The IAF History Thread

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Rakesh
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/singhshwetabh71/sta ... 24968?s=20 ---> Canberra PR.57 from No 106 Squadron of the Indian Air Force. Srinagar Air Base, mid-1980s.

https://twitter.com/zone5aviation/statu ... 85472?s=20 ---> IP990 was the Canberra hit by a Pakistani Stinger (or Anza) on 21 May 1999. Survived thanks to the long jetpipe, and recovered safely to Srinagar by Squadron Leaders Perumal and Jha. Repaired and put back into service before being lost in a crash in December 2005.

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

By Air Marshal C.V. Gole

Air Operations in Western Sector in 1971 War

I will post in the 1971 war thread also.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Manish_Sharma »

https://myind.net/Home/viewArticle/a-wi ... ration-war

A Wing Commander reminisces his experience of 1971 Bangladesh Liberation War

Apr 13, 2022
Wing Cdr C.G. Krishna

I was stationed in the Air force Base in Gorakhpur, U.P. during May 1967 - May 1970. Those three years were non-eventful, except gaining experience in preparing and arranging aircraft for Bombing and Interdictory trainings of pilots at different Air to Ground ranges. From here I was transferred to Palam air base in New Delhi. After a couple of months, things in the then East Pakistan were getting murkier and serious.

In December 1970, general elections were held in Pakistan. The National Awami League party headed by Sheikh Mujibur Rehman secured a majority of seats in Pakistan Parliament. The Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) of Zulfikar Ali Bhutto came a distant second. Instead of inviting Sheikh Mujibur Rehman from East Pakistan to form the government, President Yahya Khan arrested him and invited Z. A Bhutto to form the Government. This, naturally infuriated the Bengalis of East Pakistan. There were large scale demonstrations and agitations in East Pakistan. In order to quell this, the Pakistan Army employed draconian methods on Bengalis. Thus, the Bengalis of East Pakistan were at the receiving end of the Pakistan Army and bureaucracy. Huge influx of East Pakistani Bengalis crossed into India every day as refugees to save their lives.

The then Indian Prime Minister Indira Gandhi pleaded with all the western nations and USA to restrain the President of Pakistan and ensure peace in East Pakistan, so that India was not beset with a huge problem of population explosion especially when India was still struggling to provide for its own people in the 70s. The Indian economy was in severe distress due to this huge refugee influx. Neither USA nor the western nations did anything to stop Pakistani’s atrocities in East Pakistan.

By the middle of 1971, India had no option left but to fend for herself. Mrs Gandhi considered the military option to help Bengalis in East Pakistan. But that would be a direct war as Pakistan and the world would condemn India. So, there was no option except to wait and watch. The Indian Army also advised Mrs Gandhi to wait till monsoon was over, i.e., till November. During monsoon, Ganges and Brahmaputra rivers would be in spate and all other rivulets in East Pakistan would hinder Indian Army offensive.

Thus, the Indian Armed Forces used six months to prepare themselves for a probable war by end of 1971. Being stationed in Palam, very close to western Air Command, we were well informed about strengthening our air defenses in western border air bases. It was also realized that apart from strengthening the already established air force bases like Ambala, Jodhpur, Jamnagar etc, there was a need to upgrade the then existing air strips much closer to Pakistan Border like Sri Ganga Nagar, Nal (Bikaner), Jaisalmer and Uttarlai (Barmer). Except for one runway and skeleton staff, there were no other facilities available at these air strips. To enable them to be battle ready, many facilities are required to be established, such as refuelling stations, explosives storages, radio and navigation aids, night landing facilities, accommodation and catering needs of at least 120 personnel etc. The IndianAir Force acted at breakneck speed, to get these things organized. These airstrips had to be capable of operating at least 16 aircrafts during war.

I, being posted in Delhi at Palam, was sent to Nal (28 Kms from Bikaner), 30 Kms from Pakistan border. When I landed there in June 1971, except for one Junior Officer and 30 airmen, there was nothing else to speak of. My task was to establish and commission above mentioned technical facilities. Another officer was also sent there to establish catering and accommodation for 120 airmen. After two months of my arrival, a senior officer with two more officers arrived to relieve me and my colleague of the excess workload. We faced many hurdles and hardships to build these above mentioned facilities, especially arranging for battle ready vehicles, drivers and civil contractors who would supply materials to us.

