Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

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Supratik
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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 29 Aug 2018 23:36


Suraj
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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 29 Aug 2018 23:43

Supratik wrote:India to bid for 2026 Youth olympics, 2030 AG and 2032 OG. I am not sure if OG is a good idea at our stage of sport achievements.

OG is a bad idea until we are able to win 5-10 golds per games in a few OGs. I also don't want us to waste money on them - they're too big to succeed anymore.

If we're going to host AG, we need to plan ahead and PACK it with fluff. At least one Indian martial art with 5-6 weight categories, mens and womens. That's 10-12 golds. More such sports. We need about 20-30 golds from these, on top of regular sports. Get rid of Pencak Silat and replace it with... I don't know - snake charming with 5 categories using different snakes, multiple snakes in synchronized bobbing or whatever, for all I care. If others can have their share of ridiculous, so can we.

I have no illusions about 'building a sports culture in the country' . I want us to win and show up at the top of medal charts. Success - even manufactured through selective targeting and training in specific niches - breeds desire and aspiration for greater success. China has no 'sporting culture' as such. What they have is an excellent sports school system to extract and hone talent. Rest of youth is out of shape, in their thick glasses with bad eyesight studying for university entrance exams, same as us. The IMDB review page for "3 Idiots" has a surprising number of Chinese/Singaporean/SoKo comments expressing how much they identify with the movie, and many of them beat down the negative comments of westerners who don't get what the Asian school system is like.

Added: Agree with Bajwa - summer youth games, Universiade, world U20 games etc are all excellent. Show the youngsters how they benchmark on the world stage. That's good enough to push them. We already have one gold in each of the last two U20 world athletics events - Neeraj Chopra in 2016, Hima Das in 2018.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 29 Aug 2018 23:47

Summer Youth games is a good idea as it will give exposure to Indian youth!

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Deans » 30 Aug 2018 00:00

Suraj wrote:
SBajwa wrote:Few athletic events, Hockey, Boxing, Bridge, Golf, etc.

Squash - we won the team gold last time and we can shoot for it again in both men’s and women’s team. Sourav Ghosal wasted his top seeding in the individual event to only win bronze so he can make up in the team event .

Athletics has been impressive with 5 golds so far . Could have been 10 but for Africans blocking us - literally in one case . Pity that Bahrain were not disqualified - I’m guessing there was insufficient proof due to lack of videos .


2 medals should be possible in sailing. With 12 of 14 races complete, we are in a medal position in 2 of the 4 events we participated in.
Sure = 2 in squash, 2 in boxing, 2 in hockey
Possible = 4 more in athletics and 1-2 in bridge.
Outside chance = Women's TT singles & 1 between Kurush/Judo/Canoeing.

That will take us to our highest ever total in the AG. The previous highest was 63.
We will also cross our previous highest of 31 Gold+Silver medals. I believe Gold+Silver is a more relevant measure of sporting success, since it
disregards `near misses' (e.g. relay protest & men's archery point recount) or the fact that 4 of our Silvers should have been gold, if the gold winner
was really Asian and not an African or Jamaican import.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chola » 30 Aug 2018 00:12

Singha wrote:silver for duttee chand in 200m, behind yet another honorary 'arab' . she is the smallest of the whole 8.



No shame in losing to what looks like an African man in the 200m.

Duttee winning ahead of those TFTA looking yellows and goris from Cheen and CarStans is pride enough. She is the actual Asian champion.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 30 Aug 2018 00:19

One interesting tidbit. If you look at medals starting from 1990 when the economy started getting liberalized you will see a co-relation with GDP i.e. our medals started expanding with GDP growth.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby bharotshontan » 30 Aug 2018 00:33

It is in a way okay by me that Africans are competing on behalf of Arab countries. This gives a preview and direct way to measure against global standards prior to Olympics.

Just like India seems to have internationally come out of equal equal with Pakistan and then I'd daresay with China as well as our own power in our own right... I'd say it is time for Indian athletics to keep Asia in mind but shoot for global competitiveness.

There is no reason to defer to Africans as genetically superior. Plenty of natural high lean muscle mass in desh.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 30 Aug 2018 00:34

by Supratik
One interesting tidbit. If you look at medals starting from 1990 when the economy started getting liberalized you will see a co-relation with GDP i.e. our medals started expanding with GDP growth.


