As an FYI, US DOD has been EPA exempt forever. All engines made for DOD are also emissions exempt. Both IC and GT.Vips wrote:The Government has now decided to take Defense Projects outside the purview of Environmental clearance procedures. That is all defence projects will no longer require the mandatory environ(mental) clearance.This is a welcome development and common sense has at last been shown by the government to not trust the babudom which more often then not exhibits JNUitis.
Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
X-posting
Do read in full - it would have been funny if not tragic. It confirms (no official sources though) that no one actually asked for this system, and it was basically a counter hafta to the americans for buying S-400 (lol we thought we could cheap-out with just 1 billion, turns out we may have to pay double that) - IAF never asked for it. One can guess how many other such deals we have signed with out any requirement from the forces, while much needed equipment is not bough and indigenous weapons are sidelined.basant wrote:Not Keen On NASAMS-II, IAF Wants Indian Missile Defence
It’s official: The Indian Air Force doesn’t want the American NASAMS-II networked air defence system and has communicated this to the government. Pitched to India since 2017 in the wake of India’s decision to procure the Russian S-400 Triumf, Livefist has learnt that the Indian Air Force has informed the government that it would rather spend resources on the indigenous multi-tiered Ballistic Missile Defence (BMD) program that includes medium and long range surface-to-air missile elements. The latter system has completed the first phase of its development and is currently part of plans for operational deployment by 2022.
...
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Truth is there has been a quid pro quo, ever since the Nuclear has been signed
1. We have acquired 11 C-17
2. 9 or 10 C-130J
3. 12 ordered plus 6 more P8I in the Pipeline
4. 24 MH60R
5. 22 Apache
6. 14 Chinooks
7. M777 Artillery
Plus Harpoon II, Light Torpedos, Excalibur shells, rifles etc.
Many of which we are finding really useful, we are also exporting a lot to the USA. Clearly whichever Govt is in power there is some give and take with GOTUS. We have to buy some weapons of theirs. Which in a way is good.
The problem is the there is huge commission gravy train involving Babudom, Politicians and even probably the odd service staff. This includes Purchase of weaponary from France, UK, Russia also.
They will market every weapon and push it through for direct commission to Children future settlement. Thats why the pressure of F16 21 instead of TEJAS MKII, Gripen, Rafale, Eurofighter , F-15 Silent Eagle, Sea Gaurdian, Nasams II Etc etc......
Some of which we will need, some of which it is in every other country's interest to destroy our domestic weapons capability. Hopefully our Industry is strong enough to start taking these lobbies on and we import only what we need and start to think strategically.
why cant we convert some 737-900 based DRDO AWACS, Fuel Tankers and a few for Bombers- given its commonlity with the P-8I this can be done quickly as Boeing has done structural modifications aldready in the base platform. It will ensure common spare parts etc.
What we need is the DRDO UCAV (RUSTOM) and UAV products now kept under wraps to start working with these.
1. We have acquired 11 C-17
2. 9 or 10 C-130J
3. 12 ordered plus 6 more P8I in the Pipeline
4. 24 MH60R
5. 22 Apache
6. 14 Chinooks
7. M777 Artillery
Plus Harpoon II, Light Torpedos, Excalibur shells, rifles etc.
Many of which we are finding really useful, we are also exporting a lot to the USA. Clearly whichever Govt is in power there is some give and take with GOTUS. We have to buy some weapons of theirs. Which in a way is good.
The problem is the there is huge commission gravy train involving Babudom, Politicians and even probably the odd service staff. This includes Purchase of weaponary from France, UK, Russia also.
They will market every weapon and push it through for direct commission to Children future settlement. Thats why the pressure of F
Some of which we will need, some of which it is in every other country's interest to destroy our domestic weapons capability. Hopefully our Industry is strong enough to start taking these lobbies on and we import only what we need and start to think strategically.
why cant we convert some 737-900 based DRDO AWACS, Fuel Tankers and a few for Bombers- given its commonlity with the P-8I this can be done quickly as Boeing has done structural modifications aldready in the base platform. It will ensure common spare parts etc.
