Tracking Errors in Defence reporting

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 11 Dec 2009 22:38

Worse, unlike the Indian Navy with its warship directorate, the IAF has no in-house expertise in designing aircraft and never acquired a stake in indigenous manufacture. Dispassionate analyses suggest that it matches or surpasses either of the American aircraft in the race and, in its more advanced configuration, can outperform even the Joint Strike Fighter F-35, a plane Lockheed Martin have promised to replace the F-16 with on a “one for one” basis were India to buy the latter aircraft.

What's this 'it' thats better than all these other aircraft?

vipins · Postby **vipins** » 11 Dec 2009 23:11

shameekg wrote:Little choice for IAF

Worse, unlike the Indian Navy with its warship directorate, the IAF has no in-house expertise in designing aircraft and never acquired a stake in indigenous manufacture. Dispassionate analyses suggest that it matches or surpasses either of the American aircraft in the race and, in its more advanced configuration, can outperform even the Joint Strike Fighter F-35, a plane Lockheed Martin have promised to replace the F-16 with on a “one for one” basis were India to buy the latter aircraft.

What's this 'it' thats better than all these other aircraft?

Could be MiG-29K(therefore may be MiG 35) as navy finalized it's customization.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 11 Dec 2009 23:47

vipins wrote:Could be MiG-29K(therefore may be MiG 35) as navy finalized it's customization.

Could be. Could be even better if the article actually mentioned it.

Especially when it calls the IAF laggards and such other things.

shiv · Postby **shiv** » 12 Dec 2009 07:07

vipins wrote:Could be MiG-29K(therefore may be MiG 35) as navy finalized it's customization.

Could be the aircraft that my uncle designed he died before he revealed the design. Maybe the reporter knew my uncle.

KrishG · Postby **KrishG** » 14 Dec 2009 01:14

Israel, India discuss AWACS delivery schedule

http://www.brahmand.com/news/storydetails.php?nid=2677&page=1&newsheadid=10

Israeli company Rafael is also vying for a $10 billion contract for the supply of 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft to the Indian Air Force, an IANS report said.

Cain Marko · Postby **Cain Marko** » 14 Dec 2009 01:43

shameekg wrote:
vipins wrote:Could be MiG-29K(therefore may be MiG 35) as navy finalized it's customization.

Could be. Could be even better if the article actually mentioned it.
Especially when it calls the IAF laggards and such other things.

Probly the Su-30MKI. Upgraded version that can supposedly make life miserable for the JSF is probly the Su-35 or Su-30MKI ver.2. Mr. Karnad seems to be quite well versed with the good Dr. el Koppo from dawn wonder!

CM.

nrshah · Postby **nrshah** » 14 Dec 2009 12:01

http://beta.thehindu.com/news/national/article64789.ece

LCH would also have a weaponised version, similar to ALH.

I thought LCH would be weaponised only. Never new utility variant of LCH is also on horizon. The way it reads, it appears that test flight this month end will be of utility variant

krishnan · Postby **krishnan** » 14 Dec 2009 12:07

What is the full form of LCH?

Nihat · Postby **Nihat** » 14 Dec 2009 12:09

LCH would also have a weaponised version, similar to ALH.

they probably meant the first prototype which is meant to fly this month , thats not supposed to be weaponized

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 14 Dec 2009 23:40

Nihat wrote:they probably meant the first prototype which is meant to fly this month , thats not supposed to be weaponized

Probably. But then they should not have said this:

“There will be rocket pods, a machine gun and also an air-to-air missiles in the combat version of LCH.

That implies there is a 'non combat' version which is not the case AFAIK.

Unlike HAL’s Advanced Light Helicopter (ALH) “Dhruv” which has been described as broad and bloated

Where did this come from?

KrishG · Postby **KrishG** » 16 Dec 2009 04:00

Bids received for indigenous fighter aircraft's engines

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/transportation/airlines-/-aviation/Bids-received-for-indigenous-fighter-aircrafts-engines/articleshow/5337659.cms

The IAF had expressed reservations about the GE engines as it increased the plane's weight from 8,000 kg to 10,000 kg. This delayed the production of the aircraft and it will be ready for delivery only by 2011.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 23 Dec 2009 19:46

http://news.rediff.com/report/2009/dec/23/president-patil-to-board-ins-viraat-today.htm

The President is expected to witness Sukhoi Su-30 and Sea Harrier fighter jets take off from the ship during her three hour stay.

atreya · Postby **atreya** » 23 Dec 2009 20:14

shameekg wrote:
Nihat wrote:they probably meant the first prototype which is meant to fly this month , thats not supposed to be weaponized

Probably. But then they should not have said this:
“There will be rocket pods, a machine gun and also an air-to-air missiles in the combat version of LCH.

