Basu? Was it because they were Hindus? There will perhaps be no answers to this deafening question.

Postscript: Mamata Banerjee, before coming to power in 2011, promised a judicial probe into the Marichjhapi massacre (and all other killings by communists in Bengal). Six years later, the survivors of Marichjhapi still await a closure. Once again, they feel let down by politicians.

Post postscript: For a heartrending literary account of the massacre, read The Hungry Tide by Amitav Ghosh.

OmkarC
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby OmkarC » 05 Feb 2017 16:53

^^ Thanks for sharing.. what sub-human beasts these marxist vermin are.

Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 11 Feb 2017 15:08

Image

.....
Their story was what my mind snapped back to as television and newspapers began reporting the rape and murder of two cousins in Badaun. The medieval barbarity of two Dalit girls, no more than children, being pulled out of their homes, raped and then strung up from the sprawling branches of the only mango tree in the village should have no place in a modern India.

But it does, dovetailing all too neatly with Uttar Pradesh’s ruling Samajwadi Party (SP) chief Mulayam Singh Yadav’s indulgent assertion that “boys will be boys” in reference to the gang-rape in Mumbai’s Shakti Mills; in party leader Abu Azmi’s statement that women who were raped should also be punished and in Chief Minister Akhilesh Yadav’s irritable outburst to journalists following the Badaun incident, “You are safe, why do you worry?”

Uttar Pradesh, and indeed India with all its contradictions, has long been the playground of politicians who have exploited caste and religious fault lines, using the police and administrative machinery to further their ends. And this was once again demonstrated in that dark, powerless night, when three Yadav brothers allegedly dragged away the two girls who had stepped out to relieve themselves.

Their uncle Baburam heard their screams and saw the girls — one being dragged by her hair — being pulled away. But he could do nothing. Nor could any of the other villagers, or the fathers. Hearing what had happened, they had rushed to the house of Pappu Yadav, one of those seen taking the girls away. And the door was opened by the head constable, Chhatrapal Yadav. “When I asked where our daughters were, he said they were inside and that they would be sent back in two hours,” the father of one of the girls told a reporter.

“I pleaded with them with folded hands... but he hit me, abused me and asked me to leave,” he went on, replaying a scene that should rightfully belong only in a regressive Hindi film of the 1950s and 1960s. The paralysis — borne of years of caste brutality and active endorsement of those who police our systems – was complete.


And so they waited, the dark hours of uncertainty deepening their dread. Until there was a phone call informing them that their children were hanging from the mango tree, a favourite of the children in the area who would swing from its branches.

How could this play out with such impunity? The publicity and the outrage that followed led to five people, the three Yadav brothers and two constables, Chhatrapal Yadav and Sarvesh Yadav, being arrested. Akhilesh Yadav effected a bureaucratic reshuffle at the top and said he would call for a CBI inquiry. And Katra Sadatganj received a flurry of VIP visitors, including Congress vice president Rahul Gandhi. And even former Chief Minister and Bahujan Samaj Party leader Mayawati, who, if reports are to be believed, has not travelled to meet any individual or family since 2007. Could her decimation in the recent elections have anything to do with it?

Sulabh International has announced that it would construct toilets in the village. That would certainly make girls and women more secure, but do little to obviate the underlying contempt inbuilt into India’s complex caste structure. Till that happens, girls and women from lower castes will continue to be vulnerable. There has been talk of compensation but the heartbroken father has said he wants nothing, only justice for the two children.

http://www.dnaindia.com/analysis/column ... gs-1993037


#EndJungleRaj

Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 12 Feb 2017 01:36

The "Mainority" school is Rehmani Model Senior School, Badi Masjid, Ramganj Bazaar,Jaipur .
'Paedophile teacher in a Muslim school raped 200 boys in last 10 years'
TNN | Updated: Feb 11, 2017, 12.55 PM IST

