China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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Sagar G
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Sagar G »

Bade wrote:While India is discussing the next big import items, PRC is silently working the technology for a Make in China.
India making it's own man portable ATGM, Murica offers to "co develop" and "co produce" next gen Javelin
India takes successful strides towards achieving design goals of Kaveri, Murica offers to "co develop" and "co produce" new age jet engines
India successfully develops ABM missile network, Murica offers Patriot system
India ____________________________________, Murica offers EMAL tech transfer
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by member_23370 »

LoL Good one...
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Sid »

Liu wrote: ...................
......................................However,because PLA still think eletromagnetic catapult is a not as mature and proven as steam catapult, the next china~made AC is supposed to still adopt steam catapult.
Lie dude, China does not possess either EMAL or catapult technology. Neither does Russia (its major beneficiary). Nor they have operational experience (true for both Russia/China). Hence both technologies will be new and unproven for China. Its a leap of faith no matter which technology they will choose, because they will be building it from scratch (of copying from somewhere).

US still has not designed EMAL to perfection, hence its not mature from their point of view.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by NRao »

Liu wrote:
NRao wrote:There is potential for further growth, but, unless they change politically they will plateau at some point. There are very few countries China can sell to and most, if not all, are 3rd world, economically challenged, nations - outside of some ME countries I would imagine who would be interested in them.
well, weapons sale is usually a political leverage...so USA's ally or quasi allies can hardly buy CHina-made weapon, even if CHina-made ones have better cost-performance.....Turkey's air-defence missle sales is a good example...


unless CHina is so powerful that most 1rd world or 2rd world countries abandon USA and sides with CHina, their weapon market would not be open to CHina
Do not know about the Turkey sale. Is it one that the "West" funded to get a working copy of a Chinese product? ???????

What is happening with Pakistan? Is the US not as confident any more with Pakistan? Because of the prying Chinese eyes and a willing Pakistan?
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/ ... B320150317

Defying U.S., European allies say they'll join China-led bank
By Yann Le Guernigou and Ben Blanchard

PARIS/BEIJING Tue Mar 17, 2015 8:37am EDT
Reuters) - Germany, France and Italy said on Tuesday they had agreed to join a new China-led Asian investment bank after close ally Britain defied U.S. pressure to become a founder member of a venture seen in Washington as a rival to the World Bank.

The concerted move to participate in Beijing's flagship economic outreach project was a diplomatic blow for the United States, reflecting European eagerness to partner with China's fast-growing economy, the second largest in the world.

It comes amid prickly trade negotiations between Brussels and Washington, and at a time when EU and Asian governments are frustrated that the U.S. Congress has held up a reform of voting rights in the International Monetary Fund due to give China and other emerging economies more say in global economic governance.
It is seen as a key vector to spread Chinese "soft power" in the region, possibly at the expense of the United States. The World Bank is traditionally run by a U.S. nominee and Washington also has the most influence at the IMF.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by John »

Sagar G wrote:India making it's own man portable ATGM, Murica offers to "co develop" and "co produce" next gen Javelin
India takes successful strides towards achieving design goals of Kaveri, Murica offers to "co develop" and "co produce" new age jet engines
India successfully develops ABM missile network, Murica offers Patriot system
India ____________________________________, Murica offers EMAL tech transfer
All jokes aside. I doubt they could care less about indigenous program it is all about $$$. Javelin was offered mainly due to counter Spike, Rafael wins the Spike deal it would another loss for Javelin which is now struggling to win more orders. Patriot has been on offer for a while and system is more of direct competitor to MR-SAM than AAD missile, MR SAM marketed by Israel will cannibalize future PAC-2/3 sales.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by member_23370 »

Javelin can be pushed down the throats of Nato armies. Israel doesn't have enough clout there. Also MR-SAM won't be sold without Isral and Indian consent. The turks were turned down and are now looking for ESSM.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by John »

Bheeshma wrote:Javelin can be pushed down the throats of Nato armies. Israel doesn't have enough clout there. Also MR-SAM won't be sold without Isral and Indian consent. The turks were turned down and are now looking for ESSM.
Spike is already deployed by NATO armies, UK & France are evaluating it for more orders.

I believe Rafael can market Barak-8 without India's consent, Turkey-Israel relationship has sourced hence they went with ESSM.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Philip »

http://www.scmp.com/news/china/article/ ... s-military

Retired PLA general 'ashamed and scared' by corruption in China's military
Fighting capability compromised by the greed of many at the top, warns retired Luo Yuan, who likens problem to Qing dynasty's downfall
Minnie Chan in Beijing
Retired People's Liberation Army major general Luo Yuan says he support moves to promote the PLA's spirit and traditions. Photo: Simon Song

A hawkish retired People's Liberation Army major general said he felt "a burning shame" and was "scared" at the number of top brass suspected of corruption.

