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Solar energy in India

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Theo_Fidel
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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 24 Jul 2017 23:16

Gyan wrote: PV plus battery may be lower still but I am looking at from India point of view where CSP makes us import independent.


Is this import situation still true for modern CSP. I had a limited exposure to the Ivanpah plant and from what I remember the equipment and materials for the plant to operate @ 550C were very high end. In fact much of tubing with high temperature heat trace came from Japan. Much of high end abrasion resistant and high reflective glass came from Texas/UK IIRC. The power block in particular was a very complicated to run without water cooling, with large chunk coming from Italy/Germany. The handful of CSP plant in India so far were built from imported knock-down kits.

To be fair I think many of these components can be eventually made in India. But for it to be economical there has to a large world scale demand locally, something that does not exist yet. Without that scale, these prices may not be viable India local equipment. This is something we learned the hard way in CSi PV. The Chile CSP plant, if I read correctly, is to be largely imported from global factories.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 25 Jul 2017 01:57

Meanwhile….

Solar tariff rates are viable down to Rs 1.5 / kwh right now in India.

And that is not the lowest. I was reading a paper on the weekend that said in essence that costs in single axis 10 degree tracking have dropped so dramatically as the industry scales up that prices close to 1.5 cents / kwh will be possible in the medium term. This is sub Rs 1 type tariffs.

What happens when Solar CSi PV drops below Rs 1 per kwhr? It will be interesting to see. Is any other power source even viable at that point?
--------------------------------

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/deve ... 70436.html

"The developers are ready for another round of aggressive biddings and think that the solar power tariff is viable even at Rs 1.5 per unit," the source said further.
The cost of solar equipment was around Rs 20 crore per MW and tariff was around Rs 15 per unit about 7-8 years ago. But with the passage of time and economies of scales at play, the cost of equipment today ranges between Rs 4-4.5 crore per MW and cost of borrowing has come down by about 4 per cent.


A banker on the condition of anonymity said that the instance of bad loan is even less than a fraction of a percentage point, which is a clear indication that these renewable projects with low tariff are viable.


----------------------
Also...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-china ... SKBN1A51JJ

China's solar industry is expected to produce 25 percent more panels in 2017 than last year, supported by domestic sales and demand from the United States and emerging markets, the head of a Chinese industry association said.

China was expected to produce solar panels with a combined capacity of 60 gigawatts (GW) this year, said Wang Bohua, secretary general of China's photovoltaic industry association.

China produced panels with capacity of 48 GW in 2016.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 25 Jul 2017 23:41

Theo with CSP I meant inherently all raw materials will be available in India unlike say LPG or Crude Oil or lithium which will always be imported. If we can make nuke plants, we can make CSP, one day.

I think by 2025 the hybrid 24/7 Solar plants tariff will fall to US 6 cents per kwh and thereafter from 2030 onwards practically no grid level new fossil fuel plant will ever be commissioned.

But lest we forget crude oil prices can also fall. GCC cost of production is around USD 1 per barrel.

Something new:-

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1AA035

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby VishalJ » 09 Aug 2017 16:52


ashish raval
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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashish raval » 15 Aug 2017 18:03

My father in desh in Gujarat just placed order of a 2kw solar roof top panel unit for 78k after deducting govt subsidy. They claim to generate 8-10 unit a day and unused energy feeds into grid and electricity board pays for contribution to grid.

Atleast 5 homes in street of 20 homes has already installed it now and order are pouring it at huge speed as people catch the fancy and retired souls needs things to entertain and talk about..

Having said this Adani Solar is providing panels and some parts of that kit contains some Chinese input all of them is assembled in India per se. I hate even tiny input from lizard but to be fair we will have to live with it for few more years when whole kit is desi..

I had been urging this for years but it seems prices has come down massively now to convince my father to take it on.

Break even in 25 years seems perfect timing for my retirement into desh.

Guess people should consider it as good option now as worthy investment of spare cash.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby srin » 15 Aug 2017 20:14

That's good news. I remember the time when roof top solar water heater prices toppled. We installed it some 15 years back and got a 0% interest loan from HDFC to cover it. Many independent row houses in Bangalore residential areas have it now.

A 2KW for 78k is already quite affordable. Last time I checked (7-8 years ago) it used to be around 100K for 1KW. Hoping it is going to fall much further and banks can also finance it at real cheap rates.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashish raval » 16 Aug 2017 02:23

srin wrote:That's good news. I remember the time when roof top solar water heater prices toppled. We installed it some 15 years back and got a 0% interest loan from HDFC to cover it. Many independent row houses in Bangalore residential areas have it now.

