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Indian Response to Terrorism

Singha
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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Singha » 27 Dec 2008 23:16

but then the hamas would also detonate one in tel aviv and one in jerusalem.

my point was, if Unkil had a use for the palestinians the way it does for
pakistan and if palestinians had nukes and roving bands of tanzeems shouting both "AOA" and "Use n-weapons", you wouldnt see the tacit support from D.C. seen today for israeli airstrikes.

that being said, its a disgrace we havent beaten up BD whose power asymetry with us is like that for isreal:palestine and doesnt have n-weapons to brandish.

maybe we are awaiting the chinese to kit them up with a few n-weapons

its a disgrace we havent built and used covert units to kill terrorists all
around the world the way Israel has long done.

Pranay
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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Pranay » 27 Dec 2008 23:31

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indi ... 901735.cms

PM Manmohan Singh asks Iran to pressure Pak
27 Dec 2008, 2226 hrs IST, PTI

NEW DELHI: As part of stepped-up diplomatic offensive to get Pakistan to act against perpetraors of Mumbai terror attacks, Prime Minister Manmohan
Singh on Saturday night spoke to Iranian President Ahmednijad and is understood to have asked him to pressure Islamabad to do more to end cross-border terrorism.

Singh conveyed to Ahmednijad that Pakistan has to take concrete action to stop cross-border terror and by being in denial mode would not help, sources said.

The Prime Minister is understood to have told the Iranian leader that India has so far exercised restraint and asked him to pressure Pakistan to take concrete action against handlers of those who carried out the Mumbai terror attacks last month, sources said




Next thing you know... India's "Esteemed Leadership" will request "regional powers" like Maldives and Bangladesh to put pressure on Pakistan to behave... So disgusting!! :(

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby SaiK » 27 Dec 2008 23:39


Akshut
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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Akshut » 27 Dec 2008 23:47

This whole 'Putting the Pressure' thing is not going to work. We are becoming a laugh for diplomats of all the countries we are calling to 'Share the Evidence'.

How many of them are very good friends of India???? Or, are we a goonda like America to put pressure on other countries to put pressure on Pakistan.
Tomorrow Bhutan's minister will be called to put pressure on porkiland. The same porkis who are dodging Americans in FATA and Waziristan.
Do South Block thinks that pakis will work if they are pressurized(IF they are actually)??

We are just projecting ourselves as low-esteem society, not willing to act. Why will Saudis act on pakis when we ourselves are not trying to bone them down????

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Chinmayanand » 27 Dec 2008 23:51

Pranay wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/PM_Manmohan_Singh_asks_Iran_to_pressure_Pak/articleshow/3901735.cms

PM Manmohan Singh asks Iran to pressure Pak
27 Dec 2008, 2226 hrs IST, PTI

NEW DELHI: As part of stepped-up diplomatic offensive to get Pakistan to act against perpetraors of Mumbai terror attacks, Prime Minister Manmohan
Singh on Saturday night spoke to Iranian President Ahmednijad and is understood to have asked him to pressure Islamabad to do more to end cross-border terrorism.

Singh conveyed to Ahmednijad that Pakistan has to take concrete action to stop cross-border terror and by being in denial mode would not help, sources said.

The Prime Minister is understood to have told the Iranian leader that India has so far exercised restraint and asked him to pressure Pakistan to take concrete action against handlers of those who carried out the Mumbai terror attacks last month, sources said




Next thing you know... India's "Esteemed Leadership" will request "regional powers" like Maldives and Bangladesh to put pressure on Pakistan to behave... So disgusting!! :(


If the world is a circus, India is the clown.Tomm he'll urge all the countries to put pressure on Bangladesh to rein in huji. :rotfl:

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby John Snow » 28 Dec 2008 00:12

{Gratuitous crap deleted}

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby BSR Murthy » 28 Dec 2008 00:25


shyamd
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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby shyamd » 28 Dec 2008 00:25

Pranay wrote:http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/PM_Manmohan_Singh_asks_Iran_to_pressure_Pak/articleshow/3901735.cms

PM Manmohan Singh asks Iran to pressure Pak
27 Dec 2008, 2226 hrs IST, PTI

Lol. You want to read what Iran did when Pak organised and interfered in Iranian Balochistan with the Amerikhans. I posted it before. Maybe MMS can learn a few things from the Iranians, when terrorist attacks are organised in their respective territory.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Akshut » 28 Dec 2008 00:38




WTF!! Man this aint goin nowhere from now!!

Forget all that response to the terror thing. My apologies to the Israelis from my govt..

Go on Israelis, and thank your god that u people ain't got leaders like ours. :(( :((

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby ssmitra » 28 Dec 2008 00:44

samuel.chandra wrote:Straight talk express : Modi. We need a Modi kind PM to correct years of pacifism.



Very clear vision on how to tackle terror.

http://www.petitiononline.com/MUMx2611/petition.html
This petition goes out every weekend to political parties & media.


Another Akhand FART with no dump. He is just another politician like the others. lots of talk.....

My humble opinion a new central agency like the one just formed but under someone like KPS gill with superseding authority over local police force in terms of training, tactics and intelligence. and MAKE the State Govts pay for it.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby A_Gupta » 28 Dec 2008 00:56

Akshut wrote:



WTF!! Man this aint goin nowhere from now!!

Forget all that response to the terror thing. My apologies to the Israelis from my govt..

