Re: Indian Army: News and Discussions 11 June 2014

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby member_23360 » 09 Jun 2015 22:24

I had feeling that this time something is bound to happen, but replicating the same against TRP will be more challenging.

This sure will send a message to our western neighbors ..

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby shyamoo » 09 Jun 2015 22:29

tushar_m wrote:Maybe the time has come for Panchi (with helina) to be fast tracked to carry out preemptive strikes on day 2 day (week to week) basis.

The good thing is that even if the "presstitutes" are misguiding people based on their agenda the common man is intelligent enough to catch them & counter them on social media & other places.

#56InchRocks trending on twitter just see the comments.

https://twitter.com/hashtag/56InchRocks?src=hash

Liked this one...
https://twitter.com/ShankhNaad/status/6 ... 9069958144

Abki bar border paar!
Last edited by shyamoo on 09 Jun 2015 22:32, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Nitesh » 09 Jun 2015 22:31

In paki side, anyone and everyone is enemy, just hit them with precision bombs.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Rahul M » 09 Jun 2015 22:37

guys please restrict yourselves to the op related discussion as much as possible. other issues can be discussed in GDF.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby partha » 09 Jun 2015 22:46

What I found amazing is that a response was given to Manipur attack so quickly by crossing the border which means a framework for such cross border operations was already in place. Kudos to the govt.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 09 Jun 2015 22:51


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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby putnanja » 09 Jun 2015 22:54

Good response by the GoI. The valour or operational capability of IA was never in doubt. But if you muzzle the lions and put them in a cage, and then shed fake tears when neighbouring hyenas attack you, and keep exchanging dossiers and "condeming" every attack, even the street dogs and cats will start attacking you.

Use power wisely, and that will demonstrate our capability and intent. Turning a blind eye to attacks on soldiers, and then not letting them prevent more such attacks must be very frustrating to the soldiers. Truly, a new beginning, one that will ensure that the hostile neighbours think twice before trying something similar.

But for some rabid mad mutts for whom clear thinking is alien concept, a visit by the doctor (SF) should dispatch it to where it belongs

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby IndraD » 09 Jun 2015 23:01

<del.>

not here. please see my post above.
Last edited by Rahul M on 09 Jun 2015 23:03, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: edited.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby RoyG » 09 Jun 2015 23:31

No doubt that our rich CI experience has enriched the SF with valuable lessons on hitting the enemy on its own turf. Amazing how there were no reported casualties.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby vaibhav.n » 09 Jun 2015 23:39

21 Para SF........Waghnakhs.

True to their name!!

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby UlanBatori » 09 Jun 2015 23:48

Pepto Bismol sales up at TOILET

NEW DELHI: India's sensational, and successful, cross-border raid in Myanmar is not likely to go unnoticed in its neighbourhood, especially across its western border where Pakistan has long been preparing to thwart a similar surgical strike by developing tactical or non-strategic nuclear weapons.

Whether or not India can carry out such a strike on Pakistan territory is a question likely to be debated with much enthusiasm after the Myanmar swoop down. The government will also be under pressure to retaliate similarly if another Mumbai like attack takes place anywhere in India.

It was in response to India's so called cold start doctrine that Pakistan started to focus on acquiring smaller, low-yield or what are called tactical nuclear weapons to deter Indian troops from entering its territory (IOW, if Indian army enters Lahore, Pakistan will nuke Sialkot and Muzzafarabad in protest). The cold start, which the Indian army has never publicly acknowledged, envisages counterattack across the border within hours of a terror attack to neutralise terror groups and camps. Unlike Myanmar, Pakistan will look upon such an incursion as an assault on its (Honour, Dignity and Sovirginity). :((

As the Indian Army confirmed in its announcement, the attack was not just retaliatory, with 18 army men being killed by rebels in Manipur last week, but also pre-emptive in nature as those eliminated were said to have been planning more attacks in India. The sui generis (Ooh! All Indians will understand that!) nature of the cross-border raid has given rise to suggestions that India under Modi may be veering towards former US president George Bush's doctrine of pre-emption which was accommodative of unilateral military action.