A 2KW for 78k is already quite affordable. Last time I checked (7-8 years ago) it used to be around 100K for 1KW. Hoping it is going to fall much further and banks can also finance it at real cheap rates.

Totally agree. It will half in next two years at this rate..I was quoted 5lakhs approximately 5 years back for a 10 is unit. Guess this is major indirect addition to electricity generation and should help smash targets for climate change way before anyone could think we can.

Imagine doing this at rate of 10000 is a day in whole of India and we are looking at massive reduction in home electricity demand via grid and increased supply of energy for industries to compete lizard and setting up more data centres.

All power to Surya Dev. Alternative energy was my fav subject during undergraduate days 1.5 decade ago unfortunately there was no encouragement, will or resources which lead me to not pursue my interest in it.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Rishirishi » 17 Aug 2017 03:46

ashish raval wrote:
srin wrote:That's good news. I remember the time when roof top solar water heater prices toppled. We installed it some 15 years back and got a 0% interest loan from HDFC to cover it. Many independent row houses in Bangalore residential areas have it now.

A 2KW for 78k is already quite affordable. Last time I checked (7-8 years ago) it used to be around 100K for 1KW. Hoping it is going to fall much further and banks can also finance it at real cheap rates.

Totally agree. It will half in next two years at this rate..I was quoted 5lakhs approximately 5 years back for a 10 is unit. Guess this is major indirect addition to electricity generation and should help smash targets for climate change way before anyone could think we can.

Imagine doing this at rate of 10000 is a day in whole of India and we are looking at massive reduction in home electricity demand via grid and increased supply of energy for industries to compete lizard and setting up more data centres.

All power to Surya Dev. Alternative energy was my fav subject during undergraduate days 1.5 decade ago unfortunately there was no encouragement, will or resources which lead me to not pursue my interest in it.



Prices for an offgrid (system that include battery) will cost arround 1lack per KW.

If you calculate 10 hours per day into 320 days you will get 3200 units. At Rs 8 per unit you get electricity worth Rs 25 600. This is about to take off in a big way.


http://www.solarenergypanels.in/solar-power-plants/1kw-2kw-5kw-10kw-off-grid-solar-power-plants

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashish raval » 18 Aug 2017 03:12

Rishirishi wrote:
ashish raval wrote:Totally agree. It will half in next two years at this rate..I was quoted 5lakhs approximately 5 years back for a 10 is unit. Guess this is major indirect addition to electricity generation and should help smash targets for climate change way before anyone could think we can.

Imagine doing this at rate of 10000 is a day in whole of India and we are looking at massive reduction in home electricity demand via grid and increased supply of energy for industries to compete lizard and setting up more data centres.

All power to Surya Dev. Alternative energy was my fav subject during undergraduate days 1.5 decade ago unfortunately there was no encouragement, will or resources which lead me to not pursue my interest in it.



Prices for an offgrid (system that include battery) will cost arround 1lack per KW.

If you calculate 10 hours per day into 320 days you will get 3200 units. At Rs 8 per unit you get electricity worth Rs 25 600. This is about to take off in a big way.


http://www.solarenergypanels.in/solar-power-plants/1kw-2kw-5kw-10kw-off-grid-solar-power-plants


True but the calculation is that for a normal house there will be only 8 units surplus per day at the most and the board only pays 3.25 rs per unit for supplying into grid for excess so let's say it is 10k worth electricity per year. To be fair breaking even in 10 years is not bad either and they reckon life of 25 years for inverter set etc.. theoretically it could last longer than that if it is well made.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Rishirishi » 18 Aug 2017 04:50

True but the calculation is that for a normal house there will be only 8 units surplus per day at the most and the board only pays 3.25 rs per unit for supplying into grid for excess so let's say it is 10k worth electricity per year. To be fair breaking even in 10 years is not bad either and they reckon life of 25 years for inverter set etc.. theoretically it could last longer than that if it is well made.


I am talking about "off grid". This mean you simply cut the connection for power and become self sufficient. As the battery prices and solar panel prices are diving, it is only a matter of time, before the cost of having a solar system becomes cheper then even the distribution cost.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashthor » 18 Aug 2017 16:10

I am planning to get it done...Contacted tata and sukam guys who said their sales guys will get in touch. 3-4 months no news of
them. Now i am talking to a local guy who says it will cost 70-80k per kw...this includes the govt subsides.

