Indian Missiles News & Discussions - May 2017

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 18 Sep 2018 10:15

We have got 4 light ATGMs in development now apart from Nag, Helina, Sant:-

Improved wire guided ATGM in which range has been improved from 1500m to 2500m. Amogha 1?

Radio Guided ATGM. Amogha 2?

Laser beam riding ATGM. SAMHO-CLGM

Nag Mini

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 18 Sep 2018 10:24

wire guided ATGM? why do we need that when laser beam and top attack IIR guided is more survivable?

wire guided is TOW era stuff. cutting edge - for the 80s.

even Milan is laser beam rider.

ks_sachin · Post by **ks_sachin** » 18 Sep 2018 12:13

There was a lot of wire left over from border fencing Singha.

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 18 Sep 2018 13:49

Other than propulsion & warhead, VEM Technologies, Hyderabad fabricated all the other subsystems of MPATGM in collaboration with DRDO.

https://t.co/9RJgvOdMlj

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 18 Sep 2018 14:43

Singha wrote:wire guided ATGM? why do we need that when laser beam and top attack IIR guided is more survivable?

wire guided is TOW era stuff. cutting edge - for the 80s.

even Milan is laser beam rider.

Milan is wire guided.

Kornet is laser guided. TOW 2 latest variant is TFTA RF guided, which is what Amogha 2 is.

Amogha, appears to be a desi Milan ... reverse eng.. err inspired.

Amogha 2 is a RF variant.

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 18 Sep 2018 15:06

I believe, Sjha monitor BRF regularly.

According to Indian DPSU, Bharat Dynamics Limited, besides the SACLOS Amogha-I & Amogha-II anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM), they are also developing an imaging infrared seeker equipped 3rd generation fire and forget ATGM called Amogha-III.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/1041961579397304320

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 18 Sep 2018 15:09

2 regiments of upgraded Akash Missile Systems cleared by DAC.

https://twitter.com/writetake/status/10 ... 4866073601

India's Defence Acquisition Council has approved the acquisition of two regiments of the upgraded Akash-1S surface to air missile for the Indian Army's Air Defence Corps. Akash-1S is equipped with a radio-frequency seeker that has proved its capability against PGMs in tests.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/1041962335441629184

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 18 Sep 2018 15:15

https://www.oneindia.com/india/dac-appr ... 78045.html

Pursuing the goal of indigenisation and self-reliance, the DAC approved procurement of two Regiments of Akash Missile Systems under 'Buy (Indian)' category from M/s BDL.

Looks like 2 regiments of Akash 1S with active seeker are being ordered

The DAC also accorded approval for progressing Design and Development of Individual Under Water Breathing Apparatus (IUWBA) for T 90 Tanks. Developed by DRDO Lab DEBEL, the IUWBA is used by the crew of Tanks as a safety gear and is required by the Tank crew for emergency escape when negotiating water obstacles while deep fording.

SO T-90 cant do deep fording which the Arjun was required under Army DSPR.

The DAC also accorded approval for Design and Development of Test Equipment for Guided Weapons System of T 90 Tank. The equipment is being developed by DRDO and will give an indigenous solution to the Test Equipment used for checking the Guided Weapon System of Tank T 90.

To check whether Invar is effective?

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 18 Sep 2018 23:04

Akash army Regiment price has fallen almost to half compared to previous Army order inspite of having a better missile & time inflation.

srin · Post by **srin** » 18 Sep 2018 23:34

Aditya_V wrote:https://www.oneindia.com/india/dac-appr ... 78045.html

Pursuing the goal of indigenisation and self-reliance, the DAC approved procurement of two Regiments of Akash Missile Systems under 'Buy (Indian)' category from M/s BDL.

Looks like 2 regiments of Akash 1S with active seeker are being ordered

From above link ...

The Missile to be procured is an upgraded version of the previously inducted Akash missiles and will include seeker technology, possess 360 degree coverage and will be of compact configuration with reduced signature.

I wonder what the reduced signature is ? Have they reduced the size of Akash ?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 19 Sep 2018 10:17

Good catch, didnt notice this and complete media silence on this aspect.

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 19 Sep 2018 10:48

ashishvikas wrote:I believe, Sjha monitor BRF regularly.

According to Indian DPSU, Bharat Dynamics Limited, besides the SACLOS Amogha-I & Amogha-II anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM), they are also developing an imaging infrared seeker equipped 3rd generation fire and forget ATGM called Amogha-III.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/1041961579397304320

He is a BRF member and is always welcome here!

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 19 Sep 2018 11:29

So what is the difference between Amogha -III and MP ATGM tested a few days ago?

JTull · Post by **JTull** » 19 Sep 2018 11:29

Aditya_V wrote:Good catch, didnt notice this and complete media silence on this aspect.

