Bharat Rakshak Forum Announcement

Hello Everyone,

A warm welcome back to the Bharat Rakshak Forum.

Important Notice: Due to a corruption in the BR forum database we regret to announce that data records relating to some of our registered users have been lost. We estimate approx. 500 user details are deleted.

To ease the process of recreating the user IDs we request members that have previously posted on the BR forums to recognise and identify their posts, once the posts are identified please contact the BRF moderator team by emailing BRF Mod Team with your post details.

The mod team will be able to update your username, email etc. so that the user history can be maintained.

Unfortunately for members that have never posted or have had all their posts deleted i.e. users that have 0 posts, we will be unable to recreate your account hence we request that you re-register again.

We apologise for any inconvenience caused and thank you for your understanding.

Regards,
Seetal

Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 18:39

A senior US military intelligence official familiar with the dossier said that the "Major General" is indeed Hamid Gul, the retired former chief of the ISI. "It's Gul," the official told The Long War Journal. "This is why the US is trying to get him on the UN list of terrorists." In December 2008 the US attempted to get Hamid Gul and other former military and intelligence officials added to the UN list of designated terrorists but has so far been rebuffed.


lol

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 19:16

Raju wrote:lol


Why? Anything that doesn't say George W. Bush and Condi Rice wore beards and went to LeT HQ and ordered the attack is not credible?

I want to write more but my NSA/CIA/DIA friends have invited me for breakfast :twisted:

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 19:20

Rangudu wrote:
Raju wrote:lol


Why? Anything that doesn't say George W. Bush and Condi Rice wore beards and went to LeT HQ and ordered the attack is not credible?

I want to write more but my NSA/CIA/DIA friends have invited me for breakfast :twisted:


there can be a response, but will you assure not to take close innings and take bat and ball home ?

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 19:26

Talking to conspiracy theorists on BR is the same as talking to Zaid Hamid types or TSPA apologists. Anything irrelevant can be turned into incontrovertible evidence and the most damning data would be dismissed as irrelevant all based on whether they support the preconceived notion.

I can't stop you from believing in your conspiracy theories and definitely will not. That said, if you have anything that is sourced properly, please post and enlighten us. That would be helpful as opposed to a post that starts and ends with "LOL"

sum
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9622
Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby sum » 08 Jan 2009 19:32

Sorry but what is the current disagreement about?

What was wrong in the posted article?

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 19:38

sum,

Raju's posts have one agenda - Americans are behind everything, they did 9/11, they did every terror attack on India and essentially anything bad that happens in the universe is America's fault.

I suppose he has some fantastic conspiracy theory behind the US fingering of Gul, explaining his LOL post.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 19:48

Rangudu wrote:Talking to conspiracy theorists on BR is the same as talking to Zaid Hamid types or TSPA apologists. Anything irrelevant can be turned into incontrovertible evidence and the most damning data would be dismissed as irrelevant all based on whether they support the preconceived notion.

I can't stop you from believing in your conspiracy theories and definitely will not. That said, if you have anything that is sourced properly, please post and enlighten us. That would be helpful as opposed to a post that starts and ends with "LOL"


Everybody who doesn't agree with your point of view is a conspiracy nut or Zaid Hamid 'types' ?
anyhow what the hell are you trying to peddle giving an american point of view to every debate.

what should I call such cases .. yank nuts ?
your arguments are very cleverly inserted to nip all opposing points of view so that everybody sings kumbayas only to the theories approved by Rangudu Sir.

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 19:51

Raju

Nope. You cannot post a single documentable source for your "information." When asked you say - "The media is in on the conspiracy" or "The Americans have total control of world media"

Tell me if that isn't identical to Zaid Hamid's "Amar Singh/Heera Lal" theories?
Last edited by Rangudu on 08 Jan 2009 19:52, edited 1 time in total.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 19:51

{OK, enough of the exchange of pleasantries. The request to post links, facts and logic is reasonable. If all you have is :(( :(( then there is of course a thread for that. :mrgreen: }

But your incredulity with the Anonymous US Official Naming Gul is something I share, see below.
Last edited by enqyoob on 08 Jan 2009 19:54, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: c above

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 19:52

Rangudu, "Gul" is a too-convenient answer. WHY is the guy allowed to run around, if he is really this active in terrorism? I mean, he is "credited" with organizing the assasination of Ahmed Shah Masood on 9/9/2001, in a very obvious precursor to the 9/11 attacks. They guys was reported to have returned to 'Pindi on 9/10, and that was clearly the signal to give the "go-ahead" to the Atta gang, and then Gul and Mush were supposedly closeted inside ISI HQ setting the evacuation from Afghanistan in motion BEFORE the 9/11 attack occurred.