What we need is the DRDO UCAV (RUSTOM) and UAV products now kept under wraps to start working with these.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
We may actually be moving backwards, I don't get it when certain senior members state "XYZ is being closely monitored from the top, all iz well onlee".
https://www.indiatoday.in/magazine/spec ... 2020-07-25![Image](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EdxzyFdUcAEqjAw?format=jpg&name=small)
https://www.indiatoday.in/magazine/spec ... 2020-07-25
Attempts at private sector ammunition production have not taken off either, though not for want of capacity, capability or investments. In June, the army’s Master General of Ordnance Branch inexplicably pulled the plug on a 2016 plan to procure ammunition from the private sector. A brainchild of then defence minister Manohar Parrikar, the plan had aimed to bring the private sector into what was until then a government monopoly. It studied the 2016 experience where ammunition deficiencies led to fast-track buys. The goal was not only import substitution but also to create a vast domestic ammunition manufacturing capacity that the armed forces could tap into in an emergency. Deliveries would commence from six months of signing of the contract and spread over 10 years.
Fifteen private sector firms had planned to bid for eight procurement contracts for specialised tank, anti-aircraft and infantry ammunition for the army’s vast Russian-origin arsenal of battle tanks, anti-aircraft guns, multiple grenade launchers and 155 mm artillery guns (see A Lost Opportunity). Some of the private players had even established plants and scouted for international partners, anticipating orders. Five requests for proposal (RFPs) for ammunition were withdrawn while no decision has been taken on proposals for BMCS (Bi Modular Charge System) and fuses. With the collapse of long-term capability building plans, short-term weapons acquisitions will continue to remain more attractive.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
The Ecosystem has done well, it feels helpless but the whole procurement process and media coverage needs to be overhauled. Policy changes pushing Private sector in and Indian MIC are crucial but it wins 0 votes so its back to Arabian horses
Mistakes of 1000 years continue no wonder a PLA soldier in the border clash took pride in his Chinese SUV and throwing contempt at Indians for not making anything. And for those wanting war, let me tell we can never win a war with imported ammo and weapons, there will never be enough numbers. Strategically our shoddy defense purchases have cut the hands and legs of the nation.
Congratulations to the commission lobby accross the board who enjoy the benefits with themselves and thier dynasties by sacrificing the nation. I really hope karma catches up with the whole lot.
No wonder our procurement process is so horrible and actively discourages Private sector into defense. This will forever keep our miltary capability backward. And paltry orders after years of trials. And don't expect any nation to respect us while we keep acting as fools where individual commissions and family settlements are important than the nation. These people involved internally in these sabotages accross the board are traitors at the level of the terrorist. We are fighting with both hands tied in the back and ultimately its lower level jawans from Army, paramilitary who pay the price. Pakistan also accesses our capabilities and knows we don't have capability in numbers to actually defeat them and keeps the terrorist tap alive.
Mistakes of 1000 years continue no wonder a PLA soldier in the border clash took pride in his Chinese SUV and throwing contempt at Indians for not making anything. And for those wanting war, let me tell we can never win a war with imported ammo and weapons, there will never be enough numbers. Strategically our shoddy defense purchases have cut the hands and legs of the nation.
Congratulations to the commission lobby accross the board who enjoy the benefits with themselves and thier dynasties by sacrificing the nation. I really hope karma catches up with the whole lot.
No wonder our procurement process is so horrible and actively discourages Private sector into defense. This will forever keep our miltary capability backward. And paltry orders after years of trials. And don't expect any nation to respect us while we keep acting as fools where individual commissions and family settlements are important than the nation. These people involved internally in these sabotages accross the board are traitors at the level of the terrorist. We are fighting with both hands tied in the back and ultimately its lower level jawans from Army, paramilitary who pay the price. Pakistan also accesses our capabilities and knows we don't have capability in numbers to actually defeat them and keeps the terrorist tap alive.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
There seems to funds crunch for LCA Tejas orders but no funds crunch for various import procurements.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
unless govt creates a monetary interest for netas, babus, def offrs in decreasing order of % for domestic products..there aint gonna be any domestic def industry...
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
this entire death of parikkar due to cancer, I am having dark thoughts about the same.
India's defence procurement lays bare today. And it tells the bystander a lot of info.
1. Dependence on imports for critical inputs. Citing fund crunch those imports are always kept limited and high profile exotic brands. So basically no numbers to sustain a warfront. Even on imported platforms, rendered rather less potent by not stocking up on spares, critical ammo add-on's, ammo numbers to sustain war, because there is not much gravy in ammo imports. Always go for high visibility this or that so that a hype is created but it matters little on actual war other than showbaazi.
2. So basically entire world and their nephew now knows that when defence is based on imports it is always meant to defend and not go on offensive. 'Going on offensive' capability is what we have always lacked and is the capability that has been crippled by few dozen exotic import bombs here & there. The import-based defence aquisition policy underpinning was that we would/could never go on offensive. Everything from AAM, AASM, LACM would be in ultra low numbers always. Only a few dozen being procured/produced each year so that stocks are kept unnaturally low.
