J & K news and discussion

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Muppalla
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Muppalla »

V_Raman,

There is no KM perception etc. Of the valley KMs, 90% ( I don't know and I may be conservative and leaving 10% as semi-good) of them are bloody scoundrels living on hafta. As Jamwal wrote in one of his posts, they throw stones, blackmail and collect hafta from all to live with warmth during winter. They do not work and may be earning more than the Banglore's ITVT crowd. Analyzing their psyche, alienation factors, mindset, their perceptions etc., are useless activities.

What is needed is just strong arm tactics and be firm with no carrots. Just sticks onlee but with a plan and strategy.
saket
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by saket »

BJP should boycott OA from now on.
Sidhant
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Sidhant »

ramana wrote:Guys today is 61st Republic Day for India. Lets not get divided today.
So request a one day moratarium in this thread.

Thanks,

ramana

PS: I can lock it but want to see who will not heed this appeal.
Agreed Sir, happy republic day to all. May India reach the pinnacle of its potential and keep always prospering. Jai hind!!
ramana
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

Rahul_M :(
SwamyG
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by SwamyG »

vina wrote: Suppose you were a party with a history of homophobic baiting and violent attacks and murders against Gays, Lxsbians and Transgenders, and also have an agenda of anti abortion /burning such clinics , because your church and "God" say so, and on July 4th you want to show up at the heavily gay Castro District with a 10,000 strong crowd with blaring loudspeakers and hailers and play out the rants from that go forth from the bully pulpit of your church about "damnation and hellfire" for "sinners", and want to plant the Stars and Stripes right on top of the hill in Castro District and shut down the place for a day ,chances are that the city is not going to let you hold that march if you insist that it is precisely on the doorstep of SF Gay& Lxsbian association and nowhere else "Jhanda wahin pehalayenge" will you fly that flag, and if at all they allow you, you will probably be directed to do it elsewhere.
And that is your opinion of BJP :mrgreen: ? Wow.
amdavadi
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by amdavadi »

we need million flag march in JK....lets see what OA can do
Karan M
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Karan M »

somnath wrote:I have my location on my profile (unlike many people on this group) because I didnt think it was a big deal..But that is completely irrelevant to a discussion - we are not discussing personal "social positions" here...
It is relevant because of your hilariously patronizing posts which then meander you into talking of strategery and this and that and that about millions of lives being effected, patriotic flag waving Indians being affected etc...its a bit too funny! You were talking of flag waving & patriotism while you were busy venting on the forum, not even away at some keypad at a flag raising event in Singapore. If you can't see how ridiculous your own position is, its really too funny!
As far as lives being affected is concerned, spare me the hypocrisy.
Boss, hypocrisy is "your" - watchword. You posture as an expert on everything from morality, politics, to procurement, to strategy to what India should & should not do...based on literally nothing, in argument after argument you make such phenomenal bloopers that it is obvious to anyone in that particular area of interest...but even that apart, in this particular case, you raised this idiotic claim of lives being effected without even being subject to any of the constraints, that is hypocrisy of the highest order.
.usually urban India isnt touched..But when Shiv Sena goes on its "nationalistic" tirades in Mumbai, you should ask the Mumbaikars(as I have been for many years), or when CPM/Mamta does the ideological things in Cal (as I have been for many years as well)..Or the residents of Hubli during the last "nationalist" flag waving...
Oh so suddenly you are a member of urban India now & are affected & were you at Hubli as well to have your idyllic life affected? Are you in India now to see that this is a nationalistic tirade akin to what the Shiv Sena does in Mumbai and is affecting peoples lives? Boss - wakey wakey, you are in Singapore. You are not affected. And comparing whats happening now to disparate cherry picked incidents in the past does not work.
Non sequitor..Given the security situation in Kashmir, professional advice of those who are in charge of the security has to be given weightage..
LOL, and as and when it suits you that professional advice or professional opinions conveyed by those who wore the uniform is to be discarded, right? Spare me the weightage business - we aren't exactly spring chickens here who need you to interpret events from us viz security & other issues. So when folks were talking of operational advantages viz their duty and basing requirements - ignore them, including fellow Mumbaikars who were not too kind to you as far as I remember. Boss, lets rephrase this: "who agrees with Somnaths prejudices = professional advice". Rest - raging nationalist fundoos not of civil society!! :rotfl:
You might argue that the political gain outweigh mundane security concerns (and it is a valid line of reasoning), but in this case the political gains are far from clear...Barring for the Congress, which gets a respite from scams, or the Hurriyat, that gets some more oxygen of publicity, or for the BJP, which presumably gets some more hindu votes!
Actually I would'nt argue anything on the lines of what you have said. Because what I have already said, expresses my position fairly clear about the overt message the BJP has sent out via its actions to a bunch of people who were busy trying to redefine the J&K status quo. Which message needn't have been sent if the Center had done its job.

