Malabar Naval Exercises

Surya
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Postby Surya » 06 Sep 2007 23:43

how far is the battle group on East Coast

90 mins - ???

wouldn't it be better to use a package from arkonam or KKD

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Postby Shankar » 06 Sep 2007 23:53

No -launching from east coat bases like arkonam will give more warning to USN as during take off the aircraft is quickly spotted on a good radar by its rapid change in altitude and speed as it goes into cruise mode and then dives for the deck.Also flying out of coastal station is an expected reaction and hence taken care off by positioning of the escorts but from pune it can cover a wider angle of strike and also at max speed at low altitude allowing very little warning

The hawk eye has sat 400 km range for standard fighter sized target like sukhoi . Sukhois on full after burner gets detected at say 15000 ft ,dives for the deck and makes 90 degree turn alternatively turns back again and comes in 100 ft over ground crosses the shore ,the quick turning ability of sukhois cortesey thrust vectoring comes on its own in such a scenario ,launches the brahmos ,climbs up to 5000 ft ,gets shot at ,turns 180 degree at zero velocity to break the doppler lock and gets out ,the jag sneaks in the confusion and drops the nuke

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Postby Avid » 07 Sep 2007 00:29

That is some imaginative thinking!

You mean to tell that AWACS are unable to spot skimming targets or look at Sukhois/ other low level a/c through ground clutter?

Also 90 min from Lohegaon to Bay of Bengal theater and back?

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Postby Avid » 07 Sep 2007 00:32

tsarkar wrote:Avid - Officers of IAF Maritime Air Operations based out of Mumbai are regularly deployed on ships to coordinate operations since pre independence days. This fellow wears a Jaguar patch - probably deputed from No. 6


Thanks. Question - the maritime Jaguars - are they flown by IAF deputation or IN itself?

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Postby Kiran.Rao » 07 Sep 2007 00:52

Avid wrote:
tsarkar wrote:Avid - Officers of IAF Maritime Air Operations based out of Mumbai are regularly deployed on ships to coordinate operations since pre independence days. This fellow wears a Jaguar patch - probably deputed from No. 6


Thanks. Question - the maritime Jaguars - are they flown by IAF deputation or IN itself?


IAF.

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Postby Cain Marko » 07 Sep 2007 02:19

launches the brahmos ,climbs up to 5000 ft ,gets shot at ,turns 180 degree at zero velocity to break the doppler lock and gets out ,the jag sneaks in the confusion and drops the nuke

Shankarbhau,
what you are suggesting is going to get the MKI fried! If it has to launch Brahmos @ low level, it has to get in too CLOSE since the Brahmos range at lo-lo profile is only around 120km and even here it will face danger from SAMs. To get to such LRSAM ranges, you are assuming that the MKI has already passed the Shornet APG 79 screen. Highly unlikely considering the hawkeye support that the shornets get.
I doubt your above scenario is viable.
The only possibility of making the USN CBG eat water is to have 4-5 Irbis/KS 172+R27+R77 MKIs provide top cover, while another 4-5 MKIs try to sneak in and fire a salvo. And using nukes vs the U.S. is akin to commiting suicide, plus a violation of self imposed NFU policy. A strike group of 5 MKIs using a combination of 5 Brahmos and 10-12 Kloobs fired from different directions @ approx. 250km will probly be the most practical tactic to get the carrier IMVHO. Even if 2-3 missiles hit, the carrier could be crippled. Top cover group of MKIs with KS 172 will cancel the Hawkeye/Shornet edge and make it a lot easier for the strike group to get into better position - just out of SAM defence range. Unless the upgraded Jags use some longer ranged ASMs, I don't see it faring too well against the CBG. Sneaking up close enough to toss a nuke is highly unlikely, rather shoot the nuke via brahmos- sub launched.

Regards,
CM.

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Postby Surya » 07 Sep 2007 02:41

Cain the nuke is to simulate a rogue nation.

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Postby Rakesh » 07 Sep 2007 03:14

Surya wrote:All Vick is saying if the Singaporean ship performs better the navy needs to accelerate its projects to build ships of comparable charateristics.


No one is disputing what Vick is saying and he is right in stating that the Formidable Class has raised the bar for corvettes in the IOR.