In the case of Pakistan though, what is of serious concern to India is the fact that along with its tactical nukes Pakistan has also simultaneously developed the short-range, nuclear capable Nasr missile.

According to Kristensen, Nasr seemed intended for use against any likely invasion by Indian troops which Pakistan may not be able to stonewall through its conventional capabilities of scooting. The ballistic missile can fire up to 60 metres and can be launched from a mobile twin-canister, pointed straight up.

"Following its first test launch in April 2011, the Pakistani military news organization, Inter Services Public Relations, described the Nasr as carrying a nuclear warhead 'of appropriate yield with high accuracy', with 'shoot and scoot attributes' (just like the Pakistani Army's famous motto) that was developed as a quick response system to 'add deterrence value' to Pakistan's strategic weapons development programme 'at shorter ranges' in order 'to deter evolving threats'," Kristensen had said in his report.


The issue here, as UBCNews has long pointed out, is that any Paki Col with a few of these in his command, can take over as Chief Executive in I'good at an hour's notice.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 09 Jun 2015 23:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Rahul M » 09 Jun 2015 23:52

vaibhav.n wrote:21 Para SF........Waghnakhs.

True to their name!!

a little background to the unit plz, for the uninitiated. 21 SF was one of the specialized ones, right ?

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 09 Jun 2015 23:55

I promise to post all Paki rona dhona in video form when they have talk shows on this matter.
I'll post them in the relevant forums...

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Prem » 09 Jun 2015 23:57

Dawood will be shifting his Khatiya every night now.He most probably see Doval reflecting in every nook and corner of Pakiland. It will long before we get the pleasure of watching Mota Saeed on Pakimediapediashedia?

How many LPDs can dock at Chabahar and how long is the sail from Karvar?

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jun 2015 00:03

Hu diz Nidhi Razdan Bibi? :eek:

Indian Special Forces Kill terrorists in Surprise raid inside Myanmar Full Report on TV

Says
2 camps 'annihiliated', all forces returned. Refuses to answer question on "how deep did u go into Militantstan? "Deep enough"
Complete support? "Myanmar is friendly nation, support was there if needed".
"Complete Indian operation?"
"done by special forces, on their own".
"helicopters used, can u confirm?"
"What is important is that our troops return safely. So many others were waiting in case needed".
"Casualties high on the other side?"
"yes, absolutely true."
"Mark a shift in dealing with terror groups?"
"Need of the hour, that's y nation voted a strong guvrmand into power: V Vill Strike U Wherever U R"
"Acted quickly?"
"Yes, absolutely".

Extend to other sector (other side, like Pakistan)?
UNDOUBTEDLY A MESSAGE TO ALL COUNTRIES THAT HARBOUR TERRORISTS. WE WILL CHOOSE THE TIME AND PLACE TO HIT THEM.

*********************************

What's with this ****COLONEL***** Rathore in mufti as a Mantri? :shock: :eek: Aren't we supposed to have stuffed pillow-cases w/ Gandi caps as netas, hain? :((

Immediately followed by a bheshterner interviewing wife of 'longest held political prisoner in India'. :(( I think a Special Forces raid is called-for at this channel as well.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 10 Jun 2015 00:08, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby UlanBatori » 10 Jun 2015 00:06

See this site for pic of 21st

Also here for some background: note pessimistic tone about coordination :mrgreen:
Those killed were mostly in their 20s and 30s, hailing from Jammu and Kashmir and Himachal Pradesh. Their bodies will be sent home in the next couple of days.

“The Khaplang group wants to show its relevance after two senior rebels broke away. When it broke off a ceasefire with the Centre in March, the breakaway group inked a pact with the government. Security forces have been attacked over six times since,” said a senior official.
Former army chief General Deepak Kapoor said there could be no kneejerk reaction to the deadly ambush as the army had refined its Northeast strategy over a long period of time. “Some drills and procedures may not have been appropriately followed. Such things can happen if you let your guard down,” he added.


Didn't NaMo just return from Indi-Chini Bhai-Bhai?