JAIPUR: For over 10 years, a paedophile teacher, Rameez, raped, abused and blackmailed numerous schoolboys for money. Despite several complaints from students, the school administration of Rehmani Model Senior School didn't inform the police by simply asking Rameez to resign, risking lives of hundreds of other children.
The shocking details emerged on Friday when parents of a 20-year-old boy filed an FIR at Ramganj police station, alleging their son was raped by Rameez for over six years.
"My son was barley 14 when this teacher abused him first. He threatened to fail my son in examinations and the child got scared. My son silently went through the trauma," said father of the victim.
SHO Ramganj Ashok Chauhan confirmed the FIR and said about 50 p*rnographic clippings of young boys have been recovered from Rameez. However, advocate of the victims Aslam Khan alleged Rameez raped 200 kids in last 10 years.
"Friends of victims told us that they had managed to recover 200 video clips from the teacher's computer. These clips were shown to school staff. But the school shunted him out and didn't inform the police," Aslam Khan told TOI.
"Had the school acted on complaints of students, Rameez would have been behind the bars and other students would not have been targeted by him," added a police official.
Rameez was arrested by police on Wednesday following a complaint by a 14-year-old boy who alleged that he was raped by Rameez. "The tutor also blackmailed his students for money," Chouhan added.

Police said Rameez confessed during the interrogation that he had been molesting and raping kids for several years. Cops are also probing as to why the school did not inform them about Rameez.
While police are probing the case and involvement of other victims, Aslam Khan said more complaints are expected to reach police station soon. "Parents are reading about the teacher and his nasty details in newspapers. More victims are likely to emerge in this case," Khan told TOI.
Abrogate Article 30 of Indian Constitution.
The special privileges in allowing these so called "mainorities" to perpetrate institutional criminal abuse (such as paedophilia & rape) using the non-interference guarantees afforded by the malicious Article 30 of Indian constitution should end.Convents & Madrassas should come under full scope of Indian law - with regard to Administration standards & standards of curriculum of the compulsory secular courses .
Every school & college irrespective of it being "mainority" or not must be truly equal in the eyes of Indian Law.

Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 14 Feb 2017 18:39

Rohith Vemula Was Not a Dalit, Concludes Guntur Collector's Report
Sakshi Khanna | CNN-News18
First published: February 14, 2017

Hyderabad: The District Level Scrutiny Committee in Guntur district of Andhra Pradesh, which was reviewing Dalit status of Rohith Vemula, has submitted its final report to the government stating that neither Rohith Vemula nor his mother Radhika Vemula was a Dalit.
The report submitted by committee concluded that the Scheduled Caste certificate obtained through fraudulent means by the family should also be cancelled.
On 17th January 2016, suicide of research scholar Rohith Vemula, in Hyderabad Central University campus, triggered nationwide outrage and protests. The political leaders from all parties converged at the campus demanding justice for Rohith.
Speaking to CNN-News18, Guntur Collector Kantilal Dande said: "Yes, we have submitted the report. We have conducted detailed inquiry, and found he was not a Dalit as claimed by his family."
"As a procedure, the family has been intimated about the findings of the inquiry. A notice has been sent seeking their response, before any action," said Dande.
The University administration led by Vice Chancellor Appa Rao Podile, along with central BJP-led government, was accused of being anti-Dalit and discriminatory which led Rohith to take the ultimate step.
The Cyberabad police had registered cases against the Vice Chancellor, Union Labour Minister Bandaru Dattatreya, and others under SC/ST Act.
The Cyberabad police had been awaiting for the final report from Guntur Collector on Rohith's caste status to finalise investigation in the case.


So even the poor mother of Rohit Vemula (the perennial poster boy for Indian Left's vilification of Hindutva & their intolerance campaign) turns out to be non SC ,having fraudulently obtained SC certificate for her family.

Now one won't be surprised if its revealed later that one or two Marxist professor's in Hyderabad University had coerced Rohit Vemula into killing himself by blackmailing him on his secret non SC "privileged" status .