3. Never encourage indigenous solutions because that changes net paradigm of only defend, never offend. Never pay suppliers on time, never give large orders for indigenous equipment, only make deals with a top creamy layer of dalals who sit and incubate in dehli and give 'suggestions' on whom to encourage and encouraging whom can have adverse impact on long-term independence and reduction of imports.
4. So what are the choices, in any crises just keep talking esp if the enemy is better stocked up on essentials.
India's defence procurement lays bare today. And it tells the bystander a lot of info.
1. Dependence on imports for critical inputs. Citing fund crunch those imports are always kept limited and high profile exotic brands. So basically no numbers to sustain a warfront. Even on imported platforms, rendered rather less potent by not stocking up on spares, critical ammo add-on's, ammo numbers to sustain war, because there is not much gravy in ammo imports. Always go for high visibility this or that so that a hype is created but it matters little on actual war other than showbaazi.
2. So basically entire world and their nephew now knows that when defence is based on imports it is always meant to defend and not go on offensive. 'Going on offensive' capability is what we have always lacked and is the capability that has been crippled by few dozen exotic import bombs here & there. The import-based defence aquisition policy underpinning was that we would/could never go on offensive. Everything from AAM, AASM, LACM would be in ultra low numbers always. Only a few dozen being procured/produced each year so that stocks are kept unnaturally low.
3. Never encourage indigenous solutions because that changes net paradigm of only defend, never offend. Never pay suppliers on time, never give large orders for indigenous equipment, only make deals with a top creamy layer of dalals who sit and incubate in dehli and give 'suggestions' on whom to encourage and encouraging whom can have adverse impact on long-term independence and reduction of imports.
4. So what are the choices, in any crises just keep talking esp if the enemy is better stocked up on essentials.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
It's pretty clear that war against China needs to be won inside India and what needs to be discussed is why Modi and co have failed to tackle this and have not brought culprits to justice. If they are clueless about it then what needs to be done to grab their attention? Not having an established local MIC is as good as being slapped by chinese and losing war.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
I would suggest that Ajai Sukla types is push back against drop in imports, hence the whining on defense budget as a % of GDP going down and hyping China land grabs, when import orders are made immediately the outrage industry is also toning down thier rhetoric, it is buying a few days peace in this long drawn war on many fronts. Meanwhile the ecosystem of babudom and media through allegations around no industrial capability or orders are built up. This direct oversight while pleasing international parties and keeping the domestic politics voters funded. It's like chakravuha with media power. We have seen soo many posters on BRF itself who have fallen hook, line and sinker to the import lobby propoganda. Quite frankly we are not ready for war and can only buy time. We can be ready for war only when we have a serious MIC. At the same time let's not self flagellatw too much. There is good input from HAL Su 30, that's why the import lobby attacks it, we have added Brahmos, Astra etc with this platform. Similarly many nascent programs are attacked and nipped in the bud.
Similarly hyping up Chinese reverse engineering etc, all thier flanker variants require significant Russian input, they cover thier inputs.
Change needs to come, it will take time with proper focus. This is attacked with misinformation.
Similarly hyping up Chinese reverse engineering etc, all thier flanker variants require significant Russian input, they cover thier inputs.
Change needs to come, it will take time with proper focus. This is attacked with misinformation.
Last edited by Aditya_V on 26 Jul 2020 10:32, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
We need to see how to ingress a cadre of technocratic people into the BJP. See how much of a difference Parrikar made in his short tenure.
This is a long term goal and must be pursued as such.
Also things are not as bleak for private sector ammunition manufacturing as reported in that article:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/meghabahre ... 19dbab19f9
The ammunition tender is likely to be reissued, here is the Army’s Master General of Ordnance: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 896079.cms
This is a long term goal and must be pursued as such.
Also things are not as bleak for private sector ammunition manufacturing as reported in that article:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/meghabahre ... 19dbab19f9
The ammunition tender is likely to be reissued, here is the Army’s Master General of Ordnance: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 896079.cms
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
It is suprising the IAF is ordering Hammer kits for huge amounts, rather than equivalent Paveway IIs'.
For parameters like performance, reliability, cost and usability
( French use it on Jaguar and Mirage, Rafael use doable), the Paveway ticks all the boxes.
The current users include NATO, France, Singapore and the US.
Do the Chinese have some counter/ laser dazzler device against the Paveways?
