Terrorist Islamic Republic of Pakistan (TSP): July 07, 2010

[bart]

^They were taken out by just 18 brave Paki Mongoose operatives.

[A_Gupta]

Madrassa math in the extreme.

http://arabnews.com/opinion/letters/article94021.ece

By ZAFAR RAJA, LONDON
Inexperienced PM

It is difficult to understand why British Prime Minister David Cameron said some totally incorrect things about Pakistan while he was in India.

Is it because he is a novice in international diplomacy? Pakistan has done so much for the war on terror, it has arrested more terrorists (17,000 in all) than any other country in the world. He should have praised rather than criticize a country that helped the UK find many terrorists on its soil.

The facts do not back up Cameron because since 9/11 and this crazy war on terror, Pakistan has suffered more deaths than any other country in the world — 2,15,672 civilians and 8,765 troops. NATO lost only 1,882 troops, 300 of them British. Pakistan has 140,000 troops on its western border against NATO’s 100,000.

[SSridhar]

. . . if MQM rakkit mards want to avenge this death who will be their immediate targets? Would like to know your take on the underlying politics.

The MQM have plenty of enemies, from the 'Establishment', to various political parties, to the Islamist parties such as JI and its offspring IJT, to Pashtun nationalists to the Taliban, to its own Haqiqi faction, to ordinary Sindhis, Balochis and Punjabis.

If one looks at the origins of the MQM, it was initially aligned with Jama'at-e-Islami until they fell out with them and there was such a bloodbath between the terrorist student wing of the JI, the Islami-Jamia'at-e-Tulaba (IJT) and the student wing of the mohajirs, All Party Mohajir Students Organization (APMSO). The MQM was then helped by Gen. Zia-ul-Haq to flourish in the expectation that PPP's dominance in the Sind will be dented by that, a decision Gen. Zia regretted later. After his death, Benazir Bhutto tormented MQM in both her terms as Prime Minister. Nawaz Sharif, for his part inflicted heavy damage on the MQM. The Army under Asif Janjua (who was Karachi Corps Commander and later became COAS), especially the Rangers, took a heavy toll of the MQM. The Pashtuns, for their part, have massacred the mohajirs too, with the Sohrab Goth incident of 1986 standing out. The ANP has been repeatedly warning the MQM of dire consequences ever since. Not that MQM was taking all these lying down. The MQM have never let a chance to harass the Pashtuns, go abegging. There is a huge Pashtun population in Karachi, the largest outside Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa. Many Pashtun areas are 'no-go areas' in Karachi, where drug and arms dealing on a huge scale take place. The MQM has been claiming in the last few years that the Taliban are living in these areas, which we know is true. But, that has inflamed both the Taliban and the nationalist ANP for different reasons. Though MQM has an uneasy alliance with the PPP and there are occasional vibes with PML-N, its worst enemy after the Pashtuns, the embers are all there. This shows the breadth of enemies that the MQM has earned for itself, any one of whom could target MQM.

This targetted killing has taken place in the Mohajir stronghold of Nazimabad. There are only two groups to suspect. This could be a Haqiqi attempt to settle old scores using the existing uncertain situation in Karachi these days. This could be a revenge killing for reasons that go back to the split in MQM. Or, there could be a Pashtun hand here as MQM itself claims. In the latter case, Rehman Malik's implication of SSP hand could be a political ploy to divert the attention to Shehbaz Sharif.

[Dilbu]

it has arrested more terrorists (17,000 in all) than any other country in the world

That is because your country has the most number of terrorists in the world. Other countries can arrest only those pakistanis who choose to visit their country.

[SSridhar]

SSP & TTP planned the murder: Rehman Malik

[SSridhar]

46 killed and 123 injured in Karachi violence

[Singha]

news.oneindia.in


Toronto
, Aug 3: Former Canadian diplomat to Kabul Chris Alexander had revealed another story about ISI that Pakistan's army chief, General Ashfaq Kayani prepared a plan to demolish the Indian consulates in Kabul.

