J&K News and Discussion-2011

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abhishek_sharma
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby abhishek_sharma » 17 Apr 2011 06:28


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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby KLNMurthy » 17 Apr 2011 07:09

abhishek_sharma wrote:A People’s General

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/a-peoples-general/777108/

from lucknow, probably means Shia, means kaffir only.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby menon s » 17 Apr 2011 09:07

Showkat killing: Three held, Andrabi husband, PoK militant suspects
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/showk ... s/777200/0
Inspector General of Police S M Sahai said the murder was the result of factional rivalry in Ahl-e-Hadees and the battle for control of the Valley’s growing Wahabbist constituency!Sahai said Showkat’s “hardline detractors” had conspired to kill him as he refused to radicalise the Jamiat and interacted with Barelvis, Shias etc. “This was not acceptable to his detractors.”


Where did all that "Kashmiriyat" go! The real thing they want is Islamism.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Vikas » 17 Apr 2011 18:57

^ Wasn't that the agenda from Day-1 ? What beast is 'Kashmiriyat' I wonder. This was always another word for Nizam-e-Mustafa where only the 'pious' Muslims would be allowed to flourish and piousness in Islamic society directly flows from the barrel of the gun.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby khwaja » 17 Apr 2011 19:14

VikasRaina wrote:^ Wasn't that the agenda from Day-1 ? What beast is 'Kashmiriyat' I wonder. This was always another word for Nizam-e-Mustafa where only the 'pious' Muslims would be allowed to flourish and piousness in Islamic society directly flows from the barrel of the gun.


Kashmir has been an Islamist movement; However, this rabid islamism has been imported, rather than homegrown. (A post Afghan domino effect, fire flamed with Pakistani oil?)... Moreover, the presence of CRPF in J&K has given rise to more discontent and anger than peace. Let's be honest about our Indian jawans. You know how grumpy and arrogant they are; even when you're at a kids fair in Pragati Maidan .. Our army might be a fine force of polished officers, yet the ground fighting force is still quite rustic and rude. It's given rise to a whole new kind of anger and frustration among the youth. Imagine being policed in your own home by outsiders.. That's the kind of anger that has surfaced in the past decade, post 1990s...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby derkonig » 17 Apr 2011 19:35

^^^^
paki alert, bad mouthing the Indian armed forces. If the Kashmiri muslims dont want the armed forces there, why dont they give up on violence and start acting like citizens of India. The soliders in the state are there to eliminate terrorism and not to do jee janab and kowtow to the islamic scum in the state.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby khwaja » 17 Apr 2011 19:48

derkonig wrote:^^^^
paki alert, bad mouthing the Indian armed forces. If the Kashmiri muslims dont want the armed forces there, why dont they give up on violence and start acting like citizens of India. The soliders in the state are there to eliminate terrorism and not to do jee janab and kowtow to the islamic scum in the state.


Exactly, "eliminate terrorism". You wont "eliminate terrorism" by being rude with the everyday fruitseller and schoolboy. Jenaab, you'll know what I'm talking about if you've been through daily checks as a civilian at a "strategic installation" protected by central forces, even those not in Kashmir.

Some things have to be accepted. Bad behaviour and rudeness is endemic to our culture. And when you're holding a gun and behaving badly, you'll feel "oppressed" and "ruled upon".

And how should one "act" like an "Indian citizen" ? Wear the Indian flag on your sleeves? Sing Vande Mataram in the morning everyday? Nationality and identity cannot be forced upon; it's a slow process, requires patience and effort to accomodate Kashmiri identity in the mainstream Indian identity. More opportunities for Kashmiris to experience India's opportunities - (simple things like an Indian Passport), trade, technology, cultural expression, music, etc. would help.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Vikas » 17 Apr 2011 21:22

AshokB wrote:
derkonig wrote:^^^^
paki alert, bad mouthing the Indian armed forces. If the Kashmiri muslims dont want the armed forces there, why dont they give up on violence and start acting like citizens of India. The soliders in the state are there to eliminate terrorism and not to do jee janab and kowtow to the islamic scum in the state.


