Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

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vivek.sharma
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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 13 Apr 2009 16:40

Arm Chair Generals Required

Qualifications: Willingness to defend "Matribhumi" and some time to write how they will do it.

Looking for Arm Chair Generals to command following corps
-1 Corps out of Mathura, Uttar Pradesh Central Command Lt. Gen. 4 Inf Div (Allahabad), 6 Mtn Div (Bareilly), 33 Armd Div (Hisar)
-2 Corps out of Ambala, Haryana Western Command Lt. Gen. 1 Armd Div (Ambala), 14 RAPID (Dehradun), 22 Inf Div (Meerut)
- 10 Corps out of Bhatinda, Punjab Western Command Lt.Gen 16 Inf Div (Sri Ganganagar), 18 RAPID (Kota), 24 RAPID (Bikaner), 6 Ind Armd Bde, Engr Bde
- 11 Corps out of Jalandhar, Punjab Western Command Lt. Gen. V S Tonk 7 Inf Div (Ferozpur), 9 Inf Div (Meerut), 15 Inf Div (Amritsar), 23 Armd Bde, 55 Mech Bde
- 12 Corps out of Jodhpur, Rajasthan South Western Command
- 21 Corps(ex IPKF) Bhopal, Madhya Pradesh

Positions are also available to command three task forces, which will re-take what always have been ours. (Details later)

Also open one Vice Admiral for Navy's Western Command and three Air Mrashals to command Air force's Western Air Command, Eastern Air Command and Central Air Command.

Job Description: You will have Independent command of the forces that will be under you, within the parameters of the Scenario. Suffice to say, you will be able to maul the arch enemy at your whim.

Any Takers?

Feel free to contact me at vshar99 at g mail dot com.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby ashdivay » 13 Apr 2009 16:54

Hi
i made a vid to show the attack of Indian mech inf on chinese lines in aski chin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wFYRjwrMYFY

i made it in hurry but , future vids will be lot better.

the vid is made using Steelbeasts Pro PE. it is one of the most powerfull and accurate Armour sims avilable to civilians.

Steelbeasts Pro is a military sim used by many countries for training. but Steelbeasts Pro PE is civilian version of steelbeasts Pro and avilable to Civilians.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 14 Apr 2009 03:08

ashdivay,

That's some nice work. Shankar's scenario can now be made in a movie :D

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 14 Apr 2009 04:26

Chapter 2 Continued

Day 2, 9:00 AM New Delhi, PM's Office

Just as soon as PM Shastri said the word, DRDO chief was talking to the NTPC's Chariman Mutthuswamy to arrange for overrides in the national grid required to get these "dispensers" started.

For General Gupta next few hours will be testing to say the least. Armed Force's cold start routine will be put to test. While he was talking to his commanders, Army, navy and air chiefs, who were on the conference calls, have already started their part of cold start routine.

10:00 AM IST,
9: 30 AM Mirpur, Pakistan Occupied Kashmir,


Jarnial khan, owner of Lahore Trucking Company in Mirpur was dreaming of a new truck, when his cell phone rudely interrupted his sleep. He cursed in Punjabi and looked at the phone number and could not believe it. "May be morning dreams do come true.” he thought before answering the phone. "Jarnial, are u all set?" asked the voice on the phone. "Yes, I am. When do you friends need to be picked up?" asked Jarnail. "2 days from now near the village Bhimbhar at the end of Barnala-Bhimbhar road. There will be 8 of them and they will call you. Give them the trucks and you will get your money" Said the voice on the phone and disconnected call before Jarnial could say anything.

After Shah disconnected call, and called an American number with voipbuster, which was picked up in Delhi by his handler. The plot has been set in motion.

10:00 AM, New Delhi, NTPC's office,

NTPC chairman Mutthuswamy was nervous because he knew what may happen, and the worst part was the "MAY", if he knew he will be confident. But then again, he has to do what he has to do. So he started the press conference.

"Gents as many of you already know, we are facing sever imbalances in power grid all over the country due to transmission issues. I just wanted the public to know that we have our teams working double time on these issues. In fact PM Shastri called me half an hour ago and I have apprised him of the situation. Questions?" and so it went on.

For Ramesh Gudipati sitting in his office in Connaught place in New Delhi, it did not make a difference. "At least it is not June", he thought and started calling the customers whose orders had been messed up yesterday.

11:00 AM, Somewhere near New Delhi, NSC Office

Defense Minister Singh was sitting along with chiefs of Army, Air force and Navy in a room choke full of monitors. The conference call was on a secure line and every participant has been verified using the encryption code and voice print match. Defense Minister started the meeting “I won’t take long, because you have to get ready for what’s inevitable. But I wanted to lay down the rules of engagement. We have been through it many times in our simulations, but I will reiterate them once again. This is NOT a WAR, objective of Army and Navy is to keep as many fronts open as possible on border. We know their air force will be inoperable, so hold your ground and call for help from Air force on the slightest hint of misadventure on monkey’s part. We don’t want to loose our men just for guarding our borders. But skirmishes are encouraged. You have to keep PA busy, but under no circumstances you are to go more then 1 KM inside the international border. And if you do cross the border, do not hold any positions. Just break their defensive positions and come back. Any questions?”

Army Chief Vijay said, “Just to confirm, you said international border, not LOC.” Everybody laughed at the hint. Singh continued “It’s good to see that all of us can laugh. And yes Vijay, I meant international border, LOC is a different story but we will discuss that when the time is right. So all of you know what needs to be done. Let’s get ready for this. This is for us, for our future generations and for brave people who we have lost since 1947 in a needless war. Jai Hind”

So started the preparations for a different kind of warfare which will cost the adversary a lot more then a war. It will hurt where it hurts the most.

12 PM IST, Jammu Cantonment Area

There was eerie silence in the room. Lt. Amit & Lt. Punit and three other teams like theirs from 18 Mountain Division were all set to embark on the mission. But this mission was different; they were to carry lots of Pakistani currency and RDX along with controlled remote explosives. They had no doubt that this was going to be an interesting mission to say the least.

Their instructions were clear, they were not to carry any identification and failure (or dying) was not an option. They were to get to the village of Bhimbhar on Pakistani side of border and set the plan in motion. Lt. Amit’s team and other teams were experts in electronics and explosives and this mission will test their expertise to the fullest.

They were to start right now and a Mi-17v5 will drop them near the border besides mountain top of Nathuan Tibba. From there they were to go down to the village of Bhimbhar and contact a local resource who will provide them transportation and all the logistics help they need. If everything goes well they will reach Bhimbhar in 2 days.
Last edited by vivek.sharma on 14 Apr 2009 16:30, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Sudhanshu » 14 Apr 2009 06:24

I was away for a while.. what, what is going on here. I am spellbound.

We have seen many ingenious work of many people in this thread. But, this is something superb.

Shankar and Vivek S writing scenario in synchronized manner. The final product is more intriguing and awesome than it ever could be.

And, we are already getting simulations on scenario ... I think we are not too much far away until some small time director among us create a short youtube clip on such scenarios (with character talking)... then , insallah, a full movie. :)

Vivek A, I like the dynamics of your writing.

We always get something new at this thread. Thanks much to you guys, on behalf your readers and many who cannot sign up to write post to show their gratitude.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Ajit.C » 14 Apr 2009 11:54

[quote="vivek.sharma"]Chapter 2 Continued

Day 2, 9:00 AM New Delhi, PM's Office

For General Gupta next few hours will be testing to say the least. Army's cold start routine will be put to test. While he was talking to his commanders, navy and air chiefs, who were on the conference calls, have already started their part of cold start routine.

11:00 AM, Somewhere near New Delhi, NSC Office

Defense Minister Singh was sitting along with chiefs of Army, Air force and Navy in a room choke full of monitors. The conference call was on a secure line and every participant has been verified using the encryption code and voice print match. Defense Minister started the meeting “I won’t take long, because you have to get ready for what’s inevitable. But I wanted to lay down the rules of engagement. We have been through it many times in our simulations, but I will reiterate them once again. This is NOT a WAR, objective of Army and Navy is to keep as many fronts open as possible on border. We know their air force will be inoperable, so hold your ground and call for help from Air force on the slightest hint of misadventure on monkey’s part. We don’t want to loose our men just for guarding our borders. But skirmishes are encouraged. You have to keep PA busy, but under no circumstances you are to go more then 1 KM inside the international border. And if you do cross the border, do not hold any positions. Just break their defensive positions and come back. Any questions?”

Army Chief Vijayarathane said, “Just to confirm, you said international border, not LOC.” Everybody laughed at the hint. Singh continued “It’s good to see that all of us can laugh. And yes Vijayarathane, I meant international border, ”

Hi Vivek,

Are General Gupta and Army Chief Vijayarathane the same? Vijayarathane sounds like Sinhala name if I am not wrong.

Anyway looking forward to for your posts.

Regards

Ajit

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby ashdivay » 14 Apr 2009 12:52

1st Combined Commonwealth Task Force
Virtual Unit for Steelbeasts Pro PE Sim

http://1stcctf.forumh.net

Hi i have 1CCTF unit in SB pro PE . similar to mine there are other VUs in that sim aswell.
and every week we fight it out in grand or small battle.
its amazing. i am the only Indian in there. but i hope others could join me.
the Sim is not a game but a actual sim. u need a powerfull computer to run it. my config is P42Ghz 2 GB Ram,512 Gforce 8500. I use a unlimited BSNL 512Kbps connection. which gives me ping of 100 to 300ms which is good.

The sim is great and can be coustomised for any scenario. Do a quick search on youtube on SB Pro PE . you will find out.

i hate to sound like someone whos advistising. but just wanted to let everyone know about this great sim. if you get it join me online , we will go against German or other EU or US units. lot of em having served in their armies will give u an understanding of how they function.

anyway the sim cost in 125$USD thats hundred and twenty five US. and you can get it at http://www.steelbeasts.com

Regards
Ash
CO
1st CCTF

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 14 Apr 2009 13:54

II CORPS ALPHA FORCE -4XT-90S – THOR -CHOLISTAN DESSERT – INETERNATIONAL BORDER

Captain Ranjit opened the hatch of his command T-90S . The air outside was very warm and very dry .The evening was setting in quickly. As he watched the small formation of 6 T-80 s started advancing slowly from the Pakistani side of the border towards his position .His four tanks were responsible for guarding the diesel tankers that kept on coming along the state highway paralleling the international border . His orders were straight and simple “no damn Pakistani tanks should come anywhere near the tankers.

