Indian Navy News & Discussion - 22 April 2015

Lisa · Post by **Lisa** » 27 Mar 2016 14:24

uddu wrote:The design will be a modification of the P17s which we are seeing for a long time

The contract is for assisting with modular construction techniques to cut short the time.

15 Years ago I met an sailor in the Indian Navy who had command responsibilities. I ask him three question, why had the Indian Navy not bothered to start building ships using modular technologies, why had the Indian Navy not started acquiring/deploying new vessels with VLS systems despite access the Russian VLS technologies and lastly what sort of plans were underfoot to digitise data collection via square planar arrays for digital combat management. He in response feigned complete ignorance of these ideas! Very nice to see that 15 years on he is now familiar with these ideas and is now implementing them.

John · Post by **John** » 27 Mar 2016 17:39

Hopefully that VLS config is not correct since its shows just 16 Barak 8 and 24 Brahmos.

srai · Post by **srai** » 27 Mar 2016 18:37

^^^

More like 16 Barak-8 and 8 Brahmos (based on the size of the VLS module).

John · Post by **John** » 27 Mar 2016 22:34

If you count the 2nd Vls module there seems to be 24 (3*8) not 8 cells.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 28 Mar 2016 01:46

arun wrote:....and a 25-year all inclusive annual maintenance contract.

....

The service support will be managed in country by a team of experienced JFD engineers. Over the life of the contract, the JFD team will train local teams of engineers to maintain the systems, employing the knowledge it has gained through years of operating world-class submarine rescue services with navies across the world and creating an indigenous expert submarine rescue capability. The service contract allows JFD to share best practice, expertise and commonality of approache, which will serve to benefit the entire global submarine community
....

Signing these long term AMCs with onsite service is a good one. I dont know if the Navy does it for all ships but last time it was the contract for Vikramaditya that was in the news.

Life long MRO is a money making machine - if we can get these global majors to setup shop in India for MRO it will create fairly good quality jobs and infra in India.

srai · Post by **srai** » 28 Mar 2016 05:04

John wrote:If you count the 2nd Vls module there seems to be 24 (3*8) not 8 cells.

Nope. The size of the module is a better estimate. Check out some of the photos of P-15A and compare the size of 2 x Brahmos 8-cell VLS vs 2 x Barak-8 8-cell VLS vs 2 x RBU-6000.

John · Post by **John** » 28 Mar 2016 05:43

Yes the size is much smaller but this is a CGI i dont think dimensions were critcal. I dont think they will get something as critical as vls cells wrong however but who knows.

That said the CGI may be out of date, picture posted earlier from IFR shows some notable differences. Looks more like P 15b.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 28 Mar 2016 10:32

The number of SAMs aboard our major surface warships can easily be doubled ,there's sufficient space for VLS modules,but I suspect that the issue is really cost. If you take the alleged cost of an Akash SAM ($10M) as opposed to a firang equiv (47M),in media reports,an MR SAM like B-8 should then cost around the same.32 SAMs will then cost over $300M,a huge sum.Add BPDMS systems,BMos,etc. and you will find that the major cost of the ship is the weaponry,sensors,ASW aircraft,etc.One would prefer a multi-layered system for the surface combatants,triple layer as we see on the Talwars.MR SAM,gatlings-cum-BPDMS. Other DDGs have SA-N-7,B-1 and gatlings. Numbers of SAMs are essential because of the massed saturation missile attacks expected.Even the PN's small fleet of missile craft can let go 16-24 SSMs against an IN taskforce. Their subs could spot the IN task force and pass on ccoordinates for OTH targeting vessels by other warships.

Therefore,we have to right from time of commissioning make provisions for a quick installation of extra VLS modules when needed. The USN has a concept where SR SAMs are located close to the hulls external sides acting as a kind of ERA for incoming heavies,protecting the innards of the ship.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 28 Mar 2016 13:38

We should consider having an installed capacity for large number of SAMs via VLS, but actual number of missiles on inventory may be less. That should mitigate any cost concerns.

Viv S · Post by **Viv S** » 29 Mar 2016 04:31

DRDO to Hand Over Sonar Dome to Defence Minister

Goa will have its own proud moments during the prestigious Defexpo being held at Quitol, Goa apart from hosting the mega event first time outside Delhi.

