The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

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sumishi
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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby sumishi » 21 Aug 2011 22:44

Altair wrote:She will come and accept Lokpal and give AH a glass of water.Rahul does charan sparsh and India celebrates! Rahul becomes PM.MMS fired for incompetence and will be blamed for all corruption inc in India!! :twisted:
Hypothetically speaking, what is the take on the protesting junta (the active ones) actually accepting such a "hypothetical" farce at face value? Are they informed enough on the die-nasty thing, or can they still be charmed by dimpled smiles?

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby IndraD » 21 Aug 2011 22:52

Altair wrote:
RoyG wrote:VAT about sonia yaar?

She will come and accept Lokpal and give AH a glass of water.Rahul does charan sparsh and India celebrates! Rahul becomes PM.MMS fired for incompetence and will be blamed for all corruption inc in India!! :twisted:


:rotfl:
well said sir but this junta looks rigid asking buniyadi sawal of roti kapda aur makan.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Muppalla » 21 Aug 2011 22:57

http://www.tsr.net.co/profiles/blogs/ca ... ger-strike

WTH is she trying to say. I can't get it.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby sumishi » 21 Aug 2011 22:58

rajanb wrote:
sumishi wrote:What a loony toon is this Rahul?? (Headlines Today), doing a Karan Thapar (CNN IBN) on Arvind Kejriwal and Prashant Bhushan right now...

I saw that. but Kejriwal stuffed him nicely. :lol:
Infact I continued watching it so that I could enjoy the polite screws.

u mean, a "thok"pal (ठोक पाल) :mrgreen:

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Patni » 21 Aug 2011 23:01

I am really pleasantly surprised and elated with on going awakening of people from all walk of life.The new age Indian is not at all short on confidence and is showing real determination to get the system to change course and be responsive towards what should be right! Politicians have thrived by dividing the mass, in endless different groups and playing electoral politics to gain power, at last the tide seems to be turning for better! The simultaneous raising of people from all part of India and from all walk of society, across class, coming out in support of call for increased accountability from power that be, is really awe inspiring! The young generation is digesting lessons of peaceful agitation well! the new and transparent governance benchmarks will be demanded and things can only get better!

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby IndraD » 21 Aug 2011 23:06

With all my heart I present this on current scenario

Singhasan khali karo ki junta aat hai (Ramdhari Singh Dinakar)

Vacate the throne people are coming

Image

http://www.geeta-kavita.com/hindi_sahitya.asp?id=415
Last edited by IndraD on 21 Aug 2011 23:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby sumishi » 21 Aug 2011 23:11

Muppalla wrote:http://www.tsr.net.co/profiles/blogs/can-the-hungry-go-on-a-hunger-strike

WTH is she trying to say. I can't get it.

Like she says in the article, "I ... try to play my part."
I can empathise with her state of mind as she keyboarded this arsetickle. I often face such a situation, when I doze off on some Sunday afternoons only to wake up in a confused state of mind trying to establish whether its dawn or dusk.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby vijayk » 21 Aug 2011 23:11

sumishi wrote:
Altair wrote:She will come and accept Lokpal and give AH a glass of water.Rahul does charan sparsh and India celebrates! Rahul becomes PM.MMS fired for incompetence and will be blamed for all corruption inc in India!! :twisted:
Hypothetically speaking, what is the take on the protesting junta (the active ones) actually accepting such a "hypothetical" farce at face value? Are they informed enough on the die-nasty thing, or can they still be charmed by dimpled smiles?


They have been falling for that in 2009 and when the corruption stink started coming out, they all realized CON stink.
The slogan "Desh ka yuva jaag gaya, Rahul Gandhi bhaag gaya" says it all about this movement.

Let this generation realize the young and charming Rahul is part of the disgusting DIE-nasty.

I remember that Rajiv Gandhi was so handsome that many young people got swayed in 1985.

Naxals support or not, this generation came to know first hand about the DIE-nasty.

Remember! CPI and CPM supported Indira before Emergency!
The same lefty, commie and communal forces who thrive on Divide and Rule are still behind Sonia system.

The young people are slowly awakening.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby RoyG » 21 Aug 2011 23:12

Muppalla wrote:http://www.tsr.net.co/profiles/blogs/can-the-hungry-go-on-a-hunger-strike

WTH is she trying to say. I can't get it.


Who the hell cares! All she has been able to do for the past couple years is squirm b/c nobody gives a sh*t about her. Typing about nonsense like privatization sucks, maoism and secularism rock, on her brand new smart phone in the comfort of a posh bungalow.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby saip » 21 Aug 2011 23:13

How many doctors do you need to check one patient, even if it is fasting Anna?
Link

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby CRamS » 21 Aug 2011 23:29

Muppalla wrote:http://www.tsr.net.co/profiles/blogs/can-the-hungry-go-on-a-hunger-strike
Our county is poised at a dangerous place right now.


Maybe then she should migrate to the elite upper west side of NY city. She will be welcomed wth open arms and showered millions and Pultizers and what not to write a weekly column in NYT about evil India and evil Hindus. Maybe Pankaj Misra with his Brit wife can also leave India now that it is dangerous.


