Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

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Suraj
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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 10 Apr 2018 19:23

All boxers through to semis, so that's at least 5 bronzes. Hopefully a couple of golds.

Muhammad Anas gets an honorable mention despite finishing 4th in 400m - he broke the national record thrice, including in the final in the rain. If he can get sub 45 second, he has a serious chance at the inter-continental level. This sort of performance will get him a medal at AG too, though gold will be hard against African imports in Middle Eastern teams.

We aren't doing badly in swimming at the level we can do. It's not like the swimmers are underperforming - they have broken many national records at these games. It's just that breaking the national record won't even get you out of the heats at this level. We are a long way off.

Hopefully we can total 20+ golds by end of games. We have more shooting, boxing, all of wrestling, badminton, squash and athletics to add golds from. The weightlifters did a great job with their unexpected 5 gold bounty.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 10 Apr 2018 19:39

Suraj wrote:All boxers through to semis, so that's at least 5 bronzes. Hopefully a couple of golds.

Muhammad Anas gets an honorable mention despite finishing 4th in 400m - he broke the national record thrice, including in the final in the rain. If he can get sub 45 second, he has a serious chance at the inter-continental level. This sort of performance will get him a medal at AG too, though gold will be hard against African imports in Middle Eastern teams.

We aren't doing badly in swimming at the level we can do. It's not like the swimmers are underperforming - they have broken many national records at these games. It's just that breaking the national record won't even get you out of the heats at this level. We are a long way off.

Hopefully we can total 20+ golds by end of games. We have more shooting, boxing, all of wrestling, badminton, squash and athletics to add golds from. The weightlifters did a great job with their unexpected 5 gold bounty.



American/Australian/western kids learn to swim before they can walk or talk. I have seen 6 months old babies being taught to swim. There is practically swimming pool every block in Cities., each townships typically have a Tennis courts (3-4), Swimming pools ( for various age groups), , diving pools, Baseball grounds (typically 3 from different age groups), American football ground, soccer ground, a park for your pets, etc.

In order to win anything in swimming a huge effort is required starting with the kids that are born right now., then may be when these kids are from 16-20 years old we can expect something. Which means not before 2040.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 10 Apr 2018 20:01

In India space may be a constraint. Even the uber luxury residences have just a pool or tennis courts. What we can do is have more sporting facilities at school and academies. for example, Manu Bhaker is a product of her school which has a shooting range. Mehuli Ghosh is a product of an academy (Karmakar's academy). Till India becomes rich that should be the strategy.

All those who have performed poorly in these games need to undertake fresh qualification for AG e.g. Gagan Narang in shooting. There are kids in teens who have won the junior and senior WC but are not in the team. There should be no automatic selection based on past performance. Similar with other sports.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 10 Apr 2018 20:47

India will never get well at sports following the western model . Needs too much money and space that we don't have. The Asian sports school system, that lets kids pursue sports while still getting an education, plus strong funding to ensure their training is top notch, would work. We have academies doing this in our case. Gopichand's academy being a prime example. Then there's the Haryana wrestling cluster. And now Abhinav Bindra and Joydeep Karmakar's shooting academy. Karmakar finished 4th in the 50m prone rifle event at the 2012 Olympics.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 10 Apr 2018 21:16

Srikanth is set to become world no 1. First Indian man in modern era. First woman was Saina Nehwal. I hope he makes good use of this and does not look back.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/spo ... 687553.cms

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby nash » 10 Apr 2018 21:40

India to become sport power house is certainly not possible with top down approach, it should be bottom up and government role should be facilitate those ground level initiative.

Now, only cities have aquatics and athletic facility but in country side we have lot of water bodies and open field which can be or should be use to find the talent at school level.

For Start, Government should incentivize production of all sports goods in India, currently most of it coming from China and then put some professional and sportsperson in SAI and respective board.

In tribal areas and villages, we have enormous talent of Athletics and Aquatics, need to capture that, as we can see whenever we get participation from all classes of society, either rich or poor, we have done well. Cricket , Badminton, Boxing, Wrestling, Hockey, etc we are at par with the world.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Karthik S » 10 Apr 2018 21:41

Suraj wrote:That is Satwiksairaj Rankireddy . The kids a monster . His MD partner Chirag Shetty still needs to improve , but this guy is mainly why that pairing is top 10 material . They’ve beaten the best in the world already . Just needs consistency .


Just saw highlights, he is indeed a monster, very quick and strong shots.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby suryag » 10 Apr 2018 21:43

dumb Q how can you have another guy as a mixed doubles partner ?

