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Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

p_saggu
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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby p_saggu » 07 Jan 2009 00:25

^^^ What rumours?

From the dossier it seems there are atleast 6 more similarly trained terrorists loose in Kashmir. So India pretty well knows that these guys plan to strike soon - like close to 26th Jan.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby milindc » 07 Jan 2009 00:50

Rangudu wrote:Which channel was GP on? Any video clips available?

TimesNow is channel. Sorry no clips.
I'm watching the re-telecast and yes, it does appear that Parthasarathy seems to smile a lot.
Last edited by milindc on 07 Jan 2009 00:54, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby bhavin » 07 Jan 2009 00:52

p_saggu wrote:^^^ What rumours?

From the dossier it seems there are atleast 6 more similarly trained terrorists loose in Kashmir. So India pretty well knows that these guys plan to strike soon - like close to 26th Jan.


Seems like there are preparations going on at atleast one of the big airbases in Western part of India ! The Rumors are coming from there..

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby kasthuri » 07 Jan 2009 00:58

Bhavin:

Are the rumors coming from TimesNow as well or some other media ? If so can you provide the link.

Thanks.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby BijuShet » 07 Jan 2009 00:59

bhavin wrote:
p_saggu wrote:^^^ What rumours?

From the dossier it seems there are atleast 6 more similarly trained terrorists loose in Kashmir. So India pretty well knows that these guys plan to strike soon - like close to 26th Jan.


Seems like there are preparations going on at atleast one of the big airbases in Western part of India ! The Rumors are coming from there..

Engaging in hath-kurchi bakwas and wishful thinking of what GoI must do is one thing, to actively disseminate rumours of purported GoI actions is close to treason Bhavinji. Please wait for rumours to materialize and be reported in the proper media. If these rumours are true then you are acting against the interests of the nation by revealing our hand prematurely. Please thoda sabar karo before posting more details.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby milindc » 07 Jan 2009 01:01

bhavin wrote:
p_saggu wrote:^^^ What rumours?

From the dossier it seems there are atleast 6 more similarly trained terrorists loose in Kashmir. So India pretty well knows that these guys plan to strike soon - like close to 26th Jan.


Seems like there are preparations going on at atleast one of the big airbases in Western part of India ! The Rumors are coming from there..


Those rumours started from Nov 27th itself :rotfl:
Bottom line, MMS doesn't have balls

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby bhavin » 07 Jan 2009 01:03

BijuShet wrote:
bhavin wrote:
p_saggu wrote:^^^ What rumours?

From the dossier it seems there are atleast 6 more similarly trained terrorists loose in Kashmir. So India pretty well knows that these guys plan to strike soon - like close to 26th Jan.


Seems like there are preparations going on at atleast one of the big airbases in Western part of India ! The Rumors are coming from there..

Engaging in hath-kurchi bakwas and wishful thinking of what GoI must do is one thing, to actively disseminate rumours of purported GoI actions is close to treason Bhavinji. Please wait for rumours to materialize and be reported in the proper media. If these rumours are true then you are acting against the interests of the nation by revealing our hand prematurely. Please thoda sabar karo before posting more details.


Thanks for the advice bijushetji - As I said it is just a rumor (going around town) ... Anyways, I am not going to post any more details... I am sure Mods can delete the post if found inappropriate...

Kasthuri - The info is not from media

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby amdavadi » 07 Jan 2009 01:13

It will be more likely jamnager base

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby p_saggu » 07 Jan 2009 01:28

Hamas, LeT use violence for political objectives: White House
Tuesday, 06 January , 2009, 20:42

Washington: Equating the Palestinian militant group Hamas with the LeT terrorists who attacked Mumbai, the White House has said both were engaged in "despicable" acts in order to achieve their "political objectives."

In a media briefing dominated by Israel's incursion into the Gaza Strip following the Hamas rocket attacks on the Jewish state, the White House spokesperson Dana Perino was asked if there were differences "between Hamas terrorists and the terrorists, who are attacking out from Pakistan against India".

"Obviously, they're two different groups," Perino said. "But I think at their base level they are despicable, evil human beings who use violence and murder in order to achieve political objectives," Perino said.

"So, in that regard, they are the same," she said in her reply yesterday.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby vsudhir » 07 Jan 2009 01:29

Folks, it is irresponsible to fear-monger, war-monger and generally-monger like this. One would think our PM saab is shri mong-mong-sing otherwise.

The peace and neighborly quiet that tsp deserves should not be disturbed by fevered rumors of impending strikes that are as likely to happen as water on the sun.
Last edited by vsudhir on 07 Jan 2009 01:30, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby p_saggu » 07 Jan 2009 01:30

India blames Pak, Islamabad threatens UN action

New Delhi/Islamabad: India on Tuesday pointed a finger for the first time at the Pakistan government, saying the Mumbai attack had the support of Pakistani “official agencies”, even as Islamabad persisted in denial and accused New Delhi of pushing the region to the brink of war.

A defiant Islamabad, however, rejected the dossier handed over by New Delhi on Monday that sought to link Pakistan-based elements to the November 26 Mumbai terror strike saying that the details provided can't be treated as evidence and even threatened to go to the UN over alleged war-mongering by New Delhi in the wake of the attacks.

... ... ...

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby p_saggu » 07 Jan 2009 01:32

Perhaps Zaid Pagla Hamid is really on to something. He talked of a 3 months deadline when an attack against Pakhistan would materialize. He is also crapping in his pants about the carrier battle group in the arabian sea, and the alleged presence of Israeli Eff Solahs in Yindoo-land. :rotfl:.

Who knows his theories about the attack on pakistan might yet prove true.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby putnanja » 07 Jan 2009 02:28

‘Lashkar taught us the weaknesses of the Indian armed forces’

‘Lashkar taught us the weaknesses of the Indian armed forces’

Haidar Naqvi, Hindustan Times

Captured militant Mohammad Amir Kasab has disclosed that the training programme of the 26/11 terrorists at Lashkar-e-Tayyeba (LeT) camps included sessions to make them familiar with the structure and operational capabilities of Indian security and intelligence agencies. The instructors told Kasab and nine others about the strengths and weaknesses of Indian forces. The men also learnt military tactics.