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Postby JCage » 07 Sep 2007 03:23

tsarkar wrote:http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/070904-N-5242D-140.jpg

Elta EL/L-8212 pod. 8212 is the pod and 8222 is the internal system.

http://www.israelaerospace.com/ELTA.asp ... 17&lang=en


What makes you say that? Any source/link? :?:
IIRC, the 8212 is just a lower end SPJ while the higher end one is the 8222, both can be podded or used internally. Eg the Jaguar upgrades have an internal 8222.

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Postby sunilUpa » 07 Sep 2007 04:33

JCage wrote:
tsarkar wrote:http://www.navy.mil/management/photodb/photos/070904-N-5242D-140.jpg

Elta EL/L-8212 pod. 8212 is the pod and 8222 is the internal system.

http://www.israelaerospace.com/ELTA.asp ... 17&lang=en


What makes you say that? Any source/link? :?:
IIRC, the 8212 is just a lower end SPJ while the higher end one is the 8222, both can be podded or used internally. Eg the Jaguar upgrades have an internal 8222.


The following link says 8212 is pod for small aircraft and 8222 is for large aircraft. :) . From the photo, it appears that Harrier is carrying 8222.

link

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Postby shiv » 07 Sep 2007 06:36

Rakesh wrote:
Surya wrote:All Vick is saying if the Singaporean ship performs better the navy needs to accelerate its projects to build ships of comparable charateristics.


No one is disputing what Vick is saying and he is right in stating that the Formidable Class has raised the bar for corvettes in the IOR.


I would like to be educated on why this is stated to be the case.

What is it about the (French built?) Formidable that has raised the bar?

Is it electronics? Is it armament? Is it stealth? Range? Speed? All of these? Could someone elaborate? To my uninformed mind - one corvette seems pretty much like another - an armed boat.

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Postby Vick » 07 Sep 2007 07:41

Shiv, if you want the simple trivial answer, it's that the Formidable is the newest corvette in the IOR that has the typical hallmarks of what a modern warship, that's entering service in 2007, should have: LO features, reduced manning, network connectivity, crew comforts, hard/soft kill features, etc.

Even if one were to look at the Formidable with just layman's eyes (that goes googoo gaagaa over weaponery), one can see that the ship has 32 VLS, 8 ASMs, torpedoes and CIWS. That's not even looking at the modern radar, the full beam width hangar, towed sonar, etc.

There are navies out there who don't have flag destroyers with that much capabilitiies.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Rakesh, the two pics of the P28 you put up don't agree with each other. One pic is showing a dual masted ship and the other is showing only a single mast. And why is the P28 carrying the Hind helo? Is there an ASW version of the Hind no one knows about?

Also, I brought this topic up before, according to the pics, the P28 will not have any guided missiles on board? That can't be right.

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Postby shiv » 07 Sep 2007 08:28

Vick wrote:Shiv, if you want the simple trivial answer, it's that the Formidable is the newest corvette in the IOR that has the typical hallmarks of what a modern warship, that's entering service in 2007, should have: LO features, reduced manning, network connectivity, crew comforts, hard/soft kill features, etc.

Even if one were to look at the Formidable with just layman's eyes (that goes googoo gaagaa over weaponery), one can see that the ship has 32 VLS, 8 ASMs, torpedoes and CIWS. That's not even looking at the modern radar, the full beam width hangar, towed sonar, etc.

There are navies out there who don't have flag destroyers with that much capabilitiies.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Rakesh, the two pics of the P28 you put up don't agree with each other. One pic is showing a dual masted ship and the other is showing only a single mast. And why is the P28 carrying the Hind helo? Is there an ASW version of the Hind no one knows about?

Also, I brought this topic up before, according to the pics, the P28 will not have any guided missiles on board? That can't be right.


Thanks for spelling it out. That is what I was looking for. I see a whole lot of threads in which a pretty picture (or description) is posted with a comment about the item that is identified in language that suggests that it is "the best" or a "must have". That is then picked up by others and the item becomes the object of all comparison and all envy without any revelation of what makes it so. We have had thousands of MRCA posts based on this sort of issue.

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Postby Shankar » 07 Sep 2007 08:29

Shankarbhau,
what you are suggesting is going to get the MKI fried! If it has to launch Brahmos @ low level, it has to get in too CLOSE since the Brahmos range at lo-lo profile is only around 120km and even here it will face danger from SAMs. To get to such LRSAM ranges, you are assuming that the MKI has already passed the Shornet APG 79 screen. Highly unlikely considering the hawkeye support that the shornets get.
I doubt your above scenario is viable.


