India Border Watch: Security and Operations

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Aditya G » 05 Nov 2016 14:03

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/worl ... s?from=mdr

....

Top sources in BSF and the government confirmed that the Pakistani army had deployed soldiers and weaponry at the Rangers' posts, placing regular Pakistan troops face to face with the BSF. "It's difficult to say if the Pakistani army has taken control of the Rangers' posts at IB but there is certainly a lot of movement, with many vehicles regularly bringing soldiers and arms. This has been going on for the past 8-9 days," said a senior official.

There is no intelligence input on what the Pakistani army is doing exactly, but the intent seems to be to beef up military presence along the international border.

...

The BSF has gathered information on the rank and number of Pakistani regulars, and is linking their presence to the firing and shelling directed at Indian civilians+ along border areas.

According to sources, the sector commander of Chenab Rangers (part of Pakistan Rangers) in Jammu is Brigadier Amzad Hussain, an army officer. "There seems a high probability that Pakistan's army is directing attacks on civilians in contrast to the Indian Army," said a BSF official

he sector opposite the Indian sector hit worst last week — Samba, with eight civilian deaths+ — too has an army officer, believed to be Lt Col Hashim Bhatti, commanding the 24 Chenab Rangers.

Similarly, opposite India's Chicken Neck sector, Pakistani army's Lt Col Tariq is understood to be in charge of the 21 Chenab Rangers, which oversees 30-odd border outposts in Head Marala. Lt Col I A Khan looks after 12, Wing in Langay Manjkay across India's R S Pura sector.


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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Paul » 05 Nov 2016 15:07

However, the army may have wanted to keep retaliation localised. That is why they targetted company HQ, not Brigade HQ.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby sudhan » 05 Nov 2016 15:42

The Napak army needs to be given an appropriate welcome, start with the 105 and 120 mm type welcome.. so that they keep their paws firmly clenched and under their musharaffs..

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Akshay Kapoor » 05 Nov 2016 15:59

Indranil ji,

I am taking the liberty of posting a link from a well known American strategic affairs analyst. The points he makes are the same that myself and several other posters have made (Pak nuclear bluff can be called, Indian response is very calibrated, India has more options than Pak, India is imposing a cost and has initiative now) but since it is still a part of Indian pysche to get external validation here it is http://www.unc.edu/depts/diplomat/item/ ... unter.html

I will also take the liberty of making 3/4 very quick points (as Maroof Raza sir would say), and since we have exchanged emails off and on, and he was kind enough to write a personal letter to me this time last year, I am happy to say that I may be influenced by him - one of the clearest thinkers I have ever interacted with.

1. Pakistan has killed over 70,000 of our citizens since early 80s as part of their strategy of death by a thousand cuts. Our response cannot be a thousand bandages (Brahma Chellany). We have never imposed costs on them and now we have taken the first step in imposing costs. This will make them factor a retaliation into their calculus and be on the back foot.

2. Our short term tactical response has the seeds of a strategic outcome through this very change in their calculus.

3. It is however just the beginning of the beginning - small calibrated responses to Pak with a clear purpose - destroying their infrastructure that they built up after ceasefire and which is used to send infiltrators and to target Indian (Hindu and Sikh) civilians.

4. Now the ceasefire - Pak asked for it because they were loosing. Then as they usually do, under the cover of ceasefire they started sending inflitartors, building infrastructure and violating it. This imposed huge losses on us. I have posted since 2014 about how our commanders could not even use 81 mm mortars without persmission from higher HQ while Pak would fire even 120 mm (note a 120 mm mortar shell is almost equivalent to a 155m howitzer shell as its thin skinned ). That is slowly changing with commanders being given flexibility and options to respond.

5. With flexibility comes the ability to take initiative which when sensibly done reduces casulaties. Restrictions increase casualties (examples have been given earlier). A one sided ceasefire (which we have had till now and which was being advocated here) will lead to own casualties. This has also been explained before.

6. Long term game has to be to balkanize Pak and destroy ISI. For this the whole sepctrum of power is needed - hard, soft, kinetic, non kinetic, driving wedge between Pak army and tanzeems, putting fear in Pak elites about our capacity to respond and hurt their personal interests, intelligence, diplomacy. All of this has also been explained and discussed in this very discussion.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby yensoy » 05 Nov 2016 18:33

The hotspot on the LOC/IB has moved to the IB because Pak can claim that they did not violate Indian territory (just as we did when we crossed the LOC). However we cannot retaliate by striking through because the IB is across from the Pak "mainland".