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 10 Apr 2018 21:45

Yes, more than 90% of our young population have no connection with organized sports. So we have tapped just a small fraction of the population. In WB most rural kids know how to swim as it is a riverine state but no organized effort to tap it.

MD is Men's doubles
XD is mixed doubles

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby suryag » 10 Apr 2018 21:51

How dumb, my ignorance is embarassing

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 10 Apr 2018 22:04

suryag wrote:dumb Q how can you have another guy as a mixed doubles partner ?

Theoretically, one of them could borrow a dupatta and bangles from, say, Barkha Dutt...

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 11 Apr 2018 01:21

Here's Rankireddy and Shetty against the Danish Mads pair, who are a top ten team:

They have beaten several of the top ten, some more than once, like the Mads pair. They've beaten the world #2 Boe/Mogensen, the top Chinese pairs, and the Malaysian pair whom they narrowly lost to in the mixed team final are currently world #1.

Rankireddy and Shetty in comparison are world #66 . But on the circuit everyone says they'll make top 10 in 1-2 years, because they beat the top 10 so often. They're just not able to get enough wild cards to move up faster.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Bart S » 11 Apr 2018 02:36

Is there a mens and womens team event for badminton just like there was for TT, or is that it for the team events?

Added later: guess not...nothing on the schedule along those lines. Strange that they would have it for TT but not badminton, could be because TT is less physically taxing.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby disha » 11 Apr 2018 05:46

Suraj wrote:To continue on my rant about the commonwealth games, here's one more factor that affects our results, and underscores why our presence there is unnecessary:

CWG medal count evolution by sport
Swimming: 15 golds in 1958 -> 32 golds in 1990 -> 50 golds in 2018
Cycling: 5 golds in 1958 -> 11 golds in 1990 -> 26 golds in 2018
Athletics: 29 in 1958 -> 42 in 1986 -> 58 in 2018

Weightlifting: 7 in 1958 to 30 in 1990 to 16 in 2018
Wrestling: 8 in 1958, eliminated in 1990 (10 afterwards), 12 in 2018
Shooting: not present in 1958, 21 in 1990, peaked at 44 in 2010, down to 19 now, eliminated for 2022

We cannot win as many medals as we did in the 2000s because our main sports have been decimated of medals, while swimming/cycling have gained. Both those are focus sports for UK/Aus for Olympics, and CWG is essentially a dry run for them. India gains nothing from participating in an event where our best sports are being cut to the bone or removed.


It is interesting to note that swimming is a sport and shooting or wrestling or weightlifting is not considered a sport at CWG!

The way around is not to boycott, but ensure that India and other non-western common wealth nations get all the CWG events for at least 2-3 decades. India has some 5 metros and several other large cities. Each can be made to host a CWG event every decade - and not just New Delhi. Then there is Dhaka and Kathmandu and Columbo. There are nations - Malaysia, Nigeria, South Africa, Kenya, Ghana, Namibia, Fiji. Between some 15-16 non-western nations, at least 6 can be made to qualify.

And that will highlight other sport categories - not just swimming and cycling.

However when common wealth nations as a group is losing its clout, it is due to the narcissistic & racist policy of the british and its cohorts australia and canada and is a loss of tremendous opportunity of those nations - both economic and cultural.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 11 Apr 2018 10:43

Nice drama in shooting . Jitu Rai and Om Prakash Mitharwal both flubbed it in 50m air pistol with just one bronze from the latter .

However we have surprise gold in women’s double trap from Shreyasi Singh ! She was in #2 spot for most of the final but reeled in the Aussie and beat her in shootout.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Ashokk » 11 Apr 2018 16:51

04:38 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | Indian hockey team with the victory avoided facing Australia in the semis. England end Pool B at second

04:37 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | It's all over! India beat England 4-3 to top Pool B

04:35 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | GOAL! Mandeep Singh scores a brilliant field goal to give India 4-3 lead with less than a minute left

04:33 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | GOAL! Varun Kumar scores through PC as India make it 3-3 against England

04:32 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | India get a PC with two minutes left

04:27 PM (IST)
Men's Hockey | GOAL! England take 3-2 lead against India with four minutes left in the contestt


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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Vasu » 11 Apr 2018 18:01

In swimming, I feel India doesn't look at the right places. I have seen young kids with my own eyes jump in a rapidly flowing Ganga canal in Haridwar to fetch a football which fell into it and swim right out. Many rural Kids on India's coasts, or kids who grow up in villages adjacent to rivers or large water bodies grow up as excellent swimmers. We need people who can identify them at an early age and take them in (in a non-authoritarian way like how China does it).

