Airborne Early Warning & Control: News & Discussion

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 04 Nov 2010 07:36

Russia Sends 3rd AWACS Plane to India

shanksinha · Post by **shanksinha** » 08 Nov 2010 01:58

Is this the Third airframe? (Image Dated 28 Aug 2010, Rostov on Don)

Photo Copyright Michail Mizikaev via russianplanes.net

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 08 Nov 2010 11:56

shanksinha wrote:Is this the Third airframe? (Image Dated 28 Aug 2010, Rostov on Don)

Too humble, sirji. Wikipedia and Google God confirm your suspicions for KW-3553. Great photos.

shanksinha · Post by **shanksinha** » 08 Nov 2010 15:05

^^Thanks Pratik, here is the same bird flying on October 4. Very nice angle looks a beauty:

Photo Copyright Iva Savickii via russianplanes.net

sankum · Post by **sankum** » 09 Nov 2010 11:13

India's first advanced radar system to roll out 2011-end

rahulm · Post by **rahulm** » 09 Nov 2010 13:04

DRDO's Centre for Airborne Systems (CABS) has designed the indigenous radar, partly perhaps learning from Israel's Greenpine radar, one or two of which were sold to India some years ago without software.

chiru · Post by **chiru** » 09 Nov 2010 15:09

^^^ i think it refers to source code being unavailable

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 09 Nov 2010 15:49

I dont think they the Israels will sell GreenPine and AWACS with source code and hardware TOT etc , its just off the shelf purchase of both with some customisation done for our needs by them.

VishalJ · Post by **VishalJ** » 15 Nov 2010 10:49

sum · Post by **sum** » 15 Nov 2010 10:54

Where was this taken? palam?

VishalJ · Post by **VishalJ** » 15 Nov 2010 10:56

care to click on it to find out ?
Tel-Aviv Sir

sum · Post by **sum** » 15 Nov 2010 10:57

Sorry, sir....link haraam in office network onlee..

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 17 Nov 2010 03:17

Registration/Serial No. KW-3553, the Third A-50EI Phalcon with the Chapati fitted on.
Date : November 03, 2010

Clicky

SaiK · Post by **SaiK** » 17 Nov 2010 06:25

Nice pics. nice

naird · Post by **naird** » 17 Nov 2010 08:13

Great pics...Have we inked the contract on additional 3 AWACS which are supposed to be more upgraded than these ones ?

andy B · Post by **andy B** » 17 Nov 2010 08:20

naird wrote:Great pics...Have we inked the contract on additional 3 AWACS which are supposed to be more upgraded than these ones ?

IIRC it was for an additional two in the immediate future with the total phalcon fleet to be between 10 to 12...again IIRC onlee

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 22 Nov 2010 17:20

X-post

Electronic warfare system experts to gather in Bangalore
MSN India

India is organising the first AOC India National Electronic Warfare (EW) Workshop (EWWI-2010) here on November 24 and 25. Dr Prahlada, Chief Controller of Research & Development, Defense Research & Development Organisation (DRDO), would inaugurate the event.

AOC India Chapter was established under the presidentship of Dr U K Revankar, Director, Defence Avionics Research Establishment (DARE), DRDO, during the first international EW conference in India (EWCI-2010) in February this year. As a part of the parent Association AOC, located in USA, the India chapter promotes the role of advocating EW between professionals of various organisations under Government, Ministry of Defence and industries.

At present, the AOC India Chapter is actively supported by DRDO scientists and industry professionals who have a common goal on the development of EW systems for Armed Forces. "The workshop would enable close interaction among the EW professionals and explore the technologies, which our Armed Forces should adopt to counter current & futuristic battle scenario", according to DRDO.

shukla · Post by **shukla** » 24 Nov 2010 18:57

X-post

India to built two test ranges of electronic warfare systems
Business Standard/ Press Trust of India

India would build two ranges for testing radar-based electronic warfare systems as it seeks to strengthen its capability in the field, seen to be vital in war scenarios. One range would come up in Chitradurga in Karnataka and another in Tandur in Andhra Pradesh, which would test "non-communication" and "communication" EW systems, respectively, a key defence official said today.

These two would be part of the 4,000-acre aeronautical test range in Chitradurga, some 200 km from here, and the 8,000-acre one in Tandur, some 135 km from Hyderabad. At present, EW systems are tested in the IAF range in Gwalior in a limited way. Once the two new testing ranges (in Chitradurga and Tandur) are operational in 2012-13, experimental and R&D tests can be conducted, said Prahlada, Chief Controller, R&D (Ae & SI), Defence Research and Development Organisation.

