Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

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ramana
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by ramana »

There is a strong possibility with all those Vickers revelations that there were plots within plots and MKN was part of the plot along with MMS. Only thing is they were thinking it was a way to entice the TSP establishment while all along there was a bigger plot going on from US side.

I posted thsi on Feb., 4th, 09, in the Mumbai Terrorist attack timeline thread....
ramana wrote:If we do a timeline from when Kasab was trained onwards what we find is that TSP had readied a terrorist squad to attack India from the sea some time back say 1-2years. Looking at which areas are accessible Mumbai was the prime target for such an attack. There were sporadic warnings from US and own intel agencies but nothing clear cut. At same time GOI was doing its own thing by ensuring SIM cards are sold to dubious characters to get a chance to eavesdrop on terror networks. Sort of low budget electronic surveillance. Somewhere in mid September there were definite warnings to India. Maybe India thought they could trap them by appearing careless. Somehow the TSP wised up decided not carry through the attack at that time. Might even have shelved it. Then there were a series of events that gave them hope that if they created a mess the US would intervene- the troop situation in Afghanistan, the Pakibanization of FATA, the US pressure to do more, the Obama interview on kashmir, the Reidel and Ahmed Rashid article on Kashmir etc. So they went ahead with the Nov attack.

The MKN types got blind sided when they got new warnings for they thought it was another case of boy crying wolf. So he did nothing except warn the Navy to chase some ghost fishing boats. He should have activated the defences in depth incase the NAvy didnt get them. The ATS was busy trying to fix Hindu terrorism charges under Pawar's guy R.R. Patil. The guests at Taj complained of the security being too much for their revelry for Thanksgiving. And all that led to increasing the casualties of the terrorists attack. The CST attack in which Kasab took part was one of the unfortunate turn of events but gave the chance for Mumbai police to redeem their honor.

The TSP aims were: unify their sorry divided nation due to external threat, move troops to the Indian border and let the jihadis a free rein in the Pakiban areas, get more aid from US as pro quid quo for bringing back the troops to the West, force US to pressure India on Kashmir, show India down and boost morale of their sorry jihadis and forces.

One reason why the US keeps telling of how it warned GOI is its does not want to lose the goodwill among Indian people despite its support to TSP and stopping Indian govt from retaliation. A hidden motive could be they want a clash between the two and claim flash point and try to carve a role for themselves.


Indian govt was caught off guard and is on quick march to retrieve its credibility but by its own actions has limited its options. A lot of gaps built up in the last few years have shown up- intel, police, counter terrorist actions, equipment, Army readiness, Cabinet crisis response, MMS heart attack requiring bypass eventually etc.

In all the hungama a hazy picture is emerging of what is possible and is for a future post.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by John Snow »

Unkil has strage ways

TSP was prepared with equipment, training from unkils man power ( as is being done as we speak )
India was tipped
Leaders slept
People wept
Unkil Laughed
TSP rejoiced

Om jaya jagadish Swami (MK) Narayan

Mai moorakh

Thoo Rakshak....

Mangalam
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Atri »

Who recorded this conversation and provided to India? was it Indian intelligence agency OR CIA? Was this recording happening real-time. OR did we receive the conversation after the incident was over? If it was real time was Army listening to instructions being given to the terrorists in action, and did they OR did they not utilize that information to set up decoys and neutralize the edge?

If army was listening to this live then perhaps Pakis knew that they are being taped, yet they chose to continue.. This shows how audacious they have become and that they need some big-time ass-spanking. Don't we have system to track down the location of the call which is being tapped by us?

We could have launched the air strikes and/or missile attacks on the probable locations in Pakistan then and there itself. If we were recording this conversation live as it was happening and were able to locate caller's position in pakistan, it was the biggest mistake and a huge loss of opportunity to launch an attack and gain an edge over TSP.

If it was such a meticulously planned operation, in all probability, TSP army must have deployed few missiles and aircrafts ready for retaliation, just in case India chose to launch surgical strikes to eliminate the handlers.

