Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

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How many of you had to defecate in open?

Poll ended at 22 Aug 2017 23:00

Never. I never had to defecate in open.
19
54%
Sometimes (like when visiting village or when guests had to come and no avl. toilets)
12
34%
Most of the times
0
No votes
Yuck! I held on tight.
2
6%
Will you ever do it? (like when visiting village or when guests come and no avl. toilets)
2
6%
 
Total votes: 35

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Rakesh » 04 Dec 2017 09:48

Disha - This thread needs all the exposure it can get. I made it a sticky. Very good thread Saar.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 05 Dec 2017 03:27

Thanks for the encouragement! It did motivate me to go and find out something (anything) on cleanliness. And this is another item I discovered:

https://www.youthkiawaaz.com/2017/12/shwetas-invicible-determinationno-school-till-the-toilet-is-build/

The story is about a school kid who refuses to go to school until her father., a daily wage laborer, actually builds a toilet. The story is a must read both for its inspiration and the tinge of sadness around it.

Currently in some form and my words may be very harsh, India is being "toilet trained". I hope the toilet training will happen in my lifetime.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 05 Dec 2017 03:33

This will warm up Jingoes hearts., rural china is also dirty. At least we can now say with pride - we are like them only! :-D

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/swachh-china-president-xi-calls-for-toilet-revolution-similar-to-pm-modis-swachh-bharat-mission

President Xi has ordered a “toilet revolution” in China with the aim to improve tourism infrastructure. As one of top four countries receiving foreign tourists, China’s sanitation facilities in the rural areas and tourism sites have had a bad reputation as reported by Financial Express.


A clean India is actually an investment in our tourism industry.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 05 Dec 2017 03:36

And this is the article I was looking for., disease burden (generally borne by the poor and lower-middle class) due to unclean spaces. At least there is some talk about it.

http://indianexpress.com/article/india/despite-swachh-bharat-per-person-disease-burden-due-to-unsafe-water-sanitation-40-times-higher-in-india-4936909/

Summing up the findings, an article in The Lancet said: “Per capita disease burden measured as DALY (disability adjusted life year) rate has dropped by about a third in India over the past 26 years. However, the magnitude and causes of disease burden and the risk factors vary greatly between the states. The change to dominance of NCDs (non-communicable diseases)and injuries over CMNNDs (from communicable, maternal, neonatal, and nutritional diseases) occurred about a quarter century apart in the four ETL (epidemiological transition level) state groups. Nevertheless, the burden of some of the leading CMNNDs continues to be very high, especially in the lowest ETL states. This comprehensive mapping of inequalities in disease burden and its causes across the states of India can be a crucial input for more specific health planning for each state as is envisioned by the Government of India’s premier think tank, the National Institution for Transforming India, and the National Health Policy 2017.”


So clean and hygienic spaces is also an investment in your health!

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Rakesh » 06 Dec 2017 07:31

Disha: What is your view on Delhi's air quality? It looks scary. How are people living there? WOW! :shock: Is this all coming from factories in the NCR? And from insane traffic in the NCR? What strategies exist to "scrub" the air clean?

https://twitter.com/VishnuNDTV/status/9 ... 1310328832 --> As Sri Lanka's cricketers struggle to breathe, the Green Tribunal asks why the Delhi test was held in the first place. We bring you a reality check on just why outdoor activity in the NCR is deadly.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby tandav » 10 Dec 2017 11:16

Rakesh wrote:Disha: What is your view on Delhi's air quality? It looks scary. How are people living there? WOW! :shock: Is this all coming from factories in the NCR? And from insane traffic in the NCR? What strategies exist to "scrub" the air clean?

https://twitter.com/VishnuNDTV/status/9 ... 1310328832 --> As Sri Lanka's cricketers struggle to breathe, the Green Tribunal asks why the Delhi test was held in the first place. We bring you a reality check on just why outdoor activity in the NCR is deadly.