For parameters like performance, reliability, cost and usability
( French use it on Jaguar and Mirage, Rafael use doable), the Paveway ticks all the boxes.
The current users include NATO, France, Singapore and the US.
Do the Chinese have some counter/ laser dazzler device against the Paveways?
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Two MiG-29 fighters destroyed Turkish air defense systems near Sirte
first time news of MiG 29 attacking ADS.???
https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2020/07/3 ... ear-sirte/Two Russian-made MiG-29 fighters attacked the short-range air defense systems deployed by Turkey in Sirte, learned BulgarianMilitary.com citing the news agency Aviapro. Turkish soldiers tried to prepare a springboard for the assault on the city of Sirte in Libya, but the idea turned into a fiasco.
first time news of MiG 29 attacking ADS.???
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Guys this is the funniest video I have seen on Youtube on S-400 SAM by Indian guy. It's in Hindi but definitely worth a watch once due to this guys enthusiasm. We should invite this guy to BRF will be fun !!!
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
^^ He has a picture of a Rafale being chased by a missile to which he later points out as being one of the "400" missile. Not the best image you want to portray ![Mr. Green :mrgreen:](./images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
![Mr. Green :mrgreen:](./images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Sumeet wrote:Guys this is the funniest video I have seen on Youtube on S-400 SAM by Indian guy. It's in Hindi but definitely worth a watch once due to this guys enthusiasm. We should invite this guy to BRF will be fun !!!
![ROTFL :rotfl:](./images/smilies/icon_rotfl.gif)
![ROTFL :rotfl:](./images/smilies/icon_rotfl.gif)
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Hammer and Paveway are not equivalent. The Hammer is rocket powered. The Paveway is an unpowered LGB.dinesh_kimar wrote:It is suprising the IAF is ordering Hammer kits for huge amounts, rather than equivalent Paveway IIs'.
For parameters like performance, reliability, cost and usability
( French use it on Jaguar and Mirage, Rafael use doable), the Paveway ticks all the boxes.
The current users include NATO, France, Singapore and the US.
Do the Chinese have some counter/ laser dazzler device against the Paveways?
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 337106.cms
Defence Ministry lays out new plans to boost domestic arms buys to Rs 1.4 lakh crore
Defence Ministry lays out new plans to boost domestic arms buys to Rs 1.4 lakh crore
New Delhi: The defence ministry plans to increase procurement from the domestic industry to Rs 1.4 lakh crore by 2025, doubling the current spending as part of its plans to create and sustain a defence manufacturing ecosystem that will also focus heavily on exports.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Plans and plans. Execution? Less said the better.
Meanwhile not a single bulk order on local pvt ammo guys. Nor is there an attempt to involve them early, so by now production would have stabilized. What has happened are the usual attempts by DRDO to rope them in as ancillary suppliers for their own programs, in the process building them into proper explosives and propellants experts, but the IA has singularly failed to execute on this. The IA had to lead this with orders, but the MGO went back and placed orders on the OFB. And its three years now and no movement even so. The latest interview from MGO claims they have "resolved all issues". Took three years to resolve policy mistakes (asking SMEs to put up financial status on par with large firms), after setting crazy GSQRs (ammo standards placed were more than the best in class international OEMs could not meet). Hope this time will be a fresh start.
Meanwhile not a single bulk order on local pvt ammo guys. Nor is there an attempt to involve them early, so by now production would have stabilized. What has happened are the usual attempts by DRDO to rope them in as ancillary suppliers for their own programs, in the process building them into proper explosives and propellants experts, but the IA has singularly failed to execute on this. The IA had to lead this with orders, but the MGO went back and placed orders on the OFB. And its three years now and no movement even so. The latest interview from MGO claims they have "resolved all issues". Took three years to resolve policy mistakes (asking SMEs to put up financial status on par with large firms), after setting crazy GSQRs (ammo standards placed were more than the best in class international OEMs could not meet). Hope this time will be a fresh start.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Just to refresh our memories....
India Allows Private Sector to Manufacture Ammo
https://www.defensenews.com/pentagon/20 ... ture-ammo/
01 Dec 2016
India Allows Private Sector to Manufacture Ammo
https://www.defensenews.com/pentagon/20 ... ture-ammo/
01 Dec 2016
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
TWITTER
@IndianDefenceRA:
@IndianDefenceRA:
https://twitter.com/IndianDefenceRA/sta ... 60645?s=19#procurement
In a major boost to pvt industry, Army has launched several RFI to procure various ammns like, 9mm bullets for MP9, 300mm 9M55K/S/F for Smerch, 155mm shells for arty, C90 CR-RB M3 disposable rocket launcher, 122 mm (non ER) rockets for BM21s annually for next 10 yrs
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
The hammer is an add on kit to a dumb bomb, which adds rocket power range extender, and either IN/GPS , IN/GPS+Laser or IN/GPS+IR sensordinesh_kimar wrote:It is suprising the IAF is ordering Hammer kits for huge amounts, rather than equivalent Paveway IIs'.
