Military Flight Safety

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Vidur
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Vidur » 30 Nov 2020 16:48

Very sad to see this. What a tragedy that such a promising officer may be lost. And so soon after his marriage.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 01 Dec 2020 01:16

https://twitter.com/ShivAroor/status/13 ... 78531?s=20 ---> Update from the Indian Navy on the fifth day of search for Commander Nishant Singh. As I reported earlier, the wreckage has been found. Naval divers doing their job now.

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andy B
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby andy B » 07 Dec 2020 17:04

Terrible news....rescue crews have located the body of Commander Nishant Singh.

I guess in some ways this was almost inevitable given 11 days had passed. Was still hoping somehow for him to be alive. May he attain moksha for he has given the ultimate sacrifice.

Manish_P
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Manish_P » 07 Dec 2020 17:17

andy B wrote:Terrible news....rescue crews have located the body of Commander Nishant Singh.

I guess in some ways this was almost inevitable given 11 days had passed. Was still hoping somehow for him to be alive. May he attain moksha for he has given the ultimate sacrifice.


His family finally gets closure.

Om Shanti.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby MeshaVishwas » 07 Dec 2020 17:44

Om shanti

manjgu
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby manjgu » 07 Dec 2020 19:01

I hope he died the moment the plane crashed... struggling in the sea is terrible. Shocked the beacon, locator is not activated automatically on contact with water? any gyan on this aspect?

JTull
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby JTull » 07 Dec 2020 19:15

This is terrible news! Did he not manage to eject?

chola
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby chola » 07 Dec 2020 20:05

andy B wrote:Terrible news....rescue crews have located the body of Commander Nishant Singh.

I guess in some ways this was almost inevitable given 11 days had passed. Was still hoping somehow for him to be alive. May he attain moksha for he has given the ultimate sacrifice.


May the good Commander rest in peace. Om shanti.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 07 Dec 2020 22:50

manjgu wrote:I hope he died the moment the plane crashed... struggling in the sea is terrible. Shocked the beacon, locator is not activated automatically on contact with water? any gyan on this aspect?

JTull wrote:This is terrible news! Did he not manage to eject?

Indeed terrible and very sad news.

He reportedly ejected. Will have to wait for the Court of Inquiry to be complete to find out what exactly happened.

The reasons for him not making it through, when his co-pilot did, is varied. Until the COI is complete, it will be pure speculation.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 07 Dec 2020 23:05

I have swapped a whole bunch of posts between the Military Flight Safety thread and the Indian Naval Aviation thread.

Going forward, I humbly request that folks follow this guideline ---->

1) Any discussion related to this particular MiG-29KUB crash or Lt Cdr Nishant Singh, please post in the Military Flight Safety thread.

2) Any discussion related to the MiG-29K/KUB fleet and future carrier borne fighter acquisitions, please post in the Indian Naval Aviation thread.

andy B
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby andy B » 07 Dec 2020 23:15

^^^

My bad saar was in bit of a rush and thought the news was important. Wilco for future reference.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 07 Dec 2020 23:53

No worries Andy Saar. Thank you for your co-operation.

Indian Navy Locates Body Of Missing MiG-29K Pilot Cdr Nishant Singh 11 Days After Crash
https://www.republicworld.com/india-new ... crash.html
07 December 2020

"Indian Navy has recovered the body of the missing MiG-29K pilot Commander Nishant Singh on the seabed 70 metres below water. It has been found 30 miles off Goa coast after extensive search. The aircraft had crashed on Nov 26 while operating over Arabian Sea," an Indian Navy official said on Monday.

chetak
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby chetak » 08 Dec 2020 10:20

The IN will only confirm the identity after a DNA test.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Cyrano » 08 Dec 2020 16:25

Sad news... Om shanti and respects to the brave commander. IN's colossal efforts to locate and retrieve the body from 70m depth are exemplary. DNA test would be a formality, though the body recovered might still be in flight uniform etc.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 13 Dec 2020 23:05

Apologies to my fellow BRFites for bringing this thread to the top. But the final closure for Commander Nishant Singh is now over. The official naval goodbye was last week. There is a saying that fighter pilots never die, they continue to soar the skies. Shano Varuna Commander! You will be missed.

https://twitter.com/Defence_Squad_/stat ... 23041?s=20 ---> MiG-29K pilot Commander Nishant Singh was laid to rest with full military honours at Goa today. Deepest condolences to his wife Nayaab and the family.

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Vivek K
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Vivek K » 14 Dec 2020 04:03

Om Shanti!

Prithwiraj
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Prithwiraj » 05 Jan 2021 23:24

IAF mig 21 crashed shortly after take off in Rajasthan. Pilot ejected safely@ Livefist

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 05 Jan 2021 23:30

oh thank goodness. I was hoping that would be the outcome. He is alive!

