UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Ministry of Civil Aviation
Second provisional list of beneficiaries under PLI Scheme for drones and drone components
https://www.civilaviation.gov.in/en/in-focus
https://www.civilaviation.gov.in/sites/ ... onents.pdf
Second provisional list of beneficiaries under PLI Scheme for drones and drone components
https://www.civilaviation.gov.in/en/in-focus
https://www.civilaviation.gov.in/sites/ ... onents.pdf
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
East Tech 2022- IAF to receive anti-drone system from Big Bang Boom Solutions
Chennai-based Big Bang Boom Solutions will deliver its Anti-Drone Defence System (ADDS) to the Indian Air Force (IAF) from August, Gaurav Sharma, chief government relationship officer of the defence startup firm told Janes .
Speaking at the East Tech 2022 event in Kolkata on 8 July, Sharma said the company received a request for proposal (RFP) in June 2022 to provide an undisclosed number of ADDS units to the IAF.
The complete ADDS system is portable and can be operated by a single person. The system utilises radar detection, electro-optic/infrared (EO/IR) tracking, and passive radio frequency (RF) scanning features to provide countermeasures against rogue unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs), Big Bang Boom Solutions said.
The system, which has an upmast weight of 25 kg, has a detection range of up to 20 km and provides an effective jamming range of 15–16 km, Sharma said. The system has a wide frequency detection band (400 Mhz – 6 Ghz), artifical intelligence (AI)-enabled pattern recognition, and can provide jamming solutions in less than five seconds after the UAV has entered the jamming range.
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East Tech 2022- Hawking Defence offers solutions to Indian armed forces
Chennai-based firm Hawking Defence showcased a number of solutions for the Indian Armed Forces at East Tech 2022, an event held in Kolkata by the Indian Army's Eastern Command on 7 and 8 July.
Captain (retd) Amber Singh Uban, company director, told Janes that Hawking Defence is offering the Indian military indigenous solutions including a series of hand-launched micro unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs), a wearable counter-unmanned aerial system (C-UAS), and a ‘Drone Flare System'.
Three micro UAVs were displayed by the company, each weighing around 400 g and characterised as being capable of swarming. Capt Uban said all three UAVs can be controlled by a single ground control system.
The Balidan micro UAV is designed as a loitering munition. The UAV can be utilised by an assault team to breach walls or mitigate rogue elements. The UAV has a foldable design and can be easily stowed in the gear of a dismounted soldier. The UAV has a Dash speed of 65 kt, Capt Uban said.
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East Tech 2022- CDSpace Robotics showcases Spot V3 VTOL UAV
Indian firm CDSpace Robotics exhibited its new SPOT V3 fixed-wing vertical take-off and landing (VTOL) unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) at East Tech 2022, an event held in Kolkata by the Indian Army's Eastern Command on 7 and 8 July.
Piyush Negi, co-founder and chief product officer of CDSpace Robotics, told Janes that the SPOT V3 system is based on an indigenous design and is being developed in-house primarily for intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance (ISR) roles.
The UAV features a fuselage structure with a shoulder-mounted wing (with detachable outer sections), a V-tail configuration, a total of eight electric motors mounted fore and aft on four booms (two each attached to inner and outer sections of the wings), a chin-mounted gimbal sensor payload, and four landing legs.
The UAV, which has a wingspan of 4.5 m, is equipped with a single internal combustion engine, featuring electronic fuel injection, for horizontal flight. The engine, which produces 4 kW (5.5 hp) of power, also has an integrated generator to cater for onboard power requirements for avionics and sensors.
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IN issues RFI for shipborne UAVs
India has announced an intention to procure 40 Naval Shipborne Unmanned Aerial Systems (NSUAS) for warships more than 100 m in length.
In a request for information (RFI) issued on 29 June, the Ministry of Defence (MoD) and the Indian Navy said that the NSUAS will be used for surveillance tasks, including signals intelligence (SIGINT), target acquisition, reconnaissance, and maritime domain awareness around a naval task group.