A huge bow mounted Sonar Dome designed & developed by Research & Development Establishment (Engineers) [R&DE(E)], a DRDO laboratory based in Pune is going to be flagged off by Defence Minister Shri Manohar Parrikar, Secretary Department of Defence (R&D) & DG DRDO Dr. S. Christopher will also be present on this important occasion. The ceremony will be held at Defexpo site in Goa on March 29, 2016. The Sonar dome will be delivered to Mazgaon Docks, Mumbai.

The Sonar Dome, a first of its kind in the country has been manufactured by a composites manufacturing company in India. This is a huge contribution by Indian Industry to the ‘Make in India’ movement. Only a couple of companies worldwide have the capability of realising such structures.

All anti-submarine warfare (ASW) ships have a sonar array fitted to the ship structure below the waterline. The sonar functions as the ship’s underwater eyes and ears. The sonar dome is a structure fitted over the sonar array so that its electronics and sensors are not exposed to surrounding hostile environment. The sonar dome has to be structurally sound as well as acoustically transparent.

R&DE(E), DRDO, Pune has successfully developed process technologies to realise large composite structures that can be used in Naval ships & submarines. The Laboratory has also developed technologies related Integral Composite Armour that can be used in Combat Vehicles. The Laboratory is also significantly contributing in development of aerospace structures. NPOL, a DRDO Laboratory at Kochi played a significant role in development of the Sonar Dome.

It is prudent to mention that Composite Material Technologies relevant to Indigenously developed Missiles have already been well established.

DRDO is also fielding Live Demonstration of number of Systems with Cutting Edge Technologies for the first time in Defexpo.

Where are the sonar domes for the Kolkatas and Kamortas sourced from?

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 29 Mar 2016 07:58

>> If you take the alleged cost of an Akash SAM ($10M) as opposed to a firang equiv (47M)

both of these costs look way off to me if you mean individual missiles. a PAC-3 costs $3 million.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 29 Mar 2016 08:06

storage containers of akash

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 29 Mar 2016 11:49

Viv S wrote:Where are the sonar domes for the Kolkatas and Kamortas sourced from?

W & J Tod UK. Here is a good illustration of their sonar dome http://www.saiindia.gov.in/sites/defaul ... pter_5.pdf

Since the report mentioned delivery to MDL, the indigenous domes will probably go to Project 15B taking shape there.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 31 Mar 2016 10:43

Looks like MOD is contemplating building more Scorpene and Kilo in India , makes better sense

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/new ... 624708.cms

While Parrikar himself has spoken of a follow-on order of the French Scorpene submarines that are under construction at Mazagon Dock Ltd in Mumbai, the ministry has also had discussions with Russian shipbuilders for a possible Make in India programme to build additional Kilo class submarines.

In addition, India has accelerated its nuclear submarine plans with two projects, for additional nuclear missiles boats as well as nuclear-powered attack submarines, being processed at a brisk pace
Officials say the ministry is contemplating two additional Scorpene subs fitted with AIP and has had discussions on two new improved Kilo class submarines to be made in India.

While this would take care of the immediate and critical needs of the navy that has flagged off the underwater fleet as the biggest concern area, these acquisitions, if they go through, would impact the P 75I project.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 31 Mar 2016 10:45

P-75I seems very expensive with figures quoted at $12 Billion , Better to build more Scorpene with AIP and Kilo 636-03 model which RuN is building for itself.

See no reason why we spend $12 billion for a new type of submarine , money better spent building SSBN/SSN

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 31 Mar 2016 12:05

GRSE has emerged as L1 in Phillipines navy frigate tender

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 31 Mar 2016 12:47

Austin,

do we have any reliable figures for the Scorpene project cost per vessel? Depending upon that we should rethink the whole P75I.

Maybe Project 75I a Nuke Sub project. Make it a 10 sub project. We already have experience in building nuclear submarines. In the interim lease atleast 2 more Akulas (if available), order 3/4 more Scorpenes and buy 4 Kilos off the shelf.

This chakkar of drafting policy (alraedy taken 18 months), getting it approved ( another year) and then the whole approval for the project within the policy etc etc will kill us.

