Military Flight Safety

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 01 Feb 2012 21:09

^^ Flying Instructor's School, this is where Instructors are trained. More here http://indianairforce.nic.in/show_page.php?pg_id=140

Pratik_S · Post by **Pratik_S** » 09 Feb 2012 10:15

Indian Military Aviation Flight Safety Report – 2011

rajkumar · Post by **rajkumar** » 23 Feb 2012 17:15

http://tkstales.wordpress.com/2011/11/0 ... rthigeyan/

Read the above about the investigation process in the IAF. Wonderful read

Nikhil T · Post by **Nikhil T** » 24 Feb 2012 13:28

Breaking: IAF Mirage crashes in MP, both pilots eject safely.

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 24 Feb 2012 13:39

damn it, the one thread that i dont want to see surface surfaces again. Thank god the pilots are safe. Pray they are no casualties on the ground

SagarAg · Post by **SagarAg** » 24 Feb 2012 14:24

Dang!!
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/mirag ... fe/916206/

A Mirage 2000 fighter aircraft of the Indian Air Force (IAF) on Friday crashed near Bhind in Madhya Pradesh soon after taking off from an air base in Gwalior but both the pilots managed to eject.

The Mirage 2000 aircraft was on a routine training sortie when it developed a snag in the engine and crashed near Bhind district, an IAF spokesperson said.

He said the two pilots in the aircraft had managed to eject and search and rescue operations have been launched to locate them.

The IAF has ordered a court of inquiry (CoI) to ascertain the reasons behind the crash.

The Air Force operates a fleet of 51 Mirage aircraft from the Maharajpura air base in Gwalior.

These aircraft started getting inducted into the IAF in the mid-80s and have had a very good flight safety record, the spokesperson said.

The IAF has also recently signed two deals worth over $ 3.2 billion for upgrading the capabilities of the Mirage 2000 with French companies Dassault, Thales and MBDA.

This is the second crash involving an IAF aircraft this year. A Kiran MK II trainer plane had crashed in Chennai on January 30.

In this financial year, this is the eighth crash of a fighter aircraft of which most were from the MiG 21 series.

Update:

Update on the Mirage crash:
The two missing pilots have been found. Wing Commander Ram Kumar and co-pilot Air Marshal Anil Chopra ejected safely. The aircraft crashed near Bhind in MP.

Thanks God

pilots are safe. But still whaat is going on. Its like taking turns: su 30-->jaguar-->mig 29-->mirage ??

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 24 Feb 2012 14:39

SagarAg wrote:

The two missing pilots have been found. Wing Commander Ram Kumar and co-pilot Air Marshal Anil Chopra ejected safely. The aircraft crashed near Bhind in MP.

Air MARSHAL????

SagarAg · Post by **SagarAg** » 24 Feb 2012 14:45

^^ Got it from rediff LIVE feeds. Can't comment on its authenticity. I myself was also shocked seeing it.

Here is the link:
http://news.rediff.com/commentary/2012/ ... tes.htm?36
Check the feed at 14:01.

Here is a little info on him by Tarmak007:
http://tarmak007.blogspot.com/2010/06/a ... o-sac.html
and at BR database:
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Database/13368

ASPuar · Post by **ASPuar** » 24 Feb 2012 14:48

Hooo boy.... some heads are gonna ROLL!

Like this:

rajeshks · Post by **rajeshks** » 24 Feb 2012 15:30

ASPuar wrote:Hooo boy.... some heads are gonna ROLL!

Like this:

Will this ejection affect his medical category and there by career/promotions?

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 24 Feb 2012 18:35

rajeshks wrote:[

Will this ejection affect his medical category and there by career/promotions?

Not at this advanced stage of his career - but thats a pretty senior rank to eject.. cant think of any earlier

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 24 Feb 2012 19:34

ASPuar wrote:Hooo boy.... some heads are gonna ROLL!

Like this:

Why? It's not funny is it?

Ganesh_S · Post by **Ganesh_S** » 24 Feb 2012 20:07

It might be useful to know if the variety of aircrafts IAF operates has any implications on crash rates. perhaps there might be a concern for maintanaince infrastructure in the sense that valuable inputs following a crash investigation may not be effectively applied across different types of aircrafts.