But Muppalla, I read your arguments. I am no expert on how best to tackle corruption in a country like India boss, but yes I can see this Lokpal business as form form of vigilanti justice. Not good for India in general, but if the movement at least begin to tackle the problem at a parliamentary level, there is some usefulness to it. Very complex problem and not to easy to deal with.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby rsingh » 22 Aug 2011 00:20

I am not a great believer Baba Ramdev et all.....as I made my position clear earlier. But I am shaken by will power and stamina of this old bhadrapurush. I wish if I was bold enough to go and protest in front of Indian Embassy...........but not.......I am just another armchair loudmouth who do not or can not act.
Here are few comments / observations from me

-I have no problem with Maoists if they give up violence and use democratic ways to make their points
- This whole episode is like a filter..........we know who is who. Biggest looser is INC and NDTV type media where pseudo intellectual in cotton kurtas make weird comments and used to get away with it.
- World respect India,Indian democracy............not a single word of "advise" from usual suspects.
- What Mamta Benerji is doing...............she has best chance to do something for country.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby IndraD » 22 Aug 2011 01:02

Dubai police crack down on peaceful march supporting AH

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... 687544.cms

Manish Tewary exposed over AH

http://aajtak.intoday.in/videoplay.php/ ... y-RTI.html

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby IndraD » 22 Aug 2011 01:24

Needless belligerence


here are three distinct issues involved with Anna Hazare’s agitation.

The first is to do with mounting corruption in high places. Prime Minister Manmohan Singh has much to answer for; Parliament can no longer delay legislation to make those in authority accountable for their sins of omission and commission.

Second, citizens of this country have the right to protest peacefully. It is an indisputable fact that the people of India are seething with rage and are no longer willing to see their country be looted by corrupt politicians. This rage has to be adequately addressed; not to do so could lead to unhappy consequences that are entirely undesirable. However, it is debatable whether the Prime Minister and his men, or the Congress leaders for that matter, can douse the flames of anger, having lit them in the first place through their callous disregard for probity.

The third issue is of legislation. That must remain firmly in the domain of the legislature which comprises elected representatives of the people. On this there must not be any compromise.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby vera_k » 22 Aug 2011 01:50

At this time, it would be best if MMS resigns and calls for fresh elections. He will lose, and INC will be in opposition at which point Rahul can take over.

The issues fanning discontent right now - like food, petrol prices or the loss of export opportunities due to the developed economies digging out of debt - will not be fixed anytime soon. Any fractious coalition that gets sworn in will either collapse under its own contradictions sooner rather than later or find the economic headwinds too heavy to steer, at which point INC can win and be back in the saddle again under Rahul.

If elections right now are not desirable in order to keep economic growth going, then they should impose an Emergency.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby joshvajohn » 22 Aug 2011 02:50

India’s culture of black money
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opi ... le2134566/


India tops the list for black money in the entire world, $1,456 billion
http://www.timesofbombay.com/2011/08/21 ... 6-billion/

The cost of the black economy
http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/lead/ar ... epage=true

Centre sitting on list of 600 Indians with Swiss accounts
http://www.rediff.com/news/report/centr ... 110819.htm

'Congress ministers have Rs 22000cr in Swiss banks'
http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes ... wiss-banks

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby James B » 22 Aug 2011 05:03


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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Aug 2011 05:18

Surya wrote:
Baba Ramdev a.k.a Bharat Rakshak


No thanks


Why, sirjee? Its not as if we keyboard warriors & jingoes here on BRF alone constitute bharat rakshaks.

I see Ramdev as a rakshak of sorts of the dehaati Bharat that is not inglis-speaking India. In that sense Muppala garu's description is not off the mark.

Anyway, moi 2 cents and all that. Each to his own, I guess.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby SwamyG » 22 Aug 2011 05:25

RoyG wrote:Hazare telling gov to go if lokpal not implemented. Where is sonia btw? Agnivesh and others around hazare make this whole thing stink. However, i get the feeling that lefties are being let down. Don't really know where this whole movement is going.

If anyone, even the organizers themselves, had suggested exactly where this was going - they would be fooling us. The mass appeal is unprecedented for recent times. Everybody, good and bad, is climbing on the bandwagon. Lots of aam admi - good people, people with hope, frustrated people, cornered people ityadi think this could be the answer to their problems. Only time will tell who is the winner.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby SaiK » 22 Aug 2011 05:32

jee.. why people in dubhai did a march? wrong place to do such things.

so, we have $1-2Trillion now for public benefit.. and exactly where the money should go.. spend it on PURA plan as envisaged by kalam ji.
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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Aug 2011 05:32

^^^Anna wouldn't have made it if coke and pepsi (not to mention Seagram's and UB) don't feature the Gandhi topi as brand mascot only....:D

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby shiv » 22 Aug 2011 06:29

saip wrote:How many doctors do you need to check one patient, even if it is fasting Anna?
Link


Depends on the system of payment and country.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby JwalaMukhi » 22 Aug 2011 06:32

SwamyG wrote:If anyone, even the organizers themselves, had suggested exactly where this was going - they would be fooling us. The mass appeal is unprecedented for recent times. Everybody, good and bad, is climbing on the bandwagon. Lots of aam admi - good people, people with hope, frustrated people, cornered people ityadi think this could be the answer to their problems. Only time will tell who is the winner.