But somehow, you are fixated only on pinning this to pure politics as it suits your POV, which is why ultimately, its hard to treat you as a credible commentator, given that your ideological position is so fixed..
so you got faxes/emails from the entire middle class of India telling you that?
LOL, speaks a lot about the world you inhabit - faxes/emails indeed! What next, did I set up a e-conference discussing the same? Has it struck you that people in the middle class or even lower middle class, in an active environment have far more leeway to interact with real breathing human beings & understand whats going on (as versus read what Waah Waah said on Waah Waah blog)
I could ask the same question of you as well, no? Since when did YOU have the "pulse" of the middle class? Or the "nationalists"? What makes YOU a representative sample?
LOL, seriously, the difference is I am not claiming I speak for ALL of India. I clearly don't. But I do know as the largest opposition party the BJP speaks for many & in this one case, given MY experiences over the past 8 years of the current dispensations (mis)rule, there is a lot of support for this particular case. The difference between you & I, is that I don't couch my statements in the garb of "unfortunately high politics does not work this way" - gimme a break, man.

If you spoke some gobbledegook about interest rates, hedge funds - I'd take your word over that of the RM from a local finance firm. But as for the rest, I just have to laugh at your statements and how (somehow) pompous & prescriptive you make them.

this isnt..But this didnt HAVE to be even a footnote..Irrelevance is the biggest (political) poison of any insurgency....the military battle in Kashmir has been largely won, even if not fully
Boss, you are really talking out of your hat here. Irrelevance? Hardly - the stone pelting just demonstrated that the battle in Kashmir is NOT won & the separatists still need to be shown their place. The military battle- won? Only because the Pakistanis are not willing to go back to the level of the 90's thanks to US pressure. If not, all gloves are off. I'm really not interested in talking more on this point, you can keep doing internet reading if you wish, & it may well have the details.
...the political battle has not been, probably wont be for some time..But sheer irrelevance will get more and more of the separatists to either fade away or join the mainstream...Its already happening in some shapes and forms, incipiently..giving such free oxygen from time to time only hlep the insurgency keep breathing...
Sorry, thats just naivete there. The insurgents will NEVER join the mainstream as long as it is financially and socially acceptable for them, thanks to misguided beliefs such as those you expressed - which allow them to be violent, display overt anti-national tendencies and commit anti-India activities without any fear of censure or political disapproval. They are in the best position.

All they can see is a soft hand, and media/vested interests lead them to believe the more they revolt, the more they can seize the moment and do what they will. In contrast, a much more open system of carrots and sticks, with the latter being integral will quickly make the sane ones realize:
1. There is no getting away from India
2. Indians will not allow it
3. Make what you can of the situation
4. Go up against the Indian state, and you lose, repeatedly.
5. Make the local economy robust, kick out all the dynastic dunces, and use ample funding for propaganda to contrast the local fair deal versus the cr@p going on in AK

Thats it. No interlocution. No keeping secessionists in 5 star luxury on Govt money.
Dilbu
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Dilbu »

Did CRPF hoist the flag finally? Are there any pictures available?
KLNMurthy
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by KLNMurthy »

somnath wrote: ...
Unfortunately high politics is not played in a fashion "you think" is right or wrong...Media, international reactions play defining roles...Why do these morons organise shipping trips to Gaza? Why did they organise stone pelting in such a large scale? the national flag will be hoisted in Srinagar today..But the tamasha of the yatra will mean sundry media outlets and governments will start pontificating on the dipute..You have jut handed another (brownie or otherwise) point to Pakistan...
So your strategy is to hide the flag in the closet, if we bring it out it will give the Pakis a chance to, what, ridicule us for having our own flag?

Is it possible to debate this issue on the basis of the values the flag stands for and the morality of locking the flag in a closet, without resorting to parading big-big people who may have the same opinion as you? Or is it your position that we should sheepishly take our lead on matters of our nationhood from you and the army chief, and just shove our feelings for the flag in the same closet where you shoved the flag?

I don't know what makes me feel more disgusted, the yawning void of values you are exhibiting, or your supercilious do-you-know-who-you-are-opposing tone. Talk of stalinism and feudalism in unholy wedlock!
ramana
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

i guess I need to lock the thread for our folks cant read!

Can be opened on 27 Jan.2011
munna
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

BJP to move court against Omar on R Day detention?

So it ends and thus it begins!
The BJP may move the courts against what it calls "illegal detention" of their senior leaders by the Omar Abdullah government to thwart its yatra to hoist the tricolour in Srinagar. Party leaders said they saw sufficient grounds for challenging the state government's actions in curbing the related stories

<snip>

Sushma Swaraj, Arun Jaitley arrested movement of leaders and their forced externment ahead of the Republic Day.
As soon as Arun Jaitely and Sushma Swaraj, Leaders of Opposition in Parliament, and yuva morcha head Anurag Thakur landed in the capital after their release from the state, top BJP leaders led by L K Advani, Murli Manohar Joshi and Rajnath Singh felicitated them and other BJP workers who made the yatra a "success".