A two acre farmer's daughter (Hima Das) wins Asian Games Silver. A rickshaw driver's daughter (Swapna Barman) wins Asian Gold! A below poverty line weaver's daughter (Dutee Chand) wins Silver.

Arpinder Singh (father has 30 acre farm in Jind haryana) and Manjit Singh (son of a middle class farmer from Amritsar) both belong to middle to upper class families.

It is definitely economy and great person like Gopichand (who saved Dutee Chand from getting barred from running)

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 01:38

Day 12
main medal prospects:
Bridge - mens, womens, mixed
Men's 1500m (Manjit Singh and Jinson Johnson again)
Mens and womens 4x400m relay
Womens discus

Other prospects
Kurash (turns out it's a variant of judo, and all our medalists are ex judokas)
Women's 1500m
Mens 5000m (Lakshmanan get a chance at redemption after DQing in 10K following bronze)

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby SBajwa » 30 Aug 2018 02:25

also Boxing

Amit and Vikas Krishnan are playing in semi finals.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 02:31

Day 12 (Thursday) is a rest day for boxing. I only counted events that have medal rounds for Day 12.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Deans » 30 Aug 2018 10:51

Supratik wrote:One interesting tidbit. If you look at medals starting from 1990 when the economy started getting liberalized you will see a co-relation with GDP i.e. our medals started expanding with GDP growth.


Yes, same with China. The reverse is true of Pak. Their medals started dropping sharply when they regressed as a society, since 1991, both
economically and in terms of the path and priority society chose to follow (Islam and supporting the military).

A problem with India is not just the number of kids who have the right nutrition and access to basic education and facilities (barely 5%),
but the difficulty of spotting talent in a country our size and having talented kids access to a sports infrastructure (equipment, coaching).
That's why its easier to develop talent in Hariyana rather than UP.

Then comes the matter of funding these athletes and creating a sports culture to ensure that these kids don't drop out due to board exams/
marriage/ financial problems. Where we do have sports facilities, my guess is that the capacity utilisation is far less than what is it in the West.
We may lament the fact that the UK has 240 football grounds of FIFA standard (against possibly 24 in India). What is more important IMO is that each of those 240 grounds are utilised for about 180 days a year (bad weather accounts for most of the remaining) while our grounds have possibly under
30 days of football.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby disha » 30 Aug 2018 12:45

Day 12 - Gold Alert!

News I heard is that we got 2 Gold today.

(Or I am reading Day 11 news :(( :( )

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 15:54

a moroccan now imported by bahrain seems main contender for the 1500m ("miler throne") vs our two boys

Men's 50km: Sandeep Kumar (4.30 AM IST)
Discus Throw: Sandeep Kumari, Seema Punia (5.10 pm IST)

Women's 1500m final: Chitra PU, Monika Chaudhary (5.50 pm IST)
Men's 1500m final: Manjit Singh, Jinson Johnson (6.05 pm IST)
Men's 5000m final: G Lakshmanan (6.30 pm IST)
Women's 4*400m Relay: Indian team (6.50 pm IST)
Men's 4*400m Relay: Indian team (7:10 pm IST)

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Vips » 30 Aug 2018 18:43

India's Jinson Johnson wins gold in 1500m

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Ashokk » 30 Aug 2018 19:12

13th GOLD for India in Women's 4x400m Relay
Defending champions India (Hima Das, MR Poovamma, Saritaben Gayakwad and Vismaya Koroth) clinch gold with a timing of 3:28.72s

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby VKumar » 30 Aug 2018 19:15

Hockey lost 7-6 in shootout to Malaysia

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 19:49

watched live today
- Jinson johnson won 1500m in good margin, Manjit was hemmed in at the back and could not break out in time - finished a distant 4th
- women 4x400m relay - fluent win , with hima das running a great first leg and other following through with good technique and consistency.
- men 4x400m relay - 1 step ahead of japan for the silver. imported rafale 4xbahrainis took the gold.
- men 5000m - govindan finished 6th, 2 world class imported qataris took 1-2 by huge margin
- women 1500m - chitra unnikrishnan took bronze

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 30 Aug 2018 19:59

We have lost 3 golds in sports where we should have won. 2 in Kabaddi and 1 in hockey. Overconfidence is the likely reason.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 30 Aug 2018 20:02