I think this is foolhardy thinking by the Pakis and will bite them in the rear. If push comes to shove, I am sure we will repeat the operation across IB, strike Pak Punjab areas and H&D saving will prevent them from admitting to the thappad.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Guddu » 05 Nov 2016 21:14

So I read that IA destroyed paki company HQ as opposed to brigade HQ. What's the difference in size between the two and is this a recent change from our side, where we took out company HQ.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby jamwal » 05 Nov 2016 21:34

http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... HPy9L.html
Indian Army destroyed Pak posts across LoC using artillery guns: Source

Indian Army had used artillery guns to destroy four Pakistani posts in a massive assault across the Line of Control (LoC) in Keran sector of north Kashmir’s Kupwara district last month, government sources said on Friday.
This is the first time the government sources have confirmed that artillary fire was indeed used by the Army to launch a massive assault against Pakistan, something which was always suspected.
It is the first case of artillery fire at the LoC since the 2003 ceasefire agreement was signed between the two countries.
They said artillery guns were stealthy moved up and used in straight fire position to raze four positions of Pakistan army to avenge the mutilation of an Indian Army jawan’s body by some suspected militants few days ago.
Violating ceasefire, Pakistan had been firing 120 mm heavy mortars to target Indian civilian areas, to which India had responded strongly.
Defence sources said while ceasefire violations by Pakistan was a regular feature “the intensity had never been so hard in the recent past.”

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Rakesh » 05 Nov 2016 21:51

Guddu wrote:So I read that IA destroyed paki company HQ as opposed to brigade HQ. What's the difference in size between the two and is this a recent change from our side, where we took out company HQ.

You can find that info by simply googling...so here goes...

Section > Platoon > Company > Battalion > Brigade > Division > Corps > Command Army

I am sure you can figure the rest out..

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby ramana » 06 Nov 2016 01:50

Guddu is asking of the army veterans not Google data.

Akshay garu please explain for all our sake.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Rakesh » 06 Nov 2016 01:54

Ramanaji, one of his questions is What's the difference in size between the two?

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby ramana » 06 Nov 2016 01:55

Indranil, Long term plan is to take apart Pakistan. Doval calls it Offensive Defence.
Deejay wrote an article linked in Balochistan thread.

Pak wants to bring focus to POK as they can scream nuclear flashpoint
Surgical strike showed to even Unven Cohen not much there.
So now its IB to prevent Indian escalation.
Artillery fire is showing there will be retaliation.
Real answer:
Answer will come somewhere else.

---
I know. He is not trolling.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby khan » 06 Nov 2016 10:43

I am trying to understand the psychology behind not targeting civilian areas in PoK for retaliation after they target civilian targets in India.

Wouldn't it make sense to target PoK civilian areas (after they target Indian civilians) to drive a wedge between their Army/Terrorists and PoK Locals?

I seem to remember reading that, the whole reason for the forward launch pads was to accommodate the locals on PoK who were tired of Terrorists in their midst - attracting Indian shelling.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Aditya_V » 06 Nov 2016 11:00

Only an idiot will claim they are targeting civilian areas. Since many paki posts are in civilian areas it is par for the course

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Sid » 06 Nov 2016 11:16

Soldier Killed In Pak Firing In Jammu And Kashmir's Poonch
http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/soldier- ... ch-1621894

SRINAGAR: An Army soldier was killed on Sunday morning in Pakistani firing along the Line of Control in Krishna Ghati (KG) sector of Jammu and Kashmir's Poonch district.

Pakistani troops resorted to unprovoked mortar shelling, officials said. "The Indian army has effectively retaliated using same calibre weapons, shelling and firing exchanges is still on," an official said.

Sources said the Pakistani troops were targeting forward Indian positions in Salotri and Sagra areas of KG Sector since 7 am.


In last two weeks, eight soldiers have been killed in ceasefire violations.

Last week, eight civilians were killed in cross-border firing by Pakistan along the International Border and Line of Control.