Addressing them, Jaitley said every action of the state government was likely to be held illegal by the courts. "Whether it was our detention at Jammu airport and externment to Punjab on Monday or subsequent arrest and detention in Kathua the next day, they are illegal acts before the law," he said.

<snip>

Jaitley said though the yatra was over, the debate on the state's integration had commenced.
For people who do not realize there are substantive questions of law/ constitutional precedent involved in a chain of orders made by the government and the execution by babooz/thullas (learn some civility fellas). Just like the RJB verdict where liberatti gang could not fathom why they had their proverbial behinds whipped in courts, actually if argued well the gobermint actions may very well be ultra vires of basic structure of constitution in a lot of instances. Remember Indira Gandhi was brought down by an innocuous looking electoral fraud case so do not underestimate the impact of legal bungling by sarkar.

A few important ones are as follows:

1) Can a state government without judicial orders debar and deport a union cabinet minister level functionary? Especially when they were not more than 3 in a group? How will they justify it especially when 144 is merely law and order act and not a political emergency?

2) Is a DM allowed to snatch items on person of a Cabinet rank leader of opposition? If so under what sanction and section of law? Can BJP ruled states debar a Union Minister under similar pretext? Is it constitutionally valid?

3) What constitues a "severe disruption or disturbance" to law and order so much so that it enable cessation of all legitimate political activity in state? Can Union Cabinet debar political activity in other parts of India a la "return of train" based upon 144 in one state? Is 144 = political emergency now?

4) MPs of India are provided with extra protection to their "freedom of speech" in fact they can get away with way more than an ordinary man. This was done to protect and endure dissidence within the nation. What are implications of snatching Mrs Swaraj'a phone? Is DM and JKP guilty of breach of parliamentary privileges?

5) Were the IAS and IPS following their All India Service rules while carrying out political orders while in executive capacity? If not then DG JKP and CS J&K should be made parties to the issue.

The J&K tamasha by Badi and Choti Sarkar is a veritable pandora's box. I repeat my point of view they should not have done it. Esepcially babooz should just stay away from all of this. See ya in courts......
ramana
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

Munna, Were any people arrested from Lal Chowk area? heard about one person Mr Reddy.
-----------------

Activists arrested in Srinagar
A number of Bharatiya Janata Party activists and leaders of separatist groups including the Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front were arrested on Wednesday for violating prohibitory orders.

At least 16 separatist leaders, including JKLF chairman Mohammad Yasin Malik, were arrested as they tried to march towards the Lal Chowk in Srinagar to hoist the party flag on Clock Tower.

“Malik and other leaders including Bilal Gani Lone and Shahidul Islam of (moderate) Hurriyat Conference were arrested as they were marching towards Lal Chowk,” a spokesman of the JKLF told PTI.

He said the separatist leaders started the march from Maisuma locality towards Lal Chowk around noon.

Police intercepted the leaders and took them into custody.

Mr. Malik, Mr. Lone and several other separatists had gone into hiding over the weekend as they apprehended arrest by police to foil their ‘Lal Chowk chalo’ march.

The JKLF chairman had called for the march to Clock Tower to counter the BJP’s plan to hoist the National Flag.

The State government made unprecedented security arrangements to foil their plans.

Earlier in the day, a BJP supporter appeared at Regal Chowk, less than 100 yards from Clock Tower at Lal Chowk, carrying a National Flag, officials said.

Srikant, a resident of Gurgaon in Haryana, was apprehended before he could make his way to the venue for hoisting the flag and was taken to Kothibagh police station
.

Six other BJP activists were arrested near a hotel here for violating prohibitory orders, the officials said.

All of them were from outside the State. They have been identified as K.M. Reddy (Bangalore), S. Varman (Assam), S. Bose (Kolkata), B Bakshipatra (Orrisa), Rajesh Chaudhry (Lucknow) and Sresh Wadia (Gujarat).

In a late night swoop, police had rounded up at least 16 activists of BJP from Rajbagh and Jawahar Nagar areas of the city as they were reportedly planning to march towards Lal Chowk.

Some more BJP activists and leaders, including three MLAs of the party, were arrested in the run up to the Republic Day celebrations since last Saturday.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

ramana wrote:Munna, Were any people arrested from Lal Chowk area? heard about one person from Andhra Pradesh
Well as per party worker claims there were about 100-200 workers in Srinagar who escaped arrest prior to 26th Jan. 20-40 people made a final bid and got to the Lal Chowk area, they were arrested and bashed up badly. Some unconfirmed reports of broken bones and real hard thrashings. Are they trying to create new Lala Lajpat Rais?
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

X-posting from Yatra thread in GD Forums
SwamyG wrote:There is a lot to that photo of Anurag, Arun and Sushma. I wrote couple of lines @ IF :-)
Something funny for you SwamyG and others, the original report is Hindi hence translating. We all know that Anurag Thakur is son of Himachal CM prof. PK Dhumal but it is interesting to note that he is chief of HPCA and the man responsible for construction of that beautiful stadium at Dharamsala!

