Indian Missiles and Munitions Discussion - June'14

pragnya · Post by **pragnya** » 01 Dec 2015 15:18

so man portable version of NAG is on. BDL and DRDO sign in for joint development.

BDL Signs MoU with DRDO
Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL) and Defence Research and
Development Organization (DRDO) have signed a Memorandum of
Understanding (MoU) for Joint Development of 3rd Generation Man-Portable
Anti - Tank Guided Missiles (MPATGM) leading to its subsequent production
for the Indian Army.

http://bdl.ap.nic.in/MediaRelease.pdf

RoyG · Post by **RoyG** » 01 Dec 2015 21:43

What's the status of spike deal? did it go through?

A manpad system needs to get going as well.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 02 Dec 2015 02:37

I think the real question is how will a ship get coordinates for a target that far - even 300 kilometers out for that matter.

noob pooch please.

John wrote:We have discussed this topic to death range of almost any Ashm is double or triple its advertised range if flight path is altered and terminal phased is reduced.

Heck even Saddam had silkworm modified into close to 300 km eange land atttack missiles and many articles have brought out the risk possed if countries like pakistan modify harpoons for similar purpose.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 02 Dec 2015 02:43

Sat and helicopter acquisition. Brahmos promotional material usually shows both, with the chopper being a Ka-31.

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/ka31/

E-801M Oko early warning radar

The early warning radar, E-801M Oko ('Eye'), was developed by the Nizhny Novgorod Radio Engineering Institute. The 6m² radar antenna is stowed flat against the underside of the fuselage until deployed.

The navigator switches on the radar system and the antenna extends, turning through 90° from the horizontal to the vertical plane. In operation the antenna rotates at 6rpm. Once the navigator has switched the radar system to operational mode, the system works autonomously without operator control. The navigator monitors the target observation on a display.

The radar has 360° azimuthal coverage. The surveillance range against a fighter aircraft size target is up to 150km.
"The Ka-31 naval helicopter has co-axially mounted contra-rotating main propellers."

The surveillance range against a surface ship is typically 100km to 200km. The radar is capable of simultaneously tracking 40 targets.

When the radar surveillance phase of the mission is completed the antenna is retracted to the storage position. The antenna is fitted with explosive bolts enabling it to be jettisoned quickly in an emergency, such as in preparation for a forced landing.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 02 Dec 2015 09:00

Couldn't they get target tracks from p8 types as well?

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 02 Dec 2015 14:48

John, He is talking of new fuel. Lets hear what he has to say.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 03 Dec 2015 01:14

Karan M wrote:Sat and helicopter acquisition. Brahmos promotional material usually shows both, with the chopper being a Ka-31.

http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/ka31/

....

Can this be done by Heron UAVs?

http://www.indiastrategic.in/topstories ... h_UAVs.htm

....

The Indian Navy particularly required UAVs for reconnaissance and surveillance with high resolution photography, meteorology, air sampling, target acquisition and missile targeting, and for tracking damage assessment and electronic intelligence gathering. There were very few naval UAVs which could operate from frigates so the Navy ordered land based UAVs which could operate from shore and be controlled from nominated fleet ships for longer ranges, till a ship borne UAV is inducted.

In 2002-3 the Indian Navy signed a contract with Israel Aerospace Industries IAI/Malat for one squadron of Searcher 2 and one Squadron of larger Heron UAVs and tasked Orbit Technologies of Israel which has also supplied the Rukmani terminals on ships for UHF, S, C and Ku band data transfer to and from GSAT 7, to design and fit container control stations on board INS Taragiri and INS Vindhyagiri.

....

The Navy has a clear line of sight (LOS) to control UAVs from ships on Charlie Band 4.1 to 7 Ghz with “Get Home Capability”. The Navy has attained confidence to operate the Heron for 24 hour capability for surveillance and targeting with the synthetic aperture (SAR) radar EL/M 2055 fitted by Elta. The Navy essentially needs a radar picture.