If this was being recorded by FBI guys real time, it is the biggest betrayal of Unkil that they chose to divulge this crucial piece of information after the tragedy took place and did not help India to avert it.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Muppalla »

x-posting from other forum
India’s Terror Stance Vexes Obama Amid Voter Ire at Pakistan
A less cooperative India would hamper Obama’s effort to keep Pakistan’s army focused on fighting the Taliban and other guerrillas along the Pakistan-Afghanistan border.
....

With all parties seeking votes by showing their readiness to get tough on terrorism, the biggest challenge to the Obama administration’s calls for moderation would be another attack similar to Mumbai, says Vikram Sood, a former chief of India’s main intelligence agency, the Research and Analysis Wing.

In such a case, “India would have to make at least a symbolic strike” on Pakistani targets, Sood said in an interview. In such a case, Clinton “should go to Islamabad and tell them to quietly take what’s coming.”
UPA/Congress may want to do a symbolic strike at TSP before the election to take the wind out of BJP's campaign. There was also a news item about Sonia asking her partymen to prepare for countering the terror campaign. Will Uncle and TSP help?
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

>>Israeli diplomat based in the US via a (Indian??) translator.

The translator was a certain Mr. Vishwanath, a Mumbai-born Indian Jew, now based in New York.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by John Snow »

JEM garu what does your Crystal ball say about the action being contemplated towards TSP.
Hope you have watched GPS Fareed Zakaria and Imran Khan in intimate talk yesterday?
TIA
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by archan »

Have been surfing channels on idesitv but all the new channels are just going berserk with the Oscars. So lame. Did someone record the news report?
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Bhaskar »

If you are talking about the Pakistani handlers and all,
here is part of the video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJtTf7r01zg
I got the next link from the video's text .

Rest can be found here - http://indiatoday.intoday.in/index.php? ... ype=video#
Our media considers Oscars given to Slumdog Millionaire bigger than 26/11, our media is just pathetic... :eek: :eek:
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Atri »

May be just a conspiracy theory.. But here it is.

Did they choose to release this newsbite today when oscars were given to Slumdog? Is the oscars just a cover-up to increase the popularity of US amongst Indians and suppress the increasing discontent among Indians? To induce the feel-good amongst Indians so that they are pacified due to their national ego being assuaged on stage of Oscars...
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Bhaskar »

the truth is that AR Rahman had been winning awards for a long time, why do Oscars and Golden Globe make all the other awards seem so small?
Rahman had been making great music since a long long time, Slumdog millionaire is certainly not his best work, not even a good work if you see Rahman's standards...
While Rahman has even been awarded the national award, the media didn't post a single news then...
When a "gora" gave us an award, we all went crazy, we all went crazy as if we won a war against pakistan... We are really dogs, atleast the people who considered the oscar awards a pride for India, an advice to all those people - go watch Taare Zameen Par and Slumdog Millionaire, under no circumstances can Slumdog Millionaire come even close to TZP. Oh wait, TZP didn't win oscars because it doesn't show India full of rapists, druglords, gangsters, fanatic hindus, women traffickers, po*nkings and child abusers. Lets face it, the image that every westerner has of india is that it is full of rapists, druglords, gangsters, fanatic hindus, women traffickers, po*n kings and child abusers.
Our media is just pathetic, the TOI page is full of Oscar news, more news is published about the oscars than compared with news of 26/11 on 27th November 2008.

But, lets get back to the topic, before the admins get mad... and I apologize for going off-topic...
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by sum »

JE Menon wrote:>>Israeli diplomat based in the US via a (Indian??) translator.

The translator was a certain Mr. Vishwanath, a Mumbai-born Indian Jew, now based in New York.
Thanks for the info, JEM-avare.

