If Volvo could do this, and that too in 1962, could they not be paid to help out kaveri?? and maybe develop a more successful offshoot??
Sweden has been gifted technology out of US's own geopolitical needs. So Sweden could stall/impede USSR from northern flank of NATO forces, during cold war, if war breaks out. Since end of Cold War, Sweden has not been in any particular favour from US. They were not given any work on F414 for Gripen E. Most probably RM12 would be end of Sweden's mil jet work.
Sweden was reached for help for Kaveri. Volvo was asked for consultancy for A/B. RM12 was even considered for LCA. Do remember Sweden barely has technology for Fan and A/B only. Nothing much. But that actually makes them a good partner for us. They have no fund or engine program to do more work on these technologies. And we want precisely those two modules to be debugged, so we can fun them. Would be mutually beneficial JV for both countries. But sadly they cant do shit unless uncle sam nods it seems. I don't think there is any OEM left which was not contacted for help by GTRE. Even if they agree to help, they need to be paid money no..? Has GOI offered to pay the money...? Last I checked GOI is seating on 2600Cr funding for 4yrs now.
Even taking help from French is nothing new. DRDO tried to borrow M88 core. Earlier IAF itself vetoed (and rightly so I think) borrowing M88 core if you believe some of the reports from 2008-2010 or so. This recent French help looks coming due to Rafale contract offset, had there been no Rafale deal we would not have seen any such initiative in all probability. So its not like GOI looks eager to fund engine development now. They can pay $1B to French but cannot give >$0.5B to GTRE.
You say why not have two parallel projects. Sure let's have it. That would be way to go. But if GOI does not fund mission critical single project, why do you think they will fund two projects.
No one expects any pilot to fly LCA with untested Kaveri in it. That why Kaveri needs to be tested on four engine airliner/transporter based FTB and then on twin engine fighter FTB. MiG-29 is best suited as Kaveri is quite near to RD33 in size and trust levels. Any other aircraft would demand significant changes in the FIghter airframe itself. That itself would become a project. No movement on FTB procurement. God know how long they gonna discus about it in Parliamentary committee. We very well know if the top tier of government wants something done, it gets done. Sadly engines is not their priority by a long shot.
Does anyone here really thing GOI/MoD is really keen on making desi engine...? GOI wanted strategically important capability of having Brahmos on Su-30MKI. We achieved what no one has done so far without any help from OEM and in like 1/10th the cost and in quite short time. No elaboration needs to be made for our success in Nuclear, Strategic missiles or Space technology. Why should Jet engine development be any different...? May be hard, but just put more efforts in it then.
I agree with your thoughts emphatically on us losing out on consolidating our available resources. We still have quite a bit of building blocks. We can still consolidate them. But I do not see it happening. I don't see the push from the top. Without that, our organisations are grappled with unimaginative/uninterested people in power and organisational egos dividing them.
I just do not buy the very simplistic argument of sweden being gifted technology due to the US's own geopolitical needs. If such were the actual case, then the direct sale of a purely military engine, in large numbers, would have sufficed to meet any and all such needs. All sweden wanted was a military engine that the US was not willing to sell them. In the end the US embargoed the RM8 for export sales because it peevishly claimed that the JT8D was after all a US engine.
BTW, didn't the US do just that with the GE engines for the LCA?? Does the US's own geopolitical needs count for naught when it comes to India and the so called technology transfer??
It cannot be an argument that the US transferred technology to sweden when sweden only wanted military engines but sold military engines to India when India only wants technology.
Where was the need for volvo to go through such a complicated design process, such a convoluted reverse engineering process where it ultimately resulted in the redesign of the entire engine itself??
Why did volvo jump needlessly through such high hoops, Its precisely because the US was not forthcoming with the critical help that sweden needed. If the US had given it's "faithful geopolitical ally" the military engine that it actually wanted, the entire problem would have been solved.
But the greedy US did not want sweden to develop a fighter to rival any of the US products thus undercutting the US export market. Isn't the Grippen doing just that today??
This is also the exact case of India today. It has paid the price for having the potential to make and export war planes. The HF 24 was the target in yester years and the LCA and its potential developed derivatives is the target today.
Volvo's approach to the RM8 development was like doing knee surgery by approaching the knee through the oesophagus, no??
Incidentally, Volvo seems to have touched, solved problems and overcome grave technical difficulties in most of the very areas that the kaveri seems to be having problems in.
Its easy to say that some one did not help us but at that time we also had a leader who insisted on lecturing the world from a high moral pedestal and that did not help in making friends and influencing people. Our people were poverty ridden, starving, hungry, jobless and without hope. Under such circumstances, when no one was willing to help, Homi Bhaba succeeded, did he not??
Did the poor guy have an extra testimonial?? No, but he had the ability, the technical chutzpah, and the drive. This makes a huge difference. If one has this then people tend to follow such leaders. APJ was another such guy. Look at ISRO also for such examples.
There is no champion today, of the likes of, and the stature of APJ, Bhaba who can lead, motivate enthuse and push through the kaveri project. Not even close.
You cannot expect any "parliamentary committee" to move forward when the entire project has all the makings of a hot potato and regularly dropped by many.
The politcos neither know nor they have cared to become aware of the intricacies of the work involved. They are also mostly grappling with the same open source knowledge available to most of the jantha.
The designers are unable to show anyone the light at the end of the tunnel. Under such circumstances, what could anyone expect from any govt with a limited mandate of five years?? It has been decades since the project began and there are no milestones to show to the public that can enthuse them and result in more financial support.
ISRO projects, DAE projects, Nuke submarine project, the gamut of warship projects that can be trotted out and displayed by the politicos on TV as though they have personally designed and built everything themselves, inaugurations, ribbon cuttings, photo ops et al.
One can come out with arcane reasons, esoteric equations and convoluted explanations as to why some piffling and absolutely bone dry parameter did not meet spec, point to the customer and say that they asked for too much but at the end of the day, there is nothing concrete to showcase.
We seem to be missing the point by a country mile. Its very easy to blame finances, infrastructure, nonavailability of testbed or what the GoI has not done. No one wants to address the 800 pound gorilla in the room which is at the very root of all the Kaveri problems.
I am sure that the ruskis must have, in addition to the project people, made a direct report to the GoI after the tests in Russia, as they had undoubtedly been tasked to do. That has not been made public.
Saddam used retired technology mandarins from various countries to further his project goals. I personally know of one desi company in the private sector that imported an amreki plant, lock, stock, and barrel and transplanted it to some wilderness in India and along with that, they also managed to snag the retired chief engineer from the same company. He led/leads the local Indian team.
They were from the defence sector and I have not kept up to say for sure but they may still be in business.
Do something, anything, take some initiative but we should not simply keep moaning that we have not received adequate funds, no one appreciates us, or we were never given a chance because that is not at the root of the problem.
Do a very simple back of the envelope calculation and see how much treasure has been expended over the years, including pay and allowances, establishment costs, travelling costs, and a myriad of other expenses, building, infrastructure, materials, fuel, vehicles, communications, subsidized food etc etc.
The figures will astound anyone. That is what it has already cost the Indian taxpayer, but
then, who's counting, no??
The Indian taxpayer is very rich. He can afford anything.