"How come so many greedy guys get promoted to the top level? Are they qualified and capable of commanding an army to fight battles?" asked Luo Yuan in an interview with the South China Morning Post.

"The fighting capability of an army would be compromised as no soldier would fight for corrupt leaders … [they] would definitely disobey superiors who were promoted due to bribes," he added.

Luo is a vice-president of a Beijing think tank made up of retired military officers. From 2008 to 2013 he was a delegate to the country's top political advisory body, the Chinese People's Political Consultative Conference.

He said he felt shame every time a senior officer was snared in the anti-graft campaign, launched by President Xi Jinping after he took over the military, Communist Party and presidency two years ago.

"The appearance of those disgraced senior officials in our army like Xu Caihou and Gu Junshan , who were worshipping money, craving promotion, buying and selling ranks … such things could previously only be read about in history textbooks. Such behaviour was the key reason behind the defeats of the Qing dynasty army and Kuomintang military.

"But now the same is happening in our people's army. It's such a burning shame!"

Xu, a former vice-chairman of the powerful Central Military Commission, is the most senior military figure to be investigated in Xi's anti-graft campaign. His case was dropped after he died of bladder cancer on Sunday.

Gu, a top ally of Xu and a former deputy logistics chief, was charged with bribery and embezzlement last year.

Some reports said Gu was suspected of selling hundreds of senior positions. Investigators believe he took bribes worth 600 million yuan (HK$757 million) as part of a 30 billion-yuan scam.

Luo said he supported Xi's move to promote the PLA's spirit and traditions as a way to revive dedication and morale among the troops, even though some critics say the army's doctrine of "utter devotion" runs contrary to modern social values.

"It's prejudiced to say the [PLA's] spirit is outdated," Luo said. "In fact, our ideological work has gone awry because of slackness in past years of promoting its glorious revolutionary traditions. That is what has caused today's problem."

Luo also said the PLA's equipment still lagged behind that of the United States.

"We welcome all kinds of impartial assessments of the Chinese military by outsiders because the spectator sees most clearly," he said. "We must be receptive to the experience of foreign armies."
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-subc ... 0319000123
Modified Xiaolong fighter completes test flight, courting buyers

Staff Reporter 2015-03-19
A Block 1 JF-17 Thunder at the Zhuhai Air Show, November 2012. (Photo/CNS)

The first modified version of China's FC-1 Xiaolong fighter completed its maiden flight on Feb. 9 in Kamra, Pakistan, reports the UK-based Jane's Defence Weekly.

The single-engine, multi-role aircraft, also known as the PAC JF-17 Thunder, was jointly developed by the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex and the Chengdu Aircraft Corporation of China.

After its first flight, the Block 2 fighter made another three successful test flights, carried out as part of Pakistan's promotion of the aircraft for overseas consumers. Air commodore Ahsan Rafiq, deputy chief project director and a former commanding officer of the Test and Evaluation Unit of the JF-17, said that the JF-17 has an additional air-to-air refueling probe, an enhanced oxygen system and an improved electronic countermeasures system.

The Pakistan Air Force signed a contract to purchase 50 Block 2 JF-17 fighters from the Pakistan Aeronautical Complex, said the report. The air-to-air refueling probe, however, will not appear until the 29th jet, which will fly later this year, said Ahsan. The Pakistan Aeronautical Complex is working with China National Aero-Technology Import & Export Corporation closely to export this aircraft to the foreign market, according to the report.

Warnes said that a two-seated version of Block 2 is currently being developed by China's Chengdu Aircraft Industry Group. "We know potential customers would like to see a two-seater, although it is not such a big deal for the Pakistan Air Force, which started flying several types, [A-5, F-6, F-7P and F-7PG] without a training version," said Ahsan. "This will give us the chance to show potential suitors how the jet can perform in the air.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Sagar G »

John wrote:All jokes aside. I doubt they could care less about indigenous program it is all about $$$. Javelin was offered mainly due to counter Spike, Rafael wins the Spike deal it would another loss for Javelin which is now struggling to win more orders. Patriot has been on offer for a while and system is more of direct competitor to MR-SAM than AAD missile, MR SAM marketed by Israel will cannibalize future PAC-2/3 sales.
I am afraid your view is very naive. It has to be more than just mere coincidence that whenever we are close to achieving a tech breakthrough suddenly out of the blue there comes an offer for so and so equipment and this has happened with clockwork precision. One aspect of course is to earn $$$ out of the deal but the other aspect and the more important one is to stop a competing industry from coming up. Take the ex. of Javelin, first Murica refused to ToT, then the offer turned to "ToT but certain things will be held back" and finally to full ToT and "co-develop" and "co-produce" a next gen missile. It's like watching a Murican striptease where skin shown is directly proportional to the bundle of cash you have in hand. I would contradict myself here and add that the offer for full ToT and "co develop"/ "co-produce" didn't come out of the blue. Murica knows very well that a man portable ATGM is just the next logical step post Nag and it's only a matter of time before we develop our version (already under development). Murica knows that this would mean a new competitor in the market and there is no way that Murica would be able to compete with us knowing the QR's our missiles have to fulfill they will simply blow away any competition out there, so here comes the fugly ass Murican trying to act pretty flipping tits Javelin over our face behaving as if it's an act of benevolence :roll:

