Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

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IndraD
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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby IndraD » 26 Jun 2016 22:16

Post Office runs out of Irish passport forms following Brexit
'I’ve always been proud to be of Irish heritage but I never thought I’d have to rely on it for proper access to the EU'#
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/po ... 04111.html

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Lilo » 26 Jun 2016 22:16

What of the british "talent" for sadism or hypocrisy rooted in the amoral british philosophy of skepticism - reducing every life to a mechanistic mode
no wonder the "talented" British elite pedophiles(yes brits sure have a talent at mutual buggery and paedophilia) came to treat working class kids as if their life means nothing when they kept preying on them.

Any way I digressed - Briturdia is living on rent of its assets - they may have a huge financial,cultural,technological stockpile from colonial and neocolonial era of 20th century but know what ?
The cashflows are slowing down and eventually it will be only a trickle and then become negative .Then comes the time when the family silver looted from the colonies has to be pawned till the stockpile mountain becomes a molehill.Then what?
And it may yet come to pass in my life time.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Suraj » 26 Jun 2016 23:14

ashish raval wrote:You mean UK importing people since last 400 years ? I doubt it; colonical spoils yes talent absolutely not continental Europe sneered at uk for being less classical in reading and writing science and not understanding mathematics written by laplace. This country has produced world class geniuses and coupled with learning things from all over the world and applying it they developed.

There's nothing special about British scientific history that the Germans or French lacked in. Britain's post-war ability to build upon what they previously had, is primarily a result of the side they ended up on, both in WW1 and WW2. I'm surprised you'd doubt that Britain benefited from brain drain. Britain was the first place every exiting Axis Power scientific luminary went to. At the end of WW2, they were also in the fortunate position of being intertwined with the new superpower, the US. The Germans on the other hand, started from square one in 1945. German might today is far more admirable than anything Britain did in the past 50 years.

Britain benefited and suffered from being an island. It benefited tremendously because the European wars stopped short at the coast, though they made up for that to some extent by killing each other a lot. They suffered because an island made them physically, intellectually and economically isolated. They dealt with that by becoming the pre-eminent maritime power of the planet. They continued that through a combination of planned aliiances and luck. They backed the right horse in the US. They ended up on the winning side not once but twice in successive World Wars over four decades. Engagement with the world gave them the capital to build their power, whether it came from colonialism, trade the right alliances or just luck.

But one thing that's characterized Britain all this time is that they never chose isolationism willingly. And their foreign policy was never driven by domestic plebian imperatives. Brexit marks the first time in hundreds of years that they did something to the contrary on both front. The implications of this action are vast. They'll coast for a while on what they've accumulated, but they cut themselves off from a huge number of beneficial deals that they put together when they were relatively much stronger than they are compared to the other side today. They'll never get those deals back.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby UlanBatori » 26 Jun 2016 23:21

Reminds me of the FOILs' many anti-India Petitions that suffered the same unfortunate result due to votes from Dr. Weigh Poo, Semliy Terait, Yom Omma etc. :mrgreen:
he had created the petition "when it was looking unlikely that 'leave' were going to win." The petition had since been "hijacked by the remain campaign," he wrote.
:((
the government was investigating reports of fraudulent signatures being added to the referendum. The petitions committee later tweeted that about 77,000 {400% jay-new-whine} signatures had been removed.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby jagga » 26 Jun 2016 23:26

Independent has published below comment from a tweeter user. Interesting read:
If Boris Johnson looked downbeat yesterday, that is because he realises that he has lost.

Perhaps many Brexiters do not realise it yet, but they have actually lost, and it is all down to one man: David Cameron.

With one fell swoop yesterday at 9:15 am, Cameron effectively annulled the referendum result, and simultaneously destroyed the political careers of Boris Johnson, Michael Gove and leading Brexiters who cost him so much anguish, not to mention his premiership.

How?

Throughout the campaign, Cameron had repeatedly said that a vote for leave would lead to triggering Article 50 straight away. Whether implicitly or explicitly, the image was clear: he would be giving that notice under Article 50 the morning after a vote to leave. Whether that was scaremongering or not is a bit moot now but, in the midst of the sentimental nautical references of his speech yesterday, he quietly abandoned that position and handed the responsibility over to his successor.