That implies there is a 'non combat' version which is not the case AFAIK.

Unlike HAL’s Advanced Light Helicopter (ALH) “Dhruv” which has been described as broad and bloated

Where did this come from?

Even I was thinking on the same lines. If there is a "non combat" version of LCH, then what's the logic of developing TWO helicopters which perform the same function (Dhruv and non-combat LCH). On top of that, there is the deal to purchase 197 utility helicopters (the Eurocopter Fennec deal fell through). This is either a bad case of DDMitis, or there is something I am not understanding at all.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 23 Dec 2009 20:52

atreya wrote:Even I was thinking on the same lines. If there is a "non combat" version of LCH, then what's the logic of developing TWO helicopters which perform the same function (Dhruv and non-combat LCH). On top of that, there is the deal to purchase 197 utility helicopters (the Eurocopter Fennec deal fell through). This is either a bad case of DDMitis, or there is something I am not understanding at all.

This is DDMitis. There is no 'non combat' version. If you have seen the LCH designs there is not much more it can be used for. They probably wanted to talk of the non weaponised prototype and being DDM wrote what they did.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 24 Dec 2009 21:08

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/After-air-President-takes-to-water-/articleshow/5371975.cms

MUMBAI: After flying a Sukhoi fighter aircraft, President Pratibha Patil arrived on board INS Viraat on Wednesday to witness a steampast by naval ships, submarines and a demonstration by helicopters and Sea Harriers.

Should be 'flying in', unless I missed the part about her manning the controls.

Rahul M · Postby **Rahul M** » 24 Dec 2009 23:56

http://www.dnaindia.com/india/report_vi ... ir_1326350

Vintage aerial bombs recovered from Jammu and Kashmir
ANI
Tuesday, December 22, 2009 14:43 IST

X-post :

Rahul M wrote:^^^
India fought two wars, one in 1965 against China and the other in 1971 against Pakistan, which led to the birth of Bangladesh.

it makes me proud to see how well informed our journalists are.

Aditya G wrote:
Rahul M wrote:^^^
it makes me proud to see how well informed our journalists are.

Not to ignore the "two wars" count

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 29 Dec 2009 22:05

http://www.ptinews.com/news/444238_India--Russia-setting-up-USD-600-million-aircraft-JV

In its basic configuration the new transport aircraft will have a payload capacity of 18.

18 what?

Jaeger · Postby **Jaeger** » 29 Dec 2009 23:57

shameekg wrote:http://www.ptinews.com/news/444238_India--Russia-setting-up-USD-600-million-aircraft-JV

In its basic configuration the new transport aircraft will have a payload capacity of 18.

18 what?

18 dumbass DDM's to perform HALO jumps. Without 'chutes.

Anoop. A. · Postby **Anoop. A.** » 30 Dec 2009 02:30

18 tonnes????

shiv · Postby **shiv** » 30 Dec 2009 06:27

shameekg wrote:
Nihat wrote:they probably meant the first prototype which is meant to fly this month , thats not supposed to be weaponized

Probably. But then they should not have said this:
“There will be rocket pods, a machine gun and also an air-to-air missiles in the combat version of LCH.

That implies there is a 'non combat' version which is not the case AFAIK.

Unlike HAL’s Advanced Light Helicopter (ALH) “Dhruv” which has been described as broad and bloated

Where did this come from?

It suddenly occurs to me that a balloon filled with air is "broad and bloated". Remove the air and its not. An ALH with a cabin for people is broad and bloated. Crush and flatten the cabin (push the side in), attach stub wings for payload on the side and you get a non broad non bloated LCH.

I suspect this DDM means that the LCH is the combat version of the ALH.

Gaur · Postby **Gaur** » 30 Dec 2009 10:01

Jaeger wrote:
shameekg wrote:http://www.ptinews.com/news/444238_India--Russia-setting-up-USD-600-million-aircraft-JV

18 what?

18 dumbass DDM's to perform HALO jumps. Without 'chutes.

Sigh, if only we could make that happen.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 31 Dec 2009 21:04

http://telegraphindia.com/1091231/jsp/northeast/story_11924877.jsp

A Sukhoi-30MKI takes off from an airfield

Nitpick alert! The Su-30 in the pic is actually landing.

ASPuar · Postby **ASPuar** » 02 Jan 2010 14:56

And now this 'gem' from the Times of India, which is apparently blissfully unaware that the "Special Auxiliary Police" is in no way shape or form connected to the army.