No kidding. Absolutely, the trio inmates of Tihar jail, namely, Raja, Kani and kalmadi probably will throw in their support to brother. Actually, the trio are probably feeling elated for the privilege of sharing their current residencies with Brother.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Anindya » 22 Aug 2011 06:33

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Religious-lines-blur-for-Annas-cause/articleshow/9690107.cms

A large number of fasting Muslim volunteers have been seen feeding hungry protesters at the venue. Iqbal, 23, a volunteer in one of the kitchens, was seen distributing food to the supporters on Sunday. "I have kept my roza, but that does not deter me from feeding all these people who come here to support Anna. It is a fight that cuts across social barriers," he said.

Maqsood Ull Hasan Qasmi, president of the Imam Council of India, who was present at Ramlila Maidan, asked fellow Muslims to come out in support of Anna. "We all are equal sufferers in this. This is our second freedom struggle," he said while addressing the gathering


and also http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Bukhari-calls-stir-anti-Islam-tells-Muslims-to-stay-away/articleshow/9690525.cms

NEW DELHI: Syed Ahmed Bukhari, Shahi Imam of Delhi's Jama Masjid, has called upon Muslims to stay away from the Anna movement saying his war cry - Vande Mataram and Bharat Mata Ki Jai - are against Islam.

"Islam does not condone the worship of the nation or land. It does not even condone worship of the mother who nurtures a child in her womb. How can Muslims then join his stir with a war cry that is against the basic tenets of Islam. I have advised them to stay away," Bukhari told TOI.

Bukhari, who is not perceived to be close to the Congress, may have inadvertently voiced the very concerns that Congress leaders have been expressing off the record about how Anna's stir has isolated Muslims though none of them had ventured to make a public statement on this. The call has also reignited the centuries old debate of Vande Mataram being anti-Muslim.

Even though Team Anna includes lawyers like Prashant and Shanti Bhushan who have taken up cudgels against Narendra Modi for his alleged role in the Gujarat riots, the Shahi Imam, one of the tallest Muslim religious leader, is critical of the movement because he feels that communalism and not corruption is the bane of the country. "If Anna had included communalism in his agenda, I would have been more convinced of his intentions," he said.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Pranav » 22 Aug 2011 06:41

Muppalla wrote:http://www.tsr.net.co/profiles/blogs/can-the-hungry-go-on-a-hunger-strike

WTH is she trying to say. I can't get it.


This is the key phrase from suzy:

Obviously, the people who were making all the money were the corporations ...


Looks like she wants to tell people that the 2G family and their hangers-on did not make any money.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby shiv » 22 Aug 2011 06:42

SaiK wrote:jee.. why people in dubhai did a march? wrong place to do such things.


Why? Indian citizens in Dubai would all have had to pay bribes in India to get various things done and the money they send home to relatives in india will be leaking away. Bribes for registering property that is already yours. Bribes for signing a building plan that is perfectly legal and valid. Bribes for getting an electricity meter fitted. Bribes for getting a water meter fitted. Bribes to get the local authority to cut and remove a tree on a public road that has fallen to block your driveway. Bribes to get a learners driving license. Bribes to get the road transport authority to give you all the free forms so that you can sell them in your small shop in an instance of corruption benefiting your private enterprise. Your father died? Bribe the crematorium clerk to ensure that the death certificate is issued. Your property tax payment is one day late? Bribe the clerk who will not accept it with the required late fee but will accept it with a bribe. You have a business that rents our road resurfacing equipment. You get the contract by paying a kickback to the local corporator and you take the risk by doing a shoddy job. You want an illegal construction? Get it done by bribing the local authority.

May BRFites have been harping on BRF for a decade about the re writing of history. But what is never mentioned is that no Indian is taught how the government works - so most Indians do not understand how deep bribery and corruption are part of the Indian system. There as a time on BRF when talking about corruption would get people angry and evoke accusations of anti-nationalism in this dharmic country. Utter nonsense. In terms of volumes of money involved India is the most corrupt nation on earth.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby vijayk » 22 Aug 2011 06:55

http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/lead/article2379704.ece
I do not want to be Anna

Here is the piece you are waiting for..

Dhoti Roy goes berserk in Hindu. I think madam did not receive the memo in time. Or may be travelling on ISI's money trying to release Ghulam Nabi Fai. Who knows?

Finally, madam clarified that she does not want to be Anna.

She doesn't want to be part of you right-wing, yindoo, bharat mata ki jai or jai hind type of low class yindoos. Madam is too classy for you.

If what we're watching on TV is indeed a revolution, then it has to be one of the more embarrassing and unintelligible ones of recent times. For now, whatever questions you may have about the Jan Lokpal Bill, here are the answers you're likely to get: tick the box — (a) Vande Mataram (b) Bharat Mata ki Jai (c) India is Anna, Anna is India (d) Jai Hind.

For completely different reasons, and in completely different ways, you could say that the Maoists and the Jan Lokpal Bill have one thing in common — they both seek the overthrow of the Indian State. One working from the bottom up, by means of an armed struggle, waged by a largely adivasi army, made up of the poorest of the poor. The other, from the top down, by means of a bloodless Gandhian coup, led by a freshly minted saint, and an army of largely urban, and certainly better off people. (In this one, the Government collaborates by doing everything it possibly can to overthrow itself.)...


