Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat (09-08-2014)

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 20 Jul 2017 18:57

The article in Global Times is correct. Hindu Nationalism will not tolerate Han expansionism, and if that means war so be it.

DrRatnadip · Post by **DrRatnadip** » 20 Jul 2017 19:06

http://m.timesofindia.com/india/diploma ... 682394.cms

Diplomatic channels between India, China have never broken; Doval will visit Beijing next week: MEA on border dispute

NEW DELHI: Without commenting on China's reported precondition for talks, India on Thursday said that diplomatic channels between the two countries "are not impeded" and have "never broken".
In that spirit, India also said that national security advisor (NSA) Ajit Doval will indeed attend a BRICS meeting of NSAs scheduled for next week in China.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 20 Jul 2017 19:12

Yagnasri wrote:http://www.business-standard.com/articl ... 412_1.html

Mulla yam got some personal information or what.

That is like a tight U turn. It seems like he was under control of some unnamed entity and now he feels free at last. His party ignored him and now he has guilt feeling about things he might have done (for party) against country. Modi ji has to give him time and listen him carefully.

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 20 Jul 2017 19:44

How George Fernades got it right!
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/dokl ... 06675.html

The sound bites from Mulayam, reminiscing Fernades...wheels within wheels onlee.

Bart S · Post by **Bart S** » 20 Jul 2017 19:47

BharataTalwar wrote:Does anyone else feel that Western msm are completely ignoring this opportunity to expose China for what they are? Why are they quiet about this? I have yet to find any major Western media or columnist cover this standoff in any meaningful way. It seems to indicate that they might stay neutral in the event of things kicking off between India and China. Its irking me how something so major can be ignored.

Western governments and media (though they often play tag team on stuff) are distinct entities as far as an India vs China conflict goes. Govts, at least US are probably silently pro-India but are not ready at this point to openly take sides (even India is playing down the issue in public so there is no reason for them to).

We can expect some pro-India voices in the US right-wing media and independent bloggers etc.

Left-wing media like NYT, LAT, WPo have been and will be pro-China as are some elements of the deep state and Albright/Clinton gang. The best example of this lot is the NPAs who lose no opportunity to rant and rave against India despite strictly following non-proliferation norms, while not even batting an eyelid as China blatantly proliferated nukes to Porkis and North Korea.

Bart S · Post by **Bart S** » 20 Jul 2017 20:16

Bade wrote:
Pratyush wrote:What how can a map make a nation look brighter then another.

Anyway am happy that chinies are happy that they are brighter than India.
Now that they got their face saver, they can proudly move out of Doka La plateau now.

Regarding the reports in the media about the statement of the ex-Ambassador or Consul from China, I did see the interview on CGTN and the statement did not come across as a threat as it sounds when reported by third party in the written media. He was going back to 1890 treaty and could not even make his case. The Indian guest ( Mr Varma) contested the claims of the Ambassador as well as the host of the show who kept interrupting the Indian guest when he said there is a fourth option, that is returning to status quo for China.

The Chinese are clutching at the straws here.

Steve Vaugh's white paki cricket team had a term 'mental disintegration' for what they used to try on opponents with their verbal tactics and sledging. The chinese tried the same but it's looking more and more like Daffy Duck's ACME disintegrating pistol:

Iyersan wrote:China: Military Activity Increases Amid Border Dispute With India
https://worldview.stratfor.com/situatio ... pute-india

The Chinese Army has moved large quantities of military vehicles and supplies into the remote mountains of Tibet near the disputed Doklam Plateau trijunction border area with India and Bhutan, The Times of India and NDTV reported July 19. Over the last week, the Chinese military reportedly dispatched fighter jets to air bases in the Chinese Western Theater Command, and a mountain brigade conducted a live-fire exercise on the Tibetan Plateau. China is likely preparing its troops for any eventuality with India, as well as sending a message to New Delhi to back down on the Doklam dispute. The border spat began June 16 when Indian troops stopped Chinese soldiers from constructing roads on the Doklam Plateau.