Lilo
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Lilo » 20 Feb 2017 16:44

National Media’s Silence on Kalikho’s Suicide Note Is Deafening
Dushyant February 18, 2017, 7:29 pm

First, the facts. A former Chief Minister of a state commits suicide. He leaves behind an emotional suicide note running over 60 pages. The suicide note contains allegations against several politicians, including a sitting Chief Minister, sitting Supreme Court Judges and senior lawyers/legal officers (to the effect that he was asked to pay bribes by people claiming to act on behalf of these judges to swing a decision in his/his party’s favour).
In any other democratic country, with even an iota of shame, nay, pretence of shame or even notions of integrity, this event would have shaken the country. Everything else would have stopped. Television news channels would have been debating the matter day and night. This would have been a front page news for months in any newspaper which continues to believe that speaking truth to power or demanding accountability is still fashionable.
At least one politician or a judge would have resigned fearing outrage. The government would have probably sanctioned an enquiry headed by a lame-duck pliable person out of need, just to show that something was being done. One would expect nothing less than 2.5 years after so many people came on the streets protesting ‘corruption’ and of course, a Lokpal.

The Brazen Impunity of Ignoring Pul’s Suicide Note
Is any of this happening?
Jaane bhi do yaaron.
What is happening can only be described in two words: brazen impunity. The person who committed suicide was the former Chief Minister of Arunachal Pradesh Kalikho Pul. According to a report here, his wife has petitioned the Chief Justice of India, seeking that an FIR be registered and investigation into the allegations against judges be commenced. The permission of the Chief Justice of India (CJI) is necessary before any FIR can be registered against a Supreme Court Judge.

She has reportedly also requested the CJI to place the petition before another judge “in accordance with the judgment in the Veeraswami case for consideration of my request.” The Veeraswami judgment inter alia says that if allegations are being made against the Chief Justice himself, then they must be placed before his brother/sister judge to decide whether the allegations prima facie merit investigation.

Suicide Note Doesn’t Mean an Investigation Can’t be Launched
At the center of this controversy is the suicide note. What is the evidentiary value of this suicide note?
In this case, while the note by itself cannot be a decisive clincher for the allegations contained therein, the first step, (if anyone is interested in investigating the matter that is) is would be to prima facie establish the authenticity of the note. The note is reportedly signed by Kalikho Pul.
At the very minimum the authenticity of his signature can be easily established. The second step would be to begin investigation insofar as the allegations are concerned. For instance, the note talks about Pul having met x/y person at x/y Five Star Hotel, this can be easily verified by obtaining the CCTV footage of these hotels.
There are just examples and I’m giving them to counter a narrative which says merely because a sentence is written about someone somewhere does not mean that that an investigation should be commenced; especially when senior constitutional functionaries are involved.
Let me make this clear: the fact that today, all we have is a suicide note, is no bar against an investigation being launched. It would be incorrect for anyone to hold that an investigation cannot be commenced merely because there is nothing else, besides the suicide note.

SC Should Take the Lead
While it is important to understand, and discuss the evidentiary value of such a note in strictly legal-technical terms, in my opinion that in an ideal world, a world where the dignity of the highest court of the land was considered sacrosanct and precious, the Supreme Court would, especially in the facts of the case, take the lead in saying that to preserve this dignity we don’t need to wait for enquiries.
In an ideal world, the judges named would want to set extraordinary standards of probity and would resign or recuse from further judicial work. The Supreme Court will not be seen doing justice if all continues as usual despite the dark cloud of those allegations hanging over its head.
They would do this to uphold and practice the principle of natural justice that "Not only must Justice be done; it must also be seen to be done."
When the Lokpal ‘movement’ was at its peak, many people expressed concern, and said the authority of the parliament was being undermined. They said that populist sentiment and mobs should not be dictating the parliament.
Many lamented that if only people at large believed that the Parliament was doing its job and had faith; then maybe things would not have come to such a pass and would have urged elected representatives to reflect.
I say this with complete humility; perhaps there is a lesson in this for the judiciary as well.
(The writer is a lawyer practising in Delhi. This is an opinion piece and the views expressed above are the author’s own. The Quint neither endorses nor is responsible for the same.)