In his eight-page confession — a copy of which is available with HT — Kasab said the assault team was given lectures twice a day and shown videos of Indian troops engaged in operation.

The security experts who interviewed Kasab said it was a military training — a capability LeT could not have unless a specialised agency was involved. “Only the Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) has the ability and means to design such a programme, which dealt with all the aspects of an operation,” said a home ministry expert not willing to be identified. “The militants’ familiarisation with Indian forces, their style and tactics, and preparing them accordingly was not possible without the ISI.”


Kasab, who was recruited in Rawalpindi, said he first completed the Daura Sufa, a 21-day training, at Markaz-e-Tayyaba in Murdike. He was later selected for another three-week training, Daura Ama, at Manshera in Buttal village. There he was trained in handling Uzi guns, AK series rifles and Green-Os. Later they were moved to Chelabandi, where he learnt to handle rocket launchers, mortars, hand grenades from trainer Abu Mawiya.

After the training ended in September, one Zakirur Rehman selected 10 men for the strike scheduled on September 27. The men were divided into five teams. Kasab and Ismail Khan were Team One with the code name VTS — Victoria Terminus Station. With the help of Google Earth they were told to learn about the stretch they had been assigned. The men were to be sent on September 24 but Zakirur Rehman cancelled the operation at the last moment. “Chacha told a team member that the operation’s cover had been blown,” Kasab told an interrogator. “Later we were all told to be patient and that our time would come.”

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby putnanja » 07 Jan 2009 02:32

Not sure if this was posted before.

Pak in denial mode despite incriminating evidence

NEW DELHI: Within 24 hours of receiving a dossier on the Mumbai attacks, Pakistan has predictably trashed the document. Pakistan foreign secretary Salman Bashir called it “insufficient” and not enough to take action on.

However, he may find few takers for his defiant denial outside Pakistan. While Pakistan may claim that India planted GPS devices and made up stories about Pakistani involvement in 26/11, there is no way India could have forged the conversations between the terrorists and their handlers in Pakistan. That remains India’s most crucial record of the complicity of Pakistani “elements”.

The conversations are chilling and show that the attackers were intent on causing maximum damage, did not want to take any hostages and were brutal in the extreme.

Here’s a sample of a chat between the Pakistani handlers and the terrorists at Taj Hotel:

Caller (from Pakistan): “There are three ministers and a secretary of cabinet in your hotel, we don’t know which room. Keep looking.”
Receiver (terrorist in Mumbai): “That’s icing on the cake.”
Caller: “Find these three or four persons then get whatever you want from India.”

Later, the caller is also heard telling the terrorist that the “wazir” (minister) should not get away. The minister, if there was one in the hotel, did.

At one point, the caller rang again. “Throw one or two grenades on the Navy and police teams. They are outside.”

But the terrorist at the Taj was confused. “I’m sorry,” he says. “I can’t make out where they are.”

The Pakistani handlers obviously couldn’t get enough of the action in Mumbai and were glued to TV, whose blow-by-blow coverage actually helped the terrorists.

‘Under fire, don’t saddle yourself with hostages, kill them’

During a conversation at the Oberoi, the handler told the terrorist, “Keep your cell phone on. We want to hear the gunfire.” Then again, “Everything being recorded by media. Inflict maximum damage. Keep fighting. Don’t be taken alive,” instructed the handler.

During another conversation, he says, “Brother Abdul, the media is comparing your action to 9/11. One of the senior police commissioners has been killed.” Abdul Rehman clearly had other problems in his mind. “We’re on the 10th-11th floor. We’ve five hostages.”

The caller was clear. “Kill all hostages, except Muslims.”

The terrorists had to take permission. “We’ve three foreigners, including two women from Singapore and China.” The answer was brutal. “Kill them.”

Even the terrorists had their troubles, particularly from a certain man from Bangalore who put up a huge fight. “He could be controlled with a big effort.” In all the killing, the handlers tried to make sure no Muslims were killed, but even as the terrorists tried their best, they inflicted huge damage on Indian Muslims killing many at CST and Cama Hospital.

But even the Pakistani handlers were taking orders from a certain “major-general” who is not identified and could be a senior LeT leader. During a conversation in Nariman House, the terrorists asked their handlers for instructions from the “major-general”.

“The major general directed us to do what we like. We shouldn’t worry.” Two factors unexpectedly helped India during the attacks. One was a serendipitous discovery by Indian officials and second was a costly mistake by the terrorists themselves.

Indian officials had been monitoring certain SIM cards that they believed had fallen into terrorist hands in
what they thought was an unrelated case. But during the attacks, some of these came alive, which helped them trace the conversations on a real-time basis.

The terrorists’ mistake will cost Pakistan dear. During one conversation, the handlers checked with the “boys” whether they had set fire to the boat or not. The young man replied he had not.

The boss asked, “What did you do to the dead body?” (this would have been the boat owner Solanki.)

The terrorist replied they had left it behind. They had to leave the boat in a big hurry and “we made a mistake.”

“What mistake?” said his handler, ominously. It turned out that neither did they open the bottom locks of the boat which would have sunk it in the sea, nor did they toss the dead body or set the boat on fire.

“When we were getting into the boat the waves were quite high. Another boat came. Everybody raised an alarm that the Navy had come. Everybody jumped quickly. In this confusion, the satellite phone of Ismail got left behind.”

That has turned out to be crucial evidence.

The SIM cards were also important to the investigation. The calls were routed through several SIM cards, one a virtual number in the US, from a company called Cellphone X, owned by one Kharak Singh. The others were from Austria.

It appeared many things were on the planners’ minds. Certainly the India-Israel relationship was high on their calculations. At one stage, the handlers said, “Keep in mind the hostages are of use only if you don’t come under fire. If you are under attack don’t saddle yourself with the hostages. Immediately kill them.”

The handler also reminded the terrorists that “the Army claims to have done their work without any hostage being harmed”.

Another thing: “Israel has made a request to save the hostages. If the hostages are killed it will spoil relations between India and Israel.”


