Terroristan - October 8, 2018

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Y. Kanan » 19 Mar 2019 14:51

Peregrine wrote:Western powers could also blacklist Azhar by adopting a Security Council resolution, which needs nine votes in favour and no vetoes by Russia, China, the United States, Britain or France. Already blacklisted by the UN Security Council in 2001, JeM is a primarily anti-India group.


IMO this is a prelude to how Russia will eventually get maneuvered into choosing China (thus: choosing Pakistan) over India in some future incident. It is unfortunate to see Russia, over time, getting effectively cornered into the situation of needing to strategically pick the Chinese over us, but we can see where things are heading.

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 19 Mar 2019 17:58

X Posted on the P E S WE Thread

World Bank sees Pakistan's potential to be a $2tr economy - Shahbaz Rana
ISLAMABAD: Pakistan could become a $2 trillion economy in the next 28 years if it remains steadfast in its reforms and manages to reduce its population growth rate to 1.2%

“With sustained reforms, Pakistan could be a $2 trillion economy when it will turn 100 in the next 28 years,” said the World Bank (WB) Country Director Patchamuthu Illangovan while sharing the main findings of the ‘Pakistan @100- Sharing the Future 2047′ report on Monday.

“The $2 trillion economy means an upper middle-income country where per capita income will be $5,702 but it will have to halve its population growth rate to 1.2% by 2047,” he added.

However, business, as usual, would mean that the size of Pakistan’s economy will be only $1 trillion and the per capita income will be just $2110. By 2047, Pakistan’s population will be 376 million at current growth rate, said the country director. The size of Pakistan’s economy is now only $275 billion.
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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 19 Mar 2019 18:13

'Proliferation of Pakistani N-programme a threat for US'

WASHINGTON: The US Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, has said that there are five big issues that threaten the American security and one of them is proliferation of Pakistan’s nuclear programme.

Counting the five threats the US is facing, while giving an interview to an American radio broadcaster, the US secretary of state said: “It's the threat that we've talked about today from China, the nuclear proliferation risk that extends from Pakistan, through all those folks who have these weapon systems places like North Korea where they can sell these weapons. I think I'm at five already but I could give you a whole list of threats that I think we can effect change on in a way that will really make a difference for the security of the American people.”

He blamed Pakistan for providing safe havens to terrorists, adding that no other administration but the current administration had taken some action against Pakistan on the issue. He said he personally took terrorism very seriously because he had lost a lot of friends in the war against terror.

“Well we've taken actions … against Pakistan that no other administration has taken. ... We need Pakistan to do more. They have to stop harboring this terror. We saw what happened with India. The conflict that rose there as a result of terrorist that departed from Pakistan. ... They need to stop harbouring terrorists.”

Pompeo said the US Administration has learnt a lot from the 9/11 terror attack and put pressure on the Pakistan government to do more.

Commenting on the recent conflict between Pakistan and India, the secretary said it was initiated because of the cross-border terrorism. He emphasised on Pakistan to take further action against such terrorists and stop providing alleged safe havens to them.

Replying to a question regarding the Taliban’s relationship with al-Qaeda and the recent talks with the Taliban leadership in Afghanistan, Pompeo said he cannot say anything definite about the issue. He said the US is working for final resolution of the issue in Afghanistan and trying to take steps for political reconciliation.

Pompeo said that Zalmay Khalilzad went to Doha for talks and returned yesterday, adding that there were some advancement in talks on the issue of Taliban and the Afghan government. He said the US wanted both should talk to each other to resolve the issue.

“There's no deal at thispoint. We don't have final resolution there but we are working towards a political reconciliation. We've been hard at it Ambassador Khalilzad has been on the ground in Doha for six or eight days back I think yesterday. We've made some progress both with the Afghan government and with the Taliban. We now need them to talk to each other. President's made clear his objective here he wants to end this endless war. But he wants to do it in a way that we don't increase risk to the United States from terror acts coming from Afghanistan. I believe we can achieve both of those groups,” Pompeo said.

Talking about US President, Pompeo said Trump wanted to end the war but he also wanted to ensure no terror attack should ever take place in future on America.

Talking about the recent attacks of the Taliban on Afghan forces, in which 50 Afghan personnel were abducted and one week before that at least 70 were killed, the secretary of state said that such attacks did not weaken the position of the coalition and Afghan forces. He said he knew who are sitting in front of the table for peace talks, saying but they want America to be safe.

Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said the United States and North Korea are trying to get the "sequencing" right in talks to end the regime's nuclear weapons program and open a brighter future for the country.

"I can't say much about the details of the negotiation as those are important private conversations," the top US diplomat said, when asked about the failure to produce an agreement at last month's summit between President Donald Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong-un. "But it's clearly a range of issues around timing and sequencing and how it is we achieve this." He said Trump's commitment to a brighter future for the North Korean people is "very, very real."

"But it must follow -- it has to follow the verified denuclearisation of North Korea," he said. "And getting that sequencing right and getting it laid out in a way that each of the parties can agree to and take down the tension level along the North and South Korean border, it matters to the people of Japan and South Korea, our important partners, and it matters to the whole world."

