Indian IT Industry

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Rajesh_MR
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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Rajesh_MR » 11 Oct 2015 19:39

AMZN seems to be in hiring spree. In last 2 years, 5 managers from group has moved to AMZ in Bangalore/Chennai

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby negi » 12 Oct 2015 11:05

Churn in storage domain

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/10/12 ... olidation/

"We're far from convinced that Dell acquiring and/or merging with EMC is a good idea, but if it did what kind of entity would we be looking at?

The crux of the matter is just how much overlap Dell is willing to endure. And the answer may be "lots". Dell's made much in recent months of giving customers choices. Exhibit A is the company's willingness to sell customers a conventional switch or a white box switch running a variety of operating systems. Exhibit B is its vast range of servers that come in just about every shape, size and configuration (and with ARM perhaps on the way).

But it's hard to see Dell enduring the considerable overlap in products it shares with EMC."

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby KJo » 15 Oct 2015 21:05


KJo
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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby KJo » 15 Oct 2015 21:08

Rajesh_MR wrote:AMZN seems to be in hiring spree. In last 2 years, 5 managers from group has moved to AMZ in Bangalore/Chennai


Problem is how to get access to AMZN BLR from the US? A recruiter lady contacted me from naukri and then said she would forward my resume. Then asked if I had interviewed with them in the last year and I said yes. But not in BLR though. That was the last I heard from her. These people don't even have the courtesy to say that they cannot forward my resume for whatever reason. They just disappear. Some things in India just have not changed.

Anyway, I am making a job switch here into some hot and fun areas, which I think will better help me get something in BLR next year.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Prasad » 16 Oct 2015 10:04

Best is to find someone on the inside and push your resume through them.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby panduranghari » 17 Oct 2015 22:46

Finally, and most importantly, are the TiSA negotiations. The aim of these talks is to reduce barriers that
inhibit trade and investment in services. The United States and European Union are leading the TiSA negotia-
tions. China asked to join the agreement in 2014; the European Union supported the request but the United
States balked. At fi
rst, US offi cials argued that China might impede ongoing services negotiations like it did
for some time in the ITA2 talks. In fact, US offi cials wanted upfront commitments to services reform, given
the sparse liberalization undertaken by China in the General Agreement on Trade in Services in the WTO. As
a consequence, US offi cials did not remove their block on Chinese participation in the TiSA even after US and
Chinese officials announced a breakthrough in the ITA2 negotiations in November 2014.
In our view, the US position is counterproductive to US interests. Chinese objectives in the TiSA are mark-edly different than those in the ITA talks. In ITA, its domestic firms are divided between supporters of liberalization, especially those that import high-tech components for their increasingly sophisticated manufactures,
and industrial producers, who want to maintain existing import barriers. In TiSA, the underlying motivation
of Chinese officials is to complement and reinforce domestic reforms being implemented incrementally since
the Third Party Plenum in November 2013. In other words, China has a vested interest in the success of the
TiSA negotiations. If the United States opened the door for Chinese participation, it would put pressure on
other major developing countries to follow suit, especially India and Brazil. If these core members of the BRICs
bloc joined TiSA, the deal could then easily be extended to the entire WTO membership and substantially upgrade WTO commitments to liberalization of trade and investment in services. Given the strong competitiveness of many US service companies, successful conclusion of services trade pacts would open substantial new growth opportunities for US exports to China and the broader Asia-Pacific region.


http://piie.com/publications/briefings/piieb15-3.pdf

Can anyone shed light on how TiSA agreement between US-China affects Indian technology industry?

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby kenop » 12 Nov 2015 16:00

I see promoted tweets from Safari on my TL on twitter with links to 3 books on product management.
As predicted by the gurus, the revolution has started.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby sum » 20 Nov 2015 11:17

^^ Not very pretty reading:

As machines become intelligent, where does India stand?

But India is lacking… Let us start by looking at academic research. We do find pockets of excellence. There is some critical mass of machine learning researchers in IISc. They can collaborate to tackle hard and interesting problems and publish world class results. Also, in some of the IITs, such as IIT Delhi, we find some people in machine learning including those who have returned with a foreign education. IKDD CODS [11], a conference in data science with world class standards, started in India in 2013.