I somehow seemed to have missed the earlier news of the terrorists having negotiated with the Israelis and came to know of it only after listening to the tapes.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by archan »

Lets face it, the image that every westerner has of india is that it is full of rapists, druglords, gangsters, fanatic hindus, women traffickers, po*n kings and child abusers.
No. This is simply a lie. Sorry. And please, this thread is about an issue way more important than some oscar, some SDM, some inferiority complexes. Kindly keep the discussion on oscar etc. in nukkad.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Rangudu »

Wow! I recently talked to a female colleague who was just recently in India and saw all its poverty and such and came away with an overwhelmingly positive opinion of our desh. I can't decide if I should :evil: or :lol: at the above characterization.

Anyway, this is not the thread for such stuff.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Bhaskar »

Pak to get voice recordings from India... I wonder if it will ask Kasab next...?
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Pak- ... 180627.cms
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by AdityaM »

Farcical comedy at its pathetic best!
What all is TSP investigating on UPAs behalf?
Furthermore, clarification has been sought from India about the contacts between a diamond merchant firm in Surat and some Hindus in Pakistan. The diamond firm is alleged to be the sponsor of the Malegaon blast through Lieutenant Colonel Purohit
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by shyamd »

Handing over tapes, means handing over knowledge on our tech and capabilities. I hope this decision was well thought out. Why don't we just hand it over to an independent authority, to do the forensic analysis, that way we could protect our techniques.
Raju

Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Raju »

handing over tapes is not a big deal since the conversations took place on ordinary GSM phones and not any satellite or VoIP phones.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

>>I hope this decision was well thought out.

Relax guys... once we get going (and that is usually the problem, to get going), the attention to detail etc is almost of paranoid proportions...
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Pranay »

http://www.outlookindia.com/full.asp?fo ... tics&sid=4

Jaswant Singh on 26/11 etc...

Do you think the UPA government has handled the aftermath of Mumbai 26/11 competently enough?

Don’t ask me to make judgements. The other aspect of 26/11 was that for 70 hours the country was brought to a standstill and all decision-making came to a stop. The problem arises when the political leadership abandons responsibility and leans on a foreign power to do its job.
Yet Pakistan has cooperated...

For two months Pakistan mocked India’s concerns. It was galling. Then within 48 hours of US special envoy Richard Holbrooke’s visit, Pakistan conceded that its citizens were involved in 26/11. It was a charade and it would be a great error on our part to put it on the credit side for India.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Bhaskar »

India’s Terror Stance Vexes Obama Amid Voter Ire at Pakistan
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... refer=home
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

Spinster saar,

In my version of BRF hot air, there are a number of things to take into account when looking at the situation:

Government does not like to act in haste. Generally the system is incapable of it and specifically government prefers to act as it is normally inclined - i.e. to let all other options play out. Violent confrontation is really the last resort. Some might consider this a weakness. Government does not mind much. So it will take its time.

I think everybody will agree that the official statements from GOI have been tougher than has been the norm, one would even say crudely but deservedly blunt in some cases. However, given the magnitude of the terrorist strike and the exact nature of it – in particular the hands-on role played by the Pakistani military, whether serving or retired – there is a consensus that a redline has been breached, it seems to me, and that statements alone will not do. Public opinion is agitated, but not to the extent that reflexive action is overwhelmingly demanded.

Next to watch is the information management. A steady stream of leaks and calibrated statements have occurred which has kept this thing in the public eye. One might say it is to optimise posturing ahead of the elections, but it is more likely that politicians understand that such a thing can be a double-edged sword. So it does not seem to be primarily aimed at electoral considerations. Nevertheless, for instance, the 7-hour tape leak is not likely to have just happened only because one journalist had good contacts somewhere in the intelligence bureaucracy. There clearly was intent to share.

These are just some examples, and of course in parallel the engagement with Pakistan government (Zardari + the military’s new monkey Gilani) is going on. I personally would not take seriously the argument that the military was “not ready”. Maybe a certain set of results were required by government, and the military said in that case you must give us time to prepare for and produce that outcome. Even that is unlikely IMHO, but possible.