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 25 Feb 2012 02:25

One more story from Hindu

Mirage 2000 crash in MP

Cain Marko · Post by **Cain Marko** » 25 Feb 2012 03:02

Good thing the pilots (and they are seniors too) are safe. Now this makes me wonder, and I've always sort of thought - the Mirage 2000 engines (M53-p2?) are getting rather old - are they also going to be upgraded in the upgrade deal? Can engines have such long lives or are new replacements being considered?

VikramS · Post by **VikramS** » 25 Feb 2012 03:51

AM Chopra is going to be turning 60 soon. I do wonder why was he was flying a fighter...

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 25 Feb 2012 04:37

Cain Marko wrote:Good thing the pilots (and they are seniors too) are safe. Now this makes me wonder, and I've always sort of thought - the Mirage 2000 engines (M53-p2?) are getting rather old - are they also going to be upgraded in the upgrade deal? Can engines have such long lives or are new replacements being considered?

The current upgrade deal does not deal with the engines AFAIK. I was wondering about it too. The Mig-29s were bought around the same time and they are getting their engines replaced.

SagarAg · Post by **SagarAg** » 25 Feb 2012 05:54

VikramS wrote:AM Chopra is going to be turning 60 soon. I do wonder why was he was flying a fighter...

Vikram ji check the news feed by Ramana Saar:

Being the commandant of the squadron, it is a tradition to fly a sortie when on a visit as a morale booster,” a senior IAF officer said.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 25 Feb 2012 07:57

ramana wrote:One more story from Hindu

Mirage 2000 crash in MP

IAF officials said that it was for the first time that a Mirage 2000 suffered engine failure since the induction of the aircraft

This is not true. One was lost during an exercise with Singaporean air-force. I think that was engine failure too.

Prem Kumar · Post by **Prem Kumar** » 28 Feb 2012 00:03

Read this

They were picked up by a SAR helicopter shortly thereafter and transferred to the military hospital in Gwalior.

from

http://www.livefist.blogspot.com/2012/0 ... oomed.html

There was so much R&Dh over why our SAR equipped aircraft are incapable of picking up wreckages in the Himalayas or YSR's helicopter. Well - here is one success & a crucial one at that (the pilots needed to be found fairly quickly in case they were injured).

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 28 Feb 2012 01:19

^^This SAR stands for "Search and Rescue" not "Synthetic Aperture Radar".

parshuram · Post by **parshuram** » 05 Mar 2012 13:51

NDTV reporting crash of Mirage 2000 in Rajasthan ...

Link

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 05 Mar 2012 13:53

Yes, parshuram ji. Shiv says fleet grounded on his livefist twitter feed.

IAF grounds entire Mirage 2000 fighter fleet pending investigation into the two crashes on Feb 25 and today. Standard procedure.

Now, what are we left with - 49 mirages?

suryag · Post by **suryag** » 05 Mar 2012 14:00

Praying for pilot

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 05 Mar 2012 14:04

suryag wrote:Praying for pilot

suryag ji,

The pilot(s) are reported to have ejected safely.

IAF Mirage Crashes, 2nd in 2 Weeks

Nikhil T · Post by **Nikhil T** » 05 Mar 2012 14:04

suryag wrote:Praying for pilot

Ejected safely.

Mirage 2000 crashes

Roperia · Post by **Roperia** » 05 Mar 2012 14:07

IAF Mirage-2000 that crashed today was a trainer too. Engine flame-out at 16,000 feet. Both pilots eject safely.

livefist twitter feed.

Engine problem!

Nihat · Post by **Nihat** » 05 Mar 2012 14:13

Hope the pilots are safe, even ejections are known to cause health problems.

haryanvi · Post by **haryanvi** » 05 Mar 2012 15:02

Any idea if the Mirage upgrade cost will come down given that now only 49 planes have to be upgraded instead of 51?

Aditya_V · Post by **Aditya_V** » 05 Mar 2012 15:21

Good to hear Pilots are safe, I hope they are without injuries, as ejection injuries can be very serious.

ON anther note I think these crashes might mean some more Rafales ordered.

chackojoseph · Post by **chackojoseph** » 05 Mar 2012 16:03

Another IAF Mirage-2000 Crashed in Rajasthan, Pilot Safe

More info.