With that credential, the guy has since then been going around very blatantly and freely articulating the cause of the jehad, and traveling all over the world, no problems with No Fly lists or airport security or visas to the US.

Why is this so? Given this record, I too find the US protestations against Gul to be a little too loud and waaaay too incredible. If the above stories of his complicity in 9/11 are true, then there is a lot to be scared about in the conspiracy theories.

Very briefly, why hasn't Gul been "rendered" to Guano Bay or Czech Republic long ago? Why hasn't he been "debriefed"?

Either he is in the pay of the West, or be is a complete non-entity, used as a whipping boy but considered quite harmless. Face it, the GWOT has absolutely no credibility if the Americans have let Gul run around this long.

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 19:56

{UN-mediated ceasefire pls}

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 19:57

Gul has openly admitted that India and Pakistan should fight US together and settle their disputes later.

Now Gul is one Islamist on the Paki side who has shown a tendency to look from India's point of view and not just drumbeat for the American-Islamist nexus like Kayani.

So American's have a problem with Gul .. and now surprise .. he is "Major General" of the convo. :lol:

lol

sum
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9622
Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby sum » 08 Jan 2009 20:00

Now Gul is one Islamist on the Paki side who has shown a tendency to look from India's point of view

Gul and Indian point of view?? :eek: :shock:

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:02

Raju, Gul has been basically doing Osama's job given Osama's Predator-induced media-shyness. I'll p(a/i)ss on his great love for India, thanks, but he is very openly and bluntly pro-Jehad against the US.

In today's news you see an item where an Arab-American citizen was stopped from flying because he was wearing a t-shirt that said "We Will Not Be Silent" - in English and Arabic.

So how come Gul has no problems traveling? Why hasn't a Predator taken him out?

OTOH, Gulbiddin Hekmatyar, who was probably a lot more pro-US than Gul, is hiding from the Predators. So why is Gul running free?

As for India's distaste for Gul, I think Indian media types, if not Track 2 Candle-Kissers, have been in routine contact with Gul - the guy is as sought-after for comments as a South Asia Expert as Stephen Cohen is.

ManishC
BRFite
Posts: 193
Joined: 29 Jun 2008 19:11

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby ManishC » 08 Jan 2009 20:03

In the spirit of raging conspiracy theories A question for the Gurus-
Amar Singh wants action against Pak in 5 days or Else.. Can this be taken as a clear indication that TSPA/ISI want a hot war badly at this point, enough to activate their proxies demanding one?
And if so where is the next terrorist strike which would have moved GOI from it's Masterly Inaction?

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:04

sum wrote:
Now Gul is one Islamist on the Paki side who has shown a tendency to look from India's point of view

Gul and Indian point of view?? :eek: :shock:


Gul is not as much anti-Indian as much he is anti-American.
baat khatam

he doesn't want any external (read western) interference in the region which at some places dovetails with Indian stand.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:05

As for India's distaste for Gul, I think Indian media types, if not Track 2 Candle-Kissers, have been in routine contact with Gul - the guy is as sought-after for comments as a South Asia Expert as Stephen Cohen is.


he was there on TV on one channel or another most of the days, until US decided that he was guilty in 26/11.
his views never seemed anti-Indian .. he was more focussed on western angle.

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 20:07

N^3,

I share your scepticism and the reason why I posted was to try to start a discussion on what the reasons behind the US' recent obsession on Hameed Gul.