Secondary roles would comprise anti-piracy, anti-terrorist activities, and assistance in Search-and-Rescue (SAR), the MoD said in the RFI document.
According to Janes data, the Indian Navy operates three unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) squadrons from shore-based locations. Janes data adds that each squadron is very likely equipped with four IAI Heron Mk II and six IAI Searcher II UAVs.
The latest requirement is focused on procuring indigenously developed platforms.
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https://indianexpress.com/article/citie ... s-8053297/
The Tapas is about to enter production quite soon.
The Tapas is about to enter production quite soon.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Tapas does not have a UCAV variant and we are stuck with Heron-TP imports ?
The TAPAS is an intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance (ISR) UAV. It is an evolution of the Rustom II armed combat UAV, which was previously being developed by the ADE. The agency is a branch of the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO).
ADE told Janes that the name ‘Rustom II' was cancelled in 2019. The system was rebranded as TAPAS. The change reflects the platform's transition from a combat-oriented platform to a surveillance UAV.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
possibly because Ghatak or SwIFT is the UCAV the forces are aiming for? do we have a set/defined RoE for a RUSTOM based UCAV?Rony wrote:Tapas does not have a UCAV variant and we are stuck with Heron-TP imports ?
The TAPAS is an intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance (ISR) UAV. It is an evolution of the Rustom II armed combat UAV, which was previously being developed by the ADE. The agency is a branch of the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO).
ADE told Janes that the name ‘Rustom II' was cancelled in 2019. The system was rebranded as TAPAS. The change reflects the platform's transition from a combat-oriented platform to a surveillance UAV.
also - am not 100% sure janes has the right info all the time
also, I think it was rustom 1 with the 2 helina missiles that was spotted on taxi trials - dont remember rustom 2 ever being spotted with any missiles
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
UAVs is one area where the DRDO (specifically ADE) is to be blamed, not the services. The IA has actually been ordering indigenous products from private players, when they are found to be good.
ADE has been a disaster, permanently in R&D mode and never in Delivery mode. The new Director seems to have instilled some sense of urgency, which is why TAPAS is close to even seeing the light of day. But the lethargy seems deep.
ADE has been a disaster, permanently in R&D mode and never in Delivery mode. The new Director seems to have instilled some sense of urgency, which is why TAPAS is close to even seeing the light of day. But the lethargy seems deep.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
TAPAS report by India TV.
Ground control station view is the first time I'm seeing it.
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Does anyone know the powerplant for the RUAV200 from HAL. ?
Is it VRDE 65hp wankel engine ?
Is it VRDE 65hp wankel engine ?
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
https://twitter.com/TheLegateIN/status/ ... EDTUDucmqA ---> Report: Since Israeli Heron UAVs of Indian Navy have completed their life cycles they will be replaced with far more capable MQ-9B Sea Guardians.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
https://www.rediff.com/news/report/indi ... 220918.htm
I don't know which company and what indigenous weapons are going to get integrated into the Heron.
But i hope that it will be integrated with the UAV launched weapons that was shown some months ago.
September 18, 2022Indian defence firms to arm Israeli Heron drones for IAF's Project Cheetah
I don't know which company and what indigenous weapons are going to get integrated into the Heron.
But i hope that it will be integrated with the UAV launched weapons that was shown some months ago.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Highlights the requirement for large number of cost-effective counter drone systems, at local security level
Punjab: 100 sorties by drones from Pakistan in just 1 year, 7 shot down
Punjab: 100 sorties by drones from Pakistan in just 1 year, 7 shot down
The Border Security Force (BSF) in Punjab has gunned down seven Pakistani drones in about a year's time, according to BSF's inspector general, Punjab Frontier, Asif Jalal.
According to estimates, there have been over 100 drone intrusions during the same period. The forensic examination of fallen drones has revealed that Pakistan-based smugglers keep changing their payload drop strategies to hoodwink Indian security forces.
Instead of their earlier strategy of airdropping contraband in open fields or near roadsides from where it was collected by Indian smugglers, Pakistani drone pilots nowadays airdrop illegal consignments either on the rooftop of a house or near it to avoid the attention of security forces.