As a good COMMIE, first madam admonishes all RSS, yindoo right-wing, sanghi, saffron middle class for all the hangama.

Is it surprising that members of Team Anna have also been associated with Youth for Equality, the anti-reservation (pro-“merit”) movement?


In addition to usual yindoo right wind conspiracy, madam added a little Forward caste vs Lower caste masala to the mix of her theories.

Watch out for undyTV, CNN/IBN next couple of days. They will bring out all the anti-Mandal student leaders who became part of Anna Bazaar. I think the SONIA madam and her cronies handed over new script. Checking for fault lines you see!

The campaign is being handled by people who run a clutch of generously funded NGOs whose donors include Coca-Cola and the Lehman Brothers. Kabir, run by Arvind Kejriwal and Manish Sisodia, key figures in Team Anna, has received $400,000 from the Ford Foundation in the last three years. Among contributors to the India Against Corruption campaign there are Indian companies and foundations that own aluminum plants, build ports and SEZs, and run Real Estate businesses and are closely connected to politicians who run financial empires that run into thousands of crores of rupees. Some of them are currently being investigated for corruption and other crimes. Why are they all so enthusiastic


Madam now added investigative journalism to her fiction. Double Dhamal!

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby sumishi » 22 Aug 2011 06:59

shiv wrote:
SaiK wrote:jee.. why people in dubhai did a march? wrong place to do such things.

...
May BRFites have been harping on BRF for a decade about the re writing of history. But what is never mentioned is that no Indian is taught how the government works - so most Indians do not understand how deep bribery and corruption are part of the Indian system. There as a time on BRF when talking about corruption would get people angry and evoke accusations of anti-nationalism in this dharmic country. Utter nonsense. In terms of volumes of money involved India is the most corrupt nation on earth.

Just a thought: Is it possible to have a thread in BRF on "governance and actual practise" managed only by BRF luminaries (not mango BRFites). It could cover all topics of our school Civics course, theory in brief and actual practise in detail. Mangoes could submit experiences as relevant. It would soon get "notoriety" on the web.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Muppalla » 22 Aug 2011 07:08

As part of Hindu puja process, the prayer starts with Ganesha puja and asking for no hindrances for rest of the puja and later to whatever they do. The priest actually starts with something called as sankalp(am).

Similar to that all these Dhothi/Aruna Roys, Manders, Diggies have one common ritual. Whatever they do or write they start with bashing RSS. It has become hillarious because they call even someone saying Bharatmata ki jai or Vandemataram as RSS. If you speak any language other than English, you are Hindu facist.

Bashing RSS for Dhoti/Mander == Om Suklam Baradharam Vishnum Shashi Varanam Chatur Bhujam Prasanna Vadanam Dhyaye Sarva Vighnopa Shantaye for most Indians.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Hari Seldon » 22 Aug 2011 07:14

From the sarkari dirty tricks dept (from twitter, TIFWIW)

@newsbuzzer
Over two dozen 'drunk' men created a ruckus at the Ramlila Maidan where Anna Hazare is sitting on a fast in the wee hours on Monday.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Sushupti » 22 Aug 2011 07:22

Anna Hazare and Co. – Coloured Revolution in the Making
Radha Rajan
19 Aug 2011

Kapil Sibal chose to overlook the fact that FDI in the print and electronic media is 26% when he thumped the pulpit in bogus anger two days ago at a seminar and demanded to know who was funding Anna Hazare’s drama and how he managed to get this kind of advertisement and publicity for his every sneeze and sniffle.

The media is not a philanthropic entity, as Kapil Sibal knows; money dictates editorial policies and nationalism is passé. The most important role in legitimising Sonia Gandhi’s neo-colonial ambition to rule a country not her own has been played by the media and Kapil Sibal cannot pretend that he and other worthies within the Congress and opportunists like Mamata Banerjee and Lalu Prasad Yadav did not bask in this media manufactured sunshine. Sushma Swaraj allowed FDI in media and the NDA may yet rue the day.


Kapil Sibal also chose to ignore the fact that the same forces which paratrooped Sonia Gandhi into the nation’s polity and the same forces which advertised Rahul Gandhi’s every sneeze and sniffle was almost certainly behind Anna Hazare and Co. And if, as the writer suspects, Anna Hazare is the means to realize Sonia Gandhi’s agenda for her family and for the country, then the conduct of all the dramatis personae, the lines they are mouthing and their actions fall in place.


The bizarre and uncharacteristically offensive statements made by Kapil Sibal gives the impression that Sonia Gandhi’s loyalists in the government actually wanted to provoke people to take to the streets in anger and force the Prime Minister to make a reckless move. And arresting the Gandhi-like toothless wonder with his own Mahadev Desai, Mirabehn and other service providers in tow, was just such a move.


The writer said it before and is saying it again – Anna Hazare’s campaign is neither nationalist or in national interest; the forces orchestrating the mass hysteria are looking to the future to create another Libya, Egypt and Indonesia-like chaos followed by take-over of the country by hooligans on the street. The take-over will be hopefully followed by prolonged chaos and then we will see the triumph of democracy when some American stooge like El Baradei or Au Sang Su Kyi will stand for elections and the kingdom of god will be established in India.