Looking to install 4kw which he says will run 2 a/c along with the fridge. But not the water pump.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 19 Aug 2017 00:06

Gyan,

This is for you. Looks like they are ahead of schedule and below your estimate already!

$500 Million for 150 MW ~$3.4 Billion per 1000MW capacity.... .. w/ storage....
-----------------------

SolarReserve Inks Deal With South Australia to Supply Solar Thermal Power With Storage for 6 Cents

https://arstechnica.com/information-tec ... comments=1

SolarReserve’s South Australia project, called "Aurora," will cost AUD $650 million (US $512 million) to build and will produce 495 gigawatt-hours of energy annually, “which is around five percent of South Australia’s energy needs,” the company says. The solar thermal energy company specifies that Aurora will operate at 135MW “under normal operating conditions” for about eight hours, but the plant does have the ability to increase its output to 150MW when needed. “Our technology is incredibly flexible to the needs of the grid operators," SolarReserve spokesperson Mary Grikas told Ars. Despite being solar-powered, “it’s decoupled from sunshine,” she said.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashish raval » 19 Aug 2017 03:51

ashthor wrote:I am planning to get it done...Contacted tata and sukam guys who said their sales guys will get in touch. 3-4 months no news of
them. Now i am talking to a local guy who says it will cost 70-80k per kw...this includes the govt subsides.

Looking to install 4kw which he says will run 2 a/c along with the fridge. But not the water pump.

80k per kilo watt is twice the price that my parents got it done in Gujarat!! Don't expect that high price anywhere.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby kit » 19 Aug 2017 16:43

Theo_Fidel wrote:
Varoon Shekhar wrote:Where did India trip up, simply absence of a plan to invest?


It wasn’t just India. The entire world other than China/Taiwan was caught with its pants down. Witness the desperate moves in USA to save their domestic industry. All of this was foreseeable, and years ago on BRF folks like me, (Chanakya, where is he) did the math to show that at increasing scale solar would approach 2 cents/kw ~ Rs 1 per kw, at which point all bets are off. Though to be honest even I underestimated the speed of the impact on the Thermal Power companies.

The main problem as I see it was that MNRE in 2007-2009, finally notified in 2012 time frame, had a total Solar power target of 10,000mw by 2022. Or about 1,000 MW of solar manufacturing per year. Note that that exactly matches the present production capacity. Some one within GOI planning commissioned that. Meanwhile China took it more seriously and installed the equipment for 38,000MW of panels in one year. They now have equipment to produce 76,000MW/year of equipment. And are working on doubling it again to 150,000 MW/year by 2020. My own view is that it was Anil Kakodkar who was special appointed by MMS at the time to lead the solar install movement who should take a chunk of blame for this. Mr Kakodkar was a Nuclear guy, and either he or folks in his circles either directly or had the ear of people in the know who said that 1,000MW would be adequate and down played the potential of solar. At that time I said that appointing Mr Kakodkar was a questionable move and I ended up getting shouted down. I think you can still go back and read these notes on BRF. A simple back of the envelope calculation in the right circles could have saved India Solar manufacturing. But it wasn’t done, so here we are…. ….India now installs about 10 times manufacturing capacity per year right now. There are single solar power plants that have more than 1,000 MW equipment in them. TN just concluded a single tender for 1.5 GW. GOI has reset the target to 175,000MW by 2025. No one in their right mind thinks it is going to stop there. NRDC just published a report that 3% of Indias wasteland would be enough to power all of India including transportation. Does anyone seriously still doubt we won’t cover 3% of wasteland with panels. I have full faith in the Indian ability to exploit this cheap power ….


interesting info ! .. BRF is always ahead of the curve . Maybe the policy makers must become members as a forethought .

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 19 Aug 2017 17:58

Theo_Fidel wrote:Gyan,

This is for you. Looks like they are ahead of schedule and below your estimate already!

$500 Million for 150 MW ~$3.4 Billion per 1000MW capacity.... .. w/ storage....
-----------------------

SolarReserve Inks Deal With South Australia to Supply Solar Thermal Power With Storage for 6 Cents

https://arstechnica.com/information-tec ... comments=1

SolarReserve’s South Australia project, called "Aurora," will cost AUD $650 million (US $512 million) to build and will produce 495 gigawatt-hours of energy annually, “which is around five percent of South Australia’s energy needs,” the company says. The solar thermal energy company specifies that Aurora will operate at 135MW “under normal operating conditions” for about eight hours, but the plant does have the ability to increase its output to 150MW when needed. “Our technology is incredibly flexible to the needs of the grid operators," SolarReserve spokesperson Mary Grikas told Ars. Despite being solar-powered, “it’s decoupled from sunshine,” she said.