Objectively, we looked at the total papers in the top 13 machine learning conferences in the last 15 years (see figure 1). All put together, India produces lesser papers than a single world class university in China – the Tshingua university. We do one-third of Carnegie Mellon University of USA. Our total research papers have been 745, China is 3956 and USA is 19,000+. We rank 15th by the number of documents we produce, with a Singapore, a Spain, an Israel and a Canada bettering us (see figure 2). We have a lot to catch up and only a disruptive mission based approach can make this happen.


Let us look at industrial research, where the picture is even starker. China produces 10x more papers, with Singapore being twice and US being 50 times ahead. New companies [12] are the engine of growth and have the potential to create disruption and maximum business value. In India, we could only find 12 papers from 5 startups in the last 15 years! One of it is Aspiring Minds - our work on programming assessment and spoken English assessment at KDD. Another notable is Strand Life Sciences, with some high quality work in Bioinformatics, Infibeam in e-commerce and S&I Engineering pushing the frontiers in computer vision. Both Strand and SI are companies that came out of IISc and are great examples to emulate. Compare this to USA or China: a Linkedin has 17, Facebook 15, a Baidu 22, Alibaba 4, Tencents 3, Renren 2 followed by a long tail of companies. No wonder MIT Technology Review’s top 50 smartest companies have 7 out of the top 10 from US, 3 from China and none from India! One may note that much of the open source software and libraries for storing, handling, searching and analyzing big data has come from new companies and not universities. The same is true for recommender systems to an extent [13].

Startups need to invest in research specifically in the area of machine learning. They need to follow the examples of (and even outperform) a Facebook, a Baidu, a Tencents and an Aspiring Minds. These companies have separate data science research groups. This will let them have a sustainable business edge, be disruptive and globally competitive. Otherwise, they we will be ripped off, once again [14], by new innovations happening in other parts of the world. The speed of innovation and disruption is much faster now – we need to keep running to be at the same pace!

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby ArmenT » 20 Dec 2015 08:27

You don't even have to read Tamil to get this....
Image

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby isubodh » 20 Dec 2015 14:18

WANTED :rotfl:

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby sum » 30 Dec 2015 04:44

Not Indian IT but guess some lessons can be learnt from the Chinese:
sum wrote:Good article on growth of China in tech domain:
How a Nation of Tech Copycats Transformed Into a Hub for Innovation

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby KJo » 30 Dec 2015 05:13

Indian IT industry had a very good 10-15 years of freebies where they made money with little effort. Now the gravy train will end sooner or later and coolie labor model will not be sustainable.
Is the industry prepared? I don't think it is... people I have talked to seem to be overconfident that Modi kuch karega or that the US will go down or some such flimsy reason.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SaiK » 30 Dec 2015 06:11

Modi can use IT, and those areas will get some boost! of course there are always niche areas where IT will succeed!

and the rest of mass rapid IT field will be competing with parotta master onlee

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Dec 2015 07:07

the mentality of the typical revered tech cos is very centric toward either copying US model or serving the US/EU market(higher billing rate) than slogging for DRDO, ISRO or any govt entity here. projects rather than even a small product like a USB stick that can stand on it own feet and be sold in millions

if you look at cheen they had a clear product focus to displace things and stand on their own by hook or crook.

I will say it again - we are at the tail end of the h1 thing. maybe in non-IT branches like mecha, aerospace, materials, chem there is still opportunity for h1 if someone does a phd/ms there but IT field is too saturated and there are enough locals including kids in the coding pipeline and another million or so stuck in the GC pipeline who are not going anywhere fast.

so while short term predictions are hard to make, I am 100% sure there is not going to be any ITvity h1 in 10 years when the kids now in high school preparing for coding careers come out enmasse. just the Sinic and Indic kids alone would number close to 1 million strong "golden horde" spread across a 10year age band...more than enough for US market + gora elite kids another 1 million.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Zynda » 30 Dec 2015 09:53

Singha wrote:the mentality of the typical revered tech cos is very centric toward either copying US model or serving the US/EU market(higher billing rate) than slogging for DRDO, ISRO or any govt entity here. projects rather than even a small product like a USB stick that can stand on it own feet and be sold in millions


Precisely. I was just thinking of the same last night after reading the ARDE New Family Munitions tender. Looks like most of the work involved is CFD simulations which can be done on a PC. So perfect for IT/Engineering Services Co to get their feet wet. I would bid the tender even if the company stands to lose out some money. Opportunities to work on projects like that will NEVER EVER come from US/EU. I think IT-Vity companies are so used to USD-INR conversion rates that it is simply unimaginable for them to work at INR-INR prices. They rather pine at US Senate increasing H1 fee visa costs shamelessly...