...

Vipul · Post by **Vipul** » 03 Dec 2015 03:27

New missile adds teeth to Navy.

The anti-ship missile was simulated by a "pilotless target aircraft" that was racing towards the ship at 500-550 kilometres per hour. This is slower than the Harpoon anti-ship missile which travels at about 865 kmph, and barely half the 1,150 kmph speed of the Exocet anti-ship missile.

A senior defence ministry official described the test to Business Standard. As the pilotless target aircraft flew toward the Lahav, the corvette's MF-STAR radar, the heart of the LR-SAM system, quickly detected it. The MF-STAR (multi-function surveillance, tracking and acquisition radar) can detect targets up to 200 kilometres away, but the actual range at which this test was conducted remains secret.

How it unfolded
Strategic affairs website DefenseNews quoted an Israeli official telling reporters that the target was acquired "at a range of more than 20 kilometres but less than 120 kilometres."

Automatically, the MF-STAR began tracking the target, displaying in real time its distance, altitude, direction and velocity on a multi-function display in the ship's operations room - on the LR-SAM's command system.

Meanwhile, an interceptor missile, housed in a canister in the warship, began its pre-launch checks. Within seconds, the LR-SAM's command system had computed engagement scenarios and calculated the impact point, where the outgoing missile would meet and destroy the incoming aircraft - a bullet hitting a bullet.

At the designated nanosecond, the interceptor missile roared out of its canister, engulfing the Lahav's deck in a ball of fire. Quickly gaining supersonic speed, it levelled out and streaked towards the incoming missile, guided by continuous target updates transmitted by the MF-STAR over a data link.

Seven kilometres short of the target, a seeker on-board the missile switched on; now the missile was itself locked onto the target, tracking its manoeuvres. The dual-pulse motor fired again, accelerating the missile that was, by now, merely "coasting". This increased velocity allowed the missile to manoeuvre sharply, keeping up with the target's evasive zigzags - termed "target dynamics".

As the interceptor arrived a few metres from the target, a proximity fuse detonated its 23-kilo high-explosive warhead. This aims to destroy the target or damage it enough to prevent it reaching the mother warship. In Thursday's test, the Israelis claim the proximity fuse was irrelevant, since the interceptor missile directly hit the simulated target. "It was metal on metal," says an Israeli source.

"All the subsystems of the missile performed as predicted and achieved the desired goal of hitting the incoming target," an Indian defence ministry statement corroborated on Friday.

Senior DRDO sources describe working with the Israelis in developing the LR-SAM as "a lesson in professionalism and capable project management".

John · Post by **John** » 03 Dec 2015 04:57

Aditya G wrote:I think the real question is how will a ship get coordinates for a target that far - even 300 kilometers out for that matter.

noob pooch please.

John wrote:We have discussed this topic to death range of almost any Ashm is double or triple its advertised range if flight path is altered and terminal phased is reduced.

Heck even Saddam had silkworm modified into close to 300 km eange land atttack missiles and many articles have brought out the risk possed if countries like pakistan modify harpoons for similar purpose.

Tracking via an airborne platform and using that for target acquisition. There are few missiles like otomat which take it step further and can get mid course guidance from a helo.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 03 Dec 2015 06:29

So LR-SAM was able to hit to kill for the target used. The PF should work for more high speed targets. And its flown from a corvette sized vessel.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 07 Dec 2015 02:37

Below picture was speculated to be under development DRDO missile.

I have stumbled upon the original photo:

It is an Exocet.

Sorry folks this aint no redux of 'garika annexe

Thakur_B · Post by **Thakur_B** » 07 Dec 2015 09:11

^^ Ha, I found that pic on NAL website few years back. Finally you solved the mystery.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 07 Dec 2015 09:27

Thakur_B wrote:^^ Ha, I found that pic on NAL website few years back. Finally you solved the mystery.

So they were doing RCS studies on Exocet.

