Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

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Supratik
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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 10 Jun 2016 20:19

Why is India not participating in Olympics tennis women's doubles? I thought Sania was world no 1 and automatic qualifier. I see only men's doubles and mixed double's teams.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 10 Jun 2016 20:24

Supratik wrote:Why is India not participating in Olympics tennis women's doubles? I thought Sania was world no 1 and automatic qualifier. I see only men's doubles and mixed double's teams.

Doubles selection is by combined ranking. Sania may be #1, but the second best player is not even in the top 100, and their combined ranking will be 100+, and cannot field a team that makes the cutoff. Mens and mixed doubles both can field two players with high rankings.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 10 Jun 2016 20:27

OK

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby NRao » 11 Jun 2016 07:54

Can we start a collection in India to pay Messi to play for India?

The guy comes in as a sub and scores 3 + an assist!! All in less than 30 mins? Crajji.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Shanu » 11 Jun 2016 09:49

Any of you guys following the Hockey Champions Trophy? Indian hockey team squandered a golden chance to beat the Olympic champions Germany. The match ended in 3-3 even though India took a 3-1 lead just after half-time.

Was watching the match yesterday. Felt so proud when India pumped in the third goal. Dunno when we last did that against Germany - not in recent times, i guess. Just could not keep the pressure on the more experienced German side. Remember, we have fielded a second string side - resting six of the top players for the Olympics. Also a good ploy to build up the reserve bench before Rio Olympics

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Jun 2016 12:58

Saina in Aus open final. She will face a much lower ranked Chinese player as Li Xuerui lost. Kidambi lost.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Jun 2016 13:24

It is going to be Lee-Bopanna and Bopanna-Sania and there will be a women's doubles team. This is surely Lee's last Olympics and he will like to go out with all guns blazing but I am not sure if Bopanna has chemistry with him. Sania's women's doubles partner is relatively very lowly ranked - so nothing much is expected. Best bet is in mixed doubles.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 11 Jun 2016 20:03

Medals in tennis are possible, especially in mixed doubles. In men's doubles, our problem has always been that our team mates (Lee/Hesh or Lee/Bopanna) detest each other, and therefore we suffer.

Ideally, Lee will put his giant ego beside for one last tilt at Olympic glory. It'll put him alongside Sushil Kumar as a multiple medalist. Ditto for Bopanna - he could get medals in both men's and mixed if he fights his heart out. Mixed is where I really hope they come through - they probably will rank as the top seed or close, since Sania is #1 and Bopanna is in the top 10. Maybe the Americans could have a higher seed if they pair up one of the Bryans with Serena. And there is Hingis/Federer.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Jun 2016 21:16

India beat GBR 2-1. They are continuing to play defensive-offence against higher ranked teams. But this time the defense was much better than before. Sreejesh is probably one of the best goal-keepers in the world today if not the best.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Bhurishrava » 11 Jun 2016 23:12

It seems noone wants to play with Leander. Neither Bopanna nor Sania.
Too much bad blood seems to suggest there will not be medals in mens doubles imho.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 11 Jun 2016 23:35

I'm surprised how well our hockey team is doing in CT2016. They have rested the regular captain Sardar Singh and Rupinder Pal Singh. In other words, we're playing without the fulcrum of our defence AND our best drag flicker. The other teams appear to be at near full strength. Germany are missing Moritz Furste but seem to have everyone else, while England, Australia, Korea and Belgium appear to be full strength teams. Not bad that we're on top of the pool after 2 games.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby BajKhedawal » 12 Jun 2016 05:44

Bhurishrava wrote:It seems noone wants to play with Leander. Neither Bopanna nor Sania.
Too much bad blood seems to suggest there will not be medals in mens doubles imho.


Why does this old man not retire? he has already appeared in 7 Olympics, stop being greedy and give our youngsters a chance.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Shanu » 12 Jun 2016 08:39

Suraj wrote:I'm surprised how well our hockey team is doing in CT2016.


Me 2. :shock:

This is one of the best defensive and counter attacking Indian side I have seen in the last 6-7 years I have been following Indian hockey. The teams playing in Champions Trophy are not like those we face in Asian Games. They are the powerhouses of the world. Drawing with World No. 3 Germany and beating World No. 4 Queendom at their home ground are extraordinary feats - especially considering that this is essentially a bench strength Indian side.