The paveway is an unpowered LGB . The Spice is unpowered glide add on kit that has GPS/IN, IR or Laser sensors
The spice was in use on Mirage and planned to be used on Rafale as it is cheaper , but hammer was an option under the rafale deal. The report is that since spice would take time (and some one time money) to integrate onto Rafale, and hammer is already integrated, plus hammer can be used in a few extra scenarios (eg low altitude, more lateral cross range), and since ladakh has opened up emergency purchases, IAF asked for hammer.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Go ahead for the purchase of military equipment worth Rs 8,722 crore.
The defence ministry on Tuesday gave its go-ahead for the purchase of military equipment worth Rs 8,722 crore, including 106 locally made basic trainer aircraft, for the Indian Air Force to provide a push to the government’s Atmanirbhar Bharat Abhiyan’ (self-reliant India movement), a defence ministry spokesperson said.
Basic trainers figure on the government’s negative import list that seeks to ban the import of 101 different types of weapons, systems and ammunition over the next five years.
The ministry’s defence acquisition council (DAC) accorded its acceptance of necessity (AoN) for buying 106 Hindustan Turbo Trainer-40 (HTT-40) aircraft from state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) at a meeting chaired by defence minister Rajnath Singh.
Under India’s defence procurement rules, AoN by the council is the first step towards buying military hardware.
“With HAL having successfully developed HTT-40 prototypes and certification process underway, the DAC approved procurement of 106 basic trainers to address the training requirements of the IAF,” the ministry said in a statement. The IAF is expected to order 70 trainers initially, with the remaining 36 to be bought after the operationalisation of the HTT-40 fleet in the IAF.
This is the first step in a long journey ahead, said Air Vice Marshal Manmohan Bahadur (retd), additional director general, Centre for Air Power Studies.
“While it’s a thumbs-up for the design and development of the HTT-40, HAL has to rise to the occasion now and produce them to a time schedule that the IAF wants. Work ethics would require a change to do that,” Bahadur said.
The HTT-40 aircraft has undergone a string of elaborate tests at HAL to demonstrate that it is safe for rookie pilots and meets the IAF’s exacting standards for trainer planes. HAL could begin the production of the trainers by early next year.
Rookie pilots in IAF go through a three-stage training involving the Pilatus PC-7 MkII planes, Kiran trainers and finally the Hawk advanced jet trainers before they can fly fighter jets. As the Kirans are approaching the end of their service life, some amount of Stage 2 training is being done on the PC-7.
The defence ministry in July 2019 suspended business dealings with Swiss plane maker Pilatus Aircraft Limited for one year for violation of a pre-contract integrity pact in a Rs 2,900-crore contract for 75 basic trainers, and also factoring in Indian investigations against the plane maker for alleged corruption and irregularities.
The contract with Pilatus included a clause for follow-on purchase of 38 more planes.
The DAC - India’s apex procurement body - also cleared the purchase of an upgraded version of the super rapid gun mount (SRGM) which is fitted as the main gun onboard warships, to improve the navy’s firepower, the statement said. This weapon will be supplied by Bharat Heavy Electricals Limited (BHEL). “The upgraded version of SRGM has enhanced capability to perform against fast manoeuvring targets like missiles,” the statement said.
Other defence items cleared for purchase include tank ammunition – the 125 mm APFSDS (Armour Piercing Fin Stabilized Discarding Sabot). It will have 70% indigenous content. The statement said some of the other approvals given by the DAC will accelerate the purchase of AK-203 assault rifles and unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) upgrades.
India on Sunday announced that it will ban the import of 101 defence items over the next five years, a significant step on the long road towards achieving self-reliance in the defence sector.
These include artillery guns, light military transport aircraft, conventional submarines, long-range land attack cruise missiles, assault rifles, sniper rifles, short-range surface-to-air missiles, beyond visual range air-to-air missiles, corvettes, missile destroyers, light combat helicopter, light combat aircraft, a variety of radars and different types of ammunition.