In 2001, India bought 310 T-90S tanks from Russia, of which 120 were delivered complete, 90 in semi-knocked down kits, and 100 in completely-knocked down kits. T-90S were made by Uralvagonzavod and the uprated 1,000-hp engines were delivered by Chelyabinsk Tractor Plant. These tanks however did not feature Shtora active protectionsystem though there are reports that a separate contract for shipment of a modernized version of this suite is being discussed.[10] The T-90 was selected because it is a direct development of the T-72 which India already employs, simplifying training and maintenance. India bought the T-90 after the delay in production of the domestically developed Arjun main battle tank, and to counter Pakistani deployment of the Ukrainian T-80UD in 1995–97. The deal between India and Russia, estimated at a value of USD $750 million, also included the complete transfer of T-90 technology and weapon systems to India. With Russian and French assistance, India developed an improved version of T-90S, known as the Bhishma. In 2006, the Indian Government awarded the Ordnance Factory Board a USD $2.5 billion deal to manufacture 1,000 T-90S Bhishma tanks for the Indian army. On October 26, 2006, India signed another deal with Russia for 800 million USD for 330 T-90S tanks.[14] In all, India plans to have 1,500 T-90S tanks in service by 2020. The T-90's main armament is the 2A46M 125 mm smoothbore gun. This is a highly modified version of the Sprut anti-tank gun, and is the same gun used as the main armament on the T-80-series tanks. It can be replaced without dismantling the inner turret and is capable of firing armour-piercing fin-stabilized discarding sabot (APFSDS), high-explosive anti-tank (HEAT-FS), and high explosive fragmentation (HE-FRAG) ammunition, as well as 9M119M Refleks anti-tank guided missiles. The Refleks missile has semi-automatic laser beam-riding guidance and a tandem hollow-charge HEAT warhead. It has an effective range of 100 m to 6 km, and takes 17.5 seconds to reach maximum range. Refleks can penetrate ~950 mm of steel armour and can also engage low-flying air targets such as helicopters.






Behind him three other T-90 s in classic box formation were stationary behind a low dune along the embankment on the state high way ,hidden beautifully in a dried out Nulla .What Ranjit found disturbing was the way the Pakistani tanks crept forward on low power at less than 2 km per hour at angle which kept them inside their side of the border ,but closer to the highway and the diesel tankers and slowly out of range of his guns .

Obviously His Pakistani counter part was up to no good ,thought Ranjit as he signaled his unit to start engine and move forward on an intercept vector cutting off the Pakistani approach to state highway carrying the life line of 2nd corps .

The four 1000 hp engines came to life with a deep rumble . As his driver engaged gear and slowly released the clutch the iron monster lurched forward followed somewhat slowly by other three in a single file as they came out of the nulla and turned north west matching the Pakistani T-80 s speed .Captain Ranjit took over command quickly

- alpha force – lead-possible target multiple T-80 – speed 3kmph and increasing –threat to our fuel convoy – standby to initiate strike –make speed 15 kmph for now and heading 310 –over
- copy that lead ,came in the response and all the four tank commanders went down and the hatched were shut quickly making the tracked monsters a deadly fighting machine
Ranjit moved fast –he still needed permission to open fire in a “peaceful border” even if the enemy was about to blow up some of the precious fuel tankers any second .
- scorpio one –alpha lead – we have a possible bandit incursion on highway – 6 T-80 s approaching slowly –request weapon free immediately
- standby alpha lead came the raspy voice on the net ,which he knew to be that of a colonel never willing to take quick decisions
- alpha lead are you sure they are a threat to our supply convoys at the moment
- scorpion –alpha lead – not certain but surely their intensions are not friendly
- alpha lead you are cleared to fire only if fired upon –that is the present ROE and nothing has changed –over

Ranjit cursed under his breadth as he switched off transmission. In the distance he could see the half darkened headlights of a large convoy approaching the base fuel station from north. The Pakistani tanks have started accelerating and doing well over 25 km/hr over the sandy terrain

-alpha force – make course make heading 315 –increase speed to 40 kmph – clear for quick engagement –we are still not weapons free .

The tank lurched and engine roar increased as his driver quickly changed gears and made the course correction. The Pakistani tanks still have not spotted him but things can change quickly in a modern armor combat.

The lead Pakistani tank turned directly onto a new heading for the highway and went maximum speed. Two others following turned towards Indian tanks and started raising the main gun .So they have been spotted at last .There was no time take permission .Even as he gave the weapons free order ,Ranjit knew he will be surely given a “rocket” by the colonel later in the evening but for that he has to live till then .

- alpha force – bandits – 317 – 50 km/hr approaching – weapons free – confirm ready

It was then the first of T-80 opened fire . The APFSDS round whistled barely inches over Ajits tank slamming into a dead tree several meter behind –uprooting it completely.

Gunner – load HEAT -target uno one – range 2356 meter- 318.96 degree –fire
The heavy tank shook as first of the Indian retaliatory shots left the barrel- The 125 mm smooth bore gun was not very good to look at but superbly accurate
- alpha 2 –take out uno 3
- alpha 3 – take out uno 5
- copy that lead – taking them out
- gunner –load AP –target uno 4 to right –fire

The Pakistani T-80 closed the range and opened fire. The tank duel between more or less evenly matched formations was intense but short lived. There of the Pakistani tanks were totally destroyed and rest scampered back to safety of their ground defenses. On the Indian side one T-90 s was badly damaged ,its both tracks blown off and fuel tank on fire , Ranjits lead tank was also heat on the front armor and all the fancy antennas were blown out as the reactive armors activated . His life was saved but just barely .With blood coming out of ruptured eardrums and nose he was rushed to base hospital .It will be more than 3 weeks before he will be allowed into combat again .

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby SivaVijay » 14 Apr 2009 15:05

Hi All,
This thread really rocks. Shankar and the two viveks are doing great job. Just my 2 cents....

Instead of having all thinking and playing roles of Indian commanders, if some can step in Chinese/Pak shoes and writing the handling of the situation from their perspective, then we are talking a real chessboard. I believe it wud be better than a single person thinking for both the ends and the uncertainity of what next will make it more realistic. :D

Hope i am not overstepping my lines here..... :D :D

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 14 Apr 2009 15:35

JAMMU AIRPORT – 1900 HRS –NIGHT HAWK FLIGHT 4XMI 17 V 5

F/L Sunil strapped in quickly after boarding. Behind him the special forces team without any uniform and rank insignia were already in with their assortment of back packs and hand guns and MP-5 submachine guns . Like all special forces they were a quite lot and kept to themselves, checking out the weapons and the scopes and knives all the time. With a brief Hi he turned to the instrument console.
The Mi-17v5 differs from the Mi-171V in having a protruding ‘dolphin’ nose rather than the glassed-in round noses other Indian Mi-17s possess, more powerful 2,200hp TV3-117VM engines with new auxiliary power unit, and an extra port door on the starboard side. It shares the rear fuselage ramp that distinguishes both of these models from earlier Mi-17 versions. The improved Mi-17v7 variant reportedly features the 2,400hp VK-2500 engine with a digital FADEC for full performance in hot and high conditions. This would seem to make it more suitable for India
He switched on the navigation lights and contacted tower
- tower –night hawk flight ready to leave –request start engine
- standby night hawk – a pair of fishbed inbound –expect clearance in 05 minutes
- copy that tower
Since this will be a low level insertion he was carrying a 57 mm rocket pod as added insurance and also medium machine gun on the doors manned by air force gunners. The glass cockpit of this upgraded Mi 17 was a welcome change.
- tower – hawk one –request permission to land
- hawk one and two cleared to land on 60 seconds interval –over
In the distance he could see the landing lights of the pair of Mig 21 Bisons come on as they made the sharp turning tactical approach to runway 21 and touched down quickly one after another and then exited the main runway – clearing his take off path.
- night hawk flight- tower – start engine – cleared for immediate take off –over
- copy tower – starting engine
Sunil flicked on the engine control circuit breakers and closed the ignition. The dull whine of 2200 hp engine slowly filled the cockpit and he could see the special forces officers close their ears . The engine rpm s stabilized and he engaged the rotors .On course pitch the thump thump of rotors overshadowed the shrill whine of the engines and the chopper was ready to lift . Sunil increased power to 80% and the Mi 17 moved forward and then lifted clean off as he moved the cyclic control forward changing the pitch of the rotors for maximum lift.
All the four Mi 17 s lifted off together and rushed forward over the taxi way before turning west and climbing out for initial cruise altitude of 300 ft over ground level .They will go down once clear of the airport class D airspace and then head staright for the drop zone on Pakistan occupied Kashmir – a flight lasting not more than 30 minutes or so thought Sunil as he eased back on the stick and leveled out building up on the air speed quickly .


january 09, 2009 17:17 IST
Imran Shehzad, who was assigned to blow up the Bombay Stock Exchange, also played a role in planning the Mumbai [Images] attacks.

Sources in both the Uttar Pradesh and Karnataka police told rediff.com that Fahim Ansari and Sabahuddin Ahmed have spoken at length about the role played by Shehzad in both the Mumbai attacks and the attack on a Central Reserve Police Force camp at Rampur in Uttar Pradesh, last January.
Shehzad, according to the UP police, is a resident of Bhimbar in Pakistan occupied Kashmir.

Along with Mohammad Farooq Bhatti, a resident of Gunjanwala, Pakistan, Shehzad was instructed by the Lashkar-e-Tayiba [Images] to bomb the Bombay Stock Exchange . They were asked to meet Sabahuddin Ahmed before they carried out the attack.
Bhatti and Shehzad were asked to help with the CRPF camp attack and also assist in surveying likely targets in Mumbai.

In his confession Sabahuddin says he was told by Lashkar terrorists based in Pakistan to meet Bhatti and Shehzad and give them instructions. Both men met Sabahuddin in Nepal for the first time.
Sabahuddin says he took the duo to meet a man named Suhail at Buntwal in Nepal where they were told about their role in the CRPF camp attack.

Suhail took the two men to Rampur. He rented a house in Rampur for the duo while they awaited further instructions. During the waiting period Bhatti and Shehzad were asked to assist Ansari who had begun conducting a survey of possible targets in Mumbai.