Days after the deadly attack in Manipur’s Chandel district, it is now emerging that India gave Myanmar phone intercepts and location details of at least two officials from the Chinese People’s Liberation Army (PLA), who were reportedly in touch with the top leadership of insurgent group, NSCN-Khaplang, suspected to be behind the killing of 18 Armymen. Officials said the information was shared two months ago, and that the matter would be taken up with Myanmar again. According to a senior government official, the insurgent group, which abrogated its ceasefire pact with the Centre in March this year, did so following instructions from the PLA. The meeting was held in New Delhi on April 10-11. It was attended by Ministry of External Affairs, Union Home Ministry and officials from Myanmar. “We held a meeting with our Myanmar counterparts in April this year and handed over intercepts of phone conversations between two PLA officials and Khaplang, the leader of the insurgent group. In the said intercept, the Chinese PLA official asks SS Khaplang about his health, tells him to relax and asks him to learn Chinese language,” a senior government official said. Sources said that officials also took up the issue of “opium cultivation and trade” being done by insurgent groups like NSCN-Khaplang, ULFA and KLO in Myanmar’s Kachin province. “The insurgent groups are running transport business and opium trade in Myanmar and we have even handed over their photographs,” the official said, quoting intelligence inputs and adding that leader of the hardline faction of ULFA, Paresh Baruah, also convinced Khaplang to snap the ceasefire agreement with Centre. He further claimed that Baruah, too, was acting on instructions from some senior officials of PLA. Khaplang and Baruah are believed to often shuttle between Taga (Myanmar) and Ruili and Kunming — both in China’s Yunnan province — and are reportedly in regular touch with Chinese officials. Intelligence inputs also suggested that a former officer of PLA has set up a factory of assault rifles in Myanmar’s Kachin province and a majority of the arms produced there are being supplied to militants of the Northeast, including NSCN-Khaplang. The official said that the arms manufacturing unit is located at Pangwa, along the Sino-Myanmarese border, and has been set up by a former PLA officer, Muk Yan Pau Huan, along with former leader of Burmese Communist Party, Tin Ying.
Last edited by UlanBatori on 10 Jun 2015 00:21, edited 1 time in total.

Suraj
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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Suraj » 10 Jun 2015 00:19

Congratulations to the government and political leadership.

The 'kabaddi rules' of terrorism are finally changing. They are no longer inviolate the moment the cross the border. We'll simply chase them across the border now.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Bade » 10 Jun 2015 00:29

Intelligence inputs also suggested that a former officer of PLA has set up a factory of assault rifles in Myanmar’s Kachin province and a majority of the arms produced there are being supplied to militants of the Northeast, including NSCN-Khaplang. The official said that the arms manufacturing unit is located at Pangwa, along the Sino-Myanmarese border, and has been set up by a former PLA officer, Muk Yan Pau Huan, along with former leader of Burmese Communist Party, Tin Ying.
Perfect target practice for a few brahmos. :P

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby member_28657 » 10 Jun 2015 01:18

Congratulations 21 Para SF! Congratulations to the Indian Army! Congratulations to NaMo for authorizing swift, decisive action!

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Mihir » 10 Jun 2015 01:20

Rahul M wrote:
vaibhav.n wrote:21 Para SF........Waghnakhs.

True to their name!!

a little background to the unit plz, for the uninitiated. 21 SF was one of the specialized ones, right ?

21 Para was converted from 21 MLI.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Karthik S » 10 Jun 2015 01:21

Very well done, especially because no causality on our side. Hope we quickly get Rustom UCAV.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby NRao » 10 Jun 2015 01:23

Good message to all - Chin and TSP.


