Transport Aircraft for IAF

The Military Issues & History Forum is a venue to discuss issues relating to the military aspects of the Indian Armed Forces, whether the past, present or future. We request members to kindly stay within the mandate of this forum and keep their exchanges of views, on a civilised level, however vehemently any disagreement may be felt. All feedback regarding forum usage may be sent to the moderators using the Feedback Form or by clicking the Report Post Icon in any objectionable post for proper action. Please note that the views expressed by the Members and Moderators on these discussion boards are that of the individuals only and do not reflect the official policy or view of the Bharat-Rakshak.com Website. Copyright Violation is strictly prohibited and may result in revocation of your posting rights - please read the FAQ for full details. Users must also abide by the Forum Guidelines at all times.
Post Reply
srai
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5220
Joined: 23 Oct 2001 11:31

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by srai »

Image
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/InsightGL/status/14 ... 23905?s=20 ---> Indian Air Force awards Lockheed Martin $328.8 mil, 5-yr contract for comprehensive support for fleet of C-130J Super Hercules Aircraft.

- India has fleet of 12 C-130Js, 6 received by 2011 and 6 by 2019
- Lockheed has also been pushing for deal of 114 MMRCA for IAF
Aditya_V
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14331
Joined: 05 Apr 2006 16:25

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Aditya_V »

Rakesh wrote:https://twitter.com/InsightGL/status/14 ... 23905?s=20 ---> Indian Air Force awards Lockheed Martin $328.8 mil, 5-yr contract for comprehensive support for fleet of C-130J Super Hercules Aircraft.

- India has fleet of 12 C-130Js, 6 received by 2011 and 6 by 2019
- Lockheed has also been pushing for deal of 114 MMRCA for IAF
What about the 2 lost in accidents?

Any idea what the IAF transport fleet strength is?

1) 11 C17
2) 10-12 C 130J
3) Il 176MD 14 or 16
4) An 32 how many ?
5) Do 228 how many?
6) VIP fleet 767, 737 etc
7) Il 78 tankers 6 nos can be converted to transport
8 ) HAL Avro? How many

Then the helicopters, Mi-17, Dhruv, Chinooks, Mi-26 - hopefully they can fly again someday; Chetak, Cheetah, etc
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Lockheed Martin bags USD 328 million Indian contract to support C-130J aircraft fleet
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... 587595.cms
24 August 2021
chetak
BRF Oldie
Posts: 32224
Joined: 16 May 2008 12:00

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by chetak »

Aditya_V wrote:What about the 2 lost in accidents?

Any idea what the IAF transport fleet strength is?

1) 11 C17
2) 10-12 C 130J
3) Il 176MD 14 or 16
4) An 32 how many ?
5) Do 228 how many?
6) VIP fleet 767, 737 etc
7) Il 78 tankers 6 nos can be converted to transport
8 ) HAL Avro? How many

Then the helicopters, Mi-17, Dhruv, Chinooks, Mi-26 - hopefully they can fly again someday; Chetak, Cheetah, etc.
why is all this info needed to be put out here?
YashG
BRFite
Posts: 936
Joined: 22 Apr 2017 00:10

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by YashG »

^^^
Unless I'm missing something our transport fleet is listed on wiki. It might not be accurate to the last number but gives a general idea.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/IndianDefenceRA/sta ... 04608?s=20 ---> Can you identify all those elephants there?

Image
bharathp
BRFite
Posts: 453
Joined: 24 Jul 2017 03:44

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by bharathp »

gajraj il76
c-17
an32s
Manish_P
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5383
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 17:34

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Manish_P »

And a MiL Mi-26
(man that thing is huge! )

And a bunch of CH-47 Chinooks
Cain Marko
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5350
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 10:26

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Cain Marko »

Manish_P wrote:And a bunch of CH-47 Chinooks
So that's whats at the back. You got some eagle eyes
Aditya_V
BRF Oldie
Posts: 14331
Joined: 05 Apr 2006 16:25

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Aditya_V »

Manish_P wrote:And a MiL Mi-26
(man that thing is huge! )

And a bunch of CH-47 Chinooks
Is that Mi 26 flight worthy
Manish_P
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5383
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 17:34

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Manish_P »

Cain Marko wrote:
Manish_P wrote:And a bunch of CH-47 Chinooks
So that's whats at the back. You got some eagle eyes
Saw it on mobile, so took some time.. but really all i look (for since a year now), is Tejas. That's it.

No Su's, no Mirages, no not even Rafales... all i *want* to see are photos of rows upon rows of Tejas
(preferably armed, and i seem to have developed a fetish for asymmetrical loadout)
YashG
BRFite
Posts: 936
Joined: 22 Apr 2017 00:10

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by YashG »

^^^
A noteworthy desire.
Cain Marko
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5350
Joined: 26 Jun 2005 10:26

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Cain Marko »

Manish_P wrote:
Cain Marko wrote: So that's whats at the back. You got some eagle eyes
Saw it on mobile, so took some time.. but really all i look (for since a year now), is Tejas. That's it.