If as you say that the sole purpose is to just earn $$$ then why have we faced so many tech/economic sanctions ??? Why still Indian institutions face tech denial regimes ??? Why dual tech isn't on offer to us ??? India still has a lot of technical catchup to do so why not offer the tech and earn billions of $$$ in return ??? The answers to these and many such similar questions can only lead to one logical end. All this recent tamasha by Murica acting oh so lovey dovey is to stop a competing industry from coming up and keep India under tech denial forever. More power and kudos to our scientists and engineers who have waded through shit to get us where we are today.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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Chinese military bases in South China Sea worries India
NEW DELHI: India has raised eyebrows over artificial islands that China is building in the South China Sea (SCS) region -- which can allow Beijing to deploy naval and air forces -- in the strategic waterway that is imperative for Delhi's Asia-Pacific outreach as well as energy investments.

Delhi has stated that stability in the region is necessary for economic prosperity and asserted that threat of force should not be used to settle disputes. Singapore Defence Minister Ng Eng Hen had had recently appealed to India to play a bigger role in the ASEAN region as Delhi does not harbour hegemonistic ambitions.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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China looks to up 'soft control' of Myanmar: report
China must increase its "soft control" of Myanmar to fulfill its dream of building a new Pacific Fleet and an Indian Ocean Fleet, according to a commentary from the Beijing-based Sina Military.

According to China's state broadcaster CCTV, the 14th Army Corps of the People's Liberation Army recently began a large-scale military exercise in the western region of southwest China's Yunnan province, near the China-Myanmar border. The exercise comes amid increasing tensions between the two countries due to the escalating violence between the Myanmar government and ethnic rebel forces, which has already spilled into China after a stray shell flattened a house and a wayward bomb killed four Yunnan farmers earlier this month.

Sina Military believes Beijing is sending a message to Naypyidaw — which began a renewed assault on the rebels' Myanmar Nationalities Democratic Alliance Army in the self-administered Kokang region on March 27 — through the exercise and also by leaking reports that it is tightening border restrictions and placing artillery units and air defense troops on standby.

For China, increasing its long-term "soft control" of Myanmar is important for both economic and military reasons. Unlike neighbors such as Vietnam, Cambodia, Nepal and Bhutan, Myanmar offers a key route to the Indian Ocean, which is why China aims to eventually rent land from Myanmar to build a PLA naval base there, the report added.

To this end, China needs to develop some kind of military alliance with Myanmar, perhaps beginning with assistance in non-military aid missions, Sina Military said. China also needs to speed up the development of oil and gas pipelines between the two countries so that it can become Myanmar's largest oil industry partner. Additionally, China should boost its investment in Myanmar's transport, port development, urban infrastructure development, medical, telecommunications and energy sectors so that the people of Myanmar can sense the positive benefits of increased Chinese influence, the report added.

If China can secure a permanent port to the Indian Ocean in Myanmar in the future, the PLA Navy's "far sea fleet" can be split into a Pacific Fleet and an Indian Ocean Fleet, the report said. The Pacific Fleet will be in charge of the first island chain — a line through the Kurile Islands, Japan, the Ryukyu Islands, Taiwan, the Philippines, and Indonesia — and the second island chain — a north-south line from the Kuriles through Japan, the Bonins, the Marianas, the Carolines, and Indonesia. The Indian Ocean Fleet will be responsible for the region from the Strait of Malacca in the South China Sea through to the north Indian Ocean. The operational regions of the two fleets can use the south of Taiwan and the Philippines as a boundary, with each being able to cross over to assist the other when necessary, the report added.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

Plan will induct together 3 x 093g ssn per state media.
They are enlarged 093 with vl tubes.
Pix released in state media
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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delete
Last edited by member_28756 on 03 Apr 2015 17:33, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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http://www.forbes.com/sites/jplehmann/2 ... s-of-face/