So if the GOI has clearly denied this and stated that it was fake news and a pathetic attempt at propaganda, why were TOIlet and NDTV and other MSM carrying this news, and what were their sources? Looks like they have an agenda, or are just gullible self-loathing idiots, or both.

Iyersan wrote:
Iyersan wrote:China: Military Activity Increases Amid Border Dispute With India
https://worldview.stratfor.com/situatio ... pute-india

The Chinese Army has moved large quantities of military vehicles and supplies into the remote mountains of Tibet near the disputed Doklam Plateau trijunction border area with India and Bhutan, The Times of India and NDTV reported July 19.
How good is STRATFOR ?

That they are basing their so-called intelligence on TOIlet and NDTV does not tell you enough?

Rajeev wrote:Just in case we do need to fight two and half front war in worst case scenario

Military strength of India, Pakistan and China: How do they fare?

http://indianexpress.com/photos/picture ... a-4757519/

As has been covered umpteen times on this thread, the conflict on the border and the chances of winning, have virtually nothing to do with extraneous (in this context) factors like overall military headcount and economy size. So this amounts to nothing but malicious scare-mongering by the Indian media. Like a dog who is cornered with no way out and his neck in the jaws of another, saying that he shouldn't be trifled with because he has a larger stockpile of Pedigree in his house.

KJo · Post by **KJo** » 20 Jul 2017 20:49

ha ha the Chinese look so comical with their threats. Modi isn't even bothering, he is probably yawning loudly and going back to sleep.

sanjaykumar · Post by **sanjaykumar** » 20 Jul 2017 20:59

India is the only nation in Asia that can stop the Chinese from this quest of theirs,expounded by OBOR and other shady gambits.If we fail to stand up and speak out boldly,not just India,but Asia also will be lost.The nations of Asia ,and most admire and look upto India for its heritage,need to be reassured by India that we will not succumb to the rapacious Chinese and by renaming geographical entities like the ICS are small but significant steps to show the world that like the moon,the world is not a ball of Chinese tofu.

I agree that only India can drag the Chinaman kicking and screaming from his opium den.

darshhan · Post by **darshhan** » 20 Jul 2017 22:06

KJo wrote:ha ha the Chinese look so comical with their threats. Modi isn't even bothering, he is probably yawning loudly and going back to sleep.

I mean do they have a seperate govt dept or ministry to issue threats or warnings. Almost every day they issue one or more to some other country (India/ Us / Japan / Taiwan etc). They are indeed the global experts when it comes to issuiing threats.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2017 22:14

shiver my brothers shiver...

china has rolled out massive amt of WMD into the mix now - NSFW

https://sputniknews.com/photo/201706271 ... es-curves/

DrRatnadip · Post by **DrRatnadip** » 20 Jul 2017 22:56

Hope they don't combine this new weapon with Pindi chana technology..That will be very scary

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 20 Jul 2017 23:15

Singha wrote:footage of the recent drills in tibet

---

Need to deconstruct this propagandu video.
0:00-0:05s-> Looks like basic 155/152mm towed artillery, that could be a soviet copy from the 60's. No fancy optics, fire control etc. Also probably cannot elevate much.
0:06-0:23s-> Truck mounted 122mm(?) artillery, nothing fancy here either but probably a good cost effective solution.
0:24-0:29s-> Grad launchers doing their thing, plus some more artillery
0:29-0:31s-> stuff exploding
0:32-0:36s-> Fireworks on a tripod, is this actually a thing?

0:37-0:50s-> Some infantry action here. Soldiers taking cover behind cloth tent pill boxes. Some mortars, rocket launchers and heavy machine guns used.
0:50-1:02s-> Oerlikon 35mm twin cannon ripoff. A star of many propagandu videos.
1:03-1:19s-> Some more infantry action, including RPG-7. Chinese troops have US style digital camouflage and helmets, but the tacticoolness ends here. Not even one soldier appears to be wearing BPJ, no provision for NVG in helmet (do they have any?), no communication gear etc. All stuff that you would normally see on NATO soldiers. And the shoes could be the same ones the NCC gets.
1:21s-> And the piece de resistance, an AT-3 sagger ripoff - a first gen ATGM from the 60/70's (this missiles came in suitcases and not tubes - there are some interesting videos on youtube on how this is set up).