Exactly, "eliminate terrorism". You wont "eliminate terrorism" by being rude with the everyday fruitseller and schoolboy. Jenaab, you'll know what I'm talking about if you've been through daily checks as a civilian at a "strategic installation" protected by central forces, even those not in Kashmir.

Some things have to be accepted. Bad behaviour and rudeness is endemic to our culture. And when you're holding a gun and behaving badly, you'll feel "oppressed" and "ruled upon".

And how should one "act" like an "Indian citizen" ? Wear the Indian flag on your sleeves? Sing Vande Mataram in the morning everyday? Nationality and identity cannot be forced upon; it's a slow process, requires patience and effort to accomodate Kashmiri identity in the mainstream Indian identity. More opportunities for Kashmiris to experience India's opportunities - (simple things like an Indian Passport), trade, technology, cultural expression, music, etc. would help.

AshokB sahab, I personally have been thru all the checkpoints, 'rude' behavior and blah blah but I never felt like picking up the stone/Grenade/gun and kill the security personal who is doing his/her duty .
MOreover the moment someone opens up dialogue with "accomodating Kashmiri identity", They lose credibility. What is so special about this Kashmiri identity.What is this identity and how can we accommodate it.
Can you kindly put it in few words and enlighten us. Like I said, It is open secret word for Muslim Identity.
Wonder why you didn't in the same breath also talked about Accommodating other identities that make up the state of J&K.

However, this rabid islamism has been imported, rather than homegrown.

That I guess is solace to the thousands killed by KM terrorists and lakhs of displaced Kashmiri Pandits.

Let's be honest about our Indian jawans. You know how grumpy and arrogant they are; even when you're at a kids fair in Pragati Maidan

No I don't know how grumpy and arrogant they are. you tell me. My experience has been most pleasant and am proud of the finest fighting force. These soldiers put their life on the line every moment of the day in Kashmir valley and yet you call them grumpy. Isn't it thanklessness.
Like most of the WKK, you too seem to be bought on the song that KM's should be treated with kid gloves, fed well while they suck every ounce of energy from rest of India and yet bad mouth us.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Vikas » 17 Apr 2011 22:22

:rotfl: :rotfl:
Marten Ji, You crack me up! Now I see the true picture of reality.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby menon s » 18 Apr 2011 04:35

Bruce Reidel on Kashmir.
i do not know if this was posted earlier!
http://www.brookings.edu/opinions/2010/ ... iedel.aspx
The cease-fire line that divides Kashmir between India and Pakistan, the line of control, would become the agreed international border between the two countries. At the same time, it would become a permeable border for Kashmiris, who could move back and forth easily. Both countries’ currencies would be valid on both sides of the line. The two parts of Kashmir, Pakistani Azad Kashmir and Indian Kashmir and Jammu, would handle local issues like tourism, sports, and the environment in joint shared institutions along the lines of how Ireland and Ulster work together now on all Northern Ireland issues.

The broad outlines of this deal were worked out by then Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf and Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh in secret back-channel talks four years ago. Musharraf told me that while a deal was not consummated, they were very close when his domestic political problems shut down the exercise. Lashkar e Tayyiba’s Mumbai attack was designed to kill it for good.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Anindya » 18 Apr 2011 07:36

From http://www.deccanherald.com/content/154315/geelani-assures-protection-kashmiri-pandits.html
it would seem Geelani wants the KMs to go on another Pandit killing spree...this time, inviting them back with promises of protection...

In a significant development, hardline separatist leader Syed Ali Geelani Sunday assured Kashmiri Pandits that 90 percent of the Muslim population in Jammu and Kashmir would protect their Hindu brethren if they returned to the Valley.