Sunil concentrated on flying as he cleared the airport area and turned north west with a slight nudge to the cyclic control lever while keeping the collective nicely balanced with his other arm and slight pressure on the tail rotor pedal to keep the chopper from spinning around its own rotor as rotorcraft went on a shallow turning dive to its final operating altitude of 100 ft over very uneven ground level.The extra engine power sure helped thought Sunil as adjusted the rotor pitch once again and stabilised the collective for fast level f;ight

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 14 Apr 2009 16:17

Ajit,

Thanks for pointing out the discrepancies. You will have to pardon my knowledge of Indian names as I have been out of India for 18 years. I will change Vijayarathne to Vijay.

On the subject of General Gupta and Army Chief Vijaya, I thought with the invent of Cold start, Indian Armed forces is moving towards a unified command, that's where General Gupta came in. He is the Chief of staff of Unified Command, where as Army Chief Vijay commands the Army.

In any case, I am assuming a Unified Command led by General Gupta, whereas respective branches of forces are commanded by their own chiefs.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby ashdivay » 14 Apr 2009 16:20

Shankar wrote:It was then the first of T-80 opened fire . The APFSDS round whistled barely inches over Ajits tank slamming into a dead tree several meter behind –uprooting it completely.

good post APFSDS (armour pearching fin stablised discarding sabot) is known as "KE" round , meaning its uses pure "keinitic energy" to penetrate eny armour. it is a round designed for speed and killing heavy armour vechs like MBT's. its penetration decreases over distance but its still effective upto 2000m. Indian KE round T-2A is a great eg.

Shankar wrote:Gunner – load HEAT -target uno one – range 2356 meter- 318.96 degree –fire
The heavy tank shook as first of the Indian retaliatory shots left the barrel- The 125 mm smooth bore gun was not very good to look at but superbly accurate



Small correction. In tank warefare no one will unload a round which is allready in breach while under fire from eny tank ,unless its a cannister (anti personel round) in such case if it is a cannister round tank will pop smoke and then loader will load what ever Cmdr will ask him to reload.

but if there is a Sabot or KE round in breach , this round is perfect for killing eny tanks. The commander will issues orders as such -

Tank Crew Engagment Drill
Cmdr spotting eny tank first. will take controle of main gun and swing it in direction of eny tank so gunner can ID eny tank.
Cmdr- "Gunner tnk !"

If gunner sees the targ he will respond
gunr-"Identified"
Once gunner identifies the eny tank the commander realeases controle of the main gun to gunner and says
Cmdr-"Fire !" (If sabot is allready in breach)
or
Cmdr-"Fire Fire Sabot!" (If round other then sabot is in in breach ,"Fire Fire Sabot!" cmd is a dual command its telling the gunr to fire whatever is in breach and the second part of command tells the loader to load Sabot once this round is fired.)

Gunner will then lash the trg with laser to get range and if its a moving trg he will press the auto lead button. bullistic computer will use the range by laser and direction of moving targ and type of ammo in breach to calc exact elevation and lead to be added to the main gun. mind u this is all done whith in second or two.

and then on TIS(Thermal Imaging sight) will display a range and fire sign. gunner will press the fire button and the round will be first round first hit.

gunner will say the following while pressing the trigger.
gunr-"On the way"

then its cmdrs job to confirm the status of round on targ and based on it he will say either of follwoing.
if the target is destroyed
cmdr will confirm if it is and say
Cmdr"Target !" and move on to next
if the target is not destroyed but hit
Cmdr "Target ! Rengage!"
If the round falls short then
Cmdr "Short ! Rengage!"
If the round flies over then
Cmdr "Over ! Rengage!"

as soon as round is fired the loader will load what ever round he was asked to load by cmdr prior to firing current round.
if he loads Sabot(KE/APFSDS) he will say
Lodr-"Sabot Up"
If (HEAT)
Lodr-"Heat UP"

oh and HEAT round is capable of taking out tanks but its slow speed make it usless at long distance. also HEAT round will not always kill tanks , it will mostly kill APC,s and other light armour. KE rounds or sabots or APFSDS are best tank killers.

Hope no one took this post in a bad way , i have lot of respect for everyone here.

also ill be making a vid for the above tank engagment.
Regards
Ash

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby ashdivay » 14 Apr 2009 17:25

Indian T-90s Intercepting Paki T-80Us

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjprMO079OE

Based on earlier post.
Please comment and rate.
Thank you
Ash

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Ajit.C » 15 Apr 2009 00:02

vivek_ahuja wrote:5TH INFANTRY BRIGADE AREA OF OPERATIONS (5 TACTICAL AO)
EAST OF DAULAT BEG OLDI
SOUTH OF THE KARAKORAM PASS
DAY 5 + 0440 HRS



Dear Vivek,

Couple of clarifications

1) In your posts you mentioned 10th Mech Infantry regiment - with presumably 4 Battalions. As far as I understand Mechnised Infantry regiments are in fact battalions under the Mech. Infantry Regiment. In fact 10 mech infantry - is actually 20 Maratha LI. Also the the Mech. Infantry battalions have their own infantry.

2) 7 Punjab is actually now 8th battalion of Mech Inf regiment.

Forgive me if I am interupting your thought process. Thought I need to bring this to your attention.

Anyway have been enjoying your writings and eagerly wait for the next posts.

Regards

Ajit

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Prem Kumar » 15 Apr 2009 01:03

Hi Ash,

Great videos - keep them coming. You have taken these scenarios to the next level - bringing multimedia in!!

A couple of questions: does the simulator let you pick the type of tank you want? Also, would it be possible to distinguish our tanks from enemy tanks (like an insignia or something)?

Anyway, great work once again

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby ashdivay » 15 Apr 2009 03:53

Prem Kumar wrote:Hi Ash,

A couple of questions: does the simulator let you pick the type of tank you want?

yea u can pick and use whatever tanks avilable in the sim.
Tank list -
LeoAS1
Leo1
Leo2A4
Leo2A5DK
Strv122
Leo2E
M1A1
T-80U
T-72M1
all the above tanks have Mine rollers and Mine Plows attachements.
u can also change diffrent ammo types. ammo from diffrent countries is avilable. eacvh ammo has diffrent penetration and velocities.
loads of other vechs are avilabe as well. including choppers.

Prem Kumar wrote:Also, would it be possible to distinguish our tanks from enemy tanks (like an insignia or something)?

No unless ur good at IDing Eny vechs based on their design. or if ur in gunner seat ur AI commander will ID the eny for u and tell u to fire at it. remember this is a realistic sim not a game. its very realistic and accurate.
if u dont learn tankers skill then ur dead. i am a Virtual Unit CO so i had to learn from bottom , i started as a gunner on a Leo2A4.
went on to commond Mech Inf unit's . then finally am a CO of my own unit.

If u get this sim , come join me ,we are currently recuriting. Today i was given honourary CO position in a German Unit. with my broken german i managed to lead my german friends to a victory agaisnt tough computer opponent.

Our unit web - http://1stcctf.forumh.net
German Unit - http://85.14.216.250
sim page - http://www.steelbeasts.com

let me know if any other questions.
Regards
Ash

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 16 Apr 2009 16:13

APPROACHING LOC – 1930 HRS –NIGHT HAWK FLIGHT 4XMI 17 V 5

F/L Sunil concentrated on his display panels as the hot zone approached .He knew he may have to initiate violent evasive moves any time now since irregular terrorists as well as regular Pakistani army posted along the LOC were likely to open fire at any unidentified helicopter without warning .He spoke on intercom quietly – hi guys ,entering bas country –hold on tight and weapons ready .

No sooner has the words escaped his lips the first burst of AK-47 fire streamed from left .Sunil pulled the collective forward and cyclic to right putting the Mi 17 in a sharp skidding turn .Other AK 47 s joined the fray and it was time to give something back in kind

-Gunner –target 8 clock 500 meters – take them out .The door gunner responded immediately, spraying the countryside below with a dazzling spray of 12.7 mm machine gun fire.

Sunil turned back and flicked open the air to ground fire switch . The gun fire was still continuing as he pointed the nose of the chopper in the general direction of ground fire and allowed the square box settle on the centre of enemy fire zone as he pushed on the fire button

A salvo of 4 57 mm rockets leaped forward of the pod and raced towards the target exploding simultaneously in small balls of black red fire and much smoke

The firing stopped –immediately.
Ease back on the collective and move the cyclic to original heading as if what has happened is of no consequence even if everyone on board knew it was a close shave with death. Rotor pitch adjust to 22 degree from 30 degree .He quickly checked there was no spar failure warning light blinking. Temperature on two stage planery gear box normal at 85 degree C . Main rotor shaft to engine rpm ration steady at 0.016 on the digital display of main panel ,so atleast no hit on the engine or the rotor gear .AC generator, hydraulic pressure horizontal stabilizer and tail rotor parameters all in the green

His R-842 VHF transceiver was on standby mode and he intended to use only during actual insertion , de icing off ( at this temperature he did not need that feature . He was flying on manual though had the option of using four axis auto pilot . His practiced eye checked the displays quickly – turn rate 3 degree,- altitude 30 meters from GL – DISTANCE TO drop zone 37 km – time to drop zone 16 minutes – final waypoint in 6.4 minutes .

Far above and behind the IAF phalcon watched his flight progress and alerted two flankers on CAP for possible quick assistance in less than 5 minutes

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 16 Apr 2009 18:10

APPROACHING LOC – 1945 HRS –NIGHT HAWK FLIGHT 4XMI 17 V 5

It may seem strange but NATO was and is using a substantial number of Mi 17 s both IN Iraq and Afghanistan in support of and in direct combat operations . The reasons for such a selection were never clearly explained but it will seem logical the ruggedness of Russian engine and air frame was the main selectin criteria along with familiarity of the local troops to Russian helicopters.