Or may be because they are mostly juniors, they are playing more as a team with more co-ordination. Hope the coach selects players who are most suited to play as a team and not as individuals for Rio. With 2-3 experienced players, inducted in the right positions, this team is a serious medal contender in Rio. Now, don't want to jinx it. :P

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 12 Jun 2016 13:14

Saina wins Aus open. First tournament victory after 14 months. She is back to better form. Was a tough match. Should be back in top 4. Need to maintain it till Olympics to have a better draw.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Bhurishrava » 12 Jun 2016 13:29

BajKhedawal wrote:
Bhurishrava wrote:It seems noone wants to play with Leander. Neither Bopanna nor Sania.
Too much bad blood seems to suggest there will not be medals in mens doubles imho.


Why does this old man not retire? he has already appeared in 7 Olympics, stop being greedy and give our youngsters a chance.

The youngsters should perform and earn their place.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 13 Jun 2016 21:28

1-2 loss to Belgium in the 3rd match. Remaining matches are against SoKo and Australia. SoKo can be beaten. A win against Aus would be excellent though. We are currently in 3rd place with 4 points, on par with GB and Belgium. GB placed ahead of us on goal difference thanks to their 4-1 win against SoKo.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chetak » 14 Jun 2016 12:16

Bhurishrava wrote:
BajKhedawal wrote:

{quote="Bhurishrava"}It seems noone wants to play with Leander. Neither Bopanna nor Sania.
Too much bad blood seems to suggest there will not be medals in mens doubles imho.{/quote}

Why does this old man not retire? he has already appeared in 7 Olympics, stop being greedy and give our youngsters a chance.

The youngsters should perform and earn their place.


The normal sporting tactic is to pay off greedy people from the associations. No other earthly reason for anybody official to push for Leander's inclusion so forcefully.

If he is not wanted by the other players, that should be it.

Go to any graveyard and look.

The list of "indispensable" people buried there is endless, with more "indispensables" joining their ranks every day.

Time to give this ill behaved old coot the boot

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Bhurishrava » 14 Jun 2016 17:18

chetak wrote:
The normal sporting tactic is to pay off greedy people from the associations. No other earthly reason for anybody official to push for Leander's inclusion so forcefully.

If he is not wanted by the other players, that should be it.

Go to any graveyard and look.

The list of "indispensable" people buried there is endless, with more "indispensables" joining their ranks every day.

Time to give this ill behaved old coot the boot


Dunno about ill behaved etc. Am sure you are privy to info about his unilateral ill behaviours. It does seem though that he plays good tennis which is one of the criterias. He has been winning lots of grand slams regularly. Probably more than any other indian.
He also does not seem to have any problem pairing with anyone. In contrast other players dont want to play with him. They would rather lose in the first round than try and get a medal for India playing with him.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 14 Jun 2016 18:10

Also he is the second highest ranked player after Bopanna but is not liked. He is known to play better for the country. /but don't expect much from men's doubles unless the pair are total professionals.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 14 Jun 2016 18:53

chetak wrote:The normal sporting tactic is to pay off greedy people from the associations. No other earthly reason for anybody official to push for Leander's inclusion so forcefully.

When you make an allegation of this kind, you have to prove it. The French Open just ended last week. Leander won the mixed doubles event. In 2015, he won the mixed doubles at Australian Open, Wimbledon and US Open. So within the past year or so, he won a career Grand Slam. He has 8 mens doubles and 10 mixed doubles Grand Slam titles overall, four of those since Jan 2015. And he's 42. His 18 Grand Slam titles is one more than a certain Roger Federer, who's also a pretty good tennis player.

There are lots of reasons why there's no younger generation taking over from him, but 'paying off associations' is far down the list. The fact is Leander is still among the best doubles players on the circuit at an age when many have retired a decade before. He's at the Olympics entirely on merit. The problem is all about his inability to work with anyone for any length of time. It's no surprise he also holds the record for having played with most different partners in a career.

Any youngster trying to take over has very big shoes to fill. Hopefully they'll not have as big an ego as him too.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chetak » 14 Jun 2016 19:08

Bhurishrava wrote:
chetak wrote:
The normal sporting tactic is to pay off greedy people from the associations. No other earthly reason for anybody official to push for Leander's inclusion so forcefully.

If he is not wanted by the other players, that should be it.

Go to any graveyard and look.

The list of "indispensable" people buried there is endless, with more "indispensables" joining their ranks every day.