Sources said every drone had built-in memory like that of a mobile phone which stored data, including the place of origin of the drone, how long and where it flew, flying speed and height, and where it delivered the payload, among others.
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Indigenous loitering munition successfully hits target at Pokhran.
An indigenous loitering munition, capable of operating from difficult terrain and high altitude areas, has reached a milestone by successfully
demonstrating its strike capability during tests conducted at Pokhran on Thursday.
Developed by Tata Advanced Systems Limited (TASL), the autonomous system is designed for Vertical Take Off and Landing (VTOL) and will soon be inducted into the armed forces. Sources told ET that the system - named ALS 50 - accurately hit the ground target with an explosive warhead during trials.
The test is a landmark for the private industry which has scaled up efforts in recent years to develop tailored solutions for the armed forces, on the back of policy initiatives steered by the Defence Ministry.
The ALS 50 - which can take off like a quadcopter and transitions into fixed wing mode during flight for long distance travel - has also demonstrated its ability to operate from high altitude areas during tests in Ladakh earlier this year.
Developed by a team of young engineers at TASL, the ALS 50 has an autonomous targeting system that can accurately identify and home into a pre-determined target. The system can also be scaled up to increase range and payload capability, as per requirements of the armed forces. Future development can also include integration of Artificial Intelligence and swarming capabilities.
The VTOL capability gives the system the ability to operate in areas where limited space is available, like narrow valleys, fortified mountain positions, small jungle clearings and the decks of warships. The armed forces have been looking to induct a range of loitering munitions - relatively low cost 'suicide drones' that can be used to accurately take down high value targets like command centres, missile launchers and enemy armour.
An indigenous loitering munition, capable of operating from difficult terrain and high altitude areas, has reached a milestone by successfully
demonstrating its strike capability during tests conducted at Pokhran on Thursday.
Developed by Tata Advanced Systems Limited (TASL), the autonomous system is designed for Vertical Take Off and Landing (VTOL) and will soon be inducted into the armed forces. Sources told ET that the system - named ALS 50 - accurately hit the ground target with an explosive warhead during trials.
The test is a landmark for the private industry which has scaled up efforts in recent years to develop tailored solutions for the armed forces, on the back of policy initiatives steered by the Defence Ministry.
The ALS 50 - which can take off like a quadcopter and transitions into fixed wing mode during flight for long distance travel - has also demonstrated its ability to operate from high altitude areas during tests in Ladakh earlier this year.
Developed by a team of young engineers at TASL, the ALS 50 has an autonomous targeting system that can accurately identify and home into a pre-determined target. The system can also be scaled up to increase range and payload capability, as per requirements of the armed forces. Future development can also include integration of Artificial Intelligence and swarming capabilities.
The VTOL capability gives the system the ability to operate in areas where limited space is available, like narrow valleys, fortified mountain positions, small jungle clearings and the decks of warships. The armed forces have been looking to induct a range of loitering munitions - relatively low cost 'suicide drones' that can be used to accurately take down high value targets like command centres, missile launchers and enemy armour.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Paras Aerospace Showcases Lethal Made-In-India Archer-B8 UCAV Attack Drone That Can Drop 8-mortar Bombs
The made-in-India Archer-B8 has the capability of carrying 8-mortar bomb ammunition and dropping in a single sortie at the identified marked location. The dropping of payload ammunition can be done by controlling munition-dropping manually or autonomously at predefined marked positions.
Paras Aerospace is a subsidiary of Paras Defence and Space Technologies Limited and it claims that the Archer-B8 UCAV attack drone can provide tactical advantage to frontline soldiers in combat operations.This attack drone can identify, track and attack the enemy positions. Thus, helping in minimising battlefield casualties while providing strategic combat advantage.
“In today’s combat and surveillance scenarios, the drones are playing an important role right from monitoring, tracking, and even destroying the enemy positions. Archer-B8 is a definite advantage for the armed forces and homeland security agencies for surveillance and security operations. Imagine, a soldier being assisted with Archer-B8 can monitor remotely the enemy position and even attack those without becoming prone to an enemy’s weapon fire,” said Pankaj Akula, CEO, Paras Aerospace.