This is just a scenario but credible .To start with 5 sukhois are quite capable of neutralsiing the cap screen of super bugs .In a recent military exercise off the coast of okinawa 2 russian sukhoi vanila type penetrated the USN carrier screen and flew just over the deck and took photos of USN personnel on deck before being chased of bysuper bugs.Igorr might hekp me ocate the link to this news report

No reason why sukhois should launch at low level .It penetrates at low level climbs to 5000 ft and launches the missile so the aegis has now 10 flying threats ,turns out and engaesz the hornets with r-27/77 shoots down a few and escapes into mainland .It is all a matter of timming and correctly using the super agility .The whole idea is to allow the lone jaguar get in close for a dumb nuke type strike .

KS 172 is help ful but only for hawkeys and then we still do not know if this with IAF for sure(likely though) so kept it out of scenario

At max pseed su can cover quite alot distance .Pune to vizag if I am not mistaken by shortest route is around 1000 kms and 2000 kms for a round trip .

I surely do not know the location of the exercise but it is north east of vizag may be some where of the coast of sri kakulam so the scenario is feasible not saying very accurate .

Just for fun yaar

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Postby tsarkar » 07 Sep 2007 10:35

Jcage – These designations were used by Elta sales engineers while making their presentations to us. We procured 8212 pods. All have similar components and performance, so no high end or low end differentiation.

Sunil - From the pdf, you can notice that 8212 has sharp sides while 8222 has slightly rounded sides. The Harrier pod has sharp sides indicating 8212. That particular pylon on the Harrier protrudes forward and hence the 8212 appears longer than it actually is.

The following 8212 image perfectly matches the 8212 image on your pdf.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Image ... 1.jpg.html

Need to change the incorrect caption on the picture.

Large = transport, MPA, etc. They probably later designed a pod for transport aircraft and reused the 8222 designation for it.

Manufacturers keep playing with designations. The newer F/A-18 is marked “Eâ€

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Postby JCage » 07 Sep 2007 13:38

tsarkar wrote:Jcage – These designations were used by Elta sales engineers while making their presentations to us. We procured 8212 pods. All have similar components and performance, so no high end or low end differentiation.


TSarkar, we procured 8222s according to Elta, Navy and the IAF- all of whom confirmed the same. The 8212 is a smaller pod meant for light aircraft. Consequently, its performance is considered to be lower than the 8222 though exact details are classified. The Israelis hope to push the 8212 for light strike aircraft, light units which have payload restrictions, not to mention cost issues.

The first tranche of 8222s were divided between the Navy and the AF. The Navy took them for the SHars, whereas the AF took them for its Jaguars and MiGs. Subsequently, we signed another deal for a larger batch for our MKIs and Jaguar upgrades.

The 8222 is not meant for " very large" aircraft like MPAs but standard fighters. The Israelis use them with their F-15s and Australia procured them for its F-111s.

Sunil - From the pdf, you can notice that 8212 has sharp sides while 8222 has slightly rounded sides. The Harrier pod has sharp sides indicating 8212. That particular pylon on the Harrier protrudes forward and hence the 8212 appears longer than it actually is.


This can be optical distortion. I wouldnt make any comparisons unless both pods are kept side by side, besides which official documentation clearly states 8222.

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Postby Singha » 07 Sep 2007 13:48

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PBY_Catalina

with long coastlines, inst a modern 8000km range flying boat a natural
for the maritime patrol and ASW role ? Rus had BE-12 from Beriev.
also ideal for sortieing from various coves and lagoons in the andaman &
nicobar islands, laccadives without land infra expenses. being able to
fly at wavetop level safely these could even gather ELINT.

I think Philip saar has been demanding flying boats (and LPHDs) for a
decade now!

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Postby tsarkar » 07 Sep 2007 15:51

The pdf describes the square pod as 8222. I attended a presentation that described the square pod as 8212. I stand corrected.

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Postby Avid » 07 Sep 2007 17:23

At max pseed su can cover quite alot distance .Pune to vizag if I am not mistaken by shortest route is around 1000 kms and 2000 kms for a round trip .


Are you trying to burn out their engines? Assuming even 2500 km round trip, that is about 1600-1700 km/hr. You want the SU-30 and Jaguar to supercruise all the way and back?

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Postby Surya » 07 Sep 2007 17:25

Avid are you surprised??
This is Shankar - check the Military scenarios thread - our very own Tom Clancy!!!!! :lol:

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Postby NRao » 07 Sep 2007 19:54

Not Tom Clancy, TC is old and is more smoke and mirrors.