Alexander stated that Kayani prepared to support suicide attacks also.


The Pakistani General has even told President Hamid Karzai that he can broker a peace deal with the Taliban, only if Indian consulates in Afghanistan are closed.

"Kayani is sponsoring a large-scale, covert guerrilla war through. His mission in Afghanistan is to keep Pashtun nationalism down and India out of Afghanistan," claimed Alexander.

Chris Alexander, was Canada's ambassador in Kabul from 2003 to 2005.

Later he became the deputy of the United Nations
(UN) mission until 2009.

He said the Pakistan Army's interference in Afghanistan violates the UN Charter and poses a threat to world peace.

[Philip]

Which is why I say that the GOI should demand that Kayani be arrested and tried in the Hague as a "war criminal",like other so-called war criminals from the Balkans have.The Canadian ambassador's words should be sent by the MEA to every nation,especially the US, that India has diplomatic relations with demanding action against the terrorist entity called Pak. As long as the US continues to allow its rent-boy to perpetrate every flithy trick in the book,the region will never find peace and the US will be complicit in all the diabolic actions of Pak,also rendering its leadership worthy of war crimes trials as an "agent provocateur".

[Kamboja]

Nation-wide Taqiya
http://changinguppakistan.wordpress.com ... -pew-poll/

The 2010 Pew Research poll found that Pakistanis overwhelmingly supported harsh punishments for various transgressions as prescribed in traditional Islam. C.H.U.P. attempts to find some nuance in the results.

I.M.O., this nuance-seeking mission creates more problems than it resolves.

In the case of the results generated in Pew’s Religion, Law, and Society section of the survey, respondents were asked black-and-white questions, like, “Do you favor or oppose making stoning people who commit adultery the law in Pakistan?” According to Moeed Yusuf, a South Asia Advisor at the U.S. Institute of Peace, much of the so-called “Muslim World” find it difficult to go against anything seen as ordained by Islam. He added, “At an abstract level, Islam remains important to even the most secular of Muslims — remember Islam is very candid about state and religion being an integrated whole (at least in the classic narrative) and so such questions would elicit such responses.”

When faced with a choice between what they are supposed to say and what they actually practice, respondents tend to match abstract questions with equally abstract answers. However, Yusuf noted, “Do they want to be flogged or stoned for the same sin? No way. What about their own family members? Most probably not.”

This is a very insightful post and article.

This is the big problem with Islam in particular and religion in general. Even relatively sane, decent, modern, liberal human beings who happen to be Muslim, when asked an 'abstract question' about whether they accept the Sharia punishments for crimes, feel compelled to respond that they support sharia law and the inhuman (by modern standards) punishments it recommends.

Now the interviewers in this survey stopped there, but in the hellholes of the Middle East and the Islamic World (including Pakistan), this question would be asked not by secular, harmless surveyors but by bloodthirsty medieval mullahs, and the context they would ask it is probably while administering a public stoning of some hapless woman for 'adultery' (read: gang-rape) or chopping off of some 'thief's' hand (read: serf refused to let feudal lord have his daughter for the night). The mullah probably asks this question a thousand times when some well-meaning, half-decent liberal type Muslim steps forward at these brutal occasions and asks if such brutality is really necessary.

That is when the Mullah will shriek 'ARE YOU A KAFFIR?!?!?!?! THIS IS PRESCRIBED IN HOLY QURAN!!!' and that stifles all further argument from the decent Muslim.

And that is the problem. That is why the Pew question was such a good one - because it gets to the heart of the matter. Do you, as a Muslim, have the courage to stand in support of basic decency and tolerance, or can you be overawed and cowed down by 'the holy book' written by a bunch of desert Arabs hundreds of years ago?

'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.' - Edmund Burke

And Islam forces good Muslims to do nothing in the face of evil. Ameen.