T
he Iraqi air force has received eight of ten Mi-17 helicopters from Russia. This was the first aircraft acquired by the air force on their own, without Coalition involvement. It's a reliable choice. Iraq has used Russian helicopters for decades, and the Mi-17 was recently acquired by Afghanistan and Colombia as well. The Mi-17 is the export version of the Mi-8, a twin-engine helicopter, roughly equivalent to the U.S. UH-1. But the Mi-8/17 is still in production and is the most widely exported (2,800 out of 12,000 made) helicopter on the planet.Â
The Mi-8 is about twice the size and weight of the UH-1, but only hauls about 50 percent more cargo. However, the Mi-8 had a larger interior, and can carry 24 troops, versus a dozen in the UH-1. The UH-1 was replaced by the UH-60 in the 1980s, while the Mi-8 just kept adding better engines and electronics to the basic Mi-8 frame. But the UH-60, while weighing as much as the UH-1 (4.8 tons), could carry as much as the 12 ton Mi-8. But the Mi-8 costs about half as much as a UH-60, and the larger interior is popular with many users. Russia also offers lower rates for training pilots and mechanics. Russia is keen on establishing good relations with Iraq and Afghanistan, both of which have been good customers in the past. While the Afghans are somewhat ticked off at the Russians because of the 1980s war, the Iraqis have fond memories of the Russians, and their military equipment. It was Russia that supplied most of the weapons for Iraq during the 1980s war with Iran.
The Iraqis actually obtained their Mi-17s from Poland, who is also supplying maintenance services. By next year, the Iraqis hope to have 24 Mi-17s in service. The Iraqi air force also has 16 refurbished UH-1 Hueys, and five similar Bell 206 Jet Rangers.
With most NATO members refusing to commit their medium-lift helicopters to southern Afghanistan, NATO is once again talking about leasing helicopters. “By mid-winter, large, vulnerable, heli- copters � likely aging Russian Mi-17s � will be clattering across Afghan skies delivering everything from bullets to beans to Canadian soldiers deployed in remote outposts across Kandahar province”, says Paul Koring of the Globe & Mail

November 2008 Update – Leased Medium-Lift Mils
Leased civilian Mi-8T helicopters began flying from Kandahar Airfield on 17. Nov 2008. The aircraft are provided by SkyLink of Toronto although they fly in AeroStan markings (this airline is based in Kazan although the Mi-8Ts all carry Kirghiz registrations). Such leases are a standard practice for SkyLink but delays suggest DND contract wrangling – leased Mils were to be supplying the CF troops in Afghan- istan by late 2007, then in the summer of 2008. Better late than never. Each Mi-8 flight reduces the number of supply convoys by road

Update: Poland Comes Through...and the Rest of NATO?
On 08 December 2007, Foreign Minister Radosław Sikorski promised eight Polish helicopters for Afghanistan. Four of them are older model Mi-17s,[7] the others are “attack heli- copters” presumably Mi-24s (left). Shortly after the NATO helicopter-lease announcements, media reports suggested interest from SkyLink Aviation of Toronto (which already operates Mi-17s in Sudan). Nothing more of this offer was heard, DND obviously prefering to pressure NATO allies. On 04 Feb 2008, Macleans reported Radosław Sikorski saying that two of the Polish Mi-17s were to be put “at the disposal of Canada”.


=Drop zone 3.4 km –time to drop zone 2 .2 minutes flashed the master display as Sunil reduced pitch to 9 degree and engine power automatically reduced to 67 % full power ,air speed dropped off to 80 km/hr

- ok guys Indian air focre thanks the army for this ferry business - we hope you enjoyed the flight and hope to fly you out again in 3 days time – hang on for quick descent
Sunil reduced power and moved the collective forward putting the chopper in a shallow dive .The flat mountain top no 34 came in view through his night vision goggles .It was time to break radio silence
- night hawk flight –lead – DZ in 2 minutes –drop height 10 meters – drop duriation 60 seconds max-expect SAM – two and four do the first drop –over

The two Mi 17 s dropped down at minimum power and hovered over the bush as quicky the first group of special forces soldiers slithered down .

- lead – night hawk 3 – we done –taking up top cover –over
As the two Mi17 s climbed up and circled overhead it was time for Sunil to go down quick and fast .

As he powered down and about to get into hover setting for the drop he sensed rather than saw the flash of a RPJ and the unmistakable smoke trail

He reacted quickly – pushing the collective all the way forward to quickly gain air speed .As the heavy chopper angle forward under full power he pulled the cyclic all the way to port and back forcing the chopper to initiate a steep turning climb .

The special forces soldiers behind cursed in hindi and in unprintable language

The grenade missed the tail rotor by less than a meter.

- night hawk 3 – did you spot the bas----
- we sure did lead –clear off – 4 o clock – 200 meters –small transit camp type maybe Taliban in transit

Night hawk three pivoted on its tail rotor and dipped the nose .A few seconds later triple salvo of 57 mm rockets hit the mud /leaf structure ,blowing it up very effectively .

- all clear lead – make your drop now .

Sunil went down quickly this time and into a perfect hover 20 meters from ground on other side of the dry river valley – soldiers off and time to return home . He sure hoped all of them will be there for the return ride baack home in 3 da

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 17 Apr 2009 05:51

Chapter 2 continued...

Day 2, 2014, 7:58 PM, New Delhi, PMO's Public relations Officer

Kumar just couldn't wait anymore. He has to start calling all the major networks at 8 PM to tell them about PM's emergency address to nation. Two more minutes, he thought and slumped on his chair again.

8:00 PM , Ambala Air Base, IAF,

Orders were clear; Indian AWACS were to be in Air by 8:30 PM. Lieutenant Rajesh completed all the pre flight checks and everything was a go. Four SU-30s providing him escort were already in the air. He set the flaps, powered up the engine and the deafening roar of the engines made his heart pump; it was like love at first sight every time. You hear her and the heart starts pumping, you touch here and all the senses are awake.

“Nothing like being in love with your work” thought Rajesh, and soon AWACS was in the air at 30000 ft and its monitors were recording every activity on both sides of border.

Not to say that our satellites were not doing anything. They were busy taking pictures of the TSP’s space (they always do), but today was to be different, because from today onwards movement of the ground assets was to be tracked to gauge the threat to Indian Army.


9:00 PM, New Delhi,

Ramesh Gudipati is a busy man, he has his own business. Not a fervent nationalist but just like any other Indian, he doesn't like his country being trampled by terrorists as and when they wish. He wished he could do more, but feeding family is priority! So there he was, ready to watch the 9 PM news and see what's happening around India and the world. But instead of news he was greeted by the Indian emblem of "Ashok Chakra", May be its the wrong channel he thought, but just as soon the announcer came on and said "Today's news has been delayed because we have been directed by PMO to do a direct telecast. Please standby". And the "Ashok Chakra" was on again.

In 30 seconds PM Shastri was on the TV and he started his speech in Hindi with English translation being shown on the screen.

"Countrymen, mothers and sisters of Bharat, we are a nation of great patience. We have been waiting since 1980 to get rid of terrorism in India. Outsiders who want to destabilize India has sown seeds of discontent among very few of our people and when we acted to crushed their designs they started to bring outsiders to continue their misadventures. But look what it got them, they are being attacked by their own mistakes. They created this monster and they should deal with it.

Today, time has come to say enough is enough. I know many of us want to reply to them in their own language but in this process we loose our brave sons and brothers. As I see it, I am not willing to loose any more sons and brothers if I don't have to. To that end, we are going to take the path that Mahatma Gandhi took, Ahimsa.

Many of you will say how can Ahimsa tackle these blood thirsty people and let me tell you. Few years ago, I would not have an answer to this, but today I do. During last few years we have made advances in technology which will let us deny our enemy tools which help them create mayhem.

But first we have to recognize who our enemy is. It is certain parts of establishment in Pakistan, which first sow the seed of terrorism and now does not know how to control it. Inshallah, we are going to help them eradicate this monster. But first of all, establishment in Pakistan should see who these elements are. We are going to help the Pakistani establishment by making these elements weak and then the establishment in Pakistan will have a chance to get its act together.

To get everything started, starting tomorrow 7 AM Pakistan standard time we are going to blockade Pakistani Air Space. First step will be complete denial of airspace available to Pakistan and No, we are not going to violate their airspace or throw a thousand Agni missiles. We will sit here with our forces on full alert in India and deny them airspace as and when we wish it.

To reiterate, any aircraft flying in Pakistani airspace after 7 AM Pakistan standard time will be brought down.

We Indians only demand that Pakistan closes all terror camps. If Pakistan acts now this is all we will need. I am giving Pakistan 2 days to accept the proposal. If Leadership of Pakistan does not act in 2 days, we will lay a siege to their shores and Airspace will not be the only space they will have to worry about. If Pakistani forces try to move their assets anywhere closer to border with us, we will not stand and wait for these 2 days. Next steps will be taken as soon as possible. We are watching them right now to make sure this happens.

In the mean time our resources will be available to help Pakistani forces fight the war against terrorism. In fact just yesterday our MiGs helped PA in Peshawar. Unfortunately, Peshawar was lost to Taleban-Al Qaida alliance. All I am asking is that Pakistan commit full heartedly to the war against terrorism and to see it through we are going to take some unconventional steps and this is first of them. Where we go from here depends completely on the response of establishment in Pakistan.

We have no intention of crossing the International border and as I said we have been patient enough and enough is enough! Jai Bharat!"

9:15 PM IST, 8:45 PM, Mushaf Air Base, Sargodha, Pakistan

Air Commodore Aehsan had too much to drink tonight. “But it’s not my fault” he thought, “Gosht was so well done, I couldn’t resist some whisky with it. Well nothing to worry, tonight will be a good night to sleep”. He closed his eyes and opened up car’s window to let some cold air in. “At least this will let me get back to my senses” He said to the driver. Just that moment his mobile rang, he checked the number and it was ATC from Sargodha. “What possibly they would have to do at this moment?” He thought as he flipped open the phone “Sir, this is Kareem, in charge of ATC. Are you listening to the news right now” came the voice from the other end. “No, but I guess you have something to say, so just say it and don’t waste my time” Barked Commodore Aehsan. “Sir, India is declaring war against us. They have said they will deny us our air space” And Kareem sputtered out what PM Shastri has said a few moments ago.

Commodore Aehsan’s Nasha was gone in a second, “What a way to destroy my night” He thought. Tonight, after so many days he was planning to drink 18 year old Chivas Regal which his son has brought from UK, and not being able to do that that made him really mad. But still he didn’t take the threat so seriously, no body gives time to its arch enemy to tell that they will attack. But to be on safe side he called the officer in charge for the night and ordered 8 F-16s to be scrambled right now and whole base to be put on Red Alert status.

The F-16s were in air in 5 minutes. “You never know what these Indians are up to” He said to no one in particular, before alighting from the car and looking at the bottle of Chivas Regal. “Well nothing wrong with spending an hour here before going to base and wasting whole night looking at the radar.” He suggested to himself and so continued his rant towards the so called attack from India.

9:16 PM IST, 6:46 AM EST, WASHINTON

President Obama has a busy day ahead. His approval ratings were lowest at 55% since he was elected in 2008, he has been reelected with a razor thin majority. Clinton was carrying on her own state of affairs. Only good thing that has happened was that economy was showing good progress. Unemployment rate was at 6.5%, people had money to spend, but now that they had time to think of something other they money, they had started to ask some intelligent questions, like why we have so many troops in Afghanistan and what have we achieved.

