Exercise Vajra Shakti

ramana
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Postby ramana » 14 May 2005 01:04

OK enough veering off topic. Please get back to the thread title, thanks.

Anoop
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Postby Anoop » 14 May 2005 18:35

From the article linked by Singha:

Singha wrote:Another innovation displayed was the Simputer, a palm top device fitted with a miniature camera. The simputer can transmit data and pictures from a recce team back to an operations centre over a radio network.


Some questions for the communication gurus:

1. Are these data and pcitures signals sent over the radio network more difficult to intercept/jam than voice signals?

2. As a related question, would radio 'silence' be maintained even if such text data signals are sent/received?

3. Is it a simple matter for two platoons, say, to communicate between themselves over this network as opposed to sending their data back to the company and then being appraised of each other's situations?

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If the answers are yes, this would be a huge force multiplier at the small unit level. SLA Marshall's book 'Men Under Fire - The Problem of Battlefield Command' (written soon after WWII, admittedly) talks of how many reverses were caused by lack of lateral communication between the flanks of a unit.

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Postby Dileep » 14 May 2005 20:44

1. Are these data and pcitures signals sent over the radio network more difficult to intercept/jam than voice signals?


Yes. With encryption and error protected coding, the data terminal would be practically impossible to intercept and difficult to jam. However, voice also can go in the same channel, in digitized form. If the comparison is with the traditional radio, this mode of communication is several orders of magnitude better.

2. As a related question, would radio 'silence' be maintained even if such text data signals are sent/received?


It depends. For text, the duration of the radio burst would be very short. An SMS like phrase can be transmitted in matter of milliseconds, and can be encoded to look like a noise pulse. But sending a picture will take more time, and radio signal will be present for that duration.

3. Is it a simple matter for two platoons, say, to communicate between themselves over this network as opposed to sending their data back to the company and then being appraised of each other's situations?


The range of the handheld units would be tens of kilometres, depending upon terrain. Technologically, it makes no difference whether the communication is between two field units or to a central location. So, I would imagine they will actually do that. there is an advantage too. If one unit is in a forward position and out of range of the command, another unit can relay info.

The technologies for this platform are well established and well within the capabilities. All we need from outside are the hardware parts :-( (processor, memory, comm ASIC, LCD panel etc).

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Postby Sunil » 14 May 2005 21:03

Dileep,

Please email me at breadomlette at yahoo dot com.

regards
Sunil

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Postby Dileep » 14 May 2005 21:11

Please email me at breadomlette at yahoo dot com

Done.

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Postby Anoop » 15 May 2005 00:09

Dileep,thanks for the clarifications.

For what it's worth, in my opinion, when these Simputers become available in numbers, it will be a big improvement in the IA's operational edge. Effective communication and situational awareness at the section and platoon level translates to success at the company and battalion levels. As training modules adapt to utilize better cross-communication within the same heirarchical level, there will be reduced information flow towards higher heirarchies and correspondingly reduced orders flow from the higher heirarchies, freeing the higher commanders to concentrate on the bigger picture. This will allow the concept of 'Directive Control' to be practised more effectively. Only what is continuously practised in peace-time can hope to be implemented during wartime.

Waiting for the real soldiers on this board to step in and correct any fallacies :).

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Postby pran » 15 May 2005 03:30

One of the most striking aspects of the exhibition was the unveiling of the imagery interpretation vehicle (IIV) and the imagery printing vehicle (IPV). Mounted on an 8-wheeler TATRA vehicle, the canisterised, air-conditioned IIV can download pictures directly from a satellite and process them. These pictures can be printed by the IPV with the print size being up to about three feet in width and length. These vehicles can function independently under any field conditions.

It sounds nice to have such facilities near the battlefield.But I wonder if such airconditioned truck will have a thermal prominence against a backdrop unless it is in the thick of the smoke and fire or equally hot zone. Will this not give its position out to any loitering UAV with thermal sensors.It is meant to used in the rear areas of the thrust however if it is a nerve centre then it is target worth attacking in the first place to break the network.
If these networking gadgets fall in enemy hands how safe are they from exposing other nodes in the battlefield. How does one manage if a node goes out or falls to the enemy and should be disconnected immediately from the rest of the network.

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Postby Dileep » 15 May 2005 04:52

I would imagine the TATRAS to be cooler than a tank, but hotter than a troop movement vehicle. Its visibility in IR does not create a huge difference IMO, because everything else, including troops tents, will be visible as well.