/rant

[Brad Goodman]

Pakistan's burning sense of injustice

A day later, on Saturday, Islamic fundamentalists burned effigies of David Cameron, but sources close to Mr Zardari said that he was the real target and suggested his own military had pulled the strings. "The ISI cancellation is a signal of their displeasure and that they do not want him [Zardari] to go," a friend of the president told The Daily Telegraph at the weekend. "The army sends these signals and then the demonstrators are on the streets."

"We're already overstretched. If we did [attack the Haqqani Network], we'd have a huge backlash and all militant groups would unite against us," says Lt Gen Talat Masood, a retired Pakistan army officer and now an influential analyst. "At least it's directed towards Afghanistan. If they cause trouble for us, we'll have no option but to go on a military option against them in North Waziristan. There's a difference of policy, not a double game."

[RamaY]

Which is why I say that the GOI should demand that Kayani be arrested and tried in the Hague as a "war criminal",like other so-called war criminals from the Balkans have.The Canadian ambassador's words should be sent by the MEA to every nation,especially the US, that India has diplomatic relations with demanding action against the terrorist entity called Pak. As long as the US continues to allow its rent-boy to perpetrate every flithy trick in the book,the region will never find peace and the US will be complicit in all the diabolic actions of Pak,also rendering its leadership worthy of war crimes trials as an "agent provocateur".

I think SMK should be given onlee this job and nothing else. Visit all 180+ nations in this world and meet the state heads to garner their support to try Kiyanahi and ISI chief as a war-criminals.

That should keep people on both sides of the border busy for a while

[RamaY]

And Islam forces good Muslims to do nothing in the face of evil. Ameen.

/rant

BRF is ahead of curve (we discussed this very point many moons ago)

[chetak]

I think SMK should be given onlee this job and nothing else. Visit all 180+ nations in this world and meet the state heads to garner their support to try Kiyanahi and ISI chief as a war-criminals.

That should keep people on both sides of the border busy for a while

This is far beyond the capabilities of this dear old geezer.

He has to design and get stitched 180+ new outfits??

[Prem]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/66ddeda4-9efe ... abdc0.html
Pakistan faces risk of further Wuddu

Relief agencies fear that the downhill movement of the water through river systems snaking into the eastern Punjab and southern Sindh provinces, where most of Pakistan’s people live, could combine with fresh downpours to worsen the devastation. They hope, however, that people will have time to move to higher ground, avoiding the rapid loss of life that hit the country last week.Waters were rising on Tuesday in parts of Punjab, Pakistan’s most populous province, which suffered an initial bout of flooding in late July. Estimates for the number of people forced from their homes in Punjab range from 180,000 to more than 800,000, illustrating the difficulty officials face in assessing the situation.Authorities are telling residents in the southern Sindh Province, home to Karachi, the commercial capital, to evacuate flood-prone areas. The Indus river has risen to its highest levels in more than a century, according to Pakistani media. Parts of Kashmir, the western Baluchistan province and Pakistan’s tribal belt have also been hit.Relief workers have mobilised a humanitarian infrastructure that was set up to cope with the affects of the fighting between Taliban insurgents and the army in north-west Pakistan, but do not have the same resources in place in other parts of the country.

The growing magnitude of the crisis is testing the resources of Pakistan’s military and its weak coalition government. Asif Ali Zardari, the country’s president, who began an official visit to the UK on Tuesday, has faced criticism from survivors who are still awaiting help. An outbreak of political violence that killed several dozen people in Karachi following the assassination of a prominent politician on Monday has added to his government’s woes.While boats and helicopters continue to ferry survivors to safety, attention is also turning to the potential long-term effects of the floods. Relief workers are trying to assess the extent of the damage to crops, fearing there could be a significant shortfall in the next harvest. Reports suggest that food prices have already soared by as much as 300 per cent in parts of the Swat Valley, among the worst hit areas.

[Lalmohan]

is it me, or is pakistan sounding as beset by calamities as bangladesh was in 1970-71?