Go on Israelis, and thank your god that u people ain't got leaders like ours. :(( :((


The problem for Israel is that the Palestinians remain just as screwed if they stop the attacks from their side, i.e., there is no incentive to stop. As a friend put it
Israel slaughtered a couple of hundred Palestinians in Gaza today, many of whom probably actually deserved it. This action was Israel's response to continuing rocket attacks and other provocations from the Palestinians. The aerial attacks, a form of shooting fish in a barrel, have the advantage of not putting actual soldiers at risk, or at any rate, much risk. I predict, however, that they won't be effective in stopping future attacks, nor do I think the Israelis think so - except perhaps for the air forces.

Stopping the attacks isn't really the point of course. The point is to make the Israeli public think that the government is doing something and give it the satisfaction of watching somebody else suffer.

Unfortunately, the only ways to actually do something all have their own severe problems: exterminate the Palestinians, rule them, or make peace with them. Israel isn't prepared to pay the cost of any of these - yet.
(emphasis added).

The difference of the case with Pakistan is that unlike the Palestinians, Pakistanis have enough of a country in which they could be happy and live in peace, if they so chose.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby samuel.chandra » 28 Dec 2008 01:12

You have to agree that he has tackled terror in Gujarat firmly. Also the last time I read, the development rate in Gujarat was 2 points above the national average. A central agency can only work with clear political backing. If we look at the landscape of political leaders in both parties, there are very few who can deliver and Modi definitely shows up at the top of the list. If we were to assume that terror control was the most important issue in India (lets assume that we all agree that terror can stop India's development), who do you think can handle it best (or second best). I don't see many candidates who have been able to handle terror and development so deftly (I personally believe without fixin the security issue, you cannot have development).

Please read this petition (there is no particular bias... as long as congress retaliates). And while you are at it, sign it as well :lol:
http://www.petitiononline.com/MUMx2611/petition.html


ssmitra wrote:
samuel.chandra wrote:Straight talk express : Modi. We need a Modi kind PM to correct years of pacifism.


Another Akhand FART with no dump. He is just another politician like the others. lots of talk.....

My humble opinion a new central agency like the one just formed but under someone like KPS gill with superseding authority over local police force in terms of training, tactics and intelligence. and MAKE the State Govts pay for it.
Last edited by samuel.chandra on 28 Dec 2008 01:15, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby NRao » 28 Dec 2008 01:12

No stealth hazards :: Gurmeet Kanwal :: Dec 10, 2008

India, Pakistan and covert operations. All in the family? :: Myra MacDonald :: Dec 18, 2008

Do read this piece {the first URL} by Gurmeet Kanwal, the head of the Indian Army’s Centre for Land Warfare Studies, about how India should respond to the Mumbai attacks with covert operations against Pakistan.

He says that ”hard military options will have only a transitory impact unless sustained over a long period. These will also cause inevitable collateral damage, run the risk of escalating into a larger war with attendant nuclear dangers and have adverse international ramifications. To achieve a lasting impact and ensure that the actual perpetrators of terrorism are targeted, it is necessary to employ covert capabilities to neutralise the leadership of terrorist organisations.”


We (IMHO) need a thread just for serious articles.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Vikram_S » 28 Dec 2008 02:27

Indian left and a muslim newspapers


http://www.sahilonline.org/english/news ... e&nid=4133
Terror attack planned by RSS and allies?

each of those who signed this so called letter should be thrown in jail for 20 years

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Vikram_S » 28 Dec 2008 02:28



napunsak GOI tells another country to be similarly napunsak

this GOI does not know meaning of shame and izzat

aur hamare pure desh ko apne besharmi se sharminda kar rahen hain

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby D_Chopra » 28 Dec 2008 02:53

One of the worst things india can do is indulge in war. War is not an intelligent or viable option these days for punishing a country full of mad men with their fingers on the nuclear trigger.

India has to systematically and covertly pull down the terrorist state of Pak inch by inch, day in and day out. RAW must sub-contract the work to Mossad, whatever $billions it may take. We know RAW isnt capable of handling Pak effectively and if it was, it would have done it by now.

When Pak is close to collapse, India doesnt have to do a thing, coz US will make sure the nukes are snatched from Pak whatever the cost. Common sense tells me that US knows the whole Pak nuke arsenal wherabouts and the security systems in place to protect them. Thats why it is pretty cool to the idea of Pakis having nukes inspite of them being a heartbeat away from falling into the hands of terrorists..

Without nukes then, Pakis can be surrounded, kicked and bullied by India, Afghan and the Shia Iran. The dragon can watch the show while its being contained by india, us, japan and australia.
Last edited by Gerard on 28 Dec 2008 03:08, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: username changed to conform with forum guidelines

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby AdityaM » 28 Dec 2008 02:54

The final solution:
http://www.theonion.com/content/video/v ... n_standoff

This was on BR humor thread long ago...but i think with UPA in power & kangress winning elections inspite of being itself, i think only something like on this link will save this country

Frankly, Indias ambition to be in Security council has gone up in Taj's flames.
Who in their right minds will vote a wimpish country to the security council !!
Last edited by AdityaM on 28 Dec 2008 03:04, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Pranay » 28 Dec 2008 02:58

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indi ... 902011.cms

India, Pak tone down war talk
28 Dec 2008, 0017 hrs IST, TIMES NEWS NETWORK & AGENCIES

NEW DELHI/BEHRAMPORE: After days of feverish speculation about a military build-up and a possible India-Pak conflict, tensions appeared to have
thinned considerably on Saturday, with both sides disclaiming any intent to initiate hostilities.