Theo I was talking about 18 hours storage with Dubai CSP plants. This Australian plant has 8 hours storage and average theoratical output of 50MW evenly for 24 hours. On that basis USD 10 million investment per MW of 24 hour renewable solar power continues to hold.

My personal view is that PV + CSP Solar giving 24 hours power will not go below US 6 Cents per kwh until at least 2030 or ever. But I will be very happy for India if proved completely wrong.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Rishirishi » 21 Aug 2017 01:01

My personal view is that PV + CSP Solar giving 24 hours power will not go below US 6 Cents per kwh until at least 2030 or ever. But I will be very happy for India if proved completely wrong


Fourtunately we do not need 24hours of linar solar power supply. We need less electricity during evening and night. Power intensive industires may only function when sun is up and shining. Power in the eveing and night can be supplied from Hydro, wind or even gas power plants working as backup.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 21 Aug 2017 20:10

Hi Rishi,

The CSP plant really is designed for the last 25% to 30%. Where daily storage and seasonal storage and yes 24 hours dispatchable become more important. Which is what Gyan and I were batting back and forth. Esp. what the ultimate cost number can be, based on materials and ultimate cost reductions. Somewhere in the $ 8 cent / kwhr range was the estimate for 24 hours (not 7) power. WRT the Australian plant, running the numbers, that cost and production and higher maintenance level gives me an IRR of -2%. So looks like a loss leader or break even type project. Either that or they they think they can bring costs down by the time construction gets going...

Your point though is exactly true upto about 75%-80%. None one really knows where that limit is. More rigid and inflexible grids like India maybe a lot lower. Recently the CEA issued a note which hinted that GOI internal does not think above 15% is feasible. A big reason appears to be that above that coal power plants PLF drops below the loan rates and become NPA. GOI will resist higher penetration. I believe TN is already 30%-35% wind+PV, so higher levels do happen within India with some issues.

The coal plants we have could increasingly be pushed into a seasonal storage power, with storage top up role. Not dissimilar to the 7 days coal we store at power plants. But not until they are paid off per GOI internals. And we would need fewer of them and they could run longer hours....

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Rishirishi » 22 Aug 2017 03:10

Theo_Fidel wrote:Hi Rishi,

The CSP plant really is designed for the last 25% to 30%. Where daily storage and seasonal storage and yes 24 hours dispatchable become more important. Which is what Gyan and I were batting back and forth. Esp. what the ultimate cost number can be, based on materials and ultimate cost reductions. Somewhere in the $ 8 cent / kwhr range was the estimate for 24 hours (not 7) power. WRT the Australian plant, running the numbers, that cost and production and higher maintenance level gives me an IRR of -2%. So looks like a loss leader or break even type project. Either that or they they think they can bring costs down by the time construction gets going...

Your point though is exactly true upto about 75%-80%. None one really knows where that limit is. More rigid and inflexible grids like India maybe a lot lower. Recently the CEA issued a note which hinted that GOI internal does not think above 15% is feasible. A big reason appears to be that above that coal power plants PLF drops below the loan rates and become NPA. GOI will resist higher penetration. I believe TN is already 30%-35% wind+PV, so higher levels do happen within India with some issues.

The coal plants we have could increasingly be pushed into a seasonal storage power, with storage top up role. Not dissimilar to the 7 days coal we store at power plants. But not until they are paid off per GOI internals. And we would need fewer of them and they could run longer hours....


Thanks for the insight.
The costly power infrastructure certainly needs to be payed off. Fortunatly the power demand will probably grow.

What i am saying is that Solar can fill the gap of peak demand during daytime as well as make the country energy independent. It is possible.
India urgently needs to start manufacturing PV cells.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ashthor » 22 Aug 2017 12:57

ashish raval wrote:
ashthor wrote:I am planning to get it done...Contacted tata and sukam guys who said their sales guys will get in touch. 3-4 months no news of
them. Now i am talking to a local guy who says it will cost 70-80k per kw...this includes the govt subsides.