China And The US: The AIIB Fiasco & America's Colossal Loss Of Face


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-0 ... ate-blasts
"US Has Screwed Up Its Approach To China's AIIB" Former US Secretary Of State Blasts
Tyler Durden's pictureSubmitted by Tyler Durden on 04/02/2015 21:50 -0400

With at least 46 nations now agreeing to join the China-led Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank (AIIB), the writing could perhaps be on the well for the dollar. And to make matters worse, this week saw former U.S. Secretary of State Madeleine Albright, rant that "\The United States has "screwed up" on its way to deal with the China-proposed AIIB and "should not have done in this way."
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Austin »

China Navy to get 3 new nuclear subs

http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2015 ... 989106.htm
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by ashi »

Prawit pushes new era of military ties with Beijing

In fact, the Thai air force's decision to match China's J10 in the air exercise with Swedish-made Gripen, instead of of its F16 jets, had sparked speculation Thailand did not want to upset the US.

However, sources said the decision was purely technical as both the J10 and Gripen belong to the so-called 4.5th generation of jets while F16 is a 4th-generation jet.

During the next round of air drills scheduled for May, the Thai air force will send two Gripen pilots from the Surat Thani-based 7th Squadron to China to train on the J10 aircraft.
The committee considering the submarine purchase said it liked the look of the diesel-powered submarines from China which cost 360 billion baht for two. Apart from the Chinese submarines, is also eyeing L15 fighter jets from China for training which are to replace the aging L39 fleet that has been in service for about 30 years.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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http://www.wantchinatimes.com/news-subc ... 0406000004
PLA could be developing two versions of Type 055 destroyer

Image

China could be developing two types of the Type 055 guided-missile destroyer — an anti-submarine and an air-defense model — according to the Kanwa Defense Review, a Chinese-language military magazine based in Canada.

The April edition of the magazine made the suggestion after analyzing the latest leaked satellite images of a ground model of the Type 055, which experts believe may have been designed as the successor to the PLA Navy's highly successful Type 52D destroyer.

Based on the satellite images, the Type 055 is 19.34 meters wide, though the ship's length-side, which has only built its main gun, is yet to be finished. The distance between the main gun and the upper level structures, where vertical missile launchers will be installed, is estimated to be 16.93 m, which is particularly wide given that the typical length is around 10 m. The total length of the ship from the main gun to stern is 130 meters, while its displacement appears to be greater than 10,000 tons.

The model appears to have no helicopter pad, meaning that this version of the destroyer may only require small helicopter drones when attacking with guided missiles. Kanwa suggests that this means the Type 055 could be developed into two models, an anti-submarine version and an air-defense version.

By comparison, the total length and width of the four Type 052D destroyers currently in construction are 154 m and 16.33 m, respectively. On the other hand, the US Navy's Zumwalt-class destroyers (DDG-1000) are 182.9 m long and 24.6 m wide. The Type 055 appears to have adopted some of the DDG-1000's stealth concepts, such as using an integrated composite beam to increase the ship's inward tilt angle.

The PLA seems to be building a Chinese-version of the DDG-1000, the report said, noting that focusing on the ability to attack targets both on sea and on land would represent a major change in the PLA Navy's development strategy. The Type 055 will be able to achieve these objectives as it can fire either the YJ18 anti-ship missile or the CJ-10 land attack cruise missile from its vertical launchers.

At last year's Zhuhai Airshow in Guangdong, it was revealed that Chinese companies are developing 155-millimeter Type WS-35R/B guided missiles with a maximum range of 60 kilometers, who appear to have similar capabilities to the latest generation of US destroyer technology.

Each DDG-1000 has a total of only 80 vertical launch cells, which is believed to be sufficient given the US Navy's abundance of guided missile cruisers and destroyers. The original design was said to have included 128 cells. However, as China currently only has 10 Type 052C/D destroyers, this means that the Type 055 could have around 90-96 cells, similar to that of the US Arleigh Burke-class destroyers.

Huanqiu, the Chinese-language website of the nationalistic Global Times tabloid, suggests that, based on the modelling process of the Type 052C/D destroyers, construction of the the Type 055 could take another one or two years to commence.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by vivek_ahuja »

New performance analysis article up on my blog: 8)

Image

A capability review of the Chinese aerial-refueling tanker fleet

This one looks at the performance of the Chinese H-6U tankers versus the IL-78MKI in Indian service.

As always, feedback is welcome. :)

-Vivek
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

10,000 ton ddg for asw looks excessive but the spruance class was 9000t and mainly asw...some had 61 cell asroc launcher
I think ability to keep up with cvn for long periods dictated the huge size.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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Austin wrote:China Navy to get 3 new nuclear subs

http://usa.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2015 ... 989106.htm
http://www.businessinsider.com/chinas-n ... avy-2015-4
China's new submarines could create problems for the US Navy

China is commissioning three upgraded Type-093 Shang-class nuclear-powered attack submarines. The new Type-093G "is reported to be an upgraded version of Type-093 … With a teardrop hull, the submarine is longer than its predecessor and has a vertical launching system," the China Daily reported.