This company also specialises in designing and manufacturing drone cameras indigenously. The camera capabilities include dual EO-IR stabilisation, thermal sensors, laser locator for long-range observation, and being lightweight the drone’s payload carrying capacity is not compromised. The cameras have the capability to zoom up to X80.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
https://twitter.com/DefenceDecode/statu ... XAALwo28fQ - Twin Turbo Prop UCAV system by India's Paras Aerospace Private Limited.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Indigenous UAV Rustom-2 to complete user trials by August 2023
The indigenous medium altitude long endurance (MALE) unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) is expected to complete all user trials by August 2023, according to defence officials. Parallelly, a separate project for the weaponisation of the Rustom UAV is also under way.
“Four prototypes of Rustom-2 are currently flying. Five production models will be manufactured by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd. (HAL), which is the production partner,” a defence official said on the sidelines of DefExpo-2022. “The production models will be ready in five or six months.”
A second official said that night flying trials had started but were held up due to logistical issues and were expected to be completed shortly. “User trials are scheduled to be conducted soon,” the official said.
Last December, Rustom-2 had crossed a milestone by reaching an altitude of 25,000 feet and an endurance of 10 hours. The target is to reach an altitude of 30,000 feet with an endurance of 20 hours endurance which has to be demonstrated, the officials stated.
DRDO officials had said in the past that Rustom-2 technologically matched the contemporary UAVs available and would also be cheaper than the imported ones while meeting the requirements of the three Services.
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https://www.businessworld.in/article/Am ... 22-458834/
Not sure what has been agreed G2G, but this is from the blue! I thought the $3B deal for MQ-9B was dead. Now we are hearing that there is some screwdrivergiri (local assembly) involved and the negotiations are still on
This is from the CNS. So, not a random remark!
Its a great system, so I wouldn't mind more purchases. But each unit costs the same as 3 Tejas! Rustom cannot come online fast enough. Not sure what is to be gained by local assembly. Our track record on screwdriver-giri of CKDs hasn't been great
Not sure what has been agreed G2G, but this is from the blue! I thought the $3B deal for MQ-9B was dead. Now we are hearing that there is some screwdrivergiri (local assembly) involved and the negotiations are still on
This is from the CNS. So, not a random remark!
Its a great system, so I wouldn't mind more purchases. But each unit costs the same as 3 Tejas! Rustom cannot come online fast enough. Not sure what is to be gained by local assembly. Our track record on screwdriver-giri of CKDs hasn't been great
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Or each Mq-9 cost as much as Rafale. In its defense, it has very low operating cost and wider usage, even during peace time.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
If they buy HALE for Naval Surveillance, its okay. Its useful too.
But the stupid equal distribution bw all three forces is not acceptable. Forces have to stop acting like 6 year old kids who want everything shared equally.
But the stupid equal distribution bw all three forces is not acceptable. Forces have to stop acting like 6 year old kids who want everything shared equally.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
^^ there is news of naval mq 9 being used for surveillance on LAC during the recent flare up
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Some youtube analysts have claimed that assembling this would help DRDO in their own HALE projects. I cant believe that any screwdrivergiri can help in any learning useful for our own HALE.
But is there any truth to this claim?
But is there any truth to this claim?
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
I really hope our Industry starts making these in-house soon. Should be less challenging than aerial vehicles.
It will be good if automobile majors like Mahindra, Tata get into this. Good export potential too.
Game-Changer: India procures Estonian unmanned ground vehicle THeMIS
It will be good if automobile majors like Mahindra, Tata get into this. Good export potential too.
Game-Changer: India procures Estonian unmanned ground vehicle THeMIS
The Indian Army has recently procured Milrem Robotics’ Tracked Hybrid Modular Infantry System (THeMIS) unmanned ground vehicle (UGV) from Estonia. THeMIS has been making waves in the military technology sector, and India became the latest country to add it to its arsenal.