Now if somebody told you this is actually a video of North Korean army and not a 10+ trillion $ GDP country, would you doubt for even a second?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2017 23:21

but note the perfect timing of firing at the same time

like a rthymic gynmastic drill or tandem platform dive - in both of these they are rather good.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2017 23:28

the sagger was used by the egyptians in 1973 war in large nos.
they look like kind of army who will unload all their long range shots but run out of ideas as they near the penalty box.

rsingh · Post by **rsingh** » 20 Jul 2017 23:31

abhik wrote:
Singha wrote:footage of the recent drills in tibet

---
Need to deconstruct this propagandu video.
0:00-0:05s-> Looks like basic 155/152mm towed artillery, that could be a soviet copy from the 60's. No fancy optics, fire control etc. Also probably cannot elevate much.
0:06-0:23s-> Truck mounted 122mm(?) artillery, nothing fancy here either but probably a good cost effective solution.
0:24-0:29s-> Grad launchers doing their thing, plus some more artillery
0:29-0:31s-> stuff exploding
0:32-0:36s-> Fireworks on a tripod, is this actually a thing?
0:37-0:50s-> Some infantry action here. Soldiers taking cover behind cloth tent pill boxes. Some mortars, rocket launchers and heavy machine guns used.
0:50-1:02s-> Oerlikon 35mm twin cannon ripoff. A star of many propagandu videos.
1:03-1:19s-> Some more infantry action, including RPG-7. Chinese troops have US style digital camouflage and helmets, but the tacticoolness ends here. Not even one soldier appears to be wearing BPJ, no provision for NVG in helmet (do they have any?), no communication gear etc. All stuff that you would normally see on NATO soldiers. And the shoes could be the same ones the NCC gets.
1:21s-> And the piece de resistance, an AT-3 sagger ripoff - a first gen ATGM from the 60/70's (this missiles came in suitcases and not tubes - there are some interesting videos on youtube on how this is set up).

Now if somebody told you this is actually a video of North Korean army and not a 10+ trillion $ GDP country, would you doubt for even a second?

Chinese might be crying in a corner and regretting about this video. Thanks Saar, for aam abdul that was high class drama. They use 3D printer to make spare parts for arms. I wonder if plastic things are TFTA enough when facing battle hard Injuns.

Marten · Post by **Marten** » 20 Jul 2017 23:37

Singha wrote:the sagger was used by the egyptians in 1973 war in large nos.
they look like kind of army who will unload all their long range shots but run out of ideas as they near the penalty box.

When the time for a charge comes, it is likely they will turn tail and scoot. And if they come across the Gurkha first, you can rest assured a new war legend will be born. NLI downhill skiing may yet be beaten.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 20 Jul 2017 23:47

Atleast noko has a fierce leader in the hq tent. These boys dont even have that

chetak · Post by **chetak** » 21 Jul 2017 00:03

watch the video

If there is an international crisis in the Indian Ocean, US and Japan will come down to help, that's what Malabar is about - Admiral Byrne.

https://twitter.com/manupubby/status/887219251639193600

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 21 Jul 2017 00:23

Singha wrote:Atleast noko has a fierce leader in the hq tent. These boys dont even have that

Yes, I was imagining the chubby leader cheerfully applauding with a childish grin on his face, but for someone used to watching 100+ guns firing simultaneously this was a rather #Mediocre drill, so maybe not.

Bart S · Post by **Bart S** » 21 Jul 2017 00:36

Indian news websites seem to be full of crappy chinese posts in the comments section. Looks like they might have not moved 15 divisions of PLA to the border but have moved 15 divisions of 50 centers outside of their censorship system so that they can post away

nam · Post by **nam** » 21 Jul 2017 00:58

abhik wrote: Need to deconstruct this propagandu video.
0:00-0:05s-> Looks like basic 155/152mm towed artillery, that could be a soviet copy from the 60's. No fancy optics, fire control etc. Also probably cannot elevate much.