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 20 Feb 2017 21:45

Altamas Kabir named in late CM Pul's suicide note has died of heart attack yesterday in Kolkata.
May not be related but could be.

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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 25 Feb 2017 03:20

Received by email in response to.my post in GDF. Reply is valuable for everyone to see, hence posting here...
------
pardon the sm-esque abbreviations and jargons in this post...

saw ur post here...
viewtopic.php?p=2119764#p2119764
as much as i hate to put it in so many words.. yes tamland is a good precursor for AP... you are correct... the reasons i see for this are way 2 complicated...

but 2 b short... both societies r inherently casteist to the core... its not like KA or KL r saintly :))... its just that the rabid casteism is so beyond normal that only AP and tamland can beat each other up... take for example my caste... iyengars.. cargo cult morons :))... n i say that with a straight face... i hate my extended family members... 99% of em r the orthodox dbags... its not like eating chicken or beef or lamb or pork is a sign of modernity... its jus that they prefer ppl like their own set of dbags... that is despite growing up in the fricking 80s n 90s... like me... DESPITE that globalization, despite the possibility of seeing ppl of different ilks, they r sadly 10-20 years behind... they ll flock to do venkatesa thirukalyanam.. n end up talking gossip abt fellow fam members like no tomorrow, cheat if possible, speak ill of random idiots that they have no idea abt n so on...

n i do see the same kinda bs frm iyers.. a little less maybe.. the gounders... the nadars.. the vellalars... the saurashtrians... the mudaliars.. the chettiars.. u name it... when u give em options, they ll pick ppl like em... jus like their stupidity...

of course i ll pick loneliness :))... cos i m sick of morons in this world... but that may be jus me..

point being... despite all these "ills" n normal behavior... tamland is very fricking religious 2 the core... which is why the new converts flock 2 xtianity or islam like crazy morons... n yet they can bash up pappans or brahmins as they r called..
http://www.mayyam.com/phpBB2/viewtopic. ... f83bd452a1
n go 2 the very same temples where the very same pappans run priestly work n get vibhuthi or kumkumam n move on with life... they jus dont see the dichotomy in bashing up ppl n yet asking em 2 do their bidding :))...

u can see the brand of drama in AP... may be a little less.. may be a little more.. but i would guess its the same level...

casteism.. religious nuttiness.. good temples... rich temples... n ppl stealing the riches to enrichen their own families and then doing penance by donating gold thulabharam or whatever... n the same mindsets... movie madness etc...

for all that the telugu fanbois of the forum claim AP to be.. its not like tamland.. its not so casteist.. its very different.. it does nt have the dravidian anti-indian bs sentiments... it does nt have the same feelings for hindi as we tams have for hindi.. etc...

bottomline is that.. AP is just an ape-shit version of tamland starting frm the early 1900s.. first came the non brahmin awareness movement.. started off with a buncha tam folks frm mudaliars n chettiar community... funded by the ramnad raja...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanmugha ... Sethupathi
these guys went abt trying 2 uproot the so far status quo in terms of brahmin dominance of gumastha jobs... 2 b fairly honest, the brahmins who dominated the gumastha jobs were NOT saints.. nor were they all rosy red in the cheek beautiful paragons of virtue... they were the winners in the darwinesque world of the 1900s with limited opportunities.. n when openings came, they jumped ship... they were not in it for "india this, india that".. they were in it for the "me myself my life"... thats the overwhelming nature of life...