The redesign of the submarine would allow it to move faster and more quietly than its previous iteration, the Chinese media reported. Crucially, the 093G model would also be outfitted with vertical launch tubes that would allow the submarine to be outfitted with the YJ-18 supersonic anti-ship cruise missile (ASCM).

The YJ-18 is designed to target enemy ships and battle groups with increased lethality and range. According to the Taiwan-based Want China Times, the YJ-18, when combined with aerial spotting and targeting from Chinese aircraft operating from an aircraft carrier, could hypothetically hit enemy ships almost 250 miles away.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 49213.html

taking advantage of shallow water and a lack of concern for environment, china is creating artificial islands and guard posts in the south china sea. i read the avg depth is only around 150m in south china sea, so its already very hard for submarines to work in....these islands will no doubt have submerged sonar devices strung out on lines to try and dominate the green water belt.

people are going to need small midget sub sized UUCV to go in and make a meal of it. perhaps a threat library and broadband noise collection and identification to seek out different types of targets to unleash TT on.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by kit »

What if China starts making similar islands in the Indian ocean ?

This is not if but just a matter of time !
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

hunt for old tang dynasty maps must be ongoing.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Lisa »

kit wrote:What if China starts making similar islands in the Indian ocean ?

This is not if but just a matter of time !
Need to change mindset,

What if India starts making similar islands in the South China Sea ?
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Ankit Desai »

China's plans to build rail link with Nepal through Mt Everest

Posting it in full.
China plans to build a 540-kilometre strategic high-speed rail link between Tibet and Nepal passing through a tunnel under Mt Everest, a move that could raise alarm in India about the Communist giant's growing influence in its neighbourhood.

This is the first time a tunnel plan has been revealed because China had earlier discussed extending the Qinghai-Lhasa line to the Nepalese border without digging a tunnel.

"A proposed extension of the Qinghai-Tibet Railway to the China-Nepal border through Tibet would boost bilateral trade and tourism as there is currently no rail line linking the two countries," state-run China Daily reported on Thursday.

"The line will probably have to go through Qomolangma so that workers may have to dig some very long tunnels," railway expert Wang Mengshu told the China Daily, referring to Mount Everest by its Tibetan name.

The idea is to find a short route to Nepal in order to access the vast Indian market in a short time, sources said. China may be trying to involve Nepal in its Bangladesh-China-India-Myanmar project because New Delhi has shown less enthusiasm for the BCIM project, they said.

The Lhasa line was extended to Xigaze, the second biggest city in Tibet, which is closer to the Nepalese border as Chinese authorities completed a 253-km long link railway line in August last year.

Restrained by rugged Himalayan mountains with its "remarkable" changes in elevation, trains on the line would probably have a maximum speed of 120 kmph.

A line of trekkers walk through fresh snow near the base of Mount Everest in the Solu-Khumbu region of Nepal. (Getty Images file photo)

The Nepal rail project which has been taken up at Kathmandu's request will be completed by 2020, the newspaper cited a Tibetan official as saying. The project was discussed during the visit of Chinese foreign minister, Wang Yi, to Kathmandu in December, according to Nepalese reports.

"If the proposal becomes reality, bilateral trade, especially in agricultural products, will get a strong boost, along with tourism and people-to-people exchanges," the railway expert said.

"The changes in the elevation along the line are remarkable. The line is probably have to go through Qomolangma so that worker may have to dig some very long tunnels," he said.
China has been scaling up its ties with Nepal much to the chagrin of India to stem the flow of Tibetans travelling through Nepal to meet the Dalai Lama in Dharamshala.

Beijing recently increased its annual aid to Nepal to USD 128 million from the previous USD 24 million.

In another move involving India's neighborhood, China is likely to sign a deal to help Pakistan build a natural gas pipeline to Iran. The contract is expected to be signed during president Xi Jinping's upcoming visit to Islamabad.
-Ankit
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

looking at google earth ocean depth data, the PLAN has a grave problem with where to hide its SSBN fleet.

the south china sea and east china sea are very shallow and barely 100 m deep.

in south china sea there is a deep bowl near the philipines but its too small

in the north there is another deep bowl between korea and japan but it will be crawling with enemy submarines and orions.

one wrong turn and a sub with a dive depth of 300m could easily hit bottom near china.

only after crossing the philipine chain is there deep clear water but its too far for PLANAF to sanitize and control.

