LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

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sudeepj
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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby sudeepj » 04 Jun 2016 20:59

The design IP of the Tejas is Indian, and that alone is at the very least 30% of the value in the fighter. Deepak Kumar is stupid and stupid essays is the only thing he can produce. Dont be like Deepak.

*How to value 'design IP' of complicated/sophisticated designs? Taking the Bill Of Materials (BOM) cost is not the right approach. For instance, if one were to take the BOM cost of, say, a high end $600 smart phone, it would come to only about $200. There is about $200 worth of expense on design IP/software etc. while the rest is profit margin. This 1/3rd each to design IP, BOM and profit margins is remarkable in how we see it repeatedly in high tech equipment. When a retard journo says, only 35% of the aircraft is indigenous, he is putting 0 valuation on the design aspect of the aircraft and is only taking a BOM approach.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Kartik » 05 Jun 2016 08:47

Rubbish, motivated article. Clear plant.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby vishvak » 05 Jun 2016 18:20

I was expecting something like this from the article:
* Joint LCA project with Russia along with following conditions:
- Mig 35 Sea Wasp engines with option of clean sheet new engine later on
- gun pod development majorly for peace time ops,
- smooth integration of current Russian armaments in inventory, since LCA can be a workhorse, with optional improved seekers later on

It is ridiculous for cost calculation right now. As such, one can't allow some arbitrary logic to increase/decrease prices when many more factors can be considered that are priceless and in favour of seller ie permutation/combination of missiles and accuracy that is improving well.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby SaiK » 05 Jun 2016 20:56

with 70% market share no country will let it go off without a fight no matter how much freedom we seek after. we all know who is doing what, but hiding under biting the teeth with a grin. these type of challenges are minimal actually now. we shall see more of it in the near future.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Neela » 08 Jun 2016 16:34

X post from Space thread
CSIR- National Aerospace Laboratories Proud to Associate with ISRO’s RLV-TD Success

Doc lists the tests done by NAL for RLV-TD.
Special mention of Tejas CLAW team contributions to RLV-TD Control laws during descent phase.

Also some nuggets here ->Letter of appreciation from ISRO

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby NachiketM » 09 Jun 2016 09:39

Thats excellent Teamwork ... :D

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby member_29417 » 09 Jun 2016 12:10

First Tejas Squadron to fly on July 1, HTT-40 waiting in wings

SOURCE: UNI

Two high profile events one after another are set to take place next month with the first squadron of India’s own Light Combat Aircraft-Tejas starting its flight on July 1 and indigenously developed basic trainer HTT-40 will have its maiden flight the same month.

The first squadron comprising four aircraft, including a trainer, will be raised at Bangalore, sources in the IAF today told UNI. The IAF is already flying two of the home grown Tejas while a trainer and the forth aircraft will be handed over before the formal raising of the squadron.

Chief of Air Staff Air Chief Marshal Arup Raha is likely to present on the historic occasion, as it is for the first time an indigenous squadron is being inducted in the 83 year old IAF. The Air Chief himself had his first sortie in the LCA last month, giving it a thumbs up. “It is my first sortie in Tejas, it is a good aircraft for induction into IAF operations,” he said after a 30 minute flight, which involved manoeuvres in the entire flying envelope of the aircraft. Coinciding with the event, Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) was trying to have the inaugural flight of its basic trainer HTT-40. The historic event is likely to be witnessed by Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar, a strong votary of indigenous aircraft. The trial sortie of the trainer was carried out last week, with the aircraft landing back in flying colours. HAL’s chief test pilot, Group Capt Subramaniam, who flew the HTT-40 for about 30 minutes, expressed his satisfaction after at the performance aircraft.

http://idrw.org/first-tejas-squadron-fl ... more-97908

Is this news Authentic ? Had heard First Tejas squadron will be formed with 4 fighter.. and now they are making it with SP1, SP2, SP3(was planned to be coming in June) + Trainer. So when SP3 coming and which Trainer is being handed over to IAF(which Raha already flown ?) !!

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Kersi D » 09 Jun 2016 13:25

tejas warrior wrote:....... as it is for the first time an indigenous squadron is being inducted in the 83 year old IAF........

[/color]



I think there was an aircraft called HF 24 Marut

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Lalmohan » 09 Jun 2016 13:38

and perhaps an HT-32

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Lalmohan » 09 Jun 2016 13:38

and a kiran...