Added later: nothing would make me happier than to watch Indian athletes give it to western athletes in their own games. I hope to see it in my lifetime.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 11 Apr 2018 18:54

Vasu wrote:In swimming, I feel India doesn't look at the right places. I have seen young kids with my own eyes jump in a rapidly flowing Ganga canal in Haridwar to fetch a football which fell into it and swim right out. Many rural Kids on India's coasts, or kids who grow up in villages adjacent to rivers or large water bodies grow up as excellent swimmers. We need people who can identify them at an early age and take them in (in a non-authoritarian way like how China does it).

Added later: nothing would make me happier than to watch Indian athletes give it to western athletes in their own games. I hope to see it in my lifetime.



Hi Vasu!

There are several different ways to swim and medals in each category (Back stroke, free style, breast stroke, medley, diving, etc). Most Indians (like myself) swam in rivers and only knew the one and the only way to swim.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Apr 2018 20:27

Lucky win against England. Defence needs to be more solid but they are playing attacking hockey which suits India.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Apr 2018 20:37

Vijender Singh rises to no 6 in world ranking.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/spo ... 651030.cms

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Apr 2018 20:39

India looses to Kyrgyzstan 1-2 in football. May loose ranking. Breaks 13 match undefeated run. May need coach with better credentials to take them to the next stage.

http://indianexpress.com/article/sports ... e-5113258/

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 11 Apr 2018 20:52

The AFC Asian cup will be held in Jan 2019 and will be the first real test of how we have progressed in Asia post resurrection of Indian football.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 11 Apr 2018 21:35

Wrestling gets underway today. Some or all of the women's events use Nordic system (everyone fights everyone else, most wins gets gold) due to lack of competitors for the standard Repechage system. Four wrestling golds up for grab each of the next 3 days. I hope we can grab half of them.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Vasu » 12 Apr 2018 12:37

SBajwa wrote:
Vasu wrote:In swimming, I feel India doesn't look at the right places. I have seen young kids with my own eyes jump in a rapidly flowing Ganga canal in Haridwar to fetch a football which fell into it and swim right out. Many rural Kids on India's coasts, or kids who grow up in villages adjacent to rivers or large water bodies grow up as excellent swimmers. We need people who can identify them at an early age and take them in (in a non-authoritarian way like how China does it).

Added later: nothing would make me happier than to watch Indian athletes give it to western athletes in their own games. I hope to see it in my lifetime.



Hi Vasu!

There are several different ways to swim and medals in each category (Back stroke, free style, breast stroke, medley, diving, etc). Most Indians (like myself) swam in rivers and only knew the one and the only way to swim.


Agree Sir. hence my point that they need to be identified early and trained. My basic assumption is that children who are so comfortable and at home in the water at such an early age, with proper training, diet and mental conditioning may do very well in a competition.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby nash » 12 Apr 2018 14:08

Sushil Kumar - Gold in 80 sec , are you kidding me .. :rotfl: :rotfl:

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 12 Apr 2018 19:09

All these examples of natural talent just serve to underscore my earlier argument - that the western approach isn’t going to work . The same kid in the West would have access to a swim club or school where a coach would spot him and push him forward .

We don’t have such places. We don’t have so many coaches . There are probably more capable swim coaches in one US state than in all of India . You guys should read the story of the boxers and their Argentine coach . It was in Indian express 2 days ago . The boxers are all in the medal round because he fixed their basics - they didn’t even know how to warm up, how to position themselves to attack and defend... even Mary Kom said she had no idea . The new coach taught them and showed them examples... off YouTube !

All our strong sports are the result of the existence of a system into which kids are motivated to travel and train within . The Haryana dangals. The cluster of shooting academies in north India or army ones. Weightlifting I’m not sure where - NIS Patiala ? Gopichand academy .

The Chinese aren’t and weren’t much different. But they understand how to create a system, absorb the best modern sports science and apply it . They did not even participate in Olympics until 1984 . That first time they won 15 golds! How do you deal with political instability, famine and isolation, then join the mainstream and immediately win 15 golds ? Shooting, weightlifting and gymnastics were their focus sports then . We were there too. We won nothing . Just ‘PT Usha finished 4th’ . The Chinese had gold winners like Wu Shude in weightlifting and Li Ning (yes the same guy from the sports brand) in gymnastics .

We are behind the world in sports science , coaching - physical and mental - and physiotherapy . Even in 2018 we don’t comprehend the importance of a physio . The weightlifters won 5 golds here while nursing injuries . You could see it in the video - Sathish and Rahul both grimacing and only doing as much as needed to win . This is basic stuff . They ask for a physio , they get it no questions asked . Any accreditation problems ? The chief de mission moves heaven and earth to fix it ...