Honestly, Obama like most of the Americans does not have an answer. When he started his presidency in 2009, he thought he knew how he can resolve the situation on Afghanistan. But his policies have failed miserably. Like most of the American he saw Pakistan as an underdog, which must be saved from India, and that is why he has failed.

But today’s announcement from Prime Minister Singh has made his day as bitter as the black Colombian coffee he was drinking. He has called up an emergency meeting of his staff to discuss the situation.

The meeting started at 8:15 EST, as soon his advisory team was there and ended at 9 AM EST with the usual rant of “India should calm down”. Clinton was directed to fly to India and Pakistan to calm both of them down.

9:17 PM IST, 6:47 PM Moscow

President Robchaosky, was getting ready for his dinner when the call came in. It was from the Indian PM Shastri. PM Shastri explained to him what will this embargo entail, and went to great lengths to explain that is NOT a WAR.

At the end of half an hour conversation, it looked President Robchaosky was willing to let the situation develop and will back Indian action as long it does not escalate in a war towards nuclear tipping point.
Last edited by vivek.sharma on 18 Apr 2009 03:31, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby mohan » 17 Apr 2009 09:51

I have been following this thread pretty much every day, and I am in awe of the creativity. The jugalbandi between Vivek.Sharma and Shankar is very interesting, though I do hope Vivek Ahuja posts more (much more) frequently..

My only crib (and I say this keeping in mind Rushdie's quote: "A book is a version of the world. If you do not like it, ignore it; or offer your own version in return.") is that the scenario and the build-up has been, to me, perfect, except this instance.

I submit that none of the authors here need to throw muck at the characters as part of the story, especially when it is, on the face of it, a tangential reference.. In particular, from what little I know (which is admittedly,not a lot), PAF is the most professional of the Pak armed forces. Since, ironically, we all come from the same stock, if the PAF commodore has a 'girlfriend', so should our bandas - which is not to say that they don't - which brings me to....

I guess my feedback is, in all the stellar posts that I have read so far, this is the only segment that has ever appeared out of place to me and a little irrelevant - if the intent is to suggest that PAF took the PM's threat lightly, perhaps there might be better ways to describe it..I think it lowers the level at which you guys have been working..

Thanks!

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 17 Apr 2009 15:01

IAF HEADQUARTERS –NEW DELHI –OPERATION BLACK TERROR WATCH

The chief of air staff was a worried man today .He had an unenviable task in hand .Enforcing a strict no fly zone over a country like Pakistan had to be implemented very carefully keeping in mind a large number of US aircraft that routinely overfly its territory both transport and combat type,the large number of civilian aircraft and also the armed and unarmed drones used in fight against terror .

But before any such no fly zone can actually be implemented existing Pakistani airforce ,still a significant force had to be made to understand that it was simply not worth challenging the Indian overwhelming air superiority over its skies .Also a fool proof protocol had to be established with NATO forces operating in the area to avoid any blue on blue incident which happened in Iraq.

While the first step will be keep the Pakistani air space under 24x7 monitoring by the phalcons , a large number of combat assets had to be kept ready on ground and in air to respond quickly to any violation of the prohibitory order just now declared . While Indian air force had the necessary resources keeping it in that state of readiness was a true logistical night mare.

He looked at the air officer commanding of central ,south western and western air command and started outlying his plan . It will be more than 24 hours before first of the IAF counter air sweep patrols will commence for as long as the no fly prohibitory orders were in force .

The first task strangely was not to order for missiles or bombs rather it was a large order for aircraft engines for flankers .The order was for a 1000 AL 31 engines for Sukhois to be ordered directly from Russia and 500 RD-33K for the Mig 35 s who will be principally responsible for the counter air sweeps .

Next was to earmark the air bases which will generate the counter air sorties

And finally air battle commanders who will command the phalcons

Then ofcourse a special request for a further order for 12 Phalcons by fast track process by passing the usal govt rig ma role .




T
he Iraqi no-fly zones are two separate no-fly zones (NFZs), and were proclaimed by the United States
The NFZ in the north of Iraq was established shortly after the Gulf War. In August 1992 the NFZ in the south to the 32nd parallel was established , but in 1996 it was expanded to the 33rd parallel
From 1992 to the United States-led coalition invasion of Iraq in 2003, there were two NFZs in Iraq. The northern NFZ extended from the 36th parallel northwards, while the southern extended from the 33rd parallel southwards. The northern NFZ was initially part of Operation Provide Comfort
Operation Provide Comfort and Provide Comfort II were military operations by the United States and some of its Gulf War allies, starting in April 1991, to defend Kurds fleeing their homes in northern Iraq in the aftermath of the Persian Gulf War, and deliver humanitarian aid to them....
relief operations to a persecuted Kurdish minority in Iraq, and was followed on by Operation Northern Watch, the successor to Operation Provide Comfort, was a US European Command Combined Task Force charged with enforcing its own no-fly zone above the 36th parallel in Iraq....
. The southern NFZ was maintained by Operation Southern Watch
Operation Provide Comfort and Provide Comfort II were military operations by the United States and some of its Gulf War allies, starting in April 1991, to defend Kurds fleeing their homes in northern Iraq in the aftermath of the Persian Gulf War, and deliver humanitarian aid to them....
began. This operation essentially created a Northern NFZ to Iraqi military aircraft. The operation provided the Kurdish population with humanitarian aid and reassurance of safe skies. However, this was marred by a friendly-fire incident on 14 April, 1994

The McDonnell Douglas F-15 Eagle is a twin-engine, all-weather military tactics fighter aircraft designed to gain and maintain air superiority in aerial combat....
fighters mistakenly shot-down two United States Army Blackhawk helicopters killing twenty-six personnel. Operation Provide Comfort officially ended on the 31st of December 1996.
Following Operation Provide Comfort, the United States continued to watch over the northern skies with the launching of Operation Northern Watch
Operation Northern Watch, the successor to Operation Provide Comfort, was a US European Command Combined Task Force charged with enforcing its own no-fly zone above the 36th parallel in Iraq....
on January 1, 1997. Operation Northern Watch continued to provide air security to the Kurdish population in the north. American and British aircraft continuously maintained the integrity of the NFZ, receiving anti-aircraft fire from Iraqi forces almost daily. The operation ran until its conclusion on May 1st, 2003.
Operation Southern Watch was an military operation conducted by Joint Task Force Southwest Asia with the mission of monitoring and controlling airspace south of the 32nd parallel north in Iraq, following the 1991 Gulf War until the 2003 invasion of Iraq....
was underway to watch over the persecuted Shi'ite populations. This operation was launched on August 27th, 1992 with the mission of preventing further inhumane acts against civilian populations. Iraq challenged the no-fly zone beginning in December 1992 when a U.S. F-16 shot down a MiG which had locked on to it in the Southern no-fly zone. The next month Allied planes attacked Iraqi SAM sites in the South and bombed a nuclear facility. Baghdad eventually halted firing on patrolling Allied aircraft after August 1993.
Operation Southern Focus was a period in the months leading up to the 2003 invasion of Iraq in which the military responses to violations of the southern Iraqi no-fly zones were increased, with more intensive bombing of air defense artillery installations and other military complexes....
in June 2002. They began to carry out offensive sorties, not only against targets that had fired on them, but upon installations that had demonstrated no hostile intent. The US claimed that these increased attacks were the result of increasing Iraqi provocations, but later, in July 2005, the British Ministry of Defense released figures showing that the number of provocations had actually dropped dramatically prior to and just after the increase in allied attacks. Their records indicate that in the first seven months of 2001, there had been 370 provocations on the part of Iraq. In the seven months from Oct. 2001 into May 2002, only 32 such provocations were recorded. General Tommy Franks later acknowledged that the dramatic increase in offensive sorties was an attempt to destroy the Iraqi defenses in much the same way as the air strikes at the beginning of the Gulf War had. Needless to say, the Iraqi government in turn, claimed the NFZ and the unprovoked attacks were illegal, and in response increased their futile efforts to shoot down an allied plane. These US and British operations had the (apparently intended) effect of reducing Iraqi ability to counter air strikes prior to the 2003 invasion of Iraq
2003 invasion of Iraq



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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Nitesh » 17 Apr 2009 15:21

Shankar wrote:IAF HEADQUARTERS –NEW DELHI –OPERATION BLACK TERROR WATCH
But before any such no fly zone can actually be implemented existing Pakistani airforce ,still a significant force had to be made to understand that it was simply not worth challenging the Indian overwhelming air superiority over its skies .

AoA time for total annihilation :evil:


The first task strangely was not to order for missiles or bombs rather it was a large order for aircraft engines for flankers .The order was for a 1000 AL 31 engines for Sukhois to be ordered directly from Russia and 500 RD-33K for the Mig 35 s who will be principally responsible for the counter air sweeps .


Seeing the latest events seems like your vish is coming true shankarda :)

Then ofcourse a special request for a further order for 12 Phalcons by fast track process by passing the usal govt rig ma role .


12 more :eek: why not DRDO made :shock:

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby HarshS » 17 Apr 2009 16:01

Minor quibble, but many people make this mistake.

It's not the PMO Office, just the PMO. The O stands for Office, as in Prime Minister's Office.