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby JayS » 09 Jun 2016 14:00

tejas warrior wrote:The first squadron comprising four aircraft, including a trainer, will be raised at Bangalore, sources in the IAF today told UNI. The IAF is already flying two of the home grown Tejas while a trainer and the forth aircraft will be handed over before the formal raising of the squadron.


Does that mean SP2 is handed over already?? :D

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby SaiK » 10 Jun 2016 04:40

Lalmohan wrote:and a kiran...
3-king like a fighter? wake up!

say it is hawk (closer)!

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Khalsa » 10 Jun 2016 05:55

http://www.tribuneindia.com/news/comment/the-lca-s-33-year-journey-far-from-tejas/241592.html


Oh my god ... looks he used the entire dictionary of describing failures but still failed himself to make a compelling statement or make it into an article of influence.

In the end the people commenting below are doing a damn fine job of pulling up apart.
Please contribute to the comments and bring this guy down who is only good at teaching us how to import.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Lalmohan » 10 Jun 2016 12:33

SaiK wrote:
Lalmohan wrote:and a kiran...
3-king like a fighter? wake up!

say it is hawk (closer)!


different point janaab, we have already had many years of experience of producing aircraft and inducting them into the airforce

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby prat.patel » 10 Jun 2016 21:55

:!: :!: Cumpeteson :!: :!:

"Saab offers its cutting-edge Gallium Nitride AESA radar technology if India decides to produce the Gripen fighter aircraft for the IAF".

Not that I am a proponent of accepting this particular offer - but heartening to see the way we are being wooed. Firangis are now probably feeling the heat of losing ground to indigenous products (in this particular case, competition from now eminent success of LCA).

But not sure if the news is genuine….

P.S. – Comment may seem OT; but posting it here because I will count this event in success category for LCA Tejas. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby brar_w » 10 Jun 2016 22:03

It’s called throwing stuff out there and seeing what sticks. SAAB has this cutting edge GaN airborne radar, that neither Sweden, nor Brazil are using on their own Gripen E/F’s, choosing instead the mature and balanced (technology, timeline and risk) Selex AESA instead. SAAB is a radar integrator (like a Lockheed for example) so can offer ideas and see what sticks. Much like when they threw GaN for EW out nearly 7 years back, and everyone in the media was floored in terms of how ‘ahead’ of the curve they were. Only problem was that the timeline they had for GaN EW would make them the third (behind Boeing/BaE – F15 EPAWSS, Raytheon/Boeing NGJ) or fourth (Behind Boeing/BaE, Raytheon/Boeing, and Dassault/Thales - Spectra) to market with such a system. Wait till the disclose the cost to integrate a yet to be developed all new radar into a fighter that doesn't declare FOC till a decade from now.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby prat.patel » 10 Jun 2016 22:07

brar_w wrote:It’s called throwing stuff out there and seeing what sticks. SAAB has this cutting edge GaN airborne radar, that neither Sweden, nor Brazil are using on their own Gripen E/F’s, choosing instead the mature and balanced (technology, timeline and risk) Selex AESA instead. SAAB is a radar integrator (like a Lockheed for example) so can offer ideas and see what sticks. Much like when they threw GaN for EW out nearly 7 years back, and everyone in the media was floored in terms of how ‘ahead’ of the curve they were. Only problem was that the timeline they had for GaN EW would make them the third (behind Boeing/BaE – F15 EPAWSS, Raytheon/Boeing NGJ) or fourth (Behind Boeing/BaE, Raytheon/Boeing, and Dassault/Thales - Spectra) to market with such a system. Wait till the disclose the cost to integrate a yet to be developed all new radar into a fighter that doesn't declare FOC till a decade from now.


:D yep, makes sense!

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby vishvak » 10 Jun 2016 23:35

It’s called throwing stuff out there and seeing what sticks.
..
SAAB is a radar integrator (like a Lockheed for example) so can offer ideas and see what sticks.

Couldn't have said better. Logically speaking, more R&D will only increase and never decrease such permutations & combinations. In case of local R&D, it also makes foreign companies come up with more ideas.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby SaiK » 11 Jun 2016 13:58

huh.. you guys! and those idrw guys.. now they put modi's name on it!

http://idrw.org/iaf-chief-pilots-swedis ... more-98025

this is irritating!