Looking to install 4kw which he says will run 2 a/c along with the fridge. But not the water pump.

80k per kilo watt is twice the price that my parents got it done in Gujarat!! Don't expect that high price anywhere.


I think the Gujarat govt gives subsidies over and above the central govt subsidies.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 22 Aug 2017 17:45

Batteries of electric cars can work well with Renewable sources as they can top off when power is surplus/available. I think by 2021 we will have at least 2 million all electric cars joining the fleet with growth rate of 33% per annum for atleast 10 years. It will become difficult to sustain Crude oil above USD 30-40 per barrel.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 22 Aug 2017 23:28

Meanwhile, one little nugget....

Admittedly, this 12 cents/watt is factory price but this was the forecast price for 2050! They have hit this price this year, 23 years ahead of schedule....

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2017/07/24/ ... in-a-year/

The data also shows that the average module manufacturing cost in China is now below $0.12/W, while utilization rates in the second quarter (Q2) of the year were higher than the same period last year, at 85%. China’s solar sector once again rushed towards a June 30 FIT-reduction deadline this year, mirroring 2016’s early-year rush.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Rishirishi » 23 Aug 2017 04:24

Gyan wrote:Batteries of electric cars can work well with Renewable sources as they can top off when power is surplus/available. I think by 2021 we will have at least 2 million all electric cars joining the fleet with growth rate of 33% per annum for atleast 10 years. It will become difficult to sustain Crude oil above USD 30-40 per barrel.


I think it will be more disruptive in nature. BRF already has calculated the theoretical material price of battery to be arround 25USD per Kwh. The current prices quoted range from 100 to 150 USD per Kwh.
A car the size of Carolla/Etios will require arround 50Kwh to comfortably manage 250Km with AC on.

lets do the math.

Let us say USD 50 per kwh and a batterypack of 50Kwh. That will cost USD 2500 or RS 165 000. Now let us say that electricity cost is Rs 4 per Kwh (supply of solar peak, in daytime). For RS 200 you can drive 250KM. :shock: That is equal to cost as having a car that gives 90KM per liter of fuel

Sounds like fantasyland...

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 23 Aug 2017 12:29

Yes, that's possible but I am going by committed investments or tenders already awarded. So Tesla price gives FIRM indications or trends till 2018-2020.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 23 Aug 2017 23:32

BTW, has anything more been said about the 2030 ban on new petrol/diesel cars in India?

I'm just thinking about the charging infrastructure and the weak local electric grid in India. Installing the new 350 kw chargers is a non-trivial exercise in India. Hope someone is keeping that in mind...

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby brvarsh » 24 Aug 2017 01:01

I am sure this has been said in the list but Solar and other non fossil energy sources have critical strategic value. Lesser reliance on fossil fuel directly translates to greater leverage. Solar is plentiful and should be encouraged for people to deploy and Government must share some of its cost or give tax benefits.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 24 Aug 2017 10:14

Forget complex Li Ion batteries. In small towns locally assembled Lead Acid Batteries are being used by short distance auto rickshaws. 2018-2020 will become inflexion time for electric cars. All car majors will have to put out mainstream electric cars between 2021-2023. Around 2025, new macro economic dynamics will emerge in energy markets.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 24 Aug 2017 10:19

Theo_Fidel wrote:Hi Rishi,

The CSP plant really is designed for the last 25% to 30%. Where daily storage and seasonal storage and yes 24 hours dispatchable become more important. Which is what Gyan and I were batting back and forth. Esp. what the ultimate cost number can be, based on materials and ultimate cost reductions. Somewhere in the $ 8 cent / kwhr range was the estimate for 24 hours (not 7) power. WRT the Australian plant, running the numbers, that cost and production and higher maintenance level gives me an IRR of -2%. So looks like a loss leader or break even type project. Either that or they they think they can bring costs down by the time construction gets going...

Your point though is exactly true upto about 75%-80%. None one really knows where that limit is. More rigid and inflexible grids like India maybe a lot lower. Recently the CEA issued a note which hinted that GOI internal does not think above 15% is feasible. A big reason appears to be that above that coal power plants PLF drops below the loan rates and become NPA. GOI will resist higher penetration. I believe TN is already 30%-35% wind+PV, so higher levels do happen within India with some issues.

The coal plants we have could increasingly be pushed into a seasonal storage power, with storage top up role. Not dissimilar to the 7 days coal we store at power plants. But not until they are paid off per GOI internals. And we would need fewer of them and they could run longer hours....