In order of contribution:

1) Agricultural residue being burnt across Punjab, UP, Haryana. A better option would be to encourage agro residue mulching by cutting up the stalks etc and ploughing it into the soil. It has the dual benefit of improving soil and reducing PM2.5 and PM10.
2) Coal fired Power stations (being replaced by solar now)
3) Garbage burning (cities are mandating recycling)
4) Diesel burning engines (both vehicular and static)

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Rahul M » 10 Dec 2017 12:08

one solution to (1) is create small paper mills.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 10 Dec 2017 13:46

I needed to do some research for completeness before some comprehensive and actionable proposals are put here for debate. Hence apologies for any delays.

Delhi being a large city-state and also the NCR., it has lot of clout in influencing policies right way as long as it takes its challenges as its opportunities.

Let's start with vehicular pollution. One of the largest pollutants in NCR regions are its vehicles, right from buses, trucks, cars, two-wheelers. What can Delhi do? So many people and vehicles have to come in? Well from my calculations, Delhi needs at least 10000 (ten thousand) buses plying daily across its @1500 sq. km area. It has 50 lakh commuters going for its buses and still that is only 40-45% of its total commute needs. Needless to say there is huge scope of improvement.

“Delhi needs a high-frequency high-capacity bus system. There should be about 14,000-15,000 buses on road by 2021. Bus stands should be within a walking distance of mere five minutes from all areas. Bus frequency should be a maximum of 2-3 minutes in peak hours and 5 minutes during off-peak hours,” said Ashok Bhattacharjee, advisor, CSE and former director of Unified Traffic and Transportation Infrastructure (Planning & Engineering) Centre (UTTIPEC).


In fact, Delhi can start replacing its aging transport straight away. It can add 1000 buses every year and can give 250 bus contract to each major manufacturer with a chance to double the order based on performance and not just price. For example Tata Hispano already has a CNG-Electric hybrid and Volvo and Mitsubishi have Diesel electric hybrid.

It will take at least a decade to replace its fleet with hybrids. And a decade hence it can jump on the electric-only buses. It can partner with Tesla for example and provide a design and a solution that will help Delhi in its energy-efficient transportation need. It can come back and say that by 2025 it will purchase electric-only buses, partly powered by solar panels generating electricity form its roofs.

And DTC can become the proxies to get new gen energy efficient buses into India for other transport corporations. Entire India needs some million buses for public transportation alone.

Where is the leadership or vision from DTC? Where is the vision from Delhi Government?

People ask me what has good buses to do with hygiene and I do point them out to clean airports and clean railway stations including Delhi metro. Basically if you have pride in something people do take care of it. When people see that the Delhi Government is making effort to bring in new technology and energy efficiency and at the same time improve air quality, they will cooperate. Delhi Metro is a prime example.

Of course Delhi Gov. can be aggressive and remove 2000 buses per year or all of 10000 buses and replace them with cleaner public transportation. However where is the vision? I am not too worried about "money"., there are several central and state resources it can marshal including clean transportation bonds to fund and upgrade its infrastructure. It is an NCR and it has access to funds which other cities can only dream off.

And it is not just DTC., throw in private buses and other tour operators. They will crib but comply. And that should be another 10000 buses.

Again I am keeping the calculations at 20k buses for another reason. Let's say each bus travels 150 km every day (24 hour period - 10 trips of 15 km avg) and each bus uses say 50 litres/100 km (or 2kmpl) then one is using 200*150=300000 liters per day! Even if the diesel-hybrid is 33% efficient (it can be as high as 50%)., we are basically sloughing off consumption of 100k litres of petrol per day and this impacts the air quality straight away.

My estimates are very conservative. Anyway, 10 years from now electric only buses are going to be common and assume if Delhi goes all electric., it will slough off at least 300k to 500k litres of diesel per day. That is a huge reduction in air pollution.

Bottomline: Delhi can start cleaning up its own act on public transportation by junking its current Diesel fleet (incl. the blue line) and getting in hybrid-electric immediately with a 10 year plan to replace it with all electric. And it can set the standards and proxy for other cities and earn consultancy money on top of it for other transport corps.

The net effect and actually in a very short time will result in a better and cleaner public transport. Further, an efficient public transport will take more vehicles out of the existing road transportation leading to overall long term improvement.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 10 Dec 2017 14:25

Stubble burning is seasonal. It occurs at most three or two times a year and when it occurs in winter, the smog stays low and causes more harm compared to other times.