The following incident is sourced from people at the scene and newspapers!

It so happenes that Mr Thakur has a house in Jalandhar, Punjab and INC wanted to get even with him and "teach" him a lesson in patriotism. Mr Ravneet Bittu an INC MP and Youth Congress Leader of Punjab gathered a crowd and led his own Tiranga Yatra to Mr Thakur's house. Brushing aside all reservations and pleas by the caretaker to not enter the house Mr Bittu and his supporters destroyed the home owner's lawn and dug the flagpole right in the middle of it. Well after the pole was up and flag unfurled, the owner of the house turned up. In a major-major faux pas INC crowd had entered the wrong house and destroyed some one's lawn, finally one BJP wala :rotfl: turned up and led them to right house :lol:

Mr Bittu and his partymen were welcomed with sweets and juices and joined by BJP mayor of Jalandhar + Anurag's chachaji to jointly unfurl the flag at Mr Thakur's house, meanwhile the other home owner could barely hide his laughter at the "other yuva" leaders on a Tiranga march.

Dainik Jagran
तिरंगे पर राजनीति में गांधीगिरी

कार्यालय संवाददाता, जालंधर : भाजपा की तिरंगा यात्रा पर पंजाब युवा कांग्रेस ने भी नाटक खेला, लेकिन भाजपा के मेयर राकेश राठौर की गांधीगिरी ने कांग्रेस के मनसूबों पर पानी फेर दिया। मंगलवार को जिस समय भाजयुमों के राष्ट्रीय अध्यक्ष व सांसद अनुराग ठाकुर जम्मू की तरफ तिरंगा लेकर बढ़ रहे थे, जालंधर में युवा कांग्रेस प्रधान व सांसद रवनीत बिट्टू उनके (अनुराग ठाकुर) के घर तिरंगा फहराने के लिए बढ़ रहे थे, लेकिन रिश्ते में अनुराग ठाकुर के चचेरे भाई व मेयर राकेश राठौर की गांधीगिरी ने युवा कांग्रेस के मनसूबों पर पानी फेर दिया। इस नाटक की समाप्ति एक दूसरे को पिन्नी (मिठाई) खिलाकर हुई। तिरंगे पर इस तरह की राजनीति की किसी को उम्मीद नहीं थी। पहले से ही तय था कि जम्मू-कश्मीर सरकार भाजयुमो के तिरंगा अभियान को प्रदेश में घुसने नहीं देगी। इसी दरम्यान यूथ कांग्रेस के प्रदेश प्रधान रवनीत बिट्टू अपने युवा कार्यकर्ताओं के साथ जालंधर-फगवाड़ा मार्ग पर इकट्ठे हुए। उनका उद्देश्य अनुराग ठाकुर के बडिंग गांव स्थित घर पर तिरंगा फहराने का था। पुलिस, अनुराग ठाकुर के चचेरे भाई व मेयर राकेश राठौर और चाचा रूप सिंह धूमल को भी को इसकी जानकारी मिल चुकी थी। वे भी वहां पहुंच गए। खास बात यह थी कि मेयर (BJP) हाथ में मिठाई की डिब्बा लेकर गेट पर खड़े हो गए। (this gentle sparring is what I am talking about) साथ ही उन्होंने पुलिस अधिकारियों से भी कह दिया कि किसी को रोका न जाए। इस दरम्यान अपने दलबल के साथ आ रहे सांसद रवनीत बिट्टू को पुलिस अधिकारी सतिंदर सिंह ने रोक लिया और कहा कि झंडा फहराने सिर्फ चार-पांच कार्यकर्ताओं को लेकर जाएं। बिट्टू पुलिस अधिकारी की बात को मान गए और अपने साथ दिनेश ढल्ल, कमलजीत कौर मुल्तानी व दो-तीन अन्य कार्यकर्ताओं को लेकर अंदर पहुंचे। जब बिट्टू वहां पहुंचे तो मेयर राकेश राठौर और उनके परिजन मिठाई लेकर उनके स्वागत में खड़े थे। यह देखकर बिट्टू दंग रह गए। मेयर ने कहा कि आप लोगों का स्वागत है और प्रेम से झंडा फहराए। :D अनुराग ठाकुर के घर में खुशी के माहौल में बिट्टू ने अपने समर्थकों व मेयर राकेश राठौर के साथ मिलकर झंडा फहराने की रस्म पूरी की और वहां से चलते बने। यूथ कांग्रेस के प्रधान व सांसद रवनीत सिंह बिट्टू ने कहा कि जम्मू-कश्मीर का माहौल पहले से ही काफी बिगड़ा हुआ है। लाल चौक पर झंडा फहराने की घोषणा से वहां का माहौल और खराब हो गया है। उन्होंने कहा कि उनका मकसद किसी को नीचा दिखाना नहीं है।
ramana
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

A lot of legal boundaries were breached without due process.
Livid Jaitley, Swaraj allege state hijacking, abductionJanuary 26, 2011 11:48:03 PM

IANS | Jammu

The BJP on Wednesday accused the central and the state governments of "hijacking and abducting" its top leaders to foil the party's "Ekta Yatra" (integration march).