The media whores played into the hands of the terrorists. And one wonders what our senior officials were thinking?? Why didn't they shut off the media from live coverage ??

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby NRao » 07 Jan 2009 02:46

Such media releases are far better. When people get to know such details there is a better chance that politicians will react positively to any situation.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby ramana » 07 Jan 2009 02:49

There was no overall incharge of the cirsis. Every chota babu thought he was big shot. Its a command failure at MMS steps. From the post incident leaks the GOI knew something was going to happen. The least they should have done is to ensure there is single point of contact. The slime ball MKN went underground and was totally la patta. By inaction they were culpable.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby kasthuri » 07 Jan 2009 04:37

Hindu has the scanned copy of the dossier.

Link to the dossier given to TSP

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby putnanja » 07 Jan 2009 04:49

KP Nayar writes that the previous mumbai blasts in 1993 was known to Nawaz Sharief who ok'd the plan.

In terms of alliances, the US needs Pakistan more than India - K.P. Nayar

BETWEEN THE LINES
- In terms of alliances, the US needs Pakistan more than India
Diplomacy - K.P. Nayar

There are many ways of preparing a balance sheet. A clever auditor will tell you, if you are a good client, how he can disguise a dismal accounting reality as an attractive investment prospect. The collapsed energy conglomerate, Enron, and its now deceased auditors, Arthur Andersen, are recent examples. What is true of accounting is equally true of diplomacy and statecraft.

As the Bush administration goes into the sunset, it is logical to seek a scrutiny of the balance sheet of Indo-US relations, especially in the outgoing president’s second term, when the world sat up and took note of a bilateral relationship that became important enough for the United Progressive Alliance government to stake its very existence on last year. Such a scrutiny has, indeed, become imperative because events since the November 26 terrorist attacks in Mumbai have exposed the myth of a strategic or natural alliance between India and the United States of America much like the Enron scam.

For this columnist, who has just returned from India to the ground realities of American strategic thinking, it is sad to see a government on Raisina Hill offering to go to Washington and to other world capitals, hat in hand, with “evidence” of terrorist designs on India from across the border with Pakistan.

If P.V. Narasimha Rao had been alive today, he would have told Manmohan Singh and Pranab Mukherjee that India’s fight against terror cannot be won by appealing to the goodwill of rulers in other countries — as the Union home minister, P. Chidambaram, will do in Washington later this week — but only by putting in place a bold agenda for dealing with the cross-border threat and implementing it with cold and steely calculation.


Rao would have been speaking from experience. In 1993, shortly after the serial bombing of Mumbai, his government managed to obtain irrefutable physical evidence of a Pakistani plot to blow up Mumbai. It can now be told that the Research and Analysis Wing, India’s external spy agency, obtained the evidence after Pakistan’s then president, Ghulam Ishaq Khan, presented that proof in Pakistan’s supreme court during Khan’s epic battle against the prime minister, Nawaz Sharif, whom the president dismissed in April 1993, a month after the Mumbai bombings.

Sharif challenged his dismissal under Pakistan’s controversial eighth constitutional amendment. Khan knew that his future as president was doomed if Sharif won the case in the supreme court. He urged the court to hold part of its proceedings in camera and then presented evidence at the secret session that Sharif, as prime minister, not only knew about the Inter Services Intelligence plot to bomb Mumbai using Dawood Ibrahim’s underworld network, but had also given his go-ahead to it.

Lawyers for the State argued at this in camera sitting of the court that Sharif was unfit to be prime minister because he nearly took Pakistan to war with India by allowing the risky serial bombing of India’s premier metropolis. The supreme court quashed Sharif’s dismissal, reinstated him in office and cancelled Khan’s orders for fresh elections. Eventually, of course, both the squabbling politicians were persuaded by the army to resign and fresh elections brought in Benazir Bhutto as prime minister.

Barring India, few countries then realized that Pakistan was already on its way to being the epicentre of global terrorism. Other States were yet to experience the consequences of a process of nurturing terror that General Zia-ul-Haq had started. Besides, terrorism in Pakistan was still State-controlled; it was aimed at bleeding India, and the ISI was then in total control of such State-sponsored acts of terror.

When Rao received irrefutable proof of Pakistan’s involvement in the Mumbai bombings, he insisted that the information must be severely restricted within his government. But in his inner circle, there was an extended and vigorous debate about what to do with the spectacular intelligence coup by RAW.

Like now, many of Rao’s aides then argued that the proof which India had obtained from across the border should be shared with Washington. The Americans knew about the Indian intelligence coup and were obviously keen to lay their hands on it. A senior diplomat at the US embassy in New Delhi, who later reached the top of the American intelligence establishment, had unusually close and extensive personal equations in the New Delhi establishment. He was assigned by the Clinton administration to pursue this objective.

But Rao was firm that, to start with, sharing the evidence could compromise India’s sources in Pakistan and put at risk its human intelligence network in that country, which was much larger in 1993 than it is today. Secondly, he argued that if the Americans wanted to do something for India, they did not need proof of the kind that was in Rao’s possession — or of any kind — in order to act. No one had an answer to Rao’s contention that the US had its own sources inside Pakistan and that if the will to act against Islamabad was found wanting in Washington, no amount of proof would change that anyway.

Unlike Rao, Manmohan Singh does not appear to realize that there is no court of law in diplomacy where proof is required to administer punishment. The idea of mandatory sentencing, which is an integral part of the US judicial system, is entirely alien to diplomacy, not only in America, but all over the world also and it has been that way throughout history.

The Bush administration was in bed with Pervez Musharraf from the end of 2001 till the general went out of office, his final phase in public life being the position of a civilian president. The incoming administration of Barack Obama will soon realize — if its key personnel do not know already — that it needs Pakistan more than India as the US attempts to make Afghanistan its primary battleground against global terrorism by increasing the presence of American troops in that country and making the fight against al Qaida and the Taliban more focussed.

As he travels to Washington, it is important for Chidambaram to reflect on the reality of the fight against terrorism in South Asia — that Pakistan’s Swat valley has already fallen into Taliban hands although no one wants to acknowledge this fall. From January 15, all girls in Swat will stop attending school. Elsewhere, in Afghanistan, the Taliban’s militia are moving northwards and, if unchecked, they will soon start knocking on the doors of Kabul.