n i know that could feel a little personal.. but facts r essentially facts.. it was a dog-eat dog world... n some ppl won, some ppl lost.. n most of em who won were brahmins.. period... unless they were the landed gentry... that does nt mean that there were no brahmins who did nt suffer.. there were quite a few who suffered.. but thats like picking small stones in rice.. sad but thats the portrayal i get to see from what i read of life in the late 1800s n early 1900s... not for nothing did the mudaliars n chettiars take 2 arms... n then there was the 100s of years of pujari life... the only instance of seeing a brahmin was either at gumastha level or in a temple.. n both suck...

n anyway... these folks were joined by a few telugu folks.. some KA folks.. n some nair-waal :))..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T._M._Nair
He founded the Justice Party along with Theagaroya Chetty and C. Natesa Mudaliar.

sad to say it... but we have T. Nagar, pondy bazaar.. nadesan road.. but not till 2008 did we rename a road as nair road.. go figure.. we tams r fricking petty n i find it not amusing to state that... we ve thevar saalai.. we ve anna saalai.. we ve cv raman road... chevalier sivaji ganesan saalai... this that... we ll even have a rajnikanth saalai and a vijay saalai..

but we dont have a ramanujam road.. no anand road.. no nair road.. till 2008 n so on... for that matter.. we shd ask the many diff govts of india why playwrights, novelists, litterateurs, movie actors, n this that dominate the padma awards lists.. year n year n year over.. all except STEM ppl.. sad but thats india... india is a land of koothhadis, not scientists... if u know that tam word koothhadi, it jus means someone who puts a show... we love ppl who put a show... n we bring that everywhere.. even my company in the US is like that.. we ve bullshitters who climb faster... n real workers rot at the bottom... but yea that may b universal.. not tam or india specific...

thing is this... chettiars were the chettinaad rajas... mudaliars were more like the first citizens of a palayam... or a petty chieftain.. mudhal is first...
The surname is derived from the honorary title Mudali meaning a person of first rank in the Tamil Chola feudal society which was bestowed upon top-ranking bureaucratic officials and army commanders in medieval South India.[1]
n i donno what axe nair-waal had.. it may have had sth 2 do with the travancore raja or whatever it is...

but yea.. getting beaten up by the brits as second class citizens being erstwhile dominant citizenry mus have been insulting... not 2 worry, my periamma is married 2 a mudaliar guy, who i hate for many reasons.. but most important is that he is always nosey abt how much i earn :))... not jus me.. any1 for that matter... anyway...

n AP was no different... the very same justice party spread its wings to AP... but before one cud see it unfold as a pan-south indian movement, it got sucked into tam pride... n met with a huge boulder in the form of telugu pride... i dont blame telugus from having telugu pride.. its natural.. n i wud be sad if they did nt.. in fact, telugu pride should have been encouraged.. its like riding a tiger.. easy 2 climb.. hard 2 dismount...

n then some brahmin guy (i mean potti sriramulu n folks like him) had the idea of putting the telugu horse ahead :))... n that neatly rid the justice party movement frm under the rug... there u go.. thats the difference.. what started off as a nascent movement got spun off as 2 movements slightly independent of each other.. similar in spirit n development but acting n behaving like they r two separate beings.. no they were not... no they are not.. they are 2 faces of the same language bs... n we shd all like it... i do... n i m happy that telugus have their own state or two now... cos know what.. if they were a part of united tamland or madras province or whatever, that language wud be dead as a dodo...

u need "state patronage" 2 promote a common form of lingua franca... n i m sure there is a brahmin telugu.. a slightly variant dialect of the common telugu spoken on the street.. jus like there is a reddy baashai or a velama baashai... same for tams... of course.. if i wanna survive on the street, i ll use chaste madras tam starting with "othha"... thats how we roll... thats how i m sure telugus roll... u keep ur baashai inside ur agraharam or house n go with the flow outside... n that neat lingua franca comes frm state patronage which is directly or indirectly bestowed on popular propaganda media like movies, how ppl talk in interviews, what happens in newspapers n it need not be state ordered language reform... like we had in the 30s in tam...