The defence ministry on Tuesday gave its go-ahead for the purchase of military equipment worth Rs 8,722 crore, including 106 locally made basic trainer aircraft, for the Indian Air Force to provide a push to the government’s Atmanirbhar Bharat Abhiyan’ (self-reliant India movement), a defence ministry spokesperson said.
Basic trainers figure on the government’s negative import list that seeks to ban the import of 101 different types of weapons, systems and ammunition over the next five years.
The ministry’s defence acquisition council (DAC) accorded its acceptance of necessity (AoN) for buying 106 Hindustan Turbo Trainer-40 (HTT-40) aircraft from state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) at a meeting chaired by defence minister Rajnath Singh.
Under India’s defence procurement rules, AoN by the council is the first step towards buying military hardware.
“With HAL having successfully developed HTT-40 prototypes and certification process underway, the DAC approved procurement of 106 basic trainers to address the training requirements of the IAF,” the ministry said in a statement. The IAF is expected to order 70 trainers initially, with the remaining 36 to be bought after the operationalisation of the HTT-40 fleet in the IAF.
This is the first step in a long journey ahead, said Air Vice Marshal Manmohan Bahadur (retd), additional director general, Centre for Air Power Studies.
“While it’s a thumbs-up for the design and development of the HTT-40, HAL has to rise to the occasion now and produce them to a time schedule that the IAF wants. Work ethics would require a change to do that,” Bahadur said.
The HTT-40 aircraft has undergone a string of elaborate tests at HAL to demonstrate that it is safe for rookie pilots and meets the IAF’s exacting standards for trainer planes. HAL could begin the production of the trainers by early next year.
Rookie pilots in IAF go through a three-stage training involving the Pilatus PC-7 MkII planes, Kiran trainers and finally the Hawk advanced jet trainers before they can fly fighter jets. As the Kirans are approaching the end of their service life, some amount of Stage 2 training is being done on the PC-7.
The defence ministry in July 2019 suspended business dealings with Swiss plane maker Pilatus Aircraft Limited for one year for violation of a pre-contract integrity pact in a Rs 2,900-crore contract for 75 basic trainers, and also factoring in Indian investigations against the plane maker for alleged corruption and irregularities.
The contract with Pilatus included a clause for follow-on purchase of 38 more planes.
The DAC - India’s apex procurement body - also cleared the purchase of an upgraded version of the super rapid gun mount (SRGM) which is fitted as the main gun onboard warships, to improve the navy’s firepower, the statement said. This weapon will be supplied by Bharat Heavy Electricals Limited (BHEL). “The upgraded version of SRGM has enhanced capability to perform against fast manoeuvring targets like missiles,” the statement said.
Other defence items cleared for purchase include tank ammunition – the 125 mm APFSDS (Armour Piercing Fin Stabilized Discarding Sabot). It will have 70% indigenous content. The statement said some of the other approvals given by the DAC will accelerate the purchase of AK-203 assault rifles and unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) upgrades.
India on Sunday announced that it will ban the import of 101 defence items over the next five years, a significant step on the long road towards achieving self-reliance in the defence sector.
These include artillery guns, light military transport aircraft, conventional submarines, long-range land attack cruise missiles, assault rifles, sniper rifles, short-range surface-to-air missiles, beyond visual range air-to-air missiles, corvettes, missile destroyers, light combat helicopter, light combat aircraft, a variety of radars and different types of ammunition.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Adani's defence subsidiary acquires 51% stake in PLR Systems
I think this PLR Systems is (was?) the joing venture of Punj Lloyd with Israel Weapons Industries to manufacture small arms in India. They are the one who were planning to manufacture Tavor and Galil in India. Don't know if they have made any sales in India yet.NEW DELHI: Adani Enterprises NSE -0.77 % on Friday said its arm Adani Land Defence Systems and Technologies Ltd has acquired 51 per cent stake in PLR Systems Private Ltd.
PLR Systems was incorporated in 2013 and is engaged in manufacturing and supply of indigenously built defence equipment to the armed forces.
The company said: "Through the acquisition of a majority stake in PLR, Adani and IWI (existing shareholder in PLR) shall be able to provide indigenously manufactured defence equipment to the 1.2 million army personnel and an equal number of para military forces and state police forces and shall help achieve self-reliance aligned to the Make in India and Aatmanirbhar Bharat initiative."
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Yes that is correct. From circa 2018
https://www.armyrecognition.com/defexpo ... _arms.html
https://www.armyrecognition.com/defexpo ... _arms.html
Defence of PLR Systems, explained to Army Recognition on Thursday 12 April, Punj Lloyd and Israel Weapon Industries (IWI) have jointly set up a manufacturing facility in Malanpur (India) to produce small arms and ammunition. The plant is nearly operational.