No Su's, no Mirages, no not even Rafales... all i *want* to see are photos of rows upon rows of Tejas
(preferably armed, and i seem to have developed a fetish for asymmetrical loadout)
Tatahastu - May your nek desire be fulfilled.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/IAF_MCC/status/1433 ... 70147?s=20 ----> "There's No Such Place as Far Away"

Strategic Reach Redefined - IAF Workhorses in Mission Mode.

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
Maria
BRFite
Posts: 212
Joined: 15 Aug 2020 13:50

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Maria »

https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1435587260469051392

Livefist: BREAKING: Indian Cabinet approves procurement of 56 @Airbus C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its old Avro transports
LakshmanPST
BRFite
Posts: 673
Joined: 05 Apr 2019 18:23

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by LakshmanPST »

Maria wrote:https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1435587260469051392

Livefist: BREAKING: Indian Cabinet approves procurement of 56 @Airbus C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its old Avro transports
Finally...
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Amen!
SRajesh
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2061
Joined: 04 Aug 2019 22:03

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by SRajesh »

Maria wrote:https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1435587260469051392

Livefist: BREAKING: Indian Cabinet approves procurement of 56 @Airbus C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its old Avro transports
Hmm All Transport or :?: :?: few for 'Desi Chappati's' :D
Ankit Desai
BRFite
Posts: 634
Joined: 05 May 2006 21:28
Location: Gujarat

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Ankit Desai »

Maria wrote:https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1435587260469051392

Livefist: BREAKING: Indian Cabinet approves procurement of 56 @Airbus C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its old Avro transports
While 16 of the twin-turboprop C-295MW aircraft will be delivered in a flyaway condition by M/s Airbus Defence and Space (Spain) within two years of the signing of the actual contract, the rest 40 will be manufactured in India by the TATA Consortium within 10 years.

-Ankit
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 59773
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by ramana »

Thanks folks for posting the C-295 news. Finally, the old Avros will get retired.
ramana
Forum Moderator
Posts: 59773
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 05:30

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by ramana »

That slung load for Chinook means more of them to augment the C-295 will be procurred.
VinodTK
BRF Oldie
Posts: 2976
Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by VinodTK »

Maria wrote:https://twitter.com/livefist/status/1435587260469051392

Livefist: BREAKING: Indian Cabinet approves procurement of 56 @Airbus C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its old Avro transports
Manish_P
BRF Oldie
Posts: 5383
Joined: 25 Mar 2010 17:34

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Manish_P »

Good news indeed. The venerable Avros can get a well deserved retirement.

Any chance now for the Airbus 400M Atlas? Considering the C-17s are no longer available... and we do need more transports.
Atmavik
BRFite
Posts: 1985
Joined: 24 Aug 2016 04:43

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Atmavik »

I know the c 295 is replacing the Avros but why can’t we use it to replace the An-32 as well? The c 295 is a larger bird. Do the An 32’s have more life to them ?
LakshmanPST
BRFite
Posts: 673
Joined: 05 Apr 2019 18:23

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by LakshmanPST »

Atmavik wrote:I know the c 295 is replacing the Avros but why can’t we use it to replace the An-32 as well? The c 295 is a larger bird. Do the An 32’s have more life to them ?
Your question was already discussed here--->
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=7294&p=2477744&hilit=An32#p2477740
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/TheWolfpackIN/statu ... 80642?s=20 ---> India will be MRO hub for the C-295 transport aircraft. Many Asian and African countries will repair/overhaul their C-295s in India.
vijayk
BRF Oldie
Posts: 8760
Joined: 22 Jun 1999 11:31

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by vijayk »

How The C295 Aircraft Deal With Airbus Will Bring Relief For IAF And Indian Defence Industry
https://swarajyamag.com/defence/how-the ... industry-2
08 Sept 2021
Earlier today (8 September), the Cabinet Committee on Security approved the procurement of 56 C-295 transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force (IAF) from Airbus under a deal expected to be worth $2.5 billion.

This is the first time a military aircraft will be manufactured in India by a private company, the Ministry of Defence said in a statement.

The long pending deal for the twin turboprop transport aircraft will bring much-needed relief not only for European aerospace giant Airbus, which has seen its campaigns for lucrative defence contracts in India fail over the last few years, but also for the IAF and the domestic defence industry.