anyway... point being AP copied... not like copying is a bad idea... copying is a skill 2... a fine skill actually.. as long as u do it well... AP copied some good ideas frm tamland.. n a lotta bad ideas... bad according 2 me... being right next 2 each other means ideas get copied... why we even copy silly ideas from punjabi into tam...

so what were copied... i can name a few... what became telugu self respect movement... atmagauravam as ntr called it... was a shittily stolen version of the tamlanders self respect movement... this pissing on other castes is a finely copied version of the tamland side but it cud be that both discovered it simultaneously.. :))... mania for the movie herrows n temples for the heroinettes are also copied versions :))... wanting 2 watch the hips of buxom ladies is another :))... movie istars taking 2 politics launching frm their hips reform movements frm their acting careers... punch dialog.. schadenfreudish comedy... historicals n mythologicals in the 40s thro 60s... sharing the same movie cast as well as technical ppl... followed by social dramas frm the 50s thro 70s... all were copycats... i dont blame copying... i m jus pointing out trends.. of course the telugu fanboi ll claim tams copied telugus... fat chance... madras was the principal movie making destination... n it was/is remained easier 2 access frm tamland side than frm AP side... all the backwater ppl of AP (remember hydrabad was the nizam hellhole then) took for ever 2 make it to madras.. it was/is a 6 hr train ride frm tiruchy or madurai.. 6 hrs up north frm madras, u might get guntur... thats access... thats what tyranny of geography means...

now they have rediscovered historicals in teluguland... n tamland has gone the way of crime thrillers, potboilers etc..... tamland is uniquely extra spatial... in the sense of clamoring for expats in MY, SL, burma, SPore, london, ca etc... telugu's extra spatial nature is mostly like "gimme madras, gimme ganjam, gimme yanam, gimme andaman"..

so what does tamland future foretell of AP... first what is tamland future...

there is a big vacuum in terms of pol space... what was a binary choice has now expanded... even my friend frm school seemed 2 be suggesting starting a party 2 fish in troubled waters :)).. n he asked me for a name.. i told him.. make it "mint money munnetra kazhagam"... m3k :))... sounds like a movie title n a good pol part-ay name... so yea.. we ve a vacuum... lotsa troubled ppl fishing in troubled waters including our overactor :))... i mean kamal if u did nt know that loser... n rinse n repeat superherrow (i mean vijay uncle)... rajni's days were over in the mid 90s.. he is too old 2 b cm.. his health does not permit... his liver is a disaster... he is not even a clean guy 2 start with...

thats where the vacuum is...

can bjp fill it.. of course not.. cos u need brains 2 fill a vacuum... these guys have a vacuum for a brain.. nice try... so who else...

we ve status quo frm the 2 percenters.. i mean pmk.. mdmk.. dmdk... muslim parties.. vck.. dp... so thats fubar.. doa... no one can win a pan tam vote... the only one left is dmk.. but those guys r losers.. if they had an election today, they ll win in a jiffy.. only cos there is vacuum...

the scope is there for aap... but problem is when u have a name called aam aadmi party n come 2 madras, ppl ll throw black paint at u.. literally.. no kidding.. n thats how it shd be... dont come here preaching 2 us abt aams n aadmis.. gtfo already... how diff is that frm bhaarathiya janatha katchi... bullshit... so they r not gonna start... so short of that, we ll ve a motley group of anti-corruption wannabes.. like this sagayam fellow.. devasahayam fellow... etc.. ppl who act like they r the best hope... but have an ax2grind... or nuke mama udhayakumar wanted to be that, but was firmly put in his place.. now he may jump a bit 1 or 2 leaps.. but thats that..