Speaking at the India National Electronic Warfare Workshop (EWWI-2010), he said an investment of Rs 200 crore each is expected in the two test ranges. "Electronic Warfare is becoming a very important area because... You may have all weapons but if somebody jams you (the weapons), you are as good as useless. Before firing the missile, you are already decimated," he said. "Without electronic warfare, you cannot win a war. Once you have it (EW capability), you have to test it, you can't wait for a war to test it," Prahlada said.

He said the present EW systems have been integrated with MiG-27 fighters and operational flights are slated next year. They would be integrated with MiG-29 fighters and the light combat aircraft next year. In 2012, Prahlada said India would fly a fourth-generational EW system, which is being developed by Defence Avionics Research Establishment and Defence Electronics Research Laboratory.

Prahlada also said DRDO was expecting a budget of Rs 9,000 crore in 2011-12 in the area of strategic systems and tactical defence.

PratikDas · Post by **PratikDas** » 05 Dec 2010 09:21

Open invitation to gurus and mango jingos to have a look at my suggestion in the Newbie Thread. Many thanks!

dinesha · Post by **dinesha** » 11 Jan 2011 12:18

Airborne Early Warning Aircraft ready for roll out by next year
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/128 ... ready.html

ramana · Post by **ramana** » 21 Jan 2011 09:32

Anyone recall the IAF made available a katara HS 748 for the AWEC prototype which crashed? Seems like there is a reluctance to support local programs.

merlin · Post by **merlin** » 21 Jan 2011 09:41

ramana wrote:Anyone recall the IAF made available a katara HS 748 for the AWEC prototype which crashed? Seems like there is a reluctance to support local programs.

Exactly. IAF said it could not spare an Il-76 for modifications so they gave an old HS-748.

Old time service guys still think (after all the recent successes) that DRDO is khadi gram udyog. Plus there are huge ego issues here and lots of past bad blood with DRDO. Takes a mature mind to look past all that baggage and look at national interest first.

Jagan · Post by **Jagan** » 21 Jan 2011 11:28

ramana wrote:Anyone recall the IAF made available a katara HS 748 for the AWEC prototype which crashed? Seems like there is a reluctance to support local programs.

merlin wrote:IAF said it could not spare an Il-76 for modifications so they gave an old HS-748.

With just 15 Il-76s on its strength - and assuming serviceability levels are 70-80% on an average. the IAF really cannot afford to spare a single aircraft for a program that may have gone on for decades. Additionally, the HS748 crashed because the radar dome seperated and knocked off the vertical fin. Not the aircraft's fault. Nothing wrong with their decision there not to spare an Il-76

Austin · Post by **Austin** » 21 Jan 2011 12:25

Jagan wrote: Nothing wrong with their decision there not to spare an Il-76

True , the other issue with IL-76 is we do not have the design document to make the structural changes on a IL-76 , so they would have to involve ilushin and TSAGI to do the wind tunnel test for the hack and fly it to Russia to do the structural changes.

HAL has been manufacturing HS-748 for donkey years and could do the necessary structural changes for the hack and without involving anybody and ofcourse they could spare a HS-748

Rahul M · Post by **Rahul M** » 21 Jan 2011 12:50

guys, if you want to discuss scams in general please use the specific thread.

Jagan wrote:
ramana wrote:Anyone recall the IAF made available a katara HS 748 for the AWEC prototype which crashed? Seems like there is a reluctance to support local programs.
merlin wrote:IAF said it could not spare an Il-76 for modifications so they gave an old HS-748.
With just 15 Il-76s on its strength - and assuming serviceability levels are 70-80% on an average. the IAF really cannot afford to spare a single aircraft for a program that may have gone on for decades. Additionally, the HS748 crashed because the radar dome seperated and knocked off the vertical fin. Not the aircraft's fault. Nothing wrong with their decision there not to spare an Il-76

unless IAF has some 4 engined aircraft in large numbers, they will never be able to spare one for a need like this. and given the numbers ordered for C-17, not to mention its cost, that seems very very unlikely.

the better option for DRDO would be to get a readily available civilian aircraft. air India probably has a dozen mothballed somewhere which can be acquired cheaply and one article kept up in the air by cannibalising.
GE for example uses an ex PanAm 747-100.

rohitvats · Post by **rohitvats** » 21 Jan 2011 13:33

ramana wrote:Anyone recall the IAF made available a katara HS 748 for the AWEC prototype which crashed? Seems like there is a reluctance to support local programs.