Nice part about the PM's speech, where he used the word Inshallah. Good work combining strategy, military, technology, and the aam admi.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 17 Apr 2009 18:39

Code: Select all

Russia’s MiG-35 fighter to win billion-dollar contract and leave US rivals behind
Front page / Russia / Politics

10.02.2009    Source: Pravda.Ru
 
    
    
    



Pages: 12

 

Russia is prepared to fight for the highly lucrative arms market of India. Delhi will assign $35 billion for the five-year program to completely rearm the national armed forces. A third of this amount falls for aviation. About $10.4 billion is to be spent on purchasing 126 up-to-date fighter jets. Several other billion dollars will be used to acquire 197 light helicopters.
India has become one of the largest arms importers during the recent years due to the nation’s complicated relations with Pakistan. A third Indo-Pakistan war may break out at any moment. Foreign companies get ready to fight for the Indian billions. France’s Rafale, Europe’s Eurofighter, Sweden’s Gripen and USA’s F-16 and F-18 will be a serious competition for Russia.
Russia’s Sukhoi already conducts cooperation with India : the nation launched the licensed production of Su-30MKI fighters in 2004. However, Russia has another trump card to win a possible contract – the MiG-35 fighter, which will be unveiled at Aero India 2009 air show.
MiG-35 is outfitted with aviation electronics of new generation, including a powerful radar. The aircraft also has optoelectronic systems to fight air and ground targets, a powerful defense complex and latest airborne weapons.
“MiG-35 is virtually a new modification of the old fighter, but it is quite competitive. Its low price and technical advantages leave Western rivals behind,” Konstantin Sivkov of the Academy for Geopolitical Problems told Pravda.ru. “It would also be better for India to buy this fighter for compatibility reasons. The political aspect and the foreign orientation of the political leadership play the most important role on the market of arms. The future tender will test the political orientation of India ,” the expert said.
Russia has all chances to sign the contract with India at this point. The two countries have been maintaining friendly relations with each other for many years. One should not forget the ties between Russia’s MiG Corporation and its Indian partners either. MiG fighters originally appeared in India in 1963, whereas MiG-21 used to be the basic aircraft of the Indian Air Force for years.
The cooperation continues today as well. India’s navy receives the MiG-29K/KUB carrier fighter on a regular basis. The personnel of the Indian Air Force undergoes the technical training in Russia . To crown it all, MiG modernizes India’s MiG fighters and supplies them with necessary spare parts.
Speak the truth and shame the devil on Pravda.ru forum





That Indian air force will finally go for the Mig 35 was awell known fact not just to the large population of fulcrum lovers in India . The 200 plus option to manufacture 300 more was inked in august 2009 once the intrusive end user verification clauses by US was outright rejected by IAF along with obvious political slant towards Pakistan even after dastardly terrorist attack on Mumbai .

The Mig 29 /35 manufacturing plant started production in 2011 and By 2014 was already producing close to 200 units every year. The flanker engines were however all directly imported though deep maintenance facility were available in several air bases like Lohegon, Bareilly ,Tezpur and Srinagar

The concept of mixed aircraft operation first tested during cope india 04 was put to great use with coming years. Mig 29/35 s operated with Su-30 s in typical 4 air craft formation sporting equal number of each bird . In larger formation for air dominance or deep strike the number of Mig 35 reduced say a typical 8 bird formation may consist of 5 flankers with 3 fulcrums and for near border operation the ration was reversed .

Again for a mission involving air to ground fulcrums were used in larger number because of its higher slow speed agility at low altitude

Why Mirage 2000 S were not much sued with flankers or fulcrums is their data link protocol was different and in a world of net centric operation that is a weakness Indian air force could not afford .

Mig 21 population was almost exclusively used for air base combat air patrol .Flying in formation of 4 usally they would sanitize the local air space every 3 hours 24x7

Most of the Mirage 2000 S were withdrawn and kept in reserve except for special air to ground operation that included dropping of strategic weapons and they kept on operating out of Maharajpura in some what hush hush m

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek_ahuja » 17 Apr 2009 18:42

THE VILLAGE OF DOKUNG
SOUTH OF KONGRA LA
SIKKIM
DAY 5 + 0652 HRS


The paint reflected off the metallic panels of the parked Mi-17 under the bright eastern sun that had just risen above the peaks around the Samchho La to the east. The helicopter was parked on the helipad just south of the main Battalion camp in the sector. The DIA Lt-Colonel rubbed his gloved hands to keep warm even as another gust of wind whipped up light snow through the yellow glow of the sunlight. He could see several of the ARC ground crews working on the finishing touches of their paint work on the body of the helicopter. Armed guards were patrolling the perimeter around the large camp area.

The camp itself currently had nothing more than a skeletal workforce since most of the unit was already deployed into the mountains. There was a war on in the Laddakh front and another in the Sikkim front to the east. Out on the extreme northern borders of Sikkim, there was silence, except for the wind blowing by. The camp workers were going about their morning routine as if it was yet another day. Northern Sikkim had very few locations from where the enemy could mount an attack, all of which were extremely remote from the Chinese side and hard to reach from the Indian side. There was no strategic value to the terrain but had a lot of political value. But the current war had stretched the Chinese ground forces to a point where sparing troops for such smaller sectors was deemed impossible.

The Lt-Colonel was standing in front of the winter hut given to him as his personal residence during his stay here. He was holding a cup of tea in his hand by now even as he watched the SOCOM Major and his small group of men walk out of their huts to the side fully loaded with UBGL Tavor rifles, grenades and extra ammunition clips. Then there was the heavy bag pack, and each team member also had a speciality role and its associated equipment. To top it off, there was the heavy winter gear, helmets and body-armour. Each man was carrying basically his own weight in equipment so that the team could operate off the land for at least a couple of weeks in case everything went well. This Long Range Reconnaissance Mission or LRRM was going to be in tough terrain where local supplies were scarce to say the least.

The Lt-Colonel sipped his tea as he watched the soldiers applying the streaks of white to their faces to help merge into the white and brown environment behind them in this terrain. Then a door to another hut opened to reveal three other men, this time ARC pilots in thick winter coats covering their white-brown flight overalls. They closed the door behind them and then glanced over to their passengers before walking down towards the parked helicopter on the southern end of the camp while talking and discussing the flight plan amongst them along the way. A few seconds later the SOCOM team followed suit, trudging through the one feet of snow that had fallen during the night over the entire valley.

It was peaceful here, the Lt-Colonel thought as he stared at the quiet majestic power of the white capped Himalayan peaks with the yellow glow of sunlight shining off their eastern peaks. The brutal war that had been going on between India and China for the past five days was so distant here except for the work going on within the camp. It was then that the distant sounds of fighter jets came through the valley in a distant rumble from the east to remind everybody that while northern Sikkim was peaceful, the same was not true of the Chumbi valley to the east as well as the northern Bhutanese border, where the first skirmishes between the Royal Bhutanese Army had finally broken out during the night in the Lhuntse sector.

The “Unknown” Chinese Division, as it was now being referred to within the Indian Defence Intelligence community, had finally began probing thrusts into the Lhuntse sector where it was believed that the goal was to capture the valley and then encircle the Indian IV Corps forces in the Tawang Sector from the west in anticipation of their main thrust for Tawang. This Chinese Infantry Division had moved south of the Karo La in Tibet but had not proceeded to follow its other two sister Divisions, the 55 Div. and the 11 Div., in the main thrust down the Chumbi valley. But its intentions were now becoming clear as Bhutan was being invaded by it. The Royal Bhutanese Army was currently deploying into the Lhuntse sector with everything it had, and also some Indian units under overall IMTRAT Command were assisting with air and artillery support, but the outcome was far from clear in Bhutan.

Over in the Chumbi valley, however, the main forces of the Indian XXXIII Corps was now finally initiating its moves to crush the Chinese 55 Div., 11 Div. and the Border Guards units in a Corps level counteroffensive in the Chumbi valley. Code named, Op. CHIMERA, the first phases included the attack on the 55 Div. and the elimination of the BGUs since they were currently the forces spearheading the Chinese forces in the sector. 11 Div was beefing up the forces even as it moved down from Gyantse to assist 55 Div forces...

The whining noise of the Mi-17’s engines broke the Lt-Colonel’s thought process and he jerked back into reality on the ground to see the main rotor blades of the helicopter rotating even as the SOCOM Team-Five members boarded from the aft ramp of the helicopter. A few seconds later the helicopter blades were running on full power and the snow whipped up all around had blinded the Lt-Colonel’s view. It was a few seconds before the Mi-17 finally lifted above the snow cloud it had raised and continued to raise altitude while heading north.

The sun reflected off the freshly bright red star along the sides of the helicopter as it flew over the Lt-Colonel’s hut in a deafening roar and then the sounds reduced again as it headed towards the northern Himalayan peaks around the Kongra-La into Tibet...

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek_ahuja » 17 Apr 2009 18:51

Guys,

From now on I will be adding whatever posts I put on BR Scenarios thread on my Blog as well, so that I can maintain continuity for the scenario.

The reasons for this include my inability to provide daily posts on the thread alongside Shankar and Vivek.Sharma's combined scenario due to work requirements on my time. So what happens is that my posts are like a few splotches alongside a river of posts from the other writers.

In any case, Shankar seems to have left his earlier sceanrio to begin a new one with Vivek Sharma. They have started a new scenario and then there is my own scenario. Overall, I believe the thread is too cluttered with three (?) scenarios going continuously.

Of these three, mine is the slowest moving, for which reason I believe I need to find a non-obtrusive place to continue the scenario. My blog fits this role. So you can read the posts here as well as on the blog in case you want to read several posts in a row for continuity's sake...

The blog address is: http://mach-five.blogspot.com/

Thanks.

-Vivek

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek_ahuja » 17 Apr 2009 19:30

THE ROAD TO LHUNTSE
NORTHEASTERN BHUTAN
DAY 5 + 0730 HRS


The smoke was everywhere. The village was on one of the last road-heads in the sector after which there were only mud tracks through terrace cultivated hills in case one wanted to reach the northern border of Bhutan with Tibet on foot. But this village was no more. The Chinese long range Smerch units had launched severe attacks during the night from beyond the border that lay forty kilometres to the north and had practically levelled the civilian structures in the village under a barrage of artillery rockets. Their reasons for doing so had been clear. Royal Bhutanese Army trucks were moving down this road as they brought in supplies and reinforcements for the hopelessly outnumbered and outclassed RBA units north of this sector.

Well, not any more...the RBA Colonel thought as he stepped out of his jeep at the middle of the convoy and walked past the line of parked RBA trucks along the mountain road even as injured and panicked civilians were streaming and running down the other side of the road. He could see the smoldering ruins of the civilian houses in the village. The dead and dying were everywhere even as his men were rushing to administer first aid and urgent medical support to the civilians. The Colonel and his small entourage walked past the rows of burning houses and panicked and desperate people until he came across one RBA Major whose face had been blackened by the soot and grime of battle through the night. The Major was walking down the road from the north along with a few of his men. All showed the exhaustion of combat on their faces. All showed the injuries sustained on the battlefield...

The Major spotted the clean uniformed Colonel of his unit and despite the exhaustion managed to snap off a salute which the Colonel proudly returned. He ordered his men to help the Major’s men and told them to sit down and have water. A couple of minutes later the Colonel had retrieved his maps and the Major had regained enough of his strength to speak so he asked the Major for an update of what was going on...

“The front is broken, Colonel.” The Major said as he then used his arm to point out the northern peaks beyond Lhuntse where the night battle and skirmishes had occurred with the Chinese “Unknown” Divisional forces and the outnumbered and outgunned RBA defenders. The Major’s face told the tale of what had happened even before he said a word...