All of a sudden, one day the then Chief Minister of Rajasthan Barkatullah Khan landed at our airstrip along with the District Collector and Superintendent of Police. We received them and took them to our operational briefing room. We explained to the Chief Minister our war preparations and in the end, we put across our difficulties regarding getting vehicles, drivers, civil contractors, among other things. The C.M. looked gravely at the Collector and S.P. and instructed them to provide complete support to us immediately. Khan acknowledged the poor conditions at our airbase and promised to visit us again after a fortnight.

Since I was also directly responsible for transportation, I visited the Collector the next day and put across our requirements. Nearly 6 jeeps, 8 trucks, 4 water tankers and one heavy duty 10 ton crane were requisitioned along with drivers. He acted immediately and sent them over to us. Their travel and daily allowances (T.A. and D.A.) were taken care of by the Collector. These drivers, mostly Sikh gentlemen, were so good that they literally became soldiers themselves! They would do all types of jobs to help us. They worked as labourers in offloading explosives, ferrying equipment from aircrafts etc. Due to all this, things were progressing well at our airbase. As promised, Barkatullah Khan visited us again after twenty days. He saw the progress of work and was satisfied.

It was a mountainous task to build a Bomb Proof Explosive storage shelter within a short span of time. Checking the inventory of explosives likes Bombs, Rockets, High Calibre Ammunition, and listing out the accessories required to make all these operational was a huge task. Even if a safety pin was missing, a bomb or rocket could not be loaded on to the aircraft. The Napalm bombs especially required plenty of accessories. The shortages thus found were to be indented to our Command HQs and we would patiently wait for their supply. Similarly, Bomb Disposal Equipment and Personnel were to be made ready to defuse the unexploded bombs and take them away from important installations to demolish them taking all safety precautions.

Main ground equipment like Aircraft Starter Trolleys, Oxygen and Air cylinders, Hydraulic Trolleys, Towing Arms etc. were procured in record time. Radio and Navigation Mobile Vehicles were positioned at suitable places. An Aircraft Battery Charging Room was established. Sufficient trenches were dug all around the airfield. The list was endless. I along with another junior technical officer and 60 odd technical airmen worked incessantly to make the airfield operational by the end of October 1971. But we could not get the air defence guns with ammo (Ack Ack guns) till then. However, we managed to get them by the middle of November.

Winter was severe. Being a desert, the temperatures at night were close to 5oC. We have been observing night blackouts from November onwards at our base to prepare for war time. We were also practicing simulated air raids using sirens. To sum up, we were ready in all aspects for war with Pakistan by the end of November 1971. To our surprise, our then Defence Minister, Babu Jagjivan Ram along with his wife visited us in the last week of November. His visit was a great morale booster for all of us. Babu Jagjivan Ram was a gentle and soft spoken person, his wife too was empathetic about our families stationed in Delhi. This visit by him and his wife really helped boost our morale.

On 03rd December 1971, we all were ready to have early supper. As usual we were observing a black out. Suddenly the air raid warning siren went on. We knew then that the Pakistan Air Force was attacking us. All of us ran to our respective trenches in the darkness. Most of us had 3 cell torch lights. By then we also had eight fighter aircraft stationed at our base. It was found to be a false alarm. The enemy aircraft must have changed direction towards Jaisalmer. Those days communication facilities were rudimentary. Hence, we were not sure as to what happened to the enemy raid. After the clear siren all of us rushed to the mess to have dinner. All this was in total black out conditions, using only torch lights.

Foreseeing large requirement of batteries for torch lights, we requested the District Collector to get us nearly 700 of them. He managed to supply us in two installments of 350. After finishing dinner, we went on our shift, our watch duties. Within an hour, the real enemy air raid happened. Three enemy aircrafts came in a wave and dropped six 1000 kg high explosive (HE) bombs, one after the other. We all ran and jumped into our trenches to save our lives. One of the bombs fell very close to one end of the runway, causing some damage. One bomb fell near one of our messes, causing some damage to the kitchen equipment and furniture. The remaining bombs were dropped close to our perimeter. Thankfully, all of them exploded. As mentioned above, there was little damage to one end of the runway and to the kitchen. After the all clear signal, all of us ran out of the trenches to check for any casualties or fatalities. Fortunately, we were all safe and no aircraft was damaged.

Immediately India declared war on Pakistan after this unprovoked attack on our airfields in the western and eastern airfields. As soon as we received instructions, our aircrafts were launched to attack the enemy border air bases that were closest to us. Except for one aircraft, the rest of the 7 aircraft returned safe after dropping bombs and rockets. The eighth aircraft landed with fire on one wing. It took nearly 15 minutes to put off the fire. Since all the aircrafts were to be made battle ready again; rockets, bombs and aircraft gun ammo were loaded under pitch dark conditions. Refuelling of these aircraft also was done in record time. The aircraft which landed with wing fire, was to be checked for damage. Temporary repair work was undertaken and the aircraft was cleared for attack again. In fact, the pilot was so eager to go back and bomb those enemy anti-aircraft gunners who damaged his aircraft that we had to hold him back until we had everything in order!