First, I don't think that Gul being one of the planners of Mumbai is far fetched. It is in fact VERY plausible because:

1. Gul has and still admits today that he is an "advisor" to LeT

2. See this. Gul says:
The West was willing to listen to India and even pamper it because of its vibrant economy, particularly the large domestic market; Pakistan had nothing remotely comparable. To prevail over its traditional enemy, Pakistan would have to expend its energies undermining the Indian economy and fragmenting the internal market.


Attacking economic targets to bring India to its knees is a theory advanced by Gul openly for years. Given that and his LeT ties, it is very much possible that they tapped Gul for target identification and strategic parts of the terror campaign.

Now, why is the US getting a "khujli" for Gul now?

My theory is that US desperately wants India not to push the "serving ISI" aspect of Mumbai regardless of evidence. All US officials have gone out of the way to exonerate the serving ISI leadership and Kayani. I think it has to do with whatever GUBO deal they have cut with them on that aircraft carrier. The Americans want to keep this TSPA leadership team. Thus to mollify India, they have publicly come out with support for the "LeT did it, with retired ISI/TSPA help" theory.

Anyone who takes Gul's words "supporting" India at its face value must be high on something strong. This man smiles and blames "Hindu extremists" even as he ordered terror attacks on India. Just read his comments on India in the Urdu media to get his real feelings for our country. There is not a day that goes by where Gul is not quoted as seeking a dismemberment of India and "reabsorption" inti Pakistan. So much for his pro-India views. :roll: :evil:

I never thought I'd see a day when BR would have Hamid Gul supporters. Quite pathetic.
Last edited by Rangudu on 08 Jan 2009 20:08, edited 1 time in total.

sum
BRF Oldie
Posts: 9622
Joined: 08 May 2007 17:04
Location: (IT-vity && DRDO) nagar

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby sum » 08 Jan 2009 20:08

Raju wrote:
sum wrote:
Now Gul is one Islamist on the Paki side who has shown a tendency to look from India's point of view

Gul and Indian point of view?? :eek: :shock:


Gul is not as much anti-Indian as much he is anti-American.
baat khatam

he doesn't want any external (read western) interference in the region which at some places dovetails with Indian stand.

Certainly a new perspective for me. So, you say that Amrikans just making Gul a fall guy since they want him more badly than Indians?
Surely, if the Amrikans wanted him so badly, why would they have allowed him to roam around spitting venom so freely. That seems to be the exclusive preserve of India's enemies!!! :P
Last edited by sum on 08 Jan 2009 20:12, edited 1 time in total.

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:08

If Amar Singh is as pro-"othercommunity" in UP as he is said 2 b, and given that the "other community" in UP, if Kaleem Kawaja and his buddies in the US are anything to go by, is 97% pro-TSP, why is he calling for "action against TSP"?

This does indicate desperation in TSP that yet another expensive attack brought no positive results.

Rahul M
Forum Moderator
Posts: 16223
Joined: 17 Aug 2005 21:09
Location: woh log gawad hai, unpad hai !
Contact:

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rahul M » 08 Jan 2009 20:09

err.. Raju ji, have you seen the "we will reduce bangalore to rubble..." etc etc ?

there are many of his interviews on youtube, please help yourself.

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:12

Writing on Hamid Gul on BRF:

his views never seemed anti-Indian
:roll:

He does not need to be, when on Indian TV - the anchors represent that pov so well that it would be superfluous for him to do so. And there are enough viewers in India with zero memory, who can be easily taken in (no offence) - see what happened when Pervez Musharraf, the terrorist who ordered the torture-murders of Indian soldiers, and caused the deaths of over 400 in Kargil, came to Agra. a year later. "Shame" is not an emotion felt in the Indian media, and "attention span" is not something that the modern Indian TV-watching public is known for.