Rahul M
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rahul M » 05 Jan 2021 23:32

this thread man. heart always skips a beat when this is active.

anyway, good to know pilot is okay.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Bhaskar_T » 06 Jan 2021 04:07

@IAF_MCC (Official Twitter handle of IAF) - During a training sortie in the western sector, a MiG-21 Bison aircraft experienced a major technical malfunction this evening. The pilot ejected safely at about 2015 hrs. There is no loss of life. An Court of Inquiry has been ordered to ascertain the cause of the accident.

https://twitter.com/IAF_MCC/status/1346 ... 29824?s=19

Prithwiraj wrote:IAF mig 21 crashed shortly after take off in Rajasthan. Pilot ejected safely@ Livefist

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Manish_P » 06 Jan 2021 11:20

Rahul M wrote:this thread man. heart always skips a beat when this is active.

anyway, good to know pilot is okay.



Ditto. Feelings shared by all of us here.

Some times I have wondered if it would be better if there were two separate threads, one for safety related developments and another for actual incidents...

Anyway, relived for now.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Mort Walker » 06 Jan 2021 11:24

Prithwiraj wrote:IAF mig 21 crashed shortly after take off in Rajasthan. Pilot ejected safely@ Livefist


Glad pilot is fine. Hope he didn't get too beat up in the ejection. Time to recycle all those Migs to get the useful metals out and get the Tejas Mk1 and Mk1A.

LakshmanPST
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby LakshmanPST » 06 Jan 2021 15:23

Wonder whether it is Bison or someother model...

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Barath » 06 Jan 2021 17:30

I thought all the non Bison models were already retired ... https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 549_1.html

Manish_P
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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Manish_P » 06 Jan 2021 18:07

The tweet from the official IAF media center clearly mentions it as a Bison.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby LakshmanPST » 06 Jan 2021 20:43

Manish_P wrote:The tweet from the official IAF media center clearly mentions it as a Bison.


Oops... How did I miss that...??? :eek:

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby ramana » 06 Jan 2021 21:45

A July 2020 post by TKSTales on flight safety of Hunter planes:
https://tkstales.wordpress.com/2020/07/

JUL
5
Fatal Roll-Over
Posted on July 5, 2020 by tkstales
Standard
My story today is a sad one as it normally is when I talk of aircraft accidents. It is an old tale but the lessons that we can draw from this accident or rather a series of accidents is eternal.

A fatal accident took place in Bhuj. I was then the Director Flight Safety. Air Marshal Latif was the Vice Chief – my direct super-boss. Air Chief Marshal Mulgaonkar was the CAS. I was required to brief the CAS immediately of any serious accident. Chief held the DFS directly responsible for such happenings. Fortunately for me, on that day the CAS was away to Europe for a week. I reported the happening to the VCAS and went back to my office.

There was a second fatal accident in the same Squadron within the week. The nature of both the accidents were similar. In a low-level training mission in level flights the aircraft just rolled over and went into the ground . There was no call on the radio and there was no perceived reason why any pilot would crash in such a way. A high powered Court of Inquiry was ordered for the two accidents clubbed together.

A couple of days later the CAS returned. There was a hushed silence on the fifth floor of Vayu Bhawan. The Chief was angry. A little later we got called into a conference. All PSOs, ACsAs, all Directors, Joint Directors, And Deputy Directors of the Operations Branch were to attend.

As soon as we convened, we received a blast from the Chief. We were all useless – unable to perform our duties. So much so that as soon as his back was turned we had allowed two fatal accident to take place. Having had his outburst the Chief cooled down. He then looked at the Director Personnel (Officers) and gave out a series of directions. The Officer Commanding of the defaulting Squadron was to be sacked immediately. Three or four other placements were also to be done. He would issue other directions shortly.

I was confused. For the previous six or eight months, my focus was on restoring the confidence of the field staff about the top brass. Removing the CO for accidents that had not been investigated as yet would destroy organisational trust at the ground level. Fortunately, the CAS then asked whether anyone had any question. He put his finger out and pointed to each one by turn. There were no doubts. His finger point marked me last. I was in a sort of daze.

I stood up and told him that as his Director of Flight Safety it was incumbent upon me to advise him to with-hold the directions he had just given till the Court of Inquiry was complete.

There was stunned silence in the hall. The CAS got visibly upset. He looked at me and started to say something. Then he changed his mind and huffed out of the conference hall by himself without waiting for his staff to catch-up. His staff officer ran after him. All the senior staff hung around in confusion for some time. I went up to the DP(O) and asked him what his interpretation of the decision was. He told me that he would action the Chief’s directions immediately. I begged him to give me some time to react. He agreed not to issue any orders till the evening.