Since India's surgical strikes on staging areas for terrorists in Pakistan-occupied Kashmir on September 29, Pakistan has violated the ceasefire more than 60 times.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby manjgu » 06 Nov 2016 13:25

DELETED.
Last edited by ramana on 08 Nov 2016 00:26, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ramana

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Rahul M » 06 Nov 2016 13:33

I would hope we do not get sucked into a targeting civilians tit for tat, it is the forces, especially the equipment that should get the bulk of our attention. in the long run that would be what matters.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Aditya G » 06 Nov 2016 15:30

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/sunday ... 19286.html

Senior Army officers describe the present border situation as “the most tense” period since the 2003 ceasefire agreement. The ongoing firing by both sides along the 749-km Line of Control (LoC), and also the 198-km long International boundary (IB) in J&K, is the “most intense.”

Since September 29 ‘surgical strikes’ on terror camps in POK, the ‘sporadic, routine’ firing has given way to both sides using a variety of medium arms. These include mortars (both 81mm and 120mm), light & medium machine guns and sniper weapons such as Dragnov rifles. India has already announced that four Pakistani Army posts were destroyed on Oct 29, a day ahead of Diwali, in retaliation against the mutilation of a soldier by terrorists aided by the Pakistan Army.

The number of ceasefire violations is no more a benchmark for the seriousness of the situation. “Even one bullet fired is a violation and a mortar that travels up to 10km is also counted the same. The intensity and intent matter. And it’s different this time,” said a defence source.

Military-held posts of either country are bang on the LoC on both sides, at some places, less than 20 metres away, in the mountainous region. A forward post can typically have 10 soldiers, and if it comes under fire, the rest of the battalion can only direct fire at other posts of Pakistan, which increases the firing intensity. “These are abnormal times,” says a serving officer.

The increasing number of cross-LoC fire-assaults is being attributed to modern surveillance equipment such as night vision and thermal imagers that make reaching an enemy post physically impossible. That was not the case a decade ago. “This makes coordinated firing as the most viable military response across the LoC or even the IB.” The situation could call for further action if bigger artillery guns (155mm) are used, say defence sources.


http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/sunday ... 19275.html

Pakistani border guards (Rangers) are firing with weapons meant for the country’s Army, and that too, on the civilian areas on the Indian side. The BSF response is with traditional weapons like 82mm and 120 mm mortar, 25-pounder artillery, medium and light machine guns and sniper fire. A 25-pounder artillery gun carries about 10 kg of ammunition to hit targets up to 10-12 km. The force has fired this gun about 100 times. 8) The BSF has also fired 3,300 long-range mortar shells (which can hit targets within range of 5-6 km), 2,100 short range mortar shells (effective for 900 metres), and over 35,000 bullets using small arms like medium and light machine guns.

In the past one month the BSF’s relentless action has seen over 40,000 rounds of fire. As the exchange of fire intensified particularly since October 19, Indian troops have fired more than 7,000 mortar shells resulting in several Pakistani soldiers being killed. Both along the IB and LoC, most Pak firing is meant to provide cover to terrorists to infiltrate or inflict casualty on civilians so as to build “domestic pressure on the Indian government to reduce hot counter-pursuit,” said a senior BSF officer.

Inspector General (IG) BSF of Jammu Frontier DK Upadhyay claimed that Pakistani troops are deliberately targeting civilian areas in J&K’s Samba, Kathua and Jammu districts. “Our retaliation is specifically aimed at targeting the Pakistani bunkers, 14 of which were completely destroyed,” he said, adding the civilian casualties reported on the other side of the IB and the LoC might have resulted in “collateral” damage.


Any good pictures of BSF 25 pounder guns?

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/sunday ... 19267.html

High-explosive shells light up a pitch-dark night in the RS Pura Sector of the International Border (IB) with alarming frequency. Border Security Force jawan Om Prakash is on duty: he has been awake like this for almost 24 hours inside his border outpost. He and his two colleagues have not been able to go back to the base camp as snipers have dug themselves in across the border. The three have to cheat death, and their sleep. There is no food and water. “We are closer to god!” he chuckles.

For over a month now, the routine shift of a BSF jawan has been doubled. That also means a company commander has to be doubly vigilant and keep the jawans’ morale high. He must also take care of their health. “Our task is, come hell or high water, we have to ensure no one is allowed to infiltrate,” says Om Prakash. “If a jawan is injured, his colleagues’ job is to first evacuate him and give him first aid. One jawan retaliates, giving cover fire, while another colleague informs the company commander about the incident. He has to play multiple roles at that moment,” says a BSF Inspector, wishing anonymity. In the last month of intensified skirmishes, three BSF jawans have died and a few others injured. “This is the time we are trained for,” says the Inspector. The coming days could be more challenging with reports of Pakistan army soldiers replacing their border guards (Rangers).

