MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 21 Mar 2011 08:00

Do not know if Spain is part of this circus, and, have not seen any reports of German planes. Between the UK and Italy, they have sent only the Tornado for ground ops. The EF is there to ensure air integrity!!!! Cosmetic is my impression.

Also get the impression that France has its own circus act - way outside of what the others seem to have.

I do not think it will, but hope that none of this will get attention in the MMRCA deal.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby RSoami » 21 Mar 2011 09:01

..Eurofighter was never designed for A2G role..It was designed as a pure air superiority fighter keeping in view the peaceful, humanitarian, no-attack-stupidity of the Europeans..In fact the attempt to make it multi role has been undertaken only after India announced its tender for the planes.No wonder its not ready for A2G role.
...And all this talk of it acquiring multi role capability and navalized version and a halo around the cockpit will vanish if India were not to buy it. Future of a majority of the six planes hangs on the Indian order.Gripen, Rafale, Eurofighter, Mig-35...even F-16 I think IMHO.
UK slamming Ef2K is actually a good news for our price negotiating team.

You meant the ghoos negotiating team??!!! :P
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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Gurinder P » 21 Mar 2011 09:35

^^ dude take a deep breath man, calling the europeans stupid for their beliefs is like the kkk ranting about anybody but wasps being subhuman (I am not calling you a bigot, just a comparison between outbursts).

Noted that the lack of a2g on the typhoon would be a detriment as a multirole fighter for India. The reasoning for the europeans making the typhoon it an air sup. Fighter was that it could rule the skies as the tornadoes did ground attack.

Best regards.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby shukla » 21 Mar 2011 15:39

Dassault in trouble..desperate for export orders. Hopes pinned on Brazil n India.

Dassault Aviation – Changing Course Depends on Rafale Export.
Defense update

Thanks to record-breaking deliveries of Falcon business jets, the company demonstrated an impressive 22% increase in net sales, compared to 2009. However, with orders for business jets declining, Falcon alone cannot sustain the company for much longer and Dassault is hoping to win at least one export order for the Rafale to secure its future growth.

In contrast to the overall positive performance of the company, its defense activities went through a difficult year in 2010, with new orders of € 792 million, far lower compared to the € 2,529 million received in 2009, this peak year included a follow-on order for 60 Rafale fighters from France. In fact, Dassault’s 2010 defense order book was slightly lower han 2007 in terms of new business. In actual deliveries Dassault completed and delivered 11 Rafale fighters in 2010 (compared to 14 in 2009). The same production rate is expected to be maintained for 2011.

As expected, defense activities in France totaled € 606 million, 75 percent down in 2010, compared to € 2,276 million peak year in 2009.

The forecast for 2011 indicates a challenging year – global economic slowdown, growing competition in the business aviation sector, depreciated dollar impacting the competitiveness of European companies, reduced defense spending in Europe and abroad all present negative trends. Winning one of the tenders in India or Brazil could change the picture dramatically. “We are discussing with several export prospects. They recognized our military aircraft’s qualities during its evaluation and we are looking forward to concluding deals.” Said Charles Edelstenne, Dassault Aviation president and CEO. Among the leading prospects are Brazil and India, both are expected to announce their decision in 2011-2012.


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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby SaiK » 21 Mar 2011 17:04

it would be always a GUBO with an exchange back scratch GUBO.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Rakesh » 21 Mar 2011 22:16

IAF Wants Long-Range Standoff Strike Missile
http://livefist.blogspot.com/2011/03/iaf-wants-long-range-standoff-strike.html

All valid points and ties in with the link above. Good post Brando!

Brando wrote:IMO, what the IAF really needs is an electronic attack/ground attack fighter that can penetrate enemy air-defenses and carry out SEAD missions because the ability to suppress the enemy's air-defenses (which are pretty substantial and modern on both our borders!) is a key part in obtaining air-superiority over a battle-space and the IAF doesn't really have too many choices in standoff range anti-radiation/land-attack munitions. Also, the IAF would need the ability to provide real CAS to the troops on the ground especially in those difficult mountain terrains.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby VinodTK » 22 Mar 2011 03:21