in contrast nature has blessed india such that much of Bay of Bengal is close to 3000m deep, and even around the A&N there is a deep trench area on both sides.
only the coastal areas near myanmar and thailand are of the south china sea depth nay shallower around 50m only. phuket is like that.

so between the A&N and our coast we have a large clear sandbox with us on 3 sides and the 4th side opening clear into the indian ocean vastness where the
depth increases to 5km.

so my prediction given the geography and relative strength of american SSNs is cheen will not set much store by its SSBN fleet and instead rely on dispersable rail and road mobile ICBMs as its primary deterrent. there are vast areas in tibet and mongolia out of range of american air force and cruise missiles.

we do not have such vast empty areas and will need to rely on a mix of rail and sea based arsenal.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Aditya G »

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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

All the light blue above is very shallow.
From Hainan their missile sub's would need to hide in the deep blue hole west of Philippines that's why they want the whole place and are busy squatting on every piece of rock.
Else have to enter the american fishpond of west pacific or India ocean via couple of deep water straits
Its a very sub optimal situation for ssbn ops
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by kit »

I dont know ..looking at their resourcefulness , they might as well make subterranean sub bases right in the indian ocean !
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by member_23370 »

Sure..and they will sprout gills also and not need subs.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

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http://thediplomat.com/2015/04/confirme ... r-missile/
Confirmed: China Deploys New 'Carrier Killer' Missile
A new report by the Office of Naval Intelligence highlights the growing capabilities of the Chinese Navy.


Franz-Stefan Gady for The Diplomat

April 11, 2015

This week, the Pentagon’s Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI) released an unclassified assessment of the Chinese navy’s new capabilities and missions in the years ahead.

Compared to ONI’s last unclassified analysis on the PLAN six years ago, the more than 300-ship strong Chinese People’s Liberation Army Navy (PLAN) has “made significant strides in operationalizing as well as modernizing its force,” notes the new 2015 report. Notably different from 2009 is Beijing’s current shipbuilding program, which is now focusing more on the construction of multi-mission vessels rather than anti-surface warfare combatants.

The most striking revelation of the 2015 ONI report is that the PLAN has apparently already equipped a class of guided missile destroyers with China’s most advanced supersonic anti-ship missile. “[T]he newest class, the LUYANG III destroyer is fitted with the new vertically-launched YJ-18 ASCM,” the report says.

Writing last week (see: 175 Comments), I highlighted that this new weapon constitutes a major threat to U.S. and allied surface vessels deployed in Asian waters. As of now, only one Type 052D Luyang III-class destroyer is currently in service with the vertically launched YJ-18. However, the PLAN plans to commission ten more such vessels by 2017 and also plans to deploy the missile on Type-093G and Type-095 submarines.

“In 2013 and 2014, China launched more naval ships than any other country and is expected to continue this trend through 2015-16,” according to the study. In 2013, the PLAN either laid down, launched, or commissioned more than 60 ships, although the emphasis overall is on quality rather than size. Looking at just numbers, Beijing already fields a formidable naval force today:

As of this publishing, the PLA(N) consists of approximately 26 destroyers (21 of which are considered modern), 52 frigates (35 modern), 20 new corvettes, 85 modern missile armed patrol craft, 56 amphibious ships, 42 mine warfare ships (30 modern), more than 50 major auxiliary ships, and more than 400 minor auxiliary ships and service/support craft.

The PLAN’s submarine fleet currently deploys 66 boats — five nuclear-attack submarines, four nuclear ballistic-missile submarines, and 57 diesel attack submarines, although the report does not indicate how many of the vessels are, in fact, operational. Additionally, “by 2020 the submarine force will likely grow to more than 70 submarines,” ONI assesses.

Furthermore the paper notes that major qualitative improvements are occurring within naval aviation and the submarine force, which are increasingly capable of striking targets hundreds of miles from the Chinese mainland
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by brar_w »

Document: Office of Naval Intelligence 2015 Assessment of Chinese People’s Liberation Army Navy




http://news.usni.org/2015/04/09/documen ... -army-navy
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Singha »

I figure upto depths of 100m, satellites and their new age sensors might be able to make out submerged submarines and the surface effects of their underwater wake,
so entire south china sea (barring the philipines deep hole) , yellow sea(east china sea) and bo hai bay apart from being problematic as a bastion also the lack of stealth issue.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Philip »

More on the ONI report. The USN is worried about the Hainan sub base and PLAN SSBNs based there in caverns beneath the mountain,and contiguous waters allowing China to adopt a bastion approach to securing its strat sub fleet.However,with newer more sophisticated subs arriving,Chinese SSBNs in the future may make begin to operate further from the mainland in the vastness of the Pacific.with missiles capable of striking anywhere on the US mainland.With Chinese SSNs beginning to operate in the waters of the IOR without detection by the IN,the UW scenario in the Asia-Pacific theatre is going to be exceptionally active.