NRao · Post by **NRao** » 31 Mar 2016 13:43

Policy delay casts doubt over submarine purchase

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 31 Mar 2016 13:46

the kind of uber spec SSKs like soryu people talk about have the similar price tag as SSN minus the cost of special safeguards for the n-plant and materials. in that sense better to accelerate the arihant pgm itself and use as "hunter killer/SSGN" role. it will carry the twice the weapons load of a SSK and can stay out at sea much longer

we can build more arihant mk1a faster than we can build a soryu or U216 locally - every darn tool, process, component and training of staff will be new.

maybe even a 30% smaller SSK version of arihant can be designed

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 31 Mar 2016 13:55

^

I agree, much easier and less risky route. I hate this 'new design' philosophy. Even P17A is getting delayed and expensive by a desire to get uber agies system.

So my proposal is : Make P75I an extention of Arihant (per Saurav Jha follow on ships will be larger with upgraded PWR 90 reactor and after the 1st 4 vessels plan is to make an even larger vessel with a larger reactor/two smaller reactor). Make 10 of hunter killers. Rope L&T in a big way. Keep developing and improving our sonar tech and sonar stealth.

Lease 2/3 more Akulas, build 3 /4 more Scorpenes with AIP and buy 4 Kilos off the shelf.

soumik · Post by **soumik** » 31 Mar 2016 20:16

Like I've said many times earlier we need numbers today and our own SSK in the long term , the best way to do this is either buy 20 kilos outright using 9 of the 12$billion of P75I( it should still leave us with some 3$billion to spend on life extension of the older kilos and HDWs).Or buy 10 Kilos and another 6 Scorpene using the same funds saving the same amount of money for life extension. either way we get a fleet of 30 SSKs by 2030 which gives us time till 2035 to develop our own SSK.
Submarine fleet in 2025
6 Scorpene(1st tranche)
6 Scorpene(2nd tranche)
9 Kilos(modernized 1st tranche)
10 Kilos (2nd tranche)
4 HDW(modernized)
i.e. 35 SSKs add to this another 4 SSBNs and Three SSNs for a total of 42 Submarines by 2030.
using the other option we get
29 Kilos(20 new 9 life extended)
6 Scorpene
4 HDW(life extended)
Adding the same number of Nuclear boats we have 44 Submarines by 2030.
We can easily have a 40 Submarine Navy by 2030 if we play our cards right.

We paid some 450$ million each for the first six Scorpene even if we take current cost as 600$million after accounting for inflation we can still buy another 20 Scorpene as well.

These numbers will buy us a lot of time to build up our own SSK line which can start replacing the older Kilos and HDW in 2035.

srai · Post by **srai** » 01 Apr 2016 08:48

^^^

Kilos and Type-1500 are long in the tooth and most of them will likely be retired within a decade. Apart from sea worthy up-keeping and some upgrades, not too much should be spent on them at this point.

Going for 6 more Scorpene makes sense since build knowledge and infrastructure is there. It would be a more efficient way forward. More ToT could be pursued and more indigenous items could be incorporated in the second lot.

While second lot are being built, India should design and build its own indigenous SSK design in addition to the SSN and SSBN work it is already doing currently.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Apr 2016 12:28

Birdie num-num chirped that future desi built subs could be split between the R co. and L&T.
The R Co. already have an agreement in place with Rubin for upgrades,new build Kilo subs.The latest gen Ru Kalina class AIP sub is expected to be completed within 2-3 years,a new series to replace the 4 Amurs. This series could replace the older Kilos when they retire post 2020. A new Western design to replace the German U-boats and foillow on Scorpenes could also start around 2020.For the moment,a few extra new-build Kilos (2 could be finished within 3 years with the new Kalina design to follow after) and Scorpenes to tide over the current numbers crisis would look after the conventional sub requirement,numbers needed for patrols on both seaboards in the IOR. For global blue-water ops,esp in the Indo-China Sea,the 6 new SSNs and another 2-3 Akulas would be very welcome.

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Apr 2016 12:30

Ghee shakkar sir. How good is this birdie's news ?

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Apr 2016 12:45

Philip wrote: For global blue-water ops,esp in the Indo-China Sea,the 6 new SSNs and another 2-3 Akulas would be very welcome.