Again here Delhi can take a lead. All of the stubble can either be converted to paper, cardboard or cattle fodder. However Delhi can use its famed educational institutions like IIT-D or other science research institutes to convert the cellulose into alcohol. All it has to do is fund some PhD, Masters and Bachelor programs with some achievable targets.

However above is a long term goal. In the short term, it can supply certified charcoal makers (here is a poor man version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqI63IEg3MM) or come up with a sophisticated making of bio briquettes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQfp-XIxNq0 and purchase it back to use it in power plants.

Either way, several million tons of charcoal can be created from the agri waste.

Bottomline: Several solutions exist, but Delhi has to show vision and leadership.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SriKumar » 10 Dec 2017 16:14

Is there any report or study published on the contaminants in the Delhi air? This would point to the sources of pollution. If there is such study done, and the report is public, please point me to it.

Initially the media went after vehicular pollution as being the main culprit- so the odd-even rule came into play 8 months ago. Did that help? (I guess not since it was done away with quietly). Then it was Diwali. And what happens....... the pollution in NCR area becomes worse 2-3 weeks after Diwali (if it is Diwali, the pollution would have spiked the very same day(s) and tapered off over the next 2-3 weeks). Then it was stubble burning. Stubble burning seems to have taken place about 4-5 weeks ago... I dont know if stubble burning took place the days before the SL test. Plus Yogi banned it in UP, that did not seem to help at all. Specifically the fact that pollution became high during the week prior to SL test, which was 3-4 weeks after the Haryana stubble burning points to some other source.

Doing an air quality study different months of the year would point to the source quite conclusively since the molecules and particulate matter from burning petrol/desiel are different from burning vegetable matter (stubble) are different from gunpowder (fire-crackers) are different from factory discharge (depends on the factory type as well). I am thinking it is the factories but they have not been discussed much. It starts with a study identifying the molecules and particulate matter. I sure some study would have been done somewhere but it does not seem like the Delhi govt is using that to direct anti-pollution activity (unless the study conclusively pointed the finger at vehicles as the primary cause).

Added later:
Ages ago, there was a story in US press where a city (near the border?) had problems with pollution. It was traced to some factories (and not vehicles etc) and this was done based on chemical analysis. And it turned out some factories smoke stacks polluted more than others. So, they installed devices at the top of the chimneys to track how much smoke/pollutants it was spewing. Some factory wallas would secretly run their factories for extra hours at night, to escape detection. The installed devices on the chimneys ended that deceit because the authorities could now track exactly what pollutants came from which chimney and how much- so one could not blame others to obfuscate the cause.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 11 Dec 2017 00:21

^ All pollution is bad. Vehicular, farm, factory and construction dust. Each adds to the overall pollution spectrum. One just needs to identify the source and get moving on fixing it.

Delhi can show the way by being combative about air, water and ground pollution. I has the resources and it just needs to show the vision. There is no silver bullet and no magic pill. The hard work has to start now to start paying off 2-3 years later.

Check out the second video in my link., it is a simple solution to make charcoal briquettes. There is no high technology involved here. In fact, taking care of "agricultural waste" is the easiest.

Here are the steps to take care of "agricultural waste" and again taking care of "agricultural waste" is the most easiest

1. Delhi partners with Haryana, UP & Punjab to make and supply shredders to small and medium farmers. Farmers can use the shredded farm "waste" as compost or mulch. This has as much been pointed out by others, including converting it into paper or cardboard or even engineered wood. All of them are value added solutions which farmers will adapt if they are shown a better incentive than just burning the crop "waste".

2. Delhi with its universities can actually create initiatives to buy some of the farm compost or mulch for its own urban gardens or for growing gourmet mushrooms. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECD_ds41gY8. There are several universities who do the research and Delhi Universities like DU and JNU can partner using their science departments.