And as the day wore on, the enormity of that step started to sink in: the markets, Sterling, Scotland, the Irish border, the Gibraltar border, the frontier at Calais, the need to continue compliance with all EU regulations for a free market, re-issuing passports, Brits abroad, EU citizens in Britain, the mountain of legislation to be torn up and rewritten ... the list grew and grew.

The referendum result is not binding. It is advisory. Parliament is not bound to commit itself in that same direction.

The Conservative party election that Cameron triggered will now have one question looming over it: will you, if elected as party leader, trigger the notice under Article 50?

Who will want to have the responsibility of all those ramifications and consequences on his/her head and shoulders?

Boris Johnson knew this yesterday, when he emerged subdued from his home and was even more subdued at the press conference. He has been out-manoeuvred and check-mated.

If he runs for leadership of the party, and then fails to follow through on triggering Article 50, then he is finished. If he does not run and effectively abandons the field, then he is finished. If he runs, wins and pulls the UK out of the EU, then it will all be over - Scotland will break away, there will be upheaval in Ireland, a recession ... broken trade agreements. Then he is also finished. Boris Johnson knows all of this. When he acts like the dumb blond it is just that: an act.

The Brexit leaders now have a result that they cannot use. For them, leadership of the Tory party has become a poison chalice.

When Boris Johnson said there was no need to trigger Article 50 straight away, what he really meant to say was "never". When Michael Gove went on and on about "informal negotiations" ... why? why not the formal ones straight away? ... he also meant not triggering the formal departure. They both know what a formal demarche would mean: an irreversible step that neither of them is prepared to take.

All that remains is for someone to have the guts to stand up and say that Brexit is unachievable in reality without an enormous amount of pain and destruction, that cannot be borne. And David Cameron has put the onus of making that statement on the heads of the people who led the Brexit campaign.


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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Yagnasri » 26 Jun 2016 23:55

I do not see anyone making such a statement. Further elites need a facade of democracy. They can not go openly against the vote. At least not after it was lost in spite of such a massive "management of opinion" by them.

Further, no evil thing is going to happen in the long term for mango Brits who are not doing well as it is. I am not sure KoMoran has some great eeevil plan of doing some serious damage leave fellows. He and others with him do not know what hit them in their ba&&s.

The UK is the fifth largest economy in the world, and I do not know what is the fuss all about. Yes, there will be serious issues in the short term and may be the middiam term. But in the long run, there should not be any problem. WTO terms of trade are already in place, and UK will join as I think it needs to do that now and life goes on.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Jun 2016 00:23

I think the Islamic Republic of UQ has a terrific future as the Pakistan of The West. Sit across the Channel and Irish border and be a pest to Oirope. Yeah, yeah, people bleat about how Baluchistan West (Gibraltar / Falkands) and Sindh West (Dera Scot Khan) and Balwaristan West (Azad Eire) want to leave, but how far has that got the original Baluchistan, Balwaristan etc? London will be like LaHore or Karachi (faux elegant/sophisticated, prostituted to all terrorists and criminals). The analogies fit very well. The Americans have engineered this to keep Europe from getting too uppity. Armed with nuclear weapons and an American-supplied Air Force too!

Send terrorists across to Eire and France every couple of weeks to kill law enforcement people and civilians. Host big money from Saudi Arabia in its brothels and shopping centers and Hunting Trips. Transfer WMD to terrorists. Shelter anyone with an Interpol Red Corner Notice. Center for Hawala on a massive scale. PLUS, bonus! They have Amnesty International to keep lecturing Europe on Hyooman Rites. What do you see wrong with this, hain?

The MughalBritish Empire is gone, long live the Mughal British Empire. But the Sun never dares to turn His back on the Pakistani British slum. Move the political capital and Shariah Court from London to Bradford.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Satya_anveshi » 27 Jun 2016 01:51

Expect China to post better than expected results and US to ride that propaganda to say aaall izzz well with global economy except EU.

Earlier, US would dump all its sheet on China woes and never to blame its own fundamentals (or lack there of).
Last edited by Satya_anveshi on 27 Jun 2016 02:09, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby RajeshA » 27 Jun 2016 02:01

Some old British wisdom on Europe


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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby NRao » 27 Jun 2016 02:22

The English are thing and behaving worse than Congress?