By now it was lunchtime, but I was not hungry. I locked myself in my room to address the CAS directly on this issue. Two or three drafts of the note that I was trying to compose had to be trashed, but I was finally ready with my note by about two-thirty. It was written in my longhand and ran to over three pages.

I took the note to the ACAS (FS&I). He read it through without a pause, crossed his address and readdressed to the VCAS. I found the VCAS alone. As I entered his room he raised his questioning eyes. I looked down to the file in my hand, and offered it without a word. The VCAS also read the note through nonstop and marked it to the CAS.

I now took the file with the note to the Chief’s office and gave it to the SO. Aggarwal, the SO, took it in and placed it on his table. I sat in the guest enclosure. And I sat there. After about an hour Aggarwal told me that the Chief had read the file and had put it aside. I continued to wait. Then, about four o’clock the CAS called me in.

Normally the Chief always asked me to sit down before he spoke to me. However, on that day he let me stand. For about fifteen minutes he spoke his heart out full of frustration. Flight Safety was his field of special interest. If the safety record was not upto his expectation he was upset. He was however a man of reason. He did not change a single letter in the note.

Out of the CAS’s office I ran to the DP(O) and gave him the file duly marked for him. The immediate problem was solved. I could now pay full attention to the CoI .


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The CoI examined the case of both the aircraft rolling while going down. Unfortunately, both aircraft had disintegrated and had burnt down. The recovered servo-dynes could not give any clue for the aircraft’s behaviour. No training or operational mistakes came to light. Thus these two aircraft also joined the list of ‘unresolved’ cases of accidents.

Once the CoI proceedings were approved I decided to launch a second level inquiry within the directorate. Files of all Hunter accidents that were unresolved or had reports of rolling while going down were segregated. Between 1962 and 1978 there were more than ten cases. Then we started investigating technical health of each of these aircraft. Slowly it emerged that a particular technical instruction regarding the hydraulic system leading to the aileron servo dynes had not been implemented. It was strange that an instruction related to the control system was on concession on all Hunters throughout the Airforce for about fifteen years without raising a stink.

We went deeper. Logistically the mod kits had been received from the UK and had been distributed to the bases. In the base, the instructions were not carried out because the kits appeared to be incomplete, some parts could not be found/identified. We could not trace any activity to rectify this logistic/technical situation.

We enlarged our enquiry to technical training. It was discovered that the manufacturer had considered this instruction to be of critical importance and had offered to train one fitter for installing this instruction. A smart Sergeant was selected and sent. He completed his training and was complimented for his performance .

On return, the SNCO was posted to a non Hunter station far away because he had spent many years in the North: the rules demanded that he must share his time in the South or East. For the next fifteen years he never worked on a Hunter.

These accidents happened off many bases and on many exercises. One happened in the East: a young lad was practising dummy dives over the airfield. In one of the dives as he rolled in, the aircraft continued to roll and went into ground. There was one off Ambala. A pilot in his early training days was practising parallel quarter attacks with his flight commander in the lead aircraft. The Flight Commander saw the aircraft turning into him but instead of reversing the turn for the attack he kept on rolling and dived into the ground from 20000 feet. Many more accidents are there that I cannot recollect details of after these forty-odd years.

We ferreted out that SNCO from his non-Hunter appointment. By then he had become a JWO. A team was formed under his leadership. The team visited all Hunter stations and installed the instructions on all aircraft.

This story stands in the calendar year of 1977 or 1978. We flew the Hunter for more than another decade thereafter. Thankfully we did not have any further incidents of uncontrolled rolling.

The story gives me shivers even now. Why did so many of us senior guys fail our juniors over fifteen years and indirectly cause so many young deaths? If any of you young tech managers go through this story now and try to find parallels in the present environment, you might find some things that you have never imagined; who knows? You might end up with the satisfaction of saving some lives from accidents that get prevented by your actions.

I shall not spell out the lessons from this story. My readers are smart. They will find the lessons for themselves.


See the through root cause analysis using defacto Fault Tree analysis to find the root cause and effective corrective actions.

Faults are buried under hence root cause.
Abhibhushan saar doesn't go there but underlying circumstances were there that led to this loss of ten aircraft to this mode of failure.
However proud of him for speaking up and the Chief for listening.

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Re: Military Flight Safety

Postby Rakesh » 07 Jan 2021 21:36

Some good news in this thread....in fact, this is amazing news in relation to that MiG-21 crash earlier this week.

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 71009?s=20 ---> IAF MiG-21 crashes in Suratgarh base.Pilot ejected safely. First MiG-21 crash since September 2019 and 2nd IAF fighter crash in past 16 months.

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 98464?s=20 ---> 2020 was the safest year in IAFs entire history with only one IAF fighter jet crash recorded.


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