Where does that leave Obama? He needs Pakistan more than ever to prevent Afghanistan from reverting to the Islamic militia headed by the one-eyed Mullah Omar. If the Americans were to act on India’s evidence against Pakistan and put Islamabad on a tight leash, they would have to turn to Tajikistan as an alternative supply route for US forces in Afghanistan and as a way to ferry the additional troops and equipment that Obama wants to send out in the fight against al Qaida and the Taliban. But that would require toning down US criticism of Russia’s Vladimir Putin and seeking an accommodation with the Kremlin. That would be unacceptable to many people in Washington.

If the Americans had not burnt their boats with Turkmenistan, they could have relied on the regime in Ashgabat to help. The US has another choice. It could turn to Islam Karimov in Tashkent for help, but that would mean turning a blind eye to incidents such as the shooting of innocent protesters in Andijon in 2005 and giving in to impossible demands by Uzbekistan. The Democrats in the White House and on Capitol Hill will have no stomach for that.

Pakistan realizes that US pressure on Islamabad for its role in Mumbai on November 26 has run its course. Obama may take some cosmetic action to appease India, but no more. The balance sheet of the Bush administration’s promise to make India a superpower is that Manmohan Singh is now back to the very square in which Narasimha Rao found himself in 1993. The incoming US president may continue the tradition of celebrating Diwali in the White House, but when it comes to alliances that matter, Pakistan will count first, more than India.
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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby tripathi » 07 Jan 2009 05:23

^^Ravi i think PVNR was able to pull that coz of his chanakian thinking as article suggests.also remember he was minister of external affairs in both indira gandhi and rajiv ganndhi cabinet. Another reason for him to pulling this off was that he kept USA at arms length in india's strategic goals.but all this changed after him when successive govts. pandered to usa in india's strategic affairs thereby always losing the initiative.And present UPA govt. has gone over board with all its strategic partnership bullshit with usa.i'm sure that one day our nuke deal thing will sure come to bite us in future.we lost friends in russia,iran in a zeal to make partnership with usa and at last usa backstabed us on 26/11.next thing on board is kashmir as obama said.so india needs to be careful of usa.keep friendship with them but say no to any partnership with them.engage them in business but not in ur strategic affairs.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby JwalaMukhi » 07 Jan 2009 07:45

What is the substantial significance of the timing of these attacks, discounting the symbolic?
Attacks staged after:
1) US election results are in.
2) India and US governments are close to lame-duck stages.
Who are benefactors other than pukis due to the timings?
Panda? Anybody else?

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby VikramS » 07 Jan 2009 09:08

JwalaMukhi wrote:What is the substantial significance of the timing of these attacks, discounting the symbolic?
Attacks staged after:
1) US election results are in.
2) India and US governments are close to lame-duck stages.
Who are benefactors other than pukis due to the timings?
Panda? Anybody else?


The attacks were supposed to happen in Sept end but some cover was blown and the attacks postponed.
Right now they were designed to catch the US in a lame-duck situation where any dramatic action would not be possible. It was also designed to reduce the number of brothers the TSPA is forced to kill in the West by moving the TSPA to the East. Burning the NATO convoys was meant to sent a message to the new POTUS about the tactical importance and the strategic location of TSPA. With plans to double the number of US boots on the ground in Afghanistan, the message was heard loud and clear in DC.

And finally it was done to increase the hold of the TSPA in the country; they have been out of power close to an year and the trigger fingers are getting itchy. The civilian leadership obviously was more accomodating to the US(e.g. Pasha being sent to India on Rice's persuasion). The military leadership took that opportunity to portray them as cowards who sold out to pressure from the SDRE, with the Army stepping in to save TSPs H&D. Any talk of reining in the ISI are now distant memory. Bo0b presser and 10% are in serious risk of getting Ashfaqed.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 07 Jan 2009 12:54

Complete radio silence from MKN all through this entire episode. And even after one month not a single squeak.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Singha » 07 Jan 2009 12:58

chankian conspiracy to make us believe he is no more and stop bothering him while he pens his memoirs. or maybe on
a special mission on saffron terror on direct orders from Madam. :mrgreen:

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 07 Jan 2009 13:17

On Sept admittedly this group under Lakhvi was busted and their 'cover was blown' .. so obviously MKN knew then.
What did he do from Sept to Nov 26 ?
then he keeps complete silence for 2 months.

Which 'senior' American officials did he meet between Sept and Nov 26 ?

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Sanku » 07 Jan 2009 13:23


Singha
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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Singha » 07 Jan 2009 13:34

unkil has shifted back to regular unkily mode now after hoodwinking the credulous GOI that "we will take care of it"

MMS is the one left with katora in hand and no coins to show :mrgreen:

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 07 Jan 2009 13:42

National Security Adviser (U.S.) Says Pakistan Is Top U.S. Challenge
JANUARY 7, 2009
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1231280 ... lenews_wsj

"You can't really solve Afghanistan without solving Pakistan," Mr. Hadley said in an interview in his White House office Tuesday. "That's why I think Pakistan is at the center" of the challenge for the incoming administration.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby jrjrao » 07 Jan 2009 18:26

Layer by layer, the Pakis will have to swallow their H&D and unpeel their earlier denials:

Ajmal Kasab belonged to Pakistan: Official sources
http://www.geo.tv/1-7-2009/32159.htm

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby jrjrao » 07 Jan 2009 18:29

Ajmal Kasab belonged to Pakistan: Official sources

ISLAMABAD: Ajmal Kasab, allegedly the top suspect in Mumbai attacks, hailed from Pakistan, official sources said Wednesday.

Initial probe has proved that Ajmal Kasab is a Pakistani national.

http://thenews.com.pk/updates.asp?id=64364

Do recall that as per Zaid Porki Hamid, this was/is one "Amar Singh" with a safron band on his wrist....