Security is a major concern. The SATIs reportedly have a self destruct mechanism. Any computing system that goes to the field should have one anyway.

The data will be encrypted. Even the freely available encryption like PGP is next to impossible to crack. The only way the enemy can get anything out of a SATI is by making the signalman talk. That too not far geographically from his expected location. Same with the other info vehicles and locations. Even if the enemy gets all the flash chips of the SATI intact, they can do nothing with it.

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Postby Calvin » 15 May 2005 18:14

What does Vajra Shakti mean?

Anoop
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Postby Anoop » 15 May 2005 18:16

Vajra - Indra's weapon, the thunderbolt

Shakti - Power

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Postby daulat » 15 May 2005 18:30

personally I would have been happy with "Vajra-danti", to rip mushy a new tighter aperture between the pomegranates

what with its canine like associations, would have been a good psy-ops blow to the old H&D as well...

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Postby Muppalla » 15 May 2005 18:38

http://www.deccan.com/home/homedetails. ... ital%20eye

Indian army to get digital eye


New Delhi, May 14: The Indian Army’s infantry will now get a digital eye. The Army has been testing the hand-held Simputer, which is to be given to the soldiers of the Ghatak platoon who lead an attack in an operation, to send back images of the battle-ground to operation headquarters.

Once fully adopted, the Indian Army will become one of the few forces to use such a system. The Army bought some Simputer units, developed indigenously by the Indian Institute of Science, earlier this year. It has been testing it in various locations, including in anti-terrorist operations in Jammu and Kashmir. It was also tried out during the recent Vajra Shakti exercise in the plains of Punjab.
An officer of the Corps of Signals, which has made some innovations to make the Simputer compatible for transmitting images, said the hand-held device will be carried by soldiers of the Ghatak platoon.

The soldiers are given a digital still camera. After taking photographs of the area of operation, the soldiers can transmit it to operation headquarters from the battlefield. The officer said this is in contrast to the earlier practice of verbally transferring information through normal communication devices. Commanders will now get precise information to enable them to plan strikes. The official said the system has been working fine and has proved to be very effective.

Only a particular brand of the digital camera has been made compatible with the Simputer. It can take photographs from a distance of 300 metres. The procedure involves soldiers of the Ghatak platoon being dropped by helicopter in the operation area. Armed with the latest light-weight devices, they can send credible feedback to military planners.

The Simputer is just one of the many digital surveillance systems adopted by the Army to enhance its fighting capabilities. The thrust of the Army has been on force multipliers, which are important for fighting futuristic battles. The use of hand-held computers is just the Army’s way of taking the digital revolution to the infantry soldier level. It has already started using advanced surveillance equipment acquired from Israel and satellite imagery.

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Postby dinesha » 15 May 2005 19:06

Indian army to get digital eye

These Simputer r also known as SATHI (Situation Awareness and Tactical Handheld Information)
Tech Details: http://www.ncoretech.com/sathi/pdf/sathi.pdf

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Postby Ragav » 18 May 2005 19:09

sathi and simputer are different
simputer is more like a pda while sathi was developed exclusively for army
http://www.simputer.org/

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Postby Dileep » 18 May 2005 23:38

sathi and simputer are different
simputer is more like a pda while sathi was developed exclusively for army

Simputer was first developed as a hand held computer. Then SATHI was derived from that platform by the same company. They are NOT the same, but related. I am sure same operating system is used, and a lot of applications too.

The Simputer as a business is a failure. I think SATHI can save that company if military fully inducts it.

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Cold Start

Postby san » 22 May 2005 09:11

Hi, I'm new to the forum,

I'd like to discuss the new Cold Start doctrine, and the new SouthWestern command.

What impact will it have on Pakistan's strategic policies and tactics?

I feel this is long overdue, since we have allowed Pak to wage low-level warfare against us for long enough. Even after discovering their nuclear deterrent, we should have still adopted this Cold Start policy as our own reciprocal form of "enhanced low-level" warfare, to keep the situation at a level just one notch above their preferred guerrilla war approach.

So why have we suddenly gotten wise, and adopted Cold Start? Why and how did we suddenly smarten up?

Has there been some kind of change in the strategic/geo-political scene that has allowed us to do this? Is it because Pakistan has a lot of forces tied down on the Afghan border? Is that what's made Cold Start feasible?

Will we be able to practice the hot-pursuit forward policy prescribed by Cold Start, or will it be something that only exists on paper?


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