Dr. K of Oz. Dr. K is real.

Just BTW, Dr. K is working on the latest technique - Su head butting. A technique that the Chicom tried on the US spy plane a few dozen moons ago. Started by the Germans in WWII (tail end - check out History Channel - not kidding)

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Postby uddu » 07 Sep 2007 20:16


ramana
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Postby ramana » 07 Sep 2007 22:21

From Telegraph, 7 Sept.,2007
Behind banter, an Indian Ocean axis

[quote]
Behind banter, an Indian Ocean axis
SUJAN DUTTA


Image

Japanese fleet in the Bay
of Bengal. (PTI)
Port Blair, Sept. 6: The sharp voice rang out across the verandah that overlooks Minnie Bay through which vessels sail to dock in Port Blair’s military and civilian harbours: “Hey Masakatsu, you here too?â€

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Postby Paul » 07 Sep 2007 22:37

Allowing IN warships to dock at Deigo Garcia should be a key benchmark in setting up CBMs between the US and Inadian Navies.

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Postby Paul » 07 Sep 2007 22:55

Shankar wrote:Day before at Lohegaon was held up for 2 hrs as 3 sukhois followed by two more sukhois and lone jaguar took off in quick sequence and headed for south easternly direction.The pilot said delay due closure of air space because of unscheduled exercise.tHE Sukhois were carrying winf tip R-73 dummy /training rounds black stripes on white background I think.


Just a layman question......If the Sukhois were to take part in Malabar, wouldn't they have to switch on the BARs radar, and thus reveal the frequencies and other details to the USN. Wasn't this the primary concern and because of this the MKIs radars were switched off during the recent exercises with RAF.

I am sure there must be quite a few USN ELINT planes participating in the exercises as well.

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Postby Shankar » 07 Sep 2007 23:42

The sukhois amy or may not have swithed on the Bars ,might have got their situation info from the IN ships or shore based coastal radars .

As regards sukhois burning out engines again that may happen if they keep the after burner on all the way back and forth which is not really nessecery. Last 25% of ingress and 10% of egress should have sufficed .By the way the su-30s are quite fast without after burners also . The key is the location fo the exercise area at the time of he strike how close to the shores and how north of vizag .Please dont take take 90 minutes as a bench mark actually we were delayed from 0750 hrs to 1015 hrs to be exact which is 2 hrs and 25 minutes -does that make the scenario more feasible .Assume location of the ships 500 km north east of vizag and close to srikakulam orissa caost .

Just a scenario guys -not a researched tactics paper -enjoy and think

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Postby Avid » 08 Sep 2007 01:22

as a bench mark actually we were delayed from 0750 hrs to 1015 hrs to be exact which is 2 hrs and 25 minutes -does that make the scenario more feasible


Assuming 25 minutes loss, i.e. close down before the take off and confirmation of close air space, to reopening after all landed. So say 2 hours, total of 3000 km (1500 km each way), that still is 1500 kmph about Mach 1.35. That is supercruise requirement. SU-30 can do this without afterburners? What about the Jag?

Even without assuming any time loss, it turns out to be average speed of Mach 1.1 over 3000 km sortie. Damn we got ourselves a F-22!

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Postby venkat_r » 08 Sep 2007 01:55

Very intersting indeed. India from defining the sphere of Influence or neighborhood till "straits of malaca" now going beyond and talking in terms of "arc of freedom" or some other terms like "arc of friendship" or what ever it is called. This is the next natural step. Indian Navy's rapid development and deployment to ensure the safety of the Indian Ocean region, especially all of south east asia - Will go very well with all the countries in that region and also has multiple advantages for India.

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Postby SaiK » 08 Sep 2007 02:26

Is INS Jalashwa directly participating in the exercises?
[quote]INS Jalashwa skips Mumbai

Arunkumar Bhatt

It is the second largest warship in the naval inventory

The warship was acquired from the U.S.