We have no global blue water ambitions nor pretentions. SSNs are needed for choking off choke points wrt China and operating in IOR region, Bay of Bengal and Arabian sea. Pahle utna to karen.....

'The new SSNs' - still a gleam in the navy's eyes right ? Birdie didn't say that any significant progress has happened ?

Did birdie say anything about buying new kilos and Akulas to tide over the crisis for now ?

kit · Post by **kit** » 01 Apr 2016 12:52

the new carrier groups will certainly need submarines as well for "extended patrols" near abroad .. heck india will never say it has global power projection !

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Apr 2016 13:07

Birdie's chirps or "fishy tales"?

Anyway,choke point sanitaising is much better done using smaller conventional boats and LR UUVs. The USN plans a huge fleet of blue-water UUVs with months of endurance to continuously track enemy subs. A fleet of UUVs operating in the A&N theatre could easily "sniff" out any intrusions which could be swiftly "snuffed" out by land based ASW air assets and ships and subs based in the theatre.The development of as many airbases/airstrips,helipads in the A&N theatre is essential if we want to dominate the IOR.

Akshay Kapoor · Post by **Akshay Kapoor** » 01 Apr 2016 13:25

Philip,

I agree with you on devlopment of airbases in A&N. But you did not answer my quetsion - what did birdie say ?

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 01 Apr 2016 13:52

Sorry,AK,Birdie chirped what I posted.R Co. in aggressive "Jaws" mood.I think that the 75-! has floundered.

subhamoy.das · Post by **subhamoy.das** » 01 Apr 2016 19:54

All these private players are committing tons of money on back of NDA govt. What happens, god forbid, if UPA comes back? There must be some thing they have done to safe guard their investments or are they 100% sure of NDA rule for years to come!

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 02 Apr 2016 09:56

VLS modules have to be fitted on subs for the current BMos,which cannot unlike the envisaged BMos-M,fired from std. torpedo tubes."Seamless integration" probably refers to integrating the weapon with any sub's individual fire control system.Our U-boats cannot accommodate BMos,neither can our Scorpenes,nor Kilos unless a VLS module is added.

BMos-M should be accelerated as it will prove to be a match-winner when used on much smaller vessels and more carried by our frontline aircraft.

http://www.brahmand.com/news/BRAHMOS-ca ... /1/10.html

Indian Army to have 2 more regiments of BRAHMOS missile: Defence Minister:-Two more regiments of the short-range supersonic cruise missile, BRAHMOS, will be inducted into the Indian Army within next fifteen days, Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar has said....
BRAHMOS can seamlessly integrate on any globally-made submarine: Sudhir Mishra:-The Indo-Russian BRAHMOS missile can be integrated on submarines built by global manufacturers without much technological challenge and this has been validated by several of the submarine builders, BrahMos Aerospace CEO and MD Sudhir Kumar Mishra says in an exclusive interview to Arming India....
India developing seekers for BRAHMOS, other missiles: Sudhir Mishra:-India is developing its own seeker technology for its missiles, with efforts from the state research and development agencies and the private sector. Once ready, this indigenous seeker technology could be integrated on the BRAHMOS supersonic cruise missile and other Indian missiles from the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) stable....
S Korea says North fired missile, jammed GPS systems:-North Korea has fired another short-range missile off its east coast on Friday, even as regional leaders have met in Washington to discuss the threat of Pyongyang's nuclear weapons programme....
Indian Army to have 2 more regiments of BRAHMOS missile: Defence Minister:-Two more regiments of the short-range supersonic cruise missile, BRAHMOS, will be inducted into the Indian Army within next fifteen days, Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar has said....
BRAHMOS can seamlessly integrate on any globally-made submarine: Sudhir Mishra:-The Indo-Russian BRAHMOS missile can be integrated on submarines built by global manufacturers without much technological challenge and this has been validated by several of the submarine builders, BrahMos Aerospace CEO and MD Sudhir Kumar Mishra says in an exclusive interview to Arming India....
India developing seekers for BRAHMOS, other missiles: Sudhir Mishra:-India is developing its own seeker technology for its missiles, with efforts from the state research and development agencies and the private sector. Once ready, this indigenous seeker technology could be integrated on the BRAHMOS supersonic cruise missile and other Indian missiles from the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) stable....