Ck link for video-clips and map.

http://freebeacon.com/national-security ... l-buildup/
ONI Reveals Massive Chinese Naval Buildup
New supersonic cruise missile deployed

BY: Bill Gertz
April 10, 2015

China has deployed a new high-speed anti-ship cruise missile and is sharply expanding an armada of advanced guided-missile warships and submarines, according to a naval intelligence report made public Thursday.

The Office of Naval Intelligence, in its first unclassified assessment of the Chinese navy in six years, revealed deployment of the new YJ-18 supersonic anti-ship cruise missile on warships and submarines that analysts say poses a major threat to U.S. and allied vessels.

China’s current naval force of 300 surface ships, submarines, amphibious ships, and missile-armed patrol craft is rapidly expanding, the report says.

According to the report, China began building or launched more than 60 naval ships and vessels last year, and a similar number of warships are under construction or deployed for 2015.

“Major qualitative improvements are occurring within naval aviation and the submarine force, which are increasingly capable of striking targets hundreds of miles from the Chinese mainland,” the report said, adding that despite some shortfalls, “it is emerging as a well equipped and competent force.”

The key focus of the Chinese navy is anti-surface ship warfare through deployment of large numbers of advanced destroyers, frigates, and submarines, supported by long-range range over the horizon radar.

The new YJ-18 cruise missile is deployed on the newest class of destroyer called the Luyang III, and on diesel attack submarines known as the Song/Yuan class, and nuclear-powered Shang-class attack submarines.

Andrew Erickson, a Naval War College professor, said the YJ-18 poses a significant threat.

“This supersonic missile could be extremely difficult for U.S. and allied ships to defend against,” Erickson said.

The YJ-18 reportedly has a maximum range of 111 miles at a speed of Mach .08 and a higher speed range of 24 miles. The new missile is more capable and has a longer range than the current anti-ship cruise missile arsenal.

Additionally, the report reveals that China’s coast guard now has more ships and vessels than the combined coast guard forces of countries in the region.

It was the first time the U.S. government has acknowledged China’s deployment of the supersonic missile, which appears based on the Russian SSN-27/Klub cruise missile.

The report also says deployment of DF-21D long-range anti-ship ballistic missiles will expand the attack range of the Chinese military “further into the Philippine and South China Seas.”

The report notes China is using its newly expanded naval power in maritime disputes throughout the region, including the Bohai Sea, Yellow Sea, East China Sea, and South China Sea.

“Against this back drop of increasing military capability, China’s leaders appear increasingly willing to assert China’s maritime claims, even when such actions risk exacerbating tension with China’s neighbors,” the report said.

China has clashed with Vietnam, Philippines, and Japan over maritime claims to islands in the South China and East China Seas.

Further escalating tensions, the Chinese have reclaimed “hundreds of acres” of land last year as part of a buildup of naval and maritime law enforcement operations in the South China Sea’s Spratly islands.

“Together with cutting-edge Second Artillery Force [missile] developments and South China Sea island building, this raises a serious risk for the U.S. and its allies,” Erickson said.

“If China envelops a disputed feature such as Second Thomas Shoal in a ‘Cabbage Strategy’ with nonmilitary Chinese personnel facing foreign forces—backed by some of the world’s most potent ballistic and cruise missiles—how will America respond? Washington needs an answer soon, or it will risk major erosion of its interests and those of its allies.”

China’s submarine force also has expanded rapidly. Currently, China has deployed 59 diesel submarines and nine nuclear power submarines, and ONI estimates the numbers will increase to 63 and 11 respectively by 2020.

“China’s newest indigenous submarine-launched [anti-ship cruise missile], the YJ-18, extends a similar capability to the SONG, YUAN, and SHANG classes,”
the report said. “Previously, China’s only indigenous sub-launched ASCM was the YJ-82, which has a much shorter range.”

The report also reveals that China has now deployed four Jin-class nuclear missile submarines that are expected to begin operational deployments this year.

Adm. William Gortney, commander of the U.S. Northern Command, said earlier this week that China’s has three missile submarines in the water that are a “concern.”

The sea deployments of the submarines, armed with JL-2 submarine-launched ballistic missiles, “will mark China’s first credible at-sea second-strike nuclear capability,” the report said.

“The JIN-class nuclear ballistic missile submarine (SSBN) is poised to begin strategic patrols in the near future, for the first time, putting Chinese intercontinental range ballistic missiles to sea,” the report said.

“At the same time, with the commissioning of the Kuznetsov-class aircraft carrier Liaoning China has taken the first step as a carrier-capable navy.”