India can be a very hard state when it comes to certain issues, although we are a soft state in general and government can be indecisive or slow to make up its mind. Soft conduct for the most part does not mean an inability to act hard, however – and we have been unbending on certain issues considered critical. Our model is fairly effective for our circumstances and well within the limits of our power, perhaps some might say too much within the limits. Still, in future, other countries may find that our way of doing things it is effective for them as well – if they are prepared to take the long view.

It appears that government has a certain set of deliverables expected from Pakistan and the message has been conveyed. If those deliverables are not forthcoming, speaking very generally, we can expect that the internal situation in Pakistan will get very messy – not that it needs a lot of help, but some gentle nudges here and there won’t hurt at all. No one will stand up and acknowledge anything. But the game that Pakistan is playing is not new, and not one that we cannot play. Perhaps even play better. It may be argued that government does not have the balls for it. My personal view is that it does.

In short, India will extract a price from Pakistan for this perfidy. Rest assured. It may not be in the manner we want, i.e. not a crushing and visibly violent victory of some kind, but it will come and it will be sufficiently satisfying. Other governments are well aware that we can be stubborn mofos once a point of no return is reached, or they should be by now. Some consideration will be given to the interests of third parties, but it will not have a determining effect on whatever we choose to do. Therefore, it is in their interests to take whatever action is required to ensure that these deliverables are forthcoming. Clearly, such action is being taken – although on BR many of our members may not see it in quite those terms.

Can it all go pear-shaped? Certainly, it can. But then we can be quite confident that our Arab wannabe neighbor with a central asian dick up its rear will present us with another opportunity. The idiots who pass for strategists in their country will surely think up some other shenanigan, kill a few hundred more and tell the fools who look up to them that they have struck yet another blow for Islam…

One way or the other, they will not let our desire for vengeance go unsated.

(I wish I had the time to do an analysis of the government response and statements since 26/11. People often confuse media and expert comment or speculation with government position, and the situation is not helped by the press which tries to twist the language in such a way that often the difference is hardly discernible).

PS - I missed Imran on GPS.

PPS - Pls don't go only by what you see in the press on government officials. It can safely be assumed that the moral integrity of media people is no more or less than that of politicians or bureaucrats. There are serving people being badly maligned on BRF who are not unaware of it and are unable to defend themselves publicly. They may not deserve it.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Abhijeet »

JEM, do you have a prediction for when a response that is satisfactory in some visible way will be delivered? Do you think the GOI is pushing for some visible victory (however small) before the elections?
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by shyamd »

Raju wrote:handing over tapes is not a big deal since the conversations took place on ordinary GSM phones and not any satellite or VoIP phones.
True. But weren't the sims fitted with some VoIP chip and the actual calls were being made through VoIP?
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Tilak »

Govt quietly drops plans for NSA-led taskforce
22 Feb 2009, 0046 hrs IST, Vishwa Mohan, TNN
NEW DELHI: Prime Minister Manmohan Singh's proposal to have a task force under national security advisor M K Narayanan for bringing a 100-day plan to address emerging security challenges has been quietly dropped.

Though all his suggestions which were to be taken up for consideration under the task force are being followed by the home ministry, the way it is being done is different from what he had proposed during his address to police chiefs in a conference on November 23 last year — an indication of Narayanan's declining stock post 26/11.

Instead of having such an NSA-led task force, the home ministry has been working on both short-term and long-term plans where, in the changed scenario post-Mumbai terror attack, it is home minister P Chidambaram who has been at the helm of affairs with Narayanan only playing second fiddle.

Confirming that the task force has not been constituted, PM's media advisor Deepak Sandhu said: "The plan was slightly altered in the changed circumstances after the Mumbai terror attack. Both the home minister and the NSA have been jointly working on what the PM had suggested. Both of them are meeting on a daily basis to discuss crucial issues."

Manmohan Singh, while addressing the police chiefs, had suggested setting up of the task force which could initiate "a 100-day plan to develop an integrated capability" to address emerging challenges in areas such as terrorism, naxalism and insurgency.

He had said: "The task force could be chaired by the NSA with suitable representation from the central and state agencies."