Anna Hazare is just a test run for things to come. The Generic Church is using Anna Hazare to assess what brings Indians to the streets and the reactions of political parties and other important organizations to mass hysteria and the media’s own self-whipped frenzy.


Just so people who are jumping into the issue fingers to nose and feet first come to their senses, they should pause, step back and contrast the drama unfolding around Anna Hazare and Co. (don’t lose sight of the Co.) with how the same government dealt with Baba Ramdev’s protest in June at Ramlila Maidan against the same corruption; only Baba Ramdev, unlike the more wily Anna, named names forgetting the all-important Congress/BJP bi-partisan commandment: Thou shalt not take the name of the Lady.

Isn’t it strange that all cataclysmic events in the country impacting this family happen in the absence of the Lady, who (like Bollywood’s police) always arrives in the interregnum between the climax and the denouement and reaps the benefits!


The Plot


Get rid of the Prime Minister who is now standing like a soldier between the Manchurian Candidate and the Throne.

As if to prove the point, Arnab Goswami, holding forth from his newsroom told us, hiding coyly behind “unnamed credible sources within the Congress”, that the whole thing was a “mess because the Prime Minister is refusing to avail of the reservoir of experience” available in the party. The reservoir of experience referred to Ahmed Patel and AK Anthony who, in her absence, are Sonia Gandhi’s flies on the wall and whom the Prime Minister is keeping at arms’ length.

Dramatis Personae

- The Prime Minister
- Sonia Gandhi and her coterie
- Anna Hazare and Co., primarily Kiran Bedi and Arvind Kejriwal, beneficiaries of the Rockefeller Foundation munificence who aspire, like Sonia Gandhi and her son, to be power centres without going through the democratic process within the party or within the country
- The 24 hour English News channels which are being trained by the Generic Church to become important instruments towards the Coloured Revolution


Unmasking Anna Hazare

- Is Anna Hazare’s campaign against corruption or is it to coerce the government to accept his draft of the Lokpal Bill?
- If the campaign was against corruption why did he not join forces with Baba Ramdev or invite him into the movement?
- If, as Anna Hazare hinted, Baba Ramdev’s campaign was flawed because it was political, why did Anna Hazare meet Advani on 1st July and Sonia Gandhi on 2nd July?
- If Anna Hazare is the common man’s man and his movement is apolitical he should not have sought the support of leaders of political parties and individual Members of Parliament
- Can any effective movement against corruption keep politics, political parties and politicians out of it
- For a man who claims to be the face of RK Laxman’s cartoon with his ears to the ground, did he not know about the innumerable charges of corruption that Dr. Subramanian Swamy has levied publicly against Rajiv Gandhi, Sonia Gandhi and her family in Italy?
- If Anna Hazare can meet Advani and Sonia Gandhi, why did he not seek a meeting with the Prime Minister, unless he thought he could get the Prime Minister to do what he wanted through Sonia Gandhi and not through the Indian Parliament?
- Was this not petty politics on the sly and smacking of self-interest?
- If the campaign was against corruption, why did he sidle up to Sonia Gandhi against the Prime Minister?
- Why was Anna Hazare’s letter to Dr. Manmohan Singh on the eve of Independence Day disrespectful of his person and the high constitutional office of the Prime Minister?
- Anna Hazare like an obedient minion of the media made the media’s heroes his heroes and the media’s villains his villains; this was a dead give-away that the forces who pull the media strings are pulling Anna Hazare’s strings too
- Anna Hazare is threatening to go on an indefinite fast until the government accepts Arvind Kejrival, Prashant Bhushan and Kiran Bedi’s draft of the Lokpal Bill
- This brazen Gandhi-like coercion to use the nation’s ordinary people to fulfill a personal agenda (accept my Bill) actually means Anna Hazare has not only no faith in the government, but is insisting now with the villainous media playing the chorus that the Prime Minister ‘read the writing on the wall’ and without delay pass his Bill
- Those promoting Gandhigiri with so much hysteria must sit down with Gandhi’s Collected Works and find out for themselves the number of times that Gandhi undertook fasts - we can count them on the fingers of one hand – full fast, partial fast, fast for a predetermined period, and indefinite fast, and learn how many of these fasts were undertaken for the nation and how many for his fetishes
- Expressing mistrust of Parliament or denying Parliament the right to discuss and then reject (or accept) the Draft is akin to questioning the entire democratic process which made this parliament and an insult to the last citizen of this country who participated in the process, warts and all, and expressed his preference for those representing him
- Most importantly, Parliament is accountable to the people; Anna Hazare and Co. are accountable to none
- Anna Hazare is now insisting that the government and the entire nation must accept only his draft of the Lokpal Bill; the Gandhian despot is out in the open

Sonia Gandhi’s Coterie


As the writer pointed out immediately after President Obama’s state visit to India, the fact that Sonia Gandhi was not given any pre-eminence during the formal reception or subsequent state functions in the President’s honour pointed to the fact that all was not well between the Prime Minister and the Congress President. Even the President of India, widely seen as Sonia’s appointee, was kept at bay.


On the issue of corruption too the divide between the Prime Minister (polite for government) and Sonia Gandhi (polite for the Congress party) became obvious once the dichotomy government vs party began to be openly talked about. Obviously Sonia Gandhi no longer controlled UPA II as totally as she had controlled UPA I or continues to control the party; there are ministers in the cabinet whose personal loyalty to Sonia Gandhi outweighs their loyalty to the cabinet, Prime Minister or Parliament.

