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INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby SaiK » 25 Feb 2015 03:46

111m. +1 bheeshma

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby member_23370 » 25 Feb 2015 04:35

The beam is also about 11m. There is no way that beast only carries 4 VLS tubes. Even the garbage like Xia with 10 m beam had 2 rows of 6 JL-1's. Same with the french Redoubtable class.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby chaitanya » 25 Feb 2015 04:52

The front of the hull is shiny as well, just like the pictures floating around online. Any reason for that?

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Gagan » 25 Feb 2015 05:16

Arihant itself !!!

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 25 Feb 2015 07:37

most definitely. in relation to the size of sail, that boat is way too long to be a kilo. the white composite sonar area matches the indoor shot (and proves its not a Ohio camping in vizag for some secret indo-us anti-cheen plan!)

I do agree it looks like having space for 6-8 tubes. whether they fitted it is another matter.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 25 Feb 2015 07:38

Bheeshma wrote:The beam is also about 11m. There is no way that beast only carries 4 VLS tubes. Even the garbage like Xia with 10 m beam had 2 rows of 6 JL-1's. Same with the french Redoubtable class.


but the Xia was longer at 120m and had two rows of 6 tubes each. the additional 10m accomodating 4 tubes is logical.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby negi » 25 Feb 2015 07:42

Well we do not know about the crew quarters and internal space management in Xia or even Arihant so 5-10 meters difference doesn't mean much.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 25 Feb 2015 07:45

http://i.ndtvimg.com/mt/2014-08/INS_Ari ... _final.jpg

we know this pic is genuine because ndtv is in some trouble over it.

problem with the hump section is its narrowness...tapering to the top. so single row of 4 tubes onlee. :((

in other SSBN the hump is entirely boxy like delta, or like a box pierced into a cylinder and sticking out (Jin class) and where not flat, the doors open down to the side to squeeze in two rows of tubes and still retain some smooth curvature.

http://www.allwoodships.com/Submarines/ ... issile.jpg

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby negi » 25 Feb 2015 07:48

chaitanya wrote:The front of the hull is shiny as well, just like the pictures floating around online. Any reason for that?

May be that part is not covered with anechoic tiles like on a kilo. That shiny part looks like a one piece akin to car's bonnet which can be taken out for routine maintenance .

http://www.militaryimages.net/photopost ... ukirti.jpg

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby member_23370 » 25 Feb 2015 08:01

Singha wrote:
Bheeshma wrote:The beam is also about 11m. There is no way that beast only carries 4 VLS tubes. Even the garbage like Xia with 10 m beam had 2 rows of 6 JL-1's. Same with the french Redoubtable class.


but the Xia was longer at 120m and had two rows of 6 tubes each. the additional 10m accomodating 4 tubes is logical.



Its not the length but the beam that was my point of contention. The redoubtable had 10.6 m beam and could take 2 rows of M45(1.93 m dia). I suspect A class may have 2X4 silos.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Ankit Desai » 25 Feb 2015 08:34

Can it be one of the older class, acts as escort for sea trial ? I know older class has shorter length but just a thought. May be HDW 209 ?

-Ankit

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby nevin » 25 Feb 2015 09:05

its definitely Arihant, its not Kilo and not HDW. Forward position of the sail, diving planes on the sail, the aluminium colored covering upfront etc. are giveaways.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby ravip » 25 Feb 2015 09:08

If anyone failed to notice there is another submarine just behind the Arhinat in the pen and not the pen which is beside, from the looks it resembles Akula, any idea which sub is that?

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby pralay » 25 Feb 2015 09:12

chaitanya wrote:The front of the hull is shiny as well, just like the pictures floating around online. Any reason for that?
Number plates must have white background :P
and not to forget the holy words "Horn OK Please" :lol:

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby hnair » 25 Feb 2015 09:23

ravip, good observation on the second one. Looks like a floating deperming cage (based on the lattice-like shadow on the quay)

Regarding layout of tubes. IIRC, khan was also toying with a single-row (in-line) of tubes for its Ohio replacement, since there is a lot of interest in yindoo style "minimum-detergent", which is distinct from the past stupidities of "unaffordable unseemly detergent". Not a bad idea to spread out the risk in larger number of hulls than in a single Death Star type.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby member_23370 » 25 Feb 2015 09:27

ravip wrote:If anyone failed to notice there is another submarine just behind the Arhinat in the pen and not the pen which is beside, from the looks it resembles Akula, any idea which sub is that?