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby ashish raval » 27 Jun 2016 02:23

Suraj wrote:
ashish raval wrote:You mean UK importing people since last 400 years ? I doubt it; colonical spoils yes talent absolutely not continental Europe sneered at uk for being less classical in reading and writing science and not understanding mathematics written by laplace. This country has produced world class geniuses and coupled with learning things from all over the world and applying it they developed.

There's nothing special about British scientific history that the Germans or French lacked in. Britain's post-war ability to build upon what they previously had, is primarily a result of the side they ended up on, both in WW1 and WW2. I'm surprised you'd doubt that Britain benefited from brain drain. Britain was the first place every exiting Axis Power scientific luminary went to. At the end of WW2, they were also in the fortunate position of being intertwined with the new superpower, the US. The Germans on the other hand, started from square one in 1945. German might today is far more admirable than anything Britain did in the past 50 years.

Britain benefited and suffered from being an island. It benefited tremendously because the European wars stopped short at the coast, though they made up for that to some extent by killing each other a lot. They suffered because an island made them physically, intellectually and economically isolated. They dealt with that by becoming the pre-eminent maritime power of the planet. They continued that through a combination of planned aliiances and luck. They backed the right horse in the US. They ended up on the winning side not once but twice in successive World Wars over four decades. Engagement with the world gave them the capital to build their power, whether it came from colonialism, trade the right alliances or just luck.

But one thing that's characterized Britain all this time is that they never chose isolationism willingly. And their foreign policy was never driven by domestic plebian imperatives. Brexit marks the first time in hundreds of years that they did something to the contrary on both front. The implications of this action are vast. They'll coast for a while on what they've accumulated, but they cut themselves off from a huge number of beneficial deals that they put together when they were relatively much stronger than they are compared to the other side today. They'll never get those deals back.

Can you name a few exciting scientists and noble laureates who made Britain heir home and were not born in Britain? I would just ask you to go through a wiki page on history of science and mathematics in Britain vs France and Germany. Britain with tiny population has produced more noble laureate than Germany and almost twice as many as France..this is despite the fact that Germany is closer to Scandinavia and has fairly decent history with them..now don't tell me that noble is rigged...it may be but not in science if may say so..

Indians/we can dislike British for their occupation but we cannot take away the fact that this island has produced geniuses time and again right from Newton, faraday, Maxwell, Turing to hawking..one can choose to ignore this but pages of history of science does not.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Yagnasri » 27 Jun 2016 02:32

From the above Yes Minister episode -

Lord Haker of the Kamekazi.

With one stroke, approbation, elevation, and castration.

Pity we are not having such a great productions from the UK anymore. All we see is XX rated US s&&t.

What EU super babes do - In defeat malaise and in Victory revenge.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Lisa » 27 Jun 2016 02:36

List of countries by FDI abroad

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... FDI_abroad

1 United States 4,854,000,000,000 2013 est.
2 United Kingdom 1,884,000,000,000 2013 est.
3 Germany 1,871,000,000,000 2013 est.
4 France 1,489,000,000,000 2013 est.
5 Switzerland 1,432,000,000,000 2013 est.
— Hong Kong 1,392,000,000,000 2013 est.
6 Belgium 1,215,000,000,000 2013 est.
7 Japan 1,179,000,000,000 2013 est.
8 Canada 1,047,000,000,000 2013 est.
9 Netherlands 1,034,000,000,000 2013 est.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby IndraD » 27 Jun 2016 02:41

British science & research under serious threat after Brexit, key universities already in touch with Westminster to clarify where do they stand http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2016/06/ ... pean-union

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby SriKumar » 27 Jun 2016 02:56

ashish raval wrote:Science is a two way street..
My point exactly. The street just got narrower and a lot narrower. UK reduced the traffic on this street.

And by the way, my point about science still stands. It needs loads and loads of *government* money. Few to no private players can afford to spend on decade-long projects where much of the output will be in the form of arcane papers gathering dust in a library (or, frozen bits of information on a hard-drive accessed rarely). The 'financial technology' and the middleman-giri that UK was able to use to get the financial clout until now will shrink and probably in a significant way.

if Europe moves Airbus away it will take less than 10 years for uk to build and Airbus competitor with BAE, meggit, qinetiq,cobham,gkn and rolls Royce consortium..
Yes, less than 10 years. This statistic falls in the same category as UK being 2nd in science. There seems to be a high degree of expectant optimism in your comments.