The Pakistani leadership, which had orchestrated a war frenzy to distract international attention from the Mumbai 26/11 attacks, suddenly lowered the ante as its shrewd gameplan to use the fear of conflict to its benefit appeared to have paid off, with Mumbai moving into the background.

India also helped cool matters by pointedly disputing reports that it had started massing troops on the border in anticipation of a conflict with Pakistan, although not without protesting that Islamabad had created a war smokescreen to escape acting against the perpetrators of 26/11 and other jihadi atrocities against India.

Addressing a gathering of Persian teachers in Berhampore, foreign minister Pranab Mukherjee said, "An unfortunate atmosphere is being created in recent times. I would like to state that the issue is not the defence of Pakistan and war. Instead, the issue is the terror strikes in Mumbai. The magnitude and ferocity of the attack indicate that the strike was a well-planned move."

The defence ministry in New Delhi took care to scotch speculation that India was in aggression mode, with its spokesperson downplaying troop movements as routine fare.

Pakistan's President Asif Ali Zardari, speaking at a rally in Sindh to mark the first anniversary of the assassination of his wife Benazir Bhutto, promised that his country would act against the `non-state actors' responsible for terrorism, but on "its own". His nominee, Prime Minister Yusuf Raza Gilani, claimed that Pakistan did not want war.

While the de-escalation should soothe the tense nerves of the international community, it was being feared that Islamabad, by raising the bogey of war, may have edged out India's concerns. By feeding fears of an imminent conflict between two nuclear-armed rivals, it had ensured that the focus would shift towards conflict prevention. Indian security experts noted that Gilani made it a point to mention that "our friends are persuading India against aggression".

While the government persisted with reminders to Islamabad about unkept promises, independent security experts sid Pakistan may have got away with almost no cost at all. "As of now, Pakistan has managed to divert attention from the Mumbai attacks to an India-Pak conflict," said K Subrahmanyam.

The veteran security analyst also dismissed the
Pakistani President's fresh promise of counter-terror cooperation. "If Zardari was so serious about what he is saying, what prevented him from carrying out investigations independently on the basis of what had been conveyed to Pakistan by India and other countries?"

Brahma Chellaney, another expert, spoke in the same vein. "Pakistan has now been let off the hook internationally. It was their strategy from the beginning to create a war-like situation. Re-deployment of forces from the Afghan border and air sorties over its cities were all designed to deflect attention from the core issue of the terrorist strike on Mumbai," he said.

It was diplomacy by fear, and Pakistan played it effectively. As it allowed passions to run high and let known terrorists join in the show of national belligerence, it was also playing victim. As part of the script, its foreign secretary, it now turns out, even summoned the Indian high commissioner in Islamabad, Satyabrata Pal, on Friday to lecture him on the need for India to bring down tensions.

There was no report of any response to the provocation by New Delhi until late on Saturday, though sources said that the Indian high commissioner had conveyed to Pakistani foreign secretary Salman Bashir during his meeting that India wanted Pakistan to address the real issue of terrorism and that war-mongering was being indulged in more by Islamabad than India. Bashir is said to have told the high commissioner that the two countries should continue with the process of dialogue.

The US and China had on Friday asked India - in a clear sign of Pakistan's success - to engage in a dialogue with Pakistan. It's becoming increasingly evident that India has so far nothing to show for all its diplomatic offensive in the aftermath of the Mumbai attacks.

That Pakistan has mastered the art of brinkmanship was evident on Saturday when PM Yousaf Raza Gilani and President Zardari, having attracted the eyes and ears of the world by their military grandstanding, made statements against war which earned them praise in the international media. While Gilani said that Pakistan would only react and not act, Zardari went a step further and said that terrorism was a cancer for Pakistan. Zardari added that Pakistan did not want war with India.

On the face of it, Pakistan seems to be doing all the right things and India has clearly failed to call Islamabad's bluff. The US message was not music for Indian ears as it didn't ask Pakistan to address any concerns specifically. "US officials are in touch with both the Indians and Pakistanis. We continue to urge both sides to cooperate in the Mumbai investigation as well as in counter-terrorism in general. We also do not want either side to take any unnecessary steps that raise tensions in an already tense situation," White House spokesman Gordon Johndroe told AFP.



I just hope that the Indian electorate throws out this spineless cabal currently "in charge" of the country in the coming national elections; for the sake of the dignity and self respect of India. :(
Last edited by Pranay on 28 Dec 2008 03:02, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Rishi » 28 Dec 2008 03:01

X-Post

http://www.zeenews.com/zee-exclusive/20 ... 7news.html


India should explore military option if diplomacy fails: Brajesh Mishra

India and Pakistan are again at loggerheads after the terror strike in Mumbai on November 26, 2008. Media on both sides of the border are predicting the chances of a war between the two neighbors. The political leaders at their level are trying to avoid a military conflict that could possibly trigger a nuclear threat.

Amidst all this tension and war mongering, Zeenews.com’s Swati Chaturvedi in ‘Kahiye Janaab’ talks to former National Security Advisor in Atal Bihari Vajpayee’s government, Brajesh Mishra about his views on the standoff.

Here are the excerpts:

Swati: Pakistan press is calling India a “friendly enemy”. In the current scenario is it right for Pakistan to create war hysteria?

Brajesh: Democracy in Pakistan is mere eyewash. Pakistan Army, read General Kayani, is calling the shots in the country. Even before the Mumbai attack, Pakistan Prime Minister had said that the ISI will work under Interior Ministry, but the order was revoked the very next day. This clearly shows that army is mightier than the political leadership. The kind of statements that Pakistan politicians were making immediately after Mumbai attacks and the statements they making today clearly shows the shift in their stand.