Now that the war had started, I had to make two shifts of 30 technicians per shift, so that we could pull through the war with the least fatigue. When this was informed to all of my 60 technicians, all of them in one voice shouted aloud with great gusto and vigour that they would work for 24 hours daily and did not require any shifts. I was amazed at the spirit and morale of my airmen! Thus, we all decided to work all 24 hours enmasse.

There was no enemy air attack on our airfield for the next two days. But our fighter aircrafts were constantly carrying attacks on nearby enemy airfields and on some enemy army convoys. For us, day time was the best time; no blackouts, no darkness.

On the midnight of the third day, we had an enemy air raid. This time more enemy aircrafts took part in the attack. 10 bombs were dropped. The accuracy was better. Six bombs fell close to the runway and aircraft parking lot. Due to desert soil condition, these bombs threw away mountains of sand, thereby reducing damage to runway and parked aircrafts. Sand being loose takes the shocks of the blast wave due to explosion and nearly stops any damage nearby. Two bombs dropped close to our perimeter fencing but did not explode.

Next morning, I and our bomb disposal team demolished these bombs in situ, as our installations were far away. Otherwise, we had to defuse the bombs and carry them to a safe place for demolition. This is a very tricky and hazardous job. While diffusing, the one ton H.E. bomb may go off, leaving no trace of even 10 gms piece of the officer diffusing it. Especially in black out conditions, it was more or less suicidal!! We were wondering as to how the enemy was more accurate in tonight’s bombing compared to 3rd December. Out of curiosity, I and my deputy embarked on a 4-wheel drive jeep to travel in the direction of enemy attack, beyond our perimeter. After we travelled in this direction for about 12 kilometres, we found to our surprise ashes of dry grass burnt in the shape of arrow, directed towards our runway. This meant that some people were working against us by helping the enemy. So, it seemed we had enemies in that area. Immediately, we informed the Collector and S.P. They got into action and made security arrangements for about 20 kms in that direction from the next day onwards.

On the 6th day, one of our aircraft was severely damaged due to enemy rockets and barely made it to our base. The pilot was brave enough to bring such a damaged aircraft back home. So, our fleet strength now was seven aircrafts. On the next day, we received eight more modern aircraft with better range and air to ground capabilities and better pay loads. These aircrafts could carry Napalm bombs. Thus, they had more wherewithal to destroy enemy fuel dumps, tanks, bridges etc. For me, it was a challenge to arm these aircraft with Napalm bombs. None of my technicians had experience in preparing the Napalm bombs and arming them after loading on to the wings of the aircrafts. There were 22 parts required for this. Compared to the quantity of Napalm tanks and fuel mixtures available, two of the 22 were in shortage. It meant that we could not load and send aircraft with Napalm bombs. There was an urgent message from our command that four of eight newly arrived aircraft should be sent on Napalm bombing missions.

Taking samples of these two parts which were in shortage, I went to the nearby Army regiment and requested them for their help. They had their field workshop close by. They managed to take our similar parts from their store and in about two hours gave me the quantity I required. It was a God-sent help. I cannot specifically state the parts for obvious reasons. The day was saved and we could prepare and send many Napalm bombs thereafter.

For us it was business as usual. All my 60 airmen technicians were working 24 hours a day. During day time; repair of aircrafts, maintenance, preparations and loading of bombs, rockets, aircraft ammo were undertaken. During nights; continuous refuelling, loading and arming of aircraft from sortie to sortie and running into trenches when the air raid siren went off, all these were normal activities.

On 12th December 1971, around 9 pm, we got a call from the Collector that an aircraft had crashed 60 kms away, towards Jaisalmer. Villagers went and saw bombs lying near the aircraft. They vacated the village and took shelter 3 kms away fearing bomb explosions. At the same time, we too received instructions from our Command that we should go and check the crashed aircraft. One of our aircraft from the other base had also not returned to its base after its mission. I along with 6 airmen with necessary demolition items travelled in a Jeep towards the said village. We had to travel without headlights. So, we used torches as lights and travelled at slow speed. With difficulty, we managed to reach the village around 2 am. A policeman was waiting to take us to the crash site. As we approached, I could make out in the dark, it was a sand dune on which a fatal crash landing took place. Most of the aircraft was damaged by fire. This was our aircraft, not the enemy's. In that darkness, it was clear that one bomb was with the aircraft at the time of crash. We could not locate the bodies of the aircrew. I decided to wait till dawn. At dawn, we could see how difficult and dangerous that crash landing was. Finally, we found small pieces of flesh of the crew. It was difficult to collect them without emotions and preserve them. Finally, I demolished the bomb in situ, as it was far away from the village. We returned to our base within 2 hours. Emotions ran high in me, as the crew whose body pieces I collected were my colleagues from three years before.

On 16th December 1971, a ceasefire was declared. Lt. Gen. A A K Niazi, the Commander of East Pakistan forces surrendered to the Indian Army, with 93,000 Pakistani soldiers. The war was over. But for us at the border, the emergency state continued as a precaution. One could not trust an enemy like Pakistan. So, for all armed forces men on borders, the war-like vigil continued. No leave, No relaxation!

Events Worth Mentioning

1. The Chief Minister of state made two visits to our air force base before the war. He made our morale go high. He also brought for us all necessities to make our lives easier. He assured us that the state of Rajasthan was with us. In fact, after the war was over, all of us were presented quality woollen cloth for two coats/blazers; as a mark of gratitude from the state of Rajasthan. An amazing and heart touching gesture by the C.M. of Rajasthan. On our request, the 25 civilian drivers of Jeeps and trucks were also gifted the same.

2. The civil administration of Bikaner district, especially the Collector and S.P. were very proactive and rendered all the help needed in time. They were available to us 24 hours of the day. They did this continuously for three months before the start of war.

3. The visit of Defence Minister, Sri Jagjivan Ram and his wife, also boosted our morale. His quiet and calm demeanour gave us great courage.

4. The civilian drivers of hired Jeeps and trucks were eager to stay in the camp at night during the period of war, though I tried to convince them that our airmen would drive these vehicles during night. We did not want their casualties as they were not soldiers. But they would not listen to us. In fact, they helped us by doing manual labour for all our preparations of armament loads. Great people with such patriotism.

5. On a personal note, I went through anxious days and nights regarding the birth of my first child, she was due on 16th December 1971. Telephones were out of question those days. Except praying for everything to go well, I could do nothing. My wife was at our home town in Hyderabad, while I was fighting a war.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Please read above article in conjunction with following articles from Bharat Rakshak IAF pages

Air Marshal M.S. Bawa: Saga of Longewala:

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/histo ... #gsc.tab=0

Wing Commander K.S. Suresh: Battle of Longewala

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/histo ... #gsc.tab=0

Jaisalmer Diary:
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/histo ... #gsc.tab=0

122 (AdHoc) Squadron at Jaisalmer:
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/histo ... #gsc.tab=0

An article on 106 Canberra that took the Longewala pictures.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/histo ... #gsc.tab=0
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Manish_P »

Manish ji, many thanks for sharing that fascinating article

The first 12 paragraphs are repeated. Request you to kindly edit the post. Thanks again.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

Manish_P wrote:Manish ji, many thanks for sharing that fascinating article

The first 12 paragraphs are repeated. Request you to kindly edit the post. Thanks again.
Thank you for advising. I have edited his post.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/singhshwetabh71/sta ... EutmKUQWSA ---> A Type 77 MiG-21FL (I think) with TACDE. Surprisingly very good quality. @TheGhostRider31

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https://twitter.com/singhshwetabh71/sta ... EutmKUQWSA ---> One more TACDE MiG-21 image.

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Manish_P »

Rakesh wrote:
Manish_P wrote:Manish ji, many thanks for sharing that fascinating article

The first 12 paragraphs are repeated. Request you to kindly edit the post. Thanks again.
Thank you for advising. I have edited his post.
Rakesh sir. Many thanks. These are such re-readable posts. Many times over, often spread over seasons :) . I am a big fan of such posts shared in the past (posters like AkshaySG, TSarkar, Shiv ji and many more). Have often wished for a thread purely for such posts (written by veterans, serving faujis)..
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/TheGhostRider31/sta ... 7ClsmXHQjw ---> So for all the Top Gun fans, we have a home grown one too. We call it TACDE!!

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Hunter aircraft performance in 1965 and 1971.

Link: https://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.u ... istory.php

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India made extensive use of the Hunter F.56(A) and T.66(D/E) from 1957 to the early 1980s, being the first export customer of the type, and continued to operate a small number for target towing duty until 2000. Participating in the 1965 and 1971 conflicts with Pakistan, the Hunter proved to be a formidable ground attack aircraft and took a heavy toll of Pakistani armour. However in the air to air role the Hunter did not come off too well in combat with Pakistani Sabres, with 8 being lost in the 1965 war compared to 6 Sabres being shot down by Hunters. Pakistani pilots were lucky in that most of the Hunters they encountered were bomb-laden and operating at extreme range, and much easier prey as a result - especially when Sidewinder AAMs were employed by the Sabres. When encountering Hunters configured for air defence, they did not do so well but wisely dragged Hunters into low level, low speed turning dogfights, where the Hunter's performance was closest to the Sabre, instead of engaging at higher level where the Hunter would have been far superior. A single Pakistani F-104 finding itself in combat with a Hunter eventually had to disengage when the pilot found himself unable to turn with the Hunter.

In the 1971 war the Sabres did not do so well. While six Hunters were lost, eight (possibly nine) Sabres were claimed by Indian Hunters (Pakistani sources accepting fewer losses but not by any great margin). A further three Hunters were lost to MiG-19s and four to Mirages - while some have doubted the quality of the Indian pilots' air-to-air training, the Hunters were once again largely configured for ground attack and faced with missile attacks; to have done as well as they did in the circumstances is an indication that good training was not something the Indians were lacking!
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

Click on link below if you want to order this poster.

https://twitter.com/MrityunjayRagh2/sta ... BD_G4cmFiA ---> A small illustration of MiG-21 Bis of IAF and showcasing every squadron which operated this legendary fighter.

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by nachiket »

^^Nice graphic. I believe only 4 squadrons are still left flying the Bison now - Nos. 3, 4, 23 and 51. The others have been numberplated (21, 32, 35, 37) or have converted to other types (15, 24 - Su-30, 45 - Tejas). Hope we see some of the numberplated ones raised again flying the Tejas Mk1A in the future.

Edit: Seems to be some errors in the list. Some of the squadrons mentioned (15, 35, 37) operated the M or Bis and not the Bison.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

Flying the Indian Air Force Ajeet | Anil Golani (PART 1)

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Very nice thread on the 80 pilots who trained on F-86 Sabres in USA.

https://twitter.com/AnchitGupta9/status ... sZf4w&s=19
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Was there an IAF pilot named Dick Khan?
He was among those who were trained in US.
I recall seeing his picture in Illustrated Weekly. Shown next to a F-104.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

https://twitter.com/AnchitGupta9/status ... Gcerz2P-uw

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12 Vir Chakras were awarded to a single unit in the 1947 Kashmir War. That record stands unbeaten to this day, held by a Transport Sqn – No. 12 Sqn
@IAF_MCC
. This is the valiant saga of the last RIAF unit to be raised by the Brits. # IAFHistory (1/30)
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

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Re: The IAF History Thread

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Manish_P
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Manish_P »

ramana wrote:Oldest pilot biography

https://twitter.com/AnchitGupta9/status ... ZSD_Q&s=19
Wow

The air warrior looks remarkably fit in the photo of his 100th B'day :shock:

Wish him continued good health.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Srinagar airbase and No. 51 squadron..

https://twitter.com/AnchitGupta9/status ... bf8zg&s=19
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

https://ciaotest.cc.columbia.edu/olj/sa ... phr01.html

Paper by Air Cdre RV Phadke on the IAF Vision 2020 written in 2001
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Rakesh or anyone, Do we have a definitive account or book on IAF ground attack operations over the years from 1947 thru 2019?
Would be nice if historical gun camera footage was reviewed by somebody.
I would include gun, rocket, and bomb attacks
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Re: The IAF History Thread

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https://twitter.com/officialTatya_1/sta ... XPh8Q9Wwug ---> IAF taking delivery of a pair of MiG-25RUs with tail numbers DS 361 and DS 362.

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https://twitter.com/officialTatya_1/sta ... XPh8Q9Wwug ---> Camera Bays.

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Twitter thread on the late 90s sonic boom created by the IAF's MiG-25 over Islamabad, Pakistan.

A quote from the twitter thread below ---> One of IAF Mig-25 Garuda pilots said that IAF wanted to show that PAF was the IAF's Bunny :lol:

https://twitter.com/VivekSi85847001/sta ... XPh8Q9Wwug
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

About Flt Lt Indra Lal Roy, DFC RAF

https://t.co/aJZ6guKGkU

Air Marshal Subroto Mukherji was his nephew
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Re: The IAF History Thread

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Akbar Nama: The story of Mil Mi 25/35 and Indian Air Force
https://medium.com/indra-networks/akbar ... f0ab48d095
06 March 2022
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Re: The IAF History Thread

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Salt of the Earth -The Indian Air Force Story

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Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/HariRam42245512/sta ... R4Biz6FPsw ---> Yo aviation fans and balloon shooters. This is about the MiG 21 from the book below written by Air Marshal Sharad Deshpande.

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by vsunder »

This is an article written by me in another avatar. The original article which was circulated to certain forum mods has pictures attached to it.

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SRIRAM VENKATASUBBA SETTI(SETTY) INDIA'S PIONEER AERONAUTICAL ENGINEER AND DESIGNER



The name of S.V. Setti is now almost forgotten and perhaps in all of India possibly there may be 5 people who are aware of this name. He was a pioneer in the field of Aeronautical engineering and the first Indian to design an aircraft. One of his designs the Avro 504, was a successful bomber used by the Allies in WW1 and this type was the first aircraft to bomb Berlin. His brilliant life was tragically cut short.

Setti was born in 1879 in Mysore into a family of meagre means and did his Bachelor of Arts from Maharaja's College in Mysore. He then left to study engineering at the Guindy engineering college in Chennai and transferred to the prestigious Thompson Engineering college in Roorkee. Till 1909 he worked as an asst. engineer in the Public works department of the Mysore kingdom. In 1909 he won a scholarship from the government of the Kingdom of Mysore that enabled him to study at Faraday House in the UK. Faraday House was a prestigious institution that was set up by industry that trained people in the production and distribution of electricity when formal electrical engineering was not a subject in universities. This institution does not exist anymore having closed in 1967. Hounsfield a student of the Faraday House got a Nobel Prize in 1979 for his role in the development of the MRI machine. Let it be remarked that Johannes Radon an Austrian had already worked out the mathematics for the MRI in 1919, 60 years before Hounsfield got the Nobel by building the MRI machine for which Radon had already laid the theory.

Coming back to Setti, after his studies he became an apprentice at A. V. Roe and Company, the only aircraft manufacturer in the UK. A. V. Roe became the famous AVRO aircraft company later. He also learned to fly. He also became an associate of the Institution of Electrical Engineers.

While testing an Avro D prototype, S.V. Setti crashed but escaped unhurt. After carefully studying the flaws of the aircraft, Setti came up with a new design with a goal of improving the aircraft. Avro allowed him to implement his design and asked Setti to fly it. He did on March 12, 1912, and landed safely. Famous Australian aviator John Duigan, who witnessed the flight, purchased the biplane on the spot.


Merely eight years after the Wright brothers’ historic first flight in 1903, the first Indian S.V. Setti followed suit. Between 1911-12, S.V. Setti designed and helped manufacture planes at Avro of UK. He also piloted them. Fire that engulfed sections of Avro’s plant in Chadderton in October 1959 destroyed most of the early records of the company. Besides, it obliterated much of the evidence of Setty’s remarkable aviation achievements.

The first reference to S.V. Setti in Flight, the official organ of the Aero Club of the UK that started publication in January 1909, is in the issue dated June 24, 1911 where he is referred to as a new pupil at Brooklands Aerodrome. Over the next eight months it makes around 10 references to Setty flying various exercises in the Avro biplane or the Green-engined Avro, usually solo, at times carrying out circuits, at times doing some rolling practice. The last reference in the issue of March 2, 1912 says he placed the Avro on its head. The report mentions that the pilot was unharmed, but this was probably Setty’s final flight. Notably, aviation at the time was dominated by accidents—minor and major—that did not necessarily reflect on the calibre of the pilot.
The aircraft that Setti built for Duigan is considered the prototype of Avro’s later E type. The D and E types were the models for the Avro 500. The Avro 500 was itself the inspiration for the Avro 504—the first and one of the most widely operated early trainer aircraft—that first flew in September 1913.

In a certificate dated March 12, 1912 Avro recommended Setti with the words: He has had considerable experience in the Flying School and has become very efficient in the tuning up of aeroplanes and engines. He has the makings of a very good pilot. He has also worked in the Drawing Office on some new types of machines, and we now consider him to have had sufficient experience to be left in entire charge of the erection of a machine of any type. Setti left England for India on June 30, 1912 with a gold medal from A.V. Roe for General Proficiency in Aeronautics. Inscribed on it was an Avro E.
After Setti left for India, Avro released the 500 series of aircraft, including the Avro 501, 502, 503 and 504. All of these, except the Avro 504, were similar to Avro 500 aircraft in basic design. The new biplane aircraft which Setti had designed turned out to be Avro 504, a popular World War I bomber. The Avro 504 evolved into the world's first trainer aircraft, In November 1914, the Avro 504 was the first aircraft to bomb Germany in the war. Setti designed the Avro Duigan which became the model for Avro 500 and then designed the new biplane the Avro 504.

In 1913, Setti became the founding superintendent of the University Visvesvarayya College of Engineering which was started in a shed in Bangalore. Sir M. Visvesvarayya after whom the college was named was the Dewan(Prime Minister of the Kingdom of Mysore) at that time and himself a brilliant engineer. This college was the first engineering college in Karnataka.
Setti's dream was to continue designing aircraft in Bangalore based on his experience with A. V. Roe. However fate took a cruel turn. During the great Influenza pandemic, Setti, his wife and one of his four daughters passed away. Setti passed away Oct 12, 1918 at the age of 38.

In the US, great pioneers in aviation and also valiant airmen have important airports named after them. In India a Squadron Leader Devayya, or a Group Captain Suranjan Das or a S. V. Setti has no airport named after them. Here are some pics of Setti. Setti is wearing the Mysore style turban sitting in the cockpit of his Avro. In the photo that states "this plane is the one of the most successful of its type", Setti is on the extreme right.

The author of this article is a Distinguished Professor of Mathematics and an Elected Fellow of the American Mathematical Society.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by vsunder »

@Rakesh The Canberra hit by a Stinger at Kargil in 1999 was from 106 Squadron Lynxes. Group Captain "Chow" Ranveer Singh Chaudhary my classmate in school (we finished school together in 1969) was the CO of 106 squadron when it happened and was Mentioned in Dispatches for the Kargil conflict. Chow's younger brother was a pilot in an IAF Helicopter unit and his father was a Squadron Leader. Here is the BR page for Chow:

https://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Database/13769

Chow retired as Air Commodore after commanding 36 Wing based at IAF station Makarpura near Vadodara. Chow was written up in Illustrated Weekly of India in 1970 being the youngest member of the NDA team to scale Nun Kun peaks in Ladakh. He was one of an extremely brilliant class from school who have long gone on to attain international fame.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S.V._Setty

Sri S.V. Setty

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With Avro 500 biplane:

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Wiki link on Avro 504: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_504

Had a 20 +year service run!!!

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"The 504 was the first British aeroplane to strafe troops on the ground[14] as well as the first British aircraft to make a bombing raid over Germany.[1][15] It was also the first Allied aeroplane to be downed by enemy anti-aircraft fire and was the first aircraft flown by many future aces, including Billy Bishop."
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Truly an aviation pioneer.
Sri S.V. Setty should be honored especially with Aero India 2023 in Bengaluru.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

BAE acknowledges Avro 504 is derived from Avro 500

https://www.baesystems.com/en/heritage/ ... -avro-504k
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by vsunder »

Here is another article I wrote, its on the net somewhere :rotfl: The other article is far longer and this is a precis of that one.

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The Sad Story of the De Havilland Comet


The De Havilland Company was a pioneer aviation company in the UK. During WW2 it designed and built the all wooden Mosquito figher-bomber known for its speed. Then came one of the early jet fighters, the De Havilland Vampire, powered by Rolls Royce Goblin engines that were also inducted into the Indian Air Force(IAF). With this induction the IAF became the first air force in Asia to induct jets.
What is less known is that De Havilland also pioneered civilian jet powered flight with its design and construction of the De Havilland Comet DH 106 which it unveiled in 1949. It had SQUARE windows, cabin pressurization and a clean aerodynamic design with swept back wings. 4 Rolls Royce Ghost jet engines powered the plane. BOAC the forerunner of British Airways introduced it into its commercial routes in 1952. But then problems happened. Within a year after introduction, three Comets were lost. One Comet was lost soon after take off from Kolkata's Dum Dum airport killing everyone on board in 1953. In 1954 came another serious accident when a Comet plunged into the Mediterranean shortly after take off from Rome Ciampino airport. All 35 on board perished. Initially these accidents were blamed on pilot error. The Royal Navy did recover 70% of the wreckage of the Rome disaster from the sea and the wreckage was reconstructed in the UK at the Royal Aircraft Establishment at Farnborough.
It was then the design flaw was realized. Pressurization and depressurization of the cabin over several flights is like squeezing your toothpaste tube everyday. Over time this creates metal fatigue and cracks develop. These issues began in the Comet from the area of the SQUARE shaped windows. The cracks propagated to the rest of the air frame and fuselage, and eventually control surfaces failed at maximal aerodynamic stress, which an aircraft experiences soon after take off or during descent. Or the fuselage cracked in a catastrophic way. At that point a fatal rupture or loss of control doomed the aircraft.
Meanwhile Boeing was learning about all these failures and planning for their own venture into designing and constructing a successful commercial jet liner. So Boeing went in for OVAL windows that minimized stress and production of metal fatigue cracks from that area. It took other measures to strengthen the fuselage from repeated pressurization and depressurization of the cabin and incorporated all this into the Boeing 707 which had its first flight Dec 20, 1957. The Boeing 707 was safe, reliable and became the mainstay of commercial jet aviation in the world. So ended De Havilland's pioneer role in jet transport.
Within 10 years of the Boeing company unveiling the 707, they unveiled the iconic Jumbo jet 747 in December 1968. The De Havilland company became bankrupt and became history.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