Time to give this ill behaved old coot the boot


Dunno about ill behaved etc. Am sure you are privy to info about his unilateral ill behaviours. It does seem though that he plays good tennis which is one of the criterias. He has been winning lots of grand slams regularly. Probably more than any other indian.
He also does not seem to have any problem pairing with anyone. In contrast other players dont want to play with him. They would rather lose in the first round than try and get a medal for India playing with him.


A good family friend of over 30 years is the long time well networked secretary of the LTA for a major state. Some players are regular tantrum throwing prima donnas, set off by sometimes minor and mostly imagined ego related "slights". Males and females included.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chetak » 14 Jun 2016 19:25

Suraj wrote:
chetak wrote:The normal sporting tactic is to pay off greedy people from the associations. No other earthly reason for anybody official to push for Leander's inclusion so forcefully.

When you make an allegation of this kind, you have to prove it. The French Open just ended last week. Leander won the mixed doubles event. In 2015, he won the mixed doubles at Australian Open, Wimbledon and US Open. So within the past year or so, he won a career Grand Slam. He has 8 mens doubles and 10 mixed doubles Grand Slam titles overall, four of those since Jan 2015. And he's 42. His 18 Grand Slam titles is one more than a certain Roger Federer, who's also a pretty good tennis player.

There are lots of reasons why there's no younger generation taking over from him, but 'paying off associations' is far down the list. The fact is Leander is still among the best doubles players on the circuit at an age when many have retired a decade before. He's at the Olympics entirely on merit. The problem is all about his inability to work with anyone for any length of time. It's no surprise he also holds the record for having played with most different partners in a career.

Any youngster trying to take over has very big shoes to fill. Hopefully they'll not have as big an ego as him too.


dirty money and quid pro quo is a fact of life in sporting associations. There are very little other avenues that can be exploited except during major tournaments when the political sharks move in to corner the bulk of the cream leaving little for the associations. Association elections are costly affairs and need funding. Players earning in crores are a natural target.

In international tournaments players don't actually have to win a tournament to make money. Mere entry and also every round they advance to guarantees them money, win or lose.

A reasonably placed fit, not injured and higher seeded player player entering 15 -20 even no name tournaments, without winning any of them but advancing to maybe second/third round in some of these will make about 4-6 crores per year easily. Of course he will have expenses to take care of like coach, physio, manager whatever but still there will be a tidy sum left over at the end of the year.

The association mammas will target this, in many cases.

Some relatives have also played in the ranjii trophy, again for a major state and so inputs and gossip keep trickling in during family gatherings.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 14 Jun 2016 19:35

Please do some research before making allegations. Playing tennis is extremely costly. I have seen reports where the costs are as high as 50 to 60 lakhs per year for top grade training and you make money and get sponsorship only when you break into the top 150. Only those right at the top make substantial money. For most middle class parents in India it is not affordable to let their children take up tennis as a career. So paying off federations is not the problem if at all it is a problem as you are claiming.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby BajKhedawal » 14 Jun 2016 19:42

I shoot university and high school sports in US, and Tennis is one sport which is dominated by foreigners here. Last few years I found quite a few Indian kids from Delhi, Gujarat, Orissa, etc come and play for NCAA division 1 universities (which is where most professional national level players for football, basketball, are drafted from). These desi kids are very good players, and constantly get ranked as #1 seed in the team. Mind it they are competing against kids from europe (russia, ukraine, germany, france, slovakia, sweden) who are very good and clinical about winning. So the talent-pool and training in India have certainly come a long way. I am sure there are plenty of good players in desh just waiting for a chance to showcase their work.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 14 Jun 2016 20:50

I wonder if they are genuine players "from India" or migrating based on sports quota.

Anyway, India bt Korea 2-1. Tepid game. Bad PC conversion. Korea have also changed their game but I think it has done them disservice. Everyone is now playing Euro-style.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby BajKhedawal » 14 Jun 2016 21:03

Don't wonder, I am telling you first hand.

They were of Indian nationality, and played fantastic tennis.

Majority returned to India, maybe couple of them went on to do masters.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 14 Jun 2016 21:04

chetak: Tennis is an expensive game in India. I've played it on an amateur basis when I was in my teens. It was not at all cheap then. Paes is older than me, and Bopanna's my age.

In any place and sport where there's no organized scouting and sport school system, it's every one to himself. They'll do whatever is needed to help their kid get ahead. It's a disservice to those who have achieved great sporting success to call it 'dirty money'. Anyone or their parent who strongly desires to get ahead would do whatever it takes to get the resources, facilities, coaching and anything else it needs to succeed. The effort and life it takes to achieve world-beating sporting success should not be underestimated.