...


^“This is the time we are trained for,” good to hear that from you inspector.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby shiv » 06 Nov 2016 17:38

Rahul M wrote:I would hope we do not get sucked into a targeting civilians tit for tat, it is the forces, especially the equipment that should get the bulk of our attention. in the long run that would be what matters.

When Pakis hide among civilians, this will happen

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Rahul M » 06 Nov 2016 17:40

if it happens it happens, but it should not be the primary objective.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Guddu » 06 Nov 2016 20:32

Considering that mortar fire is the most common weapon used, do we have an edge in technology.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Ashokk » 06 Nov 2016 22:52

Aditya G wrote:Any good pictures of BSF 25 pounder guns?

Image
Corrected.
Last edited by Ashokk on 07 Nov 2016 00:42, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Aditya G » 06 Nov 2016 23:24

^ thats 105 mm IFG

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Ramesh » 06 Nov 2016 23:32

^105mm LFG

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Aditya G » 07 Nov 2016 00:18

IFG. LFG does not have the armour plate.... AFAIK

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby JayS » 07 Nov 2016 00:41


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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby JayS » 07 Nov 2016 00:47

Akshay Kapoor wrote:Indranil ji,

I am taking the liberty of posting a link from a well known American strategic affairs analyst. The points he makes are the same that myself and several other posters have made (Pak nuclear bluff can be called, Indian response is very calibrated, India has more options than Pak, India is imposing a cost and has initiative now) but since it is still a part of Indian pysche to get external validation here it is http://www.unc.edu/depts/diplomat/item/ ... unter.html

I will also take the liberty of making 3/4 very quick points (as Maroof Raza sir would say), and since we have exchanged emails off and on, and he was kind enough to write a personal letter to me this time last year, I am happy to say that I may be influenced by him - one of the clearest thinkers I have ever interacted with.

1. Pakistan has killed over 70,000 of our citizens since early 80s as part of their strategy of death by a thousand cuts. Our response cannot be a thousand bandages (Brahma Chellany). We have never imposed costs on them and now we have taken the first step in imposing costs. This will make them factor a retaliation into their calculus and be on the back foot.

2. Our short term tactical response has the seeds of a strategic outcome through this very change in their calculus.

3. It is however just the beginning of the beginning - small calibrated responses to Pak with a clear purpose - destroying their infrastructure that they built up after ceasefire and which is used to send infiltrators and to target Indian (Hindu and Sikh) civilians.

4. Now the ceasefire - Pak asked for it because they were loosing. Then as they usually do, under the cover of ceasefire they started sending inflitartors, building infrastructure and violating it. This imposed huge losses on us. I have posted since 2014 about how our commanders could not even use 81 mm mortars without persmission from higher HQ while Pak would fire even 120 mm (note a 120 mm mortar shell is almost equivalent to a 155m howitzer shell as its thin skinned ). That is slowly changing with commanders being given flexibility and options to respond.

5. With flexibility comes the ability to take initiative which when sensibly done reduces casulaties. Restrictions increase casualties (examples have been given earlier). A one sided ceasefire (which we have had till now and which was being advocated here) will lead to own casualties. This has also been explained before.

6. Long term game has to be to balkanize Pak and destroy ISI. For this the whole sepctrum of power is needed - hard, soft, kinetic, non kinetic, driving wedge between Pak army and tanzeems, putting fear in Pak elites about our capacity to respond and hurt their personal interests, intelligence, diplomacy. All of this has also been explained and discussed in this very discussion.


+1

We need to gear up for breaking up Pakistan in a conventional war in future. A lot of background work needed before final blow a la 1971 - on all fronts, diplomacy, geo-politics, Covert Ops, Economy and weapons. But until then we need to keep the sub-conventional War on. Make it harder for pakis to take next step against India, by imposing heavy cost every time they take one step. We need to maintain a python's grip on Pukis. Just like Python tightens grip slowly every time the pray breaths out and make breathing increasingly difficult. We need to crush Pakis slowly and steadily until we are ready for final blow.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby manjgu » 07 Nov 2016 11:24

rahul M ...i think 80% of mortar fire is shoot and scoot... and hope for the best results..especially the smaller mortar fire ( which is the main component of mortar duels). the bring a mortar to a position ..fire a few rounds..and then run to another and fire...and so on...