We also need to roll out a little PR video of "drills" with ATAGS/Bofors shooting off .. specially with the auto-loader in action!

Just the ATAGS autoloader will make the PLA artillery look 60s.

abhik · Post by **abhik** » 21 Jul 2017 01:00

https://youtu.be/eGs_dcXt-3k?t=2m26s
Average cost to equip a US soldier is $17.k vs $1.5k for PLA soldier. It shows.

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 21 Jul 2017 01:15

chetak wrote: currently, without the malacca straits, the hans are up the shyte creek without the proverbial paddle.

CPEC is far far away.

just need to sink a few fully laden bulk carriers at specific places already identified and not only the hans but the world's economy will rapidly wind down. we will not be much affected except for very high global oil and some commodity prices.

The han economy will tank rapidly with massive internal unrest.

this is the black swan event that has been gamed by all countries in the world.

If its gamed, its not a black swan event. True black swans are difficult to forsee. A true black swan event would be conflict starting against China in multiple theatres simultaneously.

There wont be war. Chinese are not stupid people or so I believe. I expect Bakis to do their bidding.

panduranghari · Post by **panduranghari** » 21 Jul 2017 01:28

Karthik S wrote: +108, OTOH their mobile companies are the fastest growing in Indian market. They are bidding for undersea cable contracts. We have one dysfunctional system.

No Sir. We have what comes as close to a free market capitalism. Chinese would dream to have this. And they know it. This "dysfunctional" system has kept us alive. We were barely alive until the congis were thrown out. The patient is out of ER and We will live and fight another day. Easy to criticize but every dark cloud has a silver lining. We have the 3 D's in our control- Low Debt, Asset Deflation and Good Demographics. There is no other country in the world who has that. No other. That has to count for something even though it might be dysfunctional in your opinion.

Chinmayanand · Post by **Chinmayanand** » 21 Jul 2017 01:58

SwamyG · Post by **SwamyG** » 21 Jul 2017 02:07

For no reason did the Chola army go down to Malacca straits and that region to teach some rogues a lesson. It was important then for India. Now if it is important to China, then India can again visit those straits. A good wise warrior uses earth, air, water, distance, climate to his advantage.

Panduranghari, yes I too do not think the Chinese are that stupid. Neither have they been pushed to the corner yet. So it is not going to lash out foolishly, yet. Since the chaddies have got into knots, they are taking their time to untwist them, wash and wear them again without losing H&D.

ChandraV · Post by **ChandraV** » 21 Jul 2017 02:56

Hello everyone,
My first post on this forum under the new username (I had been active years ago, then lost track and lost username and access as well, until now). So, if this has been addressed already I apologize, and in that case, hopefully someone can link me to the info or give a short reply synopsis.

Question is: During the Depsang Plains incident, the Chinese PLA police and others came within spitting distance of ITBP patrols, coming more than 20km into the Indian side of the perceived LAC, and that too via jeeps and other personnel carriers (meaning they had built a motorable road quite a ways into supposedly Indian controlled territory).

There was some online commentary at that time that alluded to the Chinese aggressive patrolling leading to ITBP (and IA) unable to use their patrolling routes for regular access to the Karakoram Pass boundary. This meant that China essentially salami sliced nearly 700 sq km of the plains and mountains area in the far northeast of Ladakh.

My question is: is this the current ground reality? Has India lost Karakoram Pass? Is that no longer an agreed/accepted boundary meeting point between China and India, similar to how so many other mountain passes are along the LAC?

The reason to ask is because googlge maps certainly has the area labeled as "Pakistan" and though there is a solid road for some distance descending from Karakoram Pass towards the Depsang Plains, the road seemingly abruptly ends and then its just a dirt track for miles until the DBO post and ALG. So then, is DBO army/ITBP post and ALG also still secure under Indian control, or is that lost too? It would seem that the Chinese are dangerously close to the Shyok river south of the DBO post and in coming fall or spring seasons, may make a move towards it, there by cutting off the DBO and Karakoram Pass access road from connections to other border posts further south and to Leh. Although there looks to be another cross-mountain road connecting DBO to Nubra Valley/THOISE via Murgo...but that seems like just a river valley dirk track.