[Brad Goodman]

And Islam forces good Muslims to do nothing in the face of evil. Ameen.

/rant

BRF is ahead of curve (we discussed this very point many moons ago)

That will be the biggest question we need to look into when we discuss how to manage pakistan's failure and how we can manage the mobs that will be marching towards our western borders.

[CRamS]

Pakistan's burning sense of injustice

"Pakistan is consumed with its hatred of India, it thinks of little else but India. But India thinks little about Pakistan at all.

Even a cricket ball bowled straight into Kiyani's crotch at 100+ mph would be painless compared with this hit . But for WKKs and RNIs, India can deliver this pain.

[CRamS]

is it me, or is pakistan sounding as beset by calamities as bangladesh was in 1970-71?

Not at all. I will say TSP is in trouble when GHG shows signs of nervousness. Right now DC is the trump card. They are keeping GHQ afloat. And GHQ has complete control.

[vijayk]

Pakistan's burning sense of injustice

With a sigh of sadness, a senior American diplomat of Pakistani origin explained the contrasting standpoints of the two countries viewed through Washington's eyes: "Pakistan is consumed with its hatred of India, it thinks of little else but India. But India thinks little about Pakistan at all. It's busy globalising, its companies are launching international takeovers," he said.

His point is borne out by the figures. Pakistan's economy is growing by 3.5 per cent a year, while India's is heading north to nine. Its oil and gas companies are buying up reserves all over the world, while its steelmakers, hoteliers and motor manufacturers are preparing for global domination.

My American friend also spoke with admiration of India's deep-rooted democracy, its secular society and its Bollywood film industry, which promotes films about religious tolerance and a corny kind of love. "India and America are so alike in so many ways," he said.

When I asked a senior Pakistani diplomat about this comment, he gave me a copy of Mohsin Hamid's short story The Reluctant Fundamentalist, a tale of a sinister chance meeting between a once-Westernised Pakistani seething with anger at US domination and an American businessman. His gift was offered by way of explanation of why so many Pakistanis hate America and its Western allies.

[sanjaykumar]

is it me, or is pakistan sounding as beset by calamities as bangladesh was in 1970-71?


Not only that but, looking at the telly, Pakistan looks just like Bangladesh. The people too look like Bangladeshis (not that there is anything wrong with that). Nudge, nudge, wink, wink.

[Brad Goodman]

Ashna in USA conducted by paki

Pakistani man charged with raping teen in US

[Karna_A]

And Islam forces good Muslims to do nothing in the face of evil. Ameen.

/rant

BRF is ahead of curve (we discussed this very point many moons ago)

There are a few muslims who have figured this out that "muslims, inspite of being basically good people are trapped by terrorist Islam ideology". Muslims are not a problem, but Islam is. One is Son of Hamas as below.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosab_Hassan_Yousef
http://www.sonofhamas.com/

As link by Ramana points out, the Islam and its teachings itself are suspect as they were all written 200 years after the fact. In fact, what is highly likely is Caliphs twisted the original teachings to give them an Arab imperial character.
http://forums.bharat-rakshak.com/viewto ... &start=480

What TSP is to figure out whether Abdul Sitar Edhi is true muslim or Tere Bin Laden and whether Abdus Salam knows more science than Mullah Omar.

[rgsrini]

deleted by moderator

[shynee]

Pakistan violence: Sparked by Karachi's 300th assassination this year

The murder of a Pakistani politician on Monday sparked deadly riots in Pakistan's southern port city of Karachi in which 35 people were killed and at least 80 wounded.

The death of Raza Haider, a member of parliament and senior leader of the secular Muttahida Qaumi Movement (MQM) party, is the latest and most high-profile in a series of political assassinations that have deepened ethnic tensions in Pakistan’s financial capital. Over 300 people have been assassinated for ethnic or political reasons in Karachi this year. But now, the government claims that militant groups are behind Haider's assassination.