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby sum » 07 Jan 2009 18:49

I predict that the Pakis have realised that being aggressive is only hurting them further.
Expect to hear more "confessions" with blame squarely on LeT and no one else. On hearing the usual Paki sweet talk, all our DDM mellows down, the GoI mellows down, GOTUS asks both to investigate together, Pak throws a few crumbs like arresting the LeT big boys and putting them into eternal court cases and everything back to normal!!! :(

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby jrjrao » 07 Jan 2009 19:04

Yep, as per the predicted script:

Surviving gunman’s identity established as Pakistani
Dawn
ISLAMABAD: Pakistani authorities during the course of their own investigations into the Mumbai carnage have established the identity of the only surviving terrorist Ajmal Kasaab as a Pakistani national.

A high-ranking government official while confirming the report told Dawnnews that because of the nature of his crime the government has still not taken any decision on whether to provide him with consular access.

The official said Kasaab is the son of Amir Kasaab and Mrs Noor Illahi. But the identity of other militants killed in the Mumbai carnage is yet to be established. However, senior security officials told Dawnnews preliminary investigations have established these militants were operating on their own and had absolutely no link with any section of the country’s security apparatus. :rotfl: A formal announcement in this regard is expected in the next few days.

So, the mofos say that they have not yet established that the other perps were Pakis, but even without this, they do know, 400% sure onlee, that these unknown unidentified had no links with anybody in the naPak army or the ISI.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby John Snow » 07 Jan 2009 21:51

apropos Mrs Karkares's alleged observation, one must understand two things

1) the failure of GOI/Govt Maharashtra to provide councelling. Suitably breif her about PR and the abuse of her opininns by press at large and the interpretation.

2) On a personal note the family of Sri Karkare must be going through slew of emotions ranging from anger to dellusion to resigning to fate. ( we at BRF are going through the same after the inaction of Mumble Mumble Mouse, M^3 the dumb and diametric opposite of N^3 :wink: ).

So I say one more failure of administration who should have used he appearences to India's advantage.

Sigh.....

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby chetak » 08 Jan 2009 00:20

John Snow wrote:apropos Mrs Karkares's alleged observation, one must understand two things

1) the failure of GOI/Govt Maharashtra to provide councelling. Suitably breif her about PR and the abuse of her opininns by press at large and the interpretation.

2) On a personal note the family of Sri Karkare must be going through slew of emotions ranging from anger to dellusion to resigning to fate. ( we at BRF are going through the same after the inaction of Mumble Mumble Mouse, M^3 the dumb and diametric opposite of N^3 :wink: ).

So I say one more failure of administration who should have used he appearences to India's advantage.

Sigh.....


John Snow ji,
Dicey situation.
I know exactly how you feel.
Extremely difficult to even venture comment on Mrs Karkare's observations without leaving yourself open to all sorts of
allegations.
But it had to be said. :(

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby chetak » 08 Jan 2009 00:28

Raju wrote:Complete radio silence from MKN all through this entire episode. And even after one month not a single squeak.


He has established permanent residence on the throne in MMS's toilet. :lol:

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby SSridhar » 08 Jan 2009 12:42

FBI to let India prosecute Mumbai attackers

"This is the major tragedy in India, so it is fully appropriate that Indian authorities handle the investigation and prosecution," a FBI spokesperson said.

"If at some point many many years down the road... there is an opportunity for the United States to prosecute them for the killing of Americans, our prosecutors would take a look at that point," he said.

"There is no stature limitation on murders, so it does not matter when that time would be but absolutely the priority here is let India to handle the investigation and prosecution," he said.

At this point of time FBI is not registering a separate case against those responsible for the killing of US citizens in the Nov 26 Mumbai attacks. Instead, it is extending all help to India in investigating the case.

"The FBI will work with the Indian authorities as well as our partners to cover all leads, wherever they may take us," the spokesperson said.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby John Snow » 08 Jan 2009 13:16

There's a Mole in the Bucket
Traditional
(Boys)
There's a Mole in the Cabinet, dear Liza, dear Liza,
There's a Mole in the Cabinet, dear Liza, a hole.

(Girls)
So fix it dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
So fix it dear Henry, dear Henry, fix it.

With what should I fix it, dear Liza, dear Liza,
With what should I fix it, dear Liza, with what?

With straw MManS, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
With straw, dear Henry, dear Henry, with straw.

But the strawMManS, is too soft, dear Liza, dear Liza,
The strawMManS is too soft, dear Liza, Liza, too soft.

So throw him dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
So throw him dear Henry, dear Henry, throw him !

With what should I throw him , dear Liza, dear Liza,
With what should I throw him , dear Liza, with what?

Use the barge pole, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
Use the barge pole, dear Henry, the barge pole.

(The song I learned in 1959 Bombay Naval Primary school Colaba RC church when my father was with DGNP Bombay)
*********************

Jaswant's mole story: connect the dots

August 22, 2006 Rediff

Former foreign minister Jaswant Singh has been 'discredited' by much of the media and the 'mole' issue seems to have already been forgotten. All that needs to be done to ascertain the truth of the existence of the alleged 'mole' and his/her identity is to find out if indeed a 'supersecret' meeting in Bangalore as described in the purported American letter did take place. If it did who all attended Who was it that flew to Bangalore via London, Frankfurt and Mumbai
And, who was it that was making the 'other side' of the argument regarding the nuclear test to the then Prime Minister P V Narasimha Rao.

There are enough pieces of information available to suggest that there was indeed a 'mole' and that the whole issue warrants investigation.

First, let's understand what Jaswant Singh actually said � as against what was reported.

Point number one: This is not the first time, as has been repeatedly said, that Jaswant Singh has raised the 'mole' issue. He himself seems to have forgotten and the nation seems not to have noticed it, but he had hinted at leakage of information on nuclear plans even in his 1999 book Defending India.

In the postscript to that book, Jaswant Singh wrote of the cancelled 1995 nuclear test that 'Satellite imagery, and some even suggest human intelligence from India, revealed the plans to the US government�'

Point number two: In his latest book, A Call to Honour, Jaswant Singh did not allege that there was a 'mole' in the usual sense in which that word is understood � an insider spy, a double agent.

What he did say was that there was leakage of information, not on all or even several aspects of the nuclear programme, but on one particular event that was being planned -- a nuclear test -- from someone with access to the highest levels of the Indian government.