Ultimately, Paes' accomplishments are unmatched in India, the best in Asia, and among the best in the history of Grand Slam doubles tennis. He's still a very strong player at 42, who just happens to be ranked below Sania and Bopanna at the moment, and has known personality issues. Please don't make it into more than that.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chetak » 14 Jun 2016 21:10

Supratik wrote:Please do some research before making allegations. Playing tennis is extremely costly. I have seen reports where the costs are as high as 50 to 60 lakhs per year for top grade training and you make money and get sponsorship only when you break into the top 150. Only those right at the top make substantial money. For most middle class parents in India it is not affordable to let their children take up tennis as a career. So paying off federations is not the problem if at all it is a problem as you are claiming.


I was talking only of lower seeded players. Top seeds make their own way because they are out of the clutches. But why is the association pushing so hard for leander, if the players don't want him?? and why is leander pushing so hard to play the Olympics again, is anyone going to miss him?? or is it for a medal or merely for the history and record books??

During ramesh krishnan's time the then association simply buried a player who was at least as good as him. Just did not let him enter (m)any tournaments under one silly pretext or another.This was a kid named royappan, IIFC. Hope all those b@$t@rd$ are rotting in hell now.

I know many families who have almost bankrupted themselves by paying enormous money to quack coaches hoping to get lucky by "making" their children professional tennis players. This used be a craze once upon a time among middle class families with parents virtually killing themselves taking their wards from coaching camp to coaching camp.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 14 Jun 2016 21:21

chetak wrote:But why is the association pushing so hard for leander, if the players don't want him?? and why is leander pushing so hard to play the Olympics again, is anyone going to miss him?? or is it for a medal or merely for the history and record books??

Because he's the best player they can pair with, that's why. It's the brutal truth. There's no active Indian player outside of Sania, Bopanna and Paes who plays at their rarefied heights. Paes may be allegedly a d1ck, and Sania and Bopanna may hate him for that, but they're also professional players who are paid to suck it up and play with the best player they can play with. Saina already picked Bopanna for mixed. That is fair because Bopanna is ranked higher and she gets along better. But for Bopanna in men's doubles, there's no one close to Paes' level as a replacement. As a paid professional he needs to work with Paes (and vice versa) to find a common ground at a very important tournament for the country. That's what professionals are supposed to do.

The Indian tennis association isn't doing anything wrong by pushing for Bopanna-Paes. While Bopanna may be ranked higher, his highest Grand Slam accomplishment is a single losing final in US Open. He lacks Paes' big match temperament. Paes has as many Grand Slams as Sania + Bhupathi + Bopanna combined.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chetak » 14 Jun 2016 21:28

Suraj wrote:chetak: Tennis is an expensive game in India. I've played it on an amateur basis when I was in my teens. It was not at all cheap then. Paes is older than me, and Bopanna's my age.

In any place and sport where there's no organized scouting and sport school system, it's every one to himself. They'll do whatever is needed to help their kid get ahead. It's a disservice to those who have achieved great sporting success to call it 'dirty money'. Anyone or their parent who strongly desires to get ahead would do whatever it takes to get the resources, facilities, coaching and anything else it needs to succeed. The effort and life it takes to achieve world-beating sporting success should not be underestimated.

Ultimately, Paes' accomplishments are unmatched in India, the best in Asia, and among the best in the history of Grand Slam doubles tennis. He's still a very strong player at 42, who just happens to be ranked below Sania and Bopanna at the moment, and has known personality issues. Please don't make it into more than that.


Suraj, I don't mean to offend anyone by saying all this. I come from a family of sportsmen who have played at state and national level. Association elections and their politics were common knowledge. If anything, things have worsened considerably.

Any game is expensive, which is why all sorts of creeps have made all out efforts to insert themselves into management and administration roles. look at association after association, it's all an endless parade of politicians or politically connected entities. Most of them are very obviously not there for the good of the game. Some of them are certainly there because of their dedication to the sport. Either way it needs big bucks and big backing.

Can anyone stop this lady or can anyone match her financial muscle??

Even as the controversy over top two wrestlers and brand ambassadors refuses to die down, Nita Ambani looks all set to hog limelight in the Olympic Games in Rio this August.

Founder-chairperson of Reliance Foundation, which has sports as a thrust area of its activities, has been nominated as an individual candidate to be elected as a member of International Olympic Committee (IOC).