I will say it again - we are at the tail end of the h1 thing. maybe in non-IT branches like mecha, aerospace, materials, chem there is still opportunity for h1 if someone does a phd/ms there but IT field is too saturated and there are enough locals including kids in the coding pipeline and another million or so stuck in the GC pipeline who are not going anywhere fast.


Nope. Aviation industry is on gradual decline in US as mentioned by Manja saar several times. Mech, Aero etc. were never the mass employers for later immigrants (90s, 2000s) like IT was. There always will be handful of opportunities but it wasn't as easy as IT folks for whom any major company was willing to hire & sponsor H1 along with GC. For ex: major Auto OEMs like Ford, Toyota rarely hire foreign nationals on H1. They do make use of staffing agencies which in turn hire H1s...But for majority of desis at least, the ripe sector for an immigrant in recent times has been IT industry.

if you look at cheen they had a clear product focus to displace things and stand on their own by hook or crook.


One has to really admire their vision & determination. Even on MIL-Aviation scene, they have J-10/JF-17/J-16/J-15/J-20/J-31/ARJ/Comac C-919 major programs going on. They are aggressively pursuing indigenous activities in all sectors. Here in desh, both Govt & Pvt. Sector have been very lethargic in that aspect.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Bade » 30 Dec 2015 10:05

Why are not senior IT wallahs from the big-5 in India willing to get out from the existing IT model and do Indian projects. They must have made enough to not feel 'insecure' in case their new ventures fail as they have a fallback option. Or maybe it will take one more generation to become huge risk takers.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby partha » 30 Dec 2015 10:24

Bade wrote:Why are not senior IT wallahs from the big-5 in India willing to get out from the existing IT model and do Indian projects. They must have made enough to not feel 'insecure' in case their new ventures fail as they have a fallback option. Or maybe it will take one more generation to become huge risk takers.

It's the mindset problem. Senior IT wallahs in Bangalore/Hyd are from 90s or early 2000s and they lack startup mentality. India's startup revolution will be driven mostly by young engineers who graduated in the later part of the last decade. That's when I observed an increase in number of people in my social circle wanting to start their own companies and some of them were even successful. In the early 2000s startups were unheard of.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby JayS » 30 Dec 2015 10:28

Zynda wrote:Precisely. I was just thinking of the same last night after reading the ARDE New Family Munitions tender. Looks like most of the work involved is CFD simulations which can be done on a PC. So perfect for IT/Engineering Services Co to get their feet wet. I would bid the tender even if the company stands to lose out some money.


It ain't so trivial saar. One who has not handled this specific type of store-separation simulations might take months just to get the validation case right. Even for experienced company with decent resources readily available, it will be 8-12 months long project at least. And you will need real powerful machines to run those simulations or buy computational time on some cluster (CFD needs large number of processors with about 2GB RAM per processor).

My experience with ARDE guys is they ask for moon in shoestring money. What I find funny is companies like TCS can very easily get such projects. They can afford to do it even for free as a ice-breaker. But they bid (if they bid) with very high quotes. Apparently, their logic being they have to quote premium values just to maintain reputation, or some nonsense thing like that.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Zynda » 30 Dec 2015 10:43

nileshjr wrote:It ain't so trivial saar. One who has not handled this specific type of store-separation simulations might take months just to get the validation case right. Even for experienced company with decent resources readily available, it will be 8-12 months long project at least. And you will need real powerful machines to run those simulations or buy computational time on some cluster (CFD needs large number of processors with about 2GB RAM per processor).