Fabulous performance in atheltics. 19 medals, 7 golds. I hope they take the young ones and give them the best facilities, coaches and make them compete in European and world leagues and meets.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Ashokk » 30 Aug 2018 20:03


Suraj
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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 20:27

Hockey performance continues to prove that team sports are unreliable as gold medal fetchers. Quite possible we will end up with 0 golds out of 4 between hockey and kabaddi. Scoring 76 goals in league stage is pointless when they can't even make the final.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby jpremnath » 30 Aug 2018 20:40

Bahrain is nipping behind us with 12 gold to our 13...we could have cleared Uzbeks and Taiwan if we managed to get Hockey and Kabaddi holds..ah well...Is there any more events where we have hopes for gold?

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Deans » 30 Aug 2018 20:48

Supratik wrote:We have lost 3 golds in sports where we should have won. 2 in Kabaddi and 1 in hockey. Overconfidence is the likely reason.


We lost to better opponents in Kabaddi though we certainly seemed complacent.
Archery (Men's compound) IMO was lost due to a huge cock up in scoring in the last round.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 20:48

Supratik wrote:Fabulous performance in atheltics. 19 medals, 7 golds. I hope they take the young ones and give them the best facilities, coaches and make them compete in European and world leagues and meets.


4 more golds (2 to dutee, 1 to hima, 1 to mens 4x400) lost to honorary arabs. all became silver.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 20:50

jpremnath wrote:Bahrain is nipping behind us with 12 gold to our 13...we could have cleared Uzbeks and Taiwan if we managed to get Hockey and Kabaddi holds..ah well...Is there any more events where we have hopes for gold?


show me 1 native bahraini or qatari born holding those golds. a mockery has been made of the system, like hiring a top100 JEE kamandu studying in 1st year to appear on candidates behalf :D

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 20:52

what i liked about hima and duttee both was their smiling confident posture in high pressure make or break final runs.

aane do saalo ko kind of attitude.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 20:57

My problem with those stating it's ok that we have Africans for competitors because it makes us better, is this - yes technically everyone benefits from better competition.

But this is not a legal process. Bahrain and Qatar does not give citizenship to a single Indian who worked there decades, set up companies , build their monuments, never broke their law. Their naturalization durations are 25 years each after which your application depends on the big cheese deciding whether or not to naturalize you (almost 100% decline rate).

And then when it suits them they 'naturalize' a bunch of sportspeople without any statutory basis which means tomorrow they can take it away and send these people back to Africa.

Provided they had normal laws, I have no problem with them naturalizing people. But they don't have any immigration law. They just offer cash and a 'certificate' and the rest of the world's supposed to believe that's all fine and dandy, while the average Mallu in Gelf has no hope of ever getting citizenship there and getting to access the great welfare programs after a lifetime of working there.

Think about the big picture here. If one wants African competition, we set up an Afro-Asian games for it too. It never got off the ground.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 20:59

Singha wrote:what i liked about hima and duttee both was their smiling confident posture in high pressure make or break final runs.

aane do saalo ko kind of attitude.

We have stopped wetting our pants when we see Chn/Jpn/SoKo beside us in the final. If anything, in several sports we strike fear in others 'these guys are dangerous now - even their 15-16 years olds are winning gold'. 7 golds in Athletics is an outstanding performance. That's really 17 in the 'Deans tally' of G+S since we have 10 silvers too.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chola » 30 Aug 2018 21:05

Singha wrote:
jpremnath wrote:Bahrain is nipping behind us with 12 gold to our 13...we could have cleared Uzbeks and Taiwan if we managed to get Hockey and Kabaddi holds..ah well...Is there any more events where we have hopes for gold?


show me 1 native bahraini or qatari born holding those golds. a mockery has been made of the system, like hiring a top100 JEE kamandu studying in 1st year to appear on candidates behalf :D


Really freaking irritating. Phoney imported Bahrainis stole at least two golds from us and they are nipping at our ankles on the rankings.