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby member_28985 » 11 Jun 2016 19:59

If IAF decides to pursue Tejas Mk II, realistically when will HAL be able to deliver it?

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Vivek K » 11 Jun 2016 20:16

Never! The plane can be realized but acceptance from the IAF that is another matter. So long as we don't realize that we MUST build our own weapons, there is no point in MkIIs. If we only require future Mark II, III, IV and so on so that we can hold up the delays and ridicule the effort only so that we could introduce a Rafale or a Eurofighter. Do we want the Mark II? That is the question we must answer first.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Manish_Sharma » 12 Jun 2016 01:40

prat.patel wrote::!: :!: Cumpeteson :!: :!:

"Saab offers its cutting-edge Gallium Nitride AESA radar technology if India decides to produce the Gripen fighter aircraft for the IAF".


This is not competition with Rafale to get mmrca!

When Tejas flew in Bahrain, it resulted immediately that chinee-porki jf 17 tucked its tail and ran away from show itself. THAT WAS IMMEDIATE EFFECT OF TEJAS PERFORMANCE !!!

Now what we see is delayed reaction of scandinavian jf 17 = grippen. They are feeling very insecure knowing that Tejas has been tested in much much more difficult conditions like dusty hotty Bharat + Tejas team has matched or crossed grippen high points like hot fuelling etc.

If we produce grippen here, swedes can advertise around as "inspite of having Tejas the Bharat needed grippen..."

Grippen is as poisnous for us as jf 17

So they are taking now Trojan horse path of entry and sabotage from inside. That's why when i had seen the pics of fatty fadnavis the cm of MH i immediately wrote to bjp, pmo, dm accusing betrayel.

We all need to protest on such news items in our personal capacities, as a group or taking help of friends and relatives.

Two mantras needed to nailed in the head of govt :

1. 6 Tejas for 1 Rafale
2. grippen is our competitor to "Make in Bharat" and "Exports from Bharat"

Modi govt. will listen if we flood the PMO and MoD with such messages.

I want to make a prediction here:
The day Tejas Mk 2 gets nearer to FOC the french will offer producing Rafale GaN tech plus engine mfrg. here

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby prat.patel » 12 Jun 2016 02:12

Dhananjay wrote:
prat.patel wrote::!: :!: Cumpeteson :!: :!:

"Saab offers its cutting-edge Gallium Nitride AESA radar technology if India decides to produce the Gripen fighter aircraft for the IAF".


This is not competition with Rafale to get mmrca!

When Tejas flew in Bahrain, it resulted immediately that chinee-porki jf 17 tucked its tail and ran away from show itself. THAT WAS IMMEDIATE EFFECT OF TEJAS PERFORMANCE !!!

Now what we see is delayed reaction of scandinavian jf 17 = grippen. They are feeling very insecure knowing that Tejas has been tested in much much more difficult conditions like dusty hotty Bharat + Tejas team has matched or crossed grippen high points like hot fuelling etc.

If we produce grippen here, swedes can advertise around as "inspite of having Tejas the Bharat needed grippen..."

Grippen is as poisnous for us as jf 17

So they are taking now Trojan horse path of entry and sabotage from inside. That's why when i had seen the pics of fatty fadnavis the cm of MH i immediately wrote to bjp, pmo, dm accusing betrayel.

We all need to protest on such news items in our personal capacities, as a group or taking help of friends and relatives.

Two mantras needed to nailed in the head of govt :

1. 6 Tejas for 1 Rafale
2. grippen is our competitor to "Make in Bharat" and "Exports from Bharat"

Modi govt. will listen if we flood the PMO and MoD with such messages.

I want to make a prediction here:
The day Tejas Mk 2 gets nearer to FOC the french will offer producing Rafale GaN tech plus engine mfrg. here


yep; totally!
And I was hinting to this exactly. I didnt mean Swedes are trying to compete with Rafale.
This is competition with LCA programe itself.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby PratikDas » 12 Jun 2016 02:27

Dhananjay wrote:1. 6 Tejas for 1 Rafale
2. grippen is our competitor to "Make in Bharat" and "Exports from Bharat"

I'm a huge fan of the LCA and what it means for India's future but that ratio in bold is likely to be 3 Tejas for 1 Rafale or at best 4:1 if SDRE maintenance is very cheap. The Rafale is about $244 million per plane for life cycle costs, which is about double the flyway cost. The $41 million cost of the Tejas is not going to be a life cycle cost but a flyaway cost - unless someone has a reference to prove me wrong.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Manish_Sharma » 12 Jun 2016 05:17

prat.patel wrote:
yep; totally!
And I was hinting to this exactly. I didnt mean Swedes are trying to compete with Rafale.
This is competition with LCA programe itself.