if admk under sasi n co manages 2 pull it off for 4 more years with not many disgusting corruption spectacles, in 2021, they ll still lose it... but wannab cm... for eternity.. or tamland's charles :))... i mean stalin thatha... ll still be the best bet then... despite all shenanigans frm mka or kani n the maarans... despite all that its his 2 lose.. n then he wants 2 plant herrow udhayanidhi as the next king in waiting n probably b not like his appa... i guess.. but who knows...

there is enuf vacuum for any determined bozo 2 hijack it... but 2 sustain n compete against dmk they ll need 2 play the aap type game of reluctant political suiciders :))... hard.. but not impossible...

we ve one vishal who has his eyes set on everything frm fefsi elections 2 tamland elections :))... or we cud ve ashwin find 234 idiots for us... who knows... or we have this rj balaji n raghava lawrence n co who r everywhere :))... but they r all small fry... for some1 2 become big, u need a riot... this jk shite was one.. but not big nuff... modi was not willing 2 suicide himself 2 make some herrow come outta zerrow.. anyway... so we need an issue... LTTE is done n dusted.. tam pride is done n dusted... jk is done n dusted... so whats left... some massive set of ppl dropping off dead n official apathy n lethargy.. what cud that be... no idea...

anyway the parallels r similar with AP... if CBN kicks the bucket... then u have nara lokesh... n his clones.. some drama that ll be... cos there ll always b bozos frm the ntr clan wanting 2 do lakshmi siva parvathi type drama... if jagan gets arrested in DA for a long time.. then u have jus akka sharmila-jaan who ll be sucking at this shite for a long time... if kcr kicks the bucket, he has a whole family 2 jump into the cm seat.. as far as TS goes, there seems 2 be someone 2 fight out... AIMIM ll just be a pest... 7 seats max... one MP seat at best... screw em... the rest of AP is there 2 run it to the ground... for AP... the vacuum is a real possibility... now who ll fill up is a good shite... cud be some movie herrow like prabhas who has sth 2 say on everything... diff is that tamland is in vacuum already... AP ll b there soon... so yea precursor whatever.. ....
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kiranA
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby kiranA » 25 Feb 2017 06:30

^^ Ramana, You really liked that long rambling incoherent post by someone who obviously thinks too high of himself ? I used to like your posts for their brevity.

ramana
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby ramana » 25 Feb 2017 12:19

I still like brevity.
Long rambling post has stuff in it.
If you see my post was two lines and triggered this.

Varoon Shekhar
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 26 Feb 2017 00:35

Sorry, don't know really where else to ask this, but can anyone state whether the public sector company Hindustan Machine Tools is still operating? I do know that the watch manufacturing division was shut down 2 or 3 years ago. HMT doesn't appear in any economic news reports, which doesn't mean it's still not around and functioning. But I am just wondering. It has contributed in the past to defense and space sectors.

pravula
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby pravula » 26 Feb 2017 01:28

Varoon Shekhar wrote:Sorry, don't know really where else to ask this, but can anyone state whether the public sector company Hindustan Machine Tools is still operating? I do know that the watch manufacturing division was shut down 2 or 3 years ago. HMT doesn't appear in any economic news reports, which doesn't mean it's still not around and functioning. But I am just wondering. It has contributed in the past to defense and space sectors.


http://www.hmtindia.com/

https://www.nseindia.com/companytracker ... ymbol=HMT#

There was an appointment of a director Feb 16, 2017. Very much alive.

Varoon Shekhar
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 26 Feb 2017 01:44

Cool, thanks! It was unfortunate what happened to the watch division, but the rest of the company is still going reasonably well, it appears.
But there's no question it has become very low profile, even more so than usual!

Sicanta
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Re: Indian Interests

Postby Sicanta » 02 Mar 2017 03:59

Why These Muslim Women, Survivors Of Triple Talaq, Went Over To The BJP

http://www.huffingtonpost.in/2017/02/28 ... mg00000001


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