Trump and Kim met in Hanoi, Vietnam, Feb. 27 and 28 to flesh out an agreement they reached at their first summit in Singapore in June. The agreement committed the North to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula in exchange for security guarantees from the US. The second summit ended with no deal due to disagreements over the extent of North Korea's denuclearization and US sanctions relief.

"We believe we're still moving forward. It's certainly difficult -- we knew it would be," Pompeo. "We made a little bit more progress in Hanoi, now three weeks back, when President Trump traveled there to meet with Chairman Kim. We'll re-engage with him," he said.

"We still haven't made the progress we need to make on denuclearisation. The conversations certainly continue. I hope we can achieve that," he added, noting that was Kim's "promise" to the world at his summit with Trump in Singapore.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby saip » 19 Mar 2019 21:07

Comparison of Paki economy with India's. Today, with pk rupee devaluation, Paki economy is probably 7% of India's.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby sanjaykumar » 19 Mar 2019 22:12

Does this mean grazes e Hind has been postponed?

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 20 Mar 2019 04:16

Pakistan in 2047 – EDITORIAL

In its latest policy report, titled Pakistan@100: Shaping the Future, the World Bank (WB) has stated that by 2047 — when Pakistan turns 100 — the country will have to significantly reduce spending on defence and bring down the population growth rate by half. The report adds that the country must divert its resources on investment on its citizenry and double what it currently spends on education and healthcare. The WB warns that failure to do so could result in Pakistan finding itself stuck where it is right now 28 years later.

Meeting these challenges will not be easy. The recent post-Pulwama attack hostilities with India may have been a diplomatic and media victory for the Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) government, but also showed that resolving the Kashmir issue remains a distant dream. It is necessary to point out here that despite the large chunk of the Pakistani GDP that is spent on defence, India’s defence expenditure is seven 4.5 times higher. Considering that India has a much larger economy as well, this is an arms race that Pakistan cannot win, and will prevent the country from making the human investment required to significantly improve the quality of life of Pakistani citizens.

The WB has also pointed out that Pakistan cannot rejuvenate its economy and bring the population growth rate under control without emancipating its women. Not only will this result in more women joining the workforce, it is also necessary for bringing down the country’s present fertility rate. However, as recent online reactions to the countrywide Aurat Marches on International Women’s Day show, sexism and misogyny remain deeply entrenched in Pakistani society. This will have to be addressed politically, as well as through the education system.

The environment is also a key concern. Pakistan is currently threatened by acute water shortage, but despite this its economic model remains highly inefficient in terms of managing the country’s water. 80 percent of the country’s water irrigates crops that generate less than five percent of the national economy. Its irrigation system is also considered by and large the most inefficient in the world. Pakistan needs better infrastructure management and pricing that reflects the country’s situation in terms of water if it is to avoid becoming a water-scarce country in the coming years.

One hopes that Pakistan’s civilian and military leaders have had a glance at the WB’s report. Because unless our leaders stop strategising in terms of short-term political gains and strategic advances against our neighbours, any improvement in the lives of Pakistani citizens will be marginal at best. *

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 20 Mar 2019 04:56

China terms Mumbai attacks as one of the "most notorious" terrorist attacks – PTI

BEIJING: In a rare acknowledgment, China on Monday described the 2008 Mumbai attacks carried out by Pakistan-based LeT terror outfit as one of "the most notorious terrorist attacks".

In a white paper on its massive crackdown against militants in the restive Xianjiang province, China said the global spread of terrorism and extremism over the years had inflicted agony on humanity.

The paper described the Mumbai terror attacks as one of "the most notorious terrorist attacks", adding that the "global spread of terrorism and extremism over the years has inflicted agony on humanity".

The release of the paper titled "The Fight Against Terrorism and Extremism and Human Rights Protection in Xinjiang", interestingly coincided with foreign minister's Shah Mehmood Qureshi's visit to China.

Throughout the world, terrorism and extremism gravely threaten peace and development, and endanger the life and property of individuals, said the white paper released by China's State Council Information Office.

The paper came days after China for the fourth time blocked a bid in the United Nations Security Council on Wednesday to designate Pakistan-based chief of Jaish-e-Mohammed (JeM) terror group Masood Azhar as a "global terrorist" by putting a technical hold on the proposal, a move India termed as disappointing.

The JeM has claimed responsibility for the February 14 Pulwama attack that left 40 CRPF personnel dead and escalated tensions between India and Pakistan.

"Striking aggressively at terrorism and furthering the de-radicalisation effort is the common responsibility of the international community and essential to the protection of human rights," it said.

China opposes all forms of terrorism and extremism, and opposes double standards on fighting terrorism, said the white paper, adding that Beijing opposes linking terrorism and extremism with specific countries, ethnic groups or religions.

China advocates comprehensive measures to address both the symptoms and the root causes, with the dual purposes of striking at terrorist activities and eliminating poverty, so that there will be no room for terrorism to breed, it said.

In one of the most horrific terrorist attacks in the country's history, 166 people, including Americans, were killed and over 300 injured as 10 heavily-armed terrorists from Lashkar-e-Taiba (LeT) created mayhem in Mumbai on November 26, 2008.