The northeast Ladakh area really needs road building on a war footing. may be google maps images are outdated and there has been lot of progress in the last 3 years. Is that so?

ashish raval · Post by **ashish raval** » 21 Jul 2017 03:05

uddu wrote:The Dokhlam issue seems to be deliberately created by the Chinese to divert attention from OBOR passing through POK, Indian territory. May be they wanted to create a diversion or a bargaining chip when we go to get POK. May be finally the GOI must have sensed it right and bringing in back attention on POK with the Visa approval and now the same Sushmaji making the above statement.

There is no bargaining chip when it comes to building on a disputed land. No arbitration court will accept Chinese assertion on cpec or obit if it ever went to arbitration. It is meant to be destroyed if it is built on a disputed land however expensive it is. Period and CPEC will be a vanity project and Chinese will soon learn the cost of keeping bases around the world after world is fed up with fake chini maals. It will be destroyed in event of Indo Pak war..Period!! If push comes to shove one China policy is burned in ravan dahan and Brahmos gets deployed in Taiwan and Tibetans gets AK-47 to save their holy holy land.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jul 2017 03:33

SriJoy wrote:
Philip wrote:We are not hijacking anything from anyone unlike China.Why do we always have to be "apologetic" about our global heritage and the enormous influence we've had on Asia in particular? It is China that is trying to appropriate Buddhism by building its own Disneyland Buddhist centre to rival the Potala Palace,while it simultaneously calls upon its citizens to denounce religion!

This servile mentality of most Indians in denying their rightful influence upon the world is mainly due to the 500 years of European domination in Asia,which began when Vasco-Da-Gama landed up on our shores.Thanks to their huge naval superiority,the Portugese,supplanted by the Dutch,supplanted by the English who were stronger than the French,established their colonies to steal the wealth of Asia.But everywhere you go to in ASia,you see the enormous Indian influence esp. n the amazing architectural monuments like Borubudor in Indonesia,Bali too,Angkor Wat in Cambodia,the Burmese and Thai Buddhist temples...even in China and Japan!
When you say that we should call mainland SE Asia as 'Indo-China' or their sea as 'Indo-China sea', it *IS* hijacking SE Asian identity. You said so yourself- we see enormous Indian influence in SE Asia. For that reason, if its okay for us to impose our identity on the natives, then it is also Okay for Europe to call us 'eastern-most Europe/New Europe' for similarly influencing us. to argue otherwise, would be to be inconsistent hypocritical.

India is the only nation in Asia that can stop the Chinese from this quest of theirs,expounded by OBOR and other shady gambits.If we fail to stand up and speak out boldly,not just India,but Asia also will be lost.The nations of Asia ,and most admire and look upto India for its heritage,need to be reassured by India that we will not succumb to the rapacious Chinese and by renaming geographical entities like the ICS are small but significant steps to show the world that like the moon,the world is not a ball of Chinese tofu.
I can assure you, living in a place chock-full of thais, vietnamese, Koreans, Japanese, etc as well as having extensively travelled in the region, their view of us is a slightly more pacifistic version of how we view Europeans : topical influence only. And i can tell you for a certainty, most Vietnamese, Cambodians and thais have a greater affinity with Chinese culture than Indian, because their food, dress and ancestral worship protocols closely resemble Chinese ones.
By calling SC Sea as IC Sea, we are simply following in China's footsteps, by appropriating and overriding native culture for our ego. We don't need to pull a China to stop Chinese remodelling of Asia.
And if we are going to follow your example and imitate China by calling other people's backyards by Indo-centric names and such, India will definitely lose out to China, because if one is stuck between two domineering bullies, its better to succumb to the stronger and richer one. All the good-will India has built in Asia is precisely because we project ourselves as a soft power alternative to China. the day we start re-drawing maps unilaterally and re-naming places unilaterally, we become China light and lose.

Srijoy, A few things first:

This is a Bharat Rakshak Forum. Bharat means India.
We give rat's behind what China thinks.