He also rejected the idea of setting up safety zones for Pandits because "this gives a sense of divide between the Muslims and the Hindus".

"With the help of Allah and on behalf of the 90 percent Muslim majority of the Valley, I assure you that your temples, lives, property and honour would be protected by us as you return to your original homes here," Geelani, head of the radical Hurriyat group, told people at a camp.

The separatist leader was addressing 142 families comprising 500 men, women and children, who welcomed him at the Vessu migrant transit camp in south Kashmir's Anantnag district.

"None of you will ever come to any harm from your Muslim brothers," he assured them. Geelani was accorded a warm welcome by Sanjay Saraf, national youth president of Lok Jan Shakti Party and the patron of the Kashmir Pandit Amity Council, along with other members of the Pandit community at the camp.

"To be a good human being, one must have good character," he added.The 142 Pandit families came to the transit camp a fortnight ago as part of their plan to return to the Kashmir Valley they had left in 1990.

Quoting from the Holy Quran, Geelani said Allah does not discriminate between human beings on basis of religion, caste, colour, creed, wealth or poverty, rural or urban origin.

"When I was released after two years from the jail in 1992, I made it clear that the Pandit brothers are a part of our great heritage and we have to coexist under all circumstances.

"I reject the idea of creating safe zones for the Pandit community. This gives a sense of divide between the Muslims and the Hindus here.

"You must appeal to the government to allow you to return to your original places in villages, towns and cities. We have centuries old traditions of sharing each other's joys and sorrows. Those traditions are dear to us and have to be re-established," Geelani said.

He told the members of the Pandit community: "Our fight with India is not because it is a Hindu majority country. Our fight against India is only because certain promises were made to us those must be kept."

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby ManishH » 18 Apr 2011 09:24

Geelani doesen't know what's going to hit him now. He mistakenly thinks those returning are the meek who can be used as tools in his secessionism. But these very people will undo his ethnic cleansing. My wishes and prayers with those brave people who have decided to resettle. Here's a pic of the resettler colony ...

Image

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Vikas » 18 Apr 2011 10:02

I am not sure if there was a reason inviting this terrorist Geelani for pep talk, but me sitting few thousand miles away, I guess the folks on the ground know better than I do.
"None of you will ever come to any harm from your Muslim brothers," he assured them

And if it does, we will immediately declare ,"They can't be Muslims for Islam doesn't permit this as mentioned in Q <Insert your own sura here>

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby CRamS » 18 Apr 2011 10:15

menon s wrote:Bruce Reidel on Kashmir.
i do not know if this was posted earlier!
http://www.brookings.edu/opinions/2010/ ... iedel.aspx


So MMS accepted TSP currency in the valley. Good the deal was still born.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby chetak » 18 Apr 2011 13:14

CRamS wrote:
menon s wrote:Bruce Reidel on Kashmir.
i do not know if this was posted earlier!
http://www.brookings.edu/opinions/2010/ ... iedel.aspx


So MMS accepted TSP currency in the valley. Good the deal was still born.


He knows that they are already printing Indian currency on their own :twisted:

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Sudip » 18 Apr 2011 13:28

The Foreign Fighters Problem, Recent Trends and Case Studies: Selected Essays

From pg 74

Kashmiris whom I interviewed in Kashmir’s capital of Srinigar in the
spring of 2007
claimed to have initially been grateful for this military assistance,
but this initial feeling was replaced by fear and distrust when the foreign
militants spoke of establishing strict shariah Islamic law in this easy-going Sufi
Muslim land. The foreign fighters it seemed had grand plans for transforming
Kashmir into a base of operations for carrying the struggle into India proper.16


Author: Brian Glyn Williams is Associate Professor of Islamic History at the University of Massachusetts
atDartmouth.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby satya » 18 Apr 2011 13:37