The Prime Minister is being checked and stalled by this group on every move that he wants to make to deal with the crisis of corruption within his own party and within the institutions manned by the boss-lady’s appointees. After all he did get the CVC removed and he did get the CAG report out too; Suresh Kalmadi and Sheila Dikshit are not the end points in the trail of corruption; and if we factor in the imminent disclosure by Wikileaks’ Julian Assange of the list of Indians who have stashed money abroad, the time had come for the Prime Minister to be removed.

The essential difference between the movements led by Baba Ramdev and Anna Hazare was that while Baba Ramdev’s focus at was on black money stashed abroad, the focus of Anna Hazare and Co. was not corruption as a pervasive phenomenon but on the Lokpal Bill which this team had drafted.


The draft Lokpal Bill is not the same as the issue of corruption, and Sonia Gandhi’s coterie, better than any other group in the country understood this; as did the Prime Minister. And that is why Sonia Gandhi personally and her loyalists, Ahmed Patel, AK Anthony, Kapil Sibal and P Chidambaram with Digvijay Singh scoring the music dealt with Baba Ramdev in the manner seen at midnight on June 4 and succeeded, and why the same entities stood aloof and allowed the Prime Minister to deal with Anna Hazare and why the Prime Minister failed.


Sonia Gandhi’s unelectable minions in the government and party made sure the Prime Minister was isolated on the issue and also that he would fail to check Anna Hazare so that they could now legitimately ask for his removal and promote the Manchurian Candidate to the throne.

So whose cause is Anna Hazare really serving?


Kapil Sibal went out of his way to make a villain of Anna Hazare by repeatedly stating that Anna Hazare was usurping the function of Parliament by drafting the Lokpal Bill. If it was bad in principle, then this was not the first time. As pointed out earlier, Kapil Sibal was uncharacteristically offensive with a Gandhian (!) besides taking liberties with the truth. It was not just Anna Hazare and Co who had drafted their version of the Lokpal Bill; Aruna Roy, another beneficiary of Rockefeller munificence had her version of Lokpal Bill ready too.

The scandalous Prevention of Communal and Targeted Violence Bill was also not drafted by Parliament; it was drafted by Sonia Gandhi’s NAC and her loyalists had indicated that the government intended to place this Bill too in Parliament and pass in the monsoon session! It was almost as if Kapil Sibal wanted to inflame passions using the more than ready media to do it. At a time when senior ministers in the Cabinet ought to have watched their words and reacted with caution, Kapil Sibal and Ambika Soni were doing the exact opposite.


If the idea was to push the government deeper into the crisis and hold the Prime Minister responsible, they succeeded. The Manchurian Candidate after all, is ready and waiting. The Hindu has already said so.


The Media wants a Coloured revolution


The role of the media in the unfolding drama has been no less villainous than the role by Sonia Gandhi’s henchmen.

- Are the people outside Tihar jail the aam admi or are they political?
- We are here for Anna, screamed one while another wore a fetching cap with “I am Anna” slogan printed on it
- This is not like Baba Ramdev; this is not communal. We are here for Anna.
- Let me pan my camera on this gentleman. He has come here all the way from Hyderabad for Anna
- This man has ‘bunked’ office and he is here for Anna.
- People March, government crawls, screamed Times of India


All that the media wanted to hear, all that the media wanted to show. Not a single unseemly sight, not a single discordant note. India is with Anna screamed the media the whole day. A question though – how did the media in all that milling crowd find that one man who had come there for Anna all the way from Hyderabad or that one man who had ‘bunked office for Anna or that one lady who screeched this is not political, this is not communal, we are with you Anna.

When Sonia Gandhi ordered the midnight Stalinist assault against Baba Ramdev and his bhaktas, we did not see the media reacting in self-righteous anger. Electricity to Ramlila Maidan was cut off at night, women and children were forced to wander on the streets at night and Baba Ramdev was forcibly removed from Delhi and ordered to stay out of Delhi for the rest of the month.


The media did not ask how this was any different from the British government transporting Tilak and Savarkar away from their own country into exile or how this was different from Kashmiri jihadis forcing Kashmiri Hindus from out of their homeland.


The media is making the same pernicious distinction between ‘ordinary people’ and people with political affiliations that Lalu Prasad Yadav made when he almost justified the burning alive of men, women and children in the Sabarmati Express at Godhra Station by describing them as ‘karsevaks’.

By the media’s definition, ordinary people deserve the halo aam admi only when they are not karsevaks, not RSS cadre, not Baba Ramdev’s bhaktas and not Hindus.


Warning


The very idea of Lokpal Bill is bad in law because it envisages an extra-constitutional body which will usurp the functions of parliament, police and judiciary.
http://www.vigilonline.com/index.php?op ... &Itemid=71

The media has instigated a section of the people against their lawfully elected government. The media has shamed the country by depicting the government as being susceptible to blackmail.

This is eerily similar to the days when the media paraded hysterical relatives of the hostages of IC 814 and took great pride in having forced the government to succumb to jihadi blackmail. It does not bode well for the nation if the media delights in getting the government to ‘crawl’ whether before Anna Hazare or before terrorists.