Secondly SCS was called Indo China Sea till the 1970s.
The whole of South East Asia was called Indo China.
Vietnam was called Indo-Chine.

So it was the Chinese who renamed that area as South China Sea and US went along to pull FSU down.

We need no fall for that.

As for living in multi-cultural area good for you.

BTW please don't preach to old time members.

Not good.

khan · Post by **khan** » 21 Jul 2017 03:34

chetak wrote:watch the video

If there is an international crisis in the Indian Ocean, US and Japan will come down to help, that's what Malabar is about - Admiral Byrne.

https://twitter.com/manupubby/status/887219251639193600

This guy is a serving admiral and this appears to be an Operation Malabar briefing.

This is a very explicit threat to China from the US - not some unauthorized leak.

ChandraV · Post by **ChandraV** » 21 Jul 2017 03:39

China acts on the principles of "might is right" and of "possession is 9/10th of the law." China has economic might, and thanks to relentless snooping and reverse engineering, plenty of military might as well. And China has used it to claim and then to build on its claims... nobody is moving them from the Spratly Islands, and nobody is moving them from Aksai Chin nor even from Dokalam Plateau.

chanakyaa · Post by **chanakyaa** » 21 Jul 2017 03:50

khan wrote:
chetak wrote:watch the video

This guy is a serving admiral and this appears to be an Operation Malabar briefing.

This is a very explicit threat to China from the US - not some unauthorized leak.

Perhaps, they will. The other side of the coin is that, hypothetically speaking, if India were to be in a position to cause any serious damage to China, it is the same country that will come to the rescue of the Chinese and prevent any serious damage to the Chinese manufacturing and supply/chain machine.

Peregrine · Post by **Peregrine** » 21 Jul 2017 04:01

X Posted on the STFUP Thread

Pakistan tries to poke its nose into Doklam

NEW DELHI: Amid the Sino-Indian military standoff near the Bhutan-China-India tri-junction, Pakistan high commissioner Abdul Basit met the Chinese ambassador to India Luo Zhaohui. In what further raised eyebrows among Indian authorities, after his meeting with Luo, Basit was also learnt to have a sought a meeting with Bhutan's ambassador to India Vetsop Namgyel.

Top diplomatic sources confirmed to TOI that Basit called on the Chinese ambassador on Wednesday. They also confirmed that he was likely to soon meet the Bhutanese ambassador.

TOI has learnt that the situation at Doklam, where Indian troops have physically prevented the Chinese from constructing a road, was discussed in the meeting.

Basit is learnt to have wanted to discuss the situation with the envoys of both the countries. Basit has completed his tenure as high commissioner here and is expected to return to Islamabad next month.

Beijing is currently actively engaging the international community to drive home its point that it is India which is the aggressor at the Doklam plateau which is disputed between Bhutan and China. Unlike any other border transgression in recent times, the Doklam stand-off has even seen the Chinese embassy under Luo actively engage the Indian public to expound Beijing's position.

Political counsellor Li Ya recently released a video to address the concern of "some Indian friends".

More than a month into the "eyeball to eyeball" standoff though, it is still not clear how it'll all end as China publicly insists on an immediate and unconditional withdrawal of Indian troops. India has so far not engaged with foreign missions the way Beijing has. Or even if it has, it is not saying so. Until Wednesday, even the Russians had not been briefed about the situation.

Indian officials have warned against warmongering in the media but the fact is that it is the Chinese state backed media which has taken an unusually strident position on Doklam. They have also sought to exploit India's vulnerability in Kashmir by talking up the threat to India from Pakistan.

A noted Global Times columnist wrote recently that the India's logic in stalling Chinese road construction at Doklam could also be used by a "third country" to enter "India-controlled Kashmir" if it received a request from the Pakistan army. Basit's meeting with Luo may further fan that sentiment.

Despite the remark by Indian Army chief Bipin Rawat that India is ready for a "two-and-half front" wars, the government will be mindful of the threat from Pakistan in case there indeed is a flare up at Doklam.