Wht's more imp. for India mere symbolism or substance ? Say we accept TSPCN in J&K .Its value will be decided by our bankers & traders if GOI try to give some inflated value to TSPCNs it will lead to black mkt where its real value will be lower again who wins ?. Thing is MMS knows its mere symbolism & TSP abduls will celeberate it as victory without thinking tht we have got a say in their affairs not limited to TSPoK but their whole trading system beyond J&K borders this is wht MMS has vision of .One more thing dont take MMS as lightweight he knows wht he is doing and knows his history can't say more .In my opinion we were getting the substance . Symbolism was for TSP .Wht if Afghans begin to come to India via J&K and CAS traders too will they hold transit currency of TSP or INR where they buy real guds and sell their stuff .But then this is not an 'elegant victory' ?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 18 Apr 2011 13:51

^^^Purely on economic terms, getting INR to be legal tender in PoK will be a massive boost to actually consolidate India's influence in PoK, not the other way round...As INR is epxected to remin a stronger ccy to PKR in the foreseeable future, all traders will naturally want to hold and transact in INR, in the process building more dependencies in the PoK economy to India...In some ways, Pak will end up creating INR as the reserve ccy AND legal tender in PoK! It will be an economic "win" for us...Obviously, eitehr the Pakis were not serious about the proposal or didnt understand the ramifications or were merely looking at the optics - probably all three..

Politically though, it will be a little difficult to sell in India as well - somehow these joint structures of governance and ccy being legal tender on both sides would look like a diminshing of Indian sovereignty...Though on balance, as long as the border was sanctified along LoC, and no restrictions on military activities along the border, it is a good deal from a practical perspective...

Would have been far more difficult to sell in Pak though...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby satya » 18 Apr 2011 14:05

Arre Baba TPSians rite from Jernails to abdul on street stand for symbolism only see their minarets their mizziles all hawa no substance . IIRC there use to be cotton traders from my native state of Haryana who use to buy cotton from TPS till early 90s and use to hold their currency there wasn't much fuss about it so i dont think it will be an issue. Besides wht tomm. in J&K can't foreign tourists exchange their currency are we gonna say Unkil or Aunty rules J&K ?

No one is making TSPCN as legal tender it will be treated on par we treat other FCNs simple. As for jt. mechanism a bit tricky for i am not sure if it would have been 50:50 or based on population or some higher veto from Dilli n Pindi but then again issues covered in it were the least controversial to move up the ladder ie LC type house for J&K and so on .......

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 18 Apr 2011 14:10

^^Satya-ji, thoda difference hai..People holding a ccy and asking for an "exchange" through regular (or irregular!) channels to the legal tender in a region is a bit different from making a different ccy as legal tender itself..So foreign tourists can pay for pashmina shawls in USD (or whatver other ccy), it does not make USD as legal tender in J&K...Thos etxns are tightly regulated, or are too small to be regulated...Making PKR legal tender in J&K, or INR legal tender in PoK is a different ballgame..Of course, finally to India's advantage only..

But of course, MMS etc are all US cabal out of sell India ourt short, isnt it? :wink:

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby satya » 18 Apr 2011 14:17

Where does TSPCN being legal tender in J&K came from? Wht i understand from wht i heard n read was its so not possible to exchange TSPCN for INR in J&K with FOREX dealers without some sawaaljawaab ,tht was to be changed . Making TSPCN a legal tender hmm never heard earlier. Bruce Reidel's article says Both countries’ currencies would be valid on both sides of the line now my understanding is valid = can be exchanged at money changers or there's some other source tht says it will be a legal tender ?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 18 Apr 2011 14:20

^^^Yes, that is what is being talked about typically when you say that the ccy wil be made "valid" in a country/region - it becomes legal tender...Simple Ccy exhange by authorised dealers is pretty par for the course - as long as any ccy has a market, ie, the authorised dealer can "lay it off" in the market, and there are no regs barring dealing in it, any fcy can be exchanged..

