Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

The Technology & Economic Forum is a venue to discuss issues pertaining to Technological and Economic developments in India. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Karthik S
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4134
Joined: 18 Sep 2009 12:12

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Karthik S » 23 Jan 2018 21:44


Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 62927
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Singha » 24 Jan 2018 10:38

where the critical control systems and traction motors of the EMU being sourced from ?
is there some bideshi consultant involved?
our WAP locos use a mix of alstom and hitachi designed motors iirc.

designing good interior of a day train is no different from that of a luxury volvo / scania / merc bus seen commonly here. even the exec chair car of current shatabdi trains lags behind in fitting quality and finish from these bus interiors albeit they are very spacious. the economy chair cars have a crude fit and finish. nowhere near aerospace grade.

they should involve the automotive sector which already has deep ecosystem and ties for sourcing interior plastics , upholstery, design elements etc.

hanumadu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 11 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby hanumadu » 27 Jan 2018 19:28

Some more info on train18 and train20

Vips
BRFite
Posts: 929
Joined: 14 Apr 2017 18:23

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Vips » 27 Jan 2018 22:09

Fantastic. Give more responsibilities and empower the young employees and the PSU will also deliver.

hanumadu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 11 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby hanumadu » 28 Jan 2018 01:28

hanumadu wrote:Some more info on train18 and train20


This video says train18 is indigenous design. In the previous video, the GM of ICF says the design is not Indian but foreign. What is the truth?

salaam
BRFite
Posts: 211
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby salaam » 28 Jan 2018 07:54

hanumadu wrote:
hanumadu wrote:Some more info on train18 and train20


This video says train18 is indigenous design. In the previous video, the GM of ICF says the design is not Indian but foreign. What is the truth?


If its being made in India and designocopied in India, that should be enough. I would love to see it on the rails. Most probably at that time the same GM will be saying how he fostered the introduction of breakthrough design, and it was under his tutelage that youngsters were imbibed with the notion of shunning mediocrity and achieving greatness.

Finally proof of pudding is in eating, or maybe riding in this case.

yensoy
BRFite
Posts: 894
Joined: 29 May 2002 11:31
Location: USA

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby yensoy » 28 Jan 2018 13:45

hanumadu wrote:
hanumadu wrote:Some more info on train18 and train20


This video says train18 is indigenous design. In the previous video, the GM of ICF says the design is not Indian but foreign. What is the truth?


My recollection of the interview and presentation is that Train18 is indigenous in that it is a repurposing of stainless-steel LHB coach (which is by itself an imported design) to make it self-propelled which is a local design probably with industry and foreign consultancy.

soumik
BRFite
Posts: 124
Joined: 15 Jan 2009 21:01
Location: running away from ninja monkey asassins

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby soumik » 28 Jan 2018 23:15

hanumadu wrote:
hanumadu wrote:Some more info on train18 and train20


This video says train18 is indigenous design. In the previous video, the GM of ICF says the design is not Indian but foreign. What is the truth?


Train 18 seems to be a reverse engineered Swiss Stadler EC250 with lower
rated motors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE4kccEEFwE

MOU for the same was signed on 04/10/17
http://pib.nic.in/newsite/PrintRelease. ... lid=171372

shaun
BRFite
Posts: 927
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby shaun » 29 Jan 2018 00:11

Train 20 with aluminum body , we might see Talgo coming in.

Katare
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2196
Joined: 02 Mar 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Katare » 29 Jan 2018 07:02

Didn’t It clearly say in video that design is from two EU companies and the manufacturing is being done in India.

hanumadu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 11 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby hanumadu » 29 Jan 2018 07:54

Katare wrote:Didn’t It clearly say in video that design is from two EU companies and the manufacturing is being done in India.


Which video? the GM one or one with the PPT?

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 62927
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Singha » 29 Jan 2018 08:29

given the massive cost of TGV type dedicated lines, these electric EMU trainsets could provide a working solution to speed up our trains by making them accelerate faster after stations and signals?

what other benefit does EMU provide over a powerful unitary electric loco? the motors will make each bogie heavier, vs a 200t electric loco. does it offer better ride quality due to heavier bogies and smoother acceleration vs the characteristic "jerk" of a IR train starting off?

HSR seems to work both ways, the TGV has a loco, while most of the rest incl the pointy nose/catfish shinkansen are EMU.

Karthik S
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4134
Joined: 18 Sep 2009 12:12

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Karthik S » 29 Jan 2018 09:18

The accelerator has to be faster with EMU, also EMU will have better traction over TGV, think of difference between AWD and FWD cars.