The government is our government, our country’s government and if the government crawls as the media gloats, it is the people of the nation who are humiliated; it is democracy which has been diminished. It is the media dancing to the tune of 26% FDI which has brought this humiliation upon us.


The hysterical crowds in Delhi and elsewhere are not India. For every hundred individuals the media is showing the world as ‘India’ there are ten thousand sitting at home deeply concerned about the consequences of this media-orchestrated frenzy.


The Catholic Church alone sees the possibility that the Prime Minister is not going anywhere and if he is going somewhere at all then he will probably take the government with him. And that is why the Catholic Bishops Conference has admonished Anna Hazare and told him the country cannot be governed from the streets. The Catholic Bishops Conference would ideally like the country to continue to be governed from 10 Janpath.
http://www.cathnewsindia.com/2011/08/16 ... agitation/


The BJP should think long and hard about whether to make common cause with Anna Hazare just because he is posturing against the Prime Minister. The BJP must also think long and hard whether it wants to play postman and carry Anna Hazare’s parcel to Parliament or if it wants to maintain the dignity of Parliament by strengthening its law-making capacity. My enemy’s enemy is not my friend here.

These are anti-national forces staging a dress rehearsal for a future coloured revolution with a Manchurian Candidate already groomed and ready to be anointed. The BJP must not aid the forces which want the Prime Minister out and the Manchurian Candidate in; the BJP must bring the government down, Sonia Gandhi, Rahul Gandhi, Kapil Sibal et al.

The author is editor, http://www.vigilonline.com

http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisp ... px?id=1928

shivajisisodia
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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby shivajisisodia » 22 Aug 2011 07:22

shiv wrote:
SaiK wrote:jee.. why people in dubhai did a march? wrong place to do such things.


Why? Indian citizens in Dubai would all have had to pay bribes in India to get various things done and the money they send home to relatives in india will be leaking away. Bribes for registering property that is already yours. Bribes for signing a building plan that is perfectly legal and valid. Bribes for getting an electricity meter fitted. Bribes for getting a water meter fitted. Bribes to get the local authority to cut and remove a tree on a public road that has fallen to block your driveway. Bribes to get a learners driving license. Bribes to get the road transport authority to give you all the free forms so that you can sell them in your small shop in an instance of corruption benefiting your private enterprise. Your father died? Bribe the crematorium clerk to ensure that the death certificate is issued. Your property tax payment is one day late? Bribe the clerk who will not accept it with the required late fee but will accept it with a bribe. You have a business that rents our road resurfacing equipment. You get the contract by paying a kickback to the local corporator and you take the risk by doing a shoddy job. You want an illegal construction? Get it done by bribing the local authority.

May BRFites have been harping on BRF for a decade about the re writing of history. But what is never mentioned is that no Indian is taught how the government works - so most Indians do not understand how deep bribery and corruption are part of the Indian system. There as a time on BRF when talking about corruption would get people angry and evoke accusations of anti-nationalism in this dharmic country. Utter nonsense. In terms of volumes of money involved India is the most corrupt nation on earth.



Sir,

I couldnt agree more, Sir. I congratulate you on a very profound and CORRECT analysis. Spoken like a true nationalist, although as you said, most people will brand you an anti-national for criticising corruption and the corrupt.

Even now, I think what you say will not be appreciated by a lot of people. Large numbers of people, even in the middle class, have become too invested in corruption in India. As much as I support anti-corruption movements of all kinds and hue, I personally somehow cannot bring myself to being optimistic that there will be any major dent made in corruption in India, despite all the best intentions and efforts of people like Anna Sb and Babaji and millions of others who are supporting them. I think corruption is so ingrained in the Indian DNA and has been for our entire history (although it has progressively gotten worse with every passing millenium, every passing century and every passing year), that these genuinely anti-corruption millions are far more likely to disappear than the rest of the Indians curing themselves of this genetic disease.

There, I will now brace myself of extreme fire that will be directed at me for making the above statment.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Sushupti » 22 Aug 2011 07:28

Lokpal and the Three (Magsaysay) Musketeers
S Faizi
21 Aug 2011

While condemning the short detention of Anna Hazare and his colleagues, it is nevertheless pertinent to understand what the Magsaysay Award really is, especially in the wake of the United States’ official support to the anti-corruption agitation led by three Magsaysay awardees (Anna Hazare, Kiran Bedi and Arvind Kejriwal).

http://www.vijayvaani.com/FrmPublicDisp ... px?id=1923

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Venkarl » 22 Aug 2011 07:30

Q) How to create fault-lines?
Ans:Bukhari calls stir anti-Islam, tells Muslims to stay away

With Sonia's church already at work and now Bukhari's call, the sankusthapan for creating initial fault lines among protesting citizens has already started. Next, a communal riot may be orchestrated and then all up in the air in the name of peace, national harmony and security. But protesting middal class citizens have to be aware of such tactics and make others aware to overcome these "Calls and Critics"

JMT

P.S. While we fight among ourselves what Altairji has said could happen. Anything is pojjibul in India you see.
Last edited by Venkarl on 22 Aug 2011 07:35, edited 1 time in total.