3. I have already pointed out use of agricultural waste as briquettes.

And all of the above does not take much resources. Spending even Rs. 10 crore per year to bring the above to fruition will result in big changes. And the good part is, the outcomes of above are easily measured.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 11 Dec 2017 00:45

And here is a must watch video on Agricultural Waste disposal


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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 12 Dec 2017 01:18

I do want to add., for air pollution in Delhi (and across all metros in India)., the sources need to be identified:

1. Agriculture "waste" burning (effects for eg. Delhi)
2. Vehicular pollution (pollution due to vehicles) (all metros)
3. Burning of Garbage openly (effects all metros and tier-2 and tier-3 cities)
4. Factories (eg. Agra, Delhi)
5. Construction (all metros)

Some of the solutions are very simple and straightforward. For example., banning of burning agriculture "waste" around 250 km radius from any city centre. Also the city can start providing solutions on turning agriculture "waste" into useable and profitable product. Changes in this area will result in positive outcomes that is seen in months. There are several ways in which this can be implemented on ground.

Vehicular pollution., the solution here is both short and long term. In the immediate term., all city and state transports can start taking in diesel-hybrid with a plan to convert it to electric only in say a decade. The next is to ask the private bus operators to retire their diesel buses. Then comes the local taxis. I think each city can ask its auto-rickshaw drivers to upgrade to electric taxi where some bridge funding is provided by the city on a nominal interest. https://cleantechnica.com/2017/11/24/uber-mahindra-partnering-electric-taxis-india/

Burning of garbage openly is a result of not putting initiatives in clean spaces., basically collect garbage and get garbage to power plants going. Here is one successful plant running in Bengaluru, Kerala. http://www.thenewsminute.com/article/how-bengaluru-company-leading-way-turning-wet-waste-green-fuel-71908

Construction again comes under city limits and each city can work out a plan and also coach the builders on safe practices.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 02 Jan 2018 06:48

Major news:

https://swarajyamag.com/insta/after-sikkim-arunachal-is-the-second-state-in-northeast-india-to-be-open-defecation-free

Arunachal Pradesh became the second state in Northeast India to be declared Open Defecation Free (ODF). Sikkim was the first state to be declared free of open defecation, way back in 2008.

The three remaining districts of the border state – Upper Subansiri, Siang and Changlang – were declared Open Defecation Free (ODF) officially on 31 December, an official release said.

Arunachal Pradesh has 21 districts and the state attained the goal nearly two years before the national deadline of 2 October, 2019.

The state government had cut short the ODF target by one year and 10 months ahead of the national target and set 31 December as the deadline.

The project undertaken under the Swachh Bharat Mission (Gramin) or SBM (G) saw the light of day only after the state government extended an incentive of Rs 8,000 per toilet in addition to the Centre's support of Rs 12,000, thereby raising the grant for constructing a toilet to Rs 20,000.

The state also launched the Swachh Arunachal Mission on 2 October this year at Tawang which envisaged the Swachh Protocol (Cleanliness Protocol) aimed at ensuring sustainability of assets created under SBM (G).

“I am personally overwhelmed to find people participating in construction of toilets even in remote villages along the international borders like Vijaynagar, Taksing, Pipsorang despite communication bottlenecks requiring strenuous trekking for days together carrying construction materials along with ration on head load,” Chief Minister Pema Khandu said while crediting the accomplishment to the people.

“Today we attain freedom from open defecation. We have finally won the battle and liberated ourselves from the open defecation menace. The tiring and rigorous fight against open defecation was a herculean task but not impossible, state Public Health Engineering & Water Supply Minister Bamang Felix said.


Two states in India go ODF! I hope the rest of the states go ODF by 2 Oct 2019.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby BajKhedawal » 07 Jan 2018 23:36

Swachh Bharat Hits Another Swachhta Milestone....

Open Defecation Free| Written By: Anisha Bhatia| January 04, 2018 12:09 PM

Till now, the government has been successful in building more than 6 crore individual house hold latrines in rural and urban parts of the country and has declared nine states and two Union territories free from the practice of open defecation – Sikkim, Himachal Pradesh, Kerala, Uttarakhand, Haryana, Gujarat, Arunachal Pradesh, Chandigarh and Daman and Diu.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 10 Jan 2018 05:02

I have been to Diu, really clean place. Excellent beaches. This was almost a decade back and I did not see any open defecation or garbage on the street. Except for some areas which were dusty (lack of trees) and wire hanging openly, it was actually a good clean place.