Arun Jaitley and Sushma Swaraj, opposition leaders in the Rajya Sabha and the Lok Sabha respectively, levelled the charges against the Congress-led United Progressive Alliance (UPA) government at the centre and the Omar Abdullah government in Jammu and Kashmir at a press conference here.

Jaitley and Swaraj arrived here after being released earlier in the day from the hotel in Kathua, 85 km south of Jammu, where they were lodged after their arrest Tuesday.

Jaitley said that the "fight is not over, it will continue, and the government of India, the ministry of home affairs, railways and Jammu and Kashmir will have to explain their actions."

He said the trains they were travelling on were detached. "This is called hijacking."

"We three (Jaitley, Swaraj and Ananth Kumar) were forcibly lifted and taken to Punjab Monday night. This action is illegal as there is no legal validity of such actions. In simple words, it is an act of abduction committed by the state."

He said this has happened for the first time since 1947 when the people have been arrested for carrying national flag and entering Jammu and Kashmir.

{ A little overboard. The action was for entering J&K which is a sensitive area!}

Jaitley also said that both the central and the state governments did so with an "objective of pleasing separatists. The state has ideologically and psychologically surrendered before the separatist."

Jaitley was referring to militant-turned politician Yasin Malik, whose militant outfit Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front had declared that it would not allow the BJP to hoist the national flag at Lal Chowk.

The BJP launched its "Ekta Yatra" from Kolkota Jan 12, culminating in the flag-hoisting ceremony in Srinagar's Lal Chowk on the 62nd Republic Day.

But the state government foiled the attempt. The party leaders and workers were arrested Tuesday evening when they entered Lakhanpur, the gateway to Jammu and Kashmir from Punjab.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

For all those calling Tiranga Yatra divisive.

Watch the genial sardarji R.P Singh from Delhi who according to unconfirmed reports had his bones broken today after a thrashing by security forces to abort his bid for Lal Chowk. He went to Lal Chowk in 2008 and got Jammu-ites, Kashmiris and Ladakhis to walk with him and hoist the flag there. I hope and pray that he is fine, he is one man who has never aspired for any post and is a comitted nationalist. It is touching because he saw 1984 pogroms from his own eyes and saw Sikhs being butchered by the ones who claim to carry no hate baggage.



Just watch the handsome number of people with him!!

Hear Kashmiris saying "Bharat Mata Ki Jai"!! The DDM, Liberatti and media chaperones/wingmen will never let you hear these words. Cause they want crisis and divides to persist, we cannot go there and be one people! hack thoo
Theo_Fidel

Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Theo_Fidel »

Odd that no one has mentioned what actually happened. But then no other Tiranga would do right.. ..Bah!

http://www.thehindu.com/news/states/oth ... 127322.ece
Even as Mr. Malik, Hurriyat leader Bilal Lone, and 16 others appeared from a corner at Lal Chowk chanting pro-freedom slogans, the police stopped them and bundled them into their vehicles. Mr. Malik and others had been hiding in the area.

Police also detained seven BJP activists who tried to break the cordon with the tricolour in their hands. They were severely thrashed and taken to the police station.

Only the local unit of the CRPF stationed at Lal Chowk unfurled the tricolour, which officials said was a routine practice.

Official functions at Jammu, Srinagar and other district headquarters passed off peacefully. Governor N.N. Vohra and Finance Minister A.R. Rather unfurled the flag at Jammu and Srinagar respectively. Without naming the BJP, Mr. Rather said that some parties were trying to divide the country on communal lines, “but the people have given them a befitting reply by not paying heed to their calls.” Sources said that the tricolour was hoisted at around 450 places across the Kashmir division.
http://www.thehindu.com/news/states/oth ... 127322.ece
Last edited by Theo_Fidel on 26 Jan 2011 23:37, edited 1 time in total.
svinayak
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by svinayak »

Theo_Fidel wrote:Odd that no one has mentioned what actually happened. But then no other Tiranga would do right.. ..Bah! Only the local unit of the CRPF stationed at Lal Chowk unfurled the tricolour, which officials said was a routine practice.

Official functions at Jammu, Srinagar and other district headquarters passed off peacefully. Governor N.N. Vohra and Finance Minister A.R. Rather unfurled the flag at Jammu and Srinagar respectively.
Why do they allow foreign flag to be put in the same region. What is the reason for that.