That may be the case, but Pakistani society is seeing a growing degree of both religious and ethnic polarization. There have been attacks by militants on Sufi shrines in other parts of the country. And while retaliation has been limited so far, there were signs of further trouble in the overnight rioting. The MQM represents Karachi's majority Urdu-speaking population and are rivals for political leadership and land ownership with minority Pashtuns who have migrated from northwestern Pakistan seeking employment.

[Brad Goodman]

Problem is there is no room for introspection in Islamic society. So like all other humans muslims have a rational brain that tells them what is right and what is wrong what is relavant to current times and what is outdated but when they put on their islamic blinkers (especially when they are in group) there is no way they can refute anything written in holybook and this is where the clash of civilizations can find its root.

The problem actually increases exponetially with the amount of education the momeen carries and the distance between him and mecca. They live in this oxymoron where they want to migrate to west and at the same time hate west. They want to avoid shariah but at the same time advocate shariah. They want to their faith to be tolerated but at the same time cannot tolerate any other faith.

[CRamS]

"India and America are so alike in so many ways,"

At a universal level, we are all alike . But to suggest that India & US are so alike; this TSP RAPE must have spoken something potent, or maybe he was refering to the contempt both have for TSP.

If India and US are so alike, we wouldn't see the Indian conatainment policy thats in place right now.

[Brad Goodman]

"India and America are so alike in so many ways,"

At a universal level, we are all alike . But to suggest that India & US are so alike; this TSP RAPE must have spoken something potent, or maybe he was refering to the contempt both have for TSP.

If India and US are so alike, we wouldn't see the Indian conatainment policy thats in place right now.

I think the containment policy is a legacy from the cold war era. Guess like bureacracy anywhere in world the foggy bottom based babus are also slow to adjust to new realities that Thomas Friedman has written about. Perhaps they havent counted the number of Indian resturants in greater washington area to realize what happened post 1989. Also look at some other intitatives like Indian Ocean rim axis of democracy proposed by unkil or the nuke co-operation or now the whole technology barriers being lifted (least they are talking and we can see which way it goes during the november visit).

Expat NRI have done a great job of being great ambassadors for their motherland. Not just by showcasing their education but also being active in politics, media and other spheres of US society its just matter of time before this permeates all the way into foggy bottom.

[Karna_A]

The problem actually increases exponetially with the amount of education the momeen carries and the distance between him and mecca. They live in this oxymoron where they want to migrate to west and at the same time hate west. They want to avoid shariah but at the same time advocate shariah. They want to their faith to be tolerated but at the same time cannot tolerate any other faith.

Hinduism and Secularism are more like a Garland with different flowers all sewn together with a dharmic/constitutional law thread. Outwardly there is unit level distinction and lack of uniformity, but inwardly all have same soul and flow.

The distorted Islam which is nothing but Caliph Arab imperialism is like Charcoal where everything is burnt down and therefore there is an outward uniformity, but no inward soul or thread to bind all. TSP-BD, Iran-Iraq etc. are examples of that.

TSP is basically a burnt Garland, and since the common binding thread is all gone there is nothing to keep it together.
The efforts of TSPA to link all burnt charcoal into a presentable Garland using an anti-India rope, in a vain bid to copy India is hilarious at best and preposterous at worst.

[BijuShet]

TSP IT industry suffers another loss.
From The News : Foreign Ministry confirms arrest of Pakistani brothers in UAE

Tuesday, August 03, 2010 - By Jamal Khurshid - Karachi

The Foreign Ministry, while confirming the arrest of two Pakistani brothers, including cardiac specialist Dr Akmal Waheed by the UAE authorities, informed the Sindh High Court that the UAE government’s response with regard to the detention of Pakistani citizens was awaited.

“The Pakistan embassy has requested the UAE government to let it know the reasons of their arrest to provide them consular access and the response is awaited,” Director Foreign Affairs for Gulf Region told the Sindh High Court on Monday. The court was hearing the petition seeking safety and release of two Pakistani brothers from UAE intelligence custody.