The proposal was, however, dropped when Chidambaram took over as the home minister post 26/11. One of the first decisions Chidambaram took after taking over as home minister was to ask Narayanan and the RAW chief to be present in North Block during the daily intelligence briefing against the earlier practice of only IB director briefing the home minister.

A number of measures have also been taken in the past over two months to strengthen the security set up and improve the response mechanism. These include operationalisation of the Multi Agency Centre (MAC) which has now been working on a 24X7 basis as the nodal centre for all intelligence relating to terrorism — on the lines of what the PM had suggested about developing a net-centric information command structure.

Besides, the home ministry has also set up a Standing Committee of state directors general of police — as suggested by PM — to advise the government on police and police-related legal matters. This institutional mechanism under the home secretary comprises five state DGPs — Maharashtra, Andhra Pradesh, Karnataka, Gujarat and Uttar Pradesh — who will be taken on board in rotation for facilitating regular consultations between the states and the Centre on security matters.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by John Snow »

JEM Saar ,Thanks for a ringing endorsement of GOI, I also got an optimistic sense from your post in the very very long run GOI will wake up and act, especially protect its people from terror , ok if that is too much expect, atleast a token response will ensue.

This is all for GOI , but disappoint from you post stems from the fact that you have not even tangentially touched upon what is that this GOI and its able NSA veteran Anantha Sayanam MK Narayanan going to do?

It is the third monthly shradha for the heroes and civilians killed in Mumbai Massacre this week. I don’t see any encouraging signs do you other than bhashan after bhashan and pouring expressing of gratitude for unkil having allegedly leaning on TSP. Is this super MKN and his boss MMS envision to be India?

Spinster used to lamblast Jasso Mithaiwala, but our NSA Ananthasayanam MK Narayanan turned out to be super Chai Biscootwala .

“There are serving people being badly maligned on BRF who are not unaware of it and are unable to defend themselves publicly. They may not deserve it.”

No they don’t have to defend themselves, they are paid to defend the Nation and Indian citizens. If anybody were to be in his shoes he would have quit else heads would have rolled.

Sorry for the delay in rejoinder, needless to say you and I have to work for Chai Biscoot unlike our NSA :mrgreen:
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by ramana »

The Indian babucracy hasa severe way of dealing with failure. MKN is walking dead or "jivaa shavam". He wont do anything but go thru the motions. Sure they wont fire him or anything but even the peon wont pass him the chai!
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

Similar criticism was made of Brajesh Mishra as well - an excellent NSA imho, and a patriot to the core. The story posted by Tilak is interesting. Read what has actually happened. One there is opinion "an indication of Narayanan's declining stock post 26/11" and "Narayanan only playing second fiddle"...

Then, there is fact: "Both the home minister and the NSA have been jointly working on what the PM had suggested. Both of them are meeting on a daily basis" (I don't know about daily, but anyways)... and "One of the first decisions Chidambaram took after taking over as home minister was to ask Narayanan and the RAW chief to be present in North Block during the daily intelligence briefing"

MKN was one of the first to offer to quit. The offer was refused. Many interpretations have been made about the reason for this... focused mainly on political reasons.

If you go back to pre-26/11 you will find that his take on Pakistan is not very different from BRF and stated in quite undiplomatic terms. Remember that the role of NSA is just that. The NSA has no power to force implementation within our system.

In any case, our problem is not primarily with individuals - although certainly there are exceptions, and one head that rolled at least was well worth it. Our problem is institutional lethargy, lack of an overall sense of urgency with regard to anything. But things are moving ahead, a bit faster :) ...

More later when I can...

SHODA (Standard Hot Air Disclaimers Apply)
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

>>JEM, do you have a prediction for when a response that is satisfactory in some visible way will be delivered?

No...I'm not well enough informed.

>>Do you think the GOI is pushing for some visible victory (however small) before the elections?

I have no primary sources. My hot air is only from what I read in open source. I don't think either party wants to touch this issue with a bargepole - at least not in any meaningful way. Both have skeletons. Neither is perfect, and neither wants to commit. Politics as usual. There will some rhetoric.