Ajai Shukla: Antony, pull the plug on the MMRCA
Antony cannot be swept away by the fighter pilot community’s simplistic argument that credible defence against China and Pakistan depends upon building up 42 fighter squadrons, up from the 32 squadrons that currently exist today. Instead, he must take a broader view, considering three key questions. Firstly, is victory in the air in modern warfare about mere aircraft numbers or about capabilities? Increasingly, digital networking and command and surveillance systems are significant force multipliers, allowing one squadron to do the job of three. But those networks involve top-secret source codes that no developer parts with, not even for Rs 42,000 crore. If the IAF has to be, as it often insists, a fully integrated and networked force, it must develop its own fighters, complete with network systems.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Surya » 22 Mar 2011 03:36

the man has been bought lock , stock and barrel

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2011 03:41

By whom?

Outside of the JSF reference and AMCA, it echoes some on BR who either wanted the LCA or the MKI. At that time there was a MCA, not the reverential AMCA.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Surya » 22 Mar 2011 03:49

ever since his lifafa outing to khan the man has been touting that as the only option. He is now betting that the IAF will have it by 2020. its more than a few wet dreams - as he extends to his newspaper articles

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2011 03:55

True. However, the US will never live on a promise. I very much doubt that the US will even entertain the idea of "IF we need". They will WANT a $10 billion down payment. So, yes, I agree that he is dreaming. Then, was he paid to dream? From what I am understanding he is hedging. He wants the $10 billion to go towards the AMCA and R&D (which IMHO is just great), but if it does not work, then he states, that India should make a deal now to get the JSF in about 5 years. THAT, I doubt will fly in DC. IF he is paid, then someone has wasted a ton of money. IMHO of course. (Does not mean he is not paid. May be he forgot the script back in DC and the soft copy got lost in China, while coming via gmail.)

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby manum » 22 Mar 2011 04:01

NRao wrote:By whom?

Outside of the JSF reference and AMCA, it echoes some on BR who either wanted the LCA or the MKI. At that time there was a MCA, not the reverential AMCA.


To buy JSF one has to scrap MRCA...thats what the point he is making...Its a parallel game altogether...but in whole point how he is linking of buying JSF to making our defense industry indigenous...
If talk about scraping MRCA...then talk about it,and LCA variants....why bring JSF into it which is further lagging...

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2011 04:08

manum wrote:If talk about scraping MRCA...then talk about it,and LCA variants....why bring JSF into it which is further lagging...


That is an easy question to answer: The LCA is not in the same class as the AMCA. Only a JSF (supposedly, one can make the arg: why not the FGFA?) can replace a failing or a late AMCA.

I cannot see the LCA in this discussion.

However, the point he is making is one of high techs. And, i agree that neither the MMRCA nor the LCA - from a pure tech PoV - fall into the category of a AMCA. Not even close. I doubt that the FGFA will fall into that category - a point I have made some time back.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby ks_sachin » 22 Mar 2011 04:19

Don't miss the woods for the trees mate....It a point of view does not suit ones opinions then silly tangents arise which are detract from any debate....

JSF apart there is an interesting line of thought here.

Considering the fact that there are a lot of knowledgeable posters on BRF who states that LCA Mk1 itself is quite capable and teh Mk2 is to be even more so ( I also recall someone saying it is on par with the Gripen) why do we need an MMRCA deal?

Hypothetical question then - If MMRCA does get canned can the LCA plug the gap.....?
Also some of the other force multipliers that he has suggested - can we upgrade these to plug the gap....and what needs upgrading?

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby nachiket » 22 Mar 2011 04:26

VinodTK wrote:Ajai Shukla: Antony, pull the plug on the MMRCA
[quote]Antony cannot be swept away by the fighter pilot community’s simplistic argument that credible defence against China and Pakistan depends upon building up 42 fighter squadrons, up from the 32 squadrons that currently exist today.


Yes. And apparently a retired Armoured corps officer knows better than the fighter pilot community.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby VikramS » 22 Mar 2011 04:34

I actually agree with Col. Shukla here.

There are three primary blocks which are contending for the MRCA:
The Russians, The French, and the US & poodles.

Typhoon, Grippen etc. have too much US input to be considered sanction proof. They are essentially US poodles.