You've gotten into specifics about how UK can do fine and re-invent everything it needs to etc. etc. Whatever you said applies to EU just equally, and they have more resources whether it is labs, companies, defence companies, manufacturing etc. They are not going to sit around watching UK build competencies in these areas to only compete with EU in 10 or 20 years. In fact, if the EU leaders' statements is anything to go by, they wanted to start yesterday- quite literally in fact, with their calls to start discussions on the separation plan.

Playing up one side (UK) does not tell the story. Yes, anything is possible...UK can even produce two engine companies....why did they stop at just one? (Hint- how much of it is govt. money..over the past decades?)

is quite significant afaik and EU will be mad to make those areas out of reach to UK..besides why would you loose a customer with whom you have 68 billion pounds of trade deficit per year to turn into sour customer who imports from your competitors in your doorstep!!

Well, if you are talking markets and madness, please note that is also a two-way street, and EU markets are larger than UK markets....and if Scotland moves from UK, the British market will be even smaller. This 'parting of ways' with EU does not seems like a velvet divorce. EU is not happy, and by that I mean not just the governments but the people as well. And the current EU powers also have the need to go the extra mile to demonstrate stability of EU in near and distant future and need to plan accordingly. It will tell on their interaction with UK in the areas of commerce, markets and anything else including science and engineering and industry.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Jun 2016 05:28

The inventors of Graphene were two Russians who made the first sheets by rubbing a graphite ("lead") pencil on a paper. I don't think they were born in England. Saying that (ex) Europeans win the European RDX Foundation prize is well.. :roll:

Most of the rest is because the british controlled publication avenues. To present a paper at the Royal Society of Pea-Brains, for example, one had to be a Member. IOW, one had to give one's stuff to the Member to Read, and the Member would promptly steal the credit. This is how come many of those Great Scientists were Lawd this and Lawd that - not that landowning playboys had any ability to solve equations.

Read the history of CV Raman or Jagdish Chandra Bose, and it is clear who did the work - and who got the credit.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby ramana » 27 Jun 2016 06:19

Lilo and anyone else, We all are here to learn.
UK Brexit is very painful. Its like undoing 800 years of history by demagogues.
Lets not make it more so by pointing av others.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Suraj » 27 Jun 2016 07:47

ashish raval wrote:Indians/we can dislike British for their occupation but we cannot take away the fact that this island has produced geniuses time and again right from Newton, faraday, Maxwell, Turing to hawking..one can choose to ignore this but pages of history of science does not.

This post summarizes what's wrong with your argument . You want us to blow smoke up the UKs behind because ? This is Bharat Rakshak . None of that matters here . Nothing about UKs past alleged greatness is our concern . All that matters is what's going to happen to them now because of Brexit and how it suits us .

I'll reiterate what I've stated earlier - UK has no better scientific history than Germany or France . And in fact since you're using the Nobel as the example , I assume that's the same bauble they denied Gandhi because Churchill was against it ? Nuff said . They win because they have the power to control who doesn't win. The politics of those awards is not restricted to the peace prize either.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Yagnasri » 27 Jun 2016 08:22

They ensured that MKG do not win Nobel in 1948 in which year they have not found any one suitable to award it. JP did not get it by the nun from Albania got it. Now see how Vidhyardhi got it along with Malala. What is the contribution of both of them to their nations? Nothing.

@Ramana sir. I do not think there is any new ideas of win for racist fellows here. In fact there is nothing new in these ideas. Dogs and Indians are not allowed boards are being replaced by Arabs and Polish are not allowed.

One of the most rediculas ideas coming out of EU is discussed here:

"The only thing that should be toast is our EU membership," said Brian Monteith, Leave EU's chief spokesman, "They may take our tea and toast but they will never take our freedom, but we can have both when we vote to leave.

"We are constantly told leaving the EU is a leap in the dark but the real unknown is just how much more depressing and grim life will be in the homogenised, soulless EU. They are already taking menthol out of our cigarettes, next they'll be saying oil of bergamot causes cancer and Earl Grey Tea will be no more."