THeMIS is a versatile and highly advanced UGV that has a range of potential applications in military operations, from reconnaissance and surveillance to logistics and transportation. With its ability to operate in a variety of environments and complete tasks with a high degree of autonomy, THeMIS has the potential to significantly enhance the capabilities of the Indian military.
Its primary purpose is to reduce the number of troops needed on the battlefield by performing a variety of roles, including transportation, ordnance disposal, intelligence operations, and even being weaponized. THeMIS has an open architecture that allows it to be quickly configured for different missions.
The UGV has a payload capacity of 750 KG with an open architecture. THeMIS is a small, tracked unmanned vehicle that is 7.8 feet long and 3.75 feet high. It has a maximum speed of 20 km/h and a maximum payload capacity of 1,250 kg and is equipped with advanced sensors and cameras that allow it to perform tasks with a high degree of autonomy and navigate challenging terrain. It is powered by a hybrid-electric drive system that combines an internal combustion engine with an electric motor, providing a range of up to 15 hours on a single tank of fuel.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
No, what is going to be learnt by this screwdrivergiri?YashG wrote:
Snip....
But is there any truth to this claim?
Working on carbon fiber?
We have expertise in that through the construction of LCA, the rotor blades of the different helicopters. Etc.
Aerodynamics?
If Rustom and other projects have failed to teach. This is not going to succeed.
Control laws?
If the nearly 35 years of tinkering arround drones using long easy as a surrogate did not teach our people anything. This is not going to teach anything.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Manish_P wrote:
Game-Changer: India procures Estonian unmanned ground vehicle THeMIS
The Indian Army has recently procured Milrem Robotics’ Tracked Hybrid Modular Infantry System (THeMIS) unmanned ground vehicle (UGV) from Estonia. THeMIS has been making waves in the military technology sector, and India became the latest country to add it to its arsenal.
I never fail to be surprised how the IA quickly manages to import items from no name manufacturers. Somehow the usual summer ,winter, rainy, full moon with Equinox and Deepika dancing in background type trials are never done in these cases.
Here is a system that manufacturer claim not withstanding is not proven anywhere. Estonia don’t have a desert as far as i know, so not sure how much rugged it is to withstand the Rajasthan desert type weather conditions. There are no reports of the famous “s0ak” test that seems to be gold standard for IA where it is expected to start after overnight in open… Then there is a whole supply chain for this product to take care of…
How come there is money for this type of things?
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Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Brilliant Tanaji, for the sheer lyrical quality of the prose. Take a bow! Just to speculate, what would be the 'core competency' of this Estonian company?Tanaji wrote:Manish_P wrote:
Game-Changer: India procures Estonian unmanned ground vehicle THeMIS
The Indian Army has recently procured Milrem Robotics’ Tracked Hybrid Modular Infantry System (THeMIS) unmanned ground vehicle (UGV) from Estonia. THeMIS has been making waves in the military technology sector, and India became the latest country to add it to its arsenal.
I never fail to be surprised how the IA quickly manages to import items from no name manufacturers. Somehow the usual summer ,winter, rainy, full moon with Equinox and Deepika dancing in background type trials are never done in these cases.
Here is a system that manufacturer claim not withstanding is not proven anywhere. Estonia don’t have a desert as far as i know, so not sure how much rugged it is to withstand the Rajasthan desert type weather conditions. There are no reports of the famous “s0ak” test that seems to be gold standard for IA where it is expected to start after overnight in open… Then there is a whole supply chain for this product to take care of…
How come there is money for this type of things?
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Saar, I have no doubt that it works … probably. It is well engineered for their set of conditions as well and no doubt unmanned vehicles is their core competency. But the question is there:
Will it work in Indian conditions that range in various extremes. I believe we have past experience on this score.
Why do Indian products never get the same amount of love as these cases and are subjected to never ending cycles of testing? Arjun, Nag, LCH, the list goes on..
I am dumping on the differing the treatment the powers that be that do the acquisition mete out to Indian products than this Estonian product itself.
Will it work in Indian conditions that range in various extremes. I believe we have past experience on this score.
Why do Indian products never get the same amount of love as these cases and are subjected to never ending cycles of testing? Arjun, Nag, LCH, the list goes on..