How can this be reversed. Why is this flag here inside India
Image
Last edited by svinayak on 26 Jan 2011 23:48, edited 1 time in total.
Theo_Fidel

Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Theo_Fidel »

No foreign flag is allowed. It is always taken down. Note the others arrested as well.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

Theo_Fidel wrote:Only the local unit of the CRPF stationed at Lal Chowk unfurled the tricolour, which officials said was a routine practice.
Ashwatthama Hattah! Another one of those economies with truth, the fight here was about unfurling the flag at Lal Chowk's ganta ghar where OA "stopped" the unfurling of flag for the first time in 20 years. CRPF unveils it at its chowki or post that is a little removed from the area, I have been to Lal Chowk and know who does what and where? CRPF post is off-centre to Ghanta Ghar and since it is a government structure it flies tricolor even on normal days. But then everything coming from gobermint and its chaperones must be ultimate truth no? The status of Lal Chowk flag hoisting is as yet unknown depending upon how far R P Singh and party reached.

So in effect CRPF post Lal Chowk unfurled a flag on their own structure. Period

This ain't over and will come back to haunt all the helpers of political repression.
Last edited by munna on 26 Jan 2011 23:46, edited 3 times in total.
svinayak
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by svinayak »

Check these guys out

http://twocircles.net/2011jan23/bjps_ra ... ction.html
BJP's Rashtriya Ekta Yatra: Heading in wrong direction
Submitted by admin2 on 23 January 2011 - 12:14am
Articles India Politics Indian Muslim
By M. Zajam,

Bhartiya Janata Party (BJP) fascination with Muslims, Kashmir, Pakistan and Yatras is never going to end. Its politics and programs revolve mainly around these issues. Latest in the series, Rashtriya Ekta Yatra, is heading towards Kashmir for hoisting flag in Lal Chowk, Srinagar on 26th January. This yatra started on 12th January from Kolkata will pass through 11 states before reaching Srinagar. Earlier Murli Manohar Joshi of BJP had also hoisted flag in Lal Chowk in 1992 under heavy security cover.

This time flag hoisting is planned when normalcy has just returned to valley after weeks of unrest. J&K chief minister Omar Abdullah has requested Bharatiya Janata Yuva Morcha (BJYM) to reconsider its decision as it is likely to disturb peaceful conditions in the valley. This Ekta Yatra has even divided BJP led National Democratic Alliance. Janata Dal (U) National President and NDA convener, Sharad Yadav, has requested BJP to call off the yatra stating nothing should be done to hamper the peace. Interlocutors appointed by Government of India has brought good news from Kashmir saying that most people they met in the Valley were against a UN resolutions or plebiscite to resolve the Kashmir issue. Kashmir panel head Dilip Padgoankar said most people reiterated their faith in democracy, fundamental rights, pluralism and tolerance. These interlocutors have been meeting people from all section of society for past few months to get their views about the Kashmir problem.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Rudradev »

Theo_Fidel wrote:Odd that no one has mentioned what actually happened. But then no other Tiranga would do right.. ..Bah! Only the local unit of the CRPF stationed at Lal Chowk unfurled the tricolour, which officials said was a routine practice.

.
Routine from 1991-2009. ABANDONED IN 2010 (followed by a summer of stone-pelting and terrorizing Amarnath Yatris by the emboldened separatists.)

The question would be, what development has made it "routine" once again? Absent that development, would it still be "routine" ?

Or would the flag-hoisting ceremony on Republic Day have been allowed to fall by the wayside? And with what results?
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by SwamyG »

Theo_Fidel wrote:No foreign flag is allowed. It is always taken down. Note the others arrested as well.
Why are foreign flags taken down? Why are they not allowed? It is a free country.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by CRamS »

ramana wrote:A lot of legal boundaries were breached without due process.
Livid Jaitley, Swaraj allege state hijacking, abductionJanuary 26, 2011 11:48:03 PM
Ramana Garu, do you think MMS will get even a feathery touch of an admonition from any quarter other than BJP? India is not US where dems == (dead even) reps so much so that if reps say 2+2=5, media has to report that as a legitimate rep opinion or else there is "liberal" bias.

Guys,

where do we go from here? BJP has made a point on the inviolability of India's soverignty and territorial status quo in Kashmir. As we speak, the separatist dogs along with their foreign backers gathered at a conference in London where Fakroo declared that he is fed up with India. TSP will rather go down in a mushroom cloud than accept Kashmir as India's. US is leaning on a pliant MMS to give up the valley to TSP so Obama can declare victory over the mighty Taliban. MMS may not sign a surrender ceremony at the Lal Chowk, but he sure wouldn't mind surrendering through joint love making agreement. Where are we headed?
Theo_Fidel

Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Theo_Fidel »

This must be the tread with the most TSP flags on BR. Talk about own goals...
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by munna »

Actually where were the so called 20 companies of CRPF deployed today to thrash and arrest any "Indian" but let a crowd of "Separatists" gather without let or hindrance.
OA said he will use "any" force to prevent tricolor hoisting then why are the people on the tower not subject to "any" force? Do not tell me alienation acts as a bullet proof device so that liberal bullets are ineffective against them. pah..
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Frederic »

Theo_Fidel wrote:This must be the tread with the most TSP flags on BR. Talk about own goals...
So these days even talking about what the Hurrirats and the separatist scum do and showing pics of the Paki flags flown by them is a self goal?