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby jamwal » 07 Nov 2016 20:12

LoC erupts again: 2 Army jawans killed; 4 security personnel, woman injured
http://www.dailyexcelsior.com/loc-erupt ... n-injured/

AMMU, Nov 6: After a lull of three days, Line of Control (LoC) erupted again in wee hours of this morning with Pakistani forces resuming heavy mortar shelling and trying to push militants into Indian territory at two places in Krishna Ghati (KG) sector of Poonch district in which two Army jawans were killed and five others including four security personnel and a civilian woman were injured while as troops launched major counter offensive in which seven Pakistani posts were decimated and five Pakistani troopers were killed opposite KG sector.
The two infiltration attempts by the militants, which were aided and abetted by the Pakistani troops in KG sector, were thwarted successfully by the troops. All militants, who were trying to sneak-in into the Indian side under covering fire by Pakistani troops, retreated to Pakistan occupied Kashmir (PoK).
Sources told the Excelsior that Pakistan resumed heavy shelling using 120mm and 82mm mortars in Krishna Ghati sector at about 4 am today targeting forward Army posts and civilian areas. Subsequently, they extended shelling to Sabjian sector in Poonch.
Under the cover of shelling and firing, troops spotted two big groups of militants infiltrating into the Indian territory in Krishna Ghati sector. Troops challenged the militants but as they kept on moving towards Indian side, Army personnel from their forward posts retaliated, leading to heavy exchange of gunbattle in which an Army jawan was injured, who subsequently succumbed to his injuries.
The martyr has been identified as Sepoy Gursevak Singh, 24, son of Balwinder Singh R/o Warana, Lalpur in Tarn Taran area of Amritsar district in Punjab.
Troops, however, successfully thwarted both the infiltration attempts despite open support to the militants by Pakistan army. All militants fled back to PoK.
Later, Pakistan army started heavy mortar shelling and firing at Sagra, Balnoi and surrounding villages of Krishna Ghati sector and Sabjian sector, both in Poonch district using 120mm and 82mm mortars. Indian side responded very effectively.
Another Army jawan attained martyrdom in the exchange of shelling while four others including two Army personnel, a BSF Sub Inspector and a Special Police Officer (SPO) were injured. A civilian woman was also injured in the shelling.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby vanand » 07 Nov 2016 20:55

Aditya G wrote:
Any good pictures of BSF 25 pounder guns? [/b]


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordnance_QF_25-pounder

India have many

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Akshay Kapoor » 07 Nov 2016 22:49

Ramana Garu,

Sorry for the late response but I have decided to take a break from BR so I don't come on here much.

Re your question , as Rakesh said there is a lot of info on google and infact BR army section has a TOE on an inf BM from the early 90s. So I won't say too much more as I want to encourage people to read and learn things. I will however take this opportunity to talk about tactics and how a company functions in diff tac situations.

First of all company sized formation is called by different names in diff arms and services. In the infantry it's a company known as coy. In the ENGRS it a FD Coy or field company. There is also a Field Park Company in the ENGRS which keeps all bridging equipment. In armour you have squadrons and batteries in the arty. Services have companies. There are between 3-4 company's in a regt/Bn. Plus HQ and a support coy. The basic tenet is that attack has to be in a ratio of 3 to 1. So if a bn is attacking it should attack a coy, a brigade should attack a bn and a div a brigade.

Why - many reasons - One rule of thumb is one to attack one to hold and one to exploit break through. No point in achieving a breach and not exploiting it. Unfortunately for many reasons the Indian army has not been great at this at brigade and above - except eastern sector in 71. P

Second - the assault must be delivered with concentrated overwhelming force like a torrent of water smashing through an objective.

Third- support and reserves.

A inf coy is used to be commanded by a Maj and now it can also be a Lt col (another sad thing that has happened because of the deep rooted issues with our higher defence mgt). Platoons are supposed to be commanded by a officer but are commanded by a JCO because of sever shortage of officers especially in inf and armour.

A coy is a pretty cohesive entity - lowest level where loyalty to a formation starts. Troops do identify with coy. This is especially strong in engrs and armour - why because their companies: squadrons often operate independently (away from the rest of the regt) in support of the inf. That is why in terms of class composition (in fixed class regts like Kumaon)it is often done at a coy level. Inter company completions in sport or firing etc enhance loyalty to a coy.