"Brussels is storing up all barmy regulations, power grabs and budget demands it can delay until after the referendum," added Robert Oxley, a spokesman for Vote Leave, "But if we vote remain quicker than you can boil a kettle the same damaging proposals will be back on the table and we will be powerless to say no. The only safe way to avoid a referendum hangover is to Vote Leave."

“What we want is to let the free market reign, not this diktat by bureaucrat,” said David Coburn, a UK Independence party MEP from Scotland who highlighted the proposals set out in the EU’s “Ecodesign” consultation.

Mr. Coburn, who recently purchased a new kettle and toaster on moving house, has grumbled that his new appliances no longer seem to have the ‘oomph’ they once did. “I think I must have bought a euro-toaster, I have to put the bread in five times and it’s still pale and pasty. Perhaps it’s powered by windmills,” he told The Telegraph, “And the kettle? Watching a kettle boil has never been so boring.”

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Yagnasri » 27 Jun 2016 08:50

As I said. There is nothing new on racist Uk. The infamous "rivers of blood" speech full text.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/3643 ... peech.html

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Satya_anveshi » 27 Jun 2016 09:01

Heck why did I not think like this genius. Yes, this would be an absolute parallel of what UK did with EU (may be they should have a referendum on UN too)

Sarah Palin congratulates the UK on Brexit and urges the U.S. to 'follow suit' and abandon the UN

Sarah Palin has congratulated the UK on voting to leave the European Union and has urged the United States to emulate the spirit of their transatlantic ally and leave the United Nations. :rotfl:

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby vera_k » 27 Jun 2016 09:19

Russia accused of clandestine funding of European parties

UK warns of "new Cold War" as Kremlin seeks to divide and rule in Europe


Well, this is European incompetence on display. They had 70 years to write a constitution and form a nation - which they failed to do - so can't really blame outside interference for starting to breakup.

If Russian interference cannot be handled, how will they handle the coming situation where more than just the Russians will try to break up the EU?
Last edited by vera_k on 27 Jun 2016 10:01, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby JTull » 27 Jun 2016 09:24

I voted to leave. I look at EU as a Soviet Socialist entity run by politico bureaucrats who never had to explain themselves to an electorate.

Let us not get carried away by media reports from Scotland and London, claiming to show mass hysteria over this result. Out of 12 regions only three regions voted to remain (Scotland, Northern Ireland and London). The ones who make the most noise need not be correct. If media steps out of London, they'll hear the views of ordinary Brits. 72% voting turnover is very high for these parts and people did have a say. Democracy means that we all accept the majority decision whether we agree with it or not.

Here are my 'main' reasons (others may have different reasons, whereas many others may not agree with me at all):

1. Sovereignty and Democracy: I would like to have parliamentary supremacy. I want our elected leaders to be governing us and not Brussels which acts without accountability and often under some kind of remote control from Germany.
2. Immigration:
a. Open Borders for travel and for employment are different beasts: British citizens are able to travel visa-free to over 190 countries. Brexit wouldn’t stop Brits from travelling to EU countries, but reciprocal barriers are likely for ability to work in EU. With the constant expansion into poorer Eastern European states, UK which has the most generous benefits system, suffers the most. Currently there are 3 million EU citizens "estimated" to be living in UK while only 1.3 million Brits are in EU. A large continent which has such an 'attractive' and 'open' markets should surely have attracted more Brits. Moreover, a blank cheque now being extended by Merkel to Turkey for visa-free travel is not in our best interests, a view shared by widely across the EU. Allowing this kind of access to a country with porous borders on its south is plain dangerous.

b. Impact on job market: Visit any Starbucks, Pret or like in London and you’ll find only Spanish or Eastern European employees. Visit any Job Center (for unemployment benefits) and you’ll again find the same. Many of the millions of Polish and Romanians work in casual labour market and are paid in cash. They don’t pay taxes, and send most of their cash back home. They make negligible contribution to the economy. Once they are here for 6 months (earlier it was immediately on arrival), they can start claiming unemployment benefits, and theoretically, continue to do undeclared cash work. Once they’re on benefits, their entire family arrives (using social housing, school places, NHS, etc. – see below) because they get increased benefits depending on number of family members.

c. Impact on Infrastructure: NHS is crumbling despite massive investments. It just cannot cope with 20% jump in population in last 13 years I’ve lived here. Same goes for school and university places, roads, and other public services.

d. India: Why should EU citizens have priority over qualified people from India or China. The proposed points based system will be a leveller.