Indian special forces already use IWI’s Tavor assault rifle. This is a one-way relation. On the other way, Punj Lloyd already exports key parts to Israel, and is about to produce its own X95 assault rifle, a totally made-in-India weapon.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
They have sold X95s. They are making the entire IWI product line in India. Unlike SSS defence, these guys are slowly consolidating their position.Kakkaji wrote:Adani's defence subsidiary acquires 51% stake in PLR Systems
I think this PLR Systems is (was?) the joing venture of Punj Lloyd with Israel Weapons Industries to manufacture small arms in India. They are the one who were planning to manufacture Tavor and Galil in India. Don't know if they have made any sales in India yet.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
They come with IWI's proven product line. With SSS, one hopes for the best, but there is a long way to go before they can demonstrate usable products.They have sold X95s. They are making the entire IWI product line in India. Unlike SSS defence, these guys are slowly consolidating their position.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Given that K-30 SPAAG procurement is now cancelled, what is the alternative we are building ?
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Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Adani is making big acquisitions in Defence, have already bought Col. Shankar's Alpha Defence, which had 800-1200 crore order book!
It shows that defence is a challenging field, even so called profitable companies like Alpha, fully flushed with orders and led by such an experienced promoter such as Col. Shankar could not hold on.
Sadly, in the end, they had to sell to Adanis , who have access to better financing, and are rumoured to have deep access to a certain someone who calls the shots...
It shows that defence is a challenging field, even so called profitable companies like Alpha, fully flushed with orders and led by such an experienced promoter such as Col. Shankar could not hold on.
Sadly, in the end, they had to sell to Adanis , who have access to better financing, and are rumoured to have deep access to a certain someone who calls the shots...
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Not to go OT but after the Adanis i wish Mukesh Ambani also makes the Defence Vertical a priority. At the end of the day a robust Indian MIC is what matters and if it is the Big Boys entry that will make it happen then god speed to them.
Tatas, Mahindras, Bharat Forge, L&T, Godrej and now the Adanis. Defence is business which requires deep pockets. The small players would simply not have the capability to overcome the machinations of the import pasand babus and the middlemen lobby.
Tatas, Mahindras, Bharat Forge, L&T, Godrej and now the Adanis. Defence is business which requires deep pockets. The small players would simply not have the capability to overcome the machinations of the import pasand babus and the middlemen lobby.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
For small players, it would always likely be build and get acquired. And, many times that's better as big guys can't do what small guy can for getting things built. Adani would not have been able to build the order book with being big. That's where small and nimble guys come in to get innovation running. Rinse and repeat for nimble guys as that's where most of their expertise is. Most start losing their expertise at the mark of growing big enough where cultural change is required across the organization. Everyone is happy till tinkering days are over and now have to get boring task of production rolling and documentation going. Quality and reliability guys are staring you down and you feel like you are the designer and arrived here before them. Most start seeing core competency depart at this level. Many sell, sign no compete for minimum time, and get right into it after the no compete ends and start making something new and better by rejoining core team. From the GoI perspective, they need to make sure that there's a requirement to have certain percentage being small businesses as suppliers. Nothing better to hear than Indian big guy has a connection as only big guys would be able to compete in muddy waters occupied by import lobbies.
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- Joined: 11 Aug 2016 06:14
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Ah yes, true that.darshan wrote:For small players, it would always likely be build and get acquired. And, many times that's better as big guys can't do what small guy can for getting things built.
ADTPL was doing well till 2015-16, with turnover of Rs. 420 crore, and a solid Rs. 1000 crore order book.
The promoter, Col. Shankar, talked of a conservative 8% growth to Rs. 450 crore for the next year.
Sadly, for some unknown reason, turnover halved to Rs. 210 crore in 2016-17 and Rs. 218 crore in 2017-18.
It's like orders were not placed and payments not made, and turnover got hit as a result.
Col. Shankar had to finally sell to Adani for Rs. 400 crore.(Quite A good deal .....for Adani).
Col. Shankar had a good run, an Electrical Engineer and EME veteran, then R&D Head at BEL, put in his pension money to start Alpha Design in 2004.
I'm honoured to have met the man on a couple of occasions, he's a quiet dynamo of energy, one of few Colonels to be awarded the Vishist Seva Medal, usually reserved for Generals. Outstanding work done on converting obsolete naval Seacat missiles into a Desi version of Tigercat.