My last on this. Sorry If I have upset anyone. I am certainly not a leander fan.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 14 Jun 2016 21:33

The problem with your argument is that it has very little to do with the topic at hand. Leander is currently an active top level player. For men's doubles, he's the best person to partner Bopanna. While the latter may be higher ranked now, that is just a statistical artifact. The person Bopanna does not want to play with, has won all four Grand Slam titles in doubles in the past year and half. Bopanna himself has not won any at all. He just happens to be ranked higher because he's playing more often, but he hasn't won anything big. Paes keeps winning on the big stage at an age when his former peers are in the commentators box talking.

This is not about associations, money, corruption etc etc. If some world #150 is paired up with Bopanna at the expense of Paes, that would be corruption. If Paes and Bopanna cannot play professionally together, that's their own failing. Nothing to do with money, corrupt associations etc. Professionals are called that because they are supposed to put their personal issues aside to perform well. Bopanna and Paes are the best two players, so they play together.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Yayavar » 14 Jun 2016 22:54

^^Paes not being a 'friendly' might mean his Hingis partnership might end soon too.

Bopanna should reconsider to put an Olympic medal in his cabinet... Leander has one already.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 15 Jun 2016 02:00

At CT2016, after all but one pool match, we're in 2nd place with 7 points, behind Australia. GB is 2 points behind, Belgium at 4 points, and Germany and SoKo at 3 points each. Thursday we play Australia. GB plays Belgium, Germany and SoKo pair off at the bottom. We are guaranteed to finish in the top 4. Beating Aus will get us into final. Draw with Aus means we may make final depending on how GB vs Belgium goes. Ideally we want GB-Bel to draw, in which case we are through to final no matter what.

Elsewhere, archery team is warming up well, making final of the World Cup, to be fought against world champs Korea. Hopefully Deepika Kumari is much stronger mentally than in 2012, and can medal in Rio.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 15 Jun 2016 17:42

Like Suraj I also played tennis in India at junior level. Nepotism, favoritism, politics was all there but never heard of people paying bribes to make a career. Certainly, at the level of Paes that would be prime time news. Nobody is going to take the risk. The associations get money from sponsors and govt. That is where the money is misused generally and also fund their chai-biskoot to 5 star parties.

CT2016, India is on tenterhooks. They have to play exceptionally well against Aus or wait for a draw between GBR-Bel.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 16 Jun 2016 20:55

India lost to Australia 4-2 in Champions trophy. I am not sure whether we will play for bronze medal or not.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 16 Jun 2016 21:07

We are certain to play for bronze medal at least. We have 7 points. Korea and Germany have 3 points each and at most can have 6 points if one of them win today.

Whether we play for gold depends on GB-Belgium game. If they draw or Belgium wins by no more than 1 goal, we're in the final, from what I understand of the goal difference.

In the archery world cup, Atanu Das, who made the Mixed Team final along with Deepika Kumari, also made the men's single semifinal in the recurve event. Deepika lost in the quarterfinal of the women's event. Koreans are dominating here, but they can only have 2 archers at Olympics, so both Das and Kumari could make the medal rounds at Rio with luck.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby saip » 17 Jun 2016 01:31

With Belgium and GBR drawing 3-3 India is into the final. But we have to beat Australia. Should not be happy with a silver.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 17 Jun 2016 01:34

Congrats to the hockey team. For 35 years they had no medals at the world stage. Now in successive world level events (Hockey World League and CT2016) they have medals. First a bronze in HWL, and now they fight for gold or silver in CT2016 .

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Bhurishrava » 17 Jun 2016 15:19

The argument against Leander is the same that everyone here despises. That people should be selected on merit and not on whims and fancies of associations. Or other players for that matter.

Srikanth has gone up 2 places in the BWF rankings after his semi final show in Australia. Still out of top ten though. He is 11.

Nehwal is up 2 places at six.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 17 Jun 2016 22:27

While we're on the topic of CT2016, FIH and the English Hockey folks deserve a round of loud boos for being such morons as to domain restrict every single video on their site. Idiots need to realize there's no point in releasing a dozen videos of a match when all of them are accessible only in UK.

In comparison, during the HWL in Raipur in India (hardly a major metro) we had live feeds and highlights videos available soon after. And the event in London can't do that properly.

Belgium beat SoKo 4-3 to finish 5th. Germany leads GB 1-0 in the 3rd place match now.


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