“We were battered into the ground by Chinese artillery for an hour before their infantry began manoeuvring around us. We were completely overwhelmed by the numbers. Three Companies of the Battalion, Alpha, Delta and Echo, were overrun to the last man. They inflicted some losses on the Chinese but it was difficult to tell. My Company and the remaining others were not overrun but took crippling losses in men and material before we had to withdraw to regroup and plug the gaps caused by the decimation of the other Companies. The Chinese had airlifted some infantry to peaks between Lhuntse and us and we didn’t even know about them until the leading column of my men were mown down by machine-gun fire. It was complete chaos afterwards and despite my attempts the men were massacred. We managed to escape by going east into the hills and then taking the route south until we managed to locate Lhuntse thanks to the fires after the rocket attacks and we walked here.”

“What about the other three Companies?” the Colonel asked.

The Major shook his head: “They are gone, sir. The last we heard were intermittent radio messages saying they had been ambushed. BAT HQ came over the line for a few minutes with the Lt-Colonel shouting for information before they went off the air too. There may be some units still out there to the north but they are likely to be low on supplies and unlikely to be cohesive to a degree to stop the Chinese.”

“God damn it! The Battalion reported only minor skirmishes to Command yesterday night. Couldn’t that idiot tell between a skirmish and a Divisional attack?! So where’s the front now?” the Colonel asked after regaining his composure. Before the Major could answer, a few civilians came running down the road in panic shouting that that they had seen Chinese soldiers on the peaks some kilometres beyond the village. Even as the Colonel’s men caught hold of those civilians and began asking questions, the Major completed his thoughts:

“There is no front, sir. This valley and Lhuntse are lost...”

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek_ahuja » 17 Apr 2009 19:58

YUMTHANG VALLEY
WEST OF THE GORA-LA
EASTERN SIKKIM
DAY 5 + 0820 HRS


The airlift of the battery of Pinaka MLRS by the Mi-26s of the Indian “Featherweights” flight had taken over two days to complete on account of the presence of just a handful of the powerful Mi-26 helicopters in the Indian fleet. They had also brought in much needed supplies and even a counter-battery radar section to assist the MLRS in targeting acquisition. The unit was currently deployed west of the peaks around Gora-La that separated Yumthang valley and the Chumbi-valley as a giant wall of stone. On the western side of the wall were the Indian XXXIII Corps forces and on the eastern side were the Chinese 55 and 11 Division forces.

But the one thing going for the Indians was the air supremacy that had been wrenched from the PLAAF over Tibet during the course of the last five days over both Laddakh and to a much lesser degree in the Arunachal sector. Tibet was still inaccessible because the Chinese S-300 belt deployed there was still alive and kicking, as five Indian aircraft crews had found. Four of these had not lived to fight another day. But all that was meaningless in the Chumbi valley where the tactical missions were being flown by Indian Mig-27s with relative impunity. One Mig-27 had been lost to the massive triple-A fire but the losses incurred on the Chinese forces during their transit from Gyantse to the valley over open roads had proven deadly.

Even so, 55 Division was still a powerful force and to be reckoned with. The Chinese threat to Sikkim was still deadly and so Operation CHIMERA was underway. The thin mountain air was particularly helpful for any artillery system since it helped increase range of the rockets by a very good degree. For the long range Pinaka rockets, though, that was unnecessary. Nevertheless, the calculations had to be made to account for the lower drag and this job was done by the onboard mission computer for the launch crews.

The morning serenity, a bright sun and a bright blue sky were rudely interrupted by the thunder and flash of rockets as several Pinaka rockets left their launchers and headed eastwards over the Chumbi-valley...

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 18 Apr 2009 03:33

Harsh, Mohan,

Thanks for the constructive input. I have changed the elements you talked about.

By the way, it was not to denigrate any one, but rather it was my state of mind at the time I wrote it. :rotfl:

Cheers.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 18 Apr 2009 03:40

Hey Guys,

Any of you willing to maintain a map to track movement of Army Division level movements?

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Khalsa » 18 Apr 2009 05:00

vivek_ahuja wrote:Guys,

From now on I will be adding whatever posts I put on BR Scenarios thread on my Blog as well, so that I can maintain continuity for the scenario.

The reasons for this include my inability to provide daily posts on the thread alongside Shankar and Vivek.Sharma's combined scenario due to work requirements on my time. So what happens is that my posts are like a few splotches alongside a river of posts from the other writers.

In any case, Shankar seems to have left his earlier sceanrio to begin a new one with Vivek Sharma. They have started a new scenario and then there is my own scenario. Overall, I believe the thread is too cluttered with three (?) scenarios going continuously.

Of these three, mine is the slowest moving, for which reason I believe I need to find a non-obtrusive place to continue the scenario. My blog fits this role. So you can read the posts here as well as on the blog in case you want to read several posts in a row for continuity's sake...

The blog address is: http://mach-five.blogspot.com/

Thanks.

-Vivek



Awesome.. !!

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 18 Apr 2009 14:03

IAF STATIONCHANDIGARH – EAGLE SIGHT FLIGHT -0600 HRS

Wing commander Shanti Bagmore slowly walked towards her huge bird ,which will be her home for next 14 hours .While her job was keep the aircraft flying in pre designated route and as per additional requirements of the on board air battle commander usually a senior air commodore her job also entailed protection of the aircraft and everyone on board in case of hostile action and so she have to have in mind a real time picture of all diversionary airfields and flight profiles she will have to execute in event of such an attack . Co coordinating with the escorting flankers becomes critical since her comparatively slow maximum air speed and turn rate ,flankers escorting her in relatively close proximity correct and precise communication assumes paramount importance
Her calm and logical mind was her biggest asset .This allowed her to graduate from trainers to An 32 TO Il 76 in 2009 and finally her command in 2013 as the first IL 76 female commander in Indian air force .She did a short stint in IL 78 before being kicked up to command the most critical asset of the force

Unknown to her today PAF will test her command capability to its limits simply because they had no answer to Indian awacs and the only solution for them to end this inequality was to take blow it out of the sky
Not that IAF was not aware of this problem and in a logical and professional manner the expected strike by a PAF force was factored in to the strategic planning.


By the early 1970’s the USSR began to operate the Tu-126 Moss, a military version of the Tupolev Tu-144 airliner. This four-engine turboprop operated with a crew of 12 and carried the Liana radar (NATO Code name Flat Jack) in a rotordome mounted above the fuselage. However, the large counter-rotating metal propellers used by the Kuznetsov NK-12M turboprop engines seriously compromised the performance of the radar and only a few versions of this aircraft were developed. These deficiencies were only marginally improved by the installation of replacement radar called Shmel – what was needed was a new airframe.
To replace the Tu-126 Moss it was decided that the new platform had to be jet powered and the obvious aircraft was a modified version of the new IL-76MD Candid transport aircraft which was just beginning to enter service in the mid 1970’s. The new aircraft, designated the A-50, was developed and manufactured by the Beriev Company and, like the E-3A Sentry, mounted a rotodome above the fuselage. In addition the usual nose glazing and tail turret of the Candid were replaced with new radomes and an in-flight refueling probe was installed above the nose. The aircraft are equipped with an extensive avionics suite including voice radio, data links, IFF, an ECM system and comprehensive navigation equipment. The normal crew complement is 15, comprising of 2 pilots, a flight engineer, a navigator and 10 systems operators. Compared to the E-3, the crew facilities inside the Mainstay are Spartan, with no rest bunks and high noise levels.


The Indian Air Force (IAF) has been keen to acquire an effective AWACS system for many years to give it a competitive edge in it’s long running dispute with Pakistan. In early April 2000 Russia agreed to lease two A-50 Mainstay aircraft to the IAF and during July 2000 these aircraft were used along the border with Pakistan to see exactly how far inside the other country the radar could identify targets. Eventually in 2004 India decided not to buy the A-50 Mainstay ‘off-the-shelf’ and instead concluded a $1.1 billion deal with Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) for them to install a version of their Phalcon radar on three IL-76MD aircraft. The first aircraft was delivered from the Tashket factory in Uzbekistan to the IAI factory in Israel in Apr 2005 and the other two following in May and June 2005. The first IL-76MD fitted with the Phalcon radar will be delivered around Dec 2007, with the second aircraft following in Sep 2008 and the final aircraft in Mar 2009. These aircraft will probably work alongside a number of smaller Embraer EMB-145 AEW aircraft, equipped with a phased array radar developed in India by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) in a seven year programme costing $3,88.9 million. Currently it is planned to mount the radar above the fuselage in a similar manner to the Ericsson PS-890 Erieye radar

An Il-76M/Candid-B aircraft was delivered to Israel in 1999 to install the Phalcon radar and other avionics systems for China in the A-50I AWACS configuration. Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) developed its Phalcon system for Israeli defence forces and for export. Airborne Early Warning, Command and Control (AEWC&C) systems play a major role on the modern battlefield by providing realtime intelligence command and control needed to achieve and maintain air superiority over the combat area, and to enable surveillance of borders in peacetime. The AWE&C phased array radar replaces the conventional rotodome radar. It is mounted either on the aircraft fuselage, or on top of the aircraft inside a stationary dome, providing full 360° coverage. This electronically steered beam radar, offers a tremendous advantage over mechanical rotating antenna, as it supports the tracking high maneuvering targets. The radar can detect even low flying objects from distances of hundreds of kilometers, day and night, under all weather conditions. Verification beams sent at specific, individual, newly detected targets, eliminate false alarms. Moreover, track initiation is achieved in 2 to 4 seconds as compared to 20 to 40 seconds with a rotodome radar. This system had been sold to Chile, where it is designated as "Condor. In early April 2000 Russia reached preliminary agreement to lease two A-50 aircraft to the Indian Air Force to step up its aerial surveillance on the border with Pakistan. India conducted trials of the A50 in July 2000, and the results were reportedly satisfactory. Beriev was to produce three A-50E AEW aircraft for India with IAI of Israel providing the aircraft’s electronic systems. The A-50E airborne early warning and contol aircraft is intended to perform the following missions: detection, tracking and IFF determination of the air and surface targets, surveilance, command, control and communication functions for both commands posts of automatic control systems, guidance of fighters to air targets and attack aviation to serface targets.
In early 2002, the U.S. requested that Israel postpone the proposed $1.2 billion Phalcon deal, because of increasing tension between India and Pakistan. Since then it had been frozen, waiting for U.S. approval. The Israeli-made Phalcon radar would extend the range of the Indian air force, enabling very long-range identification of targets and control over the weapons aimed at them. There is no American equipment on the Russian planes.
In mid-2003 the US approved the sale of the Israeli produced Phalcon airborne radar system to India. In October 2003 Russia, India and Israel signed an agreement for supply to India 3 A-50 aircraft (based on Ilyushin-76 airplane) for long-distance radiolocation control, detection and guidance. At the request of the Indian party, the aircraft will be equipped with low-noise and fuel-efficient PS-90A-76 engines instead of usually provided D-30KP engines. A part of the revenue obtained from the deal will be received by the manufacturer of the PS-90A-76 engines - Perm Engine Company.