Super logic Machi.

Let's all pretend everything is hunky-dory and the problem will melt away in an orgy of joint-lovemaking.

Best Regards
Fred
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by svinayak »

Theo_Fidel wrote:This must be the tread with the most TSP flags on BR. Talk about own goals...
:) Yours is a losing game. It will take you nowhere.
National interest comes first and national interest is supreme.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by R_Kumar »

I wish they could capture video or some photos.
http://www.haindavakeralam.com/HKPage.a ... 164&SKIN=B
Young Mohan Reddy reaches Lal Chowk - Let us Salute him!
26/01/2011 07:43:06 Smt. Radha Rajan


Not all Sonia's thugs not all Sonia's goons could deter young Mohan Reddy from getting within 50 yards of the clock tower in Lal Chowk with flag in his hand shouting Bharat mata ki jai and Vande Mataram.

For me, this young man is hero. He breached the jihadi fortress with the flag and demonstrated to all spineless and shameless Hindus in the Congress and all political parties, to shameless and spineless Hindus in the print and electronic media, to the spineless and shameless Hindus in the bar and the judiciary that nationalism is a raging fire still burning in some hearts.

The flag he carried was snatched away; the young man was thrashed and hauled away by the jihadi J&K police.

Ashok Malik who writes columns for the Pioneer and for Hindusthan Times who squeals privately but writes the yatra is a tired idea should be shamed first. Then the judges of the SC who amended the judgment because they couldn’t resist the pressure of White, Brown and other Christians and evangelists; then Nitish Kumar, then Sharad Yadav, then Dilip Padgaonkar and lastly every shameless Hindu in the INC who lies down obligingly for their imported European president to rub her shoes on,

Mohan Reddy is my hero. I would gladly go to jail for him or with him.

Shame on the nation!!
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Frederic »

The solution prescribed by the liberal commentariat to the rest of us, AKA, "triumphalist" flag bearers:

*Can't let anybody other than the Kashmiri Pundits to hoist the Tiranga at the Lal Chowk. After all it is their land, livelihood and honour that was taken from them. So let them schlep their mushraffs from "cushy" abodes in Delhi and other assorted places and march towards Lal Chowk with food, booze and Nautanki. Oh, don't forget to include some "uncovered" wimmen, preferably of the Kashmiri speaking Hindu type. And don't forget to invite valley teenagers who have never heard a Hindu girl speak in Kashmiri before. Did I mention Aamir Khan and Katrina Kaif?

*If any of the rightwingers dare to join, perform a "brilliant" Kammandu ops in the middle of the night, hijack their trains using state power. Opposition leaders? What opposition, my foot? Bundle them up and throw them across the river.

*And finally, please, please don't score any self-goals machhaans. There are no Paki flags in the valley. Even if a few misguided elements are displaying them at Lal Chowk, it would be a self goal to harp too much on the pictures. Aman ki aasha hain na Sirjee?

*Wonder if it would be a self goal to display the pictures of the Tiranga being burnt and trampled upon?
May be the coffee table commentariat can weigh in?

Best Regards
Fred
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by SwamyG »

CRamS: Are you saying the following?

1. India destroying the status quo, gives J&K away - in some form. Self-rule, join-rule or Paki rule.
2. Pakistan is happy as it is a victory.
3. So now Pakistan then controls its help to Talibans, and leaves Afghanistan in peace.
4. Once Afghanistan is in peace, USA announces victory and goes back?

If yes,
1. Next American elections are in 2012, so there will be pressure from America before that no?
2. What is the guarantee that Pakistan will leave Afghanistan in peace? If it can khulify now, why would it not continue to khujlify later? Wouldn't Americans be aware of this? If they are why would they pressure India on J&K?

Feeding the rabid dog will not help us control it, it only strengthens the dog. If politicians expect Pakistan to be happy with the Valley alone, then they are mistaken. The Frankenstein monster has grown large enough.

Anyway it is very bad for India - to move rabid elements from Middle East to Pakistan to "Akhand Pakistan".
Last edited by SwamyG on 27 Jan 2011 00:47, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by svinayak »

SwamyG wrote: If politicians expect Pakistan to be happy with the Valley alone, then they are mistaken.
No country will allow Taliban to come inside their country
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by Prem »

What if the pressure is not from Khan but from within ? There are many so called DIE /Liberal running around trying to get prizes/ individual kudos from their ilks in WEST .OTOH, Paki Kachori did not want present Poak government to earn the accolades . Repeated Reference to MushMohan Jugalbandhi confirm the suspicion of hankering after Noble/Goebble prize for the con job done on Indians .
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by SwamyG »

Musharaaf and MMS - Joint winners of Nobel Peace Prize would really tickle people.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by BijuShet »

Theo_Fidel wrote:Odd that no one has mentioned what actually happened. But then no other Tiranga would do right.. ..Bah!

http://www.thehindu.com/news/states/oth ... 127322.ece
Even as Mr. Malik, Hurriyat leader Bilal Lone, and 16 others appeared from a corner at Lal Chowk chanting pro-freedom slogans, the police stopped them and bundled them into their vehicles. Mr. Malik and others had been hiding in the area.