BRAHMOS can seamlessly integrate on any globally-made submarine: Sudhir Mishra
Article Posted on : - Apr 01, 2016
Arming India Interview: Part 3

NEW DELHI: The Indo-Russian BRAHMOS missile can be integrated on submarines built by global manufacturers without much technological challenge and this has been validated by several of the submarine builders, BrahMos Aerospace Chief Executive Officer and Managing Director Sudhir Kumar Mishra said in an exclusive interview to Arming India.

BrahMos Aerospace has already shared the integration data with French, German, Russian and Spanish submarines builders, apart from the Indian public sector submarine builder, Mishra said. This could mean India's Project 75I, the six second line of conventional submarines for which a Request for Proposals is awaited, could deploy this Indo-Russian supersonic cruise missile in the future, irrespective of the global submarine manufacturer that India could tie-up with for building these Air-Independent Propulsion capable vessels.

BrahMos is also readying to validate the air-launched BRAHMOS from an Indian Air Force's Sukhoi combat aircraft and the test could take place anytime soon, with the work on the missile set to be over next month.

EXCERPTS FROM THE INTERVIEW

What is your order book?

May, June and July 2015 have been very happy months for us. We got orders for six ships, both retrofit and new, which the DAC has approved. Defence Acquisition Council (DAC) has also approved the fourth regiment for the Indian Army. This in itself is more than a $1 billion order book. We already had orders until 2022. Now it means, we can live till 2027. It has extended by another five years, plus another 10 years of service. That is, minimum until 2036, we will survive, as we provide product support also. It has been an interesting, fruitful and rewarding months. The ships are Project 17A and the first three Talwar class guided frigates.

What about the submarine version of BRAHMOS? Has there been any development there?

BrahMos Aerospace has demonstrated, by flight testing from a pontoon, that we have the capability to make a submarine-launched BRAHMOS also. Now, all of us know that a lot of submarines for our Navy are under-construction and are going to be constructed at several shipyards. The Indian Navy knows about the capabilities of BRAHMOS and I am sure they will consider fitment of BRAHMOS on some of their submarines. Because, BRAHMOS offers a unique capability. It is a cruise missile, can attack land targets or ships. I am sure that they are considering it and we are talking to several people. Yes, the services are having a lot of interest in submarine-launched BRAHMOS. It is a universal missile. We don't have any technical problems or challenges. We have already demonstrated it and it is ready to fit in. So, this is from our side.
From the side of the platform suppliers, we have spoken to all the submarine manufacturers in the world and they have certified and given in writing that they can integrate BRAHMOS into their platforms without any problem. We have also shared with them the integration data on our design, whether French, German, Russian, Spanish or Indian.

What about the air-launched BRAHMOS?

That is the real challenge facing us. We are going to launch. Let me just give you the quantum of work. When you want to integrate a weapon on an aircraft, especially a weapon like BRAHMOS which weighs 2,500 kg, and the aircraft is not having any provision to integrate such kind of weapons, then it becomes very challenging. The challenges were, first we have modified the aircraft itself. It means, the platform itself has been modified. HAL Nasik has done a fantastic job. Earlier, Sukhoi Design Bureau, the original manufacturer of the aircraft, asked huge amount of money - they asked for $200 million - and we didn't have that much money to integrate. So, HAL took up this task as an engineering challenge. They took two aircraft, modified and successfully handed over these aircraft during Aero India to BrahMos Aerospace, and now the ASTE of Indian Air Force are flying these modified aircraft successfully without a single problem. It is a great engineering capability that we have achieved.

Second is the launcher. The launcher is again composed of electrical and mechanical integration. Then, the missile integration to the launcher and third, is the aerodynamic studies. We have completed the electrical and mechanical integration of launcher with the aircraft. This work has been entirely done by BrahMos Aerospace. We designed the launcher, we integrated the launcher to the aircraft. We have completed the Computational Flow Dynamics analysis, wind tunnel testing for the aircraft, and launcher with the aircraft. Then missile separation from the aircraft. This work has been successfully done by NAL, Bangalore.
Apart from this, we completed ground vibration test of the aircraft at HAL Nasik. All of this has given a lot of confidence to us. Now we have flown the launcher also along with the aircraft. We are now implementing the engineering studies to integrate the missile with the launcher and the aircraft. By March-end it will be over. We will go for the instrumented missile flight test to measure various parameters that the missile and the aircraft will be facing while flying.