Also, neither did Jaswant Singh suggest that such leakage was occurring on a regular basis nor that the source of the leak did it with a deliberate intent to harm India.

What he did bring to the fore is simply that information did leak out on something that should have been a very tightly guarded secret. It may have been inadvertent, just loose talk from a loud-mouthed diplomat.

Or, it may have been deliberate but nevertheless with no intent to harm India but rather because the informant hoped to acquire the trust of the Americans and become a bridge between the US administration and the Indian government, a task that he took upon himself with only good intentions.

Or, as it happens so often, it may have been a case of someone jockeying for a particular posting or to secure a favour from the Americans.

It would be correct to conclude, as many have, that there was no serious leakage of information over an extended period on the nuclear programme and that if there had been, then the Indian nuclear weapons programme would probably not have come to the stage that it has. This, however, does not rule out the possibility that information did leak out on one particular occasion.

Point number three: The alleged informant was not necessarily in the Narasimha Rao PMO, but he/she was a person 'with direct access to the prime minister'.

Now, here are some more dots that those who are interested in following this case can connect:

One, Narasimha Rao was in Bangalore on at least one day in the month of November in 1995, possibly more. Rao was in Bangalore on November 17, 1995 to attend the rolling out of the first technology demonstrator of the Light Combat Aircraft by the DRDO. Obviously, some key DRDO people were available in Bangalore on that day for the prime minister to hold his 'supersecret' meeting.

Even on November 18, 1995, Rao was close to Bangalore, at Anantapur to attend Sai Baba's 70th birthday. He could easily have flown back to Bangalore to conduct his 'supersecret' meeting.

The purported US official's letter says that his source told him the meeting in Bangalore would be held over a weekend. November 17, 1995, was Friday, 18th Saturday, 19th Sunday.

Again, the official says in the letter that he had given his Indian source his contact numbers where he could be reached over the Thanksgiving weekend. In 1995, the Thanksgiving weekend was from November 24 (Friday) to November 26 (Sunday).

It is also possible that the 'supersecret' meeting was held during or close to the Thanksgiving weekend, because some top cabinet ministers were available close to Bangalore, again at celebrations relating to Sai Baba's institutions, in that period.

Two, although the Thomas Graham mentioned by Jaswant Singh has been reported to be a senator, it seems no senator by that name existed, at least not in 1995. The media concluded that Jaswant Singh, therefore, had no real case to make.

Add to this the fact that the media has unquestioningly accepted as truthful the denials issued by American officials with regard to the letter that Jaswant Singh produced. This is a curious instance of judgment having been passed in a case based simply on a denial of guilt by the accused.

But there was indeed a Thomas Graham in an important and relevant position in the Clinton administration in 1995. Ambassador Thomas Graham was Special Representative of the President for Arms Control, Non-proliferation and Disarmament from 1994 to 1997.

Columnist S Gurumurthy, who has claimed that he has secret Rockefeller Foundation documents that suggest that the 1995 nuclear plans leak and certain other American activities in 1997 during I K Gujral's prime ministership were connected, has said that those receiving Indian information were officials at the Rockefeller Foundation and the Carter Center.

It so happens that around the time, the Rockefeller Foundation's International Security Program focusing on non-proliferation was headed by a person named Thomas Graham. Whether the Thomas Graham at Rockefeller Foundation was the same Thomas Graham who was the Special Representative of the President is not clear.

Harry Barnes, who is supposedly involved in the exchange of the purported letter, was at the Carter Center at the time. Barnes, who was US ambassador to India in the 1980s, continues to be very much interested in the India-Pakistan conflict. He is currently involved with the 'Karakoram Science Park' in the Karakoram mountains. This project is funded by the US National Science Foundation, the Lounsberry Foundation and, curiously, the US Office of Naval Research.

Former Indian ambassador to the US, Naresh Chandra, whom Gurumurthy alleged was one of the 'moles', in fact referred to Thomas Graham in an interview to Mumbai's Daily News Analysis newspaper in March 2006.

Speaking on the Manmohan Singh-George Bush nuclear deal, Naresh Chandra was quoted as having said, '�The foundations for the nuclear deal were laid in the 'nineties. There were ongoing non-formal contacts among scientists, government officials and Track II actors. Raja Ramanna, Arunachalam and MEA officials from our side were involved and from the US side people like Tom Graham, Harry Barnes, Douglas MacNamara and Rockefeller Foundation officials. So moves did begin at that time.'

Jaswant Singh might well have chosen to bring out the issue of the nuclear leaks out now to suggest in his own complicated way that the Bush-Manmohan Singh nuclear deal, which has at its core America's refusal to recognize, and deal with, India as a nuclear weapons state, is indeed born of those initiatives of the previous Congress government which were undertaken prior to the emergence of India as a declared nuclear weapons state and therefore sidesteps the reality of India's nuclear weapons status and its substantive implications for the US, the NSG countries and the non-proliferation regime.

Third, certain remarks reported to have been made by former prime minister Gujral following his meeting with former US president Bill Clinton in September 1997 seem to corroborate Gurmurthy's claims that the Rockefeller Foundation, with the help of the Indian 'moles', had indeed attempted to bring about a meeting between Clinton, Gujral and the former prime minister of Pakistan Nawaz Sharif on the Kashmir issue without the knowledge of the Indian ministry of external affairs and US governmental agencies such as the State Department and the National Security Agency.

Before we get to Gujral's remarks, here is Strobe Talbott's account of how the Clinton-Gujral meeting came about.

In his book on the Jaswant Singh-Strobe Talbott talks, Engaging India, Talbott first describes how the US State Department, the National Security Agency and the president's schedulers battle it out every year to schedule bilaterals between the American president and other heads of state who go to New York for the annual UN General Assembly in September.

Talbott then says, 'That particular year, it was Clinton himself who insisted on spending time with both Inder Gujral� and Nawaz Sharif�He (Gujral) had come to the meeting expecting tough questions and harsh demands on Kashmir and nuclear weapons�'

N. Ram, who accompanied Gujral on the tour, reported in Frontline that Gujral had heaved a huge sigh of relief after his meeting with Clinton because nothing substantive came up for discussion. On board the prime minister's aircraft, Gujral gave vent to his feelings with a Ghalib couplet:

Thi khabar garam ke Ghalib ke udenge purze
Dekhne hum bhi gaye the pa(r) tamasha na hua.
The hot news was that Ghalib would be torn to bits.
We too went to watch, but nothing at all happened.