As Rahul suggests, Gul need not rant against India, since he's going to raze yindoostan and become Caliph one day (or maybe vice-Caliph to Gohar Ayoob Khan)

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 20:13

N^3,

One more reason for American khujli for Gul could be what B.Raman wrote a few years back. Gul is the ringleader in the "Videotape-e-Publish" business for Zawahiri and Osama. Remember that to date, no one has been able to explain how those tapes find their way from Al Qaeda types to the Al Jazeera Karachi office. If there is another 9/11 being planned, I can't imagine if Gul is not in on it. Gul has publicly warned several times that he fears being renditioned into some CIA camp and if the TSP govt facilitates such a thing, his people would reveal a lot of secrets and destroy the nation. That is why Gul hasn't been touched.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:14

My theory is that US desperately wants India not to push the "serving ISI" aspect of Mumbai regardless of evidence. All US officials have gone out of the way to exonerate the serving ISI leadership and Kayani.


this means obviously that US is as much complicit in Pakistan terrorism against India as the 'serving ISI generals' themselves. US has provided the international and financial support for TSPA terrorist perfidy against India all along.

And thus exactly a solution to this problem doesn't run anywhere near US.

Americans can support whatever Pakistani perfidy against India but they can always have their share of supporters.
sum wrote:Surely, if the Amrikans wanted him so badly, why would they have allowed him to roam around spitting venom so freely. That seems to be the exclusive preserve of India's enemies!!!


American influence with Pakistan Army does not involve TSPA officers or Generals like Gul.
this is the code in the TSPA that retd and serving officers shall never be touched.

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:16

That is why Gul hasn't been touched.


Why would this make the US shy if he is really what he seems to be? Seems to me that he must know where Bin Laden and "Mullah Omar" are, at minimum. So this whole circus makes no sense to me at all.

If the US is not willing to capture and interrogate the obvious leaders of the Al Qaida, I wonder why send young people to die in the mountains.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:17

Rahul M wrote:err.. Raju ji, have you seen the "we will reduce bangalore to rubble..." etc etc ?

there are many of his interviews on youtube, please help yourself.


No, there is not going to be any defence of Hamid Gul's past statements from me.

Just that he is more anti-American rather than anti-Indian currently, and I have no problem with that.
TSPA Islamists who are anti-American should be encouraged as much as possible.

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 20:19

this means obviously that US is as much complicit in Pakistan terrorism against India as the 'serving ISI generals' themselves. US has provided the international and financial support for TSPA terrorist perfidy against India all along.


Nonsense. By that logic, India is complicit because despite being attacked 50000000000000000 times, we have given TSP a "Most Favored Nation" status and refuse to call them a terrorist state officially.

US has made it clear that it will go only so far in support of India and to make them go farther is in India's hands. US' interests in TSP are somewhat aligned with ours but not totally.

This is what happens when people start obsessing on one imagined enemy and can't tell between a superpower playing games skilfully while sharing some interests with India versus a terrorist chief who smiles and tells Indians he will kill them all. The obsession/compulsion leads to the former being branded as THE enemy while the latter becomes a "friend" :roll:

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:23

Rangudu wrote:
this means obviously that US is as much complicit in Pakistan terrorism against India as the 'serving ISI generals' themselves. US has provided the international and financial support for TSPA terrorist perfidy against India all along.


Nonsense. By that logic, India is complicit because despite being attacked 50000000000000000 times, we have given TSP a "Most Favored Nation" status and refuse to call them a terrorist state officially.

US has made it clear that it will go only so far in support of India and to make them go farther is in India's hands. US' interests in TSP are somewhat aligned with ours but not totally.

This is what happens when people start obsessing on one imagined enemy and can't tell between a superpower playing games skilfully while sharing some interests with India versus a terrorist chief who smiles and tells Indians he will kill them all. The obsession/compulsion leads to the former being branded as THE enemy while the latter becomes a "friend" :roll:


Superpower itself is planning the attacks against India and ISI-agents are just executing it like obedient lapdogs.
Once Superpower agenda in region is finished, it will eliminate all this ISI, TSPA within the blink of an eye .. or probably they will know what is coming and quieten themselves.

Or else we will get hit again, until their plan is fulfilled.

the whole game is being played by TSPA on Superpower-behalf to subdue the Independent Indian spirit and to curtail our liberty and make us as subservient as American citizens.
TSPA is being used as a cats-paw by unkil.

Rangudu
BRFite
Posts: 1751
Joined: 03 Mar 2002 12:31
Location: USA

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Rangudu » 08 Jan 2009 20:27

Raju wrote:Superpower itself is planning the attacks against India and ISI-agents are just executing it like obedient lapdogs.
...TSPA is being used as a cats-paw by unkil.