Pakistani cardiac specialist Dr. Akmal Waheed and his brother Asad Waheed, who were performing professional duties at Medical Duty and Dental College, Raisul Khaima, UAE, for the last couple of years, have been detained by UAE intelligence agencies since April 4 along with their five other Pakistani colleagues.

Dr Akmal, earlier accused of having links with Al-Qaeda, attacking corps commander convoy in 2004 in Karachi and financially aiding and harbouring banned Jundullah activists but was cleared from all charges, had migrated to Raisul Khaima, UAE, along with his family for the purpose of employment and since then he was earning his livelihood by private employment at the hospital.

Detainees’ brother Ajmal Waheed submitted that his brothers along with other Pakistani citizens, including Dr. Ayaz, Faraz Nasir and Dr. Waseem, were detained by UAE authorities on April 4 and they were not produced before any court of law. The petitioner expressed apprehension of shifting of his brothers from UAE to Guantanamo Bay with the consent and permission of Pakistani government although they were not involved in any case. He submitted that the lives of the detainees were in danger and they could be tortured to death by the intelligence agencies of UAE and other countries having influence in the Gulf region, as there was no information regarding the whereabouts of the detainees.

He alleged that US intelligence agencies were bent upon taking the custody of Dr. Akmal Waheed, who had provided medical treatment to Afghan war victims after US and NATO forces invaded Afghanistan in 2001. {Link in my next post indicates that these 2 had a brother who was a Kidney specialist who provided his services to taliban escaping bombing in Afghanistan and we know that OBL needs regular services of a kidney specialist.}

Filing comments on the petition, Director Foreign Affairs for Gulf Region Dr. Abdul Malik submitted that UAE government has been approached by the Pakistan Embassy in UAE regarding the arrest of Dr. Akmal Waheed and others who were picked from Raisul Khaima. He said that the foreign ministry had instructed the embassy in UAE to ascertain the facts about their detention and to get consular access and inform the ministry accordingly, adding that the diplomatic mission has been in correspondence and actively pursuing the case with the UAE government to know the reasons about the detention of the Pakistani citizens and make arrangements for their release.

Petitioner’s counsel Shaukat Hayat and Mohammad Farooq said that Consulate General of UAE was also made respondent in the petition for the court’s direction to ensure safety and well-being of the Pakistani citizens and furnish all record and charges of detention before the court, however, the comments were not yet filed. After taking the comments on record, the court adjourned the hearing as the response from the UAE government regarding the detention of the petitioner’s brothers was awaited.

[BijuShet]

From The News dated 03/23/2008

Dr Arshad Waheed killed in Wana

Sunday, March 23, 2008 - By Jamal Khurshid

KARACHI: Karachi-based Dr Arshad Waheed, who was running a clinic in Wana, was identified as one of the victims of an alleged US missile attack on a house sheltering militants in Wana on March 16.

Dr Arshad Waheed, a kidney specialist of the Jinnah Hospital, had shifted to Wana with his family, following his acquittal by court of law on charges of attack on the convoy of the Karachi corps commander and a Rangers van and harbouring and training al-Qaeda and Jundullah activists, providing them funds and medical treatment, sources said. When contacted, the sister-in-law of Dr Arshad, who is residing in Karachi, said she had received the information regarding his death in a “US attack”. She added that his family, however, was safe. Sources said Dr Arshad was living in Wana, providing medical treatment to the people affected in the ongoing battle between the security forces and the militants there. The sources added that Dr Arshad was out of contact with his family members.

The name of Dr Arshad, along with his brother Dr Akmal Waheed, a cardiac specialist of the National Institute of Cardiovascular Diseases, appeared in the media following their mysterious disappearance on June 17, 2004 in Karachi as then federal Information Minister Sheikh Rasheed Ahmed in his reported statement accused them of involvement in the corps commander convoy attack case and facilitating the militants in Wana.