Nine of the attackers were killed by police while lone survivor Ajmal Kasab was captured and hanged after handed down death sentence by an Indian court.

Perpetrators of the 26/11 attack, including its mastermind and banned Jamat-ud Dawa (JuD) chief Hafiz Saeed, continue to roam freely in Pakistan.

The US has offered a USD 10 mn reward for information that brings Saeed to justice.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby arun » 20 Mar 2019 15:07

X Posted from the Balwaristan thread.

People of Gilgit-Baltistan are Indians, Pakistan has no right there, says activist Senge Sering :

Clicky India Today

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 20 Mar 2019 16:13

X Posted on Neutering & Defanging Chinese Threat & Analyzing CPEC Threads

India signals to boycott China's Belt and Road Forum for 2nd time – PTI

BEIJING: India on Wednesday signalled that it will boycott China's second Belt and Road Forum for a second time, saying no country can participate in an initiative that ignores its core concerns on sovereignty and territorial integrity.

India boycotted the first Belt and Road Forum (BRF) in 2017 after protesting to Beijing over the controversial China-Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) which is being laid through the Pakistan-occupied Kashmir (PoK) overriding New Delhi's sovereignty concerns.

Chinese foreign minister Wang Yi recently said that next month China plans to hold a much bigger, second BRF which will also be attended by Pakistan Prime Minster Imran Khan.

Speculation is rife whether India would attend the second BRF as China has deepened its commitment to expand the $60 billion CPEC, which aims to connect China's Xinjiang province with Pakistan's Gwadar port with a host of road, rail, gas and oil pipelines.

China has also undertaken a host of energy projects under the aegis of the CPEC.

India's ambassador to China Vikram Misri told the state-run Global Times that "above all, connectivity initiatives must be pursued in a manner that respects sovereignty, equality and territorial integrity of nations".

"No country can participate in an initiative that ignores its core concerns on sovereignty and territorial integrity," he replied to a question about India's concerns over the BRI and whether India would take part in the second BRF meet.

The Indian envoy's interview was carried by the daily on Wednesday.

"To be honest, we have made no secret of our views and our position on the BRI is clear and consistent and one that we have conveyed to the authorities concerned.

"India shares the global aspiration to strengthen connectivity and it is an integral part of our economic and diplomatic initiatives. We ourselves are working with many countries and international institutions in our region and beyond on a range of connectivity initiatives," Misri said.

"However, it is also our belief that connectivity initiatives must be based on universally recognised international norms, good governance and rule of law. They must emphasise social stability and environmental protection and preservation, promote skill and technology transfers and follow principles of openness, transparency and financial sustainability," the Indian envoy said.

India along with the US and several other countries have been highlighting the concerns over the BRI projects, leaving a number of smaller countries in debt traps.

The concerns grew louder after China took over Sri Lanka's Hambantota port on a 99-year lease as debt swap. Several countries including Malaysia and even Pakistan have wished to reduce the Chinese projects over debt concerns.

Asked whether India-China ties are back on track, Misri said: "the bilateral relationship between India and China is of great significance not just to the two countries, but also to the larger region and the international community".

He said that the Wuhan summit between Prime Minister Narendra Modi and President Xi Jinping in April, 2018 was a "milestone in bilateral relations during which the two leaders exchanged views on overarching issues of bilateral and global importance, and elaborated their respective visions and priorities for national development in context of the current international situation".

Last year, the two leaders also met on the sidelines of multilateral summits.

"These meetings have reinforced strategic communication between the two countries at the highest levels and helped in elaborating a road map for continuing contacts. China is India's biggest neighbour and we assign a very high priority to this relationship," the Indian envoy said.

"Unlike some 50 years ago, when our relationship had a much narrower basis and there was not much communication, today we have what one would call a full spectrum relationship.

"This has been possible because our respective leaders have realised that mutually-beneficial cooperation responds to the most urgent developmental needs of our people and these needs to be prioritised over other issues," Misri said.

Asked about the impact of India's elections on India-China ties, Misri said: "my own feeling is that on foreign policy issues there is a broad political consensus in India on where our national interests lie. I do not think therefore that the outcome of the elections will impact the broad contours of India's foreign policy in general or the very important relationship with China in particular".

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Vivasvat » 20 Mar 2019 18:22


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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 20 Mar 2019 20:48

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 21 Mar 2019 01:22

The weakening rupee – Editorial

Down, down, down the rupee goes; where it will stop, nobody knows. But there have been estimates. A financial analyst told this newspaper that the rupee will fall to Rs150 by the end of the year,[/url] but even he couldn’t say whether the expected decline would be gradual or more of a crash.

At the same time, plans are afoot to allow for a free currency float which would only be a good thing if the government can cut non-essential imports that are more significant than cheese. What is clear is that the government’s financial planners are now trying to play this as a good thing, pointing to the reduction in the current account deficit in recent months and the inflow of foreign loans from the Middle East.

But what they are refusing to do is admit that their pre-election economic promises were hollow, and Pakistan will keep suckling at the teat of the IMF for many years to come, because the money to pay back all of those foreign loans has to come from somewhere, and it definitely won’t come from the Pakistani economy, which even the State Bank admits will fail to get anywhere close to the 6% growth target set for this year.