3 or more coys together make a regt or bn. This is the optimum size for having an identity of its own, the ability to survive in a battle independently and also have the flexibility. More would lead to lack of cohesion and become difficult to exercise command and less would not have the where withal to independently survive and accomplish tasks. Inter company completions work best in a 3-4 coy scenario.

Interesting tidbit - All major Indian defensive actions have been fought by an isolated company- 23 Punjab (Longewala) , 13 Kumaon (rezangla) , 4 Kumaon (Badgam)

BN/Regt is the most cohesive and generates the highest identification in officers and men. It's resources are very fungible.

RR Is a little different. More companies for ability to react and less heavy weapons.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby VKumar » 07 Nov 2016 23:02

Tomorrow PM to meet the three service chiefs to discuss about ongoing fighting with TSP.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby ramana » 08 Nov 2016 00:22

Rahul M wrote:if it happens it happens, but it should not be the primary objective.



Except manjgu no one is saying that is the primary objective.

This is not a Western/journalist site which can look at things in detached way.
Its our soldiers being fired upon.

I have a good mind to ban manjgu for week.

---
manjgu I deleted your content for I didn't want to ban you.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby ramana » 08 Nov 2016 00:31

Akshay Kapoor,
Thank you very much for explaining the company formation and its importance in battle.
Long ago I thought Major command coy and Captain is 2IC.
So are Bns being commanded by Cols?
This is bad promotion policy of the IA Mil Secy Branch.
The officer shortage is hitting the IA badly for the lower formations.
This will lead to bad officer crunch then the time comes.

Deejay is also keeping away.

Please don't.
BRF will be the loser if you all keep away due to idiot comments by posters.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby manjgu » 08 Nov 2016 06:58

ramana...would suggest u re read my post. I never said its primary objective..i said targeting of civilian areas is done by both sides deliberately/ on purpose but neither side admits it.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby Guddu » 08 Nov 2016 18:31

Looks like it's time for another thappad. PM meets military chiefs, raheel retires soon, this cross border firing has gone for too long.....somethings got to change.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby schinnas » 08 Nov 2016 19:01

Whatever thappad we give, Pakis being Pakis will try to atleast respond in a minimal way. Their paki mind will consider not responding as the failure / defeat. The only way to ensure total submission is total and convincing defeat of Paki Army and balkanizing that place.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby rohiths » 08 Nov 2016 19:03

This is where the shortage of 155mm guns are showing up. We should ideally had 1000 guns facing LoC and pounded the hell out of Pakis in a continuous barrage day in and day out till there is a dead zone of 20km into the other side of LoC and caused ~1000 to 2000 paki casualties.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby khan » 08 Nov 2016 19:50

rohiths wrote:This is where the shortage of 155mm guns are showing up. We should ideally had 1000 guns facing LoC and pounded the hell out of Pakis in a continuous barrage day in and day out till there is a dead zone of 20km into the other side of LoC and caused ~1000 to 2000 paki casualties.

Yes. But I don't see why Pinaka or even air-power cannot be used to shut them up - which is after all the goal here.

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby rohiths » 08 Nov 2016 19:56

khan wrote:
rohiths wrote:This is where the shortage of 155mm guns are showing up. We should ideally had 1000 guns facing LoC and pounded the hell out of Pakis in a continuous barrage day in and day out till there is a dead zone of 20km into the other side of LoC and caused ~1000 to 2000 paki casualties.

Yes. But I don't see why Pinaka or even air-power cannot be used to shut them up - which is after all the goal here.

Pinaka is not accurate enough. Air power will be escalating beyond a threshold

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Re: India Border Watch: Security and Operations

Postby sivab » 08 Nov 2016 20:00

Things are getting hot again ... :D

Image

https://twitter.com/PIB_India/status/795991686069428224

PIB India ‏@PIB_India 16m16 minutes ago New Delhi, India
Prime Minister @narendramodi is chairing a Cabinet meeting at South Block

PIB India ‏@PIB_India 9m9 minutes ago New Delhi, India
PM @narendramodi will address the nation at 8 PM today. The address will be first in Hindi followed by English
Last edited by sivab on 08 Nov 2016 20:03, edited 1 time in total.


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