A broader audience than those two. After all those two also have backers and supporters.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Karan M » 10 Jun 2015 01:27

Bade wrote:
Intelligence inputs also suggested that a former officer of PLA has set up a factory of assault rifles in Myanmar’s Kachin province and a majority of the arms produced there are being supplied to militants of the Northeast, including NSCN-Khaplang. The official said that the arms manufacturing unit is located at Pangwa, along the Sino-Myanmarese border, and has been set up by a former PLA officer, Muk Yan Pau Huan, along with former leader of Burmese Communist Party, Tin Ying.
Perfect target practice for a few brahmos. :P


Why sir? Why waste so much money on these jerks. They are worth INSAS, Tavor, Ak rounds plus some nicely sited demolition eggsplocives onlee.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Bade » 10 Jun 2015 01:32

Whatever can cause it to go away without having to harm soldier's precious life on such nuisance....planning and overwhelming use of force is what keep the good guys safe. Same philosophy needs to be applied in J&K CI ops too to keep casualty a minimum.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Karan M » 10 Jun 2015 01:37

We can use troops in well planned ops when there is low risk of casualties. Otherwise LGBs etc.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby partha » 10 Jun 2015 01:41

UlanBatori wrote:Hu diz Nidhi Razdan Bibi? :eek:

Indian Special Forces Kill terrorists in Surprise raid inside Myanmar Full Report on TV

Says
2 camps 'annihiliated', all forces returned. Refuses to answer question on "how deep did u go into Militantstan? "Deep enough"
Complete support? "Myanmar is friendly nation, support was there if needed".
"Complete Indian operation?"
"done by special forces, on their own".
"helicopters used, can u confirm?"
"What is important is that our troops return safely. So many others were waiting in case needed".
"Casualties high on the other side?"
"yes, absolutely true."
"Mark a shift in dealing with terror groups?"
"Need of the hour, that's y nation voted a strong guvrmand into power: V Vill Strike U Wherever U R"
"Acted quickly?"
"Yes, absolutely".

Her question:
YOU {not WE}had complete support of Myanmar army and govt?

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby IndraD » 10 Jun 2015 01:46

Image

Thirty minutes, from ‘insertion’ to ‘kill’ to ‘out’. Forty of India’s toughest fighting men, commandos from the elite 21 Para (Special Force) Regiment, in two teams. Russian-made Mi-35 attack helicopters of the Indian Air Force. Two rebel camps, four km deep in Myanmar. Both destroyed with surgical precision and extreme prejudice.
A similar number were said to be injured, and the others were scattered by the ferocity of the attack that involved use of the machine guns mounted on the Mi-35s. These guns fire the heavy and incredibly powerful 12.7 mm round at the mind-boggling rate of about 4,000 rounds a minute, what is referred to as ‘hosepipe’ in army slang. Little survives such firepower, and in Myanmar early on Tuesday, little did

The camp close to Noklak was a Khaplang base, sources said. “It is suspected that top leaders of the Khaplang faction including Starson Lamkang (the self-styled finance minister, or ‘kilonser’) may have been at the camp,” sources said. Lamkang is believed to be involved in the June 4 ambush that was claimed by the NSCN (K). The outfit had in March ended the ceasefire with the Indian government


http://www.hindustantimes.com/india-new ... 56716.aspx

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby IndraD » 10 Jun 2015 01:53

Some pics from different newspapers :

Image

Dhaka Tribune

Image
DD News

Image
DNA NEws

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Karan M » 10 Jun 2015 02:00

None of the above pics are from the current ops. Last pic is of IA taking on BATs from last year

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 10 Jun 2015 02:02

Nidhi Razdan was pretty when she was young, but now is getting old and wrinkly.
Being in a leftist news organization can have its toll. It is apparently cultural in NDTV to be suspect of every good thing that anyone in India doesn. Anything than while skinned furriners do, you'll find gushing, sheepish pride in them !!!

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 10 Jun 2015 02:03

I doubt if any media camera wala was informed of the raid and asked to come along.
They must be furitively trying to book air tickets and hotels to Izwal

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 10 Jun 2015 02:10

Was this supposed to go to the Rohingyas or the NSCN groups?
Pakistan to provide $5m food grant to Rohingya camps

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gagan » 10 Jun 2015 02:15

Hmm, The news about the Indian special forces raid has still not reached the pages of Paki and Cheeni news outlets...

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Prem » 10 Jun 2015 02:26

Gagan wrote:Hmm, The news about the Indian special forces raid has still not reached the pages of Paki and Cheeni news outlets...