From The Daily Times (the article dated 06/11/2004 on the attack on the convoy of the Karachi corps commander )
Karachi corps commander survives attack

* Six soldiers, three policemen, one bystander dead
* Musharraf and Jamali express outrage over incident

By Hasan Mansoor and Intikhab Ali

KARACHI: Seven Pakistan Army soldiers, three policemen and a bystander were killed when unidentified people ambushed the Karachi corps commander’s motorcade near Clifton Bridge, military and police officials said on Thursday.

“At least six soldiers were killed in the ambush. Some policemen and a pedestrian were also killed,” Inter-Services Public Relations Director General Maj Gen Shaukat Sultan told Daily Times.

City police chief Tariq Jamil confirmed the death of three policemen and a pedestrian in the attack. Two of the policemen were identified as Sub-Inspector Hasan Asghar and Head Constable Mohammad Nazeer.

An attempt to assassinate President Pervez Musharraf, reported in April 2002, failed when an explosive-laden car en route President Musharraf’s motorcade did not explode. Officials said Corps Commander Lt Gen Ahsan Saleem Hayat left his Bath Island residence for Corps House at about 8:40am and unidentified people ambushed the convoy when it neared Clifton Bridge at about 8:45am.

Witnesses said seven to eight gunmen in a 16-seater Toyota Hiace van ambushed the motorcade with automatic weapons.

“The firing was very intense and lasted for at least 10 minutes,” a witness said.
...

[jrjrao]

x-post:

Here is a Paki in a Paki national daily, explicitly threatening the world with Paki JDAM attacks:

Pak bashing or resuscitating war economy
by
Dr Jassim Taqui Deputy Editor
http://pakobserver.net/detailnews.asp?id=44899

An intense anti-Pakistan campaign continues in the Western media. All and sundry erupted to put the blame on Pakistan to justify 9 years of US and NATO failure in Afghanistan...
...
...
The WWII ended with US use of nuclear bombs against the civilians in Japan. The ongoing war against the Muslims is producing evil. It is creating suicide bombers, despair and even rejection of life. The mighty Western powers and their allies should beware huge number of suppressed people. They should realize that the waves of evil could not spare them if they continue killing innocent civilians under one pretext or another. This is not 1945. This is an era of proliferation of mass destruction weapons. Desperate players might resort to desperate measures. Reaction could come in a massive way that would endanger the survivor of human race.

[Prem]

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/fra ... akistan-us
France Takes Harder Line on Pakistan Than U.S.

The government of France is joining Britain in taking a tough stand on Pakistan for its double-dealing with the Taliban in Afghanistan. From Reuters:

French officials have said little in public about the WikiLeaks reports but the Foreign Ministry said President Asif Ali Zardari's visit would allow Paris to "tackle questions of security and the fight against terrorism, the regional situation, as well as economic cooperation" with Pakistan."We have to hope that President Sarkozy will talk about the Afghan question," said Christophe Jaffrelot, senior research fellow at the Centre for International Studies and Research at the Sciences Po institute in Paris."Pakistan has two sides to it, which sometimes puts our troops in danger," he told France Info radio. "Objectively, it is our ally. All our reinforcements pass through there but at the same time it uses all the resources from the West to conduct its own policies and back Islamic groups, including the Afghan Taliban."

[RamaY]

Bijushet ji

Are you saying Dr Arshad Waheed was killed on 3/23/2008 in Wana,Pakistan and later got arrested on 8/3/2010 in UAE?

Cool. This way one can only guess where the Rambo (Mehsud) of TTP will show his face.

[Brad Goodman]

If France and UK are serious about squeezing Pakis there is no point in ambushing poor Zardari who went there for a pleasure trip. They need to get Kayani and do the fire drill.

[Carl_T]

Problem is there is no room for introspection in Islamic society. So like all other humans muslims have a rational brain that tells them what is right and what is wrong what is relavant to current times and what is outdated but when they put on their islamic blinkers (especially when they are in group) there is no way they can refute anything written in holybook and this is where the clash of civilizations can find its root.