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby satya » 18 Apr 2011 16:31

Somnathjee

Confirmed from a kala coat - kali topi - kala chasma -white gypsy wali billi in dilli so yes u r rite 'legal tender' issue was indeed put up in the final solution talks ie of having ' two legal tenders' from India & TSP but then MMS told Mushy about the problem of such a system whereby a 3rd currency apparently of newly formed country of J&K had to be introduced ( other solution to have both currencies in system was of a peg btw INR & TSPR tht would have tied TSPR to INR i think ) and it was mutually put in thanda basta for further brainstorming but rest of mechanism to be put in place to start moving things . Apparently this twin legal tender thing was Unkil's brain idea . Kiyani is feeling suffocated in Pindi with no room left for him to scratch given both Panda & Unkil dictating no. of inhales per minute, send feelers to desh a sort of SOS :(( No. of curses for Mushy increasing in Pindi every passing hr with smile widening on MMSjee's face dekha bataya tha na ABVjee ne aapko :rotfl:
Crisis Manager of UPA is MMS not pranabda .MMSjee's solutions ensure no solution for min. of 2 decades :mrgreen:

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Gagan » 18 Apr 2011 19:15

WRT the MMS-Mushy deal.
Both of these guys were being dishonest with each other.
1. Mushy was aiming at making the LOC more porous without dismantling his terrorists. In addition to conning MMS to reduce force levels, Indian Army withdrawing from Saltoro in return for some sugary words from him to boost MMS's ego and some Taquiyya.
Once the border became porous, the IA withdrew from Siachen, he had more than a foot in the door, and could very well do what he wanted.
2. MMS was trying to be more chankiyan than mushy. He probably had been warned by his aides what the dangers of his proposed moves might be. But the gamble he was taking was that because the Indian economy was much stronger, the people of POK once they are able to travel to J&K proper, won't want to leave. They will sooner or later see that their economic and political well being was much much better looked after as citizens of India than under Pakistani subjugation.

Mushy being a Kammandu, a wily bandicoot, actually thought that his plan would succeed (just has he thought that pumping hot air into his soldiers could make them survive on Siachen and then fight on siachen and finally win in siachen)(or that just occupying the heights in Kargil meant that India will simply roll over and surrender).

Kiyani is different, old school. He knows that his and his army's safety lies in preserving the old order - India is the enemy, rachet up terrorism in kashmir etc etc, and the more that India gets angry at pakistan, the more his army is invaluable to pakistanis.

We can continue to debate on what would have happened if that plan had actually gone ahead. But reading history it seems to be that the LOC=International Border and open borders / open LOC is an idea that predates MMS. It appears that post 71 there was some mention of this in talks between IG and ZAB. I dunno if this was talked about even earlier, is this a remnant of JLN's post UN resolution decision?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby negi » 18 Apr 2011 19:18

Ha ha chankians are yet again high on donkey pee; no wonder India has not solved the J&K issue for all these years.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 18 Apr 2011 19:51

Gagan wrote:But reading history it seems to be that the LOC=International Border and open borders / open LOC is an idea that predates MMS. It appears that post 71 there was some mention of this in talks between IG and ZAB

Gagan-ji, not sure about the "open-ness", but there was an informal understanding in Simla about converting LOC into IB..Dont think there was enough discussion to have arrived at ideas of "open-ness" though..

All the ccy as valid legal tender, soft borders etc actually play substantially to India's strengths..I am a bit surprised that Musharraf agreed on those lines...It gives Pak nothing barring some flimsy optics...Maybe he is stupider than what we think he is :twisted:

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Gagan » 18 Apr 2011 20:35

But the open borders and concessions on Siachen are dangerous in the short term.

Pakistani leaders don't want to think beyond their immediate rule. They want a "Victory" over India to show to the abduls back home, they don't give a damn if the country goes down the pakistan.