My experience with ARDE guys is they ask for moon in shoestring money. What I find funny is companies like TCS can very easily get such projects. They can afford to do it even for free as a ice-breaker. But they bid (if they bid) with very high quotes. Apparently, their logic being they have to quote premium values just to maintain reputation, or some nonsense thing like that.


Nilesh, thats exactly my point. Companies like TCS have the resources to build the required infra as well as to hire some key personnels who can compress or accelerate the validation process. The experience gained will be hard to put a value on.

Honestly, like KJo had mentioned, many folks (outside of TCS) do not have a good opinion about them. All these reputation is a false excuse. In fact they can build up their reputation by taking on such projects. TCS Aerospace as well as Infy are sitting on their bumbs twiddling thumbs currently with no projects in the pipeline.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby JayS » 30 Dec 2015 11:03

Zynda wrote:
Nilesh, thats exactly my point. Companies like TCS have the resources to build the required infra as well as to hire some key personnels who can compress or accelerate the validation process. The experience gained will be hard to put a value on.

Honestly, like KJo had mentioned, many folks (outside of TCS) do not have a good opinion about them. All these reputation is a false excuse. In fact they can build up their reputation by taking on such projects. TCS Aerospace as well as Infy are sitting on their bumbs twiddling thumbs currently with no projects in the pipeline.


They way I see it is, they do not want to dirty their hands with challenging work when they can print $$ by doing same old repetitive "bread & butter" jobs. Unless the $$ dry out, at-least the big companies will not look for such low hanging fruits. I feel there is lack of 'strategic' thinking in Indian IT/Tech industry, both as an organisation and also as an individual. (To be honest I am using very civil language here, otherwise I am very critical of our IT wallas :wink:).

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby member_20292 » 30 Dec 2015 12:02

^^^

Guys, please think like a shareholder of TCS, which I am sure a lot of you are already.

If there is money, and high "return on capital employed" to be made in a certain low quality but stable work, then as a business owner, you will be silly to take on the "shoot-for-the-moon" projects with low monetary return.

Shareholders will desert TCS in droves if they see profits slipping. "Dhandha karna hai tho rokda dikhane ka" ~ or some such. Shareholders care about profits only. And it is far more profitable to stick to similar products that one has already made before , and gradually, profitably move into unrelated areas. If the profits lie in doing social media, analytics and cloud in the future, then that is where the Indian majors will also move to. They will not move into hard Aero projects so soon. They will take time to do that.


Its not only the lower value in INR of these DRDO projects, but too the technically hard nature of the projects, lack of opportunities for scaling in other markets because foreign govt.s will not give access to such work to Indian IT firms and last but not the least, the lethargy by which the govt. organizations pay their vendors.

All of us can cry hoarse at "innovashun" but how many of us have put our money and potential where our mouth is and done something about it?? *I have*

I was earlier in MatSci and used to be a lab grunt in the US. But when I saw that the amount of fixed asset investment into facilities was going to be very large for me to make a dent in any startup type of a setup , I moved fields and got into IT. Do I believe my decision was good? Maybe , Maybe not. On one hand the battery and supercapacitor field is a hot research topic and the oppotunities are present along with money. However, scaling is enormously tough in MatSci. People try to ghusao nanotubes and nanoXYZ into many a product without realizing the economics of how it works and how they will make finances work in the future. A successful and leading company of Lithium Ion batteries was A123 systems, which eventually lost a big contract with General Motors to LG Chem and had to be sold to BYD-China.


In the IT field now, I find again, that the work and the products are at times easier to specify and the action is faster. However the enormous amount of competition in the field makes it tougher to get contracts. However, there is a lot of action in IT and the potential to scale up is higher. One does have to be smart about choosing the right projects to bid for, and the products that one believe can have a long term impact on the market. IT can also be capital intensive, though not on the scale of MatSci. The impact and pace of change is also higher . India is also a good market to deploy IT products and we are currently witnessing a lot of Venture Capital flowing in due to the potential of IT in making India a common market using IT solutions.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SriKumar » 30 Dec 2015 14:12

mahadevbhu wrote:^^^

Guys, please think like a shareholder of TCS, which I am sure a lot of you are already.
I think this is exactly the problem. Think like a shareholder of xyz ITvity company, and (if you apply this thinking to the direction of the company) the company will continue on current path for years/decades to come- desi ITivty is two decades old and counting, and there are no signs that US outsourcing will reduce long-term (so no incentive to change direction from current path). In fact, think like a shareholder of any company and one will probably not look beyond 1-2 years out (or, one quarter- if you are an analyst tracking 'company performance for Wall St'; or 1 week, if you are into buying-selling shares; or one day if you are a day-trader).