There is no point putting all the eggs in Russia's basket, especially with the FGFA in the pipeline. IAF should get technology input from other camps. However, there is still concern about the US as a strategic partner. Further if India selects any of the poodle planes (Typhoon or Grippen), the wrath of the Khan might be even worse over the longer term. Further there will be lot of scope for finger pointing since these are multi-national conglomerates and it will be very hard to pin-point the source of mischief.

From the technology point of view none of the MRCA air-frames provide a significant leap compared to what the IAF already has in its inventory. Almost all the gains are in the avionics/weapons section which can easily be retrofitted on the current air-frames which the IAF carries.

The focus should be to use the budget to strengthen the Indian aviation complex. If the money has to be spent outside India, and the US has to be trusted then it should be to get a clear qualitative edge which the JSF provides. Buying the teens or the poodles provides little extra while compromising India's strategic independence.

Personally I am not sure what role the MRCA will fill which is not currently filled by the MKIs and the other aircraft in IAF inventory. Perhaps the focus should be on buying some more of the existing air-frames with an up to date avionics suite.

If the need is absolutely critical, and can not be fulfilled by buying more of the current class of aircraft, I would get a few squadrons of the Rafale, by all means a very capable aircraft. IAF's experience with the M2K has been quite positive and the Rafale offers a natural upgrade step. It is likely that the Rafale will require a smaller gestation period before the platform can be utilized to its full potential, compared to other MRCA contenders.

The numerical gap in aircraft strength should be filled with LCAs and developing the manufacturing base within India which can produce a few squadrons every year. Further a private sector R&D infrastructure should be nurtured. Over the longer term, if India has to become self-sufficient in military technology, the military complex should be able to attract the best engineers, scientists and the often neglected, managers. An Indian private sector would be in a much better position to attract and retain talent, and compete with foreign companies when it comes to fighting with the gloves (and pants) off.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid ... EaexgdeJDY

It seems that the French are having a hard time sustaining their own independent industry. I think India should consider this opportunity to do long term partnerships with the French with a focus on becoming development partners.
Last edited by VikramS on 22 Mar 2011 07:05, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2011 05:55

XPosting to record a data point:

Craig Alpert wrote:In Combat Debut, Navy Jammer (F-18 Growler) Targets Libyan Tanks
The Navy sped up production of its Next Generation Jammer earlier this year, meaning the Growler’s payload will soon be able to insert viruses into enemy command networks, not just block radars and communications transmissions in under five years.


AESA for you!!!!!!

Not dead sure, but in this area, I suspect Rafale is not even close. Forget the rest.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Singha » 22 Mar 2011 06:06

maybe but the problem is Unkil never ever gives his best EW to outside. the Growler is not for export - period. even in P8I there were laws barring export of US ASW gear so Boeing is 2nd sourcing some kit from a canadian vendor.

Growler is like the uber rich guys wife abduls can think about but not touch.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby VikramS » 22 Mar 2011 06:09

NRao wrote:
Craig Alpert wrote:In Combat Debut, Navy Jammer (F-18 Growler) Targets Libyan Tanks

The Navy sped up production of its Next Generation Jammer earlier this year, meaning the Growler’s payload will soon be able to insert viruses into enemy command networks, not just block radars and communications transmissions in under five years.


AESA for you!!!!!!

Not dead sure, but in this area, I suspect Rafale is not even close. Forget the rest.


This not new or specific to the Shornet.

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/de ... 6d649146cd

"The technology allows users to invade communications networks, see what enemy sensors see and even take over as systems administrator so sensors can be manipulated into positions so that approaching aircraft can’t be seen, they say. The process involves locating enemy emitters with great precision and then directing data streams into them that can include false targets and misleading messages algorithms that allow a number of activities including control."

This has to do with EM war-fare. AESA with its beam-shaping can concentrate a lot of EM energy in a narrow zone and may be useful. However the crux of the jammer is the understanding and penetration of the command and control system.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby negi » 22 Mar 2011 07:14

Ha Unkil is peddling it's Prithvi sized HAWK SAM system to dilli, a system which I first saw when I used to wear nappies. Leave Growler we might not get the APG-79 with all it's capabilities.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby SaiK » 22 Mar 2011 07:32

Singha wrote:Growler is like the uber rich guys wife abduls can think about but not touch.

:twisted: quite a growl indeed!