Police also detained seven BJP activists who tried to break the cordon with the tricolour in their hands. They were severely thrashed and taken to the police station.

Only the local unit of the CRPF stationed at Lal Chowk unfurled the tricolour, which officials said was a routine practice.

Official functions at Jammu, Srinagar and other district headquarters passed off peacefully. Governor N.N. Vohra and Finance Minister A.R. Rather unfurled the flag at Jammu and Srinagar respectively. Without naming the BJP, Mr. Rather said that some parties were trying to divide the country on communal lines, “but the people have given them a befitting reply by not paying heed to their calls.” Sources said that the tricolour was hoisted at around 450 places across the Kashmir division.
http://www.thehindu.com/news/states/oth ... 127322.ece
Official functions in J&K passed off peacefully because they were sanctioned by the J&K state govt and Central govt. These functions I presume allowed the Indian flag to be flown by officials who in some cases would be aligned to certain parties (read non-BJP). But one more pre-announced function where the participants (read BJP) wanted to peacefully fly the Indian flag causes you and your ilk to show your Bile. Do you not see that as a problem? You are perfectly happy with the alleged CRPF flag hoisting ceremony at Lal Chowk but the same done by BJP makes you angry.

This my friend is the real issue. You are hiding your bias by shrouding it in the sensitivity of the people of J&K. The ruling party and its supporters are claiming the sole right and privilege to fly the Indian flag. I hope you will recognize that there are other Indians too who may be politically aligned differently than you but who also wish to safeguard the integrity of the country.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by CRamS »

SwamyG:

Here is what I am saying succintly. Any so called "peaceful" resolution of the so called "Kashmir dispute" that everybody else in the world refers to except nationalists in India (a dwindling breed) who consider J&K to be India's integral core, will involve a loss of soverignty over the valley. I mean if India cannot even show enough muscle as to hoist a flag at Lal Chowk to assert its soverignty, how in heaven's name can it stand up to US, China, TSP, and their puppets in the valley who are making obnoxious demands to India? More so if TSP is ready to go into a nuke war with full international connivance? I mean its time, as someone said on rediff that was posted here, that India deal with J&K by taking the bull by its horns. All this back channel crap, and begging TSP to allow some space is just slow motion surrender and nothing else.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

CRS This yatra showed the real issue is integration of J&K with India.
Its being prevented by NC in J&K and INC in rest of India.
They both have their legions of followers in and out of govt and chatterati.
Its these who have to be negated.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

BTW, Is the mere stoppage of the ekta yatra from its goals enough to keep Omar Abdullah in good books of the separatists?
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by SwamyG »

The stealthy manner the train was returned was talked about. Here is one of the news item about it. It shows the resourcefulness, speed and intelligence with which Indians can act. Maybe all is not lost, just trying to see a light in the dark tunnel.

One gets a feeling of reading a few pages of spy novel, except that the authorities were not acting against foreign rogues but domestic political party activists.

Was something like this done ever before?

http://www.asianage.com/india/bjp-worke ... secret-744
The Bengaluru-New Delhi Karnataka Express, whose 18 bogies were full of Karnataka BJP youth activists, arrived at Sarola station in the district and was due for onward departure to the north.

The activists, estimated at around 1,500, were scheduled to join other colleagues from different states for the party's Tiranga Yatra in Srinagar Jan 26.

However, the centre and Jammu and Kashmir government have already announced that political activists from other states would not be allowed to create mischief. The local railway authorities here acted swiftly to thwart the onward journey of the train.

When the train halted here, they blacked out Sarola railway station.

Taking advantage of the blanket of darkness, they detached the train's engine and attached it to the rear of the train.

Two more bogies with around 150 Railway Protection Force personnel were also attached to the train and around 1.30 a.m., it "started" its journey - but in the reverse direction and back to Karnataka.

It was only too late when the BJP workers, many of them fast asleep, in the train realised that they had been taken for a ride and halted the train at Nagansur station on the Maharashtra-Karnataka border.

A railway official said that 'the drastic measure was implemented in order to avoid any untoward situation in Maharashtra'.

The police operation resulted in delays of two other trains traversing by the route.
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Re: J & K news and discussion

Post by ramana »

Most likely all this will become evidence in a law suit. No wonder Jaitley calls hit a hijack.

As the train arrived at 1:30am and would have traversed Maharashtra by daybreak the railway official's remarks are not correct. He is trying to use potential trouble as a shield for their illegal action. At a contract law level there was breach of contract between the passengers and the railways. Buying a ticket is a contract.
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