Meanwhile, Revenue Minister Hammad Azhar has been trying to deflect the conversation to a familiar talking point — assets abroad. This has been a go-to point for every federal government when confronted with the question of ‘Why can’t you fix the economy?’ Yet no action is taken to reform the agriculture sector because of the harm it will inflict on millions of poor farmers. Yet, those gaining the most from bad agriculture policies are the multi-billionaire ‘farmers’ who are financing every major political party in the country.

The government is a vanity investor that lets bad businesses bleed money while calling them symbols of national pride. This often directly and indirectly helps individual ‘board members’ of the day, but the shareholders keep losing. And apparently all is fine with that because we keep repeating the same strategies.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Rudradev » 21 Mar 2019 03:00

Unmentionable Forum has a thread:

A poll of 2,000 Chinese respondents was conducted on Chinese social media platform We Chat, regarding Christchurch Mosque shooting.

81% of them sympathize with Brenton Tarrant, the NZ Mosque Shooter :mrgreen:

56%: a LOT of sympathy :D

25%: some sympathy

15%: don't know.can't say

Only 4% opposed the shooter!

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby abhishek_sharma » 21 Mar 2019 04:59

This website has PDFs of many books on Pakistan.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby K Mehta » 21 Mar 2019 10:35

abhishek_sharma wrote:This website has PDFs of many books on Pakistan.

Thank you. It has many good books. I got the ebook of who owns bakistan

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 21 Mar 2019 15:17

US to Pakistan: Further terror attack on India will be extremely problematic PTI

WASHINGTON: The United States has asked Pakistan to take sustained, verifiable and irreversible action against the perpetrators of terrorism, while warning the country that another terror attack on India will prove to be "extremely problematic".

"We need to see Pakistan taking concrete and sustained action to reign in the terrorist groups, mainly the Jaish-e-Mohammed and the Lashkar-e-Taiba in order to ensure that we don't have re-escalation (of tension) in the region," a senior administration official told reporters at the White House on Wednesday.

"And, if there's any additional terrorist attack without Pakistan having made a sustained, sincere effort against these groups, it would be extremely problematic for Pakistan and it would cause re-escalation of tensions, which is dangerous for both countries," the official said on the condition of anonymity.

Asked about the steps being taken by Pakistan in the aftermath of the Balakot air strike by Indian fighter jets, the official said the US and the international community needed to see "irreversible and sustained" action against the terror groups.

"It's early to make a full assessment," the official said.

In the recent days, the official said Pakistan has taken some "initial" actions. They have frozen the assets of some terrorist groups and made some arrests. They have taken administrative control of some of the JeM facilities, the official added.

"But we clearly need to see more. We need to see irreversible action because in the past, what we've seen is they made some arrests and then a few months later, they released these individuals. The terrorist leaders are sometimes still allowed to travel around the country, hold rallies," the official said.

Reiterating that the United States is looking for "irreversible action", the official said America is working with its international partners to increase pressure on Pakistan. "Because it has been too long that these groups have been able to operate."

Observing that Pakistan has economic concerns as well, the official said the Financial Action Tasks Force (FATF) is one area which demonstrates the need for them to take these actions against terror groups. "Otherwise, they're at risk within the system and the FATF to be grey-listed," the official said.

Pakistan needs to decide if it wants to be viewed as a responsible international player and have access to all the financial mechanisms that are available or is it going to continue to fail to take the steps necessary against these terrorist groups and see itself further isolated. "The choice is Pakistan's," the senior administration official asserted.

While the situation between the two south Asian neighbours have de-escalated, the two armies are still on high alert and that concerns the US, the official said.

"So, we realize that if there, God forbid, would be another terrorist attack that you could quickly see the escalation in the situation once again. So that's why, we're making clear that any additional military action by either side runs an unacceptably high risk, for both countries and for the region," the official said.

The Trump administration, the official said, has taken sort of a "zero tolerance policy" on the issue of safe havens to terrorists.

"The terrorist attack on February 14th on India was a demonstration that Pakistan's continuing provision of sanctuary for any terrorist group is not acceptable," the official said.

During the height of the crisis -- February 26-28 -- the United States was in continuous contact with Indian and Pakistani officials, both on the ground in New Delhi and Islamabad.

"They were working the phones continuously and were deeply engaged in seeking to deescalate what was a very dangerous moment in India-Pakistan relations," the official said.

The United States has also reached out to influential countries to have them help deescalate the situation, the senior administration official said.

Some of these countries are China, Saudi Arabia, the UAE, Qatar, the United Kingdom, the European Union, Japan and Australia.