SaiK
BRF Oldie
Posts: 35822
Joined: 29 Oct 2003 12:31
Location: NowHere

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby SaiK » 29 Jan 2018 10:05

Why so much effort in doing any joint venture with firang nations? We have to think about only indigenous efforts. I can't understand this thought about we are not capable or we can't do it. It must be the existing IR capability, and not outside IR, but within India.

Katare
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2196
Joined: 02 Mar 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Katare » 29 Jan 2018 10:45

hanumadu wrote:
Katare wrote:Didn’t It clearly say in video that design is from two EU companies and the manufacturing is being done in India.


Which video? the GM one or one with the PPT?

The one that Karthik posted

Singha
BRF Oldie
Posts: 62927
Joined: 13 Aug 2004 19:42
Location: the grasshopper lies heavy

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Singha » 29 Jan 2018 13:27

SaiK wrote:Why so much effort in doing any joint venture with firang nations? We have to think about only indigenous efforts. I can't understand this thought about we are not capable or we can't do it. It must be the existing IR capability, and not outside IR, but within India.


well one has to start somewhere. Cheen spent tens of billions in procuring japanese and euro hsr trainsets and tech and built on that later. their HSR network buildout is estimated at 1 trillion around 100b a year for 10 years in the initial frantic pace and now a moderate pace is doubling their HSR.

our desi electrical motor industry may not yet be able to make new gen AC traction motors from scratch without starting off from a proven licensed design.

fantastic feats of scaling up civil construction and standardization was achieved.

http://www.railjournal.com/index.php/hi ... -less.html

Zynda
BRFite
Posts: 1458
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 00:37
Location: J4

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Zynda » 29 Jan 2018 18:25

UK has gone with the high-speed EMU/DMU solution on their rail network. I think only freight trains on UK rail have a dedicated loco. On mainland Europe, dedicated loco hauled passenger trains still seem to be plying. Could be a good idea to replace Shatabdi Express or day trains with such solutions. I think we will be augmenting existing LHB Fiat bogies (which are already good for up to 180 Kph) with a traction motor and modifying the LHB coach shell & convert it to EMU.

At one time Kirloskar Electric Co. was supplying AC Traction motors to IR for powering WAP locomotives. Sadly, I think Kirloskar Electric is in such a sad state that it is effectively wiped off the map. However, with Siemens, Bombardier, GE & others having engineering offices in India (& plants too), it would not be difficult to ask them to come up with something under MII banner.

Like GE Rail is showing off/promoting its WDG-4G/IR Evo locos proudly as being designed at JFW Centre in BLR.

I liked the Bombardier TRAXX 3 loco...up to 12,800 HP on Pax locos...it could be used in future if required for hauling long-distance 24 coach trains at 160 Kph.

arshyam
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2909
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby arshyam » 29 Jan 2018 18:37

Singha wrote:what other benefit does EMU provide over a powerful unitary electric loco? the motors will make each bogie heavier, vs a 200t electric loco. does it offer better ride quality due to heavier bogies and smoother acceleration vs the characteristic "jerk" of a IR train starting off?

A single heavy loco is like an Arjun tank, with all the weight arguments applicable. Basically, the wear and tear on the tracks will also reduce with smaller distributed motors. Smoother acceleration - I don't know. LHB rakes jerk because of the CBC system, but EMUs also use these types of couplers, and their jerks are much lesser. Anecdotally, I'd say less jerks in the EMU config.

The one thing I am not clear about yet is how ICF plans to run these EMUs at high speeds (150+) with multiple pantographs. Our electric traction wire system (OHE) is not designed for high speed trains with multiple pantographs, and that's why even the double WAP-5 loco Rajdhani special runs with a single pantograph up and a thick cable delivering power to the second loco. Running heavy electrical cables through the length of the EMU rake is not feasible.

Bart S
BRFite
Posts: 1257
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 00:03

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Bart S » 29 Jan 2018 18:55

Zynda wrote:At one time Kirloskar Electric Co. was supplying AC Traction motors to IR for powering WAP locomotives. Sadly, I think Kirloskar Electric is in such a sad state that it is effectively wiped off the map. However, with Siemens, Bombardier, GE & others having engineering offices in India (& plants too), it would not be difficult to ask them to come up with something under MII banner.

Like GE Rail is showing off/promoting its WDG-4G/IR Evo locos proudly as being designed at JFW Centre in BLR.

I liked the Bombardier TRAXX 3 loco...up to 12,800 HP on Pax locos...it could be used in future if required for hauling long-distance 24 coach trains at 160 Kph.


It would be great if we could build a JV with GE and Indian Pvt sector to develop high powered electric rail components and perhaps locomotives. I think they only currently sell diesel electric, but could be a win-win for them and us and be a complementary product area for both parties from an R&D and IPR perspective vs just license building Bombardier/Alstom designs.