:D
Ok, apologies for misunderstanding

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Manish_Sharma » 12 Jun 2016 05:23

PratikDas wrote:I'm a huge fan of the LCA and what it means for India's future


:)
I know you are, I also remember the gritty front you had put up on on Siachen thread against Siachen vacating mms-kanwal-tyagi support posters. So I can never doubt you Pratik ji !

but that ratio in bold is likely to be 3 Tejas for 1 Rafale or at best 4:1 if SDRE maintenance is very cheap. The Rafale is about $244 million per plane for life cycle costs, which is about double the flyway cost. The $41 million cost of the Tejas is not going to be a life cycle cost but a flyaway cost - unless someone has a reference to prove me wrong.

Oh, I didn't know that. I simply thought 25 million for Tejas and 250 - 300 million for rafale. So reduced it to 6 for 1 instead of 10 for 1 and wrote to every one, BJP president, PMO, Parrikar plus Mrs. Lekhi. :oops:

But I still say even 3 to 1 is good to write and as many BRFites should be writing. This sort of govt. comes once in many centuries.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby member_29417 » 12 Jun 2016 07:26

prat.patel wrote::!: :!: Cumpeteson :!: :!:

"Saab offers its cutting-edge Gallium Nitride AESA radar technology if India decides to produce the Gripen fighter aircraft for the IAF".

Not that I am a proponent of accepting this particular offer - but heartening to see the way we are being wooed. Firangis are now probably feeling the heat of losing ground to indigenous products (in this particular case, competition from now eminent success of LCA).

But not sure if the news is genuine….

P.S. – Comment may seem OT; but posting it here because I will count this event in success category for LCA Tejas. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


When we are already getting ELM-2052 AESA radar from Elta, what is the need of another ASEA ? We also have Uttam in the background being developed.

OR do we have any problems with ELM-2052 AESA radar ? bco's we didn't heard of any news on its integration testing with Tejas yet.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby prat.patel » 13 Jun 2016 08:05

tejas warrior wrote:
prat.patel wrote::!: :!: Cumpeteson :!: :!:

"Saab offers its cutting-edge Gallium Nitride AESA radar technology if India decides to produce the Gripen fighter aircraft for the IAF".

Not that I am a proponent of accepting this particular offer - but heartening to see the way we are being wooed. Firangis are now probably feeling the heat of losing ground to indigenous products (in this particular case, competition from now eminent success of LCA).

But not sure if the news is genuine….

P.S. – Comment may seem OT; but posting it here because I will count this event in success category for LCA Tejas. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


When we are already getting ELM-2052 AESA radar from Elta, what is the need of another ASEA ? We also have Uttam in the background being developed.

OR do we have any problems with ELM-2052 AESA radar ? bco's we didn't heard of any news on its integration testing with Tejas yet.


Sorry, if my original post was not clear enough. I am not at all saying we need this offer.

All I am suggesting is that - The fact that the phoren manufactures are coming up with such offers is because maybe they are not threatened by the success of LCA. And I think such offers would not have come if they were not threatened by the fact that they are about to miss the bus. Maybe such desperate attempts by them is an in-direct acknowledgment of the LCA Tejas success.
This is what I was hinting towards. I am not saying there is any problem with the LCA program and we need new radar tech.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby member_29417 » 13 Jun 2016 09:38

Anyone having information on ELM-2052 AESA radar integration on Tejas, what is the status? Had the work started?
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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Indranil » 15 Jun 2016 00:16

There is something interesting happening in the Tejas stables:

3184th flight on 09 June
TD1 : 233, PV1: 245, PV3: 387, LSP1: 74, LSP3:278, LSP5: 290, TD2 : 305, PV2: 222,
PV5: 133, LSP2: 314, LSP4: 209, LSP7: 176, NP1: 63, LSP8 : 156, PV6: 53, NP2: 46

3158th flight on 26 May
TD1 : 233, PV1: 245, PV3: 387, LSP1: 74, LSP3:278, LSP5: 290, TD2 : 305, PV2: 222,
PV5: 130, LSP2: 314, LSP4: 208, LSP7: 176, NP1: 63, LSP8 : 156, PV6: 49, NP2: 28