Thank you for making my point about your cussed obsession. Is there a shred of evidence to support this "Zaid Hamid" type blather?

Understanding nuances is key to understanding the world and thus vital to be able to influence events.

Jumping from "US not willing to help India 100%" to "US planning attacks against India" :roll: smacks of a "Kuffar are evil" or "Hindus are bad" type "analysis" that we hear from TSPians.

Seriously, if you were a computer program, the "Error catcher" would have flagged the program the moment a conclusion like "Hamid Gul is pro-India" :lol: is reached.

What a waste of bandwidth! :roll:

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:30

Rangudu wrote:
Raju wrote:Superpower itself is planning the attacks against India and ISI-agents are just executing it like obedient lapdogs.
...TSPA is being used as a cats-paw by unkil.


Thank you for making my point about your cussed obsession. Is there a shred of evidence to support this "Zaid Hamid" type blather?

:


ofcourse ! After every terror attack against India is successfully executed TSPA is gifted new F-16s, Missiles, Cobra's by unkil.

Look at not what they talk .. look at what they do.

& here comes the reward for 26/11 .. US$15 billion for Pakistan.
Incumbant Vice-President himself is coming with the good news.

Biden to visit Pakistan on fact-finding mission

WASHINGTON: The United States’ vice president-elect is expected to visit the South-Asian region on a week-long fact-finding trip. Mr Joseph R. Biden is expected to arrive in Islamabad on Friday with a bipartisan delegation of the US Senate. They are also expected to visit Afghanistan and possibly Iraq.

India is not known to be on their itinerary.

A statement from Mr Biden’s office said the trip was designed to help with upcoming reviews that the executive and legislative branches would be taking in coming months of US policy towards the region.

In the new set-up, the Democrats will control both the executive and legislatives branches. This places them in a unique position to redesign US policies.

The visit is particularly important for Pakistan as the new Congress will take up two major legislative measures that directly concern the country – the Biden-Lugar and ROZ bills.

One of them – the Biden-Lugar bill – can bring as much as $15 billion for Pakistan over a period of 10 years, while the other – the Reconstruction Opportunity Zones bill – would help establish specially-designated areas in Pakistan and Afghanistan that could export products to the US without any duty.

http://www.dawn.net/wps/wcm/connect/Daw ... mission-yn
Last edited by Raju on 08 Jan 2009 20:43, edited 1 time in total.

Vipul
BRF Oldie
Posts: 3727
Joined: 15 Jan 2005 03:30

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Vipul » 08 Jan 2009 20:30

How Vijay Surve aided the National Security Guard.

Shocking details of how AK-47 armed policemen were not ready to take action even when Volunteer Citizens were ready to do so.All the Policemen at Colaba Police station went underground fearing for their safety.

NSG Gaurds had to depend on and ask for water and food from local residents for 2 days and the state Govt did nothing :x

samuel
BRFite
Posts: 818
Joined: 03 Apr 2007 08:52

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby samuel » 08 Jan 2009 20:39

Who controls Hamid Gul?

ManishC
BRFite
Posts: 193
Joined: 29 Jun 2008 19:11

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby ManishC » 08 Jan 2009 20:40

narayanan wrote:If Amar Singh is as pro-"othercommunity" in UP as he is said 2 b, and given that the "other community" in UP, if Kaleem Kawaja and his buddies in the US are anything to go by, is 97% pro-TSP, why is he calling for "action against TSP"?

This does indicate desperation in TSP that yet another expensive attack brought no positive results.


Well if TSP is so desperate for war then perhaps all the :(( on this board should turn to :| atleast for the time being.
OT from this thread - Being from UP I can tell you the Muslims are mostly pro nearest Mullah and then sectarian loyalties when it comes to voting with "Saudia" figuring topmost wrt brand loyalty with TSP a fading blip. However these postulates do not apply to Islamic Republic of Azamgarh the other constituency Amar Singh had in mind with his Batla house emissions.