Wonder if Missiles with seeker do not require FCR. But I thought 1S is still be guided till it gets close to the target.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 19 Sep 2018 11:41

Seeker only complements comand guidance, seeker range against PGM's and cruise missiles besides airccraft will be just a 2 Kilometers.

mody · Post by **mody** » 19 Sep 2018 11:59

The news says that the Akash-1S has already been tested. However, no news of the tests have ever been posted.
Good news though that 2 additional regiments have been ordered for the Army.

Any news on the order for additional 7 squadrons for the IAF? Last heard, it was still under price negotiations. Any news if the same has been approved? Also, the 7 additional squadrons will be the 1S variant or the Akash-1 variant. As the 1S now seems to be ready for production, it would make more sense to go for the 1S variant.

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 19 Sep 2018 12:01

There was news on Akash 1S being tested for the last 2 years

Karan M · Post by **Karan M** » 19 Sep 2018 12:04

mody wrote:The news says that the Akash-1S has already been tested. However, no news of the tests have ever been posted.
Good news though that 2 additional regiments have been ordered for the Army.

Any news on the order for additional 7 squadrons for the IAF? Last heard, it was still under price negotiations. Any news if the same has been approved? Also, the 7 additional squadrons will be the 1S variant or the Akash-1 variant. As the 1S now seems to be ready for production, it would make more sense to go for the 1S variant.

where were you?

Gyan · Post by **Gyan** » 19 Sep 2018 16:20

Reduced signature can imply that RF seeker only requires intermediate updates compared to continuance guidance requirement for command guidance.

pkudva · Post by **pkudva** » 19 Sep 2018 21:42

Karan M wrote:
mody wrote:The news says that the Akash-1S has already been tested. However, no news of the tests have ever been posted.
Good news though that 2 additional regiments have been ordered for the Army.

Any news on the order for additional 7 squadrons for the IAF? Last heard, it was still under price negotiations. Any news if the same has been approved? Also, the 7 additional squadrons will be the 1S variant or the Akash-1 variant. As the 1S now seems to be ready for production, it would make more sense to go for the 1S variant.

where were you?

True to say, 7 Sqdrns of Akash were to be placed in early part of the Fiscal. Since then no news has been heard. Is it i the cold storage, CCS Approved or Contract Signed......No one has a Idea.

We see regular news on DAC approval , But Hardly any news is heard on the Contracts being signed. Is it a Budget Constraint, Technical Constraint or any other issue. Only time will say....This dispensation has limited time to issue Orders to domestic Players for crucial Programmes.

Indranil · Post by **Indranil** » 19 Sep 2018 22:54

"Reduced signature" is not for the missile. It is of the system. The logistical footprint of the entire system is much smaller that Akash Mk1.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 20 Sep 2018 03:05

Those inflatables work with WWII generation radars only. Every RV has a unique beta (Beta = Weight/(Cd*Reference area). What beta gives us if a unique signature as it reenters and only decoy that can mimic the beta of a RV is another RV of same configuration.

So those are useless balloons.

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 20 Sep 2018 03:15

https://twitter.com/strategic_front/sta ... 9654893568 ----> Godrej Aerospace built airframe assembly of the Air launched version of the BrahMos cruise missile (BrahMos-A) ordered by the Indian Air Force.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 20 Sep 2018 03:34

Good ops security. No one has their badges visible.

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 20 Sep 2018 09:27

ashishvikas wrote:I believe, Sjha monitor BRF regularly.

According to Indian DPSU, Bharat Dynamics Limited, besides the SACLOS Amogha-I & Amogha-II anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM), they are also developing an imaging infrared seeker equipped 3rd generation fire and forget ATGM called Amogha-III.

https://twitter.com/SJha1618/status/1041961579397304320

All Amoghas are 2nd generation ATGM missiles; i.e they are not Fire&Forget like 3rd generation ATGM.

BDL which has the experience of producing 2nd generation missiles like Konkur, Milan leveraged their expertise + some knowhow available through indigenous efforts like Nag ATGM.

It is part of impory substitution, to supply cheap alternatives to costly 3rd generation varities.

BDL has expertise in producing Milan 2T(range 2km).
Milan 2T further progressed into Milan 3(improved warhead), Milan 3 ADT (remote firing post) and finally to Milan ER /ADT (range extended to 3km).
If you compare, Amogha1 has range of 2.8 km, much like Milan ER but wire guided.
Amogha 2 with remote firing capability is similar to Milan ER/ADT. It was said at that time, as i could recall, there will be both RF&IR variants.
So Amogha 3 is most likely just the IR variant.