On this forum we talk about the Arabization of Pakistan being a reaction against a Hindu "other". However, I think a big part of the conflict is between Persian Islam and Arab Islam. Islam in the subcontinent has historically been the Persian reconstruction of the Arab religion, accompanied with the spread of Persian culture and language, and the use of pre-Islamic persian terms for religious purposes. However in the last few decades, as we know on BRF, due to cash flowing in, the movement to Arabize the religion and culture has taken hold. Part of that Arabization is the idea of going back to 7th century Arab customs, eg. from Khuda to Allah. We see the same conflict in places like Indonesia with confrontation between Arab and indigenous constructions of Islam. I believe that is a big source of the problem and that's where the idea of "not refuting what the book says" comes from.


Nations like Turkey, Iran, and Indonesia have indigenous constructions of Islam and strong national identities, whereas Pakistan has neither, so I don't think the same rules work for them as they work for Pakistan.

[BijuShet]

RamaYji, Dr Arshad Waheed was dispatched to meet his 72 on 3/23/2008 in Wana,Pakistan by Unkil using TSP's national bird.

Arshad, Akmal and Asad Waheed are brothers. Arshad is already dead where as Akmal (cardiac surgeon) and Asad had relocated to UAE to escape the wrath of Unkil and TSPian Army. It seems in April this year Akmal and Asad were picked by UAE intelligence and held in captivity for 3 months before formal acknowledgement to Govt of TSP by UAE. Allegations are being made that these arrests were done on behalf of unkil and that these 2 remaining brothers may get sent to Guantanamo. It is also being alleged that TSP govt is playing along as these 2 have been fingured before in several terror incidents.

[abhishek_sharma]

Obama, Cameron jointly scripted pincer attack on Pak?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 254005.cms

[Prem]

If France and UK are serious about squeezing Pakis there is no point in ambushing poor Zardari who went there for a pleasure trip. They need to get Kayani and do the fire drill.

Mirage upgrade deal with high $ value was exactly for the similar benign purpose to help IN track Agostas on real time basis. Poaks karma will keep coming back bitting their butt. Poaks fast becoming one legged stool and one right kick will flipp them over.

[svinayak]

Obama, Cameron jointly scripted pincer attack on Pak?

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 254005.cms

Because they had nudged MMS and Indian govt to go for peace talk even when they know that Kiyani would cut down the talk humiliating India. To prevent backlash on Indian govt they had to take corrective measure pretending to get angry. Only if action on the ground is taken it can be seen that they are serious

[svinayak]

With a sigh of sadness, a senior American diplomat of Pakistani origin explained the contrasting standpoints of the two countries viewed through Washington's eyes: "Pakistan is consumed with its hatred of India, it thinks of little else but India. But India thinks little about Pakistan at all. It's busy globalising, its companies are launching international takeovers," he said.

His point is borne out by the figures. Pakistan's economy is growing by 3.5 per cent a year, while India's is heading north to nine. Its oil and gas companies are buying up reserves all over the world, while its steelmakers, hoteliers and motor manufacturers are preparing for global domination.

My American friend also spoke with admiration of India's deep-rooted democracy, its secular society and its Bollywood film industry, which promotes films about religious tolerance and a corny kind of love. "India and America are so alike in so many ways," he said.

When I asked a senior Pakistani diplomat about this comment, he gave me a copy of Mohsin Hamid's short story The Reluctant Fundamentalist, a tale of a sinister chance meeting between a once-Westernised Pakistani seething with anger at US domination and an American businessman. His gift was offered by way of explanation of why so many Pakistanis hate America and its Western allies.

This American observation of looking at Pakistan whenever they talk about India is fascinating. They cannot take an independent view of India alone for its culture and presence.
Some Americans I have interacted show fear of the hatred by Pakistan of Indians.