People in Mumbai can actually fly to Diu (flight on alternate days), spend a weekend there and come back. Cheaper and better than Goa.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Haresh » 13 Feb 2018 16:48

Clean India is a very good business opportunity.
The French company Veolia is offering some good solutions.

https://www.veolia.in/

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Singha » 22 Feb 2018 08:38

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-b5n0SWKuEA

an israeli co named lishtot worked for 15 years to develop this keychain sized water contaminant sensor ...

these are kind of STEM technology which changes lives, not trying to make a quick buck with an app/delivery/ecommerce/pptgiri/mba which all our youth are focussed on.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Karthik S » 22 Feb 2018 10:05

Gurus, how other countries manage to remove all sand, mud and dust from their cities? In India you can see these along all major roads in all cities.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Singha » 22 Feb 2018 11:21

mechanized cleaning of roadsides , plus they make sure roads are paved all the way to footpath with proper slope and drain holes so a muddy shoulder is not left to create dust and mud ... or to crack the side of the road by erosion leaving a steep fall-off (often seen in village, hill and forest roads here)

that is why all the salt thats use to deice roads also magically vanishes soon as the snow melts off.

in my apts which is attached to a tech park, a "roots logistics" vehicle does this, and roads are paved upto sidewalk as i mentioned. so no real dust and dirt, just as abroad.

our air also has higher ambient levels of dust due to terrain (beijing too) and pervasive (re)construction. take any colony. once the initial set of people are done building bungalows, some start adding floors to make some rent, then front sides will come as shops, then older homes broken to make multi storey apartments...it is *never* stable and done with unlike a american housing colony. and no measures like misting is done at construction sites to control dust. all the workers are surely suffering heavy lung damage.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Singha » 22 Feb 2018 11:28

here it is being done on the median of mahadevpura road leading into whitefield

Image

but nothing possible on side which is rock and mud.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Singha » 22 Feb 2018 11:29

Image
Image
Image

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Singha » 22 Feb 2018 11:35

bikes and even trucks break the median and use "cuttings" to take shortcuts leading to more soil coming off the median onto the road.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Karthik S » 22 Feb 2018 11:45

This indeed is what's needed. Once pavements are built in all major cities, need to import or build such machines to remove all sand and mud and then mark lanes. Need to impose strict rules on construction activities. In almost every city I lived, all house/apt construction, the sand and bricks are put on roads (public property), this not only blocks right of way for the traffic, but also dirties the place especially during rainy seasons.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SBajwa » 22 Feb 2018 23:08

Rakesh wrote:Disha: What is your view on Delhi's air quality? It looks scary. How are people living there? WOW! :shock: Is this all coming from factories in the NCR? And from insane traffic in the NCR? What strategies exist to "scrub" the air clean?

https://twitter.com/VishnuNDTV/status/9 ... 1310328832 --> As Sri Lanka's cricketers struggle to breathe, the Green Tribunal asks why the Delhi test was held in the first place. We bring you a reality check on just why outdoor activity in the NCR is deadly.


I was there in December 2017 - January 2018. It is not live able city during the winter months. Large part is because of not enough rain and alluvial soil particle hanging in the air.

Then Kharif crops (October - November) in Punjab, Haryana and Western UP gets harvested (usually paddy)., and then to save time farmers burn the left over stubble as they are in hurry for Rabi crops (November-December - April-May). The earlier they do then most time they have for the third crop season between Rabi and Kharif (usually vegetables). Then smoke from villages all around Delhi also hangs in the air.

I get sore throat and chest issues every single time I land into Delhi.

for some strange reason Chandigarh is much more smog free then Delhi despite being sorrounded by agriculture states.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Katare » 23 Feb 2018 01:13

Singha wrote:mechanized cleaning of roadsides , plus they make sure roads are paved all the way to footpath with proper slope and drain holes so a muddy shoulder is not left to create dust and mud ... or to crack the side of the road by erosion leaving a steep fall-off (often seen in village, hill and forest roads here)

that is why all the salt thats use to deice roads also magically vanishes soon as the snow melts off.

in my apts which is attached to a tech park, a "roots logistics" vehicle does this, and roads are paved upto sidewalk as i mentioned. so no real dust and dirt, just as abroad.

our air also has higher ambient levels of dust due to terrain (beijing too) and pervasive (re)construction. take any colony. once the initial set of people are done building bungalows, some start adding floors to make some rent, then front sides will come as shops, then older homes broken to make multi storey apartments...it is *never* stable and done with unlike a american housing colony. and no measures like misting is done at construction sites to control dust. all the workers are surely suffering heavy lung damage.