Inverse multiplexing is the only way to go!

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Vivek K » 22 Mar 2011 09:01

VikramS - couldn't agree with you more. Buy AESA tech, Engines, munitions for the LCA. MKII needs to be expedited. Start on MK3 (AMCA) simultaneously.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Jamie Boscardin » 22 Mar 2011 10:06

On the MMRCA been scrapped!, there is an outside chance that it happens as the Air Chief mentioned.
Buy EF, other contenders will go to court and say, the selected ac should have operational AESA as stated by IAF (by 2013 and not 2015 as the intended goal for EF AESA).
Buy Rafael, MOF, Saab, Mig will crib about L1 etc.
Buy any American ac, huge desi lobby will crib about selling out to america's.

Whichever way you look, if you really wanted to scrap the MMRCA, you just have too many variables to choose from and too many eager plays who will oblige.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Multatuli » 22 Mar 2011 12:43

Actually I hope this happens. India will spend USD 30bn (certain to escalate) on the FGFA + USD 10.5bn (also certain to escalate, there is no way any of the competing aircraft will come at 10.5 billion) on the MRCA in the next 20 years. This is an obscene amount of money. And I don't see a need for the MRCA, 120 tejas mk1, from 2018, 160 tejas mk2, from 2025, 200 tejas mk3, with 300 su-30MKI's should be enough.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Multatuli » 22 Mar 2011 12:59

Mid-air refuelers (say a total of 24) with more long endurance Airborne Warning and Control platforms would do more to enhance IAF's capabilities then 126 foreign design MRCA's. And I agree that there is no need to bring in the F-35, which is a pipe dream anyway, since it won't come without India formally joining the ranks of American client states.
Last edited by Multatuli on 22 Mar 2011 13:02, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby jai » 22 Mar 2011 13:02

I think both scenarios have been discussed in the previous threads - go for MMRCA or cancel it; and quite a lot has changed around our neighborhood since IAF first wanted to get more Mirage 2000's - which led to this circus finally.

Both the dragon and pukis have been arming themselves to the teeth and a two pronged war is more a possibility now (if it happens) than ever before. Both seem to be very aggressive in their stance towards us, and have extensively modernized their defense forces.

IAF would naturally be the number one choice for quick reaction defense or offense against any enemy attacks, and thus needs to be ready for the worst case scenario - where they will need both hi technology and numbers if they are to keep both the pukis and dragon at bay at the same time. In my opinion, it will need over 50 Sqns to ensure peace and parity in this environment.

Given this reality I think the GOI should quickly conclude the contest, give IAF the plane they want, and really move to a high rate of production of the selected platform. The govt has enough legal eagles to deal with any dissenters who want to go to court and should put them to good use for once. Its GOI's prime responsibility to let nothing come in the way of conclusion of this contest and then speedy induction of the selected platforms.

We have enough money now for parallel modernization of the other armed forces and for acquisition of other systems, it would make no sense to not acquire more high tech fighters right now.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Viv S » 22 Mar 2011 13:07

NRao wrote:Do not know if Spain is part of this circus, and, have not seen any reports of German planes. Between the UK and Italy, they have sent only the Tornado for ground ops. The EF is there to ensure air integrity!!!! Cosmetic is my impression.

Also get the impression that France has its own circus act - way outside of what the others seem to have.

I do not think it will, but hope that none of this will get attention in the MMRCA deal.


I don't about Italy but Britain's detachment consists of 10 Eurofighters and 4 Tornados. The Tornados employed the Storm Shadow on the first RAF missions - which the EF will not be able to use for quite a while yet. Also, I don't think the other AFs involved have been engaging in tank busting like the French.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Gagan » 22 Mar 2011 13:19

Is the 'scrap MMRCA' 'buy JSF' tag line appearing in the press because khan knows that its birds are out of the contest?

Maybe the price negotiation committee didn't approach Boeing.

Given the way the Rafale and the EF are vying for attention (advantage Rafale) in Libya would also suggest that the eurobirds are the leaders.