:roll:

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/indi ... 404167.cms

Army jawan kills two colleagues before shooting himself in Bihar

PTI
2 January 2010

AURANGABAD (Bihar): A 'drunk' Special Auxiliary Police jawan allegedly gunned down two of his colleagues before killing himself following a quarrel over a trivial issue in the district, police said today.

During patrolling in Khairi village, the jawan Fulwendra Singh entered into an argument with his colleagues fired from his official carbine killing Balkishore Singh and Anil Singh on the spot last night.

Police suspect that the jawan was in a drunken state. He later committed suicide by shooting himself, police said.

The three bodies were brought here for autopsy.

atreya · Postby **atreya** » 02 Jan 2010 18:10

The doctor classifies such cases as being afflicted with DDM-itis!! :mrgreen:

Anyway, leaving aside the Army part, isn't our auxiliary police called Home Guards? I have never come across the term "Special Auxiliary Police". Or am I wrong? :oops:

Sachin · Postby **Sachin** » 02 Jan 2010 19:57

atreya wrote:Anyway, leaving aside the Army part, isn't our auxiliary police called Home Guards?

Check the thread on Indian Army.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 06 Jan 2010 21:18

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/BrahMos-missile-to-be-inducted-into-Air-Force-in-2012/articleshow/5416420.cms

Three flights on the new version had proved successful and the army would be inducting two more of this version shortly, Pillai said.

What a shame. All that testing for just 2 missiles. :wink:

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 16 Jan 2010 23:29

http://www.zeenews.com/news596492.html

Having taken nearly 37 years to have a regiment of the indigenous tanks since the project was approved, the tanks have changed designs from a 40-tonne class vehicle with a 105-mm gun at the conception stage to 50-tonne vehicle with a 201-mm gun during production.

No need for new artillery. Use the 201mm gun to blast everything to smithreens.

Rahul M · Postby **Rahul M** » 16 Jan 2010 23:35

shameekg wrote:http://www.zeenews.com/news596492.html

Having taken nearly 37 years to have a regiment of the indigenous tanks since the project was approved, the tanks have changed designs from a 40-tonne class vehicle with a 105-mm gun at the conception stage to 50-tonne vehicle with a 201-mm gun during production.

No need for new artillery. Use the 201mm gun to blast everything to smithreens.

PTI --> Peddling Trash to India

sevoke · Postby **sevoke** » 17 Jan 2010 04:54

201Mmm gun. Clearly, this DDM journo is on acid.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 17 Jan 2010 20:09

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/Photo/2575/3/Army+Day+parade.html

Indian soldiers in tanks at the Army Day parade in New Delhi on January 15, 2010.

Either they are blind, or complete morons. There is a board on the vehicle saying "ICV BMP II K Sarath" in Hindi and English. :roll:

Half the comments for those 12 pics are pointless since they dont give any additional information besides what is obvious.

Indian soldiers march during the Army Day parade in New Delhi on January 15, 2010.

Another set of soldiers march during the Army Day parade in New Delhi on January 15, 2010.

Indian soldiers ride horses at the Army Day parade in New Delhi on January 15, 2010.

Shameek · Postby **Shameek** » 21 Jan 2010 22:58

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/jan/21/india-tests-laser-guided-bombs-successfully.htm

Image: File photo of an IAF jet dropping a precision-guided missile

That's not an IAF jet. Its a French Mirage 2000.
That's not a missile. Its a Paveway LGB.

abhishekm · Postby **abhishekm** » 24 Jan 2010 17:28

Erm...didn't know where to post this. Apparently, a former Pakistan Air Force chief's photo appeared in a GOI advertisement issued by the Ministry of Women and Child Development. :shock:

http://news.rediff.com/report/2010/jan/ ... -probe.htm

Embarrassed by inclusion of former Pakistan Air Force chief's photograph in a government advertisement on Sunday along with Indian leaders and icons, the Prime Minister's Office apologised to the nation and ordered an inquiry into the lapse.

The photograph of former Pakistan Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed in uniform appeared along with those of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh [ Images ] and Congress president Sonia Gandhi [ Images ] in a full-page newspaper advertisement given by Ministry of Women and Child Development to mark the National Girl Child Day.

In a damage-control exercise, the PMO issued a statement saying, "The Prime Minister's Office has noted with regret the inclusion of a foreign national's photograph in a Government of India [ Images ] advertisement. While an internal enquiry has been instituted, the PMO apologises to the public for this lapse.