I hope to complete that work by April 2016. Then, we will go for drop test, when a missile model will be dropped from the aircraft and then, we will go for the real launch of the actual missile from the aircraft and that will be by end-2016. The second aircraft is getting modified. As per the contract, we have to demonstrate the flight test from both the aircraft, then only the users will accept the flight test. It is going to be a great achievement for aviation scientists and missile engineers. We have never done such a test for such a huge, heavy missile. That will give a lot of satisfaction and confidence to missile technologists, not only in India but all over the world. The launcher that we have designed is the biggest in the world.

Once you achieve all these, then would the entire fleet of Sukhois in the Indian Air Force be modified and armed with BRAHMOS? What is the requirement for the air-launched BRAHMOS that has been projected by the Air Force? What will be the difference in the weight of the conventional BRAHMOS and the air-launched version?

It is not like this. The users have their own strategy to fit the missiles and it is for them to decide. We will provide them the missiles, the launchers and modification strategy and it is for them to decide. The requirement of the air-launched BRAHMOS will certainly be in large numbers. Because, such kind of efforts need to be economical. The warhead will be the same, but while the original BRAHMOS is about 2,900-kg, the air-launched version will be about 400-kg less, because of some engineering work.

There were a lot of interest shown by some friendly nations for BRAHMOS and of course, Russia holds the export control for BRAHMOS? So, are there any talks for exporting of the BRAHMOS?

We need support and approval of both the Governments for any export of BRAHMOS. There is an enabling provision already existing in the inter-governmental agreement. As such, there is no legal problem created by either of the partners. We have been working for more than a decade now and we have had no problems either from India or from Russia. It will happen with mutual consent. BrahMos Aerospace, being a defence engineering company, will provide competence and capability to both the Governments.

We have no problem in upscaling our production. We can do that, because we have excellent supply chain with vendors. Every year, the production number also varies. It is for the Governments of India and Russia to decide to whom to export, in how many quantities. We participate in so many exhibitions all over the world and we receive so many delegations from various countries. They show a lot of interest and show a lot of willingness looking at the capability of our weapon. We are ready to meet this challenge of export. It is for both the Governments to decide on whom to supply and how to supply. It is about defence diplomacy policy.

What's your agenda for the future of BRAHMOS within the intergovernmental agreement? You have orders till 2027 and work till 2036. What's the future and how would you keep BrahMos Aerospace relevant beyond that?

The first thing, the order is not going to be stopped at fourth regiment. There will be orders for fifth and sixth regiment also. We know it very well. The second thing is ships would be manufactured and the country would be needing anti-ship missiles. So we would be there. Third, there is also going to be the issue of life-extension of the missile systems that will keep us very busy. Fourth is product support. This is a state-of-the-art missile and it would call for a lot of product support. We would be there to provide that support not only for 10 years of the life of the missile -- in some countries, the missile life is 25 to 30 years.

Initially, we are offering 10 years and beyond that there will be life extension too. As we discussed earlier, we would like to expand our business from subsonic to hypersonic, to be present in all the domains of speed. That also will give us a lot of business. Technologies are evolving. There are many things we are not able to foresee or predict. So let us wait for a few years. As things evolve, BrahMos being a hi-tech engineering company would be surviving for several decades. BRAHMOS is a very contemporary missile.

As of today, we don't see anybody is able to come out with a supersonic engine for another five to 10 years. This engine is a result of engineering research during Soviet Union times. The Soviets have never hesitated in investing in defence. Even today, the USA is still working with a sub-sonic cruise missile. They are putting a solid rocket motor in the terminal stage or booster stage to increase the range or capability. Whereas, ours is a supersonic ramjet. Nobody is having this. Chinese are claiming to have it, but we know that they are not going to have it for another five to seven years. We will continue to have it.