SagarAg · Post by **SagarAg** » 05 Mar 2012 16:53

Thanks God Pilot(s) are safe.

Chacko ji you are saying it was a single seater. On twitter feed Shiv has given names of two pilots who ejected safely

anand_sankar · Post by **anand_sankar** » 05 Mar 2012 17:22

We've been lucky the engines have cut-out in what looks like level flight at a safe altitude. Things could have been a lot worse if it happened during low-level flying or air combat exercises.

The pilots have had time to plan the ejection, that in itself reduces the risk of serious injury by a large extent. Still, it is always risky to light a rocket under your butt!

Badar · Post by **Badar** » 05 Mar 2012 19:00

Didn't take too long ... "Mirage dubbed the new coffins"
http://chhindits.blogspot.in/2012/03/mi ... ffins.html

For once, Dassault will be desperate to do whatever it can to ensure no further crashes. Otherwise at this rate the M2K upgrade order will be getting steadily smaller.

chackojoseph · Post by **chackojoseph** » 05 Mar 2012 20:15

SagarAg wrote:Thanks God Pilot(s) are safe.
Chacko ji you are saying it was a single seater. On twitter feed Shiv has given names of two pilots who ejected safely

it is twin seat. I did the story when it was evolving. I have updated it.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » 05 Mar 2012 21:54

^^ these birds never had an issue and out of the blue they start falling due to engine problems?

And DDM started calling them flying coffin.. wow?

[OT] Spy cells in my brain tells me that before the MMRCA deal is signed people will do anything to prove that French are not worth it.

saps · Post by **saps** » 05 Mar 2012 23:33

Sincerely hope.....Hotel Alpha Lima's hand in servicing these birds is not the issue.....

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 06 Mar 2012 00:09

guys, cut out the stupid speculation already !

aircrafts malfunction and when they do they crash. fighters crash more often than civilian aircraft and old fighters crash even more. if there's a problem with HAL/IAF/[insert speculation here] it would be discovered in the CoI.

and no, this isn't the first time mirages have crashed. they had a similar spate of crashes in mid 2000's, at least one of which was due to engine malfunction. I remember a pilot named gururani died in one crash. he was the son of a retd AM. but the fact remains that we have operated the M2k for over 2 decades with a rather good safety record. kindly hold your horses before blaming all and sundry.

don't post anything just because you can.

nachiket · Post by **nachiket** » 06 Mar 2012 00:14

Badar wrote:Didn't take too long ... "Mirage dubbed the new coffins"
http://chhindits.blogspot.in/2012/03/mi ... ffins.html

Amazing! Two quick crashes was all it took. Despite the fact that no pilots were killed.

Kartik · Post by **Kartik** » 06 Mar 2012 00:20

Rahul M wrote:guys, cut out the stupid speculation already !

aircrafts malfunction and when they do they crash. fighters crash more often than civilian aircraft and old fighters crash even more. if there's a problem with HAL/IAF/[insert speculation here] it would be discovered in the CoI.

and no, this isn't the first time mirages have crashed. they had a similar spate of crashes in mid 2000's, at least one of which was due to engine malfunction. I remember a pilot named gururani died in one crash. he was the son of a retd AM. but the fact remains that we have operated the M2k for over 2 decades with a rather good safety record. kindly hold your horses before blaming all and sundry.

don't post anything just because you can.

Sqd Ldr Gururani crashed due to spatial disorientation during a night sortie, not due to engine trouble.

Now that the IAF has lost 2 Mirage-2000THs (I hope these aren't from the batch of 6 THs that were delivered to the IAF from 2003 onwards), the training of pilots on the remaining twin seaters will become even more tight and availability will definitely be affected. Perhaps the new simulators for the Mirages will help reduce some burden on the twin seaters for training, but I still do hope that whenever UAE's deal with France for the Rafales comes through, maybe India could purchase a few of their twin seaters for conversion and concurrency training.

Either that, or the IAF could buy a few of the AdlA Mirage-2000Ds primarily for replacing the twin seaters that have been lost. The older Mirage-2000Bs may have very little life left since they're due to retire in 2014.