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 08 Dec 2015 18:22

pragnya wrote:so man portable version of NAG is on. BDL and DRDO sign in for joint development.

BDL Signs MoU with DRDO
Bharat Dynamics Limited (BDL) and Defence Research and
Development Organization (DRDO) have signed a Memorandum of
Understanding (MoU) for Joint Development of 3rd Generation Man-Portable
Anti - Tank Guided Missiles (MPATGM) leading to its subsequent production
for the Indian Army.
http://bdl.ap.nic.in/MediaRelease.pdf

Can be Milan-3 also (?) There were some reports that BDL was developing a longer ranged Milan missile. Or CLGM/SAMHO??

soumik · Post by **soumik** » 08 Dec 2015 20:37

ramana wrote:So LR-SAM was able to hit to kill for the target used. The PF should work for more high speed targets. And its flown from a corvette sized vessel.

The Israeli Sa'ar 5 class corvettes are among the most heavily armed corvettes globally with around 16 BARAK 8 and 8 HARPOON Missiles at a displacement of only 1275 tonnes. The Israelis are now building a bigger version called the Sa'ar 6 which will displace 2000 tonnes and carry 32 BARAK 8 and 16 ASHMS.

Picklu · Post by **Picklu** » 08 Dec 2015 20:49

what is that shiva linga at the front?

member_20067 · Post by **member_20067** » 08 Dec 2015 20:58

Picklu wrote:what is that shiva linga at the front?

Phalanx CIWS

member_22539 · Post by **member_22539** » 09 Dec 2015 09:02

Gyan wrote:Can be Milan-3 also (?) There were some reports that BDL was developing a longer ranged Milan missile. Or CLGM/SAMHO??

Nope. Milan-3 as well as CLGM/SAMHO are second generation ATGMs that require the operator to keep the target in sight during the engagement time. On the other hand the article mentions a 3rd-gen missile, which is a fire-and-forget missile like the Javelin, Spike, etc.

This has more in common with the Nag, which is also a 3rd-gen fire-and-forget missile, albeit one to heavy to be used by a person. So, maybe it is a scaled down version. At the very least, there will be liberal use of competencies developed through the Nag program.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 09 Dec 2015 10:51

Yup Javelin also weighs 25KG with 8KG warhead and 2.5 Km range, Nag 45 KG with 8Kg warhead and 5Km range, maybe a 25KG Nag derivative similar to Javelin specs is being provided.

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 10 Dec 2015 09:53

The Saar 5/6 corvette designs echo what Sandeep U and I have been saying for a long time. Smaller corvettes of size 1750-2000 like the RuN's Buyan-Ms,can pack a terrific punch.Look at the number of B-8 SAMs on the Kol class,or even the Shivaliks.They also have not more than 16/8 SSMs resepctively.They have no secondary anti-missile SAM system too,just 2 pairs of gatlings.even the Talwars have two SAM systems. One would be able to acquire 3 such heavily armed corvettes for the price of just one DDG.With an ever-expanding maritime footprint in the IOR and Asia-Pacific,we need large numbers of capable surface combatants and subs to deal with the multiplicity of threats,which will come at us "tous azimuth".Past time to urgently design a new Corvette class.

srai · Post by **srai** » 10 Dec 2015 10:25

^^^

What's the range and endurance of those corvettes? It's fine if the IN wants to operate in the far-eastern part of Mediterranean Sea (using Israeli port) or Caspian Sea (using Russian port). IOR is huge by comparison. Asia-Pacific is even further.

vina · Post by **vina** » 10 Dec 2015 12:14

What's the range and endurance of those corvettes?

Exactly. The Kamorta class at around 3000 tons is what India will need, with it's focus on ASW. Lets face it, the corvettes like the Sa'ar 5/6 etc, just wont have the endurance and range to have a sustained ocean deployment.

Loading up Sa'ar 5 class with ASW and a full sized helicopter wont be practical.