I was earlier in MatSci and used to be a lab grunt in the US. But when I saw that the amount of fixed asset investment into facilities was going to be very large for me to make a dent in any startup type of a setup , I moved fields and got into IT.
Do not disagree with some other things you wrote but the original post made by zynda (?) was about some sort of simulations and this should probably should not be conflated with capital investment related to MatSci.
Last edited by SriKumar on 30 Dec 2015 16:12, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SriKumar » 30 Dec 2015 14:24

Bade wrote:Why are not senior IT wallahs from the big-5 in India willing to get out from the existing IT model and do Indian projects. They must have made enough to not feel 'insecure' in case their new ventures fail as they have a fallback option. Or maybe it will take one more generation to become huge risk takers.
Good question. In addition to what has been written by nilesh, maybe Dileep would have some perspective on this. Now that the 'thought-leaders' :P Elon Musk and Bezos have made splashes in non-ITvity areas (SpaceX and Blue Origin), let's see if traditional engineering becomes the new paradigm-shift. :)

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Singha » 30 Dec 2015 16:30

while big shareholders want to maximise ROI year after year in terms of stock price appreciation, dividends and stock buybacks...the boards of almost every successful high tech co out there have stood their ground and funneled money into R&D and engineering that are more % that the bean counters like. they understand that keeping engg portfolio going with a balanced mix of cash-cow, current and future product is necessary to the survival of a co long term than just trying to maximise current revenue.

the biggies in indian IT services to me do not have a plan-B beyond their plan-A of using outsourcing. they may not long term survive vs the captives of the global services cos like accenture, cap gemini, cognizant....

for infy and wipro even their shareholder ROI and growth numbers has been fairly sub-par

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby JayS » 30 Dec 2015 22:14

^^ Absolutely. If you want to be in the leagues of companies like Intel/IBM/GE which not only survive changing world but lead the changes, you need to have a culture of innovation in your organization. We severely lack there. The bigwig IT companies in our country have everything but the will to innovate, it seems. This Investors' pressure for ROI is just an excuse.

Some time ago Narayan Murthy criticized IITs/IISc etc for not having any Earth-shaking innovation in 60 years. Question arose in my mind, did Infosys churn out any innovation which at least shook Bangalore if not the whole damn Earth?? Atleast I have seen none.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby member_20292 » 30 Dec 2015 22:31

the incentive to innovate me be lost in the kpi s of the company. kpi not met ....because I was wasting time thinking.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Bade » 30 Dec 2015 22:44

One way for the biggies from India to trigger a change is to start funding IITs/IISc centers/labs so they can get more bang for the buck, without affecting their bottom lines. Research staff in Univs do not seek Rs20Lakh pay packets with benefits etc.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SriKumar » 31 Dec 2015 01:22

nileshjr wrote:Some time ago Narayan Murthy criticized IITs/IISc etc for not having any Earth-shaking innovation in 60 years. Question arose in my mind, did Infosys churn out any innovation which at least shook Bangalore if not the whole damn Earth?? Atleast I have seen none.
..but..but.. dont you know? He answered the question himself in the speech...wait for it..... 'The Global Delivery Model' and 'The 24-hour workday'. And before the came up with these gems, he had proceeded to list 10 technologies that came out of MIT that changed the world (things like GPS, bionic prosthesis, microchip, RSA encryption etc.) as if in comparison. :-o
http://scroll.in/article/777653/japans- ... militarism

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby KJo » 31 Dec 2015 01:25

Narayana Murthy. Just another snake oil salesman who struck it rich. Haack Thoo.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Surya » 31 Dec 2015 03:14

not to mention his own nepotism while maintaining holier than thou approach

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Vayutuvan » 31 Dec 2015 05:12

SriKumar wrote:Do not disagree with some other things you wrote but the original post made by zynda (?) was about some sort of simulations and this should probably should not be conflated with capital investment related to MatSci.