Again in hypersonic capability, we will be leading in that front too. So we will be leading in that technology for another 20 years. And hypersonic has no limit. We can go up to seven Mach or nine Mach or eleven Mach. There will be discovery of new material, even new engineering solutions would be available and we may expand to any area. We may expand to UAV also. As of now there is no business plan, but what I am trying to tell you is that we can think of developing a hypersonic UAV too.

In fact, Dr. Kalam has given us a dream which will answer your question. Dr. Kalam always told us that we should design, develop and produce a missile that will be long-range, re-usable, hypersonic and cost-effective solution to deliver a warhead anywhere in the world. This is a dream and when we move towards this dream, there are going to be thousands of engineering challenges. But, that would only provide us business and that would answer your question.

The hypersonic UAVs are actually UCAVs.

They are, you can say, but they are not re-usable. We are talking about merging of technologies such as missiles and UAVs. UCAVs are weaponized small aircraft. Sometimes, UCAVs are re-usable and sometimes they are not.

We are marrying hypersonic technologies with UAVs or UCAVs, so they can escape if they come under attack?

Yes, possible.

Have you dialogued with the Russians on using your capability in the unmanned category? Is there a spin-off possible?

No, we have not. The spin-off possibility is there. But we have not talked or put it in writing or even done any analysis. It makes sense and it is a natural progression. This is one of the most successful JVs that the government of India wants to replicate in several 'Make in India' programs. This means we are successful. We feel that we are on the right path. If the program is replicated, then there will be an opportunity to expand under the existing format itself.

What about the mini-BRAHMOS?

Concept-wise, it is very attractive. But, so many developments are taking place and hence we are not able to come up with a definitive plan. It is much smaller in size and range is quite good and it can be launched from several platforms. An aircraft can carry two or three BRAHMOS-Mini. It can go into torpedo tubes and smaller ships can use them too. Even a missile boat can carry it. It is miniaturization of the missile and its range will not be affected and it will go the full distance in the ideal trajectory. But in other trajectories, it may reduce. We have not started the programme and it is too early to discuss it. But it is one of the business prospects.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 02 Apr 2016 13:25

... We already had orders until 2022. Now it means, we can live till 2027. It has extended by another five years, plus another 10 years of service. That is, minimum until 2036, we will survive, as we provide product support also. It has been an interesting, fruitful and rewarding months....

Refreshingly different attitude from this PSU. These guys dont take their survival for granted ... they want orders from the govt and not handouts.

vasu raya · Post by **vasu raya** » 02 Apr 2016 19:47

Philip wrote:Have you dialogued with the Russians on using your capability in the unmanned category? Is there a spin-off possible?

No, we have not. The spin-off possibility is there. But we have not talked or put it in writing or even done any analysis. It makes sense and it is a natural progression.

That would be a nice development, could take this into two paths, one optimized for endurance and another for hypersonic speed

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 02 Apr 2016 20:51

HAL ability to integrate a 2.5 ton missile is indeed no small achievement as Dr Sudhir Mishra mentioned considering we don't have extensive flight performance data of flanker something only OEM has it and add to that balancing the CG for a FBW aircraft. They took some time but they did it , built an expertise here and saved USD 200 million giving to SDB.

Nice Interview

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 03 Apr 2016 06:31

Watch Out, China: India's Navy Wants 200 Warships
http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-bu ... =hootsuite