PakiSwami Sarpa Guni have been quiet, Lets wait , then we will know their thinking.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby ShauryaT » 10 Jun 2015 02:35

Taking out NSCN killers in Myanmar
From the sketchy info available that the media has put out, what is known about the Northeast insurgent movements, and about the safe havens in northern Mayanmar the NSCN factions use with impunity, secure in the belief they’d not be hunted down to these remote sites — several things can be deduced about the Special Forces (SF) operation to wipe out members of the Khaplang group who killed 18 personnel of the 6 Dogra Regiment in an ambush.
1) It was not one of the small tactical actions involving small SF teams that are mounted from time to time by army theatre commands across live borders to take out a culvert here, blow up an amo depot there.
2) It was a bigger unit operation that was meant to signal to internal and external adversaries that a resolute India is determined to prosecute telling retaliatory kill missions, whenever merited.
3) If it was a deep penetration mission, it would perforce be a joint operation with IAF helos providing quick means of infiltration to targeted locations well inside Myanmar and for exfiltration.
4) Indian military has long had the target coordinates for use in such strike ops.
5) The Khaplangi killers, supported by PLA, would have been prompted by their Chinese intelligence minders to cross the border and hit the patrolling 6 Dogra detachment.
6) It is unlikely Yangbon was given prior notice of this action, but may have been told of it immediately after the successful completion of the mission. This because Delhi is aware that certain members of the Myanmarese ruling junta are partial to China, and the Chinese would have been alerted who, in turn, would have warned the targeted Nagas about the impending Indian action.
————–
So much for the operation itself. The surprising thing is the reaction of an ex-COAS — did I hear Shankar Roy-Choudhary right? — who wagged an admonishing finger, labeling such actions “adventurist” and “dangerous”. actions. Adventurist?? Hitting back hard, is adventurist? That such thinking prevails at all within the military just how inactive-passive the military leadership has, in fact, become. And just why any proactive or harsh retaliation by SF is so little used by India as a policy instrument. One of the pet themes I have flogged for over 30 years now is that neither the Indian govt nor the Indian armed forces really perceive SF as tools of strategic purpose and impact.

Incidentally, the Myanmar SF op, falls not in the realm of the strategic, but in the category of the extended tactical and is of the same ilk as the one launched in Bhutan some years ago against Assamese rebels, except that was conducted with the full knowledge and assistance of Thimpu).

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby RoyG » 10 Jun 2015 02:51

I have a feeling that some of guerrillas may have been captured alive and exfiltrated. Its possible that the choppers cut up the camp and then the SF moved in and killed some of them in the confusion and collected intelligence. Either way, with the entire NE opening up to both Bangladesh and Myanmar, it is going to be increasingly difficult for these groups to operate freely.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby ShauryaT » 10 Jun 2015 02:57

Rahul M wrote:
vaibhav.n wrote:21 Para SF........Waghnakhs.

True to their name!!

a little background to the unit plz, for the uninitiated. 21 SF was one of the specialized ones, right ?
Specialized for Jungle warfare says wiki.

Three of the Special Forces battalions were originally trained for use in certain environments; 1st Bn [strategic reserve], 9th Bn [mountain] and 10th Bn [desert] and the 21st Bn [jungle]. Currently, all Special Forces battalions are cross trained for all environments.


1995 saw the formation of the fourth commando battalion when 21 Maratha Light Infantry was selected to convert to special forces and slated for the Eastern Command. After stringent selection and training process that spanned more than a year, on 1 February 1996, the unit under Col VB Shinde, was formally inducted as the 21st Battalion (Special Forces), The Parachute Regiment.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby Gus » 10 Jun 2015 03:00

Fantastic operation in every which way looked at.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby member_22733 » 10 Jun 2015 03:16

I guess we knew that they did not have MANPADs and the helos were safe. Wondering where the next rung of escalation is? There will be an escalation since we have indirectly punched the dlagon.

The NSCN are now squeezed between the dlagon PLA and IA.

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Re: Joint Army/IAF Anti-Terrorist Cross Border Op into Myanm

Postby ShauryaT » 10 Jun 2015 03:22

^There are conflicting reports, if Mi 17 were used or Mi 35 or both?


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