I am dumping on the differing the treatment the powers that be that do the acquisition mete out to Indian products than this Estonian product itself.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
A desi defence company in Ahmedabad is making exact same thing, they displayed it at defexpo - IA had been taking trials. Why wouldn't they procure it desi - like not even place a token order to help these small companies take off!Tanaji wrote:Manish_P wrote:
Game-Changer: India procures Estonian unmanned ground vehicle THeMIS
The Indian Army has recently procured Milrem Robotics’ Tracked Hybrid Modular Infantry System (THeMIS) unmanned ground vehicle (UGV) from Estonia. THeMIS has been making waves in the military technology sector, and India became the latest country to add it to its arsenal.
I never fail to be surprised how the IA quickly manages to import items from no name manufacturers. Somehow the usual summer ,winter, rainy, full moon with Equinox and Deepika dancing in background type trials are never done in these cases.
How come there is money for this type of things?
All that lip service IA does for Startups - it ends up placing no orders to let a desi system really takeoff.
And **** these reporters calling imported systems game changers... can these ******* be stopped to use this 'game changing' drivel they use to sell imports!
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What is the power train driven by? Is it electric or internal combustion driven one? Is it like to like with the Estonian one?YashG wrote:A desi defence company in Ahmedabad is making exact same thing, they displayed it at defexpo - IA had been taking trials. Why wouldn't they procure it desi - like not even place a token order to help these small companies take off!Tanaji wrote:
I never fail to be surprised how the IA quickly manages to import items from no name manufacturers. Somehow the usual summer ,winter, rainy, full moon with Equinox and Deepika dancing in background type trials are never done in these cases.
How come there is money for this type of things?
All that lip service IA does for Startups - it ends up placing no orders to let a desi system really takeoff.
And **** these reporters calling imported systems game changers... can these ******* be stopped to use this 'game changing' drivel they use to sell imports!
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Estonian one is much more mature system (NATO uses it). But placing a token order even will allow the desi company to get resources for scaling their own system. There is no other way than orders for a company to mature a system. A token order can help startups in raising funds from market to scale themselves - it can also lead to acquisitions and more corporate capital. But none of it starts unless IA places some orders.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Yes, there is truth to that claim.YashG wrote:Some youtube analysts have claimed that assembling this would help DRDO in their own HALE projects. I cant believe that any screwdrivergiri can help in any learning useful for our own HALE.
But is there any truth to this claim?
The HALE as an item, subject to the laws of physics, will rarely change.
However, everything else is in a state of constant flux: materials, associated costs, size of sensors - thus weight, methods of manufacturing, testing instruments, and many more. So, there is a potential to learn a LOT. Potential is the operative word.
Indians are risk averse. As I see it, India can pay for internal R&D or outsource that risk. After all R&D for most of these items means 80%+ failure rate - something most Indians cannot stomach.
I could be wrong here, however, since I do not see imported technologies permeating into the Indian ecosystem (at a rate to move the needle) I would tend to agree that not much is being learned. But, if one wants there is a LOT to be learned.
____________________
On a slightly diff note: just because the LCA uses composites does not mean India has mastered that tech. I bet even what Indians knows about composites can be improved enormously, even for the LCA. But, ....... that carries a "risk".
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YashG, good points.. Just 6 posts up, there is a this post:
viewtopic.php?p=2567397#p2567397
Now not much needs to be said about these types of drones and their use. The Ukraine war has amply demonstrated the utility of such tools. Even if the IA thinks these are not for them, the Pakis and Chinese will surely use them. Would it hurt for IA to place an order for these to act as the equivalent of an aggressor squadron to come up with tactics to deal with them? Or to train the ordinary jawan on how to identify and destroy them? Must everything be gold plated?
viewtopic.php?p=2567397#p2567397
Now not much needs to be said about these types of drones and their use. The Ukraine war has amply demonstrated the utility of such tools. Even if the IA thinks these are not for them, the Pakis and Chinese will surely use them. Would it hurt for IA to place an order for these to act as the equivalent of an aggressor squadron to come up with tactics to deal with them? Or to train the ordinary jawan on how to identify and destroy them? Must everything be gold plated?