3140th flight on 27 Apr
TD1 : 233, PV1: 245, PV3: 387, LSP1: 74, LSP3:278, LSP5: 290, TD2 : 305, PV2: 222
PV5: 124, LSP2: 314, LSP4: 208, LSP7: 176, NP1: 61, LSP8 : 156, PV6: 40, NP2: 27

3113rd flight on 29 Mar
TD1 : 233, PV1: 245, PV3: 387, LSP1: 74, LSP3:278, LSP5: 290, TD2 : 305, PV2: 222
PV5: 124, LSP2: 314, LSP4: 208, LSP7: 176, NP1: 49, LSP8 : 156, PV6: 39, NP2: 13

3088th flight on 26 Feb
TD1 : 233, PV1: 245, PV3: 387, LSP1: 74, LSP3:271, LSP5: 290, TD2 : 305, PV2: 222
PV5: 123, LSP2: 314, LSP4: 202, LSP7: 173, NP1: 43, LSP8 : 156, PV6: 38, NP2: 12


In other words, there have been 96 flights in the past 104 days. Of these, 53 have been on the naval versions and 25 on trainers. So, IAF Tejas versions are hardly flying.

On the other hand, NP2 alone flew 18 test sorties in 11 days, NP1 12! Someone tell those loons what the wartime availability of Tejas can be!

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby fanne » 15 Jun 2016 04:42

could the trainer flights be linked to training IAF pilots for the formation of first Sq in July?

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby sankum » 15 Jun 2016 07:35

Only LSP3:7,LSP4:7,LSP7:3,PV5:10,PV6:15,NP1:20 and NP2:34 are flying since 26 feb 2016 till june 9 2016.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Kakarat » 15 Jun 2016 08:03


NachiketM
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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby NachiketM » 15 Jun 2016 09:15

I had just flown into Dabolim airport on Friday afternoon and was stuck on the taxiway for 30+ mins as the parking bay was full. Luckily my plane was very close to the INS Hansa parking bay and got to see a few aircrafts and flying ops. :D
There were MiG-29Ks, Dornier Do 228s, Kamov Ka-31 AEW Choppers and IL-38 ASW aircrafts ...
Saw 2 Migs taking off followed by 2 Dornier takeoffs and 1 landing. The parked IL-38 ASW aircrafts are amazingly huge in size and the radars on top and the bulge at the bottom looked really awesome ... :shock:
One thing that massively impressed me was the short takeoff of Dorniers ... It was definately between 500-600 mts ... Dint know Dorniers had such short takeoff capability ... :eek:
The Mig 29Ks look really amazing especially with the golden-brown coating on the canopy...
While flying back from Goa I also saw a N-LCA parked just out of its hangar and when we tookoff the STBF at INS Hansa was a sight for sore eyes ... ;)

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Lalmohan » 15 Jun 2016 11:15

the Do228 is quite the mountain goat

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Gagan » 15 Jun 2016 14:09

The coast guard operates dorniers off 1.25km long airstrips all the time. They have built such airstrips all over the coast

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Khalsa » 16 Jun 2016 00:07

NachiketM wrote:The Mig 29Ks look really amazing especially with the golden-brown coating on the canopy...


I thought so ....
Do the Ks have a coating of Gold just like the F-16s ?
Why is it brown / gold ?

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby NachiketM » 16 Jun 2016 05:26

Khalsa wrote:
NachiketM wrote:The Mig 29Ks look really amazing especially with the golden-brown coating on the canopy...

I thought so ....
Do the Ks have a coating of Gold just like the F-16s ?
Why is it brown / gold ?


Well it was a little purplelish TBH ... But I dont know if the downcasted monsoon weather had anything to do with it ... :roll:
hmmm...
They were a mix of twin seaters and single seat ones...
Also the one taking off was numbered 810... Could see its amazing short takeoff ability ... I think the WSO had dozed off ... he wasn't moving ... :rotfl:

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby Khalsa » 16 Jun 2016 05:45

^
LOL
He has become desensitised to those Adrenaline pumping take offs.

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Re: LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

Postby ArmenT » 16 Jun 2016 18:49

Hi-res pictures and movies of the LCA from the official site
Including picture galleries for calendars of various years :-)

Mods, perhaps the link should be on the first post of the LCA thread.


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