We don’t lack for talent in sports to win say 10-15 golds per Olympics. We lack talent in coaching and support staff to get anywhere close, right now .

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 12 Apr 2018 20:50

India lost to Australia by one goal in women's hockey. A freak goal and failure to convert an open chance cost the match. Harinder needs to work harder on the girls. The good news is that the girls look fitter but are short on strategy e.g. when Aus was pressing in 3 quarter they did not know how to break it. The men's team had similar problem before Oltman fixed it. The good news is the gap with top teams and India is closing. I hope the momentum is maintained.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 12 Apr 2018 21:17

Here's the article on the boxers and their coach:
Five boxers assured of medals, thanks to positional play
Read it and see what even a 5x world champ, Asian Games gold and Olympic medalist like Mary Kom never got taught. Now imagine if all those folks had training like the Cubans do.

All our 8 male boxers cruised into the medal round. Mary Kom is in the final. that's a minimum 8 bronze + 1 silver guaranteed from boxing, all of them potentially upgradeable to gold.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 12 Apr 2018 22:09

I would assume that to be the case in most sports in India.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 13 Apr 2018 09:47

Two more golds from shooting. Tejaswini Sawant wins 50m 3 positions, Anish Bhanwala - just 15 years old - wins 25m Rapid Fire Pistol. Anish has 2 golds in the world junior championship and one in the latest world cup, and now is CWG champion.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 13 Apr 2018 17:58

Gold Coast, Australia (CNN)Indian athletes Rakesh Babu and Irfan Kolothum Thodi have been kicked out of the Commonwealth Games on Australia's Gold Coast after syringes were discoverd in their apartment.

Louise Martin, president of the Commonwealth Games Federation, said Friday that cleaning staff found one needle in a cup on a bedside table. Another needle was found in one of the athletes' bags.
Babu, who was due to compete in the triple jump final Saturday, and Thodi, who finished 13th in the 20km race walk final, told the Federation Court of the Commonwealth Games that they didn't know anything about the needles. But their testimony was deemed "unreliable and evasive" according to Martin.
The Court found Babu, Thodi and three other individuals with the Indian team in violation of the Games' "no needle policy."
Babu and Thodi were immediately banned from the Games and asked to leave Australia.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 13 Apr 2018 18:05

Image

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 13 Apr 2018 18:09

So far so good except Men's hockey. We have been able to convert many of the silver medals from Glasgow to gold medals. Hopefully there will be more in the next two days. We are probably going to end in 3 position.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 13 Apr 2018 18:16

how good is viktor axelsen ?

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 13 Apr 2018 18:20

Six Indians in boxing finals. Lets see how many can convert to gold.

Victor Axelsen is pretty good but not dominant. Inconsistent and beatable. Not like Lin Dan when he was the champ. Kidambi's main challenge will come from himself and then Axelsen and Chen Long. Momota if he returns to where he was could be a potential challenger.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 13 Apr 2018 18:28

AG shooting will be more closer to world standards and will be the real test. They should send the juniors in place of those who did not win anything in CWG.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 13 Apr 2018 18:29

http://bwfbadminton.com/rankings/2/bwf- ... les/2017/5

japan has 5 in the top 25 women. the most of any country.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 13 Apr 2018 19:47

Kidambi's ranking means nothing. All that matters is having big titles to his name - Olympic gold, WC gold, All England gold. His greatest achievement so far is not #1 ranking but beating Lin Dan in the final of China Open, one of the Big Four events.

Our boxers are doing surprisingly well. Minimum 7 silvers guaranteed . We've never done anywhere close to this good. Usually we'd make it near medal round and lose to someone from a more technically sound country, like England or especially Northern Ireland who are a boxing powerhouse. This time, many of our boxers thrashed ENG or NIR boxers on the way to final. Clearly Santiago Nieva has done wonders to make our raw talent aware of basic boxing technique and skills, at least to dominate at this level.

Wrestlers disappointed today. Just one gold out of the four up for grabs. Canada are doing better than us.

Saturday should complete our performance picture: 4 golds up for grabs in wrestling, 7 in boxing, TT, badminton and squash medal rounds represented . Plus two potentials in shooting. From present 17, a final tally of 20 golds would be an expectation. 25 would be outstanding.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Karthik S » 13 Apr 2018 20:30

Why does in Olympics England, Scotland and Wales play under Great Britain and in Commonwealth they play separately ?

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 13 Apr 2018 21:51

They play in European and Olympic games as United Kingdom. While in commonwealth games (former part of british empire). They play as their own.


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