Swati: What should Indian government do in the current scenario?

Brajesh: The current stance of Pakistan clearly shows that they are lying as per their habit. It is difficult for India to terminate all relations with Pakistan, as it is a neighboring country. Now, if we want to take military action against them then the time has come to attack Pakistan. But if we want to tackle the issue diplomatically, then it is very difficult to persuade Pakistan to take action against the terrorists.

Swati: Do you think America is fully supporting India over this sensitive issue?

Brajesh: America is only providing lip service rather than taking any concrete steps over this issue. America is capable of pressurizing Pakistan, but it is not doing that. The Indo-US nuclear deal was not only meant for nuke cooperation, but it was also a strategic deal. In spite of that, America is shying away from taking stern measures against Pakistan. It is a well known fact that Pakistan’s economic condition is such that it cannot survive without the help of US and Europe. This way US is capable of talking to Pakistan in firm terms, but it is not doing so because of its own strategic interests.

Swati: Pakistan is probably the only nuclear power in the world that has a nuclear doctrine that says “nuclear blackmail”. How can we tackle this?

Brajesh: Immediately after the Parliament attack in 2002, when army was deployed along Pakistan border, the Pakistan foreign secretary said that in case of a war, they can use any weapon clearly indicating towards their nuclear capability. I replied that if you are capable of destroying one of our cities say Delhi or Mumbai, then in the repercussion Pakistan can be erased from the world map. After that, they never talked about using nuclear weapon. Even now, they are not talking about a nuke war, but there are all sorts of possibilities in a war. It depends on the political leadership and how much control they have over the situation. That determines the course of a war.

Swati: Do you think war is a possibility?

Brajesh: India is trying to resolve the matter diplomatically for the last one month even though our Foreign Minister has himself admitted that they are not succeeding in isolating Pakistan over this issue. To succeed diplomatically, it is necessary for India to show its military might. This does not necessarily means attacking Pakistan, but showing the world community that India is capable of doing that.

Swati: We always talk about attacking militant training centers across the border. In your opinion, should India go for surgical strikes?

Brajesh: Since India has resorted to diplomatic methods to solve this issue, it should give some more time to Pakistan to act and take action against the disturbing elements and so called “non state actors”. This will give India an option to show the world community that military strike was the last option left in the scenario, in case India finally decides to go for surgical strikes.

Swati: If you were the NSA, what would you have suggested your Prime Minister in the current situation?

Brajesh: As I told you, I would have suggested that if initially we have not taken any military action against them and approached the issue diplomatically then we should give some more time to Pakistan to act, so that if in the future we resort to military means then the world community should know that it was the only option left with India.

Swati: How do you see the change in US administration and its approach towards India amidst talks of a special envoy in Kashmir?

Brajesh: If Obama appoints an envoy in Kashmir then that would see the end of Indo- US relationship that has developed significantly in the past 10 years. Obama needs to understand the ground reality of the region that any interference in Kashmir issue, that is primarily between India and Pakistan, will drastically hit the Indo-US relations.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby AdityaM » 28 Dec 2008 03:09

LordOfWar wrote:One of the worst things india can do is indulge in war.


The "Lord of war" spake: Let their be no War ! :rotfl:
Soon, you will have nothing to lord over....... You are headed to the darwinian awards for making yourself unemployed.

LordOfWar : You will be hearing shortly from "The Admins"

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby John Snow » 28 Dec 2008 03:43

For all those who think war is not the answer, Then I say downsize the armed forces and wind up the DRDO junk we can save lot of money may be on second thought armed forces and its requirements are for kick backs and R day parade pagentry and wagha chowkidar tamasha

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby NRao » 28 Dec 2008 03:45

What ALL of them are saying (paki and Indian) should be recorded. It will come in use - to replay - in a few years. The persons may change (perhaps not), but the titles will still be relevant.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Surya » 28 Dec 2008 03:46

The palestinians have a land - its called jordan = let them go take it Jordan + West bank + gaza

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Shreeman » 28 Dec 2008 03:47



For the love of benji, what do these folks smoke? Who is listening to you? Why do you have to say anything, if you can't even zip up your pants right?
Can't you just eat your chai biscuit quitely?

Still, if this is what we grow as babus and netas, then India fully deserves whatever is coming its way. Not one idiot seems to have grasped what the events have done to India's progress. Doubt if they care either.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby RavinM » 28 Dec 2008 03:55

The response of GoI on the whole episode has been disgustingly nauseating :x
Why are they begging around for a stick?, can't they go and whallop those Porki puppets+masters, before they know what hit them? I thought Indian military was robust, I think these spineless snakes, will finish their valour forever!

Sorry rabbits, Israel is not spineless like GoI
Last edited by RavinM on 28 Dec 2008 04:19, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Vikram_S » 28 Dec 2008 04:15

not only is GOI not able to safeguard own citizens, it does not want Israelis to protect israelis.

GOI has reached new heights of being stupid and shameless

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby vsudhir » 28 Dec 2008 04:20

Pakis being Pakis can't stop themselves. I wager they will continue staging more attacks and indulge in loudmouthed lies afterwards.

Whilst GoI and the desi establishment is more determinedly nonviolent that even MKG could have been, Pakis being pakis could well provoke war on their own accord. There alone lies any hope that India will militarily respond to Baki terror.