So Mushy was 400% thinking short term on this one. He was probably thinking that a situation would arrive whereby he could walk into Bana Post and rename it Qaid Post or that his kammandus and Jihadis would bring him victorious into the Dal Lake.
I notice that in the interview with Karan Thapar, when he was asked if the greater autonomy, reducing armed forces, greater powers in the hands of the people, mantra that he was prescribing for the part of J&K with India would also be applicable to POK - he was surprised that this was even brought up by Karan Thapar, he was ambivalent, non commital and then finally to get rid of the awkward position that KT had put him into finally said "yes" in a rather quiet voice. That behaviour pattern displayed his intention to be 400% insincere and was visible for all to see.

So my feeling is that, there is great short term danger with this plan unless pakistan ENDS - full stop terrorism (which is like NEVER going to happen - as long as pakistan lives).

But in the long term, every paki, civilian or general knows in some corner of their hearts that it is India that will save their musharrafs one fine day. Inspite of them having killed us, wishing us the most grievous harm possible, they believe that the Indians will save them. It is a very Pakjabi thought process that outsiders will find difficult to understand

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby khwaja » 19 Apr 2011 01:30

Pakistan tries to use the Islamic identity to woo kashmir, and lay claim on it. They're good in portraying the issue like two sides of a coin: the islamic issue as a weapon to build resonance inside Pakistan, and peace&demilitarization and poverty alleviation to appeal to the west, and "high thinking" men like MMS.

Im sure that MMS is more sophisticated and chanakian than what we understand him to be though his basic twist of mind seems more similar to the ideology that has kept India as a defensive state throughout history.

I like the idea explained by Gagan, of a civilian conversion of poK-ians into Indian Kashmiris, based more on economic realities and political freedoms - very much possible; We have examples how Bangadeshis and tamils from Sri Lanka try desperately to get across the border in search of better opportunities, many Indians resist amalgamation of Bngldsh, or Sri Lanka on grounds of refugee inflows.

INR's strength among the regional economies shouldn't be underestimated. Imagine a Pok citizen travelling to Dubai, he'd be much better off transacting and sending remittances in INR than PKR (wud u want a currency whose economy is undergoing inflation of 12-25%)

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby CRamS » 19 Apr 2011 01:51

khwaja wrote: Im sure that MMS is more sophisticated and chanakian than what we understand him to be though his basic twist of mind seems more similar to the ideology that has kept India as a defensive state throughout history.


Sophisticated and chanakian my foot. He is a "South Asian", not an Indian, and that explains his appeasement of Pakis, and desire to make joint love in Srinagar, and his casual dissing of 26/11 in his quest to make western-scripted history. Only an Indian nationalist can realize the sacrosancy of Kashmir to India, and hurt and pain and humiliation of 26/11.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby jamwal » 19 Apr 2011 14:44

Dutch missionary faces deportation after 'converting Muslims'

Fr Borst recently told Dutch Catholic newspaper Katholiek Nieuwsblad that he denies the accusation.
“Muslim extremists say that I have converted tens of thousands of people to Christianity. That’s not true. I’m not converting anyone.”
Jealous
He also said that the accusers are probably jealous of the Catholic school he runs successfully. “The quality of our education is much higher than other schools. Some people don’t like that. Last year, a Muslim extremist even set fire to the building.”

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Venkarl » 19 Apr 2011 19:47

Sudip wrote:The Foreign Fighters Problem, Recent Trends and Case Studies: Selected Essays

From pg 74

Kashmiris whom I interviewed in Kashmir’s capital of Srinigar in the
spring of 2007
claimed to have initially been grateful for this military assistance,
but this initial feeling was replaced by fear and distrust when the foreign
militants spoke of establishing strict shariah Islamic law in this easy-going Sufi
Muslim land.
The foreign fighters it seemed had grand plans for transforming
Kashmir into a base of operations for carrying the struggle into India proper
.16


Author: Brian Glyn Williams is Associate Professor of Islamic History at the University of Massachusetts
atDartmouth.