We lincense produced w ToT Milan 2. When Army needed better armour piercing round in bulk it went for Milan 2T. We again inked separate agreement for Milan 2T lincense production.

Rather than going further for Milan 3 and then to Milan ER/ADT in the same way as the Army requirement changes, BDL leveraging their inhouse expertise developed Amogha, cheap alternative to costly Nag type missile which is needed in bulk, much larger quantities as per Army requirement.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 20 Sep 2018 09:34

Are there any plans of inducting the Amogha series? Haven't seen much news about it

Kanson · Post by **Kanson** » 20 Sep 2018 10:20

Amogha 1 is their first attempt. They are progressing further to fulfill some of IA needs as per news.

ashishvikas · Post by **ashishvikas** » 20 Sep 2018 12:25

Here's what Bharat Dynamics Limited has to say about Amogha III.

https://t.co/VR9tZYr59L

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 20 Sep 2018 12:35

It would appear that we are fast approaching a situation where we are extremely well placed wrt 3rd gen ATGM. As we are with 155 mm arty.

KBDagha · Post by **KBDagha** » 20 Sep 2018 15:31

Prahaar test fired successfully. Source: #Hemant Rout @Twitter

arun · Post by **arun** » 20 Sep 2018 17:17

KBDagha wrote:Prahaar test fired successfully. Source: #Hemant Rout @Twitter

To go with his tweet, Rout’s article in New Indian Express.

Prahaar seems to have set a new standard for the proverbial ultra-slow motion glacial type testing programme

. First launch in July 21, 2011 and a full 7 plus years later this the second test launch:

India successfully test fires short-range tactical ballistic missile Prahaar

A Deshmukh · Post by **A Deshmukh** » 20 Sep 2018 17:41

arun wrote:
KBDagha wrote:Prahaar test fired successfully. Source: #Hemant Rout @Twitter
India successfully test fires short-range tactical ballistic missile Prahaar

Salients points:
- Solid fueled.
- range = 150km
- terminal accuracy < 10m
- canisterized. road mobile launcher - carrying 6 missiles.
- 7.3m long, 1.3 tonne wt, payload - 200kg

jaysimha · Post by **jaysimha** » 20 Sep 2018 17:47

IE todays photo,,

http://pib.nic.in/newsite/photoright.aspx?phid=35809
DRDO successfully launched surface to surface tactical missile ‘Prahaar’ from Chandipur Coast, ITR, Balasore, Orissa on July 21, 2011. photo

I think IE is posting the old pictures.

new photo yet to arrive...... may be....

Varoon Shekhar · Post by **Varoon Shekhar** » 20 Sep 2018 17:57

Is this the "Pralay" that was scheduled to be tested between Sept 20-22, or is that a separate test?

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 20 Sep 2018 18:04

Varoon Shekhar wrote:Is this the "Pralay" that was scheduled to be tested between Sept 20-22, or is that a separate test?

2 seperate missiles.

Kakarat · Post by **Kakarat** » 20 Sep 2018 18:23

https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1042751917208817670

FIRST PHOTOS: Today’s test of India’s Prahar tactical surface-to-surface missile.

JayS · Post by **JayS** » 20 Sep 2018 18:29

Good news. What kind of trajectory Prahaar follows...? I'm thinking its not pure ballastic one.

SSridhar · Post by **SSridhar** » 20 Sep 2018 18:42

Pratyush wrote:
Varoon Shekhar wrote:Is this the "Pralay" that was scheduled to be tested between Sept 20-22, or is that a separate test?

2 seperate missiles.

Prahar bridges the gap between Pinaka, a 40-km range multi-barrel rocket system, Smerch, a 90-km range MBRL system, and the 350-km Prithvi -II.

In June 2013, the new DRDO Chief Dr. Avinash Chander said that the earlier generation 150 Km range Prithvis (designated as P-1) would be replaced by the Prahaar missiles. He said, “We are withdrawing the tactical 150 km-range Prithvi missiles and will replace them with the Prahar missiles, which are more capable and have more accuracy”. This would extend the range of the Indian artillery corps to 150 Kms instead of the present 90 Kms determined by Smerch / Pinaka.

Pralay is a PDV derivative with a longer range (500 Kms) and more a China-oriented missile.

nam · Post by **nam** » 20 Sep 2018 18:42

If Prahaar gets inducted, then we can be sure that AAD is getting deployed.

Inducting in to IA, would be the best way to reduce the cost of AAD and make it economic to deploy. And given that both AAD & prahaar will be similar, we can hide our BMD in the open.

If Pralay is a derivative of PDV, then again it also makes it economical.

Trikaal · Post by **Trikaal** » 20 Sep 2018 20:39

Is Prahar India's response to Nasr? Tactical nuke missile. I remember reading about this ages ago.