Where is this sub?...Ok saw it..

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 25 Feb 2015 09:44

it is the Akula, but doesnt that shed look like a degaussing facility with just a plastic cover for rain protection?
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/22/16/45_big.jpg

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby adityadange » 25 Feb 2015 13:15

INS Arihant caught sun bathing and most probably his cousin INS Aridaman is hiding in the pens.

will anybody please share the image on different site? that url is blocked in my company. :((

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby negi » 25 Feb 2015 13:17

^ GD but diving panes on Akula are not on the coning tower , they deploy from the forward section of the hull.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 25 Feb 2015 15:42

^ I meant the sub inside the degaussing shed.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby member_23370 » 25 Feb 2015 19:53

Any guess on when this pic was taken. Must be old the Arihant is still on its sea trials, been 70 odd days.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby dinesha » 25 Feb 2015 20:49

Image

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby ramana » 25 Feb 2015 21:42

So from Dec 16, 2014 to Jan 11, 2015 is less than 30 day sea trials time. Looks like the machinery checked out and most likely the BO15 are out loaded for firing trials. So expect some news soon any time.


IN should invest on a covered wharf for its detergent subs. This open pen is not useful.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby vardhank » 25 Feb 2015 22:49

Am I looking at this incorrectly, or is the (probable) sub in the (probable) degaussing shed a fair bit wider (beam) and a bit shorter than the Arihant?

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby member_23370 » 25 Feb 2015 23:23

Thanks Dinesha but how can Arihant be in the wharf on 11 Jan if the sea trials are going on? Or is it Aridhaman? The second is chakra since it looks roughly same dimension 107-8 m and has broader beam -13.5m.

Ah just saw ramanas post. That's another possibility the first sea trial was only 20-25 days. I hope they do the real K4/15 test firing soon after the sea trials.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby SNaik » 26 Feb 2015 00:10

Singha wrote:it is the Akula, but doesnt that shed look like a degaussing facility with just a plastic cover for rain protection?
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/22/16/45_big.jpg

Released to Public

ID: DNSC9501503 Service Depicted: Navy

A stern view of the nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine USS WEST VIRGINIA (SSBN-736) passing through the Magnetic Silencing Facility at Naval Submarine Base Kings Bay. The facility is used to determine a submarine's magnetic signature in order to minimize the possibility of detection.

Location: KINGS BAY, GEORGIA (GA) UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (USA)

Camera Operator: JULIE IRWIN Date Shot: 1 Nov 1994

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Ankit Desai » 26 Feb 2015 01:21

SNaik wrote:
Singha wrote:it is the Akula, but doesnt that shed look like a degaussing facility with just a plastic cover for rain protection?
http://photos.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/22/16/45_big.jpg

Released to Public

ID: DNSC9501503 Service Depicted: Navy

A stern view of the nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine USS WEST VIRGINIA (SSBN-736) passing through the Magnetic Silencing Facility at Naval Submarine Base Kings Bay. The facility is used to determine a submarine's magnetic signature in order to minimize the possibility of detection.

Location: KINGS BAY, GEORGIA (GA) UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (USA)

Camera Operator: JULIE IRWIN Date Shot: 1 Nov 1994


But there was shade before. It looks like the non transparent material erode away. Even you can see some of it still on the hood. If you check google map , you still can see non-transparent shade.