It is expected to serve for 15 years

Image
[b]IN UNISON: Japan’s Maritime Self-Defense Force destroyer JS Yuudachi leads a formation during the five-nation “Malabarâ€

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Postby SaiK » 08 Sep 2007 03:01

Image
Flying high... A US fighter plane prepares to touch down on the US super-carrier Kitty Hawk in the Bay of Bengal, during the Malabar exercise, on Friday. Twenty-seven ships and submarines from the United States, Australia, Japan and Singapore have joined seven from host India off the Andamans archipelago in the Bay of Bengal for six-day manoeuvres in the international exercises, codenamed Malabar, which started on the September 4. AFP

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Postby putnanja » 08 Sep 2007 03:24

IAF Jaguars ‘sink’ USS Nimitz, F-18s return the favour to INS Viraat

[quote] ON BOARD USS Kitty Hawk (150 miles west of Port Blair), September 7: As the small green dots approached closer on the radar screen, the Indian officer sitting deep inside USS Nimitz knew it was too late to save the ship. Jaguar maritime fighters of the Indian Air Force (IAF), operating from the Car Nicobar air base, had managed to come dangerously within striking range to successfully launch anti-ship missiles on the super carrier.


The IAF registered its first “killâ€

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Postby Harshad » 08 Sep 2007 08:53

[url=http://www.telegraphindia.com/1070908/asp/nation/story_8291247.asp]Sorry Sam: India draws the line at submarines
- Other allies in mind[/url]
[quote]SUJAN DUTTA
On board the USS Kitty Hawk in the Bay of Bengal, Sept. 7: The Indian Navy turned down requests from the US to deploy its submarines in the Malabar war games, an officer has confirmed.

The US first requested for a Russian-origin EKM Class submarine. But that was not in Indian plans since the time the country began working on the drill from October last year.

Subsequently, the navy planned to deploy one of its Shishumar class submarines but even that was decided against.

In the absence of an Indian submarine, the USS Chicago was the only “targetâ€

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Postby Kartik » 08 Sep 2007 10:13

can anyone confirm if the SHars had the upgraded Elta 2032 radars ? the radome seems to be the same which would indicate a small antenna--antenna size could be cutomisable, but then again, no Derby's on display..on the FA-2s of the RN, the larger Blue Vixen radar meant that the radome had to be redesigned to fit in the larger antenna..no such thing on the IN SHars ?

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Postby uddu » 08 Sep 2007 13:27

IAF Jaguars ‘sink’ USS Nimitz, F-18s return the favour to INS Viraat


This was by a combined team of Jaguars of the IAF and F-18's. The same type of Jaguars that sank the USS Nimitz.

We have seen how the Jaguars were successful in their mission earlier (Line of duty). INS Viraat requires an early warning platform that is highly reliable.

IAF Su-30 MKI is also taking part in the exercise. The F-16 seems to have got a kill when the MKI made a mistake. May be close combat.

Hornet's refuelled IN Harrier.

Regarding the payment for fuel, Rakesh will send Laddu equivalent to the amount of fuel. :D

Navies forge new alliance in Indian Ocean detente
Link

"Gotcha pal! Be careful next time," the radio crackled in the cockpit of a Russian-made Indian war jet as a US F-16 scored a "kill" during a multi-nation naval drill in the Bay of Bengal.

The scorecard of one of the biggest-ever peacetime wargames in the region included a joint "attack" on Indian aircraft carrier INS Viraat and a mid-ocean hunt for the US nuclear submarine USS Chicago by warships from Australia, Japan and Singapore.

"The purpose of this high-end exercise is to build inter-operability between navies," said William Crowder, commander of the Seventh Fleet, the largest forward-deployed US naval strike force.

He was speaking on Saturday aboard the US super-carrier USS Kitty Hawk as the six-day "Operation Malabar" neared its end.

Malabar symbolises a new alliance between the Indian and US militaries, Cold War adversaries less than two decades ago who now say there is a need for global action against rising extremism and nuclear proliferation.

The Seventh Fleet barrelled into the Indian Ocean 36 years ago after India unwittingly destroyed a US plane in Pakistan during a full-scale war between the South Asian rivals in 1971.

"There's zero connection to 1971... I was 19 years old then and things have since then changed -- changed for good," Crowder said as Indian Sukhoi-30s and US F/A-18s flew in joint formation over warships dotting the Bay of Bengal.

The green light by India -- a trusted Cold War ally of Russia outside the Soviet bloc -- to the first-ever US proposals for common procedures for the drill was also a sign of new bonding between Western and Asian militaries, analysts said.

"Barely a month ago we ordered our Sukhois not to use their radar during an exercise in the United Kingdom because we feared the British would decipher our top-secret frequency codes," a top Indian airforce commander said.

"There's been a paradigm shift in mindsets," he added as US Navy Superhornets offered mid-air refuelling to Indian Sea Harrier combat aircraft.

"We did not charge for the fuel though," joked admiral Crowder as commanders from the five militaries held joint "war" briefings aboard Kitty Hawk to try to "sink" the American submarine.