JayS
Forum Moderator
Posts: 3396
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby JayS » 29 Jan 2018 19:33

hanumadu wrote:Some more info on train18 and train20


Good to see PSUs innovating. Shows that all it takes is one man pushing from up to shake up the whole system.

But I am wondering, why didn't they go with shared wheel bogey or whatever its called. I mean bogey placed at the junction of two coaches. That reduces number of bogeys by half. Talgo trains are even one step further - only two wheels per coach. But they are smaller and lighter coaches and since we can use little heavy duty systems, 4 per coach should be good enough. Better than current 8 per coach. There is very good scope for weight optimization everywhere on our railway coaches. Lighter the better.

Zynda
BRFite
Posts: 1458
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 00:37
Location: J4

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Zynda » 29 Jan 2018 20:05

Arshyam good points on OHE limitations and also thanks on that crucial point of twin WAP5 arrangement on Raj.

Jay, I think ICF is modifying existing LHB coach design to adapt for EMU kind of arrangement & LHBs have 8 wheels per coach design. Hopefully ICF design capabilities have improved but I think during mid-2000s, they tried to upgrade the old Swiss based coach (also called ICF coach) to 160 Kph speed limits and failed. Had very high oscillations IIRC. So I am not really confident on ICF coming up with any new designs of their own...in fact, I am a little skeptical about the Train 18 as well.

Recently, ICF Chennai tried to come out with a high speed local EMU for Mumbai capable of running at the same 160 Kph. But these failed RDSO trails and are now certified for 80 Kph only.

A NDTV article about the same...

60-Crore Trial Run Of High-Speed Mumbai Train Is A Failure

The dreams of a high-speed local train have crashed and burned. The special rake was supposed to have a running speed close to that of Gatimaan Express {running LHB coaches}, India's fastest train. But after pouring Rs. 60 crore and six years into building it and conducting trial runs, the railway authorities have finally admitted that the so-called high-speed train is barely faster than a regular local.

The Western Railway (WR) started testing the high-speed MRVC 1181 train in 2012, but all these years, officials remained tight-lipped on why it hadn't been pressed into service. It is only now that the authorities have responded to RTI (Right To Information) queries, admitting that the Rs. 60-crore rake is a complete failure.

Mumbaikars were promised a train that would run at speeds of 140-145 kmph, close to the speed of Gatimaan Express (160 kmph). Instead, Mumbai's fastest train has been dying a slow death as it sits abandoned at the Virar car shed. Its parts have been stripped and used on other trains that are in operation. Now, the officials have decided that the rake will run at the same speed as any other local - at a humble 80 kmph.

This information came to light through a series of responses this month to a commuter activist's RTI applications to WR, the Mumbai Railway Vikas Corporation (MRVC), and the Lucknow-based Railway Designs and Standards Organisation (RDSO).

Contradictory answers

The trials were conducted between Mumbai, Virar and Dahanu, but all three organisations have given contradictory information on the number of trials conducted. WR's reply stated only that trials were conducted at variable speeds, and sanctioned speed was 145 kmph. MRVC's reply stated that two trials were conducted on the Virar-Dahanu section, and that they were not successful. This response also added that the train will be put into regular service after necessary modifications. There was no mention of the trial speed.

The reply from RDSO said that three trials were conducted, and the train failed at 140 kmph, which was the top speed for testing. RDSO's response further explained that the train failed the trial runs because of a fault in the design of the bogie (the undercarriage and wheels).

While the high-speed rake looks similar to the other locals, it is the bogie that would have made all the difference. It's frame and technology was bought from Siemens, Austria, as part of the R4,500-crore Mumbai Urban Transport Project (MUTP). The train would have cut down the travel time for longer distances to Dahanu, Karjat and Kasara by at least 20 to 25 minutes.

Dead weight

The train was rolled out by the Integral Coach Factory (ICF) in Chennai. The nine-car rake was filled with heavy bags of sand and debris during the test runs. "The bags were equal to the weight of a crowded train. Trials were conducted till a few years ago, but now the train has just been standing here," said an official at the Virar car shed. The train has now been cannibalised, as most of its functional parts, like lighting, seating and other accessories, have been used as replacements for existing running trains.

Railway officials now claim that they had only planned to conduct trials with the rake, and it was never intended to be pressed into service. "There are limitations within the city for such high-speed travel, given the back-to-back line up of the trains in the saturated suburban system and the quality of tracks. But, it is easily possible outside city limits, at the Dahanu and Kasara-Karjat stretches. However, the tracks too need to be equipped to cater to such speeds," said an official.

No officials were willing to speak on record about the project, and there was no explanation for why the authorities spent Rs. 60 crore on a train that was only meant to be used for trials. It seems all the more wasteful now, considering the success of the new Bombardier rakes, which are capable of running at about 110 to 120kmph, and cost nearly Rs. 10 crore less to make.