EARLIER REPORT:

In a huge embarrassment, a full-page newspaper advertisement given by the Centre to mark the National Girl Child Day carried a photograph of a former Pakistan Air Force chief along with that of Prime Minister Manmohan Singh and Congress president Sonia Gandhi.

The advertisement also showed sports icons Kapil Dev [ Images ] and Virender Sehwag [ Images ] and sarod maestro Ustad Amjad Ali Khan along with former PAF chief Tanvir Mahmood Ahmed in uniform with the heading, "Where would you be if your mother was not allowed to be born?"

An unrepentant Minister for Women and Child Development Krishna Tirath [ Images ] defiantly refused to accept the blunder and accused the media of hair-splitting.

She said the "message is more important than the image. The photograph is only symbolic. The message for the girl child is more important. She should be protected."

Tirath told reporters that whether the mistake was on part of her Ministry or the DAVP which releases government advertisements, will be investigated

.

What a horrific mistake!

anuraghchauhan · Postby **anuraghchauhan** » 24 Jan 2010 17:42

Ya! even i heard about the same news that the former PAF Chief photo is being included in the GOI Advertisement in leading news papers. By doing so i cant understand what are the intentions of the Indian government, b'cauz if they want to portray/illustrate some some examples then they should use the indian counterpart not the pakistani b'cauz we have more well deserved air chiefs like Fali homi major.

anuraghchauhan · Postby **anuraghchauhan** » 24 Jan 2010 17:50

ROME: The Eurofighter Typhoon is "leading the race" to win a contract from the

Indian government for 126 fighter jets, valued at around $10.4
billion, India's
ambassador to Italy said on Friday.......

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics/nation/Eurofighter-leading-race-for-India-deal-Report/articleshow/5491058.cms

I can't understand why indian government favoring typhoon b'cauz its not a war tested platform and it is too expensive also. In my personal opinion we should go for a MIG - 25 or for F-35 (by asking americans to replace F 16 with the F 35) since indian navy is eagerly looking at F 35C for the IAC2 which it will induct somewhere around 2017. So it will be more convenient for us to have same type of aircraft in both services so that we can have true interoperability. And it will also help us in bring the cost per unit to some extent low as well as common maintenance facility.

nachiket · Postby **nachiket** » 24 Jan 2010 17:51

^^ Huh? Wrong thread. There is no error in that article.

You can post your views here though.

abhishekm · Postby **abhishekm** » 24 Jan 2010 17:59

anuraghchauhan wrote:Ya! even i heard about the same news that the former PAF Chief photo is being included in the GOI Advertisement in leading news papers. By doing so i cant understand what are the intentions of the Indian government, b'cauz if they want to portray/illustrate some some examples then they should use the indian counterpart not the pakistani b'cauz we have more well deserved air chiefs like Fali homi major.

I doubt the GOI did this on purpose. But it still boggles the imagination. After all, this was a pic of a PAF chief in full dress uniform!!! :eek:

Waiting for the moment when the Pakistanis blame R&AW for this and for attempting to recruit their former Air Chief Marshal by means of a newspaper advertisement! I can already imagine rottweiler-in-chief Rehman Malik addressing a press conference on this issue :wink:

shiv · Postby **shiv** » 24 Jan 2010 19:17

I think it is a double error. The ad agency has been given a task and the morons in the ad agency like all morons from the ad agencies that make ads for drug companies took a photu off the net. That was error one.

Error 2 was the PMO's PR officer who did not cross check. It is likely that the PMO's PR officer is another moron for whom one uniform is the same as another - all pandus.

I am supremely happy this occurred. I am hoping to see more such idiocy so that some heads roll. Idiots of the first order....

ManuT · Postby **ManuT** » 24 Jan 2010 23:11

abhishekm wrote:I doubt the GOI did this on purpose. But it still boggles the imagination. After all, this was a pic of a PAF chief in full dress uniform!!!

shiv wrote:Error 2 was the PMO's PR officer who did not cross check. It is likely that the PMO's PR officer is another moron for whom one uniform is the same as another - all pandus.

Which begs the question, what are they smoking over there. :lol:

Rahul M · Postby **Rahul M** » 24 Jan 2010 23:17

An unrepentant Minister for Women and Child Development Krishna Tirath [ Images ] defiantly refused to accept the blunder and accused the media of hair-splitting.

She said the "message is more important than the image. The photograph is only symbolic. The message for the girl child is more important. She should be protected."

what a supreme idiot, bar none.

Jagan · Postby **Jagan** » 24 Jan 2010 23:46

ROTFL - from the India Today website

Who is online