Sir, how did the "Khatara" impression came into being? Or the fact HS 748 was unsuitable for the project? And that HS 748 crashed because of some issues related to its age and very nature of the aircraft?

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 23 Jan 2011 17:54

LRDE L-STAR, Part of India's AEW&C Programme.

Pratyush · Post by **Pratyush** » 23 Jan 2011 20:27

The nube question I have is that does this radar have 360 capability?

kit · Post by **kit** » 23 Jan 2011 20:57

Pratyush wrote:The nube question I have is that does this radar have 360 capability?

doesnt look like it has.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 23 Jan 2011 21:02

neither does the Ereyie...though I read the ereyie azimuth to the sides is more than our 1st cut target and hence blind spot zones fore and aft smaller.

the only balance beam type radar which does apparently have 360' coverage is the Wedgetail MESA radar which has a T shape...the range fore and aft will be smaller because the aperture of the top part of the 'T' is much less than the length of the balance beam side looking arrays.

Marut · Post by **Marut** » 24 Jan 2011 19:27

SAAB Erieye has 300 degree coverage - 150' each side - giving a blind spot of 30 deg in the front and rear.
LRDE is supposed to match that too. From the little I know of the progress, it is reaching this level.

putnanja · Post by **putnanja** » 28 Jan 2011 06:30

Embraer To Roll Out Indian AEW And C On Feb. 21

India’s Embraer-built Airborne Early Warning & Control System (AEW&C) is scheduled for rollout Feb. 21 in Brazil.

A senior defense official confirmed to Aviation Week Jan. 27 that the first flight of the modified EMB-145 is expected around May. “The first EMB-145 will land in India in August 2011 for system integration and subsequent induction into the Indian Air Force (IAF),” the official says.
...
...
“The AEW&C with the systems integrated by CABS will fly in India in early 2012,” the official says. “CABS have already begun the integration on ground-based systems [according to the] exact specifications [of] the EMB-145, including the seating arrangements.”
...
...
The Indian AEW&C system can operate with a maximum crew of 12. “It can fly non-stop for 10-12 hours with midair-refueling,” the official adds. “The all-up weight is 24 tons. The aircraft is being modified to enable mounting of mission systems and be certified for airworthiness, including . . . icing conditions, by Brazilian authorities as per the FAR 25 standard.”
...

Juggi G · Post by **Juggi G** » 28 Jan 2011 21:15

Sizing Up the

LRDE L-STAR, Part of India's AEW&C Programme.

2200 x 1461 Resolution :-

http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/703/lrdelstar.jpg

VishalJ · Post by **VishalJ** » 04 Feb 2011 15:20

^ ROTATE ^

Gaur · Post by **Gaur** » 04 Feb 2011 15:36

^^
You really post the most beautiful pics.

Willy · Post by **Willy** » 04 Feb 2011 16:10

Marut wrote:SAAB Erieye has 300 degree coverage - 150' each side - giving a blind spot of 30 deg in the front and rear.
LRDE is supposed to match that too. From the little I know of the progress, it is reaching this level.

Why didnt they go for a full 360 degree coverage????

Cybaru · Post by **Cybaru** » 04 Feb 2011 21:37

In most cases, it isn't required. Most AEW fly with top cover of 4 to 6 planes. You are also flying in a pattern. Patterns are different for different theaters. When you fly a loop or pattern, you are constantly moving and turning, which kind of brings about 360 degree awareness without compromising fuel efficiency of the platform by sticking bulbous radar cones in the front and back. You also don't have to recertify the airframe with all those changes. You are always going to have blind spots somewhere on the platform even on those that claim 360 degree coverage. Think about it.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 Feb 2011 05:50

Cybaru wrote:You are always going to have blind spots somewhere on the platform even on those that claim 360 degree coverage. Think about it.

Absolutely. In fact "full coverage" would be a sphere with the AEW aircraft at the center. This is not achievable by one aircraft.

shiv · Post by **shiv** » 05 Feb 2011 06:01

I just realised that this thread was started by the late Harry. It's eerie to read his first post.

Singha · Post by **Singha** » 05 Feb 2011 09:04

whatever we put here in br, facebook, orkut is our legacy which will outlive us for sure....