The report contradicts a key theme of U.S. intelligence analysts for the past 15 years, namely that China’s military was defensive and focused mainly on preparing for a conflict with Taiwan.

The new report says China’s naval buildup is for operations far beyond Chinese shores, including sea-lane security and other power projection.

“Over the long term, Beijing aspires to sustain naval missions far from China’s shores,” the ONI report said.

Among the naval operations showing the expanded reach were the Chinese navy’s combat training in the Philippine Sea, training missions in the Mediterranean, and increased intelligence ship deployments in the western Pacific. Last year, for the first time a Chinese submarine was deployed to Indian Ocean.

Rick Fisher, a Chinese military affairs expert, said the YJ-18 is also likely to be deployed in land-based and aircraft-launched versions.

“This is a quite informative but fair assessment of the current and near term prospects for China’s naval power,” Fisher said of the report, noting that ONI provides more details than congressionally mandated Pentagon reports on the Chinese military.

“Its identification of the Navy [Communist] Party Standing Committee is a significant contribution to our understanding of the PLA,” he said.

The committee is the Party organ that makes decisions for the navy and the report notes that China’s military is a “party army” not a traditional national defense force as other nations have.

“This is a crucial point,” Fisher said. “It means that 35 years of effort by successive U.S. administrations to engage the PLA has been to a major degree misdirected. There must now be a major push by all U.S. agencies charged with ‘engaging; China to focus on the Party.”

Other key disclosures in the report include:
•The NATO code name for China’s J-10 fighter, the “Firebird”
•China’s navy will likely emerge as “one of China’s most prolific [unmanned aerial vehicle] users”
•The Chinese navy has 50,000 mines
•China will likely conduct warship deployment to the central and eastern Pacific in the next five years.
•The PLA Navy made “sporadic” progress as integrated joint-war fighting capabilities


The report concludes that China’s naval build up of aircraft carriers, ballistic missile submarines, and potentially large-deck amphibious ships is altering how the PLA navy operates and “is viewed by the world.”

“Here, ONI is suggesting what to some non-government analysts is obvious: China is building its naval forces for eventual global power projection,” Fisher said.

“ONI is now suggesting, as others have already, that China could soon be projecting naval power in the same manner as the U.S. Navy,” he said. “The Washington policy community has not yet started to understand, much less respond to this level of strategic challenge.”
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by rohankumaon »

Russia Confirms Arms Deal to Supply China With S-400 Air Defense Systems

Numbers of system purchased has not been given..

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/world/20150413/1 ... z3XCAFripv
member_28756
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by member_28756 »

rohankumaon wrote:Russia Confirms Arms Deal to Supply China With S-400 Air Defense Systems

Numbers of system purchased has not been given..

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/world/20150413/1 ... z3XCAFripv

From TASS....watch the new version HQ 10000 copy cat comes out in a few years. :roll:

http://tass.ru/en/russia/788778
MOSCOW, April 13. /TASS/. China has purchased S-400 missile defense systems from Russia, director general of Russia's major arms exporting company Rosoborobexport Anatoly Isaykin has told the Kommersant daily in an interview.

Isaykin refused to disclose terms of contract but confirmed that China had become the first buyer of the cutting-edge air defense system. He noted that it emphasizes the strategic nature of Russian-Chinese relations.

The head of Rosoboronexport said that the Russian defense industry is obliged to supply the S-400 air defense system to the Russian Defense Ministry first of all, despite the fact that many foreign countries are interested in purchasing the system.

The systems, which are capable of launching up to 72 missiles and engaging up to 36 targets simultaneously, entered service in 2007 to replace the S-300 systems. S-400 Triumf is designed to shield from air strikes, strategic, cruise, tactical and operating tactical ballistic missiles and medium-range ballistic missiles.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by govardhanks »

Saw this twitter wanted share here,

J20 a/c carrier flight story and how it was faked.
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Re: China Military Watch - August 9, 2014

Post by Austin »

China developing 3 new SAM per CDF and Global Security

http://www.globalsecurity.org/space/wor ... /hq-26.htm
HQ-26 Anti-Ballistic Missile Interceptor

The HQ-9B, HQ-19 [THAAD counterpart], HQ-26 [SM-3 counterpart] and HQ-29 [PAC-3 counterpart] are designed primarily for Anti Ballistic Missile capabilities. While the HQ-9A air defense variant of the HQ-9 series is very well attested, the remaining theater missile defense interceptors are poorly attested, and verge on being little more than rumors.

Very little is known about this system, a Sea-based missile that uses a dual pulse motor, such as the motor M136 SM-3 or that of PAC-3 MSE. The certification is expected at the earliest in 2015 and it could equip Type 055 destroyer.
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