Cheers

sum · Post by **sum** » 21 Jul 2017 05:49

Ant scurrying between two elephants and trying to "mediate" between them

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jul 2017 05:53

Indian media tone is that of darpok rascals bleating against own government while slurping omelets from Chi-Pak ambassadors.

NaMo needs to move against these obvious Fifth columnists who are abusing freedom of press to peddle foreign powers interests in India.

Global Times and noted is oxymoron.

Indian Army Chief is Gen Bipin Rawat.

Where is Shiv Sena when you need them!

g.sarkar · Post by **g.sarkar** » 21 Jul 2017 06:40

ramana wrote:Indian media tone is that of darpok rascals bleating against own government while slurping omelets from Chi-Pak ambassadors.

NaMo needs to move against these obvious Fifth columnists who are abusing freedom of press to peddle foreign powers interests in India.!

Ramanaji,
Only at BRF you write what you think and there is no money paid out. Indian media has been paid for by the outsiders. How can you write against Sugarland if you have receiving hafta from them for years for writing BS? Indian media is anything but not a namakharam.
Gautam

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 21 Jul 2017 08:06

After RG & family met with the Chinese Ambassador, the usual suspects have been activated. I have seen articles in the wire and also in HT. Ironically they are blaming Right Wing government for not rolling over.

The one scenario I want to discuss is IA's ability to occupy meaningful areas in Tibet.

Perhaps we should start a new thread on military strategies for the recovery of Tibet.

Ideally that will involve cutting of the road/rail lines to main-land to create an island and then penetrating deep into the island.

What are the potential cut-off points which could be severed? How feasible would it be to cut them off?
Is there a ring of such cut-off points which could be created and defended?
After they are cut-off what does the IA need to rapidly move through the island?
On the Indian side of the island, where are the major PLA deployments and bases?

What would it take to hold the PLA on the other side of the island?
How to prevent a heli bridge? Can a distributed network of teams armed with anti-chopper weapons used to ward of aerial assaults?
How to blunt the impact of PLA artillery on the forces defending the cut-off points?

And to those who wonder why India has a stronger claim over Tibet?
Have a look at the Ka, kha, ga which Tibetan's use. Reminds you of anything?

williams · Post by **williams** » 21 Jul 2017 08:13

phillydesi wrote: My question is: is this the current ground reality? Has India lost Karakoram Pass? Is that no longer an agreed/accepted boundary meeting point between China and India, similar to how so many other mountain passes are along the LAC?

Not really. From DBO ALG, Karakoram Pass is 15 km away and patrols go all the way where the Chinese road ends. DBO ALG and south of DBO ALG have permanent ITBP camps. We also have dominant control of the Eastern part of Siachen Glacier (lot of people think our focus in Siachen is only on the western side). Problem in that area is we have treacherous mountains with poor road infrastructure. BRO is building all weather road from Sasoma to Murgo and then from Murgo to DBO. Current govt has made this road a priority and by 2018-19 we should have good road link. IAF have good airlift capacity to maintain robust supply line and it kind of quadrupled after acquisition of heavy lift C130 transports. However we have been acting a bit timid and that has given the wrong idea to the Chinese and hence these kind of puny behaviour. In most cases we have thwarted these advances. Road infrastructure on the Chinese side are better because the terrain that side is better. However thanks to the tireless work done by our armed forces, we are much better off today and well prepared.

Arjun · Post by **Arjun** » 21 Jul 2017 08:16

SriJoy wrote: It won't be perceived well by the locals- the SE Asians and its pretty simple to see why.

Your understanding of SE Asia seems superficial...The only reason the term may not fly with SE Asians is that it is too closely associated with the mainland part of the region. See the comments in this blog for instance (these are from SE Asians): http://cimsec.org/lets-change-the-name- ... -sea/17853

Jarita · Post by **Jarita** » 21 Jul 2017 08:17

Forget about Tibet and this and that, we must have an end vision in mind of what China should really look like given what it's continued civilization has been over 000's of years. That is the aspirational map of China which we should aim towards and achieving that is not necessarily a military expedition.