Moisture level in the soil and air also play a vital role in how much dust is generated in cities and on roads. In India, it rains only for 3 months and than it is a long bout of dry season which dries out soil (killing all plants/grass) which frees silica/mineral particles from the organic matters. Finer one's get air born and go every were. In west on an average it rains pretty much every month of the year, combine this with lower average temperatures and you got a lot of green grass all over the place.

I had a thought that for Indian conditions someone should invent a low cost plant based biodegradable resin/adhesive that can be sprinkled, on a monthly schedule, around roads and medians to bind the dust particles into clumps as it dries. Traditionally that is what has been done in Indian summer afternoon in front of shops and houses but with water which evaporates in few hours.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Shameek » 23 Feb 2018 01:46

The other contributing factor is the constant 'digging up' of roads on some pretext or the other. (phone, internet, pipes etc.) The road and sidewalk in front of my house was made very well with 3 lanes per side and special footpath tiles to allow rainwater to percolate into the soil below. Within 2 years multiple sections have been dug up and destroyed. Permits are granted left and right for companies to dig up roads and sidewalks but no one follows up to ensure that it is brought back to earlier standards. Come the next monsoon, all that dug up mud is spread across the road and breaks it further.

I have seen multiple places abroad where they spend 3-4 months after road construction to lay grass/seeds even on the side of highways. Even China is lining a lot of highways with trees on both sides. They keep the soil bound much better.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Vivek K » 24 Feb 2018 00:00

SBajwa wrote:

I get sore throat and chest issues every single time I land into Delhi.

for some strange reason Chandigarh is much more smog free then Delhi despite being sorrounded by agriculture states.

The Thar Desert is moving eastwards because of deforestation. Need to plant trees to prevent this movement. This used to be cited as one of the factors blamed in the 90s. Delhi was then showing signs of spouting Desert style vegetation.

But one of the solutions is to plant grass. There is a lot of land/parks where there is NO grass. Why? Shoulders of EVERY road in India are bare dirt. Need to build Sidewalks extending from edge of pavement with grass on them.

Grass may be Delhi's answer. I think that Chandigarh has more grass than Delhi.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Shameek » 26 Feb 2018 21:55

The challenge with grass is it needs to be maintained and requires water. In a climate like Delhi that can be challenging. If they can select certain areas to focus on and then re-purpose waste water to irrigate the area then it may work. A lot of discipline is required by the authorities and the citizens. Don't dig up the area, don't dump trash or pile sand/bricks, etc. Also planting trees/larger shrubs helps as they provide shade and prevent the soil from drying out quickly.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SRoy » 27 Feb 2018 22:00

There is something worth sharing.

My apartment is at the busiest intersection where the IT crowd of Kolkata change / board their conveyances. Being one of the financially well off, grid like planned localities of Kolkata, blessed with a well funded municipality, the roads are swept clean in the morning. All roads are tree lined, with well paved side walks.

What do I see in the evening?

Youngsters from the Sec V, the electronic city (I can f**king make out the company names on the hanging ID cards from my 3th floor window) patronizing illegal hawkers, buying from encroached eateries. Worse fact is these people litter the area so badly, that surrounding areas of our housing estate has become stray dog menace.

Crowd is mix of locals and UP/Bihar.

BC, does IBM and Wipro not feed these idiots in the lunch hour? Or the recruiting standards have fallen so much that they pick up these sub-humans from every nondescript colleges?

These are the cream of our society.

Modiji can cry hoarse with his Swaccha Bharat initiative, nothing is going to change.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Dipanker » 27 Feb 2018 23:21

^ Is it is possible to put up garbage cans in the area? Certainly a well funded municipality can afford them? The hawkers can also share responsibilities. They can also empty the garbage cans on their daily rounds of sweeping the roads.

It may require some initiative but it should be doable, no?

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SRoy » 27 Feb 2018 23:39

^^

No, these so-called educated IT coolies won't use the garbage bins. That's the issue.