What's contracted rate per kwh for Australian CSP solar? I could not locate it.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 24 Aug 2017 10:22

FYI. The total contribution of solar power to total electricity production (not capacity) is around 1.5% today, supposed to go upto 3% by 2022.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 27 Aug 2017 22:24

http://www.indosolar.co.in

Found this company while surfing about solar cells in India. Is this company one of the few solar cell( as opposed to panels etc) manufacturers in an environment where Chinese et al imports dominate?

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby guru.shetty » 27 Aug 2017 22:49

Theo_Fidel wrote:BTW, has anything more been said about the 2030 ban on new petrol/diesel cars in India?

I'm just thinking about the charging infrastructure and the weak local electric grid in India. Installing the new 350 kw chargers is a non-trivial exercise in India. Hope someone is keeping that in mind...


They came out with bharat charger specification. They are limiting their thinking to to ~10kw chargers. They don't even want to define ~100kw chargers right now and leave it as a future exercise. I guess they will do it once the first car in India comes with that capability. Reading the doc, I got the feeling that they just took Mahindra's current tech and made it as a standard (which looks very similar to China's GB/T standard). The pin configuration of charger is same as Mahindra's. They could have instead taken Combined Charging System (CCS) as a standard if not Tesla charger spec.

Only India specific innovation Or vision I saw was that the future chargers need to connect to a central mgmt system to figure out max power that can be withdrawn.

More here:
http://dhi.nic.in/writereaddata/UploadF ... otocol.pdf

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby nash » 29 Aug 2017 14:49


http://www.thehindu.com/business/rising ... 566889.ece
Indian firms eye tech to counter China

“Through indigenous technological advancement, we have improved the efficiency of our modules by 3.5% to 4%. Which means..., 1 MW of power can now be generated from 4 acres of land as against 5 acres earlier,” Pujan Doshi, business head, Waaree, said.

“Now the same amount of power can be generated from 20% less land. We are also working to further improve the efficiency of our modules. This will result in bringing down the overall capital cost of energy production,” Mr. Doshi said.

Similarly, Pune-based Scorpius Trackers has developed technology to help solar modules track the movement of the sun, thereby enabling producers achieve at least eight hours of output a day, compared with four hours earlier.

“As compared to four hours of harnessing in the fixed system, our tracking technology is helping producers to generate energy for eight hours a day. So, with limited resources, India can achieve the target,” Mr. Pothan said




I think this should be the way to go forward in solar energy market, currently we can't beat China in scale of manufacturing so better do the innovation and increase the efficiency.

They should also collaborate with foreign universities on solar thermophotovoltaic, which can increase the efficiency to 60+% but still in labs and our market can be helpful to bring those from labs to fields.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 04 Sep 2017 18:54

http://www.siliconvalley.com/2017/08/30 ... emi-truck/

Heavy electric truck. Max total weight 34-40 tons and payload 10 tons and range 150km to 500km

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_truck

Launched in 2006, the Newton electric truck is an all-electric commercial vehicle from Smith Electric Vehicles. The Newton comes in three GVW configurations: 7,500 pounds (3,400 kg), 10,000 pounds (4,500 kg) and 12,000 pounds (5,400 kg). Each is available in short, medium or long wheelbase.................

...................The Port of Los Angeles and South Coast Air Quality Management District have demonstrated a short-range heavy-duty all-electric truck capable of hauling a fully loaded 40-foot (12 m) cargo container. The current design is capable of pulling a 60,000 lb (27 t) cargo container at speeds up to 10 mph (16 km/h) and has a range of between 30 and 60 miles (48 and 97 km).

..............2015 was a 40-ton truck of the type Terberg YT202-EV in operation at BMW in Munich. It serves as a transport vehicle on public roads between logistics center and production plant

.............The company Lithium Storage GmbH is building together with the company Kuhn Switzerland AG a battery-powered haul truck. The vehicle is to go the end of 2016 in operation. The dump truck weighs 110 tons. The chassis is a Komatsu 605-7.

https://www.navigantresearch.com/newsro ... 00-by-2026

global annual electrified powertrain medium and heavy duty truck sales are expected to grow from about 31,000 vehicles in 2016 to nearly 332,000 by 2026.