PS: Almost everyone who could possibly have attended any 'supersecret' meeting in November 1995 is alive, except Narasimha Rao. It should not be difficult to ascertain the 'mole' truth.

(The time has come to revisit this issue in light of present Cabinet decisions effecting the Nations Security)

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 14:12

chetak wrote:
Raju wrote:Complete radio silence from MKN all through this entire episode. And even after one month not a single squeak.


He has established permanent residence on the throne in MMS's toilet. :lol:


No Sir ! Such behaviour is typical of a person who is constantly burdened with the thought that if he opens his mouth he shall speak more than he is supposed to. the lives of 250 people lost will bear heavy on him also.

thus complete radio silence.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Singha » 08 Jan 2009 14:57

he was reported to have met some amirkhan emissary yesterday, so his vital signs are stable
and not comatose.

its good to know atleast we have the kursi occupied.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby John Snow » 08 Jan 2009 15:03

Ok our babus and their masters never learn.

Apparently in the hope that Khrushchev would restrain the Chinese from further border attacks, New Delhi instructed the Indian ambassador in Moscow to explain the Indian position to Khrushchev personally. Khrushchev was to be informed that a large number of notes sent to Peiping have gone unanswered and that ‘the Chinese have started an insidious propaganda against India among socialist and nonaligned countries’. In early September, Indian Foreign Secretary Dutt formally notified the Soviet and Polish ambassadors of New Delhi’s serious concern over Chinese border incursions. Dutt privately warned the ambassadors that if the incidents were to continue, New Delhi would be forced to re-appraise its policy of nonal ignment. These appeals and Khrushchev’s apparent concern for the USSR’s whole Indian policy ‘combined to spur the Russians into an effort to dissociate Moscow from Peiping’s actions against India.”[/quote]


[quote]“Nehru told his Cabinet that in mid-October the Soviet Union had informed him that the Russians had done ‘as m uch as they were able to’ in cautioning the Chinese to exercise restraint – that is, Nehru explained, the Russians were clearly not in a position to dictate to Peiking” (the italicised words are in direct quotes in the Study). The CIA had access to Cabinet papers. Further, “at an emergency cabinet meeting in late October Nehru indicated that border fighting did not constitute a threat to India. The strategic Chinese threat, he maintained, lies in the rapidly increasing industrial power base of China as well as the building of military bases in Tibet. The only Indian answer, he continued, is the most rapid possible development of the Indian economy to provide a national power base capable of resisting a possible eventual Chinese Communist military move. Nehru seemed to believe that the Chinese could not sustain any major drive across the ‘great land barrier’ and that the Chinese threat was only a long-term one.” Such was Nehru’s understanding of the realities of the modern world that the concept of a limited war, in vogue by then, never entered his mind. He was obsessed with an all-out-war, which he regarded as unthinkable and one which would lead to a world war.

Our Army is still in that mode of Dharma Yudh of 48 days with mobilization fbefore the war for a year with T-55, T-72, T-90 :rotfl:
:mrgreen:

Retired intelligence officials say Mr Singh is right. "We know the Americans had somebody inside. They knew about plans to test nuclear weapons and stopped us in the early 90s," said B Raman, who worked for the Research and Analysis Wing, India's external espionage agency, until 1994. "The question is, was the American information from a paid informant or from an official who liked to talk too much?"





The declassification of vital CIA and US State Department documents relating to South Asia reveals that the American spy agency (CIA) had a vital source in Mrs Gandhi’s cabinet. CIA’s ‘reliable source’ leaked India’s war objectives to the US, thereby compromising India’s plan to teach Pakistan a lasting lesson.

The details of Mrs Gandhi’s Cabinet briefings were also known to the CIA within hours. The minutes of the National Security Council meeting in Washington on December 6, 1971 (See page 672 of the document) sheds some light on this. The CIA director Richard Helms informed the meeting that: “We have a report which covers Madam Gandhi’s strategy as delivered to her Cabinet at 11 pm on December 3, 1971……The objectives in the west (Pakistan) are to destroy Pakistan’s armour and in the east to totally liberate the area.”

An information cable of the CIA dated December 7, 1971 (See page 686 of the document) reveals details of Mrs Gandhi’s briefing to her Cabinet on the India-Pakistan war. The information, attributed to a reliable source, includes India’s war objectives as reiterated by Mrs Gandhi. They were:

The quick liberation of Bangladesh
The incorporation into India of the southern part of Azad Kashmir for strategic rather than territorial reasons (because India has no desire to occupy any West Pakistan territory)
To destroy Pakistani military striking power so that it never attempts to challenge India in the future
The CIA report also added that the Indian Prime Minister had informed her Cabinet that India would not accept any ceasefire till Bangladesh was liberated.

Shuja Nawaz, a Pakistani political and strategic analyst, in his book Crossed Swords: Pakistan, Its Army, and the Wars Within, says: “Mrs Gandhi asked her defence chiefs to be ready to drive into Sialkot and then proceed as deep as possible even upto Rawalpindi with the aim of destroying Pakistan. The CIA managed to get actual minutes of the meeting and passed them to Washington urgently.”

The author, however, does not mention the source of the information he has revealed in his book.

In another disclosure, the CIA director informed the Washington Special Actions Group in a meeting on December 8, 1971 (See page 694 of the document) that Mrs Gandhi had told her Cabinet that “she had expected a more balanced view from the Chinese. She expressed the hope that the Chinese would not intervene physically in the north, but said that the Soviets had said the Chinese would be able to ‘rattle the sword.’ She also said that the Soviets have promised to counterbalance any such action.”

The disclosure of India’s war objectives by the mole resulted in an aggressive policy by the US to save West Pakistan from the Indian assault.