When I glance down my window, I see few of the licensed eatery (being mobile operation ... have their carts) bringing their own garbage bins. And the boys of the eateries sweep clean the place when they leave around 9 PM. But the trash is left from other eateries that don't place bins.

Why can't the IT crowd use the garbage bins from the ones that are providing the facility?

Larger question is why would these people patronize roadside stalls in the first place?

FWIW, the municipality does their job in the morning. Keeping garbage bins everywher is not practical, as these would be stolen at night. Salt Lake is pretty deserted during nights.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Shameek » 28 Feb 2018 04:35

Wastewater reuse like the example below can help with growing grass/vegetation on roadsides and communities. This one is targeted for golf courses but could be re-purposed for other uses including playgrounds and gardens.

Golf Course Irrigation

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Shameek » 03 Mar 2018 02:30

Thermocol coated toilets for rural areas as a part of Swachh Bharat.

Link to video

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SBajwa » 11 Mar 2018 04:07

We (all educated people) People needs to separate garbage (food items, plastic & books etc & industrial waste/hazardous waste) in separate bins!!!

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby Y. Kanan » 14 Mar 2018 05:54

Karthik S wrote:Gurus, how other countries manage to remove all sand, mud and dust from their cities? In India you can see these along all major roads in all cities.


In Bangalore, my inner tears get a fine coat of dark dust (which I see on a cotton swab) by the end of each day. That’s one thing I liked about living in the US: clean ears every day.

I wonder what Indian city dust is actually comprised of. I suspect it’s mostly ash from burnt garbage.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby SRoy » 18 Mar 2018 01:46

Garbage burning as a practice has long disappeared, due to strict environmental laws.

The dust we see in cities is actually the dust from exposed soil surface.

BTW, What happens to you NRI/R2I specimen? DNA's of you guys change after few years in US?
Typical condescending NRI / R2I non sense "I suspect it’s mostly ash from burnt garbage".

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 18 Mar 2018 22:12

SRoy wrote:BTW, What happens to you NRI/R2I specimen? DNA's of you guys change after few years in US?
Typical condescending NRI / R2I non sense "I suspect it’s mostly ash from burnt garbage".


The above is condescending. And such statements have no place on this thread.

The burden of disease due to filth, squalor and unclean and unhygienic conditions is borne by everybody and hence is "unseen". It has nothing to do with DNA's of NRI/R2I specimen. And the poor pay for it disproportionately then the not-so-poor. It impacts the entire GDP of India by several percentage points.

This very thread is to bring out objectively the facts of clean india., places, options and initiatives and results and it will help if posters try to adhere to contributing to this positively rather than go into condescension.

Yes, fact is *no city* in India completely disposes of its garbage cleanly. Lot of it is burnt and it does contribute to air pollution. And then there is rampant construction - mostly illegal. Add to it poor planning and cleaning of infrastructure. On top of it vehicular pollution. On top of it burning of crop stubbles. The list goes on and on and on and is endless. And each compounds the other. And we are still at air pollution. We have not even discussed the lake burning episodes that occur in the 'garden city'.

Open condescension of NRIs is not going to stop that.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby disha » 18 Mar 2018 22:18

Y. Kanan wrote:
In Bangalore, my inner tears get a fine coat of dark dust (which I see on a cotton swab) by the end of each day. That’s one thing I liked about living in the US: clean ears every day.

I wonder what Indian city dust is actually comprised of. I suspect it’s mostly ash from burnt garbage.


:-) In reverse, I nowadays do not get the satisfaction of washing my hair and seeing the 'dark dusty' water go away.

Several cities all over the world are working towards proper planning and keeping vegetation to tamp down the dust. In US, several cities have the problem of smog, which is mostly vehicular pollution.

That is if you take a swab of a windshield of a car in US, it is mostly dust particles & partially burnt fuel from exhaust of the vehicles (including trucks), tire (or rubber) particles. In India you have to add dust as well as burning of garbage to that.

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Re: Clean India - Places, Options, Initiatives & Results

Postby tandav » 18 Mar 2018 23:13

Went to couple of beach side villages in Alibagh/konkan region and few panchayats were collecting money from tourists to permit access to beaches. The paid beaches were miles ahead in cleanliness as compared to the "free" beaches. FWIW


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