BTW, observe the reactions of the head honchos of the BJP to the way UPA. Very reasonable, all considered. Not beyond acceptable boundaries, i.e. par for the course politix.

We are stable boys and girls. Watch Slumdog :twisted:
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Sanku »

JE Menon wrote: BTW, observe the reactions of the head honchos of the BJP to the way UPA. Very reasonable, all considered. Not beyond acceptable boundaries, i.e. par for the course politix.
:
Actually thats the only thing I am watching carefully -- and despite all the piranha and aquarium stuff happening -- this is where BJP is being soft on the govt. very soft. Much softer than the nuke deal.

This is my only flickering candle of hope in the turbulent times.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Raja Ram »

Snowji,

There is an ancient tamizh saying that comes to mind "Arasan andrey kollvan, deivam nindru kollum" - meaning "The King will kill on the same day, God will wait and kill". I am reminded of that saying. The GOI is godly in its behaviour? :-? :mrgreen:

JEM,

I too feel that this time that there is tremendous amount of preparation going on and there will be retribution. This is like 71. The wait is exasperating for all concerned. But there is something going on and the increasing desperation of Pakistan is no accident. There are already some jhapads outside of public view that has been delivered and I believe that the US/West who have interceded on the behalf of the "civilian" administration of pakistan are given a last chance to deliver.

But let us also be clear about somethings. The final retribution against pakistan may or may not be an all out war. This will be an irregular warfare fought across multiple theatres. I think the GOI is preparing for this. Be that as it may.

What is indeed lacking is a clear and public articulation of what we want from Pakistan and what will happen if this is not done by them. There has to be a clear timeline and a set of actions that will be activated when there is no compliance. This is not there.

What is also lacking is a sense of independence of thought and reliance on others to do the job. The GOI should clearly and unambigously state that we are not bothered about what the world thinks about pakistan and its role. It is really disturbing to see how the GOI is trying to accommodate every possible senstivity and request from the US/West and other allies. Such outsourcing of taking retribution is galling to say the least.

The present administration stands guilty of the above. It has not demonstrated the leadership and statesmanship that was required. The Indian public and polity would have rallied around the government despite its other shortcomings if they had taken the fight to Pakistan. They have lost credibility and opportunity because of this.

Hopefully your optimism will come through. I am still waiting.

Just my ramble. Take it for what it is worth
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by JE Menon »

>>It has not demonstrated the leadership and statesmanship that was required. The Indian public and polity would have rallied around the government despite its other shortcomings if they had taken the fight to Pakistan. They have lost credibility and opportunity because of this.

I agree, but I am not complaining much as I would have no problem with a change in government right about now. The silly psychofancy of the Congresswallas is something I find disgustingly repulsive. On the other hand, not that much room for optimism on the other side either. Still...

>>Hopefully your optimism will come through. I am still waiting.

So am I boss.

But I am quite confident that my view is not wholly off the mark.

BTW guys new footage of the ISI's homeboys inside the Taj was released yesterday, don't know if someone posted a youtube link or something. Its in colour, guys wandering around casually with towels draped over their shoulders. One guy with baseball cap turned back to front (like your regular young guy perhaps out for some nookie with his GF). Amazingly relaxed.

So there is clearly some effort to keep public's mind on the matter.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Dilbu »

Chargesheet filed in Mumbai terror attacks
Three months after the unprecedented terror attack in Mumbai, a voluminous chargesheet was filed on Wednesday naming 38 people including
Pakistani nationals Mohammed Ajmal Amir Kasab and suspected mastermind Zaki-ur-Rehman Lakhvi for crimes ranging from murder to waging war against the country.

Indian nationals Fahim Ansari and Sabbauddin Ahmed, arrested in the case for allegedly carrying out a recee of the targets for the attacks, have been named in the chargesheet. They were produced in the court on Wednesday, PTI reported.
The 11,500-page chargesheet :shock: was filed in the Esplanade court but Kasab, the lone surviving terrorist, was not produced before the court owing to security reasons, PTI report says.
ramana
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by ramana »

If they throw the charge sheet at him it will kill him!