3. European Courts: More and more laws are being forced down by bureaucrats in Brussels. Several times decisions by Court of Appeal and Supreme Court (previously the Lords) have been overridden by European Courts. Many of these judgements are a result of their interpretation of UK's Human Rights Act 1998 which gave up many of the sovereign powers based on a legal requirement to enact a EU 'Directive'. Many EU countries have been dishonest and not enacted the same harsh principles but UK is now not able to amend this Act. Precedence and creative rulings under Common Law principles (used by most of the English speaking world) are not being respected by these European Courts who work on Civil Law's interpretive principles.

4. Taxes: Companies like Apple, Google, Starbucks all pay less than 1% tax in UK. All payments we make to them are routed thru gateways in Dublin or Luxembourg. Euro-zone allows tax-arb so long as it is convenient to them.

5. Direct Costs: UK is paying £350 million every week to EU. With the crumbling public services this saving has a potential to have huge impact. I've seen first-hand the luxurious life European bureaucrats are living with huge guaranteed pensions, but ordinary workers in UK industries are being forced to take pay-cuts and pension-cuts.

6. EU vs Eurozone: Eurozone is doing everything it can to fleece Britain for problems of its own creation as countries like Germany do not distinguish between EU and Eurozone. We are the second biggest creditor to Greece but all Greece administration is now being run remotely from Germany and Brussels.

UK has been the fastest growing large developed economy for last 3 years. Fundamental strength of economy and consumption doesn't change overnight. Weaker GBP should help exports in the short-term. People who are scared of the impending challenges do not understand that freedom and democracy need nurturing and sacrifices must be made. I'm glad that we've been able to choose a future where there will be greater job opportunities for my children when they graduate from universities.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby vinod » 27 Jun 2016 13:31

^^^
Right now, everyone is panicking... this is causing a lot of heartburn. I think in the long run it is good for UK but not necessarily for EU.

Recession in short term is for sure and that means who ever is going to start looking for a job now is going to find it difficult.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Singha » 27 Jun 2016 14:23

Rupees has gained some 10% vs pound due to the panic. if it sustains that should help our little cause of overhauling them in dollah terms sooner than it was proposed.
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from= ... NR&view=1W

pound has likewise lost 10% vs the dollah
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from= ... SD&view=1M

in short term indians on work assignments there who had saved the money over there, instead of repatriating it periodically will have some losses in conversion. same could be true of indian corporates who earn from work there like tcs/infy etc.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Singha » 27 Jun 2016 14:29

overall I think the british lay public has nothing much to fear. UK was like this before the EU thing came along.....for 100s of years and nothing happened. whatever level of x-border sale/integration/r&d links were there will continue for mutual benefit. NATO and OECD membership will continue.

two sets of people might lose free earnings - the laundry & investment services in city of london for cash from EU and brussels babus. the first though might actually benefit, since any stolen EU cash parked there might get additional legal protection from brexit.

the channel islands will continue as usual tax havens. dhanda to chalni hi hai.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby rahulm » 27 Jun 2016 14:51

A moderated BBC debate in Birmingham on Brexit

Question Time from Birmingham - EU Referendum Brexit Special

It's seen a a revolt against the Westminster Elites.

UK loss of its empire and it joining the EU sort of coincide - that's the difference. However, I subscribe to the view that longer term UK will do fine from this exit.

Attributes of a sovereign nation state include making decisions on economy, immigrantion, security, spending etc all of which the UK felt was being denied to them instead being made in some German or Brussels black box. Realistically, what other choice did the UK have to manage its destiny - whatever that might be? There will be short term pain for sure.

Jawohl Kommandant Merkel, The Battle For Britain (not UK) has started. The French will provide pièce de résistance

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby SaraLax » 27 Jun 2016 17:08

As many of the members have already indicated - England will do fine over the long term due to this separation from EU. A sensible decision. It will have to gulp some bitter medicine for the short term and also think out of the box for the long term but it will come out fine - whether it is the economy (including manufacturing) or science & tech or R&D & so on. I don't know if Scotland or Ireland or NI will separate from the UK completely but England has a bright future - due to their separation from EU.