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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 18 Apr 2009 16:56

Question:

How does the Fuse mechanism for explosives works on following, is it mechanical like hand guns or electronic? While answering, if you keep the answer in context of arms used by Indian Forces, that will be great.


1. Big Guns placed on Tanks like T-72, T-90, Arjun MBT
2. Artillery guns like Bofors
3. RPG launchers
4. Dumb Bombs used by Air Force. (Smart bombs will have some kinds of electronic circuitry that is given)

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 18 Apr 2009 17:32

Piezoelectric fuse for projectile with safe and arm mechanism
Document Type and Number:
United States Patent 4793256

Abstract:
A piezoelectric fuse, and safe and arm mechanism for a small active projectile is dislcosed including a piezoelectric element mounted within the projectile near the leading end thereof with an impact deformable electrically conductive shell spaced from and at least partially surrounding the piezoelectric element and a resilient material substantially filling the space between the piezoelectric element and the shell. Electrical leads connected the detonator to the shell and to a rearward piezoelectric element contact so that upon projectile impact, the shell deforms compressing the piezoelectric element generating a volatge thereacross, and thereafter, the shell makes electrical connection with a piezoelectric element forward contact actuating the detonator. The safe and arm mechanism includes an interrupter located in a "safe" position between the detonator and a lead charge. The interrupter may move from the safe position only upon both sufficient angular velocity and sufficient linear acceleration of the projectile.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 18 Apr 2009 17:43

The basic concept of a bomb could hardly be simpler. A conventional bomb consists of some explosive material packed into a sturdy case with a fuze mechanism . The fuze mechanism has a triggering device -- typically a time-delay system, an impact sensor or a target-proximity sensor -- which sets the bomb off. When the trigger goes off, the fuze ignites the explosive material, resulting in an explosion. The extreme pressure and flying debris of the explosion destroys surrounding structures

The fuze technology used with a bomb defines how the bomb is enabled to allow it to explode, or "armed", and what events detonate the bomb. Arming mechanisms include:

* A small propeller, or "arming vane", that arms the bomb after the vane spins a certain number of rotations after bomb release from the aircraft.

* An arming pin that is pulled out when the bomb is released from the aircraft.

* An inertial fuze, used on retarded bombs, that is armed by the jerk caused by the deployment of brake fins or a ballute.

* An electronic fuze, based on a timer circuit. The timer is activated by an arming lanyard that is extracted when the bomb is released from the aircraft.

Fuzes can be organized according to the detonation parameters that trigger them:

* Impact fuzes, which simply trigger when the bomb hits something. Impact fuzes can be mounted in bomb's nose or tail. As noted, a tail-mounted fuze is often used on penetrating munitions, since a nose-mounted fuze would be destroyed by impact. There are also "all-ways" fuzes that can detonate on impact at any angle. All-ways fuzes are generally used on napalm bombs and other unfinned bombs that tumble when dropped.

A variation on the simple impact fuze is the "daisy cutter" fuze, which resembles of a long rod mounted on the nose of an HE or fragmentation bomb. A daisy cutter fuze triggers the bomb before it buries itself in the ground, producing greater destructive effect over the surrounding terrain.

Impact fuzes may also have a short time delay, particularly in penetrating bombs. This allows the bomb to penetrate into the target before detonating.

* Time fuzes, which are set into action when the bomb is released, and may have delays of hours to days. They are used to interfere with the work of damage-control teams, or to harass enemy forces trying to pass through a location after an air strike.

* Proximity fuzes, which contain a small radar set that triggers the bomb at a predetermined height above the ground. Interestingly, new electronic warfare devices have been developed to "spoof" proximity fuzes into detonating at high altitude, limiting destructive effect of the bomb.

* Hydrostatic fuzes, which go off at a certain depth under water. Such fuzes are generally used in depth charges, which are not (as such) discussed in this document.

* Magnetic, seismic, and acoustic fuzes, which sense the passage of a large object like a ship or tank and then detonate, allowing the bomb to act as a mine. In US terminology, bombs so fitted are often called "destructor mines".

To actually turn the bomb, the control system sends a message to actuators that adjust the flight fins. These fins work the same basic way as the various flaps on an airplane. By tilting the fins in a particular direction, the control system increases the drag acting on that side of the bomb. As a result, the bomb turns in that direction. (See How Airplanes Work for more information).

This adjustment process continues until the smart bomb reaches its target, and the fuze mechanism sets off the explosive. Smart bombs generally have proximity fuzes, which set off the explosive just before the bomb reaches the target, or impact fuzes, which set off the explosive when the bomb actually hits something.

The main difference between the different types of smart bomb is how the sensor system actually "sees" the target in the first place.

Up until relatively recently, most smart bombs were either TV/IR-guided or laser-guided. Both types of bomb use visual sensors to locate ground targets.

A TV/IR-guided bomb has either a conventional television video camera or an infrared camera (for night vision) mounted to its nose. In remote-operation mode, the controller relays information through radio signals to a human operator, who is usually onboard the bomber plane. The remote operator relays commands to the control system to steer the bomb through the air -- the bomb acts something like a remote-control plane. In this mode, the operator may launch the bomb without a specific target and sight, and then pick up the target from the video as the bomb gets closer to the ground.

Laser-guided smart bombs work a little differently. Instead of a video camera sensor, the bomb has a laser seeker -- an array of photo diodes. As you might expect, the photo diodes are sensitive to a particular frequency of laser light. For the bomb to see its target, a separate human operator, either on the ground or in the air, has to "paint" the designated target with a high-intensity laser beam. The laser beam reflects off the target, and the laser seeker picks it up.

The laser designator has its own unique pulse pattern. Before dropping the bomb, the bomber aircraft computer tells the missile's control system the specific pulse pattern (via an electronic "umbilical" connection to the bomb). Once the bomb is in the air, the control system is only interested in laser energy with this pulse pattern. The control system's basic goal is to steer the bomb so that the reflected laser beam is hitting near the center of the photo diode array. This keeps the bomb heading straight toward the target.

The JDAM "tail kit" includes adjustable tail fins, a control computer, an inertial guidance system and a GPS receiver. Both the GPS receiver and the inertial guidance system allow the bomb to locate itself in space. The GPS receiver figures out its position by interpreting GPS satellite signals (see How GPS Receivers Work), while the inertial guidance system monitors the bomb's movements, tracking its path from its launch position.

Before dropping the bomb, the aircraft uses its own GPS receiver to pinpoint particular targets on the ground. Just before releasing the bomb, the aircraft's computer feeds the bomb's computer its current position and the GPS coordinates of the target.This system works fine even in bad weather, because the JDAM gets all its information from satellite signals, which aren't blocked by cloud cover or obstacles. The bomb doesn't have to see anything at all to find its way to the target.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vijyeta » 18 Apr 2009 22:39

Tu 126 was a development of the Tu 114 airliner.

Tu 144 was a supersonic passenger jet - the "Konkordski". One of these crashed at the Paris airshow and another was refurbished and used as a test vehicle by NASA.

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby vivek.sharma » 18 Apr 2009 23:54

Shankar,

Thanks for the quick tutorial.

Vivek

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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 19 Apr 2009 15:44

Tu 144 was a supersonic passenger jet - the "Konkordski". One of these crashed at the Paris airshow and another was refurbished and used as a test vehicle by NASA.


I know - after all i am like konkordosky (tu 144 ) and Harpoonaski(uran) and amraamski(R-77) also known as shankarosky by my russian friends

any thanks for te technical correction

Shankar
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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby Shankar » 19 Apr 2009 15:52

At the Paris airshow of 1973, the Tu-144 was said to be cleaner and faster than Concorde ands certainly was bigger. On the third day of the show it was time for the two supersonic aircraft to duel against each other in the sky - a battle of the displays. Concorde flew first and performed a breathtaking display of the sort that we are now accustomed to from the big white wonder. Whilst on the runway, the pilot of the Konkordski was told that he now had only half the time in which to perform his display, his time had been cut. The Tu-144 took off and climbed to 4 000 feet - suddenly there was a violent change in the pitch of the aircraft and it fell out of the sky, the aircraft broke up at 1 500 feet and feel onto the nearby village. All six crew and several civilians died from the accident.

Inmediately after the crash the cover-up of the reasons for the crash began, a cover-up that seemed to involve both the French and the Soviets. In 1974 there was a joint French/Soviet statement that read that it was impossible to define the cause of the crash of the Tu-144, the "Black Box" had apparently been destroyed.This seems a most unlikely event due to the design of "Black Box"'s and the record of crashes where the Box has survived despite the aircraft plunging into the ground

Shortly before the Tu-144 took off, a French Mirage fighter launched from a nearby airfield. The Mirage was fitted with reconnaissance photographic equipment. The Tu-144 crew were not informed of the Mirage, this was in breach of the airshow regulations. The Mirage climbed to 4 000 feet and began to film the canard foreplanes of the Tu-144. As the Konkordski climbed it was climbing towards the Mirage above them. The Tu-144 suddenly burst through the clouds and saw the Mirage, in a despirate attempt to avoid a collision the Tu-144 pilot performed a -1G dive. This manoevre caused thrust to be lost as a result and the aircraft stalled. The pilots despirately tried to windmill-start the engines as the plane fell out of the sky. The crew managed to virtually recover the plane, but tragically it was too late as the airframe was overstressed to destruction. This was why there was a cover-up and why the deaths of 8 people had no explanation.


-Shankarosky quoting from tripod.com

H.B.Krishna
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Re: Possible Indian Military Scenarios - XII

Postby H.B.Krishna » 19 Apr 2009 18:46

Shankar wrote:Inmediately after the crash the cover-up of the reasons for the crash began, a cover-up that seemed to involve both the French and the Soviets.....

Well dear Shankarosky, that may explain the French part of it but Soviets?? Were Soviets fed up with their "desi" Natashas and wanted more "phoren" adventure :roll:


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