160 kmph

Speed of Gatimaan Express, the nation's fastest train

140 kmph

Speed at which the high-speed local failed

120 kmph

Speed that the Bombardier rakes are capable of

145 kmph

Speed that was promised

80 kmph

Regular speed at which the special train will now run

I do hope they ICF (which ever division is responsible for Train 18 design) really succeeds because we do need PSUs to buck up...

vasu raya
BRFite
Posts: 1599
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby vasu raya » 30 Jan 2018 06:14

arshyam wrote:The one thing I am not clear about yet is how ICF plans to run these EMUs at high speeds (150+) with multiple pantographs. Our electric traction wire system (OHE) is not designed for high speed trains with multiple pantographs, and that's why even the double WAP-5 loco Rajdhani special runs with a single pantograph up and a thick cable delivering power to the second loco. Running heavy electrical cables through the length of the EMU rake is not feasible.


Had a similar question but the yt video here shows an EMU with single pantograph

soumik wrote:Train 18 seems to be a reverse engineered Swiss Stadler EC250 with lower
rated motors.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE4kccEEFwE

hanumadu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 11 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby hanumadu » 30 Jan 2018 07:36

The presentation in the youtube video talks about there being 4 pantographs but 2 will be used at any time.

hanumadu
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3989
Joined: 11 Nov 2002 12:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby hanumadu » 30 Jan 2018 08:25

Katare wrote:
hanumadu wrote:
Which video? the GM one or one with the PPT?

The one that Karthik posted


Yeah. But in the video I posted, the guy giving the presentation repeatedly says that it is totally designed in India.

sohamn
BRFite
Posts: 300
Joined: 27 Jul 2006 12:56
Location: the Queen of the Angels of Porziuncola
Contact:

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby sohamn » 31 Jan 2018 00:50

Zynda wrote:Jay, I think ICF is modifying existing LHB coach design to adapt for EMU kind of arrangement & LHBs have 8 wheels per coach design. Hopefully ICF design capabilities have improved but I think during mid-2000s, they tried to upgrade the old Swiss based coach (also called ICF coach) to 160 Kph speed limits and failed. Had very high oscillations IIRC. So I am not really confident on ICF coming up with any new designs of their own...in fact, I am a little skeptical about the Train 18 as well.


I think what might work for them is the fact that they are planning to use LHB coaches and swiss bogies to get the train set running. Since the technology is tried and tested and rated already at 160kmph, it might be feasible this time. I am more positive than before that a trainset will materialize in next 2 to 3 yrs.

JTull
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2296
Joined: 18 Jul 2001 11:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby JTull » 01 Feb 2018 18:04

Jaitley chips in with funds for (Sela Pass) tunnel to take trains to China’s doorstep in NE

GUWAHATI: Finance minister Arun Jaitley announced centre's help to build a crucial tunnel through the Sela Pass located at an elevation of 13,700 ft to push India's ambitious plan to take trains to the Buddhist pilgrimage, Tawang at China's doorsteps in the northeastern corner.

Jaitley proposed that "In order to enhance connectivity in border areas, the government will take up construction of tunnel under Sela Pass.

The survey for the 377.50 km long line from Bhalukpong on Assam-Arunachal border to Tawang was launched last year by the railways in collaboration with the defence ministry. The project, which was sanctioned in 2010-11 at an estimated cost of Rs 24,489 cr, will provide the quick reaction route for movement of troops and materials. Bhalukpong is the entry point on the road to Tawang about 290 km away and is already connected to rest of the country with a broad gauge line.

Tawang is situated at 10,000 ft and is connected by a newly laid down all-weather road and helicopter service that is dependent on weather.

India's two other proposed strategic train routes also lie in this region. These are the 248 km line to Aalo and the 227 km line to Parasuramkund in the southeastern part of the state.

Railway authorities say that proposed line to Tawang is likely to follow the road to Bomdila that lie at an elevation of 3,048 metres.

JTull
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2296
Joined: 18 Jul 2001 11:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby JTull » 01 Feb 2018 18:11

Infra Sector Gets Top Priority In Budget

The capital expenditure of the Railways for 2018-19 has been pegged at Rs 1,48,528 crore. The focus area clearly outlined at creating more capacity which involves 18,000 km of line doubling, third and fourth line works and 5,000-km of gauge conversion. This budget envisages the shift of entire railway network to broad gauge. The budget also calls for expansion of electrification work to 4,000 km. Indian Railways will be procuring 12,000 wagons, 5,160 coaches and approximately 700 locomotives during 2018-19. The Indian Railways will also be undertaking 3,600 km of maintenance and track renewal. The Railways will also be taking to use of technology like ‘‘Fog Safe’’ and ‘‘Train Protection and Warning System’’ to prevent accidents. Besides, 4,267 unmanned level crossings in the broad gauge network would be removed over the next two years to eliminate possibility of road-rail collisions, said the finance minister in his budget speech. Jaitley also announced redevelopment of 600 major railway stations by Indian Railway Station Development Co. Ltd. and declared that all stations with over 25,000 footfall per day would be provided with escalators. Subsequently, he said all railway stations and trains will also be provided with wi-fi and CCTVs.