However, the IN should do two things on absolute priority. They should put he RBU-6000 system in a stealth mount. It is ugly as it looks now and second, we should put the LWT on VL launch rocket and put them in the VL tubes.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 10 Dec 2015 12:20

Maybe that is what Phillip Sir is also saying. A smaller ship which is cheap and carry a heavy punch. A lot more can be built faster and with Nirbhay, they can be deadly even at very long range also.

member_29258 · Post by **member_29258** » 10 Dec 2015 17:52

^
speaking of Nirbhaya, no news on the same after the last test...

Philip · Post by **Philip** » 10 Dec 2015 19:39

Not all surface warships of the IN are going to patrol the coast on long endurance patrols of Africa,the Gulf,ICS,etc. The P-28s are underarmed.They carry NO anti-ship missiles at all. How are they going to defend themselves in true blue-water ops? They will have to accompany other larger warships which have such weaponry. 2000t is almost twice the size of a SAAR-5.The Buyan-Ms are around 1000t+.They carry 8 2000km range land attack missiles! A 1750-2000t corvette could carry at least 8 similar missiles (Nirbhay),an ASW helo in a hangar or below deck at the stern (there is a v.innovative design for a Ru corvette,which has a TAS,UUV and helo below deck),PDMs like Barak-1,30mm gatlings,an MBU launcher,TTs and a main gun. There could even be enough space on the beams to carry an extra 4 anti-ship missiles like BMos-M,Klub,Uran.

These corvettes would be ideal for attacking the Paki coastline, well within range from Bombay and the West coast,defending the coastal zones uoto and beyond the EEZ, and if built in sufficient number could also be permanently based in the A&N islands.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 10 Dec 2015 19:53

^^^
You are mixing their role. P-28s are ASW ships, not mini destroyers. We don't have to turn every ship into multipurpose jack-of-all-trade ship. At their current displacement they are still better armed then any USN LCS. And like LCS they lack a good CIWS. But I am assuming this ship will be upgraded with lots of bells and whistles in future to make it more potent ASW ship.

IMHO Ru is using small corvette because it has not built a large destroyer in a while, or maybe forever. They are using them because that's what they got working. Their flagships are legacy platforms and carry a much bigger punch then whats needed for these land attack missions.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 10 Dec 2015 19:56

And for Paki coastline we will have LACM like Nirbhay and PJ-10.

Why send out a vulnerable boat, open to air attack, when you have standoff weapons which can be launched from an aircraft carrier called "India"?

soumik · Post by **soumik** » 10 Dec 2015 20:01

srai wrote:^^^

What's the range and endurance of those corvettes? It's fine if the IN wants to operate in the far-eastern part of Mediterranean Sea (using Israeli port) or Caspian Sea (using Russian port). IOR is huge by comparison. Asia-Pacific is even further.

Sir, Wiki quotes a range of 3500nm@20kt/hr that is more than enough for a cruise from Mumbai to Mahe(1750nm), Mumbai to Zanzibar (2517nm), or a Kolkata to Singapore(1650nm) or Chennai Singapore(1750nm) cruise. The Distance between Mumbai and Karachi is only 485 nm while Gwadar lies at around 600nm from Mumbai. a flotilla of 10-15 such vessels are enough to keep the PN under control.
What Philip says has a lot of merit we need more heavily armed surface combatants, and moreover it also solves the quandary of how many larger vessels can be spared for CBG patrols. The IN should get 30-40 such smallish bruisers to patrol the IOR while the big guns can be sent for indo pacific or indo Atlantic forays.

Anyhoo I feel my post on the Sa'ar has led this thread astray from missiles to ships. calling on the mods to transfer all posts regarding the corvettes into any IN thread they feel appropriate.

vina · Post by **vina** » 10 Dec 2015 20:23

Philip wrote:Not all surface warships of the IN are going to patrol the coast on long endurance patrols of Africa,the Gulf,ICS,etc. The P-28s are underarmed.They carry NO anti-ship missiles at all.