For the IAF, C295s will come as replacements for its ageing Avro HS748 transport aircraft. The first of the now vintage aircraft flew with the IAF for the first time in the early 1960s. Around 50 of these, licence-produced in India by the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited, are currently in service.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

LakshmanPST wrote:
Atmavik wrote:I know the c 295 is replacing the Avros but why can’t we use it to replace the An-32 as well? The c 295 is a larger bird. Do the An 32’s have more life to them ?
Your question was already discussed here--->
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=7294&p=2477744&hilit=An32#p2477740
Air Marshal Manmohan Bahadur says the opposite...

How The C295 Aircraft Deal With Airbus Will Bring Relief For IAF And Indian Defence Industry
https://swarajyamag.com/defence/how-the ... industry-2
08 Sept 2021
“The C-295 aircraft would also be the natural replacement for AN-32s which too would be getting phased out soon,” Air Vice Marshal Manmohan Bahadur (retd) has been quoted by the Hindustan Times as saying.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Finally, India clears decks for 56 C-295 transports
https://www.livefistdefence.com/finally ... ransports/
08 Sept 2021
The deal, expected to be worth $2.5 billion, will by a three-way agreement signed between the Indian Air Force, Airbus and the Tata consortium.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Good for TATA. I am really happy for them. They have ventures with Sikorsky for the S-92 cabin, with Lockheed Martin for wings of F-16s and aero-structures for C-130s, structures for the Pilatus PC-12NG, with Boeing for AH-64 fuselages and now with Airbus for the C-295.

https://twitter.com/ReviewVayu/status/1 ... 21312?s=20 ---> We predict they will eventually build 120-150 over the course of the program. Either way, the extra long wait is over for Airbus and the Tatas who right now must be celebrating.

https://twitter.com/KSingh_1469/status/ ... 11330?s=20 ---> The Indian Coast Guard wants 6 MMMA based on the platform initially. The IAF will definitely be ordering more. The Indian Navy has an outstanding requirement for MRMA. There was an open requirement for a C27J/C295 class aircraft for the Home Ministry. The UDAN scheme also offers huge potential.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/ReviewVayu/status/1 ... 94404?s=20 ---> India's Cabinet Committee on Security approves procurement of 56 C-295MW transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force. 16 to be delivered in flyaway condition from Spain; 40 to be manufactured in India. All 56 will have an indigenous Electronic Warfare suite.

https://twitter.com/ReviewVayu/status/1 ... 89154?s=20 ---> A large number of detail parts, sub-assemblies and major component assemblies of aero structure are scheduled to be manufactured in India. Before completion of deliveries, ‘D’ Level servicing facility (MRO) for C-295MW aircraft is scheduled to be setup in India.

https://twitter.com/KSingh_1469/status/ ... 66849?s=20 ---> The last part is hugely significant. This means for the entire lifecycle of the planes they can be maintained within Indian shores. Guaranteed that this MRO service will be tapped into by regional C-295 operator also.
Vips
BRF Oldie
Posts: 4699
Joined: 14 Apr 2017 18:23

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Vips »

CCS clears procurement of 56 transport aircraft from Airbus for IAF; 40 planes to be manufactured in India.

In a major decision, the Cabinet Committee on Security on Wednesday approved the procurement of 56 C-295 medium transport aircraft for the Indian Air Force to replace its ageing Avro planes which were first inducted around 60 years ago.

Sixteen aircraft will be delivered in a flyaway condition by the Airbus Defence and Space of Spain within 48 months of signing the contract while the remaining 40 planes will be manufactured in India, according to the defence ministry.

The cost of the procurement is expected to be in the range of Rs 18,000 to Rs 20,000 crore, people familiar with the project said.

The 40 planes will be manufactured in India by a consortium of the Airbus Defence and Space and Tata Advanced Systems Limited (TASL) within 10 years of signing the contract.

"Today, Cabinet Committee on Security approved the procurement of 56 C-295MW transport aircraft from M/s Airbus Defence and Space SA, Spain for the Indian Air Force," the defence ministry said in a statement about the decision by the prime minister-led committee.

The C-295MW aircraft is a transport plane of 5-10 tonne capacity.

"Sixteen aircraft will be delivered in flyaway condition from Spain within 48 months of the signing of the contract and forty aircraft will be manufactured in India by TATA consortium within 10 years of the signing of the contract," the ministry said. :shock: (Four aircrafts a year = Free chai biskoot and samosa for 10 years!!!)

"This is the first project of its kind in which a military aircraft will be manufactured in India by a private company. All 56 aircraft will be installed with indigenous electronic warfare suite," it said.

The in-principle approval for the Avro replacement programme was accorded around nine years ago.

"All 56 aircraft will be installed with indigenous electronic warfare suite. The project will give a boost to the aerospace ecosystem in India wherein several MSMEs spread over the country will be involved in manufacturing of parts of the aircraft," the ministry said.

A large number of detail parts, sub-assemblies and major component assemblies of aero structure are scheduled to be manufactured in India.