JTull
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2296
Joined: 18 Jul 2001 11:31

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby JTull » 09 Feb 2018 03:09

Hitachi seeks Indian tie-up with eye on bullet train project

TOKYO -- Hitachi will form a technological partnership with an Indian state-owned company as part of efforts to win orders for the South Asian country's first bullet train railroad.

The tie-up between the Japanese conglomerate and BEML, one of India's top suppliers of subway train cars, could eventually lead to local production at a joint venture.

The governments of Japan and India have already agreed to adopt Japanese shinkansen bullet train technology for a high-speed railway spanning roughly 500km between Mumbai and the western state of Gujarat.

Bidding for the project by India's national high-speed rail company is expected to start soon. Hitachi, with a tack record of building bullet train cars, is seen as a strong candidate for supplying them.

The project is estimated to cost around 1.8 trillion yen ($16.4 billion). Construction is expected to start this year, with the service likely to launch in 2023.

A number of Japanese companies will take part in the project. Kawasaki Heavy Industries is another promising candidate for supplying train cars. Mitsubishi Electric, Nippon Steel & Sumitomo Metal and Toshiba also are angling to supply components.

If Hitachi does win an order, it would ship train cars built in Japan. But it would also consider building the cars in India at a joint venture in the future, marking the first time that shinkansen bullet trains are built outside Japan. Vehicle assembly would be moved to India by 2023, and key components like undercarriages also would be produced locally.

Globally, European and U.S. companies have been more successful in winning orders for major high-speed rail projects, along with Chinese companies touting cost competitiveness.

Japanese companies, for their part, are strong in delivery time management and quality -- part of shinkansen's appeal for the Indian government. Japanese companies seek to parlay their experience in India to the rest of the world. Just in India, six more high-speed rail projects are being planned.

Japan first exported shinkansen technology to Taiwan, more than a decade ago. A consortium of seven Japanese companies won orders for the high-speed railway that began service in 2007. Hitachi, Kawasaki Heavy and Nippon Sharyo built the first batch of train cars for the service, but production in Taiwan was not pursued due to concern over the potential for technology leaks.

Karthik S
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4134
Joined: 18 Sep 2009 12:12

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Karthik S » 21 Feb 2018 19:30

India could be the first country to get Hyperloop One, Mumbai-Pune travel time to come down to 25 minutes

If you thought the Mumbai-Pune expressway was the best thing that could ever happen in Maharashtra, prepare to have your expectations completely blown away. Because five to seven years from now, Virgin Group founder Richard Branson plans to inaugurate a hyperloop linking the two cities that will cut down travel time to 25 minutes, or less. The icing on the cake is that you won't have to break a bank for the privilege.

What's a hyperloop? It's a revolutionary train service that envisions loading passengers and cargo into a pod that will accelerate gradually via electric propulsion through a low-pressure tube. According to Sir Richard Branson, Chairman of Virgin Hyperloop One, the company building this system, the pod will then quickly lift above the track using magnetic levitation and glide at airline speeds for long distances due to ultra-low aerodynamic drag. In fact, with speeds 2-3 times faster than high-speed rail, hyperloop can connect far-flung Indian cities as if they were metro stops.

The technology for Hyperloop One is currently in the early stages of the commercialisation phase after the successful completion of the world's first full scale hyperloop systems test at their DevLoop site outside Las Vegas. And, according to The Economic Times, India just might be the first market for Hyperloop One, ahead of the Middle East, Northern Europe and the US, where the company is considering rolling out its service.

"We have always believed that India would be a tremendous market for hyperloop. The Pune-Mumbai route is one of the strongest economic cases we have seen to-date," said Virgin Hyperloop One CEO Rob Lloyd. So, yesterday, on the first day of the Magnetic Maharashtra Convergence 2018-a three-day summit inaugurated by Prime Minister Narendra Modi in Mumbai-Branson signed the Framework Agreement to begin the development of the route, starting with an operational demonstration track.