Yes. Have to agree with you there. They are underarmed at present and need to carry Barak 8s at the minimum in the VLS. The air defense fit of the P28 is pending and per the pics I see and space has been provided for it.

Anti Ship roles probably a Club/ Harpoon kind of weapon can be fielded definitely, maybe Brahmos and Nirbhay as well.

Yagnasri · Post by **Yagnasri** » 10 Dec 2015 20:51

Targets in Paki land and their coast can be hit from land in India without any difficulty. Making Andaman a missile base will be a great step. With 2000 km range Nirbhay an be a serious threat to most of the south east Asia.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 10 Dec 2015 21:02

Philip wrote:The Saar 5/6 corvette designs echo what Sandeep U and I have been saying for a long time. Smaller corvettes of size 1750-2000 like the RuN's Buyan-Ms,can pack a terrific punch.Look at the number of B-8 SAMs on the Kol class,or even the Shivaliks.They also have not more than 16/8 SSMs resepctively.They have no secondary anti-missile SAM system too,just 2 pairs of gatlings.even the Talwars have two SAM systems. One would be able to acquire 3 such heavily armed corvettes for the price of just one DDG.With an ever-expanding maritime footprint in the IOR and Asia-Pacific,we need large numbers of capable surface combatants and subs to deal with the multiplicity of threats,which will come at us "tous azimuth".Past time to urgently design a new Corvette class.

Philip, This is the brown water navy concept that you are advocating. All those little boats don't have endurance to patrol; the East coast of Africa to South China Sea.

I asked you sometime ago to reflect on what is the normal operating area for the IN? and the far abroad?

After the Karachi raid, KS garu wanted a small OSA boated navy in his book. I had rebutted them even as student that what India needs is Blue Water navy and not the brown water navy.

nirav · Post by **nirav** » 10 Dec 2015 21:23

+1 ^

Our naval doctrine Envisages a role for IN through the whole of Indian ocean. Bigger missile boats will be practically usable only against saarc countries. Farther out, their range limitations would significantly reduce their employment.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 11 Dec 2015 01:09

Why are we designing a mission for the Indian Navy around a ship? Ship design flows from the capabilities IN wants from the platform and not the other way around.

For example, IN may define a capability as "hold ASW pattern over X sq km at a Y distance from Vizag for Z number of days".

Indian Navy has identified two ASW corvette classes:

1. Project-28: 2 units already commissioned.
2. Shallow Water ASW craft

Both of these classes are required. #2 does not sound very sexy, but in fact is an Arabian sea (i.e. Pakistan) specific ship. It is going to be even cheaper than 2000T ship

http://www.oneindia.com/feature/ins-sar ... 41647.html

"To ensure the security of maritime traffic plying through the Deep water Channel (DWC), off Okha, and Gulf of Kutch against threats from enemy submarines and mines, we are in the process of acquiring Shallow-Water ASW Craft and Mine Counter Measure vessels," the official added.

http://archive.defensenews.com/article/ ... ater-Craft

The ASW shallow water crafts will be used for anti-submarine warfare operations in coastal waters, low intensity maritime operations and mine-laying. The first Indian Navy official said requirements include the

- capability for sub-surface surveillance of coastal waters;
- coordinated anti-submarine warfare operations with aircraft;
- destruction of sub-surface targets in coastal waters;
- ability to carry out search and rescue, day and night, in coastal areas;
- and the ability to engage intruding craft.
- The ship would be required to operate within 200 nautical miles of the base port.

Now coming to the under armed P-28. I don't think IN has any plans for equipping this with cruise missiles as it means requisite sensors, training, cost, maintenance etc etc However they had planned to have a PDMS on it.

I think Maitri is the front runner for the role. It can work of the Revathi radar - unlike Barak-1 it is does not need a director type radar unit.