So yes, lez hope and pray Kiani embarks on i=his share of tactical brilliance. Or the jehadi frankensteins the tspa has bred go ahead and tilt the scales with that proverbial last straw.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby kshirin » 28 Dec 2008 04:29

http://www.timesnow.tv/Newsdtls.aspx?NewsID=24623
India to weed out terror from Pak if efforts fail: PC 12/27/2008 6:24:48 PM

Home Minister P Chidambaram on Saturday (December 27) said that India is prepared to face "attacks" emanating from Pakistani soil squarely but expressed the hope that efforts of other countries to make Islamabad tread the "right path" succeed. "The Mumbai terror attacks have awakened the world and international community is using its good offices to prevail on Pakistan to tread the right path. We hope these efforts succeed.

"If not, India is prepared to face the attacks from Pakistan squarely with the help of the people," he said addressing the students and faculty of Pondicherry University. The minister said everyone knew from where the terror attacks emanated and the cross border terrorism from Pakistan had been targeting India continuously for some years now. It cannot be denied that there were also supporters within India for such activities, he said.

"As far as India is concerned we are looking at Pakistan as friendly nation as there is no need for any enmity particularly when both the countries have third generation of people after their independence," he said. Chidambaram said the government was fully determined to to stamp out terrorism from the country with a firm hand. "The duty of the government to ensure security of the people can be discharged only with willing cooperation of the people. We have already declared our determination and will to put an end to terrorism as enough is enough", he said. Reminding that "eternal vigilance is the price of liberty", the minister said there was every need for the government and people to work together in the task of protecting the people, their lives and properties and also defending the country.

(Agencies)



http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/27/washington/27riedel.html?_r=1
Behind Analyst’s Cool Demeanor, Deep Anxiety Over American Policy MARK MAZZETTI
Published: December 26, 2008
WASHINGTON

BRUCE RIEDEL was a 28-year-old Middle East analyst at the Central Intelligence Agency on Oct. 6, 1981, the day a band of gunmen assassinated President Anwar el-Sadat of Egypt during a military parade in Cairo. Within hours of the attack, Mr. Riedel was summoned to the agency’s seventh floor to brief William J. Casey, the irascible C.I.A. director. Over the next several months, he began compiling a dossier about the attack — what he calls the “birth of the global jihad” — and about the emergence of a cerebral Egyptian physician named Ayman al-Zawahri.

He retired from the C.I.A. in 2006 after 29 years, and no longer has access to the nation’s most sensitive information. But his career as an analyst is far from over. As an influential terrorism adviser on President-elect Barack Obama’s transition team, he dispenses counsel to the administration-in-waiting on some of the thorniest problems it will face: as varied as the hunt for Al Qaeda’s senior leaders like Mr. Zawahri, the likelihood of another attack on American soil, and how to stave off nuclear Armageddon between India and Pakistan.

Mr. Riedel is one of a chorus of terrorism experts who see the terrorist network’s base in the mountains of Pakistan as America’s greatest threat, and perhaps the biggest problem facing Mr. Obama’s new team.

He speaks angrily about what he calls a savvy campaign by Pakistan’s government under President Pervez Musharraf to fleece Washington for billions of dollars even as it allowed Al Qaeda to regroup in Pakistan’s tribal lands. “We had a partner that was double-dealing us,” he said during an interview in his house in a Washington suburb. “Anyone can be snookered and double-dealt. But after six years you have to start to figure it out.”

At times speaking with the cool dispassion of a career intelligence analyst, Mr. Riedel has a professorial air as he sits in his living room surrounded by books about South Asia and the Middle East, and memoirs by past C.I.A. directors. His wife, whom he met at the C.I.A., continues to work at the agency as a Middle East analyst. His new book, “The Search for Al Qaeda,” jabs at the Bush administration for diverting troops and resources from Afghanistan to Iraq, and for a byzantine intelligence apparatus that “lacks a sheriff to lead the posse” in the hunt for Qaeda operatives. He believes that the terrorist network is hoping the United States keeps troops in Afghanistan and Iraq for the long haul. “In its view, the ‘bleeding wars’ offer the best opportunity to defeat the United States,” he writes. “It is much easier to kill the enemy in Mesopotamia and Afghanistan’s traps.”

And yet Al Qaeda is not invulnerable: “It lacks a cohesive vision of the future and a workable plan for government. It has often overplayed its hand and created strong blowback.”

MR. RIEDEL struggles at times to lay out a path for the president-elect on Pakistan — the foreign policy headache he calls “the hardest part of this whole thing” — that is vastly different from the course the Bush administration has charted in recent months.

For example, he believes that the C.I.A.’s campaign of airstrikes using remotely controlled Predator aircraft should continue if there is solid evidence about the whereabouts of militant leaders inside Pakistan.

Washington must approach Pakistan with a “subtle and deft touch,” he said, and strengthen the civilian government of President Asif Ali Zardari, the husband of Benazir Bhutto, the slain former prime minister, to act as a counterweight to Pakistan’s military and intelligence apparatus, which still dominates Pakistan’s political life.

Winning over the generals, Mr. Riedel said, could require a tough-love approach: overhauling military aid to Pakistan and cutting sales of the big-ticket weapons the country has used to keep pace with its archrival, India. Instead, he argues, the United States should be providing equipment like helicopters and night-vision goggles to help Pakistan’s military navigate the mountain passes where militants have established their base.

It was Washington’s too cozy relationship with Mr. Musharraf’s military government, he argues, that fueled the intense hatred for the United States in Pakistan. He cites polls that more Pakistanis blame the United States than either India or Al Qaeda for the recent surge of violence in the country.