He's the technocrat all us engineers aspire to be, sad to see the end of an innings. At the age of about 75 years, it's difficult to bounce back with a new company now.
Moral: hardwork, talent and grit will only get you so far. A Godfather and " management techniques" are more important in the long run.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
https://www.indiatoday.in/india-today-i ... 2020-09-23
Eye on China: A $3 billion US drone acquisition heads for MoD approval | India Today Insight
Eye on China: A $3 billion US drone acquisition heads for MoD approval | India Today Insight
The Ministry of Defence (MoD) is preparing to acquire 30 General Atomics MQ-9B Guardian drones from the United States, in a deal valued at approximately $3 billion (Rs 22,000 crore). A recent series of meetings within the MoD have cleared the way for the procurement of an initial lot of six Reaper Medium Altitude Long Endurance drones. These six drones—two each for the army, navy and air force—are to be procured immediately from the US, indicating the urgency of the acquisition.
The MQ-9 can carry electro-optical / infra-red multi-mode radar and multi-mode maritime surveillance radar, laser designators, electronic support measures and various weapons packages.
The MQ-9 is satellite-steered, can float above the target at 45,000 feet and stay on task for 35 hours, using radar and electronic support measures to locate the enemy—it could be anywhere, the Gulf of Aden or the Malacca Straits or in Eastern Ladakh,” a senior defence official says.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
^^^
So all 3 services coincidentally came up with a requirement of exactly 10 drones each? Any now that we don't have money for all 30 we are going to buy a starter pack of 2 each
. One more politically motivated purchase (a.k.a hafta), fettering away the already small capex budget to imports.
So all 3 services coincidentally came up with a requirement of exactly 10 drones each? Any now that we don't have money for all 30 we are going to buy a starter pack of 2 each
![Evil or Very Mad :evil:](./images/smilies/icon_evil.gif)
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
1. Wasn't there a call for a single ISR backbone? If that happens then 30 can be parked with this entity and managed centrally.
2. We do need enhancements to our ISR capabilities which is woefully short as has been proved during the current Indo-China standoff. I don't consider this deal as hafta for that very reason.
3. Capex budget will have to expand if we have to meet the challenge that China is going to pose in the short and medium term. The Chinese have already communicated their intent for India quite clearly.
2. We do need enhancements to our ISR capabilities which is woefully short as has been proved during the current Indo-China standoff. I don't consider this deal as hafta for that very reason.
3. Capex budget will have to expand if we have to meet the challenge that China is going to pose in the short and medium term. The Chinese have already communicated their intent for India quite clearly.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
The meat of the piece is behind paywall ...
https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 665_1.html
India invites Israeli companies to meet $130 billion weapons need
Defence ministry sets target of 70 per cent self-reliance in weaponry by 2027
https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 665_1.html
India invites Israeli companies to meet $130 billion weapons need
Defence ministry sets target of 70 per cent self-reliance in weaponry by 2027
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Greece is purchasing 18 Rafale F3R jets and other necessary equipment for 2 billion Euros . It wont be long before someone in India will bring this up and will ask why we paid $8.7 billion for 36 jets.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
8 of those 18 are going to be "donated" by the French and the rest 10 are apparently diverted from Egyptian orders that are in assembly (EAF will get 10 later). This is purely diplomatic play by France, UAE and allied arab countries against Turkey, safe to say any (or most) of the money the greeks have to pay would also be financed of very favourable terms.Rony wrote:Greece is purchasing 18 Rafale F3R jets and other necessary equipment for 2 billion Euros . It wont be long before someone in India will bring this up and will ask why we paid $8.7 billion for 36 jets.
Of course it is fair to ask why we have not been ably to extract such sweet deals, for example from the US, after all we are taking on their biggest adversary China. IMO this is a failure, given than we seem to not have enough money for defence but yet we spend the little we have trying to curry favour with foreign powers, rather than the other way round.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
There are items that could have certainly have been given by US from their various stocks even if just for the show purpose. So that's certainly a valid point. I have mentioned Javelin system before. Simple diversion of some in IA to be trained to use such systems opens up a possibility that chinese have to account for. Transport aircrafts are another example. Infrastructure building at favorable cost. Imports from India. All sorts of possibilities. The same of course applies to France and others too.
Re: Military Acquisitions, Partnerships & Developments
Govt of India exploring options to buy Embraer's commercial aircraft biz
[Note: most of the article is behind a paywall]
[Note: most of the article is behind a paywall]