India aspires to have a 200-ship navy by 2027, a senior naval official revealed this week.
According to India’s Economic Times, Admiral P. Murugesan, the vice chief of India’s naval staff, said that the navy is seeking to have 200 warships operational by 2027, up from just 137 at present.The senior officer shared that the aspiration of the Navy—which currently has 48 ships under construction on various shipyards across the nation—is to become a 200 ship navy by 2027. At present, the Navy operates 137 combatants with new ships being added at a rate of 4-5 a year,” the Economic Times report said.This means that India’s shipyards will have to ramp up production in the coming years, especially when factoring in that some of India’s current warships will have to be retired by 2027. A more likely scenario is that India will purchase more foreign ships in the years ahead in order to reach its target of 200 ships.Already, India is one of the largest purchasers of foreign arms. In fact, according to the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute, a Swedish think tank, India was the largest arms importer for the years 2010-2014. During that time, India was the recipient of 15 percent of all international arms transfers, up from just 9 percent in the five years prior. India’s arms purchases increased 140 percent during this period.By contrast, India’s domestic arms industry continues to suffer from severe delays in rolling out new systems, due partly to the excessive red tape involved in India’s bureaucracy. Thus, it is safe to assume that if India’s Navy boasts 200 warships by 2027, a large part of its fleet will have been purchased from abroad. Russia has traditionally been India’s top arms supplier, although the United States has been challenging Moscow for this title in recent years.
India’s desire to have 200 warships by 2027 is indicative of its growing concern over China’s rising military might. As The National Interest has previously noted, in recent months Delhi has been particularly concerned about Chinese submarines patrolling the Indian Ocean, where India seeks to be the dominant power. One recent report in India’s media noted that “the deployment of the relatively advanced Shang Class nuclear fast attack boat, [is] a significant cause of concern at [India’s] Naval Headquarters.” And for good reason: some in Chinese defense circles have boasted that Beijing could blockade most of India’s important ports using just six nuclear attack submarines.Back in May of this year, a Chinese nuclear submarine docked in Pakistan for the first time ever. This followed Chinese submarines docking at Sri Lanka, another neighbor of India, on a number of occasions last year.One way that India is seeking to combat this threat is by building up a more potent undersea fleet of its own. In that regard, during his interview with the Economic Times this week, Admiral P. Murugesan revealed that Delhi has begun work on building six indigenous nuclear attack submarines."The government has given approvals for six new SSNs (nuclear attack submarines) earlier this year. We have started work but still are at the pen to paper stage," Murugesan said.He added that India was hoping to complete the project within the next 15 years."These things take time but we will be able to improve on the timelines that the pioneers (nations) have set which typically took over 15 years for such a project," Murugesan was quoted as saying.India is also currently in negotiations with Russia over leasing another Russian-built nuclear attack submarine.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 03 Apr 2016 07:45

Abso min.number required. Neverthless,at least 25% of this number should be composed of subs.China will possess 80+ new subs by then.

member_23370 · Post by **member_23370** » 04 Apr 2016 04:29

Aditya G wrote:GRSE has emerged as L1 in Phillipines navy frigate tender

While reading on the net and looking at the specs, PN needs the ships to come at under $200 mil each. I doubt GRSE can offer Kamortas with Brahmos for that price. Not to mention IN and RuN will veto the brahmos sale to a known american ally. Something like Saryu class with AsHM added(uran or harpoon) would be ideal with 8-16 barak-1.

Prem · Post by **Prem** » 04 Apr 2016 08:32

BHEL supplies IPMS to Navy

Bharat Heavy Electricals Limited (BHEL), Electronics System Division, has successfully developed and delivered an Integrated Platform Management System (IPMS) for the indigenous aircraft carrier INS Vikrant, built by Cochin Shipyard Limited, for the Indian Navy.This system includes a state-of-the-art Automatic Power Management System. Various directorates of the Indian Navy and Cochin Shipyard participated in the final integrated Factory Acceptance Test (IFAT) Protocol.A BHEL release said that designed, manufactured and tested at BHEL, jointly with GE-Avio (Italy), IMPS is a technology-intensive, unique and sophisticated Distributed Control System for real-time monitoring and control of ship’s propulsion, power management, damage control, CCTV, personnel location, equipment health monitoring, auxiliary control, tank-level indication, on-board training system, dynamic simulation model and other simulators.

http://www.thehindu.com/news/cities/ban ... 427901.ece

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 04 Apr 2016 09:02

^^^ That should be a significant achievement if BHEL has built an Indian Designed and Manuf IPMS systems for a capital ship like an aircraft carrier.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 04 Apr 2016 09:46

>> Lease 2/3 more Akulas, build 3 /4 more Scorpenes with AIP and buy 4 Kilos off the shelf.

thats the best route. bury the P75I. focus all domestic efforts on N-subs. per tsarkar sir it is actually easier to build n-subs of 6000t+ (if we have the a working reactor) as its more roomy and all equipment does not need to be bleeding edge and very compact as in a small SSK.

one must recall China managed to put a 5500t Han class SSN into water in 1974 while it still does not make a SSK comparable to scorpene or U212.