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:42

Samuel: Whom do u want to believe? 8)

enqyoob
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2658
Joined: 06 Jul 2008 20:25

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby enqyoob » 08 Jan 2009 20:51

The trouble with celebrating that we have "resolutely" resisted the temptation to go to war despite the maiming and killing of so many innocents, is that this sounds a lot like celebrating cowardice. Also, WHY would anyone with any sense of self-preservation in TSP WANT war with India in 2009? I just don't have an answer that makes any sense, even pakisense.

surinder
BRFite
Posts: 1417
Joined: 08 Apr 2005 06:57
Location: Badal Ki Chaaon Mein

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby surinder » 08 Jan 2009 20:53

Rangudu wrote: The obsession/compulsion leads to the former being branded as THE enemy while the latter becomes a "friend" :roll:


Well said. Inability to distinguish between a friend, foe, and bystander is mark of muddled soft thinking. We as a nation are unable to see it. As time passes by, friends slide into being bystanders, bystanders become foes, and foes then graduate to become our jallad's. We still wonder why we don't have friends.

Raju

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby Raju » 08 Jan 2009 20:56

>> We still wonder why we don't have friends.

Friends are a myth. There are no friends.

samuel
BRFite
Posts: 818
Joined: 03 Apr 2007 08:52

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby samuel » 08 Jan 2009 21:10

narayanan wrote:Samuel: Whom do u want to believe? 8)


I haven't reached that point yet. The question in my mind really is that it is clear, at least to me, that Gul has been set loose by someone who is protecting him too. And this entity is what we need to deal with and not Gul. Screw Gul, he'll shortly go the way of AQK only far less ceremoniously, but only if the nuts are turned on the person or group controlling and protecting him.

We've seen examples of this numerous times, i think. A fall guy, publicly visible, the sword always seems to hang on him, but the b*stard is smugly assured that it is welded to the post. occasionally, that turns out to be not true because of some rapid or deft manouvering. And even when that happens, the controller is no where to be found. Of course 'ISI' is all too easy an answer. We need the structure of the decision making process. it is not, in my view, disorganized or chaotic. Thus the question, who controls Gul?

S

munna
BRFite
Posts: 1394
Joined: 18 Nov 2007 05:03
Location: Pee Arr Eff's resident Constitution Compliance Strategist (Phd, with upper hand)

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby munna » 08 Jan 2009 21:13

Narayananji if we take it from the perspective of Pakisense, the TSPA wants to retore the equal equal business by showing the 2 nations as 2 quarelling school children requiring external intervention. Something suggests that a bigger hand is pressing the buttons in Baki satan and not the TSPA alone. The timing of the crisis and the itch for a fight indicate geo political factors far beyond our immediate vicinity at work.

Here is my take:
1) Obama's surge is being converted into dirge for the campaign by creating royal mess against which retribution will be limited as Indian hand is being held under implicit guarantee from chinkil.
2) Massive attempt at destroying Indian growth story by destabilizing the polity and wrecking public confidence in the government.
3) Killing a new power centre in the making (India).
4) Discrediting the governance mechanisms and armed forces to establish only one policeman in th region.
5) Baki satan has the BACKING of some one and is using it to the hilt. I can only say that MM Singh and P M know much more than all of us combined let us hope for the best.

Finally Baki satan exists not for their own sake but to ruin India and this war for them is the last chance at making India regress to a 3rd world stagnant economy. They do not care for themselves as backed by a power and high on nuke nasha they are behaving like somalian pirate high on khat.

ManishC
BRFite
Posts: 193
Joined: 29 Jun 2008 19:11

Re: Terror Attacks in Mumbai - IV

Postby ManishC » 08 Jan 2009 21:26

narayanan wrote:The trouble with celebrating that we have "resolutely" resisted the temptation to go to war despite the maiming and killing of so many innocents, is that this sounds a lot like celebrating cowardice. Also, WHY would anyone with any sense of self-preservation in TSP WANT war with India in 2009? I just don't have an answer that makes any sense, even pakisense.

If the ISI proxy does actually pull the plug on UPA in short order it might also mean TSP knows a jhapad is coming and wants the guvermand reduced to a minority ASAP and premept such eventuality.
Very chankian :-?


Return to “Terrorism Archive”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests