The IAF History Thread

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 20 Feb 2009 08:52

Nayak, Thanks for the history scans.

shiv, I used to have a British a/c book that had line drawings similar to what you posted. Thanks for the memories. The retired head of HAL A/C design group was remembering those days when I met him in 2004.

Arunkumar · Post by **Arunkumar** » 20 Feb 2009 12:46

shiv ji
thanks for photos of experimental planes. When I saw the HF-73 photograph, my first reaction was , wow! a foxbat with a single tail.
On searching BR material came to know that it's demise paved the way for induction of Jaguar.

http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/MONITOR/I ... kumar.html

vivek_ahuja · Post by **vivek_ahuja** » 20 Feb 2009 13:32

The remains of an IAF C-119 at Thoise. Photograph taken just after the 62 war

Photograph ownership: K. Chari (retired volunteer, 56th Medical Battalion, AMC, Partapur sector)

-Vivek

vivek_ahuja · Post by **vivek_ahuja** » 20 Feb 2009 13:35

Jagan,

The IAF combat losses section for the 62 war lists the aircraft type for Sqn Ldr. Sehgal and Williams as a Mi-4. I believe it was in fact Bell-47s.

IIRC, the only Mi-4 loss (and capture) was in the Zimithuang (?) sector...

-Vivek

KBDagha · Post by **KBDagha** » 20 Feb 2009 21:50

Some pictures!!

http://img22.imageshack.us/my.php?image ... 077pl5.jpg
http://img22.imageshack.us/my.php?image ... 089pi0.jpg
http://img22.imageshack.us/my.php?image ... 139ta0.jpg
http://img24.imageshack.us/my.php?image ... 124gp9.jpg
http://img9.imageshack.us/my.php?image= ... 092al4.jpg
http://img10.imageshack.us/my.php?image ... 140ht8.jpg

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 21 Feb 2009 03:21

vivek_ahuja wrote:Jagan,

The IAF combat losses section for the 62 war lists the aircraft type for Sqn Ldr. Sehgal and Williams as a Mi-4. I believe it was in fact Bell-47s.

IIRC, the only Mi-4 loss (and capture) was in the Zimithuang (?) sector...

-Vivek

Right Vivek - in due course. As Sqn Ldr Williams article on BR confirms - the choppers were BZ541 and BZ543. Pushpindar says that the Mi-4 was returned in one of his books. Though no further references on it. Apparently an Otter also suffered the same fate.

Nice pic of the Packet wreck. you been wreck hunting in ladakh ?

vivek_ahuja · Post by **vivek_ahuja** » 21 Feb 2009 04:24

Jagan wrote:Right Vivek - in due course. As Sqn Ldr Williams article on BR confirms - the choppers were BZ541 and BZ543. Pushpindar says that the Mi-4 was returned in one of his books. Though no further references on it. Apparently an Otter also suffered the same fate.

Interestingly, you come across so many different tidbits of information from all over the place. I just remembered a story regarding Sqn Ldr Williams flight on the 20th of October.

The Divisional History of the 4 Division during the NEFA Ops states that on 20th of October, the soldiers fighting on the ground at Tsangdhar were amazed to see the regular morning C-47 approaching for their early morning supply drop as no one in the Army had bothered telling the IAF that the ground war had started. It states that both the Indian and Chinese soldiers were amazed to see the lumbering aircraft coming overhead. Then the Chinese opened fire with all kinds of weapons on the by-now alerted Dakota flight crew, which somehow managed to escape.

This was how the IAF came to know about the ground war. Talk about coordination between the services!

In any case, in Sqn Ldr. Williams article, he states that before he left for Zimithiang on the morning of the 20th, he was pulled aside by AVM Jawant Singh who showed him a bullet ridden Dakota. He later tried to impress these details to the Division Commander at Zimithiang, Maj-Gen Niranjan Prasad, who was supposed to be flying with him to Tsangdhar that day.

And when he was shot down, his helicopter falling out of the sky was spotted by soldiers deployed north of Zimithiang who reported as such to Niranjan Prasad and the latter mentions this in his book!

See how these stories are connected!

Nice pic of the Packet wreck. you been wreck hunting in ladakh ?

Actually, this is part of the photo collection from K. Chari's personal album. He was kind enough to give me a recollection of his tour of Laddakh as a medic in the 56th Medical Battalion during the final phases of the 62 war and the additional few years after that that he spent in Thoise, Leh etc.

I am currently editing the draft of the article for BR now. You might like to read the article: it has details of the IAF operations in Laddakh during the period he was there. Details of C-119 flight profiles, AN-12 drops and Mi-4 evacuations etc.

As it turns out, K Chari was as much a aviation enthusiast as a patriot. While he was a medic, he was also one who keenly watched the IAF aspects around him. That was as close as he was able to get because of his lack of education that prevented him from joining in the IAF. In any case, that was how he ended up talking more about the IAF in Laddakh than his own tenure as a medic!

-Vivek

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 21 Feb 2009 05:03

vivek_ahuja wrote:I am currently editing the draft of the article for BR now. You might like to read the article: it has details of the IAF operations in Laddakh during the period he was there. Details of C-119 flight profiles, AN-12 drops and Mi-4 evacuations etc.

As it turns out, K Chari was as much a aviation enthusiast as a patriot. While he was a medic, he was also one who keenly watched the IAF aspects around him. That was as close as he was able to get because of his lack of education that prevented him from joining in the IAF. In any case, that was how he ended up talking more about the IAF in Laddakh than his own tenure as a medic!

cool! look forward to it.

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 09 Mar 2009 13:29

http://livefist.blogspot.com/2009/03/mi ... unset.html

MiG-23 flies into the sunset

The MiG-23 BN of Indian Air Force retired today on 06 Mar 09, after 28 years of glorious service to the Nation. A befitting farewell in the form of a 'phasing out ceremony' was held at its last home, No. 221 Squadron at Air Force Station Halwara. The ceremony was presided over by the Chief of Air Staff, Air Chief Marshal Fali Homi Major. Wg Cdr YJ Joshi and Sqn Ldr TR Sahu of 221 Sqn flew the aircraft on its last flight.

The Air Force Station Halwara had become home to No.221 Squadron ever since they converted to MiG-23 BN in February 1982. 27 years on, No.221 Squadron is lone Squadron with MiG-23 BN on its inventory. The squadron known as the 'Valiants' was formed on 1963 at Barrackpore under he command of Sqn Ldr N Chatrath with 22 officers. It was then a part of the 55 Bengal Auxillary Air Force Squadron. Initially equipped with Vampire, Spitfire and Hurricane aircraft, it assumed the mantle of an operational unit when selected to support Indian Army's blitzkrieg advance in East Bengal during Dec 1971.

The 'Valiants' entered the Swing Wing era with the induction of MiG-23 BN in IAF on 24 Jan 1981 as a result of the IAF's need for Tactical Air Strike Aircraft in the late 1970s. This single seater ground attack aircraft was the result of Mikoyan Design Bureau's radical approach to incorporate variable geometry wings in the aircraft, a swing wing concept to compromise on the conflicting requirement of high speed flight with good low speed handling. An IAF test pilot team led by Wg Cdr Philip Rajkumar had test flown and evaluated the MiG-23 BN at Lugovaya in April – May 1979 after which the Cabinet Committee for Political Affairs (CCPA) cleared an acquisition of 95 MiG-23 BNs. Eight Pilots, nine engineering officers and 55 airmen of IAF left for Soviet Union on 01 Sep 1980 for conversion training on MiG-23 variable sweep fighters. The aircraft were then transported to HAL facility at Ozar near Nasik where they were assembled, test flown by
Soviet pilots before being handed over to the IAF on 20 Jan 1980. The first IAF unit to be inducted with these Swing Wing fighters was No. 10 Squadron.

The aircraft got its first taste of operation on 04 April 1984 when the Squadron was alerted for the launch of 'Operation Meghdoot' for securing the Siachen Glacier in Northern Ladhakh. Intensive flying began in Kashmir valley, the Mig-23 BNs were employed to the limits, flying in the mountainous region by day and night. In 1985 MiG-23 BN got the unique distinction of being the first fighter aircraft ever to cross Banihal Pass in J&K region by night.

On 25 may 1999, 'Operation Safed Sagar' was launched. The Indian Air Force was to commence offensive air action at first light of the next morning. The MiG-23 BNs were launched into action targeting enemy positions at Tiger Hill with 57 mm rockets and 500 Kg bombs. The ensuing seven weeks from 26 May and 15 July saw the squadron fly 155 attack missions more than those during December 1971 operations and accounted for 28 percent of total load drop and 30 percent of all missions flown in that area.

During the Kargil conflict this aircraft had the distinction of being the single aircraft type to fire the maximum weapon load over the dizzy heights of Dras and Kargil. The MiG-23s have had flown more than 154000 hrs in the service of the nation.

(Text & Photos Courtesy IAF)

Click the link for pics

Aditya G · Post by **Aditya G** » 09 Mar 2009 23:43

http://www.indamer.com/pages/profile.htm

Indamer C-47s?

http://medind.nic.in/iab/t07/s1/iabt07s1p95.pdf

HUMANE FACE OF IAF:AID TO THE CIVIL ADMINISTRATION

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 20 Mar 2009 08:11

Shiv/Jagan,

Need some info if you guys have it. By chance is there any record of the serial number of the Hunter flown by Wing Cdr K. Suresh during Longewala battle? Even more wonderful would be if any pics survive of that aircraft. I have a 1/144 Hunter ready for building and if possible I want it to represent Wing Cdr. Suresh's aircraft. If I finish on time I will display it in an IPMS competition next month - would be a welcome change from seeing NATO/WWII aircraft all over the place!

Many thanks!

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 20 Mar 2009 10:37

You are out on a limb there Raja. I spoke to him during Aero India 2003 and he told me then that his logbook was still with air hq . I was trying to help Polly Singh for his painting. What I didnt know was that Polly already figured that the logbook was not there and painted the Longewala battle scene so that he didnt need to paint the numbers
click for image

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 20 Mar 2009 11:18

Jagan,
hmm...thats too bad

BTW for some reason the diorama of Jaisalmer airfield by Polly Singh is missing from the B-R IAF modeling section. I know for sure, it used to be there before (this one). The hunter model in that diorama had a serial like B 318...do you have any records of such an aircraft in actual IAF service? For some reason, I can't figure out how to search your warbirds site by aircraft type and get a table of all warbirds of the same type. Any hints?

Added Later: Just another quick q.: Any images of the insignia the hunters of the OCU which participated, were sporting? Thanks!

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 20 Mar 2009 15:16

Raja Bose wrote:Jagan,
hmm...thats too bad BTW for some reason the diorama of Jaisalmer airfield by Polly Singh is missing from the B-R IAF modeling section. I know for sure, it used to be there before (this one). The hunter model in that diorama had a serial like B 318...do you have any records of such an aircraft in actual IAF service? For some reason, I can't figure out how to search your warbirds site by aircraft type and get a table of all warbirds of the same type. Any hints?

Added Later: Just another quick q.: Any images of the insignia the hunters of the OCU which participated, were sporting? Thanks!

Hmm - let me see if his daughter can help.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 21 Mar 2009 05:21

Could be BA318

Theres a listing of serial both here http://www.warbirds.in/forum/viewtopic.php?t=183 and here
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/IAF/Aircr ... Combat.htm

The BR listing is more helpful because it lists what aircraft served with the OCU/122 Sqn during the 71 Ops (you have to scan through them). Right now we know 8 serials. There may have been 15-20 aircraft with OCU. Out of which only four took part in Longewala. All we need to do is locate the logs of atleast one of the pilots and we should be good.

Polly used the insiginia of the OCU The Young 'uns/The Young Ones' for his painting. but I havent seen any photographs from that era that showed the hunters had this insignia on them. (So I can neither confirm nor deny that)

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 21 Mar 2009 13:26

shiv wrote:
Raja Bose wrote:Jagan,
hmm...thats too bad BTW for some reason the diorama of Jaisalmer airfield by Polly Singh is missing from the B-R IAF modeling section. I know for sure, it used to be there before (this one). The hunter model in that diorama had a serial like B 318...do you have any records of such an aircraft in actual IAF service? For some reason, I can't figure out how to search your warbirds site by aircraft type and get a table of all warbirds of the same type. Any hints?

Added Later: Just another quick q.: Any images of the insignia the hunters of the OCU which participated, were sporting? Thanks!

Hmm - let me see if his daughter can help.

shiv boss, Thanks a lot!

If you are able to get any info, please email me at rajabose81 at g mail dat kawm

Raja Bose · Post by **Raja Bose** » 21 Mar 2009 13:33

Thanks Jagan. Both the links are quite useful for future reference. As always you have a wealth of info!

Dont know why Polly decided to use the BA318 serial on his Hunter coz according to the B-R listing it is not known if it was with the OCU (BA314 was though).

tsarkar · Post by **tsarkar** » 24 Mar 2009 18:52

B29s in India

http://www.airforce-magazine.com/Magazi ... rhorn.aspx

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 30 Mar 2009 05:25

From a blog by Air Marshal Ashok K. Goel (Retd.)
PVSM AVSM VM

Indian Air Force and its Transport Fleet

Sree · Post by **Sree** » 07 Apr 2009 15:06

tsarkar wrote:B29s in India

http://www.airforce-magazine.com/Magazi ... rhorn.aspx

Interesting article, tsarkar - thanks for posting.

Another little-known piece of aviation history trivia from that period is that the RAF also moved some heavy bomber units to India, to participate in the bombing of the Japanese homeland. The force was designated "Tiger Force". One of the squadrons involved was the famous 9 Squadron, RAF, which had flown alongside 617 Squadron RAF in some of their missions following the Dams raid - in particular, they flew alongside 617 during the raids on the Tirpitz.

There was a plan for 617 Squadron also to join 9 Squadron in India, but before they could move, the A-bomb prompted Japan's surrender.

I don't have any on-line links, but there is an old Aeroplane Monthly article about 9 Squadron in India. Most squadron and other histories give barely one or two lines, to 9 Squadron's period in India.

Regards

Sree

rsharma · Post by **rsharma** » 07 Apr 2009 15:56

A most interesting article..

Cheapest Kill

Is the author really telling the truth, or is it just another one of those "Taller than mountain" claims of hyper-hallucinated PAF?

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 07 Apr 2009 17:31

JaiS wrote:From a blog by Air Marshal Ashok K. Goel (Retd.)
PVSM AVSM VM

Indian Air Force and its Transport Fleet

a number of retired servicemen and intelligence officers are coming up with their own blogs.

could we have a thread/consolidated post to put them at the same place ?
any suggestions will be welcome.

AmitR · Post by **AmitR** » 07 Apr 2009 20:07

rsharma wrote:A most interesting article..

Cheapest Kill

Is the author really telling the truth, or is it just another one of those "Taller than mountain" claims of hyper-hallucinated PAF?

Chances of this being very true piece of information is high. Kaiser Tufail is a respected PAF officer and one of the best military authors I have read. He rarely gets into too much jingoism or islam while telling an account.

Ardeshir · Post by **Ardeshir** » 08 Apr 2009 10:19

AmitR wrote:
rsharma wrote:A most interesting article..

Cheapest Kill

Is the author really telling the truth, or is it just another one of those "Taller than mountain" claims of hyper-hallucinated PAF?
Chances of this being very true piece of information is high. Kaiser Tufail is a respected PAF officer and one of the best military authors I have read. He rarely gets into too much jingoism or islam while telling an account.

He might write well, but doesn't mean that what he writes is true.
He states, for example, that Fg Offr Nirmal Jit Singh Sekhon didn't hit a single Sabre during the action with saw him being awarded the first PVC for a fighter pilot. How plausible is that? The bottom line is that he is a Paki, schooled in the 1 Paki = 10 Indians School of Philosophy, and his attempts to appear fair are just that, an appearance.

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 08 Apr 2009 10:22

tufail is dependable till now AFAIK but I would wait for jag's final verdict.

rsharma · Post by **rsharma** » 08 Apr 2009 12:00

Prasant wrote: The bottom line is that he is a Paki, schooled in the 1 Paki = 10 Indians School of Philosophy, and his attempts to appear fair are just that, an appearance.

Although I don't believe his account of the Gnat crash to be true, in all fairness Tufail does not seem to be suffering from typical Paki bigotry. His articles donot reflect Jingoistic sentiments and are written quite well. I particularly liked the piece in which he narrates a mid-night Mirage 5 sortie, when he was intercepted by a pair of "Tomcats" and later almost bumped into Indian interceptors off the coast of Saurashtra.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 09 Apr 2009 09:30

Fg Offr M M Singh did die when he was trying to break tightly following a call from the ATC.

There were reports of Mirage IIIs in the area. but I guess they were not of immediate threat to the Gnats because then the loss would be classified as Enemy Action and not Flying Accident.

IMO the loss of life and aircraft was entirely avoidable. infact Singh's wingman had a close shave because he was keeping station to his No.1 (Singh). The wingman went on to become a very senior test pilot with a significant contribution in the LCA test program.

krishna_j · Post by **krishna_j** » 10 Apr 2009 00:10

Cheapest Kill

[/quote]He might write well, but doesn't mean that what he writes is true.
He states, for example, that Fg Offr Nirmal Jit Singh Sekhon didn't hit a single Sabre during the action with saw him being awarded the first PVC for a fighter pilot. How plausible is that? The bottom line is that he is a Paki, schooled in the 1 Paki = 10 Indians School of Philosophy, and his attempts to appear fair are just that, an appearance.[/quote]

Disagree - KT typically presents only a fighter pilot's view - Not many know he was the test pilot for the F7 PG - maybe he is influenced with whatever evidence or point of view is there on PAF side - but I do not detect any attempt at bias in his writings or on his blog - in fact its pretty well written and engaging - he even made a visit to India and recorded his experiences in his blog and believe it got published in Indian media as well . i Respect his views as a PAF historian .

krishna_j · Post by **krishna_j** » 10 Apr 2009 00:15

Jagan wrote: infact Singh's wingman had a close shave because he was keeping station to his No.1 (Singh). The wingman went on to become a very senior test pilot with a significant contribution in the LCA test program.

Jagan - are we speaking of Polly ex LCA ?

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 12 Apr 2009 22:23

Rahul, I was thinking about the same and will start a thread for the same.

Came across the info below here.

6 April 1942

Japanese carrier aircraft make the first air attack on India.

Which got me interested in reading more about the attack and found some more data THE WESTLAND LYSANDER.

krishna_j · Post by **krishna_j** » 20 Apr 2009 00:42

has anyone read this ?

Flying high

The book has gone in detail into the careers of four young Indians who donned the uniform of the Royal Flying Corps of Great Britain in World War I and fought as combat pilots.

The author has very boldly undertaken the onerous task of researching, collecting bits and pieces of information from the UK, US, France, Germany, Canada and even Czechoslovakia.

It is a must read for all proud Indians, for, as the author says in his prologue, this book is about Indians who flew the most modern combat aircrafts when Indians were not thought to be competent enough to even drive a car or a railway engine!

SKYHAWKS
By Somnath Sapru Publishers: Writers Workshop, Kolkata
Price: Rs 400

The Indian Air Force has completed 60 years of glorious service to the nation as its air arm, and 75 in all as the youngest of the three armed forces. The first 15 years were literally full of growing pains, having to produce good professional flying with the cast-off obsolete aircraft of the Royal Air Force (RAF) and demonstrating to our then rulers that Indians could handle modern technology and use it for combat flying.

It was this very belief that Indians were unfit for higher command and could not equal the British that was overwhelmingly proved wrong by four young Indians hailing from different parts of the country who donned the uniform of the Royal Flying Corps of Great Britain in World War I and fought as combat pilots over the war-torn skies of Europe.

The book Skyhawks by Somnath Sapru, a senior journalist who in a career spanning over three decades covered the subjects of defence and civil aviation, has gone in detail into the careers of these four young pilots during the War. Ninety years ago, Indians were not thought fit to hold a screwdriver or drive a railway engine or a car and when the role of military aviation was in the process of being defined in the overall military tactics and strategy, what these four achieved is remarkable.

The young men — Hardit Singh Malik, an Oxford graduate from Rawalpindi; Indra Lal Roy from Dacca and living in England from the age of two; S.C. Welinkar from Bombay; and Errol Suvo Chunder Sen from Calcutta — were initially denied commissions as until then no Indian could become an officer in the military services. However, exigencies of war forced the authorities to grant them wartime commissions and thereby history was made.

They together created many firsts. Roy in his final phase shot down nine enemy planes in 11 days of operational flying, being the first and the only Indian to earn the title of "ace" and also being the first Indian to be awarded the Distinguished Flying Cross (DFC) before being killed in action. Malik was the first Indian Oxford graduate to become a combat pilot and the first Sikh officer to be permitted to wear a turban as headgear. He was also the first among the four to be commissioned, and served till the end of the war; later, on return to India he joined the ICS. He died in 1985. Sen flew and in a dogfight crashed in enemy territory, was taken prisoner of war and survived. Welinkar was also shot down on the Allied side of the lines and died of his injuries in the field hospital near the front.

What did their service in war contribute to Indian demand for representation in the officer cadre of the forces? Eventually, the demand for a separate Air Force was conceded in principle as a result of the Skeen Committee Report which discussed this issue. Today, it is of historic importance to the Indian Air Force and the country that apart from political leaders like Motilal Nehru who strongly advocated the creation of a new air service, a combat-battle hardened veteran like Malik also testified before the Skeen Committee, being the only Indian with a combat pilot's experience.

Consequently the Indian Air Force Act was passed and became effective from October 8, 1932; the first batch of six officers passed out of the RAF College at Cranwell and formed the first flight of the IAF at Drigh Road, Karachi on April 1, 1933. Among these newly commissioned officers was Subroto Mukerjee, who was I.L. Roy's nephew and whose example he chose to emulate by training to be a pilot.

An enormous amount of research has gone into this book; there was hardly any material or documentation available either in the IAF's archives or the Defence Ministry's records, as this narrative pertains to an era even before the RAF. All that is known is an extract from a newspaper report published in 1919.

The author has very boldly undertaken the onerous task of researching, collecting bits and pieces of information from the UK, US, France, Germany, Canada and even Czechoslovakia. It was, as the author has himself confessed, a frustrating but rewarding labour of love spanning more than two decades of hard work.

In this platinum jubilee year (2007) of the IAF, it will be appropriate if we remember our heroes of the past; as we celebrate, let us spare a thought for those "who have gone before". Such military aviation history is a must for all Indians who have served or are serving or aspiring to become pilots.

http://www.blonnet.com/life/2007/04/20/ ... 150300.htm

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 20 Apr 2009 03:54

Hi Krishna, I have it. Its a pretty detailed work - I dont think anyone can write more on the topic after that book.

The author incidentally is from Bangalore. You can order the book from him if you need a copy.

Also

A New book was released on the 90th birthday of the Marshal of AF Arjan Singh in Delhi. The book - "The ICON : Marshal of the Indian Air Force Arjan Singh DFC " was written by Air Commodore Jasjit Singh. The book release was attended by Marshal Arjan Singh and ACM FH Major.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o_no4M2xEPY/S ... 732696.JPG (Shiv Aroors blog)

-Jagan

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 21 Apr 2009 06:49

Jagan, this may be of interest to you.

On Arjan Singh DFC

krishna_j · Post by **krishna_j** » 22 Apr 2009 09:49

Jagan wrote:Hi Krishna, I have it. Its a pretty detailed work - I dont think anyone can write more on the topic after that book.

The author incidentally is from Bangalore. You can order the book from him if you need a copy.

Also

A New book was released on the 90th birthday of the Marshal of AF Arjan Singh in Delhi. The book - "The ICON : Marshal of the Indian Air Force Arjan Singh DFC " was written by Air Commodore Jasjit Singh. The book release was attended by Marshal Arjan Singh and ACM FH Major.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_o_no4M2xEPY/S ... 732696.JPG (Shiv Aroors blog)

-Jagan

ok - will speak to him Jagan

How is the Book on Medals and awards of India from manohar ?

Nayak · Post by **Nayak** » 23 Apr 2009 21:25

Scans courtesy Vayu

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 24 Apr 2009 05:34

krishna_j wrote:[
How is the Book on Medals and awards of India from manohar ?

great reference on medals - but you have to be very deep into medal collection and military research and it will be your thing.

JaiS · Post by **JaiS** » 24 Apr 2009 05:59

From:

Bonhams sells Spitfire for £1.7m

When the Vickers-Supermarine Spitfire family of single-seat fighter aircraft initially entered service in 1938, the Mark I model was an extremely sophisticated, blindingly fast and supremely powerful eight-gun weapon of war. Training pilots were expected to make the transition from humble training aircraft to this new thoroughbred, and the gulf between the two proved huge. A two-seat training version of the Battle of Britain Spitfire was first considered in 1941, but barely a handful of local service conversions were made before 1946. A post-war batch of 20 Mark IX airframes were then converted into two-seat form as the Type 509 model, for supply most notably to the Indian and Irish air forces. The forward cockpit was moved forward 13 1/2-inches and a second cockpit was inserted behind it, slightly raised to give its occupant improved forward vision. Price was quoted at the time as £5,200!

Rakesh · Post by **Rakesh** » 10 May 2009 07:57

Not sure if this has been posted before. But click on the link below...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/markdmartin/3476360167/

• Taking his dog Kanchi (a wire haired Dachund) up for a sortie in a Mig 21; he had Air Force Sergeant Unni make a special harness that strapped Kanchi to his G-suit and took her for 1 sortie below 10,000 ft and did a few high speed passes across the tower.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 11 May 2009 21:50

PAF Mirages at War at Kaiser Tufail's Blog

http://kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.com/200 ... t-war.html

Very interesting read

-Jagan

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 31 May 2009 03:25

lol nice video shiv, but the words chamcha and lifafa would mean you are losing the western audience. maybe you can find the english equivalent.

One nitpick though. Kacker went down in the area about the same time , perhaps a few minutes before Bhagwat and Brar were lost. So its incorrect to say he was lost hours earlier. The dispute is that we say he didnt go down to Alam and Alam claims him as his own.

I know nitpicks - and reminds me of the intense indo pak fora battles of ten years ago