Maybe it is a tie between EF and Rafale, and the french are leaving no stone unturned to show down the EF in Libiya.
Don't write off the Gripen either. It is:
1. The cheapest non American bird
2. The US really went after it to undermine its bid - tells me something.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Manish_Sharma » 22 Mar 2011 13:54

Multatuli wrote:Actually I hope this happens. India will spend USD 30bn (certain to escalate) on the FGFA + USD 10.5bn (also certain to escalate, there is no way any of the competing aircraft will come at 10.5 billion) on the MRCA in the next 20 years. This is an obscene amount of money. And I don't see a need for the MRCA, 120 tejas mk1, from 2018, 160 tejas mk2, from 2025, 200 tejas mk3, with 300 su-30MKI's should be enough.


^^I "Like" this!

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby jai » 22 Mar 2011 14:38

Multatuli wrote: And I don't see a need for the MRCA, 120 tejas mk1, from 2018, 160 tejas mk2, from 2025, 200 tejas mk3, with 300 su-30MKI's should be enough.


I thought the total LCA orders so far were only for 40 aircraft. Do you have a reference source for the 120 Mk1, 160 Mk2 and 200 MK3 quoted here ?

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby nits » 22 Mar 2011 18:45

F-18 and Eurofighter was never considered earlier for MMRCA Tender : Offical

What could be quite a revelation ,Indian air force official have informed idrw.org ,that until end of 2005 , F-18 and Euro-fighter was never considered for MMRCA Tender since they did not fit into air forces requirements then , Initially Air force wanted aircraft in medium weight category that included offers from French on Mirage-2000-5 ,Lockheed martin with their F-16 C/D and Russian offer of upgraded Mig-29SMT .

But opening of the Tender to multiple vendors by then Defence Minister Pranab Mukherji in UPA-1 Government insured that tender became larger ,and Medium Weight category was no longer mandatory since heavier class fighter aircrafts entered the race .

Official also told that opening of the tender surely lead to further delays and set back whole process by 5 years ,which was considerable amount of time lost to procure aircraft’s for a shrinking air force fleet , he also pointed out that Request for Proposal (RFP) actually favoured single engine fighters due to its emphasis on life cycle costs,since life cycle costs of a single engine fighter are substantially lower than that of twin engine fighter.

With Pak-FA and AMCA 5th generation fighter deal all done and work on them have already began and IAF is all set to procure and operate them by turn of this decade , official admitted that MMRCA tender and the aircraft’s have lost all its shine and will be a second fiddle to MKI and PAK-FA in near future in IAF fleet .

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby shukla » 22 Mar 2011 19:10

An Interview with Euro fighter Programmer, Erwin Obermeier

SLD: In terms of exports, is the Indian competition the most important one for Eurofighter?

Obermeier: At present, I consider the Indian Medium Multi Role Combat Aircraft competition is the most important one.  We have some others, too. And of course, the Indians, they are very clever people, and they want to have the most modern thing.  The Indians clearly want to have aircrafts with E-scan radar. And therefore,  it’s important that we swiftly develop this E-scan radar for the core customer as well as for export.

An important consideration for our export customers, like for India is the ability of the Eurofighter to carry a variety of weapons.  And the customers can integrate separately their weapons of choice, either imported or indigenously developed.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby shiv » 22 Mar 2011 19:12




Suddenly it occurs to me that the air force seems to prefer quick import deals to match Pakis - just like we did quick reactive imports for MiG 21, Su-7, MiG 23, Mirage 2000 etc. On the other hand I can see their point because the civilian establishment does not know the meaning of urgency or deadlines.

Somewhere the two will have to meet.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby VikramS » 22 Mar 2011 19:54

shivji:

I agree completely about the knee-jerk nature of procurement. There is no strategic national policy.

I strongly believe that a tie-up with the French will serve a lot of good, if they are willing to play ball.

=> Near First Rate Technology
=> Strategic Independence
=> Ability to prevent sales to Chipanda
=> They NEED a partner to continue their independence and not become another poodle.

Good thing is that like the Shakti engine India will be able to customize the technology for their specific needs, instead of the brochure wars.

Further from a longer term strategic point of view, it will always be useful to have a strong third party supplier apart from the usual US/Russian maal. From whatever I have heard, the French though a bit expensive stand by the product; what you see is what you get very little late stage arm-twisting.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby NRao » 22 Mar 2011 21:06

VikramS wrote:
NRao wrote:
AESA for you!!!!!!