“Anytime in Pakistan where more people blame you than India for the country’s problems, you are in deep, deep trouble,” he said

Born in Queens, Mr. Riedel was just a year old when his father, a political adviser at the United Nations, moved his family to Jerusalem and later to Beirut, Lebanon. As fighting spread throughout Beirut during the Lebanese civil war in 1958, he was forced to flee with his mother and brother and relocate for two months to Naples, Italy.
After the travels of his youth, he decided to study Middle East history as an undergraduate at Brown University, and earned a master’s at Harvard in medieval Islamic history.

As a career analyst, he spent most of his C.I.A. years on the agency’s sprawling campus in Langley, Va., but he occasionally got a taste of a clandestine officer’s life during trips abroad. On a trip to Beirut in 1983, 25 years after he had evacuated the city as a boy with his family, he found that many things there had not changed. Jumping off a helicopter at the American Embassy, an official asked him if he wanted a handgun or a shotgun. “I wanted the next flight out, that’s what I wanted,” he recalls with a laugh. He remained in the C.I.A.’s service his entire career but did a tour of duty at the Pentagon and worked as a senior adviser at the National Security Council under Presidents Clinton and George W. Bush. On Sept. 11, 2001, Mr. Riedel was sitting next to Condoleezza Rice, then the president’s national security adviser, at a staff meeting when she learned that planes had hit the World Trade Center.

DESPITE his ties to President-elect Obama — he has advised the campaign since 2007 — he says he has no desire to return to the grind of government service. He is currently researching a book on Israel’s nuclear doctrine. Some of his former C.I.A. colleagues describe him as unflappable and usually eager to champion a dissenting analytical view. This did not always make him a popular person at the spy agency — a place often criticized for “groupthink.”

“There are a lot of people at C.I.A. who were more wedded to traditional ways of thinking who butted heads with Bruce, and he certainly has his share of people there who don’t care much for him,” said Kenneth Pollack, who worked with Mr. Riedel both at the N.S.C. and the C.I.A. and is now his colleague at the Saban Center for Middle East Policy at the Brookings Institution. For instance, in the 1970s as the United States continued to back the shah of Iran, Mr. Riedel was among a small group of analysts to predict the fall of the shah’s government and the rise of Ayatollah Khomeini.

Today, however, he is in lockstep with his former C.I.A. colleagues on at least one matter: the necessity for Pakistan’s pre-eminent spy agency, the Inter-Services Intelligence, to sever its longstanding ties to militants operating in Pakistan’s tribal areas. These are ties the Bush administration never found a way to break, as the ISI has used the militants as a proxy force there for decades.

And they will not be broken, Mr. Riedel said, until Pakistan’s generals and spy agencies acknowledge what Pakistan’s president learned only through heartbreak — that the struggle against Al Qaeda and its ilk is “their war” as much as it is America’s.
“Zardari knows it’s his war, because he buried his wife,” he said. “That tragedy is also an opportunity.”

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby JwalaMukhi » 28 Dec 2008 04:29

Whose interests is GOI cheerleading? Does not look like India's.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby lakshmikanth » 28 Dec 2008 04:32



For the first time in my life, I feel ashamed to call myself Indian :((. I never ever thought GoI would stoop down to the level of dirt and impotency that it has by uttering nonsense like the above.

As I have mentioned earlier, we are not a power because we are not prepared to use our force under any circumstance. This behavior cannot of a power lead through a soft path by strong leaders, but rather by a power whose leaders do not have strategy or the brains to lead.

I used to be proud to see brahmos, Chandrayaan-I et al... not anymore coz i am sure we will never have the vision which will put us in a situation where we can see it being used, hence it makes no difference whether we have it or not. We need to be proud of Brahmos/Smiling Budha as a technological achievement. However, to be really proud, we need to have the leaders who will order it to be used when needed.

Indian politicians play on votebank. One BIG thing about the votebank is that people usually do not like unpopular ideas like War or more taxation and hence popular politics is the only thing that works, and this makes sure that only weak appeasers get elected on the basis of popular pranks as agenda. This weakness is reflected in International relations and we can see the disastrous results like giving bhashan to Israel and crying "mommy" to China. Its the weakness to act despite the fact that we CAN.

Democracy has failed India I guess. Democrary works when people are educated, have access to all knowledge that helps them decide and everyone votes. In India caste trumps over everything. We are not educated. The US has another problem, it has educated people to vote however they make sure people have limited access to information to vote. US is another dimension of democratic failure, however its not as plagued as India.

At the risk of attracting scorn from the moderators, I think we as a nation have a bleak future. More terrorists attacks would either bring us all together or rip us all apart, and unfortunately even with Mumbai I am not able to see strong signs of us coming together (except maybe the minor groups of well informed Indians, educated or otherwise). I hope I am wrong and if I am then please correct me. Based on what I have seen the mao-ists, nagas, mayawatis, raj "get-out-of-mumbai' thackrey et al would make sure that we, as a nation, disintegrate sometime in the future.

With stuff like this:- Manya MPs are slacking on the jobs ! all I can say is: God save India!
Last edited by lakshmikanth on 28 Dec 2008 04:40, edited 2 times in total.