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Exactly, the developer -> customer -> customer gives feedback -> developer integrates changes into the next version feedback loop never gets established because the customer (IA) doesn't order the product to begin with, therefore this iterative loop never gets established and the technology never gets properly developed. Compare that with US/EU/other countries where the govt/armed forces back the local developer to the hilt. But IA wants 'proven' 'mature' products onlee..YashG wrote:Estonian one is much more mature system (NATO uses it). But placing a token order even will allow the desi company to get resources for scaling their own system. There is no other way than orders for a company to mature a system. A token order can help startups in raising funds from market to scale themselves - it can also lead to acquisitions and more corporate capital. But none of it starts unless IA places some orders.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Has Swift made a second flight?
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Change the procurement process. Speak to the bean counters.YashG wrote:Estonian one is much more mature system (NATO uses it). But placing a token order even will allow the desi company to get resources for scaling their own system. There is no other way than orders for a company to mature a system. A token order can help startups in raising funds from market to scale themselves - it can also lead to acquisitions and more corporate capital. But none of it starts unless IA places some orders.
Give the armed forces the ability to invest in technologies/products that are not mature. Just because the armed forces trial something from a startup does not mean it has to be inducted. Do you know if the system was even close to being more than an R&D project?
Just bashing the services seems very fashionable.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Placing a token order is equal to investing. IA doesnt need to invest - even a token order is good if a tech is immature. Pvt sector will take care of the rest. Every 1 INR that IA will spend on a token order on a genuine company will help that company raise atleast 8-10 INR. Example - U place a 1 Mn USD order. Startup will be able to raise 8-10 Million USD from pvt investors.ks_sachin wrote:Change the procurement process. Speak to the bean counters.YashG wrote:Estonian one is much more mature system (NATO uses it). But placing a token order even will allow the desi company to get resources for scaling their own system. There is no other way than orders for a company to mature a system. A token order can help startups in raising funds from market to scale themselves - it can also lead to acquisitions and more corporate capital. But none of it starts unless IA places some orders.
Give the armed forces the ability to invest in technologies/products that are not mature. Just because the armed forces trial something from a startup does not mean it has to be inducted. Do you know if the system was even close to being more than an R&D project?
Just bashing the services seems very fashionable.
IA doesnt even need to pay up till the tech reaches whr IA wants. Just commit they will buy when its delivered. Then see pvt sector money playing wonders. Its a simple 1 + 1 = 11 thing. Nobody even needs to change the rules. IA has emergency procurement - Its at IA's discretion.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
Sirji,
In theory yes and there has to be some paperwork .But no officer is going to do anything that is not part of a process and within rules. Career limiting move.
You have to go to MoD and change the process.
The process is laid down by MoD and you do remember that the IA had to get clearance from MoD even to let Kalyani use firing ranges.
In theory yes and there has to be some paperwork .But no officer is going to do anything that is not part of a process and within rules. Career limiting move.
You have to go to MoD and change the process.
The process is laid down by MoD and you do remember that the IA had to get clearance from MoD even to let Kalyani use firing ranges.
Re: UAVs, Drones, Remote Surveillance Tech
This is the beauty of the Indian procurement system: there is no answer to the question of “who decides on what to buy”. You ask the armed forces they will reply “No sir, we don’t buy anything, it’s the MoD”. You ask the MoD they say “No sir, we don’t decide anything, the armed forces tell us what to buy. We only make sure process of followed “. You ask the politician, they say “No sir, we don’t sign off anything without MoD or armed forces telling us, we are not experts”.
And yet, the T90 gets bought over the Arjun, the Marut gets a burial, the Helina/Nag is in limbo and now soon the local gun systems will get a burial.
The Chandigarh lobby meanwhile knows precisely who buys what.
And yet, the T90 gets bought over the Arjun, the Marut gets a burial, the Helina/Nag is in limbo and now soon the local gun systems will get a burial.
The Chandigarh lobby meanwhile knows precisely who buys what.