Superhornets from the Kitty Hawk and USS Nimitz, the world's largest supercarrier, teamed up with India's British-supplied Jaguar bombers and "sank" the beleaguered Indian aircraft carrier INS Viraat.

"It's a changing world and we're looking at it as a huge learning experience," said Indian vice admiral Raman Suthan after Crowder handed over charge of the wargames to host India late on Friday.

Just a decade ago, the United States slapped a slew of sanctions on India in response to a series of nuclear tests in 1998 but in 2005 the two nations inked a historic atomic energy deal and embraced each others as strategic partners.

Analysts said mutual interests and fears had driven the five nations into military partnerships such as "Operation Malabar."

"We find common interests that now connect us," said military strategist Raja Menon, a former Indian admiral.

"We are exercising with countries that are democracies, they are energy-dependent but have thriving economies," Menon said.

"It's a rare opportunity to come together in the middle of the ocean and learn from each other on a wide array of issues," added rear admiral Nigel Coates, commander of the Australian strike force in the Malabar.

Crowder dismissed suggestions that the exercises were aimed at sending a message to either China or Iran.

"There is no connection between these manoeuvres and anything else," Crowder said.

The movements of US carrier groups are being closely watched amid mounting tensions over Iran's nuclear programme, seen by Washington and its Western allies as a covert atomic weapons drive.
ON BOARD THE USS KITTY HAWK (AFP)

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Postby JCage » 08 Sep 2007 14:48

uddu wrote:IAF Su-30 MKI is also taking part in the exercise. The F-16 seems to have got a kill when the MKI made a mistake. May be close combat.


I wouldnt take the above description as anything reliable.
There are no F-16s involved afaik, only F/A-18s!
Similarly the journo may have mistaken a SHar for the MKI or a Jaguar or whatever.

Second, for all the comments of "Jaguars" sinking the Nimitz and F-18s doing the reverse, one thing needs to be kept in mind. All it means is that the A/C managed to penetrate the outer BARCAP and get within missile launch ranges. But it does not mean that the missiles would have necessarily succeeded. Both navies- and especially the USN, have a range of missiles directed against sea skimmers, not to mention CIWS.

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Postby Singha » 08 Sep 2007 14:50

See See I told ya, the F-18 can fight when push comes to shove in WVR. those big non-swept wings are good at lower speeds.

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Postby Singha » 08 Sep 2007 14:57

a couple of Sea Eagles hitting the Nimitz wont do much other than destroying
a few ac on deck and closing ops for an hour until the junk is simply pushed
overboard.

You need a spread of torpedoes to really hurt these CVNs or obese heavy
ASMs like Granit. the older AS-6 kingfish was itself big as Mig21 to me.

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Postby vsudhir » 08 Sep 2007 15:53

The green light by India -- a trusted Cold War ally of Russia outside the Soviet bloc -- to the first-ever US proposals for common procedures for the drill was also a sign of new bonding between Western and Asian militaries, analysts said.

"Barely a month ago we ordered our Sukhois not to use their radar during an exercise in the United Kingdom because we feared the British would decipher our top-secret frequency codes," a top Indian airforce commander said.

"There's been a paradigm shift in mindsets," he added
as US Navy Superhornets offered mid-air refuelling to Indian Sea Harrier combat aircraft.


IOW, our Sukhois did use the BARS radars in this engagement??

Uh-oh.

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Postby JCage » 08 Sep 2007 16:35

Doubtful.

Its very likely that the Jaguars used their Elta EL/M-2032s however.

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Postby JCage » 08 Sep 2007 16:40

Singha wrote:a couple of Sea Eagles hitting the Nimitz wont do much other than destroying
a few ac on deck and closing ops for an hour until the junk is simply pushed
overboard.


I wouldnt be so sure. A few Sea Eagles can cripple a carrier if they hit it in the right spots. A carrier at even reduced speed and effectiveness will be a good blow.
But that is provided the Sea Eagles hit it in the first place. Any carrier is protected by the combined AAW assets of its escorts as well!

You need a spread of torpedoes to really hurt these CVNs or obese heavy
ASMs like Granit. the older AS-6 kingfish was itself big as Mig21 to me.


A submarine popping up next to a carrier is imho, a far greater threat than a bunch of a/c penetrating its outer BARCAP.

Until the SHars get their radars and BVRAAMs, they will be at a disadvantage against any half decent fighter like the F-18 with a good radar.


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