hmmm...2 strategic depths (Afghan+Kashmir) for Pakis....1 to train 'em and 1 to launch 'em....nice plan if it becomes a possibility..Kashmir Struggle is just a "kafan" to give more Islamic beating mowing down to Indian hinterlands....and few folks on our side legitimize this struggle by Aman ki Tamasha type screw ups ....these types think by forgetting PoK+G&B, giving siachen & sir creek on a platter to paks will make Pakis our friends and story goes to Kanchi with "Shubham" in the end.....but the reality is these leeches become more fat with more blood thirst looking down to HP and Punjab....and these A ki T types still have no clue what happened and whats gonna happen next....

CT alert.//.... Kashmir if ITfied, it'll be a problem for India anyway....but it could pose a trouble for China too with US n Europe's jealousy eyes staring at growing economic, political and military strength of China...probably China stepped in PoK to overlook situation there first hand to avoid such a situation...//

But the bottom line is...Kashmiris should realize that they are being taken for a ride in the name of Free Kashmir to first separate Kashmir from India and then use them and their lands for anti-India activities....Indian media should direct its efforts in this direction....unfortunately no

ManishH
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby ManishH » 19 Apr 2011 20:36

So once PKR is legal currency in all of J&K, what prevents TSP enforcing exclusive use of PKR and boycott of INR in J&K using it's mercenaries and a few fatwas about non-islamic money etc. ?

Venkarl: you're right on the money. J&K is the bulwark and first line of defence of Bharat.

It's time India started asking itself - what is a Kashmiri ? Does the solider who fights to defend J&K against foreign fighters have no less a claim upon the land he defends ?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby RoyG » 20 Apr 2011 01:35

Give Jammu and Kashmir more autonomy, say interlocutors
Toufiq Rashid, Hindustan Times
Srinagar, April 20, 2011

The central government’s interlocutors on Jammu and Kashmir are likely to recommend more powers for the state to strengthen its special status under the Constitution. The interlocutors favour a political solution that “upholds and fine-tunes the special status of Jammu and Kashmir under Article 370 (of the Constitution), which means giving additional powers to the state so it can assert its independent character”, said noted journalist Dileep Padgaonkar, who heads the three-member team of interlocutors.

“For decades, India has been represented (in Kashmir) by just the soldier on the road. That has to change,” he said.

The panel is likely to propose that the state’s governor and chief minister be given the titles of president and prime minister, respectively (as was the case before 1953).

The interlocutors, who include academic Radha Kumar and former central information commissioner MM Ansari, want greater devolution of power to the state legislature and elected local bodies. They also favour more confidence-building measures to create an atmosphere for talks with separatists, and a continuation of the dialogue with Pakistan.

While giving the state more political autonomy, the interlocutors want deeper economic linkages between the state and the rest of the country.

They are likely to propose that J&K be declared a free economic zone and that traditional routes of trade and commerce, including roads to Pakistan-occupied Kashmir, be reopened.

“Give people an opportunity to invest in the state. Let the state have its own tariff laws and tax laws,” Padgaonkar said.

The interlocutors, appointed by Prime Minister Manmohan Singh last October, have been boycotted by the All Parties Hurriyat Conference.

They have, however, met the main opposition BJP, which is unlikely to accept many of their recommendations, and the Left.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Give-Jamm ... 87339.aspx

I agree with opening up Kashmir with the rest of India and making it a free trade zone. However, why exactly do we have to pursue a piss dialogue with Kashmir and open it up to trade through PoK? All those jihadi b*stards are going to walk across the border and create even more chaos. Wonder what they recommend on the Kashmiri pundits front...

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Jarita » 20 Apr 2011 01:37

And so it starts again - the snow must have melted and the Amerkhans and Chinese have paid their proxies in the UPA

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Give-Jamm ... 87339.aspx

Give J&K more autonomy, say interlocutors

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 20 Apr 2011 07:33

ManishH wrote:So once PKR is legal currency in all of J&K, what prevents TSP enforcing exclusive use of PKR and boycott of INR in J&K using it's mercenaries and a few fatwas about non-islamic money etc. ?