In Video: Another attack on India will be problematic: US warns Pak

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 22 Mar 2019 17:38


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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 22 Mar 2019 20:23

An old but still pertinent Topic

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sS28sqZkdo



KLF-2014: Book Launch: What’s Wrong with Pakistan? by Babar Ayaz (9.2.2014)

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby banrjeer » 22 Mar 2019 21:31

what's wrong with Pakistan is whats wrong with India:

the reason the people of the subcontinent adopted an Alien religion and culture: India's social system could not ensure their security(butchering and terror faced by kafirs). Also there was upward mobility if you converted(Jiziya and potential interest free loans for the converted)

They are naturally traumatized and sneer at the mother ship of weakness. On top of that Indian society rejected the converts in a shortsighted manner over the ages and created a compounding security threat that we face today.

India's behaviour both in the preindustrial era and modern times have reinforced those assumptions.

We see shades of that even now with terms of derision heaped on the "aam Abduls". We should kill but not insult.
This will fill the void in their subconscious.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby banrjeer » 22 Mar 2019 21:33

and tactical victory like winning a war is not enough.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby saip » 23 Mar 2019 10:29

What is this guy blabbering claiming that India closed its airspace first and then Pakistan followed.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Aditya_V » 23 Mar 2019 11:36

saip wrote:What is this guy blabbering claiming that India closed its airspace first and then Pakistan followed.

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H&D can't admit its Pakistan which has closed its airspace

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Rahul M » 23 Mar 2019 12:10

saip wrote:What is this guy blabbering claiming that India closed its airspace first and then Pakistan followed.

Link

well, he is right on a technicality. India did close its northern airspace (north of Delhi) on the day of the Mig-21/F-16 incident and IIRC the announcement came before the pakis made theirs.

However, it was only for a few hours, half a day at most while pakis have continued to do so and still have many restrictions.

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 23 Mar 2019 17:44

X Posted on the P E S W Thread

Rupee hits record low at 140.24 against US dollar
KARACHI: In line with market expectations, the rupee hit a new record low at 140.24 to the US dollar in the inter-bank market on Friday on speculation that Pakistan had agreed with the International Monetary Fund (IMF) to let the currency depreciate ahead of obtaining a bailout.
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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 23 Mar 2019 18:16

Pakistan’s terrified Christians - Pervez Hoodbhoy

The prime minister and people of New Zealand have put before us gold-plated standards of decency, compassion, and firmness against religious terrorism. Their response to last week’s horrific mosque massacres in Christchurch was exemplary. Many countries need to learn from New Zealand, Pakistan more than most.

Donning a black chadar, 38-year-old Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern was visibly sorrowing as she tightly hugged the bereaved women around her. Muslims are not others, she said. Referring to the dead, she spoke of them simply but poignantly, “they are us”. To the Australian killer: “You may have chosen us — we utterly reject and condemn you.” Without the Bible and without reference to God, Ardern had been sworn into the prime minister’s office just 18 months ago. She says it is compassion that matters, not religion.

From end to end, her country also mourned. Newspapers reported florists running out of wreaths to be placed outside the two attacked mosques; donations for afflicted Muslim families poured in; churches held special services; and candle-light vigils were everywhere. An angered white teenage boy successfully landed an egg on the face of a far-right Australian senator who had blamed the Christchurch attack upon Muslim immigration into New Zealand. The senator promptly punched him — a punch that the youth will probably forever treasure.

Compare New Zealand’s reaction with the aftermath of every mass killing in Pakistan. With the sole exception of the Peshawar Army Public School massacre in December 2014 carried out by the TTP, I am unaware of any other atrocity inspiring significant public grief and outrage.

One hopes for the day when Pakistan has a prime minister like New Zealand’s Jacinda Ardern.

None was evident after a simultaneous attack in May 2010 upon two Ahmadi worship places in Lahore that left 94 dead. No ministers, politicians or other prominent figures hugged the bereaved ones. Shahbaz Sharif, the then Punjab chief minister, chose not to visit the Ahmadi community. However, his elder brother Nawaz Sharif called them our “brothers and sisters”, instantly drawing condemnation from many within his own party. Although one of the accused attackers was overpowered and handed to the police by unarmed worshippers, he was subsequently released.

In numerical terms, the two back-to-back suicide bombings on Peshawar’s All Saints Church in September 2013 were still more gruesome. They left 127 dead — more than two and a half times the number at Christchurch. Commiserations by national leaders rang hollow. Imran Khan, standing outside the bombed-out church, told the survivors that calamity had visited them because of US drone strikes. He said that to prevent still more such attacks Pakistan should negotiate with the TTP (which claimed the church bombing).

How can we know which of Pakistan’s minorities — Ahmadi, Christian, Hazara, Hindu, Shia — has had the roughest deal? One measure of desperation is the extent to which a minority avoids the mainstream and pursues anonymity. Nothing speaks more eloquently to this than the naming of newborns nowadays.

Take Christians. Back in the 1950s the names of Karachi’s Christians, including those in my Garden East neighbourhood, were usually biblically derived. Boys could be Jacob, Joseph, Michael, Paul, Peter, Robert, etc. Girls were often Mary, Pauline, Rachel, Rita, Ruth, etc. But no longer — Christian parents are opting for safety: Emaan, Hina, Iqbal, Maryum, Naveed, Saima, Shafqat, Shahbaz etc. Survival in a hostile milieu demands camouflaging.