Philip wrote:Not all surface warships of the IN are going to patrol the coast on long endurance patrols of Africa,the Gulf,ICS,etc. The P-28s are underarmed.They carry NO anti-ship missiles at all. How are they going to defend themselves in true blue-water ops? They will have to accompany other larger warships which have such weaponry. 2000t is almost twice the size of a SAAR-5.The Buyan-Ms are around 1000t+.They carry 8 2000km range land attack missiles! A 1750-2000t corvette could carry at least 8 similar missiles (Nirbhay),an ASW helo in a hangar or below deck at the stern (there is a v.innovative design for a Ru corvette,which has a TAS,UUV and helo below deck),PDMs like Barak-1,30mm gatlings,an MBU launcher,TTs and a main gun. There could even be enough space on the beams to carry an extra 4 anti-ship missiles like BMos-M,Klub,Uran.

These corvettes would be ideal for attacking the Paki coastline, well within range from Bombay and the West coast,defending the coastal zones uoto and beyond the EEZ, and if built in sufficient number could also be permanently based in the A&N islands.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 11 Dec 2015 01:23

Noob pooch: it is known that IN uses thicker guage steel on its ships. That must account for higher ship displacement. I am wondering how much lighter will Kamorta be if it were made using 8 MM or 5 mm steel.

Some perspective on the small vs large ASW ships:

http://defencyclopedia.com/2015/09/18/k ... -corvette/

...Since 1968, ASW corvettes have been a part of the Indian Navy’s operational strategy. They procured 11 Petya class frigates from the Soviet Union between 1968-72 and designated them as Arnala class ASW corvettes. These 1150 ton ships were fast and good at ASW, but had the following drawbacks.

They lacked the range and endurance for blue water operations
Had poor quality hulls which needed major and frequent refits
Lacked the ability to carry an ASW helicopter
Had almost no self-defense capability

These corvettes were restricted to escort role for missile boats which were also short-range vessels. They were also used to a limited degree as ocean-going escorts. The Indian Navy was happy with these ships in the following role until its transition into an aspiring blue water navy. They realized that these ASW corvettes needed to be replaced by a ship which overcame all the drawbacks of the existing class. They also needed a ship which would be equally effective in the littorals as well as in the deep oceans. This resulted in the development of the Kamorta class corvette. The Kamorta would offer the following performance enhancements over the Arnala class.

Thrice the displacement, resulting in more space for weapons and sensors
Provision of hangar and helipad for an ASW helicopter
Advanced radars and sonars
Long endurance, enabling it to operate in blue water
Ultra quiet propulsion and engines
High standard build quality

...

Each ship has a crew of 150 sailors and 15 officers and a very ergonomic design which focuses on crew comfort.
...

There is a widespread misconception that the Kamorta is poorly armed for a 3400 ton ship. But it is very wrong to look at things like that at face value without understanding the logic and naval doctrine for behind them. The Indian Navy needed a ship which has the armament of a 1200 ton corvette and the endurance of a 3400 ton frigate. Basically it is not under-armed, but over-sized. By 2017, it is expected to receive its SAM package consisting of 16-32 VL-Mica missiles which have a range of 15 km and an active seeker. This missile can intercept sea-skimming and supersonic cruise missiles and protect the Kamorta class from submarine launched cruise missiles.

...

srai · Post by **srai** » 11 Dec 2015 03:55

Aditya G wrote:Noob pooch: it is known that IN uses thicker guage steel on its ships. That must account for higher ship displacement. I am wondering how much lighter will Kamorta be if it were made using 8 MM or 5 mm steel.

Some perspective on the small vs large ASW ships:

http://defencyclopedia.com/2015/09/18/k ... -corvette/

...Since 1968, ASW corvettes have been a part of the Indian Navy’s operational strategy. They procured 11 Petya class frigates from the Soviet Union between 1968-72 and designated them as Arnala class ASW corvettes. These 1150 ton ships were fast and good at ASW, but had the following drawbacks.