vsunder, I vaguely recall Avro 504 biplane in Shuttleworth Collection in Biggleswade, Bedfordshire. Vague as my colleague took us to see it after a long flight from US!
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by vsunder »

@Ramana: I would not know about the UK. There is an Avro 504 on display at the Wright-Patterson Air Force museum in Dayton, Ohio(home of the Wright brothers). This is a very large museum with many aircraft types. I visited this museum as a student about 45 odd years ago.
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

I don't know where else to post this. A truly wasted opportunity.

https://twitter.com/idrwalerts/status/1 ... 21889?s=20 ----> Marut Vibration Test, 1962.

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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Summary of a talk by the great ACM P.C. Lal

https://web.archive.org/web/20120905091 ... l/ch12.htm
Management Development for Armed Forces



[The following article is based on a talk by (late) Air Chief Marshal PC Lal, the then Chief of Air Staff at the Institute of Defence Management on January 15, 1971]

There is a widespread awareness in industry and business that modern management practices are necessary and must be developed. In defence too, there is a great need to strengthen and extend the knowledge of management practices to get the "optimum" from our resources.

The need of this knowledge and training in management is all the more relevant now as revolution in military affairs is becoming more and more complex. If business management is concerned with the conversion of resources into wealth, defence management is concerned with the creation of strength out of available potential and effective utilisation of such strength. As ours is a developing country, still depending considerably on foreign countries for sophisticated equipment like aircraft, warships, submarines, guns and missiles; it is time we modernise our management practices and steer and channelise our efforts towards self-sufficiency. One of the effective ways to achieve this would be, in my opinion, to refine our knowledge of management disciplines and apply them at every level.

Perhaps there may not be much of difference in defence management except in the emphasis and the consequences of bad or wrong decisions. A business concern can survive inspite of a delayed or wrong decision whereas in defence, it may prove disastrous.

The success of an organisation, specially in defence, depends to a large extent on leadership at every level. Good leadership requires developed insights into human value systems, motivational aspects of human behaviour and effective communication. Unless military leaders equip themselves with this knowledge, it may be difficult to maintain esprit-de-corps and keep pace with changes in the human environment.

Leadership of men is not the whole story either, the more senior an officer becomes, the more he has to be aware that he has to maintain leadership in knowledge and professionalism. It is only then, he is equipped to wield that subtle form of authority which is the hallmark of good leaders.

What has been said so far points to the urgent need for officers to devote a considerable amount of their time and efforts towards self-development and growth. In case of senior officers, this responsibility extends also towards younger officers working under them and their development so that their potential to occupy higher ranks in time is increased gradually.

A senior officer has to be judged by the way he has developed his officers to occupy higher positions in future. It may be observed in this connection that our promotion concepts appear to be formulated to some extent on the assumption that an officer who performs well in his current responsibilities is automatically fitted to graduate to the next higher rank. How often have we not promoted an officer and found to our dismay that he exhibits inadequacies in the new rank? In the bargain, the organisation has lost a first class performer in the earlier rank.

I consider that management development programmes in the services are of the utmost importance. It is necessary for equipping officers for higher responsibilities; making the sum total of experience of the services available to all who could benefit from them; improving levels of performance, sharpening conceptual skills and broadening the perspectives of Services officers and adding to the job satisfaction of officers by providing them opportunities for self-development.

As our officers emerge from appointments of command to appointments of creation and control of resources, there is a need to equip them with the latest management discipline/techniques. Earlier, the offices of three Services and the Ministry of Defence appreciated this essential aspect; better they would be equipped to sharpen the edges of effectiveness.

(courtesy : Gp Capt DC Bakshi (Retd)
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by ramana »

Tribute to late AVM Bishnoi VrC and bar

https://twitter.com/TheBrownBeagle/stat ... DV99A&s=19
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Re: The IAF History Thread

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/mohitjayal/status/1 ... 25059?s=20 ---> The First of the First - First Supersonics @ 60 years.

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