We could pass our all time of 65 medals (Guangzhou 2010) as we have a few days yet.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Prasad » 30 Aug 2018 21:10

You know, despite the loss of golds, what I really like is, we're now comparing our performances to Olympics levels and wondering if we'd get gold or bronze. Some solid support at ground level and we'll beat the crap out of anyone. I want us to win 100m freestyle in the Olympics and wipe the $hit-eating smug grins off the brits and amrikis.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 21:21

Prasad wrote:You know, despite the loss of golds, what I really like is, we're now comparing our performances to Olympics levels and wondering if we'd get gold or bronze. Some solid support at ground level and we'll beat the crap out of anyone. I want us to win 100m freestyle in the Olympics and wipe the $hit-eating smug grins off the brits and amrikis.

We are getting there faster than we might realize. In AG speed events (short races in running) the hierarchy was:
East Asians > SEAsians > SDRE
After 2006 it became
Africans > East Asians > SDRE
Now it is
Africans > SDRE > East Asians

We've repeatedly pushed China/Japan to 3rd or 4th in sprints here while finishing behind Africans.

In field events, it was
East Asians > everyone else
Now it is either
SDRE > East Asians or
CAsians > SDRE/East Asians

Among all that, there's one guy whose performance would have also won a medals, even gold, at recent Olympics - Neeraj Chopra.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 21:51

japan and indonesia and sri lanka historically in AG had good short sprinters among men.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Suraj » 30 Aug 2018 22:03

Yes SL had some great sprinters , women especially. They hold women’s short sprint Asian records still . TSP used to usually finish above us in medal table in the 1960s at AG and CWG . Look it up . I’m glad I wasn’t born then - what a terrible time to have been an Indian then . We were weak, powerless and ashamed .

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby nam » 30 Aug 2018 22:08

4X400 relay was totally super. They put the best player at first to get a tremendous lead, which even the Africans couldn't beat.

What is amazing is it breaking the sterotype being built of Indian woman being weak and abla nari, oppressed by Indian men. Indian women in track & field is the pinnacle.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby chola » 30 Aug 2018 22:39

Prasad wrote:You know, despite the loss of golds, what I really like is, we're now comparing our performances to Olympics levels and wondering if we'd get gold or bronze. Some solid support at ground level and we'll beat the crap out of anyone. I want us to win 100m freestyle in the Olympics and wipe the $hit-eating smug grins off the brits and amrikis.


At Rio, Amrikis and Britshits went 1st and 3rd in women’s 4x100 but not even on the podium in men’s. Japan finished second in men’s and Cheen was fourth so AG have world class sprinters outside the Africans imports.

Japan took gold last night in 4x100m Men. But Indonesia beat Cheen for the silver! How the hell the Indonesians get a sprint team of that caliber out of nowhere?

In women’s 4x100m, the Bahrainis are at it again, with their imports beating Cheen for gold.

We get past Asian Games, our sprinters have a chance at OG.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby disha » 30 Aug 2018 22:39

nam wrote:4X400 relay was totally super. They put the best player at first to get a tremendous lead, which even the Africans couldn't beat.

What is amazing is it breaking the sterotype being built of Indian woman being weak and abla nari, oppressed by Indian men. Indian women in track & field is the pinnacle.


It was a pleasure to watch the 4x400 women's. The commentator's bakiness was very obvious, since he started off with Baaahreign being the favourites and commented that Indians will be barely able to hang on to a lead and striving to hang on to a lead.

In the 3rd lap when India was leading by 30m the gora's bakiness fell out of his a$$, since just prior to that he was commenting how the queen of the track is beating down on the weak Indian athlete ahead and later when in the fourth lap it was apparent that India is going to win the gold he started talking about the Indian tactics and how putting Hima Das in the 1st lap got India a major win.

This are the moments you feel proud. A daughter of a subsistence farmer here, a daughter of a rickshaw puller there - this individuals rise up from very humble beginnings and give us the pride in return of the faith reposed in them.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby disha » 30 Aug 2018 23:13

Must read: https://swarajyamag.com/insta/how-swapna-barman-overcame-poverty-immense-pain-to-give-india-its-first-heptathlon-gold-at-asian-games

India's first Heptathlon. Can somebody (preferably from Bengal) help her get specialized shoes? She has 6-toes and the normal average shoes causes her pain. Also she needs a nutritionist, a dentist and in general a coach.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Supratik » 30 Aug 2018 23:17

She is most likely going to go into the TOPS scheme.

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Re: Indian Sports and Entertainment Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Aug 2018 23:19

Jinson won the 1500 with two long strips of kinseo tape on his hamstrings

It was a commanding david rudisha kind of front running victory


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