They lacked the range and endurance for blue water operations
Had poor quality hulls which needed major and frequent refits
Lacked the ability to carry an ASW helicopter
Had almost no self-defense capability

These corvettes were restricted to escort role for missile boats which were also short-range vessels. They were also used to a limited degree as ocean-going escorts. The Indian Navy was happy with these ships in the following role until its transition into an aspiring blue water navy. They realized that these ASW corvettes needed to be replaced by a ship which overcame all the drawbacks of the existing class. They also needed a ship which would be equally effective in the littorals as well as in the deep oceans. This resulted in the development of the Kamorta class corvette. The Kamorta would offer the following performance enhancements over the Arnala class.

Thrice the displacement, resulting in more space for weapons and sensors
Provision of hangar and helipad for an ASW helicopter
Advanced radars and sonars
Long endurance, enabling it to operate in blue water
Ultra quiet propulsion and engines
High standard build quality

...

Each ship has a crew of 150 sailors and 15 officers and a very ergonomic design which focuses on crew comfort.
...

There is a widespread misconception that the Kamorta is poorly armed for a 3400 ton ship. But it is very wrong to look at things like that at face value without understanding the logic and naval doctrine for behind them. The Indian Navy needed a ship which has the armament of a 1200 ton corvette and the endurance of a 3400 ton frigate. Basically it is not under-armed, but over-sized. By 2017, it is expected to receive its SAM package consisting of 16-32 VL-Mica missiles which have a range of 15 km and an active seeker. This missile can intercept sea-skimming and supersonic cruise missiles and protect the Kamorta class from submarine launched cruise missiles.

...

Good article. Worth reading!

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Dec 2015 07:05

the P15A/B seems to be along same lines.....a big oversized for their teeth but capable of staying in the fight a long time.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 11 Dec 2015 07:12

Singha wrote:the P15A/B seems to be along same lines.....a big oversized for their teeth but capable of staying in the fight a long time.

P15s are atleast 16-24 missiles short. Arleigh Burke Flight I, which is few hundred tonnes more than P15b carries 90 missiles.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Dec 2015 07:20

even the P15 has 48 shtil SAMs coming off 2 launchers. while A and B have 32 only with no sign of barak1.
one may argue the barak8 is a far superior missile while it is, but when N number of planes/subs release M missiles it doesnt matter you need atleast 1 missile per inbound and thats where A & B are under armed.

Karthik S · Post by **Karthik S** » 11 Dec 2015 07:31

We could have had a provision for aleast a dozen nirbhays, which would have given us land attack capability and would have made A and B multi role in every way.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 11 Dec 2015 07:49

cheen is building 6 in parallel of the definitive 052D ship comparably sized. 5 are already in service. has the new UVLS that can take all types of missiles, with 64 cells.

Number Pennant Number Name Builder Launched Commissioned Fleet Status
1 172 昆明 Jiangnan-Changxing 28 August 2012 21 March 2014 South Sea Fleet Active
2 173 长沙 Jiangnan-Changxing 28 December 2012 12 August 2015 South Sea Fleet Active
3 174 合肥 Jiangnan-Changxing 1 July 2013 Late 2015 South Sea Fleet Sea trial
4 175 银川 Jiangnan-Changxing 30 March 2014 Mid 2016 South Sea Fleet Sea trial
5 117 西宁 Jiangnan-Changxing 26 August 2014 Late 2016 North Sea Fleet Sea trial
6 118 To be determined Jiangnan-Changxing 30 December 2014 Mid 2017 North Sea Fleet Fitting out
7 119 To be determined Jiangnan-Changxing 6 July 2015 Late 2017 North Sea Fleet Fitting out
8 120 To be determined Dalian-Liaonan 28 November 2015 Late 2017 North Sea Fleet Fitting out
9 154 To be determined Jiangnan-Changxing Est 2015 Early 2018 East Sea Fleet Under Construction
10 155 To be determined Dalian-Liaonan Mid 2016 Mid 2018 East Sea Fleet Under Construction