In a meeting with the Chinese Permanent Representative to the UN (Ambassador Huang Hua) on December 10, 1971 (See page 757 of the document), Henry Kissinger (President Nixons’s NSA) said, “we have an intelligence report according to which Mrs Gandhi told her cabinet that she wants to destroy the Pakistani army and air force and to annex this part of Kashmir, Azad Kashmir, and then to offer a ceasefire. This is what we believe must be prevented and this is why I have taken the liberty to ask for this meeting with the Ambassador.”

A memorandum (dated December 11, 1971) for President Nixon by Henry Kissinger (See page 765 of the document) states: “According to a reliable source Mrs Gandhi’s staff as of Thursday was still saying that, as soon as the situation in the East is settled, India will launch a major offensive against West Pakistan and hope that all major fighting will be over by the end of the month.”

It also goes on to say that D P Dhar (See page 765-766 of the document), a close confidante of Indira Gandhi and former Ambassador to then USSR, was in Moscow to sound out the Soviets on India’s intentions towards West Pakistan.

The United States administration was absolutely convinced - thanks to the reliable source they had in Prime Minister Gandhi’s Cabinet - that India had offensive plans for West Pakistan. President Nixon, in a telephonic conversation with his National Security Assistant Henry Kissinger on December 8, 1971, said that China could be a decisive factor in restraining the Indian advance.

“The Chinese thing I still think is a card in the hole there. I tell you a movement of even some Chinese toward that border could scare those goddamn Indians to death,” he told Kissinger (See page 706 of the document).

The US even threatened the Soviet Union with a major confrontation if they did not convince India to stop the offensive. In a back channel message to then US Ambassador in Pakistan on December 10, 1971 (See page 749-750 of the document), Kissinger asks him to tell Pak President Yahya Khan that the US has issued a strong demarche to the Soviets and warned them that the US will not permit any aggression against West Pakistan.

“President added that should Indian offensive be launched in the West, with Soviet acquiescence, a US/Soviet confrontation would ensue,” Kissinger’s message further adds.

There are numerous such details in the declassified documents which clearly point towards the US concern regarding the future of West Pakistan. It would not be too far fetched to say that had the crucial details of India’s war plans remained a secret, the history of South Asia would have been totally different. The US did everything (even supplied arms to Pakistan via Iran, Jordan) to save West Pakistan and they succeeded in the end.

This brings us to the most important question. Who leaked India’s war plans?

Interestingly, India was aware of the presence of a CIA mole who leaked the war plans. This was revealed in a meeting between then Foreign Minister Swaran Singh and top US officials in 1972. In the meeting, which took place on October 5, 1972, Singh told the US officials (See page 2, point 4 of the document) that Government of India (GOI) had its own sources and knew that CIA has been in contact with people in India in “abnormal ways”.

“GOI had information that proceedings of the Congress Working Committee were known to the US officials within two hours of meetings,” Singh told the US Secretary of State William Rogers.

Various accounts in the media have speculated about different names in the former PM’s Cabinet who might have worked for the CIA.

Jack Anderson, an American investigative journalist, reported about the existence of a CIA mole in the Indira Gandhi cabinet. Anderson got the Pulitzer Prize for national reporting in 1972 for his reports on US’ tilt away from India towards Pakistan during Bangladesh’s war for independence. Details regarding the mole and the information he passed on to the CIA can also be found in The Anderson Papers and The Man who kept the secrets (based on the life of CIA Director Richard Helms – Written by Thomas Powers).

Noted Indian lawyer A G Noorani, in his essay titled The CIA papers, published in the August 11-24, 2007 issue of fortnightly Frontline, states, “the mole in Mrs Gandhi’s Cabinet performed freely for the CIA all through 1971 till he was compromised. She did not sack him, however, ever forgiving of ‘human’ weakness. He survived.”

While referring to the declassified material and the above mentioned books, Noorani further says that the CIA had penetrated the Indian Government at every level. The agency received reports on “troops movements, logistics, strategy, and even some of Prime Minister Indira Gandhi’s secret conversations.”

“Was it not a matter of concern that her anxious queries to the Soviet Ambassador and his replies reached Henry Kissinger’s table while the war was on,” Noorani inquires.

While all the available information points towards a possible mole in Mrs Gandhi’s Cabinet during the 1971 war, we still don’t know his identity. I won’t speculate on the names here but the Indian Government should learn from the US and declassify old records.

Anuj, meanwhile, had filed an RTI application with the Prime Minister’s Office and the Ministry of External Affairs to seek information about the alleged mole in Mrs Gandhi’s Cabinet. But as always, the request has been turned down.

Withholding all the information since independence by giving lame excuses that declassifying it might affect India’s foreign relations with other countries is not acceptable. The nation has a right to know the information surrounding such an important episode.



IG was the man, She is missed during this Mumbai Humiliation.

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Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 17:34

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/ ... s_in_p.php

Six Pakistani handlers monitored the news coverage from Mumbai and kept in constant touch with the terrorists holed up in Nariman House and the Taj Mahal and Trident hotels during the three day siege. The handlers are identified as Zarar, Kafa, Wassi, Jundal, Bururg, and “Major General.”

Zarar has been identified as Zarar Shah, the Lashkar-e-Taiba communications expert who set up the network that allowed the Mumbai terrorists to speak with Lashkar-e-Taiba commanders in Pakistan during the attack. He also served as a key liaison between the terror group and Pakistan's Inter-Service Intelligence agency. Zarar is currently in Pakistani custody and has admitted to his role in the Mumbai attacks.

The identity of the other handlers has not been provided, but India has accused elements within Pakistan’s intelligence service and the military of supporting the attack. The handler identified as “Major General” implies the involvement of a current or former military officer. The Inter-Service Intelligence agency is a branch of the Pakistani military. The ISI chief and Army corps commanders achieve the rank of Major General or Lieutenant General.

A senior US military intelligence official familiar with the dossier said that the "Major General" is indeed Hamid Gul, the retired former chief of the ISI. "It's Gul," the official told The Long War Journal.
"This is why the US is trying to get him on the UN list of terrorists." In December 2008 the US attempted to get Hamid Gul and other former military and intelligence officials added to the UN list of designated terrorists but has so far been rebuffed.


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