LCA Tejas: News and Discussions

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 13 Apr 2016 07:04

The LCA in various avatars has completed over 2000 flights. That means 4000 takeoffs and landings. The nosewheel was used every time

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/with-two ... ly-1391301
One Shri Sudhi Ranjan Sen has invented the cheerful headline "With Two Planes, India to Raise its first Tejas Squadron.."

Mind you there is truth in that. But the headline is like announcing an appointment as follows "With high myopia and juvenile diabetes, Mr Sudhi Ranjan Sen appointed as next CEO of HAL"

The statement may be true but it highlights information that people are going to look at and ask "Now why is that information in a headline". Clearly the headline itself is gaandmasti, from NDTV, no less

There is plenty of information on "nose-wheel shimmy" on Google. But the first and ONLY reference to nosewheeel vibration comes from out friend Sudhi Ranjan Sen on NDTV in a news item that speaks of "two plane squadron", cockpit noise, nosewheel vibration etc.

Exactly what is going on? There must be someone paying to have these things published. Or someone who is viciously angry with the Tejas. Judging from viewership stats of NDTV I can see why any extra payment might be welcome. I really can't think of any better explanation for the type of chootiyapa that the news item displays.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 13 Apr 2016 08:51

Hakim,

Your posts will be equally effective without the expletives. Please maintain the decorum of the forum.

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 13 Apr 2016 09:45

Combat Aircraft Monthly on Tejas program

http://speedy.sh/x2wU8/Tejas.pdf

member_28932 · Post by **member_28932** » 13 Apr 2016 15:10

srai wrote:
Cain Marko wrote:^^ are the SPs from no. 2 onwards ioc or foc std. Are the derby, ifr and Cobham capabilities included?
Based on the article, SP3 and SP4 are structurally/component complete. So no IFR and Cobham on these. There is a possibility for IFR and Cobham cone on SP-5, SP-6 and SP7 since they are still at component level. SP8 is starting in a month so this one is probably definite (depending on how flight testing goes).

Derby is more of a software type of change. So that could be added anytime.

Cobham nosecone was supposed to be plugged by half of a meter for aerodynamic improvements. Does anybody have any idea whether these design change is incorporated in new cobham nosecone?

member_28932 · Post by **member_28932** » 13 Apr 2016 15:24

srai wrote:^^^

It would seem SP-2 went through a complete re-build to IOC-2 standards. SP-1 was much further along before IOC-2 certification was obtained and was taken to completion with as much IOC-2 as feasible. However as the IAF has stated, they will not use SP-1 for squadron formation since the build standard is not completely IOC-2. In the same light, SP-2 could have been delivered quicker without full adherence to IOC-2 standard but then would have faced the same fate as SP-1. But now, if full IOC-2 build specs, SP-2 would be able to be used for squadron formation.

DOes it mean that SP2 will a different Aircraft compared to all previous LSPs and Sp1. Can we expect a improved performance from Sp2 onward?

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 13 Apr 2016 16:51

Austin wrote:Combat Aircraft Monthly on Tejas program

http://speedy.sh/x2wU8/Tejas.pdf

nice article.. no takeaways as have already nailed many things here ahead.

except perhaps the SoP 18, and going for prod during 2017 if done, 'd be fantastic.

more than the elta 2052s, what makes it exciting is ADA working on the additional pylon for the SPJ.
can anyone tell where would this go? where is the space?

wonder what would it take do a DASA type towed radar decoy

Suresh S · Post by **Suresh S** » 13 Apr 2016 17:07

I agree with u Indranil but expletives work in real life they convey the message more effectively if delivered in a certain way. After 3 hours of frustration yesterday to start a case my patience reached boiling point and comes out the expletives with emotions and guess what patient appears in 15 minutes like magic. It works.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 13 Apr 2016 21:19

snahata wrote:I agree with u Indranil but expletives work in real life they convey the message more effectively if delivered in a certain way. After 3 hours of frustration yesterday to start a case my patience reached boiling point and comes out the expletives with emotions and guess what patient appears in 15 minutes like magic. It works.

I understand what you say, but that is outside the rules of posting on this forum.