Not dead sure, but in this area, I suspect Rafale is not even close. Forget the rest.


This not new or specific to the Shornet.

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/blogs/de ... 6d649146cd

"The technology allows users to invade communications networks, see what enemy sensors see and even take over as systems administrator so sensors can be manipulated into positions so that approaching aircraft can’t be seen, they say. The process involves locating enemy emitters with great precision and then directing data streams into them that can include false targets and misleading messages algorithms that allow a number of activities including control."

This has to do with EM war-fare. AESA with its beam-shaping can concentrate a lot of EM energy in a narrow zone and may be useful. However the crux of the jammer is the understanding and penetration of the command and control system.


Sure. (Nor did I claim that, but I understand the point you are trying to make and it is valid.)

I had posted (perhaps it is in the MRCA technology only thread), long before this Israeli effort, what they were envisioning the AESA to be: one of the goals was to make it a part of a (real) broad-band network. This news item (as far as I know) is the first time they have ack'ed that part of it.

Now, on rethinking, I MAY have jumped the gun and assigned this capability to the AESA. The article does not state that and so it may be a mistake on my part.

more l8r.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Multatuli » 22 Mar 2011 21:31

I thought the total LCA orders so far were only for 40 aircraft. Do you have a reference source for the 120 Mk1, 160 Mk2 and 200 MK3 quoted here ?


It should be obvious that those dates and numbers are something I would like to see happen and not what the GoI/IAF have announced.

Vikram S, the time to go indigenous (Indian) is right now. The economy has momentum and our R&D in aerospace has crossed a threshold with the Tejas. We seem to think alike.

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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby Drishyaman » 22 Mar 2011 22:27

Not a bad idea to scrap MMRCA. Why spend $10.5B on anything like Gripen, which fears toenter battle field and comes up with innovative excuses to avoid battle fields. Instead spend that half that money in fast tracking Tejas MK-II and half of that in fast tracking AMCA. $5B on Tejas MK-II will probably fast track it to 2015. And if Gripen misses the deal we might have an indegenious fighter better than what the Swedes would have in 2015. That money can also be used to increase the production line for Tejas MK-II.

Sweden’s defence minister announced that, without an Indian or Brazilian order, his air force would not develop the new Gripen fighter till at least 2018.


http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NEWS/news ... wsid=14544
Last edited by Drishyaman on 23 Mar 2011 01:51, edited 1 time in total.

SaiK
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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby SaiK » 22 Mar 2011 23:32

If we are scrapping MRCA, then there should be some serious thought about intermediate MCA before we jump to AMCA. Simple steps la Mirage 4000 types. Dual engine LCA Mk3, larger nose (can imitate already established FGFA nose), larger wing (perhaps redesigned dihedral and canards or FGFA type LERX), DSI / FGFA types inlets, everything masala coming quick out of NAL CFD labs). Elta AESA or LRDE AESA is a must. IAF can buy this for about $60M that includes partial stealth, complete set of avionics and ECM suite, perhaps launch barhmos and ks172 as well.

Must be flight tested in 4 years time flat. EADS or Rafale or SAAB or sukhoi can be consultants.
Last edited by SaiK on 22 Mar 2011 23:40, edited 2 times in total.

manum
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Re: MRCA News and Discussion - March 2011

Postby manum » 22 Mar 2011 23:36

I'll rather say go for Mig35, if its about only raising squadron strength (or not letting it go down to dangerous levels)...and after that get LCA in mass, in variants...
Mig 35 fulfills all the criteria and requirements posed by MRCA, while I guess it'll outperform or equally perform any of other famed contenders.
Choosing Mig 35 will not let anyone put spoke in the wheel...except they cribbing why all this drama, when its all the way Russia.
since we havent picked Typhoon engine for LCA, so we are already not in a fix to even get a European fighter, if they are still developing...and I am dead sure, now with full backup we can outdo any of the fighters in future in capability terms, We have dealt with European and Russian legacy fighters already. Engine tech is last obstacle we must cross.
and I think with such a vastly experienced and well trained IAF. We might not need to spend so much.

This is I am saying because in future arms embargo aimed at China will be removed and then only thing that will distinguish us is out contextual technology we have developed...because then everyone will be able to buy...I am sure for long time China will be buying far more than India.


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