"The programme will act as a catalyst in employment generation in the aerospace ecosystem of the country and is expected to generate 600 highly skilled jobs directly, over 3000 indirect jobs and an additional 3000 medium skill employment opportunities with more than 42.5 lakh man-hours of work within the aerospace and defence sector of India," the ministry said.

"During the process of manufacturing in India, it is expected that all the suppliers of TATA Consortium who will be involved in special processes will gain and maintain globally recognized National Aerospace and Defence Contractors Accreditation Program (NADCAP) accreditation," it said.

The ministry said the programme will provide a major boost to the 'Atmanirbhar Bharat Abhiyan' (self-reliant India initiative) as it offers a unique opportunity for the Indian private sector to enter into technology-intensive and highly competitive aviation Industry.

"The project will augment domestic aviation manufacturing resulting in reduced import dependence and expected increase in exports," it said.
The ministry said before completion of the deliveries, a servicing facility for C-295MW aircraft is scheduled to be set up in India.

"It is expected that this facility will act as a regional MRO (maintenance, repair, and overhaul) hub for various variants of C-295 aircraft," it said.

"In addition, the OEM (original equipment maker) will also discharge its offset obligations through direct purchase of eligible products and services from Indian offset partners giving a further boost to the economy," it added.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

Staggered - not rapid - inductions is the only thing that will happen. 40 aircraft over a period of 10 years works out to 4 aircraft per year.

- Easier on CAPEX budget which has to fund multiple acquisitions.
- Regular maintenance intervals and future MLUs will not put a large % of the fleet out.

Expect a repeat order. TASL will be building C-295s for the foreseeable future i.e. longer than 10 years.
YashG
BRFite
Posts: 936
Joined: 22 Apr 2017 00:10

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by YashG »

Now that C295 deal is done, I hope we will find some ways to repurpose AVROs. Some as MPAs and some as gifts to friendly ASEAN countries.
Rakesh
Forum Moderator
Posts: 18190
Joined: 15 Jan 2004 12:31
Location: Planet Earth
Contact:

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by Rakesh »

https://twitter.com/KesariDhwaj/status/ ... 92365?s=20 ---> C-295M is a versatile platform and has been adapted for various uses.

- Maritime patrol, AEW&C, SIGINT, Tanker and even a gunship (IAF demoed An-32 in a 'bomber' role during a fire-power demo).

- It is good to have indigenous eqp but given our relatively low R&D budget.

https://twitter.com/KesariDhwaj/status/ ... 19717?s=20 ---> I don't think we should aim at trying to develop everything in-house.

- If anything, I would focus on engines powering this category of a/c, than whole a/c itself.

- Similarly for our Medium Transport Aircraft requirement, best bet is C-130. Just get the production line here.

https://twitter.com/KesariDhwaj/status/ ... 05172?s=20 ---> This seems already in works - C-295 variant in maritime patrol avatar for Indian Cost Guard from DRDO (pic source: @alpha_defense).

- A single platform adapted for multiple uses will lead to lower procurement and operational cost.

Image

Image

Image

Image

Image
mody
BRFite
Posts: 1362
Joined: 18 Jun 2000 11:31
Location: Mumbai, India

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by mody »

The greater availability and ease of maintenance of the C-295 will help improve the IAF operations quite a lot and will lower the pressure on the AN-32 fleet. The operational cost of the much more modern C-295 ought to be lower than the AN-32 and for cargo loads of upto 7-9 tons, the C-295 can be used instead of the AN-32.

For the eventual replacement of the AN-32s, either Airbus and Tata JV should develop a larger variant of the C-295, that would have a total load carrying capacity of 16-20 tons or we should partner with Ukraine to make a slightly larger and advanced variant of the AN-32, with a similar load capacity of 16-20 tons.
If we can get the C-130s at a cheaper price, than that would be nice too. The existing C-130Js were meant specially for special operation ops and whatever additional equipment that we asked to be fitted, sure seem to have increased the price quite a lot. More than 1 Billion for 6 aircrafts, as compared to about 3 BIllion for 56 C-295s.
I would guess at least double the number of C-295s will be built in India, as the requirement of ICG and IN will also get added along with additional IAF requirement.

Though personally I would have preferred the C-27J in place of C-295. Common engines and cockpit with the C-130s plus I guess the C-27J is slightly wider and can carry slightly heavier loads. Unfortunately Alenia chose not to participate due to make in India clause.
kit
BRF Oldie
Posts: 6278
Joined: 13 Jul 2006 18:16

Re: Transport Aircraft for IAF

Post by kit »

mody wrote: Unfortunately Alenia chose not to participate due to make in India clause.
And that is as important as the capability itself. Any manufacturer thinking of selling to India better to keep that in mind !
Post Reply