-Ankit

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby SaiK » 26 Feb 2015 03:51

It is possible to demagnetize ferromagnetic (if at all used for INS Arihant) individually before assembly. I am sure our folks would not have used ferromagnetic materials in fear of MAD.

btw India rejected those MAD seahawks (did it carry MAD?).. not that we would not have tested it out with other MAD platforms.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Suraj » 26 Feb 2015 04:10

Unless there's spatial compression in the non horizontal axes, a simple measurement of the length using the scale reference in the first pic suggests it's much longer than 106m or 111m. 115-120m seems closer. And yes, it looks long enough to hold more than the 4 silos it's claimed to carry.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 26 Feb 2015 07:28

> IN should invest on a covered wharf for its detergent subs. This open pen is not useful.

thats the new base in Rambili with underground pens. would only be 2nd in the world after hainan . the soviet one in crimea is retired.

rest of the time ohios and deltas seem to be tied up in open wharfs. the major ssn base in groton is also a series of long jettys.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Cybaru » 26 Feb 2015 09:33

Isn't Arihant's code name S2 ?? :) Maybe there is a S1?

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Picklu » 26 Feb 2015 09:43

^^ yes, in kalapakkam

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby sum » 30 Mar 2015 11:45

X-post:
sum wrote:Budget cut hits secret nuclear submarine base on east coast

Project Varsha, India's secret nuclear submarine base on the east coast, has received less than 15 per cent of its approved budget in the current fiscal, adversely affecting its development.

Being constructed at Rambilli, near Vishakhapatnam, the base received a meagre Rs 26 crore in 2014-15 as against the budgetary allocation of Rs 197 crore, sources told Deccan Herald.

The government took away almost Rs 13,000 crore from the Defence Ministry's budge in the current fiscal. This closely-guarded naval facility is one of the projects that faced the consequences.


The slashing of the budget, however, has made Navy officials apprehensive about timely completion of the strategic project.

Though the base's construction began in 2009, the first major cash flow took place in 2011, when the Navy received almost Rs 160 crore, out of which Rs 58 crore was meant for civil construction and the rest for the communication system of the base.
Since then, Project Varsha was getting a steady supply of funds—it had received Rs 547 crore in 2013-14—before it was struck by cash shortage.


INS Varsha would be accompanied by a weapon storage facility called “missile technical positions” (MTP).

It was also impacted by the budget cut, but to a lesser extent as the budgetary estimate of Rs 237 crore was reduced by Rs 100 crore.

Jaitley has now promised Rs 137 crore for the MTP, which reduces the operational turnaround time in wartime situations.


India has readied a brand new very-low-frequency transmitting station on the Tamil Nadu coast, and installed an ultra-high-frequency transponder on its military satellite GSAT-7 for talking to submarines underwater.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby sudhan » 30 Mar 2015 12:52

Cybaru wrote:Isn't Arihant's code name S2 ?? :) Maybe there is a S1?


AFAIK, S1 and S2 are names given to the nuke reactors powering the subs. S1 was a land based prototype reactor built in Kalpakkam.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Yagnasri » 30 Mar 2015 14:09

No news on Arihant follow up boats. Noting at all.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby sum » 30 Mar 2015 14:41

^^ Isnt that good news if no news?

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Austin » 30 Mar 2015 15:31

Good Details on IN Nuclear Submarine Program

The Indian Ocean riposte

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Austin » 30 Mar 2015 15:39

Image

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Singha » 30 Mar 2015 15:55

Very ambitious and will need huge funding and scaling up with mdl running another line

Also confirms next 3 arihant class have 8 tubes.

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Re: INS Arihant (ATV) News and Discussion -2

Postby Philip » 30 Mar 2015 17:28

They could also be used in an SSGN role with 24 K-15s and/or BMos too. The article said that there was a debate going ton whether the ATV proven reactor should be used for the SSNs,or a new more powerful reactor instead.The IN in any case would want a more powerful reactor to be developed for future larger SSBNs/SSGNs.No harm in pursuing both options.However,the SSN/SSGN will have to have a greater top speed u/w and a more streamlined sail. With more new Russian SSGNs in the pipeline,there may be a possibility that more upgraded Akula-2s may be available for lease later on. If this was possible,it would be prudent to acquire another 2 apart from the second being negotiated so that we have a fleet of 4 Akula-2s easier to support,which would mean at least 2 always available for duty in a crisis.

The report about lack of funding for the Rambili base is a dampener. The N-sub base and SSBNs should be the highest priority of all the defence programmes in the country. The sub-based leg of the nuclear triad is the most secure and with a vast area of the IOR in which to hide,it will be a major task for the PLAN to seek and detect Indian SSBNs in the IOR.


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