D_Chopra
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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby D_Chopra » 28 Dec 2008 05:07

BSR Murthy wrote:Stop using force in Gaza strip, India tells Israel[/url]
:evil: :roll:


It shows the GOI, which is a descendant and inheritor of the politically correct but practically useless nehruvian foreign policy, is still willing to risk the relationship of its 2nd most important military hardware supplier. What a jooke this is. Does any of the arab league nation at whom this statement is actually targeted at, really care ? Don't they how many billions worth of defense equipment india buys from israel every year? Is India afraid its oil shipments will be threatened in some manner if it doesnt atleast act as if it is still sympathetic to the palestinian cause..This statement sums up the status of current foreign policy : fool hardy.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Rishirishi » 28 Dec 2008 05:23

D_Chopra wrote:
BSR Murthy wrote:Stop using force in Gaza strip, India tells Israel[/url]
:evil: :roll:


It shows the GOI, which is a descendant and inheritor of the politically correct but practically useless nehruvian foreign policy, is still willing to risk the relationship of its 2nd most important military hardware supplier. What a jooke this is. Does any of the arab league nation at whom this statement is actually targeted at, really care ? Don't they how many billions worth of defense equipment india buys from israel every year? Is India afraid its oil shipments will be threatened in some manner if it doesnt atleast act as if it is still sympathetic to the palestinian cause..This statement sums up the status of current foreign policy : fool hardy.


To give an idea of how strong the force of votebank is. Let us say that a particular community has 15% of the voters and the majority has 85%. The minority community is very politically active and manages to get 14% of their electorate to vote. Where as the majority community is divided and only 50% of them come out to vote.

If you can manage to get the 14% from the minority community on board, you only require 12% from the Majority community to win. If there are several small majority parties, then you may only need 4-5% of the majority vote to win.


So you see, who is in control today.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby khan » 28 Dec 2008 05:31

Akshut wrote:We are just projecting ourselves as low-esteem society, not willing to act. Why will Saudis act on pakis when we ourselves are not trying to bone them down????

This is probably wishful thinking, but maybe we are laying the groundwork for attacking Pakistan in some way.

This way, after a strike we can genuinely claim that it was a last resort... Such a stand might even buy us a few days in the UN while the armed forces rip them a new one.

sigh... wishful thinking.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Victor » 28 Dec 2008 05:35

There are a couple of things that we can do immediately without crossing any (imaginary) red lines as they are purely internal matters but will nevertheless blow a fuse in pakistan's nuts and cause it to jump up and down in anguish. If they respond with force, we will get our stamped certificate to retaliate and defend ourselves in triplicate. If they don't, their h&d will take a massive beating and accelerate their implosion as the beards and army blame each other.

If Cashmere is the self-imposed jugular vein of pakistan, let us cut it off for ever by simply removing Article 370. There are people who will argue that it is "illegal" to abrogate A370 but this is nonsense. The article is kept in place merely for political compulsions even though it has caused immense harm to the country but what else is new.
The President can use Article 368 to remove the defunct provision of taking the Constituent Assembly’s consent. After this deletion is carried out, the President can then abrogate the Article forthwith.

In addition we should immediately create Panun Kashmir out of the valley to return the Pandits back to their ancestral homeland and to guarantee their physical and cultural safety. Not to do so would be tantamount to officially condoning ethnic cleansing within India.

These steps will yield the added advantage of forcing the worms out of the woodwork so they can be marked and dealt with accordingly.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Karna_A » 28 Dec 2008 05:55

Jews were much more cowardly and nerdy than Indians before WWII. SS made them dig their own graveyards. However circumstances made Jews what they are today i.e. to act like Wounded Tigers all the time.
Indians still and always had martial people like Sikhs, Rajputs, Jats etc.
26/11 was nothing as compared to what Jews and Russians faced in WW2.
By 1945 two out of every three European Jews had been killed.
15% of Russian population died in WW2 still it became superpower immediately afterwards.
The thing to remember is even if worst come worst 15% Indian population(20-25 crore) is killed, India still will survive and in fact will quickly become world super power as there would be a tremoundous surge in Patriotism. Only then all the nalayak Politicians/Commies/Dhimmies will be Guillotined at Villlage Chowks. India still lives in it's 6 lakh villages and the Engineer in Bangalore is usually from an unnamed village which will survive.
So there is no need to fear anything. The only thing to fear is fear itself.

Once fear is gone, then Nuke war from Pakistan is just a bogey and here is how to unbogey it with a unsaid but clearly understood policy:(Just like Israeli Samson option)
(a) Every nuke on India means 5 on Pak and 10 on KSA. Not even the dimwittest Jihadi would want KSA into a radioactive wasteland for 10000 years.

Then action starting 26/11 could have been as follows:
(a) Afzal Guru tried to run away from Jail and encountered, presumed dead. (26/11). Article 370 temporarily suspended and 100K armed Indians to be settled in Valley in time for Summer.
(b) A further 200+ Foreign/Indian terrorists/extremists eating free food at Indian jails tried to run away and encountered. Indian intelligence thinks this may go on upto a week or more where every day 200 try to run. (27/11)
(c) Non State actors stopped 40% of Indus water. Once identified they will be house arrested. (28/11)
(d) Non State actors blew a oil tanker at Karachi port. Once identified they will be house arrested at the renovated Taj palace. (29/11)
With every future terror, (a) to (d) repeated and suitably modified and enhanced.
Of course it needs a different type of Sardarji aka KPS Gill and not MMS for all this, but then again it would take lot more than 26/11 to harden Indians like Jews and elect someone like Gill who is Indian Ariel Sharon. But surely a day will come in next 10-15 years when Modi/Gill/Doval are the ones making policy and MMS and SG are there to just present a non violent happy face.