Singha
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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Singha » 22 Aug 2011 07:31

as part of a larger exercise france has turned over a list of Indians to GOI who have foreign accounts (cant recall if in france or switzerland). some might be legitimate accounts used by exim companies, but the bulk will likely be illegal.
no word yet on what the GOI intends to do with it.

shiv
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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby shiv » 22 Aug 2011 07:41

sumishi wrote:
shiv wrote:...
May BRFites have been harping on BRF for a decade about the re writing of history. But what is never mentioned is that no Indian is taught how the government works - so most Indians do not understand how deep bribery and corruption are part of the Indian system. There as a time on BRF when talking about corruption would get people angry and evoke accusations of anti-nationalism in this dharmic country. Utter nonsense. In terms of volumes of money involved India is the most corrupt nation on earth.

Just a thought: Is it possible to have a thread in BRF on "governance and actual practise" managed only by BRF luminaries (not mango BRFites). It could cover all topics of our school Civics course, theory in brief and actual practise in detail. Mangoes could submit experiences as relevant. It would soon get "notoriety" on the web.

sumishi threads about corruption and suchlike were consigned to the hijab form long ago where some of them have been around for years now.

The significance of a person like Anna Hazare is that he has managed to spark off national level debate on a well known subject that has been hidden so well and sidelined so effectively that the media and people take corruption for granted and do not talk about it. The presence of this thread itself is a salute to the man's effectiveness.

I am sure Syed Bukhari and Arundotty Roy all make use of/suffer from the same corruption. The fact that they are being provoked is a happy sign of how effective this movement has been - never mind how it will end.

Most often corruption in India is blackmail. Your legal payment or your legal work is not done unless you pay the bribe and without a bribe end up breaking the law or undergoing serious loss. The accusations that Hazare is resorting to blackmail make me cheer him. Blackmail works with the rotten system of our country. There is virtually no government servant in our country who is either corrupt or is aware of corruption in his department and is unable to rock the boat. It is part of the system. That system mush change. I couldn't care less if democracy is subverted an would be quite happy to see corrupt government officials being thrown on a huge pyre and burnt alive. I am sure they can understand my sentiment.


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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby shivajisisodia » 22 Aug 2011 07:46

Bukhari is half right. Anti-corruption movement is not anti-muslim, but is certainly anti-Islamist. The hair on his back stands up and he gets allah-shivers, imagining an Indian subcontinent, where corruption is scaled back significantly. It was corruption within the Indian societies that allowed Islam to establish a strong foothold on the Indian subcontinent. A significantly less corrupt India will therefore, be the begining of the end of the Islamic beachhead on the Indian subcontinent.

I only wish, hope and pray that a signigicantly less corrupt India is possible, before it self-destructs completely.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby arun » 22 Aug 2011 08:03

Anindya wrote: ........... {Snipped} ........... http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Bukhari-calls-stir-anti-Islam-tells-Muslims-to-stay-away/articleshow/9690525.cms

NEW DELHI: Syed Ahmed Bukhari, Shahi Imam of Delhi's Jama Masjid, has called upon Muslims to stay away from the Anna movement saying his war cry - Vande Mataram and Bharat Mata Ki Jai - are against Islam.

"Islam does not condone the worship of the nation or land. It does not even condone worship of the mother who nurtures a child in her womb. How can Muslims then join his stir with a war cry that is against the basic tenets of Islam. I have advised them to stay away," Bukhari told TOI.

Bukhari, who is not perceived to be close to the Congress, may have inadvertently voiced the very concerns that Congress leaders have been expressing off the record about how Anna's stir has isolated Muslims though none of them had ventured to make a public statement on this. The call has also reignited the centuries old debate of Vande Mataram being anti-Muslim.

Even though Team Anna includes lawyers like Prashant and Shanti Bhushan who have taken up cudgels against Narendra Modi for his alleged role in the Gujarat riots, the Shahi Imam, one of the tallest Muslim religious leader, is critical of the movement because he feels that communalism and not corruption is the bane of the country. "If Anna had included communalism in his agenda, I would have been more convinced of his intentions," he said.


Comments by the luminaries of the Mohammadden faith such as Syed Ahmed Bukhari, Shahi Imam of Delhi's Jama Masjid declaring that supporting Anna Hazare’s anti-corruption movement is Un-Mohammadden owing to the anti—corruption movement using the National slogan of India, “Bharat Mata Ki Jai” and singing the National Song of India, “Vande Mataram” is very unhelpful in promoting a positive image of Mohammaddens among Non-Mohammaddens.

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Re: The Jan Lokpal Bill, Anna Hazare, and Baba Ramdev

Postby Arjun » 22 Aug 2011 08:18

arun wrote:Comments by the luminaries of the Mohammadden faith such as Syed Ahmed Bukhari, Shahi Imam of Delhi's Jama Masjid declaring that supporting Anna Hazare’s anti-corruption movement is Un-Mohammadden owing to the anti—corruption movement using the National slogan of India, “Bharat Mata Ki Jai” and singing the National Song of India, “Vande Mataram” is very unhelpful in promoting a positive image of Mohammaddens among Non-Mohammaddens.

I don't think its got anything to do with going against monotheism - the supposed Islamist justification for not backing these slogans. What is the the difference in spirit between Bharat Mata ki Jai and Jai Hind?

Basically they are being sexist - they don't like the liberalism inherent in saluting a female representation of the country. Would be outrageous to pander to such sexism.


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