But earlier this month, even this dissimulation did not work for one happily married Christian couple with three children, with the entire family having non-Christian specific names. (Dawn’s policy does not allow identification of the rape victim.) Little did they know of the hell that lay in wait. A sexual predator in their Islamabad neighbourhood stalked the wife but was rebuffed by her. With pistol in hand, and with an accomplice, the man later entered their house and abducted her. The police initially refused to register an FIR or recover her, eventually acting only under pressure.

Two weeks later the distraught and disoriented woman was shifted to a Dar-ul-Aman. With severe visible bruises, she says she had been raped for a full 10 days. The police refused the husband’s request for a medical inquiry because, according to the signed evidence, she had converted to Islam and was now one of the abductor’s wives.

This has made the problem infinitely more serious since the woman cannot now legally revert to being a Christian. That she signed the conversion document under duress may or may not matter. The courts, of course, will have to decide. But, given the slowness of such trials, this may take from many months to many years. Meanwhile the family is in hiding and the predator roams freely.

Let us step back and reflect for a moment: in a population of 220 million, there are bound to be egregious examples of wrongdoing; a wider judgement from any single example is unwarranted. A more reliable guide is the extent to which people around demonstrate empathy, and how a religious minority perceives itself positioned in the society. Sadly, this too does not look promising.

At a rally last Saturday (March 16) at the Islamabad Press Club protesting the recent abduction just a few dozen people — mostly Christians — turned up. Speaker after speaker claimed that Christians didn’t deserve this mistreatment because “we too had fought for Pakistan”. Just as unconvincing and pathetic were their appeals to the so-called “Quaid’s Pakistan” and his Aug 11, 1947, speech. But let us not blame these desperate people for clutching at straws; Pakistan’s minorities live under the boot of the majority and know they cannot speak the truth.

If there was a slight ray of hope, it came from one solitary bearded imam from the same neighbourhood of Islamabad as the victims. Forced conversions go against Islam, he said, citing the Quranic verse containing “la ikraha-fi-din” (there is no compulsion in religion). One wonders how far this line of argument will go towards easing the family’s anguish.

As structures of hate proliferate across the world, one desperately looks around for those who can intelligently use love and sympathy as tools to dismantle them. I much hope someone someday will think of nominating Jacinda Ardern for the Nobel Peace Prize. And I hope that someday Pakistan too will have a prime minister like her. Even a Snow Flake would have a Better Chance of Survival in Hell!

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 23 Mar 2019 19:30

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 23 Mar 2019 20:34

saip wrote:Comparison of Paki economy with India's. Today, with pk rupee devaluation, Paki economy is probably 7% of India's.

Link


In the five-decade period between 1963 and 2002, India generally grew slower than Pakistan, yet there were six instances of India’s annual economic growth exceeding the size of Pakistan’s entire economy.

More worryingly for the strategist, in the 15 years since 2003, India has achieved this feat nine times.


When this happens every year, then Pakistan is completely done for. It is not far in the future.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 23 Mar 2019 21:08

Aaj Kal Ka Zamana - an English comic book by the World Bank, apparently to try to drive some sense into Pakistanis.
https://openknowledge.worldbank.org/bit ... Zamana.pdf

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 23 Mar 2019 21:19

Pakistan will reject any World Bank advice, I think because the Pakistan@100 report contains this:

Imagine a Pakistan that is a major regional trading hub, acting as a logistics corridor connecting the two economic powerhouses on its doorstep, India and China. Imagine a Pakistan open to global markets and integrated in global value chains, tripling its regional trade. Imagine Lahore and New Delhi connected by a state-of-the-art high-speed rail link, allowing people to travel between the cities in less than 3 hours, instead of the 18-20 hours it can take today. Indeed, imagining a deep and mutually beneficial relationship between Pakistan and India is of paramount importance to Pakistan's further growth, prosperity and security, especially given that India could become one of the largest economies in the world by the middle of the century.

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 23 Mar 2019 23:37

Fellow B-RFites:

Found an Old Currency Rate Table

PACIFIC Exchange Rate Service

Foreign Currency Units per 1 U.S. Dollar, 1950-2019

1950 : U S Dollar 1 = INDIAN RUPEES 4.76 - PAKISTANI RUPEES =3.3085

NOW- : U S Dollar 1 = INDIAN RUPEES 68.96 = PAKISTANI RUPEES =141.30

DEPRECIATION RATE= INDIAN RUPEES 14.49 = PAKISTANI RUPEES = 042.71


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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby arun » 24 Mar 2019 00:15

X Posted from the Islamism thread.

Al La Ham Sandwich!

Big noise Mohammadden political party leader of Jamiat Ulema-e Islam (F), Fazlur Rehman, complete with Mohammadden thought leader title of “Maulana”, in the Mohammadden Terrorism Fomenting Islamic Republic of Pakistan, declares participation of women in a marathon event as “obscene”.

Any guess on what has triggered this “obscene” charge by the Maulana? Heavy Breathing Women? Bouncing Breasts? Bare skinned exposed Legs? Something not listed? ………………

Is it halal to declare an event like a marathon in which women participate as haram and incite pious momin males to indulge in presumably haram things?