https://www.iea.org/publications/freepu ... ok2017.pdf

In 2016, six countries achieved an electric car market share above 1% of their total PLDV sales.
Among these, Norway was the incontestable global leader, with a 29% market share, the result of
a favourable policy environment in recent years comprising a large range of incentives, from tax
breaks and exemptions to waivers on road tolls and ferry fees. Norway was followed by the
Netherlands, with a 6.4% electric car market share, and Sweden with a 3.4% share. China, France
and the United Kingdom all had electric car market shares close to 1.5%. China and France also
have BEV-oriented markets, and roughly three-quarters of their 2016 electric car sales were
BEVs, and only one-quarter were PHEVs. In contrast, in the Netherlands, Sweden and the United
Kingdom, the majority of electric cars registered in 2016 were PHEVs. In Japan, Norway and the
rest of the world, on average, electric car sales were more equally split between BEVs and PHEVs


..............The assessment aims to reflect the production cost of technologies that are currently being
researched once they achieve commercial-scale, high-volume production (US DOE, 2017). The US DOE
estimate is higher than the USD 180/kWh to USD 200/kWh range of battery pack costs announced recently
by GM and LG Chem (Ayre, 2015) or Tesla and Panasonic (Field, 2016; Lambert, 2016a, 2016b
) for batteries
that will be used in new EV models

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 04 Sep 2017 21:09

Gyan wrote:What's contracted rate per kwh for Australian CSP solar? I could not locate it.


Hi Gyan,

See below. Maximum Aus$75-78 / mwhr. It is for all the power daytime + storage.

https://www.pv-magazine.com/2017/08/17/ ... wer-needs/

Expected to pay a maximum of A$78 (US$ 62)/MWh, the government entered into a 20-year generation project agreement with U.S. company Solar Reserve earlier this week.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Theo_Fidel » 04 Sep 2017 21:11

guru.shetty wrote:They came out with bharat charger specification. They are limiting their thinking to to ~10kw chargers. They don't even want to define ~100kw chargers right now and leave it as a future exercise. I guess they will do it once the first car in India comes with that capability. Reading the doc, I got the feeling that they just took Mahindra's current tech and made it as a standard (which looks very similar to China's GB/T standard). The pin configuration of charger is same as Mahindra's. They could have instead taken Combined Charging System (CCS) as a standard if not Tesla charger spec.


Thx.

I had no idea they are standardizing on the Chinese standard. Little lazy if you ask me. One criticism of the chinese standard is they require a different plug for A/C vs DC charging. Most of the rest of the world has a combined one, except Japan/SoKo.

10kw DC is not a bad standard to start on.

AC2-3 kw is low but wiring in India may not support more. My own home is 3 phase but most homes in my area are single phase 30-35 amps. This works out to about 7.5kw.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 20 Sep 2017 10:28

Dubai Solar CSP rates for 700MW plant seems to have fallen to US cents 7.3 per kwh

https://googleweblight.com/i?u=https:// ... _&hl=en-IN

Even though I think all these rates will require deeper study but the fact remains is that the rates are falling. Chile solar plants are allowed to wheel and sell electricity while Australia CSP plant is for peaking power supply.

In UAE, prices of Solar may be competing with Gas, Petroleum & imported Coal, therefore seem commercially viable. UAE does not really have heavy industry and power is mainly for commercial & residential use.

I think that Renewables will cut into "imported coal Plants" first as they still cannot match pithead coal plants on costing.

Off course, all this is depend on Crude oil prices remaining high or atleast in the range of USD 40 to 60. If the crude oil prices remain consistently low ie even between USD 30 to 40 then economics of renewables will come under severe stress.
Last edited by Gyan on 20 Sep 2017 13:33, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Gyan » 20 Sep 2017 10:36

Also apart from Electric Cars, there are numerous electric tractors being introduced in the market. Somehow, I think for India, electric tractors. electric 3 shaws, electric taxis and electric buses may be at forefront of change.

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby Varoon Shekhar » 10 Oct 2017 17:51

Feels good! Something about solar glass, world's first at that thickness, developed by the company itself, from indications.


http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ind ... 020486.cms

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Re: Solar energy in India

Postby ArjunPandit » 12 Oct 2017 04:37

Gyan wrote:Also apart from Electric Cars, there are numerous electric tractors being introduced in the market. Somehow, I think for India, electric tractors. electric 3 shaws, electric taxis and electric buses may be at forefront of change.


if the govt puts its weight behind this then we may actually beat the naysayers. Institutional push is a huge influencer. If a demo can be executed. Then nothing is impossible in our nation. We just need a will to act


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