SriKumar: You and Zynda are underestimating the capital intensive nature of the CFD simulation and validation. What if the quote calls for wind tunnel validation of a model? Several (a score or a dozen) models - this after reducing the design space through hundreds or even thousands of simulations to reduce the design space (using steepest descent or conjugate gradient or newton iterations - one has to prove continuity for convergence and if possible convexity so that simple steepest descent like schemes work - with material non-linearities, temp induced stresses, fluid structure interactions, and multiphysics - varying scales of material properties - thrown in) need to be built, mind you physically not some computer simulation stuff, and tested in a wind tunnel with real life loading and accurate measurements and validate.

The problem with CFD is that there is no canonical approach nor is there a consensus as to the simulation method unlike in structures. High Reynolds number regime a different ball game altogether (which is not applicable in the ARDE RFC I presume).

If you want to license CFD codes from the usual suspects - Star/CD, Fluent (part of ANSYS), MSC, Hyperworks - they eat you up with not only per seat but per processor yearly licenses. Their monopoly can be broken. There are some efforts afoot in the US and India to do that. If you wait for a couple of years, I think it will be rewarded with a pleasant surprise. :)

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Vayutuvan » 31 Dec 2015 05:19

The real problem some of the IT big wigs face is that they are not considered "smart money". On the other hand, people like Andressen, Paul Graham (Y-combinatorics), Paul Allen, Bill Gates and his roomy, GOOG founders, Sun founders, Ellison, Zuckerburg, Twitterati etc are considered that. I have my doubts about these "big names" though. They are no smarter than your garden variety SV "tent city" denizens. Things will unfold in ways none of them have dreamed of - guaranteed.

Anyone remember Negroponte? Who?

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby KJo » 31 Dec 2015 08:08

I think Raja Bose will strike it big and become a hi fi VC and revive the Indian IT scene with some insanely great products that will put a dent in the universe.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby JayS » 31 Dec 2015 08:14

vayu tuvan wrote:
If you want to license CFD codes from the usual suspects - Star/CD, Fluent (part of ANSYS), MSC, Hyperworks - they eat you up with not only per seat but per processor yearly licenses. Their monopoly can be broken. There are some efforts afoot in the US and India to do that. If you wait for a couple of years, I think it will be rewarded with a pleasant surprise. :)


I always thought, with all the n number of codes and the technical expertise we have in our R&D establishment (which is quite impressive), we should have had a national mandate for consolidating this CFD/FEM/CAD capabilities into a good user friendly software package which then can be given out to Indian nationals as freeware or at nominal fees. Either a govt organisation with mandate (a la CDAC/CDOT) or a private company which will develop the package with the help of the Scientist/Researcher community can do this task. Initial few years GoI can fund the development and later it can sustain on license fees (large number of licenses at smaller fee).

This would greatly boost innovation by enabling academic research and also the chances of a engineering tech SME or a freelancer to succeed. Since the licensing costs of the mainstream software is highly prohibitive and they are not very useful for some serious R&D work "as is" without doing some customization which need very expensive and time consuming experimental validation procedures. A well validated, user friendly computational code will ease a lot many hurdles.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SriKumar » 31 Dec 2015 15:52

vayu tuvan wrote:
SriKumar wrote:Do not disagree with some other things you wrote but the original post made by zynda (?) was about some sort of simulations and this should probably should not be conflated with capital investment related to MatSci.

SriKumar: You and Zynda are underestimating the capital intensive nature ....
Well..... a couple of things. 'Capital intensive' is a relative term. There is a context to my response. Please read my response to mahadevbhu carefully. I merely said that using MatSci equipment as an analogy to demonstrate capital intensive nature for performing simulations is an incorrect analogy. Even a carpenter might consider acquiring his tools of trade as being capital-intensive- power saw, jack-plane :) , chisels of various kinds, drill bits...well you know the drill... :D

Coming back to the original point- raised by Bade, about why IT-majors (the 'thought-leaders', the 'visionaries' and mold-breakers among them) dont have the gumption or the interest to work on projects that are local to their area- within10 kilometers of where they have lived all their life, and prospered beyond imagination.

What you described as being capital-intensive, I feel, would be well within their financial capability to acquire and not notice the difference to their bottomline. Just consider the annual revenues and growth trajectory for the IT majors, for the past 20 years and figure it out for yourself.

It has to be something else- lack of interest, the fact that this is a desi project and does not have the 'global/international' cachet, or maybe it is difficult to deal with a desi gorment outfit (but others are doing it), perhaps it is too difficult for them, or rupee projects are less remunerative than dollar/euro projects, or something else. In looking at Narayanamurthy's speech to IISC graduates, I did not go into detail but quickly scanned it a 2-3 times. I get the impression that his knowledge of innovation (outside of IT areas) is very theoretical- the kind you get reading a book on 'Innovation for the 21st Century' or attending a few talks. Even his IT innovations (Global Delivery model and 24-hour work life model- whatever they mean) seem something like an MBA would come up with i.e. establish some common-sensical procedures and use customer and/or employee feedback to improve the processes/procedures over time- hardly the kind of innovation that gets worked on at MIT or IISc that he alluded to in his speech. And the fact that he conflated these two with MIT-type innovation (microchip, RSA) in his speech suggests he does not comprehend the difference between the two- atleast in type of knowledge, the kind of effort and most importantly, the eco-system that makes these possible.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Bade » 31 Dec 2015 21:10

To add to what was said by you above, it is not just the IT honchos that I was targeting as the group to lead change, but even those on the payroll of these companies in the upper echelons. Just spatting at a Murthy is not going to achieve something in the long run. But having acquired wealth and knowledge for 10-20 yrs what are these regular aam aadmis doing is what matters. Some may even be members here on BRF itself. :-) Murthy made a few of these types more wealthy, but what is the second gen doing with this wealth both material and experience that they acquired. IMO, Murthy types have done their part, now it up to this younger group to take it further. But they seem to have failed.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby SriKumar » 31 Dec 2015 21:46

My perspective is that people like Murthy, Premji and others are still in leadership positions one way or another, and are quite 'young' in that they are healthy and have a lot of energy and useful life left ahead of them. From their position of fame, power and influence, they can do a lot in this area. A lot of path-breaking efforts come when upper management and leadership drive it.

If anyone can feel secure about their career and financial situation, it is they and not necessarily the 'younger group' who is still in the rat race; the karnails...they are trying to become jernails; and the jernails are trying to become COAS. The head honchos who are famous are still looked up to, in that people atleast listen to what they say, and have the resources and strength make a difference in a fundamental way, if they choose to go that path. Murthy has done his part, no doubt; but I have no doubt that he has enough time/money/power/other resources within him to break a new path (actually, it is not new; companies are doing it, but are not that well-known. I think TCS does have a unit/group in this area). In fact, it may be easier for people like him to do so, than people in senior positions in these companies who are still dependent on a company job, most likely doing the same kind of job that their predecessors did in that specific position, to maintain their karnailship/jernailship to sustain EMIs/SUVs/furrin trips etc. And maybe this is why the second wave can not do much more than sustain and expand the first wave (which is definitely laudable in itself) rather than create new waves.
Last edited by SriKumar on 31 Dec 2015 21:58, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby member_20292 » 31 Dec 2015 21:56

the biggest IT firms became so because of maintaining a laser like focus on profits and money.

where is the money in aero projects? there are hardly a handful of companies that build planes and why would Infy address those technologies where the scope of scaling up is low.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Bade » 31 Dec 2015 22:14

There are many alphabet soup companies doing Government work in the US as an example. None of them make large amounts of money either and most of them last a decade or so before they fold up. But they sustain an ecosystem in the process. That is what India lacks perhaps and what I was trying to get at. These are still service companies, but stretching the same idea to spawn product companies is not that far a stretch.

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Re: Indian IT Industry

Postby Vayutuvan » 31 Dec 2015 22:53

SriKumar: Let us take it else where. I cannot say more in this particular thread.

Bade: Murty Sir does give out large number of awards (I think 50 lakhs per awardee) to about 100 academic researchers (STEM IIRC) every year. I remember seeing a page on Wikipedia. By any measure, 50 crores PA a bit of money.


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