Death by chargesheet.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Sachin »

ramana wrote:Death by chargesheet.
One charge against Kasab is that he trespassed into a Railway Station without a valid ticket (platform ticket or journey ticket) :lol:. This charge if proven gets a maximum prison sentence of 6 months.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by John Snow »

Causing commotion and disturbence of peace is the highest charges that can be established rest all are encounter killings according WKK and PCUL layers and jethmalani.

(Note that kasab is living, but jethmalini will argue he is emotinally dead!)
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by sum »

There are already some jhapads outside of public view that has been delivered and I believe that the US/West who have interceded on the behalf of the "civilian" administration of pakistan are given a last chance to deliver.
Any idea on what these "jhapads outside publice view" were?
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Ananth »

Abhijeet wrote:JEM, do you have a prediction for when a response that is satisfactory in some visible way will be delivered? Do you think the GOI is pushing for some visible victory (however small) before the elections?
By demanding a visible response from GoI we are unnecessarily constraining its response options. Why should response be "shock-n-awe"? So that every one can see on TV, enjoying pop corn? Why should the response be conventional? There is no point slapping a Paki when he is expecting it. It is better to cut his legs, which he might not be expecting.

The problem with GoI is that if it were to further make the Pakis stew in their own juices, the _approach_ does not have the necessary "oomp" factor and we jingos get disappointed by that. But there is a valid critiscism in what Umrao jaan is stating. Based on present posture of Pranbda and company one cannot say whether they are busy with chai-biscuit or whether they are screwing the TSP establishment. Also the past record of last 5 years does not help in that regard.

Since 26/11, TSP's stock in the world has gone down to such an extent that pandas themselves have no confidence in extracting the principle lend to them. Their Saudi overlords are also preferring to keep their dhirams in their sand castles rather than use that to purchase more Paki slaves. TSPA has just had to face a defeat in their own country and its own stock has gone down in the eyes of its people. These are tangible gains. But are these gains due to some strategy of dilli billies or they were to happen by default? Did Bhisma pitamahs already foresaw the Swat surrender or they are just as clueless as us? I don't know.

The reason why the itch is becoming irresistible to scratch is that the perpetrators of 26/11 are still at large. There is no evidence that their capabilities to replay has diminished to any extent.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by John Snow »

Hve you not heard the slogan ( for Sprite)

Image is everything!

Sometimes overt action is required this was the time and we missed the boat, so no amount of spin can mask the reality.
Last edited by John Snow on 26 Feb 2009 01:15, edited 1 time in total.
ramana
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by ramana »

In addition, TSPA needs an overt jhapad to bring about a realignment of forces inside TSP. Its not a modern thought but is essential keeping in view the mind set of the TSPA. All US moves are to preserve the institutional image and standing of TSPA vis a vis TSP.
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Re: Indian Non-response to Terrorism after Mumbai

Post by Anujan »

ramana wrote:In addition, TSPA needs an overt jhapad to bring about a realignment of forces inside TSP. Its not a modern thought but is essential keeping in view the mind set of the TSPA. All US moves are to preserve the institutional image and standing of TSPA vis a vis TSP.
A Jhapad need not be just bombs. It has been established that our political class is incapable of decisive action, so we should choose actions that suit our personality. A concerted effort needs to be undertaken to portray Paki civvies as incorrigible liars and Paki army as duplicitous ba*tards who are after Unkil's money and play a double game.

The various statements of Zardari and Gilani denouncing that Kasab is Pakistani, Gilani going on national TV alleging that Indians due to "domestic compulsions" have blamed pakistan, The ISI chief calling Baitullah a "patriot" for offering to fight against India, Durrani’s Firing all needs to be presented in a slick article or program in MSM. Get someone to write a bestseller about Mumbai affair, stick all this into the book. Any shred of credibility for the pakis should be utterly destroyed.
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