Vipul Dave wrote: Cobham nosecone was supposed to be plugged by half of a meter for aerodynamic improvements. Does anybody have any idea whether these design change is incorporated in new cobham nosecone?

The nose cone plug was an error in reporting. There will be no nose cone plugs in Mk1, SOP18, or Mk2.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 14 Apr 2016 00:19

Austin wrote:Combat Aircraft Monthly on Tejas program

http://speedy.sh/x2wU8/Tejas.pdf

Austin, not able to download or view the article..any other host that may work?

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 14 Apr 2016 01:42

Angad Singh. Don't expect anything but rancid statements.

Viv S · Post by **Viv S** » 14 Apr 2016 02:05

Kartik wrote:Austin, not able to download or view the article..any other host that may work?

Try this.

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 14 Apr 2016 02:32

kartik, check the browser download folder. it depends on which browser you use, see the menu option

srai · Post by **srai** » 14 Apr 2016 03:55

Viv S wrote:
Kartik wrote:Austin, not able to download or view the article..any other host that may work?
Try this.

Good reporting--accurate chronology of events (without biases).

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 14 Apr 2016 04:38

Angad writing an unbiased report on Tejas is impossible. However, He has covered the chronology fairly accurately.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 14 Apr 2016 08:51

Viv S wrote:
Kartik wrote:Austin, not able to download or view the article..any other host that may work?
Try this.

thank you! it worked.

Shreeman · Post by **Shreeman** » 14 Apr 2016 09:10

indranilroy wrote:
snahata wrote:I agree with u Indranil but expletives work in real life they convey the message more effectively if delivered in a certain way. After 3 hours of frustration yesterday to start a case my patience reached boiling point and comes out the expletives with emotions and guess what patient appears in 15 minutes like magic. It works.
I understand what you say, but that is outside the rules of posting on this forum.

Vipul Dave wrote: Cobham nosecone was supposed to be plugged by half of a meter for aerodynamic improvements. Does anybody have any idea whether these design change is incorporated in new cobham nosecone?
The nose cone plug was an error in reporting. There will be no nose cone plugs in Mk1, SOP18, or Mk2.

Actually the new nose cone integrated a 67cm longer 19 degree curvature spirofugal design intended to improve stealth and also make future redesign of the air inlets redundant. Such an architecture has been reportedly studied on 16xl (as reported by australian analyst karlo knopp) and serves many purposes beyond radar range improvement. This is what delayed the radome. Also it negates the need for both dsi and Lerx and does not result in the cockneyed j10 look or the droopy 30k look.

...
(all the reporters are making up stuff, why cant i?)

jayasimha · Post by **jayasimha** » 14 Apr 2016 19:39

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/hal-in-t ... as-1395507

HAL In Talks With Swedish Firm For Upgraded Tejas

NEW DELHI: State-run Hindustan Aeronautics Limited or HAL is in talks with Swedish aerospace major Saab, makers of single engine Gripen fighter planes, to collaborate on the upgraded version of the indigenously developed Light Combat Aircraft 'Tejas' which will replace IAF's aging fleet of MiG combat jets.

Senior defence sources said that while the first round of talks have been completed, a high-level team from Saab will arrive in India next week to carry forward the discussion.

"India needs about 300 aircraft of the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) type. Saab's Gripen is a good fighter jet and hence exploratory talks are on to see if they can be a technical collaborator for the upgraded Tejas," they said. The Defence Ministry has set 2018 deadline for making the first upgraded Tejas aircraft.

HAL, manufacturer of Tejas, is likely to hand over the fourth aircraft to the Air Force by June end. The four aircraft will make up for the first squadron of IAF which will be used for training and familarisation.

Rather than waiting for LAC Mk II, IAF had decided to go in with an upgraded version of the existing Tejas with over 40 modifications.

IAF currently plans to acquire 120 Tejas aircraft, with 100 of these having major modifications. The force wants Active Electrically Scanned Array (AESA) Radar, Unified Electronic Warfare (EW) Suite, mid-air refueling capacity and beyond the vision range missiles.

As per the production plan, six aircraft will be made this year (2015-16) and HAL will subsequently scale it up to eight and 16 aircraft per year.

Saab had offered JAS39 Gripen-E light fighter to India when the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender was announced. The bid was finally won by French firm Dassault Aviation.

Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) had a few years ago sought Saab's help in the Mark-II version of Tejas, which will eventually be inducted into the air force. Saab is likely to insist on a government-to-government (G2G) deal if they step in to assist India in developing and manufacturing a light fighter plane.

The Swedish aerospace major has already submitted a proposal to make Gripen in India under the 'Make in India' initiative.

Viv S · Post by **Viv S** » 14 Apr 2016 19:46

:facepalm:

Half a dozen aviation majors in the world and they managed to zero in on the only one that was developing a competing aircraft.

member_29378 · Post by **member_29378** » 14 Apr 2016 19:59

jayasimha wrote:http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/hal-in-t ... as-1395507

HAL In Talks With Swedish Firm For Upgraded Tejas

NEW DELHI: State-run Hindustan Aeronautics Limited or HAL is in talks with Swedish aerospace major Saab, makers of single engine Gripen fighter planes, to collaborate on the upgraded version of the indigenously developed Light Combat Aircraft 'Tejas' which will replace IAF's aging fleet of MiG combat jets.

Senior defence sources said that while the first round of talks have been completed, a high-level team from Saab will arrive in India next week to carry forward the discussion.

"India needs about 300 aircraft of the Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) type. Saab's Gripen is a good fighter jet and hence exploratory talks are on to see if they can be a technical collaborator for the upgraded Tejas," they said. The Defence Ministry has set 2018 deadline for making the first upgraded Tejas aircraft.

HAL, manufacturer of Tejas, is likely to hand over the fourth aircraft to the Air Force by June end. The four aircraft will make up for the first squadron of IAF which will be used for training and familarisation.

Rather than waiting for LAC Mk II, IAF had decided to go in with an upgraded version of the existing Tejas with over 40 modifications.

IAF currently plans to acquire 120 Tejas aircraft, with 100 of these having major modifications. The force wants Active Electrically Scanned Array (AESA) Radar, Unified Electronic Warfare (EW) Suite, mid-air refueling capacity and beyond the vision range missiles.

As per the production plan, six aircraft will be made this year (2015-16) and HAL will subsequently scale it up to eight and 16 aircraft per year.

Saab had offered JAS39 Gripen-E light fighter to India when the Medium Multi-Role Combat Aircraft (MMRCA) tender was announced. The bid was finally won by French firm Dassault Aviation.

Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) had a few years ago sought Saab's help in the Mark-II version of Tejas, which will eventually be inducted into the air force. Saab is likely to insist on a government-to-government (G2G) deal if they step in to assist India in developing and manufacturing a light fighter plane.

The Swedish aerospace major has already submitted a proposal to make Gripen in India under the 'Make in India' initiative.

How reliable is this news? The news mentions no names, just 'sources'. We should wait for some official confirmation.

jayasimha · Post by **jayasimha** » 14 Apr 2016 20:16

HAL must have asked 1 jig or two from SOAB or even a sub-assembly of the same... .
.
Given a slight chance, these phirangi log will M@ast????urate in front of these news agency..

These DDM news agencies will collect it with their folded arms and pour it on their News channel...

The same thing I think happened WRT to QR-SAM.. Army must have just asked Israelis how is your QR-SAM before finalizing some specs... So IE collected them and published ...

Their ultimate AIM: Downgrade, Degrade indigenous effort..

Cosmo_R · Post by **Cosmo_R** » 14 Apr 2016 20:20

Viv S wrote::facepalm:

Half a dozen aviation majors in the world and they managed to zero in on the only one that was developing a competing aircraft.

+1. Sheer deathwish.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 14 Apr 2016 22:31

Viv S wrote::facepalm:

Half a dozen aviation majors in the world and they managed to zero in on the only one that was developing a competing aircraft.

Not necessarily a bad thing....others have capability, but only saab has the experience of taking a small fighter of less than 6 tons to a far more capable 7 ton fighter, a long winded process. Also saab had some experience with integrating Israeli gear and had offered this option on the ng.

This seems to be for mk1 a..and not three mk3, Which is a good thing as it shows a level of urgency., and does not threaten the mk2. There is mention of 300 lca...great news, and no mention of buying the ng..Also good news.

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 14 Apr 2016 23:27

Glass half empty kinda article. Nah, don't need 5 pages of running our efforts down...

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 15 Apr 2016 00:16

HAL - nothing they do should surprise us anymore.

As if SAAB will cooperate just like that - they'll try to get a deal for the Gripen and HAL will of course go along with, screwdrivering the Rafale is increasingly a remote option.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 15 Apr 2016 20:20

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 15 Apr 2016 20:33

whoa!

In the top fotu check the visibility the pilot has if he turns his head around

member_29350 · Post by **member_29350** » 15 Apr 2016 20:53

Both the pics are a beaut. Wonderful artwork

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 15 Apr 2016 21:30

Great to see the tfta image with centerline no less..yay. Can't wait to see all pylons loaded with derbys and pythons

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 15 Apr 2016 21:34

We need Astra Mk2 in this bird. Derby-ER itself will be a huge step.

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 15 Apr 2016 21:36

Oh yes..

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 15 Apr 2016 21:52

Local production of US F 16 & F/A 18 not attractive: HAL Chairman Suvarna Raju

How involved will the private sector be in the production of the LCA aircraft in India?
The first 20 aircraft will be completed by 2018, by when we have to make a Mk 1A version of the aircraft. We are ramping up production to 16 aircraft a year. We have recently issued request for quotations to the private players to supply modules like fuselage parts and wings. If we can get this from the private sector, we can increase production to 25 aircraft a year. So, we are looking for capacity augmentation with these private players. We are looking at a concept in which HAL is an integrator that has some 20% (of total) work in the hangers. The remaining 80% of work can be off loaded to the industry. If a private company for example is setting up a shop for composites manufacturing, it will be assured for business for many years.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 15 Apr 2016 22:12

^^ Great to see a HAL Chief gung ho about LCA vs some import

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 15 Apr 2016 22:34

The top pic I guess is the N-LCA ot trainer. Hence the top notch visibility. /JMT

Viv S · Post by **Viv S** » 15 Apr 2016 23:39

Cain Marko wrote:Not necessarily a bad thing....others have capability, but only saab has the experience of taking a small fighter of less than 6 tons to a far more capable 7 ton fighter, a long winded process. Also saab had some experience with integrating Israeli gear and had offered this option on the ng.

Actually its taking a 6.8 ton Gripen C to a 8 ton Gripen E.

Also, Saab isn't the only one with similar experience. YF-16: 6.1 tons, F-16A: 7.4 tons, F-16C: 8.5 tons, F-16E: 10 tons. Also, while the Hornet & SH aren't, strickly speaking, variants of the same design (YF-17), still enough design linkages to make a good comparison there.

IMO it would much more sense to tie up with a foreign firm, which doesn't face a conflict of interest, can help on the production side (experience with high volume production) and can collaborate on marketing it overseas (particularly in the West).

Mihir · Post by **Mihir** » 15 Apr 2016 23:57

Superb photos, ruined by terrible post-processing. The liberal application of HDR makes them look cartoonish.

fanne · Post by **fanne** » 16 Apr 2016 02:04

Is this not a real photo?

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 16 Apr 2016 02:29

Fanne,

Very real. HDR is just a photo post processing technique. I love whats been done. A pic a month like this in common rag will have long term benefits for those wanting TFTA items, even the aam janta will stop believing the rubbish that our media spins out..

disha · Post by **disha** » 16 Apr 2016 05:30

Excellent Fotus!!

But to rain on the parade., they are N-LCA and should go into that thread

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 16 Apr 2016 05:30

HAL seems to have homed in on the gripen NG style wing root landing gear and additional tanks for mk2. clearly they feel they need help else no need for the consultant.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 16 Apr 2016 07:20

Cybaru wrote:Fanne,

Very real. HDR is just a photo post processing technique. I love whats been done. A pic a month like this in common rag will have long term benefits for those wanting TFTA items, even the aam janta will stop believing the rubbish that our media spins out..

+1.3