Venkarl: you're right on the money. J&K is the bulwark and first line of defence of Bharat.

It's time India started asking itself - what is a Kashmiri ? Does the solider who fights to defend J&K against foreign fighters have no less a claim upon the land he defends ?

Manish-ji, things in reality will move in the reverese direction...People tend to hold ccy that is perceived to be "strong", fatwas etc notwithstanding (you can t police every single txn, can you?)...What is most likely to happen is that Paki businessmen will setup "vehicles" in PoK to denominate their holdings in INR, thereby creating a largescale movement of Paki business into INR denomination! this is besides all legit residents of PoK/J&K...Its actually quite a bad idea for Pak even in the very short term - the action will start almost imediately on implementaion - thats why I am surprised that Mush accepted it...I am about 400% sure that MMS would not have been ignorant of the same :wink:

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Prasad » 20 Apr 2011 07:37

Wouldn't it make it a lot easier for the pukis to pump in more fake currency into the country? Once inside J&K it is far easier to siphon it across into the rest of country than the Nepal route?

somnath
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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby somnath » 20 Apr 2011 10:00

^^Prasad-ji, fake currency is more a criminal issue rather than an economic one..Legal INR is already legal tender in J&K and rest of the country!

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby Pratyush » 20 Apr 2011 15:03

Jarita wrote:And so it starts again - the snow must have melted and the Amerkhans and Chinese have paid their proxies in the UPA

http://www.hindustantimes.com/Give-Jamm ... 87339.aspx

Give J&K more autonomy, say interlocutors


Give autonomy to J&K Ok.................. No issues................. But...........................

Have they come up with any recomendation, that will be acceptable to the ROI. Ie other then Islam in the valley just what is it that makes the Kashmiries unique, when contrasted with the ROI. That they need autonomy. They need greater integration with the ROI.

The case ought ot be made of removing the 37O and intigeration. Not of causing more divisions in the fabric of the nation. One partition in the name of relegion is one too many. That was in 1947. Never again.

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby anupmisra » 20 Apr 2011 17:03

Jarita wrote:And so it starts again - the snow must have melted and the Amerkhans and Chinese have paid their proxies in the UPA
http://www.hindustantimes.com/Give-Jamm ... 87339.aspx

Give J&K more autonomy, say interlocutors


That's a trojan horse, if ever there was one. Remember the story of an Arab, his tent and his camel?

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Re: J&K News and Discussion-2011

Postby menon s » 21 Apr 2011 09:52

Interview with Lt. Gen Syed Ata Hasnain, GoC 15 Corps , Srinagar.
http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2011/04/ ... corps.html

Q. The big problem in the valley now seems to be stone pelting and mass uprising, not militancy. Is the army shifting focus?
A. I see a clear nexus between stone pelting and terrorism. From 2008, when the agitation started, the main instigators and crowd controllers were all known militants. And, the stone pelters were doing it for money. Near Zainakote is a boatmen's colony, all poor people. They were paid Rs 300 per day to throw stones. In Baramulla, where the cart pushers earn Rs 200 per day, they were willing to throw stones for Rs 300.


Q. Nevertheless, there remains real anger amongst Kashmir's youth.

If you're living in a tinderbox, where the press is negative, and you can't move around, there will be anger against everything. Most places offer ways of diverting oneself; here there is nothing, especially during the five-month winter, when everyone stays at home. We have begun organising events and competitions in football, cricket, carom, debates and quizes. We recently organised a half-marathon, and 3,000 people participated, including 300 girls. Another 8,000 people came out to cheer the runners.


so its something like this stone throwing is a sport, after the long winter hibernation ...to flex dormant muscles and a a few extra rupees...Some call this sport Azadi! :D


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