The proposed hyperloop route will link central Pune, Navi Mumbai International Airport, and Mumbai in 25-minutes, and will eventually support 150 million passenger trips annually, saving more than 90 million hours of travel time, and thus transforming lives. The system, boasting the capability to travel up to 1,000 km per hour, will also have the potential for the rapid movement of palletized freight and light cargo, creating a robust backbone for on-demand deliveries, supply chains, and next-generation logistics.

All in all, Branson claims that based on the team's studies, the hyperloop could result in $55 billion (Rs 3.5 lakh crore) in socio-economic benefits over 30 years of operation. That apart, the 100% electric system could reduce greenhouse gas emissions by up to 150,000 tons annually.

The project will begin with a six-month in-depth feasibility study, which will build upon the findings of the pre-feasibility study signed in November 2017 between the Pune Metropolitan Regional Development Authority and Virgin Hyperloop One and define the route alignment including environmental impact, the regulatory framework, cost and funding model recommendations, etc. Once this is completed, followed by the procurement stage to determine the public-private partnership structure, the construction of the hyperloop route will commence. The demonstration track will be constructed in two to three years and serve as a platform for testing, certifying, and regulating the system for commercial operations. The second phase will target to complete construction of the full Pune-Mumbai route by 2025. Future projects could also extend the route to link central Pune with the New Pune International Airport and Jawaharlal Nehru Port in Mumbai with Pune's industrial economic zones.

Said Chief Minister Devendra Fadnavis, "The Pune-Mumbai hyperloop route will be an economic catalyst for the region and create tens of thousands of jobs for India's world-class manufacturing, construction, service, and IT sectors and aligns with Make in India initiatives." According to officials, the project will ultimately be executed by a public-private partnership, which will save taxpayer money.

In fact, Branson claims the hyperloop can be set up at much lower cost than a high-speed rail network. "Price point will be at level of any other alternative mode of transportation. We are not pricing this as something only for wealthy, this will be available to the masses," he told the media, adding "I believe Virgin Hyperloop One could have the same impact upon India in the 21st century as trains did in the 20th century."

Actually, the company hopes to eventually set up a network, creating "the largest connected urban area in the world by linking nearly 75 million people across the three metropolitan areas"of the states of Maharashtra, Karnataka and Andhra Pradesh". The Memorandums of Understanding signed with the latter states governments last year to conduct feasibility studies were a step in this direction. If things fall in place, travel between Mumbai, Bengaluru, Chennai, Visakhapatnam, and Amaravati could take place in under two hours in the next decade.

Incidentally, this was not the only headline-grabbing announcement made at the Magnetic Maharashtra Convergence. Reliance industries chairman Mukesh Ambani, too, announced that his company will set up the first integrated digital area in the state. "It will be a collaborative investment worth Rs 60,000 crore, where 20 global companies will be investing," he added. No wonder Fadnavis felt emboldened to announce plans to become India's first $3 trillion economy by 2025.



https://www.businesstoday.in/current/ec ... 70975.html

Good to see such hi-tech projects are coming to India.

vasu raya
BRFite
Posts: 1599
Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby vasu raya » 23 Feb 2018 08:42

http://www.rediff.com/news/interview/why-must-so-many-elephants-die-on-the-railway-tracks/20180222.htm

On an average 80 elephants are killed in India each year.

India is home to around 30,000 elephants. 5,600 live in Assam.

Ten days before the tragedy in Assam, a group of wildlife conservationists sent a letter to Railway Minister Piyush Goyal to act on the rising elephant deaths due to train collisions. The letter listed measures that the government needs to undertake urgently to save these gentle giants.


Is BFSR which are supposed to detect crawling men at a distance, not an option here? given the size of the Jumbos

Zynda
BRFite
Posts: 1458
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 00:37
Location: J4

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Zynda » 24 Feb 2018 19:51

Here it is in its full glory...GE's WDG4G loco with our typical windows safety grill on Indian tracks :)

Image

arvin
BRFite
Posts: 148
Joined: 17 Aug 2016 21:26

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby arvin » 25 Feb 2018 11:39

Looks like Mysore thalaserry rail link has been put on back burner by rail bhavan. This is a pet project of kerala kommies and they put their best effort to include in the last budget. With no mention of it in budget and significant people in coorg and mysore dead opposed to it, the project may not even reach detailed DPR stage.
Primarily benefitting present kerala CM constituency for quick access to banglore, delhi might use this as a stick to beat commies for the political murders in the state.

Another horror project proposed by commies was a rail line thru bandipur via nilambur in kerala and was being hawked as golden IT corridor. To karnataka's credit they didnt show any interest in it unlike the first project where the two govt had a discussion.