The EU is by nature a cumbersome, unwieldy snail - which is turning into an humungous money wasting organization. The EU is a personification of tardiness & ineffectiveness in its actions, pulled in all directions by the selfishness of each of its big member states. EU is besotted with so many never-ending issues & the EU's responses for them are all jaded, muddled and self-damaging. For one example of tardiness - Every time an election takes place in Germany or France or Italy - the EU seems to shut shop on its decision making, so as to prevent from inadvertently causing any change in the results of the yet to happen elections !!. With 28 & more countries taking part in the EU - the utter lack of timely responses or even proper responses will only get more & more worse. For the purpose of an analogy - I always used to hate to that period (of a few weeks or even more than a month) prior to elections in our Indian states - when the EC comes into the picture & takes control of governance and shuts down any chance to start or finish any of the development works (roads/hospitals/new colleges/universities/transportation projects - whether initiated by state govt or central govt) because they might influence the results of the impending elections. I believe the EU will end up with having to handle more contentious issues, lose all of its 'attractions' & end up truly as an entity for all constituent nations to run away from & for all outside nations to learn how not to run a supra-national organization.

There are many advantages that England/UK has now gained
- throwing out all those restrictive rules & laws enforced by the EU on UK. Some which impacted even everyday life (stupid rules on how straight a banana or cucumber must be !!, need to sell eggs by their weight in grams & not in numbers !!!)
- the freedom to act quicker than before, to script its own innovative rules for governance, on how to react to climate change & environmental protection, to create their own flexible FTAs with almost the entire world, to pick & choose which foreigners it wants to allow into its regions & many other such possibilities.
- with EU shackles gone, there exists the wonderful opportunity to exploit its widespread expat community (working in leading positions around the world across many sectors) and to seek their help to chart a new path in its interactions with rest of the world
- the omnipresence of the one true Global language - 'English'. Funnily the EU will continue to u.se English as its primary language of communication with rest of the world as well as for its own internal communications (even though England would not be in EU)
- the close relations with non-european countries like Canada (whereas the US would only treat England as its own poodle) & Australia (huge land mass), the possibility to closely co-operate with the Danes, Norwegians & Swedes
- continues to remain as one of the 5 permanent Security Council members (even though that's ridiculous - considering its relatively small stature) and the UK can threaten to (if not even ) hit the EU with this veto power if the EU is too harsh on the UK for having brexited

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Singha » 27 Jun 2016 17:20

newcastle poster

Image

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby IndraD » 27 Jun 2016 17:28

Britain is the only country other than Saudi Arabia which does not have a written constitution. Britain has what are termed onstitutional convention, along with a lot of history and traditions running the parliament.

If majority of MPs, mindful of their constitutional duty to do what is best for Britain, conscientiously decide that it is best to remain, they can vote down Brexit referendum :mrgreen:

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Karan M » 27 Jun 2016 17:30

Suraj and SriKumar
This supports your points.
http://indy100.independent.co.uk/articl ... paign=i100

6. We won't remain a world leader in research and development

UK investment in science and universities has dried up since the recession, whereas the EU gave us £7bn in science funding alone between 2007 - 2013.

We're also going to face new barriers to collaboration with European universities and research centres.

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/he ... exit-myths

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Lalmohan » 27 Jun 2016 18:58

singhaji - those boys are 1980's fascists now grown in to middle age. they've even used the same poster from all those years ago
this result has just brought out the keeda's from the woodwork...

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby IndraD » 27 Jun 2016 19:03

For some days this display of racism will go on and then gradually stabilize for simple reason immigrants have been in UK since too long , most big cities are teeming with them, love them or hate them, they are there to stay. And they are too many in some parts of country.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby ramana » 27 Jun 2016 19:36

My point is I see two things. Discussion of UK exit and what it means and accompanying glee.
At same time I see the anguish of Indians in UK due to xenophobia etc.

While I share the first being at the receiving end of British colonization, I have sympathy for the latter also.
Further PIOs also suffer in the general meltdown.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby UlanBatori » 27 Jun 2016 20:15

Circa (never mind, b4 the 2008 recession) a certain entity decided that it would be a terrific idea to go set up a branch of their research establishment in Azad Eire (the south I mean). The bijnej plan was that dem silly Oiropeans would rush to get their research done by this Famous Entity. Paying the 150% overhead on direct costs.

After some time, realization slowly started to seep out: the Eirish asked:
Why 4 v should pay for TIME of full-time researchers? In our universities, they are paid by the guvrmand whether they do any work or not.

Also, what is this "OVERHEAD"? :?: In EU, administrators are paid direct from Broossells.

Also, we distribute research projects according to national quota not "merit", so u can compete with rest of Eirish universities where they don't have to ask money for their researcher's salaries or overhead, for the Eireland Quota which is a liberal 1-3% of the EU R&D feeding trough. Oh, sure, ur budget looks competitive! :rotfl:

IOW, there were no Eyetalians, Espanol, Port-e-Geese or (of course) no Englanders or Scotch rushing to get research done. The enterprise was just sucking $$$M out of Mongolia in a hurry. :((

And then the Eirish economy crashed, to top it all.

Just sayin', research works far differently in EU than in say, Mongolia or US.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 27 Jun 2016 20:22, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby Lalmohan » 27 Jun 2016 20:18

ramanaji - many PIO's are also part of the demographic that has benefitted from globalisation and are as engaged in europe as their english colleagues and friends. they fear the undoing of the prosperity machine that has lifted them up above the baseline

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby hnair » 27 Jun 2016 20:24

Suraj wrote:But one thing that's characterized Britain all this time is that they never chose isolationism willingly. And their foreign policy was never driven by domestic plebian imperatives. Brexit marks the first time in hundreds of years that they did something to the contrary on both front. The implications of this action are vast.


They seem to be aiming at an importance level of a more proximal Iceland. Banks et al are there for parking slush money, but basically a place you peer at out of airline door's window, when waiting at the potty-queue.

I suspect their establishment has decided to tighten the tap around the ummah inflow. BRF has been predicting this and it is happening.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby RajeshA » 27 Jun 2016 20:31

Lalmohan wrote:ramanaji - many PIO's are also part of the demographic that has benefitted from globalisation and are as engaged in as their english colleagues and friends. they fear the undoing of the prosperity machine that has lifted them up above the baseline


I would suggest that it makes eminent sense to shift some of the investment and domicile to Scotland. Then get a double citizenship - British and Scottish/Euro and everything would be fine.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby KLP Dubey » 27 Jun 2016 20:55

ramana wrote:My point is I see two things. Discussion of UK exit and what it means and accompanying glee.
At same time I see the anguish of Indians in UK due to xenophobia etc.

While I share the first being at the receiving end of British colonization, I have sympathy for the latter also.
Further PIOs also suffer in the general meltdown.


Since you specified "Indians" and "PIOs" separately (a good idea), I just wanted to clarify. By "Indians" we mean Indian citizens who are living and working in UK on some visa or residence permit. Goremint should be monitoring the developments closely and be ready to help our own people if necessary. I agree many Indians in UK are quite worried.

On the other hand we have no specific obligation towards "PIOs" (i.e. people of Indian descent who are UK citizens by birth, naturalization etc), beyond maybe an expedited OCI clearance. We cannot help them figure out their place in the new UK (or whatever balkanized states may emerge). India already extends the courtesy of OCI facility, which is available if a Brit PIO feels a need to escape to India.

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Re: Indo-UK News and Discussion - April 2013

Postby RajeshA » 27 Jun 2016 21:06

KLP Dubey wrote:
ramana wrote:My point is I see two things. Discussion of UK exit and what it means and accompanying glee.
At same time I see the anguish of Indians in UK due to xenophobia etc.

While I share the first being at the receiving end of British colonization, I have sympathy for the latter also.
Further PIOs also suffer in the general meltdown.


Since you specified "Indians" and "PIOs" separately (a good idea), I just wanted to clarify. By "Indians" we mean Indian citizens who are living and working in UK on some visa or residence permit. Goremint should be monitoring the developments closely and be ready to help our own people if necessary. I agree many Indians in UK are quite worried.

On the other hand we have no specific obligation towards "PIOs" (i.e. people of Indian descent who are UK citizens by birth, naturalization etc), beyond maybe an expedited OCI clearance. We cannot help them figure out their place in the new UK (or whatever balkanized states may emerge). India already extends the courtesy of OCI facility, which is available if a Brit PIO feels a need to escape to India.


Racism and Racial Discrimination whether against Indian citizens or PIOs is an issue on which Indian Government should speak out.


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