Maulana Fazlur Rehman incites vigilante action against Marathon event

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby gakakkad » 24 Mar 2019 01:36

A_Gupta wrote:
saip wrote:Comparison of Paki economy with India's. Today, with pk rupee devaluation, Paki economy is probably 7% of India's.

Link


In the five-decade period between 1963 and 2002, India generally grew slower than Pakistan, yet there were six instances of India’s annual economic growth exceeding the size of Pakistan’s entire economy.

More worryingly for the strategist, in the 15 years since 2003, India has achieved this feat nine times.


When this happens every year, then Pakistan is completely done for. It is not far in the future.


By 2030 we ll add a Pakistan every couple of months or less.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Mort Walker » 24 Mar 2019 02:13

gakakkad wrote:
By 2030 we ll add a Pakistan every couple of months or less.



You are mistaken. I really don't like comparing India to garbage, as the comparison should be with Germany, Japan and China. It will be in the next 3 years assuming Pakistan's economy does well and there is no further devaluation to PKR. If there is currency devaluation it will happen this year or next year depending on India's performance.

Pakistan nominal GDP 2018 in USD = $278 billion
India nominal GDP 2018 in USD = $2,848 billion

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 24 Mar 2019 16:56

Malaysia won’t take sides in Pak-India tension: Mahathir - Sabir Shah

ISLAMABAD: The Malaysian Prime Minister, Dr Mahathir Mohamad, has said Malaysia appreciates and will continue to maintain its good relationships with Pakistan and India but won’t take sides with anyone in the event of conflict.

Dr Mahathir said by taking such a stand, it also illustrated indirectly that his three-day official visit to Pakistan did not mean that Malaysia had chosen its side. “We cannot side with anyone. I think this, allowing terrorists to have this upper hand, is very dangerous. We must stop terrorists, both sides (Pakistan and India) must prevent acts of terrorism. When terrorists fight, they just want to take revenge,” he said. “They (terrorists) cannot conquer. What can they do?...kill people. Is that what humanity is fated for? We don’t want to take sides with anyone, but we appreciate the problems they face,” he said at a press conference at Nur Khan Airbase before leaving for Malaysia after concluding his visit to Pakistan.

The Malaysian prime minister also said the over-reliance of the Islamic countries on the developed nations has caused them to be afraid to protest against any wrongful actions by Western countries. He said because of this, they had to abide by what the Western countries did. “Islamic countries are too dependent on the developed nations for everything. Their ability is limited. Due to the strong support for Israel by Western countries, Islamic nations are scared to condemn Israel, and of Western countries taking action against them,” he said.

Mahathir said Malaysian delegation came to know about the wonderful capabilities of Pakistanis during the visit. He said if Pakistanis can build JF-17 Thunder aircraft and military vehicles then they can achieve anything. Replying to a question on national car producer Proton’s joint-venture to establish a manufacturing assembly plant in Pakistan, the Prime Minister said it is better for Proton to enter markets like Pakistan rather than developed countries. “When they (Pakistan) agreed with us to the proposal to manufacture our (Proton) cars, I felt it was a good thing. If they could produce military vehicles, I don’t think other types of vehicles would be much of a problem,” he said. “There are many fields... but (before this), we did not know of their capabilities and they did not know of our capabilities. Only when we are here, can we see their strengths. Their population is 210 million, we are 32 million. If we (with a population of 32 million) can make (our own) cars, they can do a lot more,” Mahathir explained. Mahathir said he knows Pakistan would like to sell their planes to Malaysia. “Everybody wants to sell planes to us. Give us one or two planes so that we can see (gauge them). (Besides that) some of the vessels, land vehicles were built by them. I don’t know how strong the Pakistani army is, and (if) those missiles can carry nuclear warheads, people will think twice about attacking Pakistan,” he said.

Asked on his discussions with Prime Minister Imran Khan on his efforts to fight corruption, Mahathir said both nations were facing the same problems in taking to court “people from the past (government) who are corrupt”. “They (Pakistan) want to take action against people from the past (government) who are corrupt but they find it difficult to get hearings in the court. They have a problem with that. We, too, have a problem because it looks like the courts have their own ideas about how serious this matter (is). As a result, we have not made much progress. We have taken cases to the courts but there are no trials,” he said. Before leaving Islamabad, the Malaysian prime minister was briefed on JF-17 Thunder jets. According to reports, Malaysia has shown interest in the Pakistani fighter plane which was built in cooperation with China. Prime Minister Imran Khan was present at The Nur Khan Airbase to see off his Malaysian counterpart.

Meanwhile, Mahathir Mohamad in a TV interview appreciated Pakistan for eradicating terrorism. Mahathir said enhanced people-to-people contacts and exchanges by promoting tourism are vital for strengthening bilateral relations and cooperation between Pakistan and Malaysia in diverse areas, including trade, economy and investment. “Pakistan has a lot of natural resources, so has Malaysia and the countries can complement each other,” he said in the interview.

The Malaysian prime minister, who concluded his three-day state visit to Pakistan on Saturday, said he was happy over the visit, which provided him an opportunity to interact with the Pakistani leadership and identify the areas of trade and economic cooperation between the two countries. He mentioned peace and stability coupled with the measures of promoting tourism as prerequisites for any country to achieve economic progress and development. Mahathir mentioned the huge number of tourists attracted every year to Malaysia, which had only 32 million population, and said he felt comfortable during his stay in Pakistan, which had all the ingredients to promote tourism and tap its potential.

Besides punishments, he said the menace of corruption could also be tackled by promoting ethical and religious values in the society. He, however, added that leaders must not be corrupt, if they were then it was very difficult to check the menace. To a question about Islamophobia, the Malaysian prime minister said, "Islam being a religion of peace taught us not to fight, kill or indulge in violence. We need to find out what we have done wrong.” At the same time, he said, media should not be allowed to be used by the people, who had no knowledge about Islam.

Mahathir also spoke about how his country, which was an agrarian society, achieved socio-economic progress and development through increased industrialisation by attracting local and foreign investors. He said for industrialisation, foreign investors are offered various incentives, which later enabled his country’s people, who acquired technical skills and know-how by working with foreign companies, to establish their own industries. He said the promotion of technical education, skill enhancement and knowledge-based information and technologies are very important for industrialisation of any country, including Pakistan.

Malaysia’s automotive company Proton was establishing a car assembly plant in Karachi in cooperation with Pakistan’s Al-Haj Automotive and the first Proton car would be on the road by June next year. Prime Minister Imran Khan and his Malaysian counterpart had performed the symbolic ground-breaking of the car assembly plant during the Pak-Malaysia Investment Roundtable in Islamabad on Friday.

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Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Peregrine » 25 Mar 2019 01:57

X Posted on the P E S W Thread

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Mar 2019 03:55

To a question about Islamophobia, the Malaysian prime minister said, "Islam being a religion of peace taught us not to fight, kill or indulge in violence. We need to find out what we have done wrong.”


They have fought, killed and indulged in violence. What more do they need to know about what they have done wrong? And without getting into religion or ideology, those who fight, kill and indulge in violence and get away without punishment will continue to do so. This is true of humans. The answer is "we continue to fight, kill and indulge in violence because we don't punish fighting, killing and indulging in violence".

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Mar 2019 08:22

https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourd ... f74f161378
When it comes to happiness Pakistan beats India big time.That's according to the recently published World Happiness Report, which ranks
Pakistan in the 67th position, and India in the 140th position—near the bottom of the list of the 156 countries ranked.

Most notably, the gap between the two countries has widened compared to two years ago, when Pakistan ranked in the 80th position, and India in the 122nd position.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby Mort Walker » 25 Mar 2019 08:28

^^^I guess if you're fukcing goats makes you happier?

Much of the metrics quoted are wrong. Maybe someone else can shed light on this some more.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Mar 2019 09:01

^^^ Hehe, Pakistanis are delusional.
The main result of the Happiness Index derives from the "Cantril Ladder" -- a survey question which asks "rate your life, with 0 as the worst possible life and 10 as the best".

Pakistanis average at 5.5, Indians average at 3.8 on the Cantril Ladder. (PS: I assume that these results have not been fudged).

On objective measures -- which are not used to compute happiness, but only to try to explain the results -- India is ahead in life expectancy, per capita GDP, freedom to make life choices, generosity, confidence in national government, positive affect (how much did you laugh, enjoy, etc. the day previous to the survey), and lower negative affect (negative feelings did you have the day previous to the survey).

Pakistanis 69% to India's 64% to say that if they have family support if they are in trouble; and Pakistanis perceive corruption at 0.798 to India's 0.805.

So there is no objective explanation for India's unhappiness relative to Pakistan unless it is that Indians can imagine a much better life than they currently have; and Pakistanis cannot. Or call it divine discontent.

But anyone expecting a revolution in Pakistan because people are unhappy is going to be disappointed.
Last edited by A_Gupta on 25 Mar 2019 09:09, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Terroristan - October 8, 2018

Postby A_Gupta » 25 Mar 2019 09:03

PS: countries from Pakistan downwards on the Cantril Ladder. Pakistanis self-evaluate themselves as higher on the ladder than Indonesians, Chinese, Yak-herders, Sri Lankans, self-evaluate themselves, etc. etc.

Pakistan
Mongolia
Dominican Republic
Greece
Indonesia
Malaysia
Kyrgyzstan
Vietnam
Ivory Coast
Nigeria
Guinea
Cameroon
Macedonia
Belarus
Turkey
Azerbaijan
Lebanon
Niger
China
Cambodia
Bulgaria
Armenia
Algeria
Venezuela
Albania
Burkina Faso
Gambia
Nepal
Morocco
South Africa
Laos
Namibia
Gabon
Senegal
Tunisia
Ukraine
Georgia
Kenya
Mozambique
Jordan
Turkmenistan
Palestinian Territories
Bangladesh
Chad
Mali
Myanmar
Sri Lanka
Ethiopia
Uganda
Mauritania
Sierra Leone
Iran
Swaziland
Liberia
Madagascar
Zambia
Togo
Egypt
Comoros
India
Last edited by A_Gupta on 25 Mar 2019 09:09, edited 1 time in total.


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