Ankit Desai
BRFite
Posts: 464
Joined: 05 May 2006 21:28
Location: Gujarat

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Ankit Desai » 26 Feb 2018 09:50

Railways starts hiring 90,000 workers

In what is being touted as the world's biggest recruitment exercise, the railways has kickstarted the process to hire 89,500 employees, including assistant loco pilots, technicians, gangmen, switchmen, trackmen, cabinmen, welders, helpers and porters.
The state-run transporter's move to provide jobs to around one lakh youth from high school pass students to engineers seems to be aimed at blunting the opposition's criticism that enough jobs were not being created under the NDA government.

The decision to fill vacancies in safety-related category is also in sync with railway minister Piyush Goyal's plan to strengthen safety in train operations which was dented by a series of derailments. The plan to fill entry level vacancies by massive hiring, coupled with trimming of the railway board by half, seems to be Goyal's strategy to "right-size" the railways which is "top-heavy". The railways has issued notifications for hiring of around 63,000 jobs in group D category that includes gangmen, trackmen and another for hiring 26,500 personnel as loco pilots and assistant loco pilots.

Around 1.2 lakh positions related to safety are lying vacant and the railways is trying to build its safety infrastructure by hiring more ground-level workforce. The additional hiring is likely to cost Rs 4,000 crore a year.

Staff expenses have grown from Rs 69,713.22 crore in 2016-17 to Rs 72,705.57 crore in 2017-18. Staff expenditure is pegged at around Rs 76,451.89 crore in 2018-19. Justifying the move, an official said the recruitment was long overdue as around 40,000-45,000 employees retired every year and the railways could not compromise with safety. However, the fresh exercise attracted controversy over minimum qualifications and age criteria.
The railways had to relax the minimum qualification for its 62,907 vacancies of trackmen, helpers etc by dropping the requirement of an Industrial Training Institute (ITI) or equivalent certificate. Now, anyone with a minimum Class X certificate can apply. The railways had also relaxed the age criteria by extending it by two years across all categories.


-Ankit

Sachin
Webmaster BR
Posts: 7027
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Undisclosed

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Sachin » 26 Feb 2018 13:34

arvin wrote:Looks like Mysore thalaserry rail link has been put on back burner by rail bhavan. This is a pet project of kerala kommies and they put their best effort to include in the last budget.
...................
Another horror project proposed by commies was a rail line thru bandipur via nilambur in kerala and was being hawked as golden IT corridor. To karnataka's credit they didnt show any interest in it unlike the first project where the two govt had a discussion.

Both these projects are not viable, for the huge investment required to lay the lines. These projects can for sure mess up the fragile eco-system in the hills & forests. Thus the protest from people in Coorg etc. The Kerala politicians have shown no concerns for forest & wild life, and this can be seen the way forest lands have been encroached in places like Munnar.

The Nilambur Road railway station (from where the Nilambur-Nanjangud line is to start) was built by the British not for passenger traffic. It was for transporting teak woods from Nilambur forests to other parts for processing. No body would use a train going through dense forests and hilly terrain, when today there are much better road facilities available. Same is the case with this Thalassery line as well. There is no guarantee that people would use trains instead of buses (or own cars).

In many hilly areas in India, there are train lines. But they were laid, before the first well tarred road was laid. Ooty was first reachable by train, before a good motorable road was laid. Those days are long gone, and now laying tracks on forest & hilly lands is only going to waste away lots of funds. Also there is no strategic importance to any of these big projects which Kerala Govt. has been trying put on some one else' head.

Mollick.R
BRFite
Posts: 124
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 10:26

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Mollick.R » 26 Feb 2018 19:11

Zynda wrote:Here it is in its full glory...GE's WDG4G loco with our typical windows safety grill on Indian tracks :)

Image


It's quite confusing.
After Piyush Goyel took over the ministry there was full push for IR completely switching over to Electric locos & there was some tussle going on between ministry & GE for hold on Diesel loco orders from Bihar's Marhowra Plant.

All issues resolved ??

Mollick.R
BRFite
Posts: 124
Joined: 15 Aug 2016 10:26

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Mollick.R » 26 Feb 2018 19:18

Ok, found it.
Looks like ministry blinked

http://www.livemint.com/Politics/0T8JfOrmYWbc8sDR89mU0K/Piyush-Goyal-says-work-on-GEs-locomotive-factory-on-track.html

Although the ministers claimed that Indian Railways has resolved the issue with GE, there are still some unanswered questions.

For instance, what happens to the Varanasi DLW? And what of the government’s plan to take Indian Railways completely electric by 2022? What happens to the diesel locomotives then?

jpremnath
BRFite -Trainee
Posts: 94
Joined: 18 Dec 2016 21:06

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby jpremnath » 26 Feb 2018 19:39

Sachin wrote:
arvin wrote:Looks like Mysore thalaserry rail link has been put on back burner by rail bhavan. This is a pet project of kerala kommies and they put their best effort to include in the last budget.
...................
Another horror project proposed by commies was a rail line thru bandipur via nilambur in kerala and was being hawked as golden IT corridor. To karnataka's credit they didnt show any interest in it unlike the first project where the two govt had a discussion.