Victor wrote:There are a couple of things that we can do immediately without crossing any (imaginary) red lines as they are purely internal matters but will nevertheless blow a fuse in pakistan's nuts and cause it to jump up and down in anguish. If they respond with force, we will get our stamped certificate to retaliate and defend ourselves in triplicate. If they don't, their h&d will take a massive beating and accelerate their implosion as the beards and army blame each other.

If Cashmere is the self-imposed jugular vein of pakistan, let us cut it off for ever by simply removing Article 370. There are people who will argue that it is "illegal" to abrogate A370 but this is nonsense. The article is kept in place merely for political compulsions even though it has caused immense harm to the country but what else is new.
The President can use Article 368 to remove the defunct provision of taking the Constituent Assembly’s consent. After this deletion is carried out, the President can then abrogate the Article forthwith.

In addition we should immediately create Panun Kashmir out of the valley to return the Pandits back to their ancestral homeland and to guarantee their physical and cultural safety. Not to do so would be tantamount to officially condoning ethnic cleansing within India.

These steps will yield the added advantage of forcing the worms out of the woodwork so they can be marked and dealt with accordingly.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby enqyoob » 28 Dec 2008 06:06

Wrong title for news story. It should be:

Stop using force in Gaza strip, India MUMBLES TO Israel
"Tell" is a very force-ful word. It may upset people and we can't have that.

I was going to post a rationalization of GOI's present course of (in)action, but I am simply not up 2 it, sorry.

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby RajaJi » 28 Dec 2008 06:11

Vikram_S wrote:


napunsak GOI tells another country to be similarly napunsak

this GOI does not know meaning of shame and izzat

aur hamare pure desh ko apne besharmi se sharminda kar rahen hain


Vikram, please don't use such language for our beloved leaders. They are only following in the footsteps of the fathers of our nation Mahatama Gandhi, and Nehru Chacha. I think instead of a military strike, if, Mahatama Gandhi ji was alive today he would want us to first dismantle our military machinery, renounce our deadly nuclear weapons, maybe donate them to our good neighbour Bangladesh. And they would of wanted every good citizen of "Mera Bharat Mahan" to hold a lighted candle, and walk to the borders of Pakistan chanting "Raghupati Raaghava Raaja Raam, Patita paavana Siita Raam, Siita Raam, Siita Raam, Bhaj pyaare tu Siita Raam, Ishwara Allah Teero Naam, Sab ko Sanmati de Bhagavaan". I'm sure seeing such love and compassion, all of the citizens of Pakistan will come running towards us Indians so we may embrace each other, the terrorists eyes will open up and they will realize that violence is not the answer but it's love that's the answer. This is the right way, this is the path of the wise only fools fight.

I used to be like you too, wanting an eye for an eye, I also wanted Pakistan to bleed and pay for the sins of these cowardice jihadis, but the love and compassion of our beloved PM Shri Manmohan Singh Ji, has changed my mind and I feel much at peace with myself now. These jihadis are not bad people they just need direction in life, they need our love and compassion. Just once try thinking the Gandhian way and you will find yourself in such peaceful splendour. Amen!

Raghupati Raaghava Raaja Raam, Patita paavana Siita Raam.....................

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Gerard » 28 Dec 2008 06:33

I think instead of a military strike, if, Mahatama Gandhi ji was alive today he would want us to first dismantle our military machinery, renounce our deadly nuclear weapons, maybe donate them to our good neighbour Bangladesh


http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/peac ... index.html

"Mr. Gandhi told his prayer meeting to-night that, though he had always opposed all warfare, if there was no other way of securing justice from Pakistan and if Pakistan persistently refused to see its proved error and continued to minimise it, the Indian Union Government would have to go to war against it. No one wanted war, but he could never advise anyone to put up with injustice. If all Hindus were annihilated for a just cause he would not mind. If there was war, the Hindus in Pakistan could not be fifth columnists. If their loyalty lay not with Pakistan they should leave it. Similarly Muslims whose loyalty was with Pakistan should not stay in the Indian Union."

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Re: Indian Response to Terrorism

Postby Karna_A » 28 Dec 2008 06:40

Vikram_S wrote:


napunsak GOI tells another country to be similarly napunsak

this GOI does not know meaning of shame and izzat

aur hamare pure desh ko apne besharmi se sharminda kar rahen hain


The problem in India is such:
(a) The smartest people(arguably) go to IFS/IAS. But once there they mostly become arrogant do-nothings as they have a King Size, lifetime VIP life. Some District Collector bunglows are bigger area wise than White House.
(b) They mostly are graduates of JNU/St. Stephens/St. Xaviers and some IITs which are extreme liberal forts.
(c) They hold all the power and most importantly access to PM and cabinet. E.g. In South Block the office next to PM is Foreign Office.
(d) In any mixed meeting they hold sway over lowly(in their thinking) IPS and even more lowly Army types.
(e) The culture of belittling Military and Police types is an art among the IFS/IAS types. Krishna menon is famous for telling an Admiral that Military people can't think.
http://www.rediff.com/news/2004/may/27spec1.htm
(f) Did you see any IFS/IAS resigning after Mumbai? It's always the IPS or Military who gets the blame. Who approves Budget?(Finance Secretary?) Who buys equipment Defence or Home Secretary. IAS has all the power without any responsibility. Same with IFS types.

Ideally all Indian embassies should be closed or severely curtailed for a year and the money should be used to provide BPJ and Assault weapons to Police.

So this "Stop using force in Gaza strip, India tells Israel" can just be thought of action of over paid and over stupid IFS officers who have spent entire life in foreign embassies and have no clue of ground realities. Obviously village Sarpanches acting as politicians don't know any better.


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