Both these projects are not viable, for the huge investment required to lay the lines. These projects can for sure mess up the fragile eco-system in the hills & forests. Thus the protest from people in Coorg etc. The Kerala politicians have shown no concerns for forest & wild life, and this can be seen the way forest lands have been encroached in places like Munnar.

The Nilambur Road railway station (from where the Nilambur-Nanjangud line is to start) was built by the British not for passenger traffic. It was for transporting teak woods from Nilambur forests to other parts for processing. No body would use a train going through dense forests and hilly terrain, when today there are much better road facilities available. Same is the case with this Thalassery line as well. There is no guarantee that people would use trains instead of buses (or own cars).

In many hilly areas in India, there are train lines. But they were laid, before the first well tarred road was laid. Ooty was first reachable by train, before a good motorable road was laid. Those days are long gone, and now laying tracks on forest & hilly lands is only going to waste away lots of funds. Also there is no strategic importance to any of these big projects which Kerala Govt. has been trying put on some one else' head.


Thalassery is a commie stronghold and the base of current powerful faction within CPM. They are doing their best to make thalassery the commercial capital of North Malabar, which unsurprisingly would have benefited them financially. This railway line was one of the many links in their grand masterplan.

arvin
BRFite
Posts: 148
Joined: 17 Aug 2016 21:26

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby arvin » 26 Feb 2018 21:22

Nilambur should remain a dead end as it was during British times and there is no point in extending it because it doesnt make sense economically or ecologically.

KA might see some benefit in the Thalaserry line because of current line has poor connectivity between manglore and banglore with grand total of maybe 7 trains connecting the two stations. Out of that 2 are kannur bound and other are north bound. A new weekly train 16566 was introduced in 2013 during UPA times but its routed through Coimbatore. The proposed Thalassery to Mysore via Mananthavadi in Wayanad district will serve as an alternative to the current line where speed limitations exist due to ghats.

Only thing is if approved they should be sensitive to the ecology of coorg and mysore. The tentative route seems to be Thalaserry, Koothuparamba, Manandavadi(wayanad), Kutta(coorg), Balele, and Thithimathi to reach Mysuru.

Zynda
BRFite
Posts: 1458
Joined: 07 Jan 2006 00:37
Location: J4

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Zynda » 27 Feb 2018 19:22

Initial trails of the new Alsthom WAG12 12000 HP freight electric loco from Alsthom India's plant in Bihar.



I hope these locomotives contain toilet facilities for pilots. I think the newer diesel locomotives & WAP-7 (?) have them.

I like the livery of these locos. I think the GE WDG4G looks garish with its bright red/yellow combo.

Sachin
Webmaster BR
Posts: 7027
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30
Location: Undisclosed

Re: Indian Railways Thread (Dec 2015)

Postby Sachin » 01 Mar 2018 12:26

jpremnath wrote:Thalassery is a commie stronghold and the base of current powerful faction within CPM. They are doing their best to make thalassery the commercial capital of North Malabar, which unsurprisingly would have benefited them financially. This railway line was one of the many links in their grand masterplan.

Yes I know, the so called Kannur faction is the State Committee, Central Committee and Polit Bureau of the CPI(M). The same folks just change places and call themselves by a different name ;) :lol:. Honestly, I don't know what is there in Thalassery (other than bakeries) which requires a new railway line to be built destorying acres of forest land. And Thalassery is still connected by railway today (MAS-MAQ line via SRR). This proposed new railway line would be at a huge loss for Railways, and any body who make money would be some Keralite land owners (who most likely would be politicians or cronies only).

arvin wrote:KA might see some benefit in the Thalaserry line because of current line has poor connectivity between manglore and banglore with grand total of maybe 7 trains connecting the two stations. Out of that 2 are kannur bound and other are north bound.

The railways also would be monitoring the revenue generated out of these trains. Out of these trains, one train which used to go via MYS has now been diverted via Sravanabelagola for a few days in the week. Looks like the patronage for trains via Shiradi Ghats and Mangalore is not very great. The travel by road is today much more comfortable and quicker when compared to trains. So vested interests in Kerala would still demand new lines, and new trains; and would say that all those trains would run profitably every day. But that may not be the case. The railways did introduce a YPR-CAN express via HSRA-SA-CBE-SRR, and this train has a good patronage. Partly because the train is also of good use for people who travel to CBE, PGT and SRR as well. A new line with only end points being major towns, and the rest of